ftp.xmission.com/2014.06.ftp.xmission.com.tar/ftp.xmission.com/pub/lists/zorn-list/old/DIGEST32

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    (AND OTHER NYC DOWNTOWN MUSICIANS)

    DIGEST #32, 3-1-95
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From [e-mail]  Mon Feb 27 12:20:03 1995
Subject: submission to the digest

simon lucas writes (regarding "Torture Garden"):
>I adore this record and am fascinated (being a Japanophile) by the photgraphic
>imagery on the cover, not to mention the illustrations by the japanese artist.
>The sleeve says they come from Zorn's private collection, but does anyone have
>further information on the origins of this material.

I'm also interested in where this material originates from.  It is
clearly fairly old and probably nearly impossible to find now--no
doubt Zorn obtained it from friends.  The closest material still
available that I know of would be the old films by Nikkatsu and another
company whose name slips my mind at the moment.  Nikkatsu is currently
re-releasing all their old films on video and they are widely
available in Japan.  A store in Shinjuku called AV Factory was releasing the
other company's movies on video, but they might have stopped by now.
There's plenty of more recently made SM material available, of
course--the best producer in the past few years has been CineMagic.

As for the artwork, similar things will appear in SM magazines from
time to time, and there may be collections available, but I don't much
like the artwork myself so I haven't paid attention.

Now for my question:  While "Torture Garden" is pretty good, my
favorite Zorn pieces are "Forbidden Fruit" and the one on the Weill
album.  What other pieces of his are similar to those two?

John Leo                    Oracle Corporation
[e-mail]                Server Technology
http://theory.lcs.mit.edu/~leo            SQL Execution group

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From [e-mail]  Mon Feb 27 14:09:55 1995
Subject: Old Shit

    hello fellow z-listers,

    I'm gonna catch up on some old comments in this mail.

ben said:
>...But his musicianship and compositional skills are certainly
>nonpareil. I just wish he'd gotten Diamanda Galas instead of Yamatsuka
>Eye to collaborate with: someone with technical ability who could also
>shriek it up would have matched the rest of the people he's played with
>perfectly.

    Eye's vocals are perfect for the situation zorn uses
    him. His insane seemingly out of control histrionics
    gives those pieces some real umppphh!

    However, I agree with you that it would be nice to
    see more Diamanda collaborations besides the one
    track on The Big Gundown. Since they are both so
    driven to work on their own things, I imagine it
    is hard for them to find common schedules.

brian (aka cya) sez:
>Yes!!!! And get some listserv (or majordomo) software and GET TO A
>REAL TIME LIST!  This would keep people going!  It's really hard to
>start up a list in digest format: people get bored, leave, etc. since
>there's no immediate reply or answer.  It helps immeasurably to
>discuss stuff when you fire off an answer, get a reply, fire off
>something else, see somebody else's reply, etc.  Just my $0.02.

    I wholeheartedly agree with brian. This list sorely
    needs some good list software, preferably one that
    supports both real-time and digest mailings.

    The benefits of this are great.
        - We will be less likely to see many replies
        to the same question in the next version of
        the digest.
        - There is more opportunity for dialog.
        - It is A LOT easier to send private e-mail
        to a fellow z-lister using the "Reply" mode.
        (Much nicer than having to retype some of
        your complex addresses :)
        - subscribing and unsubscribing is automated
        and "standard" across the Internet.
        - remailing of messages is automated.
        - mailing of digests is automated.
        - obtaining archives is easy.

    I would be happy to volunteer to help with getting a
    majordomo setup going.


[e-mail]  sez:
>Thought the denizens of this group might be interested to note that JZ was
>recently dis-invited/banned from an appearance at UCSanta Cruz's Kresge
>College because of the depiction of Asian women being tortured on some of his
>album covers.  What'chy'all think?

    It's a lame, chicken-shit attempt at publicity
    from a bunch of PC wankers.

[e-mail]  sez:
>...when he performed with say, Naked City with its wild non-
>sequitur and seemingly chaotic changes...did zorn use some sort of signal
>method to cue the musicians in an abrupt change?...similar to frank zappa's
>"conducting" method, where various body actions known previously to the
>musicians are employed for sudden style changes...just curious...

    (from my feeble memory)

    I've seen Naked City several times and in all cases every
    musician (except Eye) had a music stand with notated
    music sheets. Before each piece John would pick a song
    (seemingly on the spur of the moment) and announce it's
    sheet number to the band. The sudden style changes were
    often on a downbeat sometimes indicated with a gesture from
    Zorn. However, for Eye, Zorn conducted a lot more.

brian (aka [e-mail]) sez:
>any more thought being given to a trading list for Zorn stuff?  It
>sounds like a really good idea.

    Why not just use the zorn-list? Seems like the perfect
    use of the mailing list to me.


Matt, zorn-mgr (he's not really Zorn's manager) sez:
>I have a suggestion to make....How would you all feel about opening
>this list up to discussion of BILL LASWELL and his projects also?

    I realize I may be too late here. But I still want to
    say I think this is a bad idea. The whole point behind
    a mailing list is specialization and not having to wade
    through topics that aren't of interest. Start a separate
    mailing list for Laswell, but let's keep this list focused.

>I feel that he, along with Zorn, are the leaders of the avant-garde
>scene, and therefore Laswell stuff would not be out of place here
>on this list...Let the list know what you think, and feel free

    good idea. but I didn't notice any discussion of
    this topic. it just seemed to happen behind the scenes
    (see below)

>to start talking about Laswell....

    shouldn't this wait until the topic has been discussed
    and a consensus reached in that forum?


the next day,

Matt, zorn-mgr (he's not really Zorn's manager) sez:
>Well, it looks like the Laswell people have it.  :)  I got
>mail from several people (48) giving a hearty 'yes' to the
>Laswell idea, and only (2) 'no'.  So for now, Laswell and
>the downtown improvisers are completely fair game to discuss
>on this list.

    Wait a second! Now we've gone from adding Laswell
    to the Zorn list focus to enlarging it to include
    "Downtown Improvisers".

    While I believe there is room and interest for
    such a mailing list, it shouldn't be lumped under
    the *John Zorn* mailing list.


Henry Weld (aka [e-mail])
>I don't like much of Laswell's work, I'd prefer it if he wasn't
discussed here.

    I like some of Laswell's work, but I agree with
    my new main man Henry on this one.

    not really as grumpy as I may have come off,
    mike rizzi

--
----------------------------- [e-mail] --------------------------------

           Suicide is the most sincere form of self criticism

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From [e-mail]  Mon Feb 27 17:43:45 1995
Subject: Subrosa Discography

Thanks to Xander for the Sub Rosa information/reviews.  I'd love to see the
Subrosa Discography you've been working on, and if posting to this list
isn't innapropriate by size, please do so!
I've just posted a Crammed Disc's Made to Measure discography to
alt.music.progressive which includes at least one Zorn disc.  If anyone is
interested I can email them a copy, or can post the discography to the list
if there's sufficient interest.

Phil Z ([e-mail])

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From [e-mail]  Mon Feb 27 20:39:42 1995
Subject: godard_ca_vous_chant?

This is an  album from NATO, a french Label. They have *LOTS* of very
interesting music.... I'm looking for a list of all the recordings of NATO, so if anyone
can help I would appreciate it. Or,  does anyone knows if NATO is
reachable by internet? (address, http, ...).

By the way, "Godard", 18'42,  is more like Spillane works, and a fine piece
of J. Zorn indeed.


Sometime ago I've heard about something like "Intergallactic Ballet", as
beeing one of Zorn's past projects. Who does have info about it?

PG

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From [e-mail]  Mon Feb 27 22:37:45 1995
Subject:  Buckethead's Giant Robot

>Does anyone have an idea as to how I could obtain a copy of "Giant
>Robot",
>I absolutely have to have this album.
>
>Thanks,  Andrew
>
>--
>-------------------------
>Andrew Isherwood
>[e-mail]

You can get it from Take Notes C.D.'s.  I'm not sure about the
price, but you can get info. and order from [e-mail]

Chris Sipe
[e-mail]

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From [e-mail]  Tue Feb 28 15:50:00 1995
Subject: Masada

    There's a pretty good album review in the new CMJ about the
Masada album:

Masada "Alef and Beit"  DIW (Japan) c/o Sphere

    Masada is a project combining the considerable talents of John
Zorn, Dave Douglas, Greg Cohen, and Joey Baron.  The quartet came
together in the midst of the "Radical Jewish Culture" nights Zorn oversaw
at New York's Knitting Factory club.  When you take into account the
spirit of the group's origins, add in that the project is named for the
ancient Jewish fortress at which the Jews committed mass suicide rather
than fall to the advancing Romans, and the fact that both of the discs
dedicate the recordings to Asher Ginzberg, the "founding father of
Cultural Zionism," it seems odd that the music should sound so remarkably
close to the African-American sound of vintage Ornette Coleman.  Unlike
so many proponents of cultural traditions, Masada is not an exercise in
retracing the steps of ancestors or simply maintaining a people's chain
of common experience.  How this harmolodic free jazz connects to Jewish
culture is neatly explained in an extended quote of Gershom Scholem--in
some of the only English amid the primarily Japanese and Hebrew
packaging: "There is a life of tradition that does not merely consist of
conservative preservation...There is such a thing as a treasure hunt
within tradition which creates a living relationship to tradition."  The
music's connections to Klezmer are , at best, subatomic--most ears will
miss if this music is based on Klezmer themes or not--but it's a bold
artistic stroke that connects Zorn's culture to that of his forefathers.
As the lyrical passion ofhte music speaks volumes, where lines of
tradition and experimentation are drawn eventually becomes irrelevant.

    ---------- John Bush.
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From [e-mail]  Wed Mar  1 00:55:57 1995
Subject: 2nd Masada album?

Hello there-
I heard that the follow up to Masada's "Alef" was supposed to be
out very soon.  Any knowledge of this? Any reviews if it's out?
Or- any knowledge of release info?  'nuff said.....

But I must add:
If there is anyone out there (esp. in NY, San Francisco or Chicago)
who records live jazz on dat, and would like to do some trading for
more live jazz on dat, please contact me.(An acquaintance of mine
here in Seattle is seeking trading partners for live jazz on dat)

Respectfully yours,
James Kirchmer
P.S.- What a great mailing list! The scope is good....

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