| New book: Surprise Me with Beauty: the Music of Human Systems |
| http://www.metatronpress.com/nj/smwb.html |
| Latest CDs: Collaborations/ All Souls http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 19:54:30 EST
From: TagYrIt@aol.com
Subject: Holy Cow! john cage
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In a message dated 3/26/2002 6:06:17 PM Eastern Standard Time,
jzitt@metatronpress.com writes:
> On Tue, Mar 26, 2002 at 01:44:56PM -0800, Patrice L. Roussel wrote:
>
> > Cage is a holy cow in contemporary music
>
> Utterly off-topic, but I think you mean "sacred cow". "Holy cow!" is
> what one yells when excited at baseball games.
>
Well now that I think about it, wouldn't Cage have just LOVED being called a
"holy cow"?
Dale.
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0"><B>In a message dated 3/26/2002 6:06:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, jzitt@metatronpress.com writes:<BR>
| New book: Surprise Me with Beauty: the Music of Human Systems |
| http://www.metatronpress.com/nj/smwb.html |
| Latest CDs: Collaborations/ All Souls http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 20:00:21 EST
From: TagYrIt@aol.com
Subject: Re: john cage - floodgates part II
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In a message dated 3/26/2002 7:02:25 PM Eastern Standard Time,
velaires@earthlink.net writes:
> In actual application, you can clear a room pretty fast by putting on a
> record of any Milton Babbit or Morton Subtonick piece you wanna name.
>
Subotnick?? Really?? I think his piece "Return" is gorgeous, captivating,
entertaining, and would get anyone's attention that is half-listening to it.
Dale.
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0"><B>In a message dated 3/26/2002 7:02:25 PM Eastern Standard Time, velaires@earthlink.net writes:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">In actual application, you can clear a room pretty fast by putting on a<BR>
record of any Milton Babbit or Morton Subtonick piece you wanna name.<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SCRIPT" FACE="Comic Sans MS" LANG="0"><B><BR>
Subotnick?? Really?? I think his piece "Return" is gorgeous, captivating, entertaining, and would get anyone's attention that is half-listening to it.<BR>
<BR>
Dale.</B></FONT></HTML>
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 17:05:40 -0800
From: skip Heller <velaires@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: john cage - floodgates part II
on 3/26/02 5:40 PM, Joseph Zitt at jzitt@metatronpress.com wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 26, 2002 at 04:04:41PM -0800, skip Heller wrote:
>
>> In actual application, you can clear a room pretty fast by putting on a
>> record of any Milton Babbit or Morton Subtonick piece you wanna name.
>
> This is not true, in my experience, of the early well-known Subotnick
> pieces.
I probably wasn't playing those. The ones I had records of were
terrifically unpleasant.
> We stopped having room-clearing contests in college when the consensus
> was that we'd never beat two records I had just bought: Yoko Ono's
> "Fly" and Lou Reed's "Metal Machine Music".
Those'll work, for sure. Hell, they'll get me out of there pretty fast.
>
> But would you agree that talent plus media savvy is more effective
> than talent without it? Is there anything wrong with fame, if you have
> the talent to back it up?
Living in Hollywood and seeing different versions of fame in action has
taught me that there's no hard & fast answer for that.
I think that all depends on the degree of fame (is Dave Douglas "famous"?),
what you did that made you famous (Mike Nesmith's very formidable talent did
not make him famous), and, not least of all, the indivdual to whom the fame
comes (fame hasn't helped Brian Wilson too damn much). I don't think John
Hartford hated "Gentle On My Mind", but it led to his (fantastic) quote, "Be
careful what you get famous for."
There have been so many people for whom was detrimental that asking if
there's anything wrong with fame is to bring in a question with so many
different kinds of implications that we'd need to start a new group.
skip h
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 21:02:08 EST
From: UFOrbK8@aol.com
Subject: subotnick.
In actual application, you can clear a room pretty >fast by putting on a
>record of any Milton Babbit or Morton Subtonick >piece you wanna name.
>Subotnick?? Really?? I think his piece "Return" is >gorgeous, captivating, entertaining, and would get >anyone's attention that is half-listening to it.
what about silver apples of the moon, huh? cool enough for a crazy indie band to name themselves after it...
:)
love,
k8.
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 19:30:41 -0800
From: "s~Z" <keithmar@msn.com>
Subject: Re: john cage - floodgates part II
>>>Maybe the key is to disregard the questions and just do what's
in your
heart. Trust your own musical judgment and make what you like.<<<
Were you doing needlepoint when you posted that?
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 22:24:36 -0600
From: Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com>
Subject: Re: john cage - floodgates part II
On Tue, Mar 26, 2002 at 07:30:41PM -0800, s~Z wrote:
> >>>Maybe the key is to disregard the questions and just do what's
> in your
> heart. Trust your own musical judgment and make what you like.<<<
>
> Were you doing needlepoint when you posted that?
| New book: Surprise Me with Beauty: the Music of Human Systems |
| http://www.metatronpress.com/nj/smwb.html |
| Latest CDs: Collaborations/ All Souls http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 19:39:45 -0800
From: skip Heller <velaires@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: john cage - floodgates part II
on 3/26/02 7:30 PM, s~Z at keithmar@msn.com wrote:
>>>> Maybe the key is to disregard the questions and just do what's
> in your
> heart. Trust your own musical judgment and make what you like.<<<
>
> Were you doing needlepoint when you posted that?
>
No, you cynical prick. It's something I remind myself to do when people
want to offer me money to play music I hate. This kind of attitude won't
make you richer, but it will keep you from looking at music in a hateful
way.
skip h
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 22:44:29 -0500
From: "Steve Smith" <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: RE: john cage - floodgates part II
Much to my surprise, this has just been reissued on CD by EMI. But, as one
wag recently said to me, ANY release from EMI Classics is a limited edition
(since they go out of print so damned quickly), so if you're interested,
it's cheap. Grab it now, while you can.
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
(who doesn't have all that many Cage records, but this is certainly one of
them...)
- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com
[mailto:owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Jim Flannery
Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 5:08 PM
(My recommendations for starting points: _Three Dances_ (the flip side
of the Angel Reich/_Four Organs_)
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 23:46:46 EST
From: RainDog138@aol.com
Subject: well well well
i see that even going as far as to title my post "floodgates" was still a bit
understated. thank you to all who answered me politely and my humble
apologies to those who hate me now for ever bringing up such a volitile topic
as John Cage.
i've got a new one for ya - just so we can maybe move on...ok, i played
patton's "adult themes for voice" in my music theory class today -
specifically "the man in the lower lefthand corner of the picture." the
instructor loved it - he was already a mr. bungle fan. anyways a fellow
student came up to me and says, "sure it's innovative or atleast new to me,
but is it really music? i told him i felt it was. and continued on to say
that to me music is simply any form of audio that can change your physical or
psychological feelings at that very moment in time.
did it take you to a place that you would not have gone had you been sitting
here in silence?
that's how i define music it's it's most general form.
even the noisy or unpleasant stuff you guys/gals say you've bought and never
play again past the first or second listen - it was new to you then and it
had your attention for that moment in time. even if it's the sound of the fan
in the computer next to you that reminds you of that old fridge that used to
always hum down in your parents basement. it takes you mentally somewhere
else - it changes your mood like it or not. that to me is music.
ok perhaps i went on a tad much there, but my extremely broad question to
this group is WHAT IS THE DEFINITION OF MUSIC TO YOU? and please don't bicker
back and forth a thousand times if someone has a different opinion than
yours. as i am certain not all agree with my pathetic attempt - i will not
question your personal definition. i am just incredibly curious to hear what
you all have to say.
mike t
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 23:50:25 -0600
From: Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com>
Subject: Re: well well well
On Tue, Mar 26, 2002 at 11:46:46PM -0500, RainDog138@aol.com wrote:
> ok perhaps i went on a tad much there, but my extremely broad question to
> this group is WHAT IS THE DEFINITION OF MUSIC TO YOU? and please don't bicker> back and forth a thousand times if someone has a different opinion than
> yours. as i am certain not all agree with my pathetic attempt - i will not
> question your personal definition. i am just incredibly curious to hear what
> you all have to say.
For me, IMHO, blahblahblah, music is a way of listening to sound (and
not necessarily a way of creating it, though the term is also used for
sound that is created with the intent of people giving it that quality
of attention). Anything that you choose to listen to as music is music
for you; anything that you choose not to listen to as music isn't.
If Bishop Berkeley falls in a forest, the ants are squashed.
