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2002-02-09
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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V3 #771
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Sunday, February 10 2002 Volume 03 : Number 771
In this issue:
-
Odp: sex music
the ultimate sex album
Re: nordine?
RE: Zorn as Miles???????? and SEX!!
Jack Johnson box-set
Re: Miles ("On the corner") off list
Re: take the coltrane
Re: Jack Johnson box-set
Re: Miles/"Jack Johnson"
Re: Jack Johnson box-set
Re: Miles ("On the corner") off list
Re: Jack Johnson box-set
sex muzik.
Re: nordine?
Previte
RE: the ultimate sex album
Re: Zorn as Miles????????
Re: Sex Music (JZ?)
Re: sex muzik.
RE: Coltrane
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 10:47:24 +0100
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <marcingokieli@go2.pl>
Subject: Odp: sex music
- ----- Original Message -----
From: duncan youngerman <y-man@wanadoo.fr>
> In particular the track "Rated X"...
> (IMHO a masterpiece 10-20 years ahead of its time. A real freak!)
oh yes. the version from 'in concert' is also great.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 11:24:45 +0100
From: duncan youngerman <y-man@wanadoo.fr>
Subject: the ultimate sex album
I'd forgotten this one!
"THROB", (ca.1970), by Gary Burton!
So erotic it ought to be sold with a pack of condoms...
DY.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 02:37:14 -0800
From: Fred Heller <velaires@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: nordine?
skip heller
> Does anyone else find Ken Nordine to be so incredibly fucking gimmicky and
> stupid?
>
> Just wondering.
>
> "Word jazz....more like nerd dad!"
>
> andrew
>
>
> -
Gee, ya wanna insult anyone else I've recorded with?
skip h
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 05:44:46 -0500
From: "Zachary Steiner" <zsteiner@butler.edu>
Subject: RE: Zorn as Miles???????? and SEX!!
>> Well yeah...but how many _BB_-type women do you come across, outside
the ones in films?
I've been with one and there are many others out there. I think you
have been looking for the wrong type of women. If silly college girls
can dig it, so can intelligent woman. I just think that if you
introduce it to them slowly, they can begin to appreciate it. It's not
an album that you can take in a big swallow, but in small tastes. It's
like a fine single malt scotch or good wine; you have to ease into it.
By the way, I love Jack Johnson and can't wait until the box set comes
out either at the end of this year or beginning of next. Whoohooo!!
Zach
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 13:55:33 +0100
From: duncan youngerman <y-man@wanadoo.fr>
Subject: Jack Johnson box-set
Hopefully the liner notes will tell us where/whom this great guitar riff
comes from.
DY.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 14:52:37 +0100
From: duncan youngerman <y-man@wanadoo.fr>
Subject: Re: Miles ("On the corner") off list
Remco Takken a =E9crit :
> I can see that you like this album, but the fact that great names must hav=
e
> been on it, and the fact that Elliott Sharp likes it, mean nothing to me=
=2E
>
> About critics, now and then:
> Great efforts have been made lately, to transform Miles' electric music in=
to
> pre drum'n'bass experiments, but to me especially On The Corner retains
> quite eventless =2E No matter when (now or then) certain critics said thei=
r
> thing about the album=2E
>
> I know a (white) guitar player who was on the album, it was the only Miles
> session he attended, and he isn't even on the recent session lists of thos=
e
> who seeked out the lists of players=2E For years, behind his back, things =
were
> said like: he's on the worst Miles album ever, and nobody will ever know=
=2E
> Can't help but smile about this tragic fate=2E=2E=2E
>
> Regards, Remco
>
> 2 non-musical reasons why many people, especially critics, were either
> pissed
> at this one or did'nt pay attention:
> -The cover art, cheapo, unsophisticated, cartoony (opposite of "Bitches
> Brew"
> or "In a Silent Way")=2E
> -The absence of any credits, although the musicians were top-notch=2E
> Miles was doing his <turning-my-back-to-white-intellectuals> number, and
> this
> time he did succeed =2E=2E=2E to go unnoticed=2E=2E=2Eby whites and blacks=
alike=2E
> Too bad because the music is one of the electric Miles peaks, Imho (I know
> Elliott Sharp also digs this album a lot, which makes sense!)
>
> Best,
> DY=2E
I can't imagine why you'd want to spare the z-listers this interesting excha=
nge
on a controversial album=2E
Just the sound alone -tabla, hand-claps, whistles, etc=2E is unique (for Mil=
es at
least) and visionary: predates techno-world attempts by Byrne-Eno, Laswell,
Zakir Hussein and others=2E None of these wannabees have the swing, the clas=
s,
the poetry, the funk that's in that album (and Mile's oeuvre in general)=2E
I don't talk about the riffs, melodies, background/foreground interplay, etc=
=2E
McLaughlin's playing is charged, Imho, more inspired than in his other Miles
contributions=2E Unless that's your friend playing (what the hell -is- his
name?)? But whoever he actually is, he does it to me like no other fusion
player I've chanced to hear=2E
It's a bit condescending of you to suppose the "big names" or E=2E Sharp hav=
e
something to do with my original appreciation of this album=2E Logically ,th=
en, I
should then love all the more all other albums on which "big names" are
actually listed or which known musicians like=2E "Jack Johnson" has many "bi=
g
names"(in fact, probably the same ones with a few exceptions) and is revered=
by
all the biggies=2E I think it's a lame album=2E
"On the corner" could have been recorded by the Friendly Neighborhood Fire D=
ept
Charity Ball Players as far as I'm concerned, it rocks!
You, however, seem to give much credit to what "things were said behind" so =
and
so's "back" about it being the "worst Miles album ever"=2E Who the bloody he=
ll
cares?
Tell your friend some people on this list think it's a great album and that =
he
should be incredibly proud!
DY=2E
>
>
> >
> >
> > -
>
> -
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 15:03:56 +0100
From: "Remco Takken" <r.takken@planet.nl>
Subject: Re: take the coltrane
> > colTRANE! criminey. it's like not getting bach. or led zeppelin. or, or
> > alfred hitchcock or something.
>
>
> Uh, I don't like Led Zep, Kurt. But I love Hitchock and Bach.
>
I always felt Led Zeppelin had a great producer and guitar player in Jimmy
Page. But live? No.
There are some really weird jammy bootlegs from 1969, but usually they waded
in the dark through their own material on stage.
Hardly play'em, but they surely influenced a whole lot of mediocre groups
like Guns'n'Poses.
Regards, Remco Takken
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 09:19:43 -0500
From: "David Beardsley" <db@biink.com>
Subject: Re: Jack Johnson box-set
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "duncan youngerman" <y-man@wanadoo.fr>
> Hopefully the liner notes will tell us where/whom this great guitar riff
> comes from.
> DY.
Does anybody know when this is coming out?
* David Beardsley
* http://biink.com
* http://mp3.com/davidbeardsley
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 10:20:53 -0500
From: James Hale <jhale@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Miles/"Jack Johnson"
Jack Johnson is about to be issued in its "complete" form a la In A Silent Way, so
that may unravel some of Teo's editing.
The film has long been tied up by copyright issues. Of the few people I know who
have seen it the consensus isn't too encouraging.
Brock Peters does that narration on the recording.
James Hale
duncan youngerman wrote:
>
> Re: Jack Johnson: I'm a little bothered by the production/editing, the "In a
> silent way"quote(s)("It's about that time", I think) being spliced back in
> there. A real creative let down, IMHO. Because of the film? (why is it never
> shown, BTW?)
> Also I think there's some talking by Miles about Jack Johnson in there.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 10:23:25 -0500
From: James Hale <jhale@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Jack Johnson box-set
It's McLaughlin.
Sonny Sharrock can be heard adding wah-wah and feedback.
There is already a bootleg circulating of Jack Johnson out-takes that makes
it clear who's doing what.
James Hale
duncan youngerman wrote:
> Hopefully the liner notes will tell us where/whom this great guitar riff
> comes from.
> DY.
>
> -
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 10:26:09 -0500
From: James Hale <jhale@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Miles ("On the corner") off list
> Remco Takken a Θcrit :
>
> > I know a (white) guitar player who was on the album, it was the only Miles
> > session he attended, and he isn't even on the recent session lists of those
> > who seeked out the lists of players.
Is that David Creamer?
I always wondered what happened to him.
Like Dominique Gaumont, he seems to have just disappeared since his Miles dates.
James Hale
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 10:32:49 -0500
From: James Hale <jhale@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Jack Johnson box-set
David Beardsley wrote:
> Does anybody know when this is coming out?
>
It is currently scheduled for fall 2002 by Sony Legacy, but these release
dates have been pushed back for the previous boxes.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 11:10:33 EST
From: UFOrbK8@aol.com
Subject: sex muzik.
alright. i can't resist.
gidon kremer - homage a piazzolla. this album, a little red wine, candles,
you're gonna get laid.
morton feldman - the viola in my life.
any arvo part
brian eno - music for airports.
miles davis - kind of blue. see under gidon kremer. ;)
i guess it's the clear difference between what women see as sex musik and
what men see as sex musik... the above are just CDs that put ME in the
mood... hehe...
and WRT eno/byrne being remastered - i own 'my life in the bush of ghosts' on
CD - wasn't it digitally remastered before it was released on CD? i don't
really care for that album - surprising to me, because i love eno AND byrne
almost equally. i think it's interesting, but it's a rare listen in my CD
player.
love,
k8.
n.p. - ween 'the mollusk'
- -----
[ .n o t h i n g i s w h a t i s s a i d. ]
.k a t e p e t e r s o n.
.c o m p o s e r / p e r f o r m e r.
<A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/uforbk8/kate.html">
http://www.geocities.com/uforbk8/kate.html</A>
<A HREF="http://www.icefoundation.org">http://www.icefoundation.org</A>
(roundtable)
- -
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 03:10:44 +1100
From: "Julian" <jcurwin@hartingdale.com.au>
Subject: Re: nordine?
> Gee, ya wanna insult anyone else I've recorded with?
probably...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 03:18:30 +1100
From: "Julian" <jcurwin@hartingdale.com.au>
Subject: Previte
<< As for someone else I have no interest in, who seems to get praised here
on a
regular basis -- Bobby Previte! Tried lots of times, but...I can't remember
the
last time I even contemplated pulling one of his CDs of the shelf again.
Bought
a few of them, always thought that he had assembled a great band, and
then...blah. >>
I usually like his stuff, not all brilliant but mostly good. My favourite is
Too Close To The Pole - great band, great compositions, great album...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 11:37:17 -0500
From: "Chad Mairn" <cmairn@tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: RE: the ultimate sex album
I don't know if Lovage has been mentioned yet. Nonetheless, the album
is titled _Music to Make Love to Your Old Lady By_ and Mike Patton and
Jennifer Charles are the vocalists. Dan the Automator produced the
album. It has a smooth R&B feel that is seasoned with some interesting
hip-hop. It has been quite some time since I've heard Patton sing this
beautifully. Track 3 (i.e. Anger Management) in particular is worth
checking out.
You can listen to the entire album at:
www.75ark.com
Chad Mairn
www.baszd-meg.com
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com
[mailto:owner-zorn->list@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of duncan
youngerman
>Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2002 5:25 AM
>To: zorn-list@lists.xmission.com
>Subject: the ultimate sex album
>
>I'd forgotten this one!
>
>"THROB", (ca.1970), by Gary Burton!
>So erotic it ought to be sold with a pack of condoms...
>
>DY.
- -
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 09:20:49 -0800
From: "s~Z" <keithmar@msn.com>
Subject: Re: Zorn as Miles????????
>>>Bitches Brew is sex music. KoB: most definitely not.<<<
They both definitely are. I much prefer the albums that followed
Bitches Brew. Dark Magus and Ahgarta are my favorite recordings
for lovemaking. On the Corner, too.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 12:03:56 +0100
From: "dekater" <dekater@worldonline.nl>
Subject: Re: Sex Music (JZ?)
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
- ------=_NextPart_000_0040_01C1B22B.03F4D780
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Samerivertwice@aol.com=20
To: zorn-list@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 11:10 PM
Subject: Sex Music (JZ?)
Given the depth and breadth of musical knowledge of this group, I bet =
we could come up with quite a long list of =
make-sweet-love-down-by-the-fire recommendations.
Anyone?
I'd recommend Rodrigo's "Concierto de Aranjuez" and Ravels "Bolero".
Pretty Spanish, uh?
Jan Luyben
- ------=_NextPart_000_0040_01C1B22B.03F4D780
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#b8b8b8>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"mailto:Samerivertwice@aol.com"=20
title=3DSamerivertwice@aol.com>Samerivertwice@aol.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
href=3D"mailto:zorn-list@lists.xmission.com"=20
title=3Dzorn-list@lists.xmission.com>zorn-list@lists.xmission.com</A> =
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, February 09, =
2002 11:10=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Sex Music (JZ?)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2>Given the depth and =
breadth of=20
musical knowledge of this group, I bet we could come up with quite a =
long list=20
of make-sweet-love-down-by-the-fire=20
recommendations.<BR><BR>Anyone?<BR></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT =
size=3D2></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2>I'd recommend =
Rodrigo's=20
"Concierto de Aranjuez" and Ravels "Bolero".</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2>Pretty Spanish,=20
uh?</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2>Jan=20
Luyben<BR></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>
- ------=_NextPart_000_0040_01C1B22B.03F4D780--
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 09:29:45 -0800
From: "s~Z" <keithmar@msn.com>
Subject: Re: sex muzik.
Some of Tricky's earlier stuff is fun to get stoned and make love
to.
When the wife is in a certain mood, the King Ubu Orchestru makes
interesting things happen.
Even Derek Bailey solo recordings can get inside certain places
erotically.
But, Leonard Cohen, if you make a copy of a collection of certain
songs with certain lyrics, is perhaps the best of all.
This is one of our faves:
Light As The Breeze
-- Leonard Cohen
She stands before you naked
you can see it, you can taste it,
and she comes to you light as the breeze.
Now you can drink it or you can nurse it,
it don't matter how you worship
as long as you're
down on your knees.
So I knelt there at the delta,
at the alpha and the omega,
at the cradle of the river and the seas.
And like a blessing come from heaven
for something like a second
I was healed and my heart
was at ease.
O baby I waited
so long for your kiss
for something to happen,
oh something like this.
And you're weak and you're harmless
and you're sleeping in your harness
and the wind going wild
in the trees,
and it ain't exactly prison
but you'll never be forgiven
for whatever you've done
with the keys.
O baby I waited ...
It's dark now and it's snowing
O my love I must be going,
The river has started to freeze.
And I'm sick of pretending
I'm broken from bending
I've lived too long on my knees.
Then she dances so graceful
and your heart's hard and hateful
and she's naked
but that's just a tease.
And you turn in disgust
from your hatred and from your love
and comes to you
light as the breeze.
O baby I waited ...
There's blood on every bracelet
you can see it, you can taste it,
and it's Please baby
please baby please.
And she says, Drink deeply, pilgrim
but don't forget there's still a woman
beneath this
resplendent chemise.
So I knelt there at the delta,
at the alpha and the omega,
I knelt there like one who believes.
And the blessings come from heaven
and for something like a second
I'm cured and my heart
is at ease
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 11:46:26 -0600
From: "Samuel Quentin" <nonintention@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Coltrane
i originally liked Tyner much more than Alice Coltrane. but that has since
reversed. tyner always had this rhythmic punch that was so dramatic. i
always thought that alice was almost shy sounding. eventually i realized
that her solos seem to have a really interesting flow to them. and she was
the first free pianist i had ever heard not to have the strong mark of cecil
taylor influence. (this was back when i was first getting into free jazz)
tyner is also my "least highly esteemed" member of the classic quartet,
but at the same time... for that quartet's unique sound, i think there was
no other pianist more right for the job. mainly because of tyner rhythmic
and dramatic comping. it would combine with the rough strength of garrison
and loud polyrhythmic drive of jones, y'know?
he almost made himself the drone like in ragas, only a drone that packs a
punch. in many of the pieces (moreso after 63-64) he would become almost as
a selfless ornamentation. and this i can respect.
but i do basically enjoy a lot of alice coltrane stuff more, as far as
singling out the pianists goes.
-samuel
Hello,
...music critic Richard Meltzer has openly expressed disdain for
McCoy
Tyner's playing, so you're not alone there. Me, I like 'em okay, though I
can say that Tyner is easily my least highly esteemed member of the Classic
Quartet. At times he can feel a little "plugged in". At other times his
playing moves wonderfully. So, anyone want to express favor for Alice over
McCoy?
I remain...
Joseph
NP: Blurt- s/t LP
NR: John Barth- "The Floating Opera"
- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com
[mailto:owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Zachary Steiner
Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 7:35 PM
To: zorn-list@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Coltrane
While talking about Coltrane, I thought about my own feelings about the
man. While I like him, I think his sound of his later period was more
successful with only another instrument playing, be it bass or drums. I
am growing to dislike whole quartet playing on Live in Japan and Stellar
Regions. It could be the piano, but I'm not sure. Am I just crazy or
does any one else concur.
Listening to Interstellar Space,
Zach
- -
- -
"Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?"
-William Butler Yeats
Q: Who is it who is walking towards me?
A: All things return into One; where does this last return?
Q: Who is it who is walking towards me?
A: Even when one affirms that there is something here, one omits the
whole.
_________________________________________________________________
Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V3 #771
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