In a message dated Wed, 9 May 2001 2:01:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com> writes:
> > If paper was expensive, the average quality
> > of poetry would raise :-).
>
> Ah, so by that logic you appear to believe
> that rich people intrinsically write better
> poetry.
I've been making it a point to steer clear of this argument, but I feel constrained to point out that you've got the logic of Patrice's comment exactly backward: if, as he says, there'd be less crappy poetry if you had to make real material sacrificies to produce it (so that only people who were really prepared to pay their dues would become poets), then it would precisely *not* be the rich who'd intrinsically write better poetry; for the rich, after all, would sacrifice the least to obtain expensive paper. And would therefore be the biggest source of non-dues-paying poetic dilettantes...
OK, as you were.
David
rp: The Band, Rock of Ages reissue: the encore
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Date: Wed, 9 May 2001 18:21:28 +0100 (WET DST)
From: Ricardo Reis <l43384@alfa.ist.utl.pt>
Subject: Re: grumpy over cecil
Hi Z-people!
\\Hence my ironic comment: are not all poets great these days? To
\\paraphrase the famous sentence on Manet: what is the name of the poet
who
\\lost the recipee for bad poetry?
Although the above quote is from Patrice i will incorporate
comments on posterior posts (or at least intent to). The question is being
brandish too lightly (as i see it). and yes... it can get confusing :)
Look at the word experimentation by E.E.Cummings for instance and
tell me that such is not poetry. sure it is easy to write words on paper
but is dependent on each one to acknowledge it. And this depends on
personal tastes and education. and by the way... you need not to buy an
instrument to make music... the body is a potential sound artefact ;)
Using Patrice example on "could I dare to say that a technical
notice for an appliance is not poetry?" why the hell not? i've crossed
some technical notices in apparatus that i must are truly works of art,
by this meaning that i could fell the touch of a craftsman in there, i.e.,
human genius. A said work of art depends so much on the maker as on the
experimenter (Godard is off-quoted in my campus as: "you did not like the
film? what have YOU done to improve it?" in an aid help program). Tell me
how many CDs have you disliked some time or other and listening to it some
time later it opens a hell of a new perspective? most of the time is a
question of perspective. i defend that the individual, in the experimenter
role is so creator like the original. like i can set (not like a switch
but till certain extent) myself in the mood to appreciate stuff that most
ignore (like those technical ads...).
I'm not jumping on anyone. My personal position to individuals
carrying flags for their tastes is to learn the most from them in such
area but always reminding me of their bias. and the more one is involved
"clannish" speaking, the more predicated it seems to me. but that is,
allas!, another personal point. if they are happy why not leave them
there? it's useless to pity them with so much know all around...
wishsss,
Ricardo Reis
"Non Serviam"
n.p. The Doors - Doors
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Date: Wed, 9 May 2001 21:14:12 +0200
From: Tim Blechmann <TimBlechmann@gmx.de>
Subject: Re[2]: Braxton recommendations
Ryan> Are the ECM Circle discs still in print in Europe? Anyone know any American
Ryan> dealers with those in stock (I'm thinking of one 2-cd set, but I'm not
Ryan> entirely clear on that).
at least in Germany they are available. 2-cd set, you are right.
wonderful stuff....
PEACE
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de
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Date: Wed, 9 May 2001 16:07:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: konrad <konrad@panix.com>
Subject: Re: State of poetry
On Wed, 9 May 2001, Patrice L. Roussel wrote:
>
> I never meant that poetry as an art was easy but that poetry is the art
> for which masquerading as an artist is the easiest. And since standards of
> criticism appear to have disappeared, we are exposed to a plethora of
> pathetic attempts at being creative by totally untalented people.
Agreed that mass access dilutes the talent, whatever medium. Agreed that
there's a lot of poetry that's bad, and not only that, that i don't like
or get. But i don't agree that the landscape is barren. There's work
that i like and respect, and there's work that i don't read, but respect.
That one is exposed to 'pathetic attempt' just means you have to hone your
skills at finding the good work, the work that _works_ for you.
I just think you have to jump in the pool before you can tell me it's too
hot or too cold. I, seemingly like Joseph, see the poetry scene like the
music scene, as a cauldron (to switch vessel metaphors) of peoples' tastes
and talent, where some people cook well and some get burnt.
But if you don't like anything AT ALL, why have an opinion?
konrad
NP: humm of this damn PC
^Z
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Date: Wed, 09 May 2001 16:25:17 EDT
From: Reaboi@aol.com
Subject: Something NEW: Thursday @ Knit (& Company Comments)
thanks, Steve, for your review of Company. I was there too, the first night, and I was TOTALLY disapointed. I thought Bailey was the only really brilliant one of the bunch, in regards to his concept. many of the others--not naming names--either (A) have put no thought into their 'concept' of improv, or (B) are really fighting too hard to get small, non-traditional sounds from their instruments. as a bassist very interested in 'extended tecniques.' compare the 'extended' facility of Guy, Parker, Phillips, Kowald, Reijseger, etc. with the string players in Company. there was just very little to hold all those tricks together... (certain musicians that night also made me crazy, to the point of pulling hair out! they should take some kind of improv class before they jump in there with Derek...)
well, that said, I feel foolish promoting an upcoming Knit gig, Thursday night starting at 9pm. I'm playing bass in the 11pm set. I really think it'll be great; some of these guys are total motherfuckers, I think just as good as almost any of the 'big names.' Hope to see you there.
Thursday night at the AlterKnit:
9pm Chong Vu, trumpet
Jared Hunter, tenor sax
Jaime Fennelly, double-bass & elec
Dave Treut, drums
11pm Anderew D'Angelo, bass clarinet & elec
Jake Danziger: violin
Jaime Fennelly: double-bass & elec
Dave Reaboi: double-bass
Aaron Siegel: drums
Cheers,
Dave
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Date: Wed, 9 May 2001 16:33:19 EDT
From: CuneiWay@aol.com
Subject: Re: Don't hate me. I couldn't help myself.
Steve writes:
>Don't hate me. I couldn't help myself.
Unless you are an EXTREMELY good & fast typist, I would think that your
fingers would hate you enough for all of us.
Enjoyed reading your report, even if I don't know the book you were making
fun of...
Steve F.
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Date: Wed, 09 May 2001 22:04:29 -0000
From: "Bill Ashline" <bashline@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: A Heartbreaking Report of Staggering Company
>From: "Steve Smith" <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
(and
>it's odd, perhaps, that Roger called it "Min's group," since 'Min' is, as I
>understand it, Min Xiao-Fen's family name, since her famous pipa-playing
>father's name is Min Ji-Qian, and everyone else's group was referred to by
>their proper name, like "Annie's group" and "Simon's group," so shouldn't
>the next group actually be "Xiao-Fen's group"? Just wondering.)
Not so odd really as north asians prefer being called by their surname,
which always comes "first," which for Americans would be as nice and jolly
and democratic as being called by one's "first" name (i.e. "given" name).
