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2000-09-26
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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V3 #74
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Tuesday, September 26 2000 Volume 03 : Number 074
In this issue:
-
Re: Buckethead Revisited
Re: Ishmael Calvino
Re: nyt thread review
Re: Jim Black in Philly
Re: dolphy /varese
Re: Dolphy Varese Bird
Re: Dolphy Varese Bird
mishazorn?
cdburning
Louis Andriessen
Re: mishazorn?
RE: mishazorn?
New Charles Lloyd (rec?)
Re: Andriessen
Re: New Charles Lloyd (rec?)
Re: New Charles Lloyd (rec?)
Re: New Charles Lloyd (rec?)
burroughs (no zorn content, well maybe a little ...)
Re: a little zorn content
Re: Marion Brown
Re: Marion Brown
Coleman's Chappaqua
Re: New Charles Lloyd (rec?)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 08:17:20 GMT
From: "Arthur Gadney" <a_gadney@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Buckethead Revisited
Hello,
Best and definately heaviest Buckethead CD is "Sacrifist" by Praxis.
But beware, he has made A LOT of garbage, IMHO....
ARTHUR_G
_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.
Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at
http://profiles.msn.com.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 07:40:34 -0400
From: Matt Teichman <mft4@cornell.edu>
Subject: Re: Ishmael Calvino
Hey! This is cool that so many Zorners are into Oulipo. We should start
an Oulipo list.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 09:34:29 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: nyt thread review
http://www.nytimes.com/2000/09/21/arts/21THRE.html
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP - Farmers Market, "Graovo Dance," 'Farmers Market' (Winter & Winter)
kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote:
> does anyone still have the url for the new york times threadgill review that was
> posted here in the last few days? i accidentally deleted it.
>
> thanks
>
> kg
> np: ann dyer & no good time fairies - revolver a new spin
>
> -
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 09:49:59 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Jim Black in Philly
Swell review, Craig. Thanks for posting...
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP - Farmers Market, "New Smesno," 'Farmers Market' (Winter & Winter)
Craig Matsumoto wrote:
> Just got back from seeing Jim Black's Alas No Axis in Philadelphia.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 09:56:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: Ken Waxman <mingusaum@yahoo.ca>
Subject: Re: dolphy /varese
Well if they're Young-owned tapes we'll probably never
hear them, unless of course he can be given full
composition credit for all the music they played that
day, maybe as The Theater of Eternal Sousa.
Ken Waxman
- --- graham connah <connah@earthlink.net> wrote:
> and lastly, there is a slim chance La Monte Young
> may have tapes of himself
> and Dolphy playing together in the sax section of a
> Los Angeles Junior
> College big band.
_______________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca
- -
------------------------------
Date: 26 Sep 2000 15:41:13 -0000
From: "Tim Keenliside" <timkeen@disinfo.net>
Subject: Re: Dolphy Varese Bird
On Tue, 26 Sep 2000 00:37:58 EDT Velaires@aol.com wrote:
>I remember thinking "if only" myself, and eventually came
to the conclusion that, given Charlie Parker's nature,
it's doubtful he would have turned out to be an intense
composer, no matter with whom he might have studied.
Also, I realized that very few people actually make the
huge contribution he made to the literature of music, so
he did quite enough.
>On the other hand, BIRD WITH STRINGS could not have
possibly been the closest he could have come to kicking
down the wall between jazz and through-composed music.
Right! So "if only" Bird had studied with Varese, maybe we
would have had the real deal (imagine Bird soloing in
'Deserts'!) instead of those mostly vapid 'With Strings'
sessions. Plus Bird WAS an intense composer, especially in
real time (i.e. improvisation), however the stigma still
remains that 'jazz' artists are somehow not to be
respected for the vital composers they are! Certainly
Bird, Trane, Mingus, Duke, Miles, etc. are composers in
every way on par with Stravinsky, Boulez, Varese, Ligeti,
_____________________________________________________________
Email your boss can't read - sign up for free disinfo.net email
at http://www.disinfo.com, your gateway to the underground
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 11:19:52 -0400
From: Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com>
Subject: Re: Dolphy Varese Bird
On Tue, Sep 26, 2000 at 03:41:13PM -0000, Tim Keenliside wrote:
> Plus Bird WAS an intense composer, especially in
> real time (i.e. improvisation), however the stigma still
> remains that 'jazz' artists are somehow not to be
> respected for the vital composers they are! Certainly
> Bird, Trane, Mingus, Duke, Miles, etc. are composers in
> every way on par with Stravinsky, Boulez, Varese, Ligeti,
Hrm, this gets into the question of whether improvisation is a subset
of composition, as you suggest. There are skills involved in composition
that don't come into play in improvisation -- while none of the
mentioned composers could probably have created a melodic line in real
time the word Bird, Trane, and Miles did, I doubt that any of the three
had the sophistication in large-form structure and orchestration found
in Stravinsky and the others (though perhaps Duke and Mingus may have).
- --
|> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <|
| jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt |
| Latest CD: Jerusaklyn http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 10:59:09 -0500
From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com
Subject: mishazorn?
just started reading 'new dutch swing' by kevin whitehead (recommended reading,
at least from someone who's on page 29).
stumbled on this:
"zorn's 1987 program of vintage (misha) mengelberg numbers (like "hodjazz,"
which he recorded as "number one") speaks for his familiarity with the material
- -- and the resemblance is sometimes striking. zorn's sputters are dolphy
thirdhand."
so, what 1987 program and where's "#1" recorded?
also, any comments on louis andriessen would be appreciated. i know nothink.
thanks, y'all.
kg
np: louis armstrong & duke ellington - the great summit/the master takes
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 11:44:56 -0500
From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com
Subject: cdburning
knight-ridder ran a sorta beginner's guide to cd burning today (should i start
doing this myself?). here's maybe the most valuable bit, but write me if you
want the whole thing.
Luckily I found CD recording aficionado Andy McFadden.
I discovered Andy's talents online at his home page: www.fadden.com/cdrfaq. In
his spare time, Andy has put together what is probably the most complete listing
available on the Web of information on how to convert vinyl records to digital
CDs. The list offers troubleshooting and warns of possible problems - not all
computer sound cards are top quality, for example. It also offers links to
various software applications that perform the recording functions.
Though I consider myself to be pretty tech-savvy, I have to admit that I was a
bit overwhelmed by some of the technical jargon on Andy's site. During a
conversation about A/D converters (that's analog-to-digital), audio DAT decks,
16-bit stereo samples and SoundBlaster sound cards, Andy lost me in the tech
talk. I think my silence tipped him off.
cheers.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 12:09:48 -0700
From: "Daryl Loomis" <DRL@valley-media.com>
Subject: Louis Andriessen
The only thing I have heard by Andriessen is "Rosa: Death of a Composer," =
a phenomenal modern opera centered around a film composer supposedly =
assasinated. The libretto and the stage direction are done by Peter =
Greenaway (who is currently my favorite film director). I think it's a =
nice step towards a resurgence of opera, which has, IMO, been pretty bad =
over recent times. This is the second of three operas the two have worked =
on together and I've heard the other two are quite good as well. If Rosa =
is any indication of Andriessen's other work, I'd say he's certainly worth =
looking into.
Hope that helps
Daryl Loomis
>>> <kurt_gottschalk@scni.com> 09/26 8:59 AM >>>
also, any comments on louis andriessen would be appreciated. i know =
nothink.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 15:30:22 EDT
From: Fastian@aol.com
Subject: Re: mishazorn?
In a message dated 9/26/00 11:59:08 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
kurt_gottschalk@scni.com writes:
<< stumbled on this:
"zorn's 1987 program of vintage (misha) mengelberg numbers (like "hodjazz,"
which he recorded as "number one") speaks for his familiarity with the
material
-- and the resemblance is sometimes striking. zorn's sputters are dolphy
thirdhand."
so, what 1987 program and where's "#1" recorded?
>>
Go to the end of the discography at the end of the book where collections are
located and you'll find October Meeting 1 on the Bimhuis label. This is what
he was referring to. I have Meetings 2 and 3 which are great but have no
Zorn. I think these releases are still generally available. Maybe Cadence
has them. Cheers.
John Threadgould
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 15:46:26 -0400
From: pequet@altern.org (Benjamin Pequet)
Subject: RE: mishazorn?
At 10:59 AM 9/26/00 -0500, kurt_gottschalk wrote:
>"zorn's 1987 program of vintage (misha) mengelberg numbers (like "hodjazz,"
>which he recorded as "number one") speaks for his familiarity with the
>material
>-- and the resemblance is sometimes striking. zorn's sputters are dolphy
>thirdhand."
>
>so, what 1987 program and where's "#1" recorded?
Probably the 'october meeting' I was referring to on this list a week or so
ago, in reference to Louis Sclavis. Live recordings during the festival at
the Bimhuis in Holland, in 1987. http://www.bimhuis.nl/
OCTOBER MEETING 1987, VOL.1
BIMHUIS 001, 1992, recorded 1987. IMPROVISED MUSIC
Total loss/Tribute to Misha Mengelberg: 1. Number One 2. G-Blues 3.
Broezimann (idea: John Zorn, music: Misha Mengelberg)
4. Et on t'a fait douter (Guus Janssen) 5. Duo (Christian Marclay/Louis
Sclavis)
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 17:15:56 -0400
From: Dan Hewins <dan@synsolutions.com>
Subject: New Charles Lloyd (rec?)
This may not be the proper forum to discuss this record but I trust
you and I know we have a wide range of tastes.
Has anyone heard the new Charles Lloyd record, "The Water Is Wide,"
on ECM? The lineup is quite intriguing: Brad Mehldau, John
Abercrombie, Larry Grenadier, Billy Higgins.
I'm looking at the ECM web site and the previous Lloyd album, "Voice
in the Night," has Abercombie, Higgins, and Dave Holland. Whew.
Anyone heard this?
Ok, ok, another one. (This ECM site is turning up a few more.)
Marion Brown "Afternoon Of A Georgia Faun" has on it Braxton, Corea,
Maupin and others. Who is Marion Brown?
Dan Hewins
np: Neutrino: "Motion Picture Sountrack"
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 17:42:23 -0400
From: Brian Olewnick <olewnik@idt.net>
Subject: Re: Andriessen
kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote:
> also, any comments on louis andriessen would be appreciated.
Back ten or twelve years ago, at one of the New Music America events, I
heard Andriessen's "Hoketus" (possible misspelling) and was pretty
impressed; a lot of intricate hocketing rhythms with a strong underlying
propulsiveness. On the strength of that, I bought "De Staat" on
Elektra/Nonesuch which I didn't like at all. Seemed to be a strident
grab bag of various minimalist techniques, most clearly those of John
Adams. The few other things of his I've caught on radio have leaned more
towards the "De Staat" end of things and have dissuaded me from
investigating further.
Brian Olewnick
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 18:55:42 EDT
From: Jeffcalt@aol.com
Subject: Re: New Charles Lloyd (rec?)
dan@synsolutions.com writes:
> Marion Brown "Afternoon Of A Georgia Faun" has on it Braxton, Corea,
> Maupin and others. Who is Marion Brown?
A sweet sounding alto sax player who's appeared on a number of "avant-garde"
jazz recordings, including Archie Shepp's 'Rife Music' and Coltrane's
'Ascension.' His moving "And They Danced On" appears on the newly reissued
'Wildflowers' set (which is essential avant-jazz listening, IMO).
Here's his disco:
http://www.fmi.uni-passau.de/~schneide/marion_brown/marion_brown.html
jeff caltabiano
n.p. parliament: the clones of dr. funkenstein (1976)
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 19:20:35 -0700
From: Rich Williams <punkjazz@snet.net>
Subject: Re: New Charles Lloyd (rec?)
>This may not be the proper forum to discuss this record but I trust
>you and I know we have a wide range of tastes.
>
>Has anyone heard the new Charles Lloyd record, "The Water Is Wide,"
>on ECM? The lineup is quite intriguing: Brad Mehldau, John
>Abercrombie, Larry Grenadier, Billy Higgins.
>
>I'm looking at the ECM web site and the previous Lloyd album, "Voice
>in the Night," has Abercombie, Higgins, and Dave Holland. Whew.
>Anyone heard this?
>
>Ok, ok, another one. (This ECM site is turning up a few more.)
>Marion Brown "Afternoon Of A Georgia Faun" has on it Braxton, Corea,
>Maupin and others. Who is Marion Brown?
Marion is a fantastic under-appreciated alto player first
known through a couple of ESP disks in the 60's, He played on Archie
Shepp's Fire Music and on Coltranes Ascension. and had at least a
couple of Impulse discs under his own name. I think he also recorded
for either Black Saint or Soul Note later on.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 20:44:17 EDT
From: Jeffcalt@aol.com
Subject: Re: New Charles Lloyd (rec?)
Jeffcalt@aol.com writes:
> A sweet sounding alto sax player who's appeared on a number of
"avant-garde"
> jazz recordings, including Archie Shepp's 'Rife Music'
make that 'Fire Music.' Sorry about the dyslexia.
jeff
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 21:47:30 +0000
From: Philippe Dupuis <dupuisph@nb.sympatico.ca>
Subject: burroughs (no zorn content, well maybe a little ...)
hello,
i'm new here ...
since all you guys have been talking about burroughs
i wanted to ask if he had intended NAKED LUNCH to
be a book that "one can just pick up at any place in
story and go from there".
read it frontwards, backwards, all disjointed etc.
... that there was to be no real structure to how he wanted
the book to be presented in. i can see that his cut up books
could follow this - but was it the same for naked lunch?
because i could see this as something similar to the
jump cuts in film ... they give the feeling of a messy
construction (as i'm sure the broken feel of naked
lunch is to experience total disorientation that might
be linked with being a drug user) but upon using
them in a film of mine ... i was a bit taken by their
efficiency and just placed them "anywhere" to give
the feeling i wanted. well, that turned out horrible
and i had to edit the whole thing back from scratch -
placing a much more focused attention to every beat
and cut that appeared.
therefore questioning the structure and method
behind how burroughs placed his "independent"
stories together in naked lunch, is it simply
cut and paste here and there ... or do you think
there was a detailed method to how and which
stories followed each other?
i do remember reading somewhere that the whole
book is framed (beginning and end)by chapters that
lend themselves more to the type of style he was
using in junky.
***
what would you guys consider the 10 essential
zorn albums to own?
thanks,
martin d.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 21:36:55 -0400
From: "Caleb T. Deupree" <cdeupree@erinet.com>
Subject: Re: a little zorn content
At 09:47 PM 9/26/00 +0000, Philippe Dupuis wrote:
>
>what would you guys consider the 10 essential
>zorn albums to own?
Usually I don't bite at these, but wot the hell. In no particular order.
Naked City
Redbird
Bar Kokhba
New Traditions in East Asian Bar Bands
Cobra (Hat)
a Masada (everybody needs at least one)
Big Gundown
Spillane
Cynical Hysterie Hour
Kristallnacht
The faq at http://www.browbeat.com/zornlist/faq.html has a typical selection.
Welcome to the list.
- --
Caleb Deupree
cdeupree@erinet.com
Work like you don't need the money. Love like you've never been hurt. Dance
like nobody's watching.
- -- Satchel Paige
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 22:31:34 -0400
From: Brian Olewnick <olewnik@idt.net>
Subject: Re: Marion Brown
Rich Williams wrote:
> and had at least a
> couple of Impulse discs under his own name.
Two of these, "Geechee Recollections" and "Sweet Earth Flying" are a
couple of the finest little-heard releases from the 70's, imho. Also
quite beautiful is the recording, by Amina Claudine Myers, of Brown's
solo piano compositions.
Brian Olewnick
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 22:37:43 EDT
From: JonAbbey2@aol.com
Subject: Re: Marion Brown
my favorite Marion Brown disc is Porto Novo (Arista/Freedom), a 1967 trio
session with Maarten Altena and Han Bennink. Why Not? (ESP) is also very
good, as is the aforementioned Afternoon Of A Georgia Faun (ECM).
Jon
www.erstwhilerecords.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 2000 00:31:02 -0300
From: "Sh" <malleable@post.com>
Subject: Coleman's Chappaqua
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
- ------=_NextPart_000_032E_01C0281A.37913DA0
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Anybody know where I can pick up that Ornette Coleman soundtrack, The =
Chappaqua Suite, which was mentioned here a few days ago? CDNow doesn't =
list it. Don't have any of his stuff, and of the few posts about the =
disc, it was said to be a good one. =20
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<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Anybody know where I can pick up that Ornette =
Coleman=20
soundtrack, <EM>The Chappaqua Suite, </EM>which was mentioned =
here a few=20
days ago? CDNow doesn't list it. Don't have any of his =
stuff, and of=20
the few posts about the disc, it was said to be a good one. =20
</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
- ------=_NextPart_000_032E_01C0281A.37913DA0--
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 2000 06:27:01 +0200
From: "Jerzy Matysiakiewicz" <jerzym@dom.zabrze.pl>
Subject: Re: New Charles Lloyd (rec?)
> >
> >Ok, ok, another one. (This ECM site is turning up a few more.)
> >Marion Brown "Afternoon Of A Georgia Faun" has on it Braxton, Corea,
> >Maupin and others. Who is Marion Brown?
>
He made several albums with the famous krautrock band "Embryo"
Jerzy
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V3 #74
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