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1999-03-09
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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V2 #616
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Wednesday, March 10 1999 Volume 02 : Number 616
In this issue:
-
CT/Dewey/Elvin
Wow 2
Re: Wow 2
Avant links
CT/Dewey/Elvin confirmed; ghosts in the CD changer
Mack Goldsbury [Re: Vandermark]
Re: Recent Goodies
Re: Momentum Space?
Re: Caifanes/Ribot
Re: Caifanes/Ribot
The solution to my Tony Oxley mystery
Re: Wow 2
Supersilent 1-3
Re: Avant links
"The Improvisation Meeting in Chicago" CD
Re: Dewey Redman
Re: COBRA
Momentum Space--a review
Roscoe Mitchell "Nine to Get Ready"
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 15:16:53 -0800
From: Martin_Wisckol@link.freedom.com (Martin Wisckol)
Subject: CT/Dewey/Elvin
I swear I saw an ad for this album -- talk about double takes -- in
Downbeat. I'll check when I get home tonight and post the details if
somebody doesn't beat me to it.
Martin
np. Latin Playboys -- Dose
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 09 Mar 1999 22:28:23 -0500
From: Push <perna8601@duq.edu>
Subject: Wow 2
I've got quite a few Tzadik and Avant discs and all are notable for
their generally superior quality in packaging and sound. However, one
of my favorites, Boredoms' Wow 2 on Avant, sounds like it was recorded
through a mud filter; this is all the more baffling considering that
Zorn was actually at the helm at these sessions.
My question: Do all copies sound like this, or did I get a bad pressing
or something? I know Boredoms often indulge in deliberate lofi
recording tech, but none of their other full length albums sound this
murky (though Super Roots 3 comes close).
thanks in advance,
- -push
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 09 Mar 1999 21:38:55 -0600
From: Craig Rath <fripp@ibm.net>
Subject: Re: Wow 2
At 10:28 PM 3/9/99 -0500, you wrote:
>My question: Do all copies sound like this, or did I get a bad pressing
>or something? I know Boredoms often indulge in deliberate lofi
>recording tech, but none of their other full length albums sound this
>murky (though Super Roots 3 comes close).
>
Actually, my copy sounds rather good. I think you either have a bad
pressing or what you refer to as muddy production is exactly what they were
going for. Considering the personnel that were involved in the production
and engineering of the album, I can't imagine they would accidentally make
something sound muddy. Compared to some of their older albums (and other
albums from around the same time) it's remarkably clear sounding. The
distortion and haze seems intentional.
Or it could be that my eardrums are fried enough that I can't tell anymore.
A steady course of Fushitsusha can do that to you.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 22:46:34 EST
From: Nvinokur@aol.com
Subject: Avant links
<A HREF="http://wfmu.org/~kennyg/links.html">kenny g's avant links</A>
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 20:02:43 -0800
From: Martin_Wisckol@link.freedom.com (Martin Wisckol)
Subject: CT/Dewey/Elvin confirmed; ghosts in the CD changer
Page 15 of the April 1999 Downbeat
Ad is titled: Dance of the Titans
DR, CT, EJ Momentum Space/Verve (!)
"A powerful program of trios, duets and solos, this 1998 studio session
beautifully documents the landmark collaboration between these three
giants of improvised music." www.verveinteractive.com
Meanwhile ... my CD changer at home, when set on random, will play each
cut on each of the five discs, once before repeating any cut. But my
JVC car changer is closer to a true random play -- and it gets into
grooves (and ruts) where it likes two or three of the six CDs more than
the others, and even likes certain cuts better than others. I had the
thing fully loaded today yet in an hour and a half on the road, heard
cut five (Inspiration of Silence) from Horace Tapscott's aiee! The
Phantom three times! I still don't think it's one of the strongest
cuts, but my JVC thinks otherwise.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 01:03:38 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Mack Goldsbury [Re: Vandermark]
John Howard wrote:
> Mack Goldsbury (where the hell is he?)
I don't think I'd come across Goldsbury's name since Berne's "Songs and
Rituals in Real Time." But there's a new disc on the VKJK label pairing him
with pipe organist Andreas Bottcher, "Sunday's Symphonies," that is fairly
positively reviewed in the March issue of Cadence, pg. 131. (The label does
not appear to be carried be North Country, however, leading to the question
of ready availability...)
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP - nothing... starting to save up my pennies for "Sol Niger Within," which
I saw at Lethal last weekend... thanks, Dgasque...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 01:23:32 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Recent Goodies
David Keffer wrote:
> Dock Boggs - "Complete Early Recordings" - (Revenant, 1997) - cd
This is currently out of print and it sometimes takes Revenant a while to get
things back into print (especially since right now all of their resources are
plugged into the expensive upcoming Beefheart box), so if anyone's interested in
the Dock Boggs, grab it soon.
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP - Oh my dear Lord, it's none other than TONY OXLEY on the "BET on Jazz"
channel!!! Wonder if that means the soprano player is John Surman? The
flugelhornist has to be Kenny Wheeler... that would make the most sense. Don't
recognize the pianist or bassist, but this is very mainstream music. Anyway,
it's kinda neat watching Tony bash away Elvin Jones style on his kooky little
kit.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 01:29:03 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Momentum Space?
brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu wrote:
> Just saw a reference to a disc with this title by a trio consisting of
> Dewey Redman, Cecil Taylor and Elvin Jones (!!!!). Is this correct?
> Anyone else heard of it?
Yes, and yes. As Ken Waxman pointed out, there was a mention of this project
on booking agent Joel Chriss's website as a potential act to be booked this
summer, and I had to phone immediately for more details when I saw this about
two weeks ago. (The tour's NOT happening, but Joel still hopes to possibly
send the Taylor/Jones duo out to some festivals... still, don't hold your
breath).
The session was conceived and produced by John Snyder, maestro of A&M Horizon,
A&M Jazz Modern Masters, and other notable and extremely short-lived
avant-garde series on American major labels. The record was made for the
French Gitanes label, a branch of once-Polygram/now-Universal. I'd been told
by Joel that it was unlikely to be released in the U.S. and thought that just
had to be wrong.
And lo and behold, not only was there an ad in Down Beat as mentioned here by
Martin Wisckol, but on another mailing list I'm on, WNUR's Seth Tisue asked if
anyone had heard the new Taylor/Redman/Jones disc "issued today" by Verve.
Guess I'll be going shopping again tomorrow...
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP - still watching that Kenny Wheeler thing with Tony Oxley on "BET on Jazz,"
much to my continued disbelief... not disbelief that I'm watching, of course,
but disbelief that Tony's on my TV and it's not "Burning Poles"...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 01:52:25 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Caifanes/Ribot
hulinare@bemberg.com.ar wrote:
> Steve Smith wrote:
>
> >If this band sang in English, it most likely would have enjoyed
> >worldwide video hits, as their impassioned '80s style hard-edged yet
>
> I'm not quite sure about this, nevertheless I ask myself why any group
> would sing their lyrics in English instead people try to learn the
> language that group sings.
Hugo, your points are well taken, but while it's one thing to expect a
single listener or a small group of enthusiasts to consider learning a
foreign language to better enjoy a performance or recording in that
language (though Lord knows I'm way too lazy and would just as soon follow
a libretto), it's quite something else to expect the lazy American masses
to do so.
Thus, my point was that if Caifanes had *chosen* to sing in English,
certainly the common tongue in the U.S. and increasingly a worldwide
language, they would have had Big Hits on MTV and the like because they
played Cool Songs that were not Overtly World Music and also they Looked
Really Cute (especially the singer), and many more thousands of people
would likely have flocked to them if given an easy way to do so. But those
incentives were not enough for the band to give up its fierce dedication to
its native tongue and culture, and that I actually consider to be quite
admirable. I suppose they were quite happy with the many thousands of fans
they enjoyed in the Spanish speaking world (including in the U.S.A.), and
slackers like me were just along for the ride and the tunes.
But hey, it doesn't bother me that I don't know what Nusrat or the Ruins
are singing, either, and my Schubert lieder sets all come with
translations...
> But don't worry Steve; this is not nothing personal, naturally.
Naturally. No offense taken, and besides, as I've already admitted, I *am*
lazy. I won't speak for my countrymen, however... my girlfriend speaks
three or four languages, but she's way smarter and more industrious than me
in *most* ways.
Speaking of Ribot turning up in odd places, has anyone yet heard the new
David Sylvian album?
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP - Tony Oxley making like Art Blakey on his wacky mutant drum kit...
"BET on Jazz," where good things come to those who surf...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 22:59:29 -0800 (PST)
From: SUGAR in their vitamins? <yol@esophagus.com>
Subject: Re: Caifanes/Ribot
On Wed, 10 Mar 1999, Steve Smith wrote:
> and besides, as I've already admitted, I *am*
> lazy. I won't speak for my countrymen, however... my girlfriend speaks
> three or four languages, but she's way smarter and more industrious than me
> in *most* ways.
the mind boggles at such a thought!
hasta.
Yes. Beautiful, wonderful nature. Hear it sing to us: *snap* Yes. natURE.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 02:01:22 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: The solution to my Tony Oxley mystery
If you haven't been following the little NP messages at the end of my
posts tonight, you can delete this now.
For those who were curious, the band I'd been watching tonight on "BET
on Jazz," taped "Live at the Brewhouse," was: pianist Gordon Beck,
trumpeter/flugelhornist Kenny Wheeler, saxophonist/flutist Stan
Sultzman, bassist Dieter Ilg and (yes!) percussionist Tony Oxley.
I can sleep better now.
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP - nothing... why spoil what I just heard? :-)
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 02:06:20 PST
From: "Douglas Clarke" <dugc@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Wow 2
>From: Push <perna8601@duq.edu>
>To: zorn-list@lists.xmission.com
>Subject: Wow 2
>I've got quite a few Tzadik and Avant discs and all are notable for
>their generally superior quality in packaging and sound. However, one
>of my favorites, Boredoms' Wow 2 on Avant, sounds like it was recorded
>through a mud filter; this is all the more baffling considering that
>Zorn was actually at the helm at these sessions.
>
>My question: Do all copies sound like this, or did I get a bad
pressing
>or something? I know Boredoms often indulge in deliberate lofi
>recording tech, but none of their other full length albums sound this
>murky (though Super Roots 3 comes close).
Well, mine sounds pretty unusual as well, but that's what makes it so
amazing! I think Zorn really found the best way to deliver the punch
that the boredoms are capable of on this album.
- -Doug
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 03:38:52 -0800
From: Gene Natalia <anubis9@concentric.net>
Subject: Supersilent 1-3
Someone posted something about Supersilent's newest, 4-6, so I figured I'd
finally get around to picking up that 1-3 I've had my eye on. I'd heard
about them before, and I really like the remix project that Deathprod
shared with Biosphere of Arne Nordheim's Electric, so I shelled out my
$20.99 and took the 3cd's home and now I'm all happy. Imagine Sun Ra in at
his noisiest, with plenty of electronics thrown in, and maybe that
describes it inadequately, but at least somewhat. Parts of it remind me a
lot of Radian, but whereas Radian was kind of funky, rockish and dubbish,
Supersilent stems from improv-jazz. I guess parts of it remind me of some
of Mr. Bungle's noisier electronics on Disco Volante as well. In fact, if
someone told me these were 3 discs of members of Bungle improvising, I
would nearly fall for it. In any case, I just wanted to let the person who
mentioned the 4-6 know that 1-3 is also quite good.
-Ethan
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 07:30:33 -0500
From: "Caleb T. Deupree" <cdeupree@erinet.com>
Subject: Re: Avant links
At 10:46 PM 3/9/99 EST, Nvinokur@aol.com wrote:
> <A HREF="http://wfmu.org/~kennyg/links.html">kenny g's avant links</A>
Amazing, there's actually some very interesting stuff here.
- --
Caleb Deupree
cdeupree@erinet.com
Computers are useless; they can only give you answers
- -- Pablo Picasso
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 20:36:53 +0800
From: Jan-wen Lu <janwenlu@ficnet.net>
Subject: "The Improvisation Meeting in Chicago" CD
Hi,
Anyone know where I can get the "The Improvisation Meeting in Chicago" CD(Radio
Off Duty, LFQR 779 CD) from online distributor? It features a lot of great
players such as Jim O'Rourke, Taku Sugimoto, David Grubbs, Fred Lonberg-Holm,
Kevin Drumm, etc. Also, how to order the new Zeena Parkins CD?
Jan-wen Lu
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 13:04:23 GMT0BST
From: DR S WILKIE <S.Wilkie@swansea.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Dewey Redman
When I saw Dewey Redman in the mid-to-late 80s, he seemed interested
in starting "in" and then going "way way out" (this, over a concert,
rather than in the course of each and every tune). This struck me as
a thoroughly good strategy (one COULD take it to be a compromise
between setting the agenda and giving the audience what they want),
for it seemed as though he was able to take all the audience all the
way out with him.
Incidentally, did anyone pick up the Impulse reissue of Ear Of The
Behearer? I was impressed by their willingness to include, as bonus
material, HALF of his subsequent album, Coincide. Then again, that
may be down to my view that they picked the RIGHT half and dispensed
with the drivelly zither playing and (as if I haven't stuck my neck
out enough) one or two half-baked improvs.
Sean Wilkie
NP (ie not playing) "Somnaficient"
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 09:26:00 -0500
From: Peter Risser <risser@goodnews.net>
Subject: Re: COBRA
<<
Joe Zitt said:
I'm intrigued by the existence of a Cobra Ensemble out there. How large is
the group? Do you get together regularly, or only for occasional events?
Do you do other material?
>>
I'm curious too, since I live here and never heard of it before.
Do they all have a schedule?
I understand they are playing this Friday, but I can't make it.
Curiouser and Curiouser,
Peter
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 99 09:41:20 -0500
From: brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu
Subject: Momentum Space--a review
Picked this up last night, got home too late to give it a spin, so
this is based on a single, low-volume listen on the office boombox, a
less than adequate sound system. With those caveats:
I'll get my major peeve out of the way first. I find it a little
annoying that you have a, presumably, one-time grouping of three
talents like this and instead of an hour of trio playing you get half
that, the rest devoted to solo and duo tracks. Given that...
1) 'Nine' (Redman) is a very fine trio performance that sounded, to
me, much in line with the Candid 1960 sessions that produced the 'Air'
release. Redman, in fact, sounds uncannily like Shepp on those dates.
It's a beautiful, roiling piece that boded well for the remainder of
the disc.
2) 'Bekai' (Jones) a 4-minute drum solo with a processional kind of
feel. Not bad, but not what I was looking for.
3) 'Spoonin'' (Redman) (Wasn't this recorded on one of Dewey's
records?) A tenor/drums duet with Redman in fine form, getting into
his breathy style towards the end. Not earth-shaking, but nice.
4) 'Life As' (Taylor) A superb 8 1/2 minute Taylor solo, in his
subdued mode. Gorgeous playing, reminding me of the more 'romantic'
moments of 'Silent Tongues'.
5) 'It' (Taylor) A piano/drums duet. Taylor is fine, Jones kind of
just follows along; not a lot of exciting interplay.
6) 'Is' (Taylor) A 20 minute trio piece, episodic in character, solos
and duos formed along the way. Redman plays quite romantically here
and the piece ends with another beautiful, quiet Taylor solo.
7) 'Dew' (Redman) a 49 second Redman solo, basically a throway add-on;
strange way to end the record.
Overall, well worth owning, if not as rich as one might have hoped.
The opening trio is probably as fine as any other trio of like
instrumentalists could record today and Cecil's playing throughout,
especially on that solo track is as great as we've come to expect.
While not nearly as disappointing as his collaboration with the Art
Ensemble a few years back, it still suffers from an similar odd
production approach, a certain tentativeness in programming. Would've
liked to have had simply a full trio set on the level of the first
cut, but....
Brian Olewnick
PS: Due to monetary restrictions (potential angry wifely stares), I
passed on the new Mitchell ECM release; anyone heard this yet?
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 10:22:16 -0500 (EST)
From: eric ong <eso200@is5.nyu.edu>
Subject: Roscoe Mitchell "Nine to Get Ready"
Hello,
The new Roscoe Mitchell got realeased stateside yesterday, and I managed
to pick myself up a copy. Someone on the list mentioned that it had been
receiving rave reviews, so my expectations were rather high. Overall, I'm
quite happy with most of the tracks. Some are very reminiscent of AEC's
work on ECM (no surprise) and others have a swarming free improv feel,
evryone circular breathing like there's no tomorrow. "Leola", the opener,
has the introspective sadness of Coltrane's "Alabama", and is truly a
stunner (albeit in the ECM variety). The thick horn section gives the
whole record a bigger, richer sound, and when the whole band starts
jamming together your ear can wander among the different levels.
Characteristically, most of the horns are set slightly out of tune. So
rest assured, some very good tunes in the spirit of collectivism that
animated the AEC.
eric.
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V2 #616
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