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1998-10-17
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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V2 #503
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Sunday, October 18 1998 Volume 02 : Number 503
In this issue:
-
interesting hip-hop ???
Re: interesting hip-hop ???
Fushitsusha on Victo
end of masada releases?
tape trading
Music for Children
Re: interesting hip-hop ???
Nancarrow
On the Subject of Zorn and Composing
Harmonia Mundi
Re: interesting hip-hop ??? / Nils Petter Molvaer
Re: interesting hip-hop ???
Good Hip-Hop
re: spoken word
Re: Bell
David Grubbs
CD sale
Re: interesting hip-hop ???
Thurston's label
Re: sean
Re: Thurston's label
new Krakauer and Coleman
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 17:01:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: Anish Kejariwal <anishk@jps.net>
Subject: interesting hip-hop ???
Sorry, for the non-zorn content, but...in light of the recent thread on
post modernism and hip-hop, I was wondering if someone can give me some
good hip-hop recs? I have a friend who is an avid hip-hop collector, but
when he is playing stuff for me a lot of it sounds kind of simple and
unintersting (ex: Fugees, KRS-1). So far, I like Del the Funky Homosapien
and De La Soul. Some of Shadow's Pre-Emptive strike is really cool, but
Entroducing is way too simple and boring. I also like some of the DJ stuff
(like Qbert), and a couple drums n' bass albums (Amon Tobin's Permutation
and Squarepusher's Port Rhombus are great! feed me wierd things is
OK...some drums n' bass is way too bleak and sterile for me). So, I should
like something, but I just need to figure out what...I guess I should check
out some Wu-tang.
If this is way off topic (and way too vague), you can just respond to me
personally.
[also, I can't remember who it was, but I was in the midst of working out a
trade for a Rubber City tape...but I lost his e-mail address. Please
contact me if you are still interested. Or, if someone else could make me
a copy, I'd really appreciate it.]
thanks in advance,
Anish
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 17:17:42 -0700
From: Jeff Spirer <jeffs@hyperreal.org>
Subject: Re: interesting hip-hop ???
At 05:01 PM 10/16/98 -0700, Anish Kejariwal wrote:
>Sorry, for the non-zorn content, but...in light of the recent thread on
>post modernism and hip-hop, I was wondering if someone can give me some
>good hip-hop recs? ...
The absolute best hip-hop of all time, especially for someone reading this
list, is New Kingdom's _Paradise Don't Come Cheap_, sadly deleted around
the time it came out by the morons at Polygram, but I see it used
occasionally.
Part Beefheart, part Hendrix, part insane. Maybe totally insane. Mix of
live and samples, I think there is quite a bit of live guitar on it.
Nothing comes close. And I say this as someone who listens to a fairly
broad range of hip-hop. (The first New Kingdom is not nearly as good,
although worth owning.)
Jeff Spirer
B&W Photos: http://www.pomegranates.com/frame/spirer/
Color and B&W Photos: http://www.hyperreal.org/~jeffs/gallery.html
Axiom/Material: http://www.hyperreal.org/axiom/
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 20:22:18 -0400
From: "David J. Keffer" <keffer@shell.planetc.com>
Subject: Fushitsusha on Victo
>From: FJG_Lamerikx <flamerik@best.ms.philips.com>
>Yesterday, I picked up...the Fushitsusha release on Victo... What is wrong
with
>non-Japanese Fushitsusha releases? Why don't they stick with the all-black
>artwork concept? Plus, do I really need an explanation from Alan Cummings
about
>the style of the title printed in the inner sleeve?
FWIW: I heard from Alan Cummings that neither he nor Haino approved the
use of
that explanation on the sleeve. Victo did that on their own.
Anyway, while that quote is not essential, it hardly detracts from the album.
>I also think that the music
>does not stand up to any of the four Tokuma Fushitsusha releases - they more
>than definitely have an edge production-wise that I miss here, and I also
>missed it on the Gold Blood album (which also had lousy artwork). You only
>need to compare the version of "Pathetique" featured here to that on the
album
>of the same name to find out why I prefer PSF and Tokuma releases.
>Frankco.
I think this is a matter of personal preference. The albums you cite as
superior
are all studio recordings. The two albums you cite as inferior are live
recordings. Generally, one sacrifices some control over sound quality in
exchange for the energy of a live recording. Also, I hardly think the appeal
of Fushitsusha lies in the "edge production-wise". Lastly, I think the
recordings widely regarded as choice Fushitsusha are live recordings,
PSF 15/16 and PSF 3/4.
David "Over-production is a vice. Under-production is an aesthetic." K.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 20:57:33 -0400
From: "Robert L, III Swanger" <rls183@psu.edu>
Subject: end of masada releases?
I was going through the forced exposure web site the other day and it said
the masada 10 was going to the be last one of the series. can anyone on
this list verify this and has zorn given any reason as to why.
sorry, if this has been asked already but i'm quite new to the list and i
didn't find an answer in the faq so i thought that i would ask. thanks
Robert
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 19:59:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Arnold <david_a@efn.org>
Subject: tape trading
Sorry beforehand if this is not appropriate for the list. I have quite a
lot of Miles Davis 70's live concerts (about 60) and I want to start
collecting Zorn material - Zorn in any and all of his guises and
manifestations, I haven't heard anything yet from him that did not at
least intrigue me. So far all I have are several commercially-released
albums and one live boot: Naked City 10/9/88 at the Spontaneous Music
Festival in Quebec, from an FM broadcast, 88' on cassette, very good
quality.
My trade lists and requirements are at http://www.efn.org/~david_a/trading
Please reply OFFLIST, thanks!
david
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 23:09:25 -0700
From: Anne & Dan Dellosso <adosso@desupernet.net>
Subject: Music for Children
<HTML>
<P> I found out that Music for Children is pushed back a month or
more due to the cover being misprinted (the front and back covers are reversed).
So John destroyed all the copies except for 25 who he gave to a friend
of his to sell who i happen to know, so i guess i'll be getting my copy
by mon. If anyone is interested i can give a short review once received.
<P> dan
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<P>9</HTML>
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 23:38:22 EDT
From: Knutboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: interesting hip-hop ???
The new Outkast album, "Aquemini", is the absolute bomb. In particular, the
track "SpottieOttieDopaliscious", an amazing mix of a high school marching
band mixed ala King Tubby, a killer MC and bass line. One of the most
progresssive things I've heard all year, and in Hip Hop. JayZ's "Hard Knock
Life" (the song, not the album) is also pretty great.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 22:44:50 -0400
From: Risser Family <risser@goodnews.net>
Subject: Nancarrow
Anyone know if anyone has done any MIDI versions if Nancarrow's stuff? =
It seems like it's the obvious way to reporduce them in this day and =
age. It wouldn't have the cool huffiness of the straining player piano, =
but at the same time, the speed and agility of non-human playing was =
what he was aiming for.
In a similar vein, my 'rents got one of them new fangled player pianos =
that use floppies. I tried hacking one open and making my own music, =
but it wasn't so easy. In any case, I think that'd be fab and close to =
what Nancarrow was trying to do, plus you have the actual mechanical =
piano, not a computer simulcrum.
Anyone know anyone else who's exploring these areas?
Anyone know if Nancarrow ever branched out into, say, Nickolodeons?
Just pondering.
Peter
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 22:54:09 -0400
From: Risser Family <risser@goodnews.net>
Subject: On the Subject of Zorn and Composing
I know this is late, but I been reading the subject of, does Zorn really =
deserve the "Composer" credit or royalties considering the musicians are =
improvising and doing the real "work".
Aside from the obvious argument that a lot of times the improvs are =
directed by Zorn's loose compositions,
I think Zorn has a great talent similar to that of James Brown, George =
Clinton and Miles Davis. It's not so much that they write great music =
or play fantastic, although that's certainly true for all the above. =
What they really have going for them is that they manage to gather =
together in the same room a supernatural group of performers who click =
together, share the artist's vision and end up churning out amazing tune =
after amazing tune.
Anyway, I think that's worth something, and it often gets overlooked.
I think that's why Zorn's stuff is so great, not just because his =
talents as a player and a composer, but as a... producer? Gatherer? =
Something like that.
Peter
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 22:56:27 -0400
From: Risser Family <risser@goodnews.net>
Subject: Harmonia Mundi
Sort of totally off subject, although we did talk about Musique Concrete =
for a while...
Does anyone know where I can snag copies of the Cultures Electroniques =
series on Harmonia Mundi? I've got #6 and it rules. I've heard 2 and 4 =
in the past and they are serious computer music efforts as well. But I =
think they're all out of print. Anyone got any clues?
Please reply off list, if that's appropriate.
Thansk!
Peter
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 22:52:56 -0500
From: clockwise <clockwis@mail.execpc.com>
Subject: Re: interesting hip-hop ??? / Nils Petter Molvaer
anyone interested in jazzy hiphop with brilliant, meaningful lyrics should
check out Aceyalone "A Book of Human Language". Its on a small independant
label called Project Blowed Recordings. the new A Tribe Called Quest album
has some great beats as well but ive never been impressed with their
lyrics, and the new album as failed to change my opinion.
ps - is it just me or is the Nils Petter Molvaer release "Khmer" just a
poor (swedish) man's Grassy Knoll?
peace
clockwise
At 11:38 PM 10/16/98 EDT, you wrote:
>The new Outkast album, "Aquemini", is the absolute bomb. In particular, the
>track "SpottieOttieDopaliscious", an amazing mix of a high school marching
>band mixed ala King Tubby, a killer MC and bass line. One of the most
>progresssive things I've heard all year, and in Hip Hop. JayZ's "Hard Knock
>Life" (the song, not the album) is also pretty great.
>
>-
>
>
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 21:13:15 -0700
From: Michael Howes <mhowes@best.com>
Subject: Re: interesting hip-hop ???
>Sorry, for the non-zorn content, but...in light of the recent thread on
>post modernism and hip-hop, I was wondering if someone can give me some
>good hip-hop recs?
Some of my favorite hiphop includes...
Solid rhyming and interesting
Latyrx
SoulSides
Blackalicious
Dr Octagon
Matabase N' Breath (most things on BOMB are solid)
There are two really great comps for DJ/scratching stuff called "Return of
the DJ" volumes one and two.
The Invisible Scratch Pickles are the best scratchers hands down.
mike
mhowes@best.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 23:33:16 -0700
From: Joe Tait <tait@pdq.net>
Subject: Good Hip-Hop
I would add Digable Planets and along the "acid jazz" end of hip-hop, Dj
Krush, Dj Cam, Portishead, Differenz, Dj Vadim; and plenty of others.
How about herbie hancock's future shock??? i think everyone rememebers
the rock it video.....still does it for me :)
Joe
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 01:59:55 EDT
From: Sulacco@aol.com
Subject: re: spoken word
any of the ken nordine word jazz records are superb
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 03:09:41 -0400
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Bell
Sean Terwilliger wrote:
> How about the upcoming
> Django Bates on screwgun?
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/ssmith36/SC70007.htm
available now via mail and soon in stores...
Astrud Gilberto meets Bjork in a post-modern jazz lounge, that's my take.
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP: Nels Cline Trio - "Sad" (following a killin' Mike Watt "opera" gig at the
Knit featuring lots and lots o' Nels... plus a swell cameo by Carla
Bozulich...)
The Nels Cline Trio, what a great band that was...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 09:50:23 -0400
From: "David J. Keffer" <keffer@shell.planetc.com>
Subject: David Grubbs
Well I suspect there are some gastr del sol fans on this list
so I am going to post a review of the first post-gastr
David Grubbs release, "The Thicket" on Drag City.
I dug the gastr del sol records (including the first one
before O'Rourke joined), the various Jim O'Rourke projects,
and the David Grubbs solo instrumental album on Table of the
Elements. I thought I would check "The Thicket" out
despite the description I saw of it as pure, unadulterated pop.
(Really I have nothing against pure, unadulterated pop, if it's good.)
Plus it has Tony Conrad as a member of "the band". With so
many good things going for it, how could I go wrong?
Well, "The Thicket" is tepid, one notch up from bad, maybe two notches.
The songs sound like rough drafts of songs that gastr
del sol would have rejected. The songs are truly pop-like;
you hear the beginning of a slow, bad pop song and immediately
you can predict the entire progress of the song and you know
you just don't want to hear the whole laborious, plodding
song to its agonizingly tedious conclusion. That's my
impression on this album. Anybody else find something I am
missing?
David "five second listen, cringe, skip to the next track" K.
p.s. On rereading, this review is admittedly overly harsh.
But imagine this: a song about a train where Tony Conrad
gets on the violin and imitates the Doppler effect of a train
approaching and receding...
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 10:33:13 -0400
From: Tom Pratt <tpratt@smtc.net>
Subject: CD sale
I hope you guys don't hate these things...
$10 a pop. I'll cover the shipping.
Derek Bailey & Henry Kaiser - Wireforks: Guitar Duets (Shanachie)
The Bucketheads - All In The Mind (Big Beat)
FJF - Blow Horn (OkkaDisk) w/Vandermark, Gustafsson, etc.
Tim Berne - Fulton Street Maul (Koch Jazz) I have the vinyl...
Barre Phillips/Keiji Haino - Etchings In The Air (P.S.F.)
Don Byron Quintet - No-Vibe Zone (Knitting Factory Works)
-Tom Pratt
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 12:20:47 -0400
From: Circle9 <caliban@ctol.net>
Subject: Re: interesting hip-hop ???
If you haven't checked out the first Wu-Tang (36 Chambers), you're missing out
big-time. The second album is okay, but there's a lot of filler on it- there's
maybe one really solid disc amongst the two-disc set. For recent stuff I really
dug the Big Punisher album- his lyrics are so-so but he does have great flow
and his beats are pretty slamming. The Black Eyed Peas disc also surprised me-
I dug it much more than I expected to from the single. Also worth checking out
is the Muggs (from Cypress Hill) solo album- "Muggs presents the Soul
Assassins"- various MCs on each track, so it's a little spotty, but his beats
are about as good as it gets.
If it's Old School you're interested in, you can't go wrong with the first few
Public Enemy ("Nation of Millions" and "Fear of a Black Planet" are both
especially strong)
-SG
Anish Kejariwal wrote:
> Sorry, for the non-zorn content, but...in light of the recent thread on
> post modernism and hip-hop, I was wondering if someone can give me some
> good hip-hop recs?
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 18:47:29 -0400
From: Lang Thompson <wlt4@mindspring.com>
Subject: Thurston's label
I read a couple of article several months back about a label Thurston Moore
was starting with somebody (Byron Coley?) that would specialize in
reissuing rare music. Does anybody know if this has fallen by the wayside
or just has yet to start up?
LT
- ------------------------------------------------------
Lang Thompson
http://www.tcf.ua.edu/wlt4
New at the Funhouse website: Did Elvis Steal Rock 'n'
Roll?, The X-Files Movie Bites!, music reviews
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 19:41:09 EDT
From: Dgasque@aol.com
Subject: Re: sean
In a message dated 10/16/98 10:10:13 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
jcurwin@hartingdale.com.au writes:
> Um, I'm just curious, don't ask me why... has anyone checked out Sean
> Lennon's album, and if so, is it any good at all?
It was recommended to me by one of the clerks at my favorite CD shoppe
recently who listens to a lot of the same music as I do. I checked out the
first three cuts...not bad, but nothing i'd buy at full price.
spinning: Silver Apples- Beacon Remixed
=dgasque=
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 00:58:13 -0400
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Thurston's label
Lang Thompson wrote:
> I read a couple of article several months back about a label Thurston Moore
> was starting with somebody (Byron Coley?) that would specialize in
> reissuing rare music. Does anybody know if this has fallen by the wayside
> or just has yet to start up?
It's still happening. It's just been kinda pushed back by Thurston's other
activities, including SY, other group projects and a new solo album I just read
about in The Wire this evening. (Evidently he sent a brief solo guitar track
to a lot of different artists, both musical and visual, inviting a "remix" -
there's a review of the resulting CD as well as a news item about the gallery
showing of the visual collaborations in the UK in the current issue). Anyway,
the label deal also moved from Koch to the newly revived Sire Records. And
yeah, Byron is the other instigator last I heard...
Steve Smith
ssmith36@psrynet.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 10:58:47 +0200
From: "Artur Nowak" <arno@silesia.top.pl>
Subject: new Krakauer and Coleman
Forced Exposure has announced new Tzadik CDs, two of them are
continuation of excelent CDs "Klezmer Madness" by David Krakauer and
"Sephardic Tinge" by Anthony Coleman Trio. These CDs are my favourite
Tzadik releases so far, I'm looking forward to hear them. Maybe
someone already heard it?
Just forwarding, FYI:
KRAKAUER, DAVID: Klezmer, NY CD (TZ 7127). "This second CD for Tzadik
pays
tribute to one of the greatest clarinet soloists in jazz: pioneer
Sidney
Bechet. In this extended, multi-faceted suite, the Krakauer trio
explores
the hidden connections between Bechet and Klezmer giant Naftule
Brandwein
- -- inspired in part by Bechet's legendary and incredibly rare
performance
of 'My Yiddish Momma." $13.50
SEPHARDIC TINGE: Morenica CD (TZ 7128). "Anthony Coleman has one of
the
most intelligent and original musical minds on the downtown scene,
capable
of confounding you, delighting you, making you howl with laughter or
scream
with pain. With his popular Sephardic Tinge project he has chosen to
delight you, showcasing an unique approach to the classic piano trio.
this
second collection of original compositions and quirky cover tunes adds
a
newly-developed virtuosic edge to this already sick and twisted
technique,
making Morenica his ultimate statement on piano jazz, Sephardic
tradition,
Latin rhythms and dysfunctional harmony." $13.50
__________________________________________________________________
Artur Nowak [arno@silesia.top.DEATHTOSPAMMERS.pl]
www.silesia.top.pl/~arno/default.htm - Discography of Bill
Frisell
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V2 #503
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