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1998-04-02
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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V2 #298
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Friday, April 3 1998 Volume 02 : Number 298
In this issue:
-
ZORN,PATTON,MORI
Re: Stravinsky/Shostakovitch do jazz??
Mats Gustafsson / P. Fish Eye
20
Re: concerts
Jumping on the "20 CDs" bandwagon...
Oren Bloedow
top 20s
Re: Stravinsky/Shostakovitch do jazz??
RE: Jumping on the "20 CDs" bandwagon...
Re: Stravinsky/Shostakovitch do jazz??
BIG 20
Re: Stravinsky/Shostakovitch do jazz??
To: zorn-list <zorn-list@xmission.com>
Re: Stravinsky/Shostakovitch do jazz??
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 07:58:25 -0800 (PST)
From: J Burke <jbb4u@yahoo.com>
Subject: ZORN,PATTON,MORI
i have a video of this show at the knitting factory, march 14 @ 9pm. i
am only interested in trades and will trade audio for audio and video
for video. i am mostly interested in video, and stuuff to do with mike
patton. if anyone is interested please e-mail me privatly.
thnx
jim
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 08:24:45 -0800
From: George Grella <george_grella@pop3.decisionanalytics.com>
Subject: Re: Stravinsky/Shostakovitch do jazz??
References: <E0yKyRS-00000C-00@lists.xmission.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
James Douglas Knox writes:
> Heard a piece for brass on the radio a while back; it was a jazz-suite by
> Stravinsky for Shostakovitch (or maybe: the other way around). I think it
> was the 2nd of 2. Don't know too much about these guys, but like my few
> Stravinsky records just fine. Can anyone fill me in?
>
It's hard to tell from your description, but it might be Shostakovitch,
who wrote two "Jazz Suites," with those words in the title. If it
featured a solo clarinet, it's Stravinsky's "Ebony Concerto," which was
written for Woody Herman. If you've ever wondered where Gil Evans got
some of those great sonorities from, it's the "Ebony Concerto."
gg
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 08:23:38 PST
From: "Fran Bacon" <c123018@hotmail.com>
Subject: Mats Gustafsson / P. Fish Eye
>
>>>>>> "brian" == brian olewnick <brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu>
writes:
>
> >> Mats Gustaffson Parrot Fish Eye (OKKA)
>
> brian> Could someone provide a brief review of this? I've
> brian> almost picked it up on several occasions.
>
>Eight duets ..... I was kind of
>disappointed with the trios because the acoustic guitar doesn't really
>work for me here, especially in the relatively few moments when MG and
>Coleman are really blowing and the guitar, to me, just sounds lame
>strumming along. OTOH, you really get to hear MG's sax playing very
>well, it's a very clear recording, and I imagine this is an excellent
>document of what he sounds like live. Unlike other recordings I've
>got with MG, this one is all acoustic.
PARROt FISH EYE (for those of you who haven't seen Mats live) is NOT a
good representation of Mats-in-the-flesh. I saw him solo in New Orleans
thanks to the efforts of a very independent promoter there (no scene at
all for frimprov down there)and it was AWESOME. Everyone says that live
is always better than records: this is generally true for improv but not
always. With Mats there's such a performance-emphasis that the energy
is impossible. It was incredibly exciting and dynamic. And the
slap-tongue and vocal techniques are mesmerizing.
ALL the BEST
KSH
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 08:15:22 -0800
From: Schwitterz <mcmullenm@vcss.k12.ca.us>
Subject: 20
COUNTRY MUSIC IN THE WORLD OF ISLAM
BLOOD ON THE TRACKS
EXPOSURE
MAGIC AND LOSS
BONE MACHINE
WELD
UNCLE MEAT
AEC 1967/8
DIE LIKE A DOG
JOHN CARTER'S AMERICAN SUITE (DAUWHE + 4)
SOFT MACHINE THIRD
ADRITTI 4TET: CAGE'S COMPLETE STRING 4TETS
PASSIO
WELL TUNED PIANO
PULSE DEMON
REAL TCHICAI
SEVEN SOULS
VERNAL EQUINOX
RELATIVE RLIABILITY
HEJIRA
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 11:45:32 -0500
From: Perfect Sound Forever <perfect-sound@furious.com>
Subject: Re: concerts
Best shows... Tough one again.
Saw the Art Ensemble play one of the first shows at the new Knitting Factory- what stood out in my mind was before they
started, they all stood silently with their heads bowed, facing east. Very moving.
Just to see Sonny Rollins hit the stage at the Bottom Line a few years ago was a thrill, not to mention the way he could
hold a note for a few minutes (I was out of breath just watching this).
Ikue Mori is BRILLIANT- she sits there and turns some knobs and what she's able to coax out of samplers and drum machines is
incredible. She's a good match for any techno artist I've heard.
Lee Perry's shows at Wetlands last year were really memorable- not even just the garb he had on but the way that the Mad
Professor made him sound like he was standing on a mountain top, yelling through a thunder storm.
The Raincoats opened for Liz Phair a few years back and got a great reception (incl. me yelling my head off for them). They
were genuinely surprised and confused by the positive response. Ana told the crowd 'you know, we're not done yet,' not
understanding how enthuastic everyone was.
Then there's Judy Collins/Arlo Guthrie (first show I ever saw), My Bloody Valentine (ears rang for a month), Big Star
(yelled out the lyrics louder than Alex), John Prine (ditto), Ornette at Carnegie Hall last year (despite the lousy
acoustics).
Jason
- --
Perfect Sound Forever
online music magazine
perfect-sound@furious.com
http://www.furious.com/perfect
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 03 Apr 98 11:51:00 PST
From: Matt Walsh <MATTW@smginc.com>
Subject: Jumping on the "20 CDs" bandwagon...
I wasn't going to send in my list, but I caved in and decided to do so
for the hell of it.
If I was forced to spend the rest of my life with 20 CDs, I'd probably
rather die... I'm just the kind of person who can't listen to the same
things too frequently (which probably explains my 3,000+ CD collection).
Funny thing is, when I narrowed myself to 20, I realized that it was
pretty one-sided, and not remotely representative of my collection... So
here is my pretty boring list - this is a Jazz list and I have
practically no Jazz CD's in here! Definitely not a "best 20 of all time",
but a "20 I'd need for different emotions to get me through life", etc.
In alphabeical order:
Boredoms - "Soul Discharge"
Celtic Frost - "Into The Pandemonium"
Celtic Frost - "To Mega Therion"
Al DiMeola - "Kiss My Axe"
Faith No More - "Angel Dust"
Helmet - "Meantime"
King Crimson - "Discipline"
King Crimson - "Lark's Tongues In Aspic"
King's X - "Gretchen Goes To Nebraska"
Meshuggah - "Destroy Erase Improve"
Mr. Bungle - "Mr. Bungle"
My Dying Bride - "Turn Loose The Swans"
Naked City - "Torture Garden"
Pink Floyd - "Wish You Were Here"
Primus - "Frizzle Fry"
Rush - "Moving Pictures"
Therion - "Theli"
They Might Be Giants - "Flood"
Voivod - "Nothingface"
John Zorn - "Spy Vs Spy"
...and I'd try to sneak Lords Of Acid's "Voodoo U" in one of my jacket
pockets...
This will probably change tommorrow... Actually, if I had to choose 20
CDs, I'd spend the week before making my own 20 CD-R's...
There were some pretty interesting lists on here... Well, hope you all
had a good laugh with mine...
Later,
Matthew Walsh
Software Engineer
- Strategic Management Group
mattw@smginc.com
mattmonkw@aol.com
Matt's personal CD jukebox -
Currently playing and annoying co-workers with:
Voodoo Glow Skulls - "Firme"
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:05:20 -0500
From: "Chris Barrett" <cbarrett@neaq.org>
Subject: Oren Bloedow
This is pretty far off topic, I know, but I was wonderin' if anyone knows
anything about Oren Bloedow's new CD on the Knitting Factory label, or has
any info on him (I guess he was in the Loung Lizards for a time?). Email
me privately if you've got any info/insight.
Thanks,
- -Chris
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:57:39 -0800
From: GABE_EISENSTEIN@HP-Vancouver-om10.om.hp.com
Subject: top 20s
Albums:
I stuck to original issues -- greatest hits makes it a bit easier.
Coltrane Meditations
Stockhausen Hymnen
Ornette Change of the Century
Elvis Costello Imperial Bedroom
Zappa Hot Rats
Circle Paris Concert
Spirit 12 Dreams of Dr. Sardonicus
Zorn Bar Kokhba
Naked City Naked City
Leonard Cohen Songs From a Room
Grateful Dead Live Dead
They Might Be Giants Lincoln
Steely Dan Aja
King Crimson Discipline
Rickie Lee Jones Flying Cowboys
McCoy Tyner Extensions
Richard Thompson Shoot Out the Lights
Blue Nile Hats
Jefferson Airplane Crown of Creation
Townes Van Zandt Live in Houston
Items I was glad to see on other lists:
Stockhausen acoustic Kontakte
(EC)Nudes Vanishing Point
(I prefer the CD Pale Nudes--Wise to the Heat)
Bill Frisell Have A Little Faith
Ornette Coleman Science Fiction
Miles In a Silent Way
Dylan Blood on the Tracks
Coltrane Ballads
Caveman Shoestore Flux
(I prefer Master Cylinder)
Dave Holland Conference of the Birds
Sonic Youth Daydream Nation
(I reconsidered after the putdown of this album; sorry,
it really is my favorite SY)
too recent to make the list:
Radiohead OK Computer
Dave Douglas Sanctuary
Pigpen Daylight
Stereolab Dots and Loops
Portishead Portishead
Arcana Arc of the Testimony
Golden Palominos Pure
My top 20 live concerts
Ornette Coleman trio some hole in the wall in Detroit 1973
Ravi Shankar Ann Arbor 1974
Masada Jewish Museum NYC 1994 (or Showbox,Seattle
1996)
Elvis Costello "farewell tour" Portland 1997
Keith Jarrett solo New Orleans 1977
McCoy Tyner quartet Detroit 1974
Don Cherry,Foday Musa Suso Amazing Grace,Chicago 1980(?)
CrosbyStillsNashYoung,Joni Mitchell Chicago 1970 (my first
concert)
Grateful Dead Ann Arbor 1972
Pixies, Pere Ubu Fox Theatre, Portland 1991
Old & New Dreams Armadillo World Headquarters, Austin 1978
The Kinks,Blondie Armadillo World Headquarters, Austin 1978
Bob Mould,Vic Chesnutt W.O.W. Hall, Eugene 1989(?)
Public Image Limited Starry Night, Portland 1989
Richard Thompson,Shawn Colvin Portland 1992(?)
Van Morrison San Francisco 1986(?)
Frank Zappa Detroit 1973
Tone Dogs Blue Gallery, Portland 1989
Bill Frisell Quartet W.O.W. Hall, Eugene 1991
Poison Idea Melody Ballroom, Portland 1992
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:15:25 -0500 (EST)
From: Keldon Drudge <kdrudge@julian.uwo.ca>
Subject: Re: Stravinsky/Shostakovitch do jazz??
On Fri, 3 Apr 1998, James Douglas Knox wrote:
>
> Heard a piece for brass on the radio a while back; it was a jazz-suite by
> Stravinsky for Shostakovitch (or maybe: the other way around). I think it
> was the 2nd of 2. Don't know too much about these guys, but like my few
> Stravinsky records just fine. Can anyone fill me in?
>
Shostakovich's two jazz suites (late 1920's, early 1930's) are, for
me at least, beautiful and fun--in the same vein as his first symphony
or first piano concerto to some degree, but with considerably
more whimsy. the recording by the royal concertgebouw with chailly
conducting (and also featuring the piano concerto #1) is one of my
top 20 for sure. the jazz moniker is perhaps a bit misleading, but it
is kind of big bandish (the liner notes mention an american bandleader
called paul whiteman, but i haven't heard him...anyone?)
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:17:25 -0800
From: mike burma <rizzi@grin.net>
Subject: RE: Jumping on the "20 CDs" bandwagon...
>this is a Jazz list and I have practically no Jazz CD's in here!
Please, let us dispel the myth that this is a Jazz
list. It is the John Zorn list and to quote the charter
statement:
"The Zorn list was created so that fans of John Zorn
and his many projects could come together and chat
about the man and his music...Naked City, Masada,
Painkiller, etc.....
Also discussed on this list are: Bill Laswell, Bill Frisell,
Elliott Sharp, Bobby Previte, Wayne Horvitz, Zeena Parkins,
Knitting Factory roster artists, Joey Baron, Last Exit posse,
and any other downtown NYC connected musicians. "
mike rizzi
zorn-list-owner-and-enforcer
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:29:22 -0500
From: "Chris Barret{" <cbarrett@neaq.org>
Subject: Re: Stravinsky/Shostakovitch do jazz??
> (the liner notes mention an american bandleader
>called paul whiteman, but i haven't heard him...anyone?)
If I remember my early Jazz history correctly, Paul Whiteman's band in the
twenties and thirties played "safe" big band/orchestra jazz that wasn't as
ruanchy as the Jelly Roll Mortons and King Oliver/Louis Armstrongs for the
white, more affluent crowds. I think he was based in New York. I can't
remember if early coronet gret Bix Beiderbeck actually played with him or
not. Can anyone else fill in what I've left out, or correct in
inaccuracies I may have mentioned?
- -Chris
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:35:33 -0500
From: eric@av.letts.american.edu (Eric Gordon)
Subject: BIG 20
I can no longer resist, please excuse spelling and other errors, I'm at =
work and can't check the titles.
In no particular order;
1. John McLaughlin- Devotion
2. Coltrane- Ascension
3. Ornette- Of Human Feeling
4. Tin Berne's Chaos Totale- nice view
5. Julius Hemphil- Big Band
6. R.S. Jackson- Street Priest
7. Power Tools- Strange Meeting
8. Duke Ellington- Black, Brown, & Beige
9. The Residents- Duck Stab/ Buster & Glenn
10. Soft Machine- 3
11. Pere Ubu- Song of the Bailing Man
12. Last Exit - Last Exit
13. McCoy Tyner- Sahara
14. Eric Dolphy- Out To Lunch
15. Demi Semi Quaver- Demi Semi Quaver II
16. Blood Ulmer- Music Revelation Ensemble
17. Fred Frith- Speechless
18. John Carter- Shadows on the Wall
19. Bill Frisell- Before we were Born
20. Material - Memory Serves
21(oops). Beefheart- Trout Mask Replica
Mostly sentimental favorites here, it would be very difficult to choose =
if I actually could only have 20 records. I'm glad I don't have to. =20
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:23:58 -0600
From: Dan Hewins <hewins@synsolutions.com>
Subject: Re: Stravinsky/Shostakovitch do jazz??
Whiteman was the watered down version of big band. And, yeah, it was
directed towards the wgite folks. I read a book called "The Story of Jazz"
(which you all should read if you haven't already) that talked a bit about
Whiteman. He was more of a pop guy, well known because he was popular.
His contributions to jazz and the development of jazz were little to none.
I guess his arrangments were conservative and possibly boring to people who
enjoyed Ellington and Fletcher Henderson and others around that time. I do
believe that Bix Beiderbeck was in the Whiteman band but he played soprano
sax, not cornet.
On the subject of older (1940s) big band... I'm listening to a Dizzy
Gillespie disc called The Complete RCA Victor Recordings and it's great.
The Penguin Guide gave it a very rare 5 stars and it deserves it. Maybe I
should start making my top 20 list... On second thought, maybe not.
Dan
At 12:29 PM -0600 4/3/98, Chris Barret{ wrote:
>> (the liner notes mention an american bandleader
>>called paul whiteman, but i haven't heard him...anyone?)
>
>If I remember my early Jazz history correctly, Paul Whiteman's band in the
>twenties and thirties played "safe" big band/orchestra jazz that wasn't as
>ruanchy as the Jelly Roll Mortons and King Oliver/Louis Armstrongs for the
>white, more affluent crowds. I think he was based in New York. I can't
>remember if early coronet gret Bix Beiderbeck actually played with him or
>not. Can anyone else fill in what I've left out, or correct in
>inaccuracies I may have mentioned?
>
>-Chris
>
>
>
>-
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 14:37:43 -0500 (EST)
From: Patrick Ivan Jenkins <cz176@freenet.toronto.on.ca>
Subject: To: zorn-list <zorn-list@xmission.com>
I was wondering if anyone out there knows the answer to the following
questions.
1)I read in an article on John Zorn's Masada, that the Masada
compositions are written in six or less staves of music. If there are
any musician's out there I'd be interested on knowing how the Masada
musicians can perform such long pieces of music based on such little
musical notation and yet have the pieces come out sounding similar each time?
Are they improvising on a set of chords or melody lines or is there a
musical shorthand? I'm not a musician but I'd be curious to know?
When Zorn performed here in Toronto in 1995 with Masada and in 1997 with
Bar Kokhba, the sheet music did look like it was six staves or less for
each piece.
2)Does anybody know of a dictionary or resource book to translate the
titles of the masada compositions into English? I was told that they are
phonetic hebrew words and names?
3)I really like Mark Ribot's guitar playing on the Bar Kokhba and
Circlemaker discs. I'm interested in his Ribot's "Shoe String Symphonies"
and his other CD's but I would like to know if they're in the same vein
as his work with Bar Kokhba?
I'd appreciate any opinions on Ribot's recordings.
I'm a big fan of Zorn's Masada and Bar Kokhba projects. I also like his
Filmworks series and the Naked City CD. Any information would be
appreciated.
Thanks,
Patrick
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 14:42:48 -0500 (EST)
From: Ken Waxman <cj649@freenet.toronto.on.ca>
Subject: Re: Stravinsky/Shostakovitch do jazz??
Paul Whiteman was a white (sic) bandleader of the 1920s most
famous for his "symphonic jazz". His orchestra was the first to perform
Rhapsody In Blue, with Gershwin. However the orchestra itself was a
lumbering beast so, although he employed great sideman - Bix Beiderbecke,
Jack Teagarden, Eddie Lang, Joe Venuti etc. etc. he buried them in
arrangements and Whiteman's band was never the equal of Duke Ellington's,
Fletcher Henderson's or any other "real jazz" group of the period.
Of course because he was more palatable to the majority of
people, he was dubbed the "King of Jazz," just like Benny Goodman, not
Count Basie was "King of Swing".
Whiteman is usually seen as the villan in thge heavily romantic
the Beiderbecke sage, but, in truth, but kept the alcoholic, sick cornestist on his payroll, whether he could
play or notr almost until he (Bix) died.
Whiteman lived until the 1960s, had a TV show in the 1950s, and,
I think, helped discover Bobby Darin.
Ken Waxman
cj649@torfree.net
P.S. IMHO it's time to call the list making to a halt. I have as many
records as the next person, and as many favorites, but I think spreading
useful information is a better "read" than who likes what
On Fri, 3 Apr 1998, Keldon Drudge wrote:
>
> On Fri, 3 Apr 1998, James Douglas Knox wrote:
> >
> > Heard a piece for brass on the radio a while back; it was a jazz-suite by
> > Stravinsky for Shostakovitch (or maybe: the other way around). I think it
> > was the 2nd of 2. Don't know too much about these guys, but like my few
> > Stravinsky records just fine. Can anyone fill me in?
> >
> Shostakovich's two jazz suites (late 1920's, early 1930's) are, for
> me at least, beautiful and fun--in the same vein as his first symphony
> or first piano concerto to some degree, but with considerably
> more whimsy. the recording by the royal concertgebouw with chailly
> conducting (and also featuring the piano concerto #1) is one of my
> top 20 for sure. the jazz moniker is perhaps a bit misleading, but it
> is kind of big bandish (the liner notes mention an american bandleader
> called paul whiteman, but i haven't heard him...anyone?)
>
>
>
>
> -
>
>
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V2 #298
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