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1998-03-05
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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V2 #256
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Friday, March 6 1998 Volume 02 : Number 256
In this issue:
-
dreyblatt
Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #252
Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #252
Re: dreyblatt
Weird Little Boy
Zorn CD's online?
masada
Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #252
Re: Bass Albums
FMP/Branca
Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #255
Re: masada
more FMP and solo bass
Re: masada
Re: Laswell Info
Praxis: Transmutation
charmed, i'm sure
Re: FMP
Sabbath in Paradise
masada
ATTN: old bounces coming in
Masada box?
help with KF tape
BOUNCE zorn-list@xmission.com: Non-member submission from [louie <louie@gwtc.net>]
Re: help with KF tape
Re: help with KF tape
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 16:00:38 -0500 (EST)
From: Brent Burton <bburton@CapAccess.org>
Subject: dreyblatt
does anyone know of any dreyblatt titles besides _animal magnetism_,
_nodal excitations_ and _propellers in love_?
thanks,
b
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 12:51:01 -0800 (PST)
From: C E DANGELO <cappyd@UVic.CA>
Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #252
You don't think there's any Ornette influence (improv-wise) on News for
Lulu?
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 04 Mar 1998 13:03:06 -0800
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #252
On Wed, 4 Mar 1998 12:51:01 -0800 (PST) C E DANGELO wrote:
>
> You don't think there's any Ornette influence (improv-wise) on News for
> Lulu?
Ornette would not be the first name which comes to my mind concerning the
LULUs.
These two records are testimony of John's love for the '50s "Blue Note
artists" (a period which predates Coleman).
Are you asking the question about his saxophone style?
Patrice.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 04 Mar 1998 13:05:28 -0800
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: Re: dreyblatt
On Wed, 4 Mar 1998 16:00:38 -0500 (EST) Brent Burton wrote:
>
> does anyone know of any dreyblatt titles besides _animal magnetism_,
> _nodal excitations_ and _propellers in love_?
Is PROPELLERS IN LOVE the hat Art one? If yes, I don't know of any other record
under his name (but he is at least on one compilation).
Patrice.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 16:09:11 -0500
From: "Andy Marks" <Andy.Marks@mts.com>
Subject: Weird Little Boy
Anybody know if this has been released yet?
If so, what's it like?
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 13:19:57 -0800 (PST)
From: { brad brace } <bbrace@wired.com>
Subject: Zorn CD's online?
Any online sources for purchasing Zorn CD's and/or hearing samples?
The_12hr-ISBN-JPEG_Project <<<
> episodic ftp://ftp.wco.com/users/bbrace <
> eccentric ftp://ftp.netcom.com/pub/bb/bbrace <
> continuous ftp://ftp.teleport.com/users/bbrace <
> hypermodern ftp://ftp.rdrop.com/pub/users/bbrace <
> imagery online ftp://ftp.pacifier.com/pub/users/bbrace <
Usenet-news: alt.binaries.pictures.12hr/ a.b.p.fine-art.misc
Mailing-list: listserv@netcom.com / subscribe 12hr-isbn-jpeg
Reverse Solidus: http://www.teleport.com/~bbrace/bbrace.html
{ brad brace } <<<< bbrace@netcom.com >>>> ~finger for pgp
- --
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 13:29:33 -0800 (PST)
From: C E DANGELO <cappyd@UVic.CA>
Subject: masada
Maybe I'm missing the whole point of Masada, but doesn't it have something
to do with the expression of Jewish culture, which by definition will
entail the use of previously used material? And will it not, because of
the nature of Jewish culture, inevitably contain material derived from
cultures which have interacted with Jewish culture (Greek, American,
Spanish (see Sephardic Tinge), Eastern European, etc.)? I would fail to
see the whole point of Masada or the Radical Jewish Culture Series if it
DIDN'T use borrowed material.
Also, I think the Serge Gainsbourg album is great!
cd
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 15:37:00 -0800 (PST)
From: C E DANGELO <cappyd@UVic.CA>
Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #252
Yes, I was refering to the sax. My comment mainly relies on my opinion
that, stylisticly, there are things going on with respect to harmony and
tone that go beyond what one would have heard by these composers at the
time these tunes were originally composed. For example, the way Zorn
throws in a short, aggressive, atonal riff at the end of a phrase or
behind someone's solo - I would associate this with Ornette more than
with, say, pre-sixties Coltrane (who would spend a while building up to
such a riff during a long, developed solo). Maybe it's just because it's
alto. Maybe I just haven't heard enough Mobley.
cd
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 22:20:23 -0500
From: chasinthetrane@juno.com (Jamie F Graves)
Subject: Re: Bass Albums
Charlie Haden put out a few albums in the 70's that were very close to
solo bass albums. The Golden Number is six duets with the likes of
Ornette, Don Cherry and Hampton Hawes. Not quite solo, but a lot of these
duets include big stretches of Charlie on his own. In addition, Jimmy
Garrison got a lot of solo space on some late Coltrane albums. Someone
mentioned Tapestry in Sound off of Live in Seattle, but that album also
includes a half hour Afro-Blue, with about 10 or 15 minutes devoted to a
double bass duet.
Jamie
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 05 Mar 1998 09:08:04 +0100
From: Anders Fransson <anders.fransson@hoe.se>
Subject: FMP/Branca
- -- About FMP, one of the best i think is "We Play" by Gunter Christman
and
Detlef Shoneberg. Werry tight playing
Does anybody know when Symphony no.11 of Glenn Branca is released?
Stay untuned
Anders
____________________________________________________________________________
Anders Fransson, Biblioteket, Hogskolan i Orebro,
701 82 Orebro, Sweden.
e-mail: anders.fransson@hoe.se
Phone +46 19 30 38 66
Fax +46 19 30 38 55
____________________________________________________________________________
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 09:55:04 GMT0BST
From: DR S WILKIE <S.Wilkie@swansea.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #255
1) How can I imaginatively change from E to F
2) I strongly dissent from the tendency to group Virgin Beauty and
Tone Dialling. The second seems "cluttered" but not the first. I
think there's something in what Jeff says about Denardo's
productions, though; but virgin Beauty is the one case where it
hasn't bothered me.
3) Finally: Yes! Why have we neglected to rave about the
Coleman/Izenson/Moffett trio? But I question rating Who's Crazy?
(a film soundtrack with frustrating editing) over Town Hall Concert.
Nobody will argue with the Croydon and Stockholm recordings, though.
I'm willing to stand up for Empty Foxhole; will someone do the same
for new York Is Now and Love Call? And finally, has ANYONE got a
copy of Ornette At 12 ... PLEASE can i have a tape copy??
Sean W
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 05 Mar 1998 12:00:14 +0000
From: patRice <gda@pingnet.li>
Subject: Re: masada
C E DANGELO wrote:
> doesn't it have something
> to do with the expression of Jewish culture, which by definition will
=========================
> entail the use of previously used material? And will it not, because =============================================
the way i understand masada it is based on traditional jewish tone
scales which IMO doesn't necessarily mean the use of previously used
material. but a lot of the masada melodies do sound familiar, because a
lot of us have heard stuff based on jewish tone scales, and can
therefore easily relate to it. also, the jewish tone scales have sthg
very easily likeable, a "friendliness" for the ear, i think...
patRice
of
> the nature of Jewish culture, inevitably contain material derived from
> cultures which have interacted with Jewish culture (Greek, American,
> Spanish (see Sephardic Tinge), Eastern European, etc.)? I would fail to
> see the whole point of Masada or the Radical Jewish Culture Series if it
> DIDN'T use borrowed material.
>
> -
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 08:48:06 -0500
From: cdeupree@interagp.com (Caleb Deupree)
Subject: more FMP and solo bass
Following the discussion of FMP, I listened to Open Paper Tree (FMP
68) on the way to work today. Yesterday I said the recording of
Michel Doneda (soprano sax), Paul Rogers (bass) and Le Quan Ninh
(percussion) was muddy. After listening again, I can add a little
clarification. Doneda and Rogers, for the most part, are clear, but
Le Quan's percussion sometimes seems lost in the mix. This may be in
part because of what he plays. In one of his solos, he gets very
noisy, but it sounds like he's playing a big sheet of metal which
generates large indistinct clouds of sound (not impossible, given what
I've heard on other recordings by him). Perhaps I'm unjustly
comparing the recording to the crystal clear trio recordings of
Leimgruber, Hauser, and Roidinger on Hat, which had the benefit of a
studio recording. Hauser is very different from Le Quan, probably a
contributing factor as well.
Also, Peter Kowald's solo bass effort, Was Da Ist, is FMP 62. I
haven't listened to this all the way through yet, but it comes very
well reviewed from both Cadence (where it was on several
best-of-the-year lists) and the Penguin Guide (which gave it the
highest rating, five stars).
- ---
Caleb T. Deupree
;; Opinions are not necessarily shared by management
Computers are useless. They can only give you answers.
(Pablo Picasso)
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 10:03:54 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph S. Zitt" <jzitt@humansystems.com>
Subject: Re: masada
On Thu, 5 Mar 1998, patRice wrote:
> the way i understand masada it is based on traditional jewish tone
> scales which IMO doesn't necessarily mean the use of previously used
> material. but a lot of the masada melodies do sound familiar, because a
> lot of us have heard stuff based on jewish tone scales, and can
> therefore easily relate to it. also, the jewish tone scales have sthg
> very easily likeable, a "friendliness" for the ear, i think...
The concept of "Jewish tone scales" is also somewhat odd. What you're
probably referring to is the Eastern European modalities that are
associated with the music of the Jews whose families are from there.
That's only a small corner of Jewish music though.
In my freshman year in college, I frustrated my ethnomusicology professor
by collecting samples of what both he and I agreed could be called "Jewish
music" from around the world, analyzing it and running a statistical
analysis on it -- which showed absolutely no characteristics in common
across the set. He had made a big noise about Jewish music being an ethnic
music which should show up as consistent. It didn't. We didn't talk much
afterward.
I've run across the most common "Jewish tone scale" (roughly
D-Eb-F#-G-A-BB-C#-D ) in some Arabic music, where it was called the
"hijaz" mode (if memory serves -- this was 20 years ago). It's a bear to
notate; most of the time when I've used it, I've written in D, with a key
signature of two sharps and two flats, to try to save the player from
navigating through a nest of accidentals.
- - ---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1----------
|||/ Joseph Zitt ===== jzitt@humansystems.com ===== Human Systems \|||
||/ Maryland? = <*> SILENCE: The John Cage Mailing List <*> = ecto \||
|/ http://www.realtime.net/~jzitt ====== Comma: Voices of New Music \|
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 05 Mar 1998 10:29:28 -0800
From: Jeff Spirer <jeffs@hyperreal.org>
Subject: Re: Laswell Info
At 01:20 PM 2/23/98 -0800, Jeff Spirer wrote:
>NEW RELEASE INFO
>
>Material: The Road to the Western Lands (Remixes). Will probably be
>released on March 10 on Triloka. Remixes by Bill Laswell, Talvin Singh, DJ
>Soul Slinger, Spring Heel Jack, DJ Olive, and Material. I have a cassette
>but have not listened to it. I will post after I do. This is not the
>Seven Souls re-release, although I think there is a one-track overlap.
This will definitely be out next week. There is *vinyl* on it too.
Jeff Spirer
B&W Photos: http://www.pomegranates.com
Color and B&W Photos: http://www.hyperreal.org/~jeffs/gallery.html
Axiom/Material: http://www.hyperreal.org/axiom/
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 00:13:15 -0500
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?R=E9mi?= Bissonnette <rbisson@courrier.usherb.ca>
Subject: Praxis: Transmutation
If anybody is interested, I have a new sealed copy of the first Praxis CD,
Transmutation, to sell or trade.
Bruno
R=E9mi Bissonnette Ph.D.
Professeur titulaire
=46acult=E9 d'=C9ducation physique et sportive
Universit=E9 de Sherbrooke
Sherbrooke, Qu=E9bec
J1K 2R1
=20
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 23:19:41 -0800 (PST)
From: SUGAR in their vitamins? <yol@esophagus.com>
Subject: charmed, i'm sure
maybe i missed it, but has anyone
else picked up the new Davey Williams
(Curlew) solo release "Charmed, I'm
Sure" on Ecstatic Peace? any
thoughts? listening to it right
now for the first time. overall,
it reminds me of Myles Boisen's
"Guitarspeak". except, Williams'
style is a lot more chunky, if
that makes sense.
hasta. --dk
Yes. Beautiful, wonderful nature. Hear it sing to us: *snap* Yes. natURE.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 04:09:32 EST
From: Dgasque <Dgasque@aol.com>
Subject: Re: FMP
I don't know if it's been released on CD yet, but there's a trio of Irene
Schweizer and the drummer and bassist from the German psych/world-music group
Embryo on FMP- can't remember the name of it now...that is downright stunning.
It's quite unique from anything Irene's done since.
=dgasque=
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 10:05:12 +0100
From: Yves Dewulf <yves@inwpent1.rug.ac.be>
Subject: Sabbath in Paradise
Did somebody see the movie "Sabbath in Paradise" ?
It should include interviews with/music of :John Zorn, Marc Ribot,
David Krakauer, Frank Londen,Anthony Coleman, ...
YVes
- -
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 22:48:49 -0800
From: "Patrick Stockton" <sheepherder@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: masada
is anyone absolutely sure about the release of all the Masadas on Tzadik?
just wondering....
i dont want to buy any more if they are going to release them here in the
U.S.
patrick in portland
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 10:30:04 -0800 (PST)
From: "m. rizzi" <rizzi@netcom.com>
Subject: ATTN: old bounces coming in
Howdy all,
Your absentee list administrator here.
In cleaning up my mail folder, I've come across a number
of messages that were bounced to me and never made it to
the zorn-list. I'm going to approve them and send them
on their way. Some are hideously old, so don't panic
when you see a message from say, October!
cheers,
mike rizzi
- --
rizzi@netcom.com -------------------------------------- www.browbeat.com
"Another nerd with a soulpatch"
- -------- browbeat magazine, po box 11124, oakland, ca 94611-1124 -------
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 13:37:55 -0500 (EST)
From: William R Baker <wrb@christa.unh.edu>
Subject: Masada box?
on the Tzadik site (in the questions section)
John himself tells a tale of not 1 but 2 box sets of Masada material.
It's been really difficult for me to find Masada CDs around
and since i heard this rumour I've kind of been content to wait.
but then Tet was just released
so I'm not sure what the deal is.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 1997 10:50:09 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: help with KF tape
Does anybody have a copy of the following?
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*** - SAMPLER A.V. ARTS VOL. 1 (KNITTING FACTORY - MUWORKS): various artists
This record features excerpts from Improvised Music New York 1981.
1992 - Musiche (Italy), No 13 (CT)
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I know that Fred Frith appears on but I am curious of who else does also...
Any info about this is welcome,
Patrice.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 17:22:13 -0700
From: owner-zorn-list@xmission.com
Subject: BOUNCE zorn-list@xmission.com: Non-member submission from [louie <louie@gwtc.net>]
>From louie@gwtc.net Wed Nov 05 17:22:08 1997
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Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 17:24:43 -0700
From: louie <louie@gwtc.net>
Organization: MUK productions
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03 (Win95; U)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: zorn-list@xmission.com
Subject: zappa thread
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how interesting... seeing zorn and zappa being talked about together.
interesting because they are my favorite two composers of all time.
(my wife keeps asking me to stop buying any more cd's by these two.
she's afraid i'll go insane listening to any more of "that noise". and
get this, she thinks i'm "closed minded" because i don't listen to other
music enough...hmmm...)
i must admit that i'm obsessed with getting my hands on everything that
either of them do. must be my mission in life (albeit an expensive one)
a quick note on the ruins cd; wonderfully strange! i absolutly love the
language they use for the lyrics. complete nonsense (as far as i'm
concerned), why screw up great listening pleasure with real words. we
hear enuff of those daily... as a matter of fact i think that's why i
took to naked city early on, no words, just screaming. what else could
convey such emotion such as humor or horror so effectivey...in the same
tune...
- -louie
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 14:53:29 -0500 (EST)
From: Brent Burton <bburton@CapAccess.org>
Subject: Re: help with KF tape
On Fri, 17 Oct 1997, Patrice L. Roussel wrote:
> Does anybody have a copy of the following?
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *** - SAMPLER A.V. ARTS VOL. 1 (KNITTING FACTORY - MUWORKS): various artists
>
> This record features excerpts from Improvised Music New York 1981.
>
> 1992 - Musiche (Italy), No 13 (CT)
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
don't have a copy but it sounds like trax from the muworks album
recorded @ the kitchen with derek bailey, charles k. noyes, bill laswell
(i think?) among others.
b
- -
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 06 Mar 1998 11:58:54 -0800
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: Re: help with KF tape
On Fri, 6 Mar 1998 14:53:29 -0500 (EST) Brent Burton wrote:
>
> On Fri, 17 Oct 1997, Patrice L. Roussel wrote:
>
> > Does anybody have a copy of the following?
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > *** - SAMPLER A.V. ARTS VOL. 1 (KNITTING FACTORY - MUWORKS): various artists
> >
> > This record features excerpts from Improvised Music New York 1981.
> >
> > 1992 - Musiche (Italy), No 13 (CT)
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> don't have a copy but it sounds like trax from the muworks album
> recorded @ the kitchen with derek bailey, charles k. noyes, bill laswell
> (i think?) among others.
Since last October, I got the detailed answer to this question. And yes, you
are right about that specific one.
Patrice.
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V2 #256
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