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utah-firearms-digest      Tuesday, April 14 1998      Volume 02 : Number 045




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 08:16:05 -0700
From: DAVID SAGERS <[e-mail]>
Subject: Sarah's wants your AR-15s, M1As. and M1 Carbines.  -Forwarded

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From: Joe Sylvester <[e-mail]>
To: Multiple recipients of list <[e-mail]>
Subject: Sarah's wants your AR-15s, M1As. and M1 Carbines.
X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0 -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas
X-Comment: Anti-Gun-Ban list

"By banning the importation of assault rifles accepting large capacity
magazines holding more than ten rounds, today=92s ruling affects weapons =
like
the military-style carbine that was used in the Jonesboro shooting and
which had a 15-round magazine.

The same tests that are being applied to imported assault weapons should
also be applied to domestically manufactured weapons. While imports alway=
s
have been the major source of assault rifles in this country, today=92s
action still leaves the door open for domestic manufacturers to circumven=
t
the federal assault weapon ban. Congress should move to close this loopho=
le
by adopting standards for domestic weapons that mirror today=92s ruling."

Full statement available at:

http://www.handguncontrol.org/c-main.htm



              The Second Amendment is the RESET button
                   of the United States Constitution.=20
                          ---Doug McKay" <[e-mail]>=20


Joe Sylvester
Don't Tread On Me !







- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:34:55 -0600
From: "S. Thompson" <[e-mail]>
Subject: ARCHERD: Streisand Takes Aim At Guns

>Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 13:03:20 -0700 (PDT)
>X-Sender: [e-mail]
>X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2
>To: "Sun Tzu's Firearms Advisory" <[e-mail]>
>From: "Sun Tzu's Firearms Newswire" <[e-mail]>
>Subject: More B.S. -- ARCHERD: Streisand Takes Aim At Guns
>
>Yahoo! News Entertainment Headlines
>
>Tuesday April 7, 1998 8:39 AM EDT
>
>ARCHERD: Streisand Takes Aim At Guns
>
>By Army Archerd, Daily Variety Senior Columnist
>Reuters/Variety ^REUTERS@
>
>HOLLYWOOD (Variety) - On the heels of this week's announcement by
>President Clinton banning the importation of assault weapons, comes
>a report that "The Incident on Long Island" will pull no punches.
>
>The NBC TV movie attacks the NRA and what the show calls the NRA's
>"fraudulent" claims of gun protection under the Second Amendment.
>Charlton Heston (who has an NRA "leadership position") loudly
>proclaims these assertions in his column in Guns & Ammo and in an
>NRA ad in the current Popular Mechanics in which he demands, "Why
>don't you demand the Second Amendment be taught at your kid's school?
>Fight back."
>
>The NBC telefilm is being switched into the sweeps, May 3. It is a
>Barwood production, exec produced by Barbra Streisand and Cis Corman
>and Jordan Davis, and directed by Joe Sargent. It is the story of
>Congresswoman Carolyn McCarthy (D.-N.Y.) and tells her story "from
>housewife to gun-control advocate to congresswoman." Streisand's
>Barwood became involved in TV only to be able to produce important
>subjects, like this, that would not make it to the bigscreen.
>
>The "incident" was the murder of six and the injuring of 19 others on
>Dec. 7, 1993, on the Long Island Commuter train. One of those killed
>was McCarthy's husband, Dennis, while their son Kevin was critically
>wounded. Laurie Metcalf plays McCarthy. The script by Maria Nation
>calls the NRA by name repeatedly. Sargent, now in final post on the
>TriStar-NBC project, tells me the script explains how the NRA errs
>in its claims of protection for the Second Amendment.
>
>A lobbyist in the movie states, "Did you know that former Chief Justice
>Burger called the NRA's misrepresentation of the Second Amendment one
>of the greatest pieces of fraud on the American public by special
>interest groups that he'd ever seen -- the Second Amendment has never
>been about the right of an individual to bear arms! It's about the
>right to arm a militia. A well-regulated militia." Sargent also says
>the show "names names of Congressman who tried to avoid the issue --
>and Congressmen (like Dan Frisa) who received funding from the NRA." And
>Bob Dole, who led the fight to repeal the ban on semi-automatic assault
>weapons which allowed 19 brands of assault weapons to once again be
>legally sold. Sargent says Streisand "went out of her way" to get this
>idea pitched to NBC with Corman. Rick Rosenberg and Bob Christiansen
>produce. Before the "incident," Congresswoman McCarthy was a Republican,
>by the way.
>
>Two days before Sargent started to direct the film, he reports, "My
>cousin got hold of a gun and blew his brains out."
>
>The director will have two shows airing during sweeps: the other is "The
>Wall" about the Vietnam Veterans' Memorial in D.C. and the mementos left
>there; it airs on Showtime May 24. He is again talking to Showtime to film
>a story about pleas for peace in Ireland.
>
>As for "Incident," he says, "We hope a little of this common sense will
>rub off." Many in the biz are hoping it will and are committed to the
>end of violence via their Committee to End Violence, headed
>by Sy Gomberg, Lloyd Bochner and Allen Manning, who are joined by 197
>creative members of the biz in a pledge to cut down gratuitous,
>excessive and unpunished violence.
>---- @
>
>    Freedom of the press is guaranteed only to those who own one.
>                   A. J. Liebling, The Wayward Press
>


Sarah Thompson, M.D.
http://www.therighter.com

April 19, 1775 - The Battles of Lexington and Concord
April 19, 1783 - Congress proclaims victory in the American War of
Independence
April 19, 1933 - The US abandons the gold standard
April 19, 1943 - The Warsaw Ghetto Uprising
April 19, 1993 - The Branch Davidian Massacre at Waco
April 19, 1995 - The Oklahoma City bombing

What are YOU willing to do for freedom?

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 15:42:07 -0700
From: DAVID SAGERS <[e-mail]>
Subject: Duane Cardal

Please call Duane Cardall at 801-535-5555

Constitutional Rights are Not Trivial On April 10, 1998 Duane Cardall made
an editorial on KSL television and Radio where he criticized gun owners,
referred to as the *gun lobby* for their efforts to keep their rights to carry
concealed weapons.  He called such people who wanted to protect their
rights names such as calloused, and obstinate.  Mr. Cardall inferred that
criminal acts of two adolescent boys at Jonesboro were the fault of
law-abiding citizens who own firearms for personal protection and that
the founding fathers were wrong to include a constitutional right to keep
and bear arms.

He said that #unless they compromise a bit on issues without serious
constitutional bearing, they're likely to face a public backlash that
ultimately could result in what they fear most...a revocation of their
constitutional right to bear arms.#

I think it would be appropriate to remind Mr. Cardall that #the gun lobby# is
so powerful mostly because of the widespread participation of ordinary
people who are not involved in politics as a profession or enjoy access
to communication such as do journalists.

If people who protect their rights are called calloused and obstinate,
perhaps he should consider the virtues of a five-day waiting period for a
government review before he releases his next editorial opinion.  Or
perhaps his own threat is applicable here:  If the news media
#compromise a bit# on their right to bias reporting however they want,
they could lose their right to free speech.

We should remember that 60 years ago that there was a very
charismatic leader who promised the people safe streets if they would
register their firearms, wealth if government could regulate industry and
to make their country the greatest in the world if they surrender some
trivial freedoms.  Today we call that form of government fascism.

Today we have a very charismatic leader who promises safe streets if
we ban a list of firearms that grows longer every year, great economic
progress if we will submit to government regulation and to lead our
nation into a bright new millennium if we will only surrender some trivial
freedoms.  Today our leader is Bill Clinton, arguably the most corrupt
president in American history and the liberal news media is behind him all
the way.

 Neil Sagers

Duane Cardall can be reached for comment at 801-535-5555 or at
[e-mail].

The text if Mr. Cardall*s editorial appears below and can be found at
http://www.ksl.com/TV/opinion.htm

   GUNS AND LITTLE GIRLS

April 10, 1998
Before many more days dim the memory of the tragedy of Jonesboro,
let's  talk about guns.

The causes of that horrible scene run deep with blame being placed on
everything from violence in the media to the breakdown of the family.
Whatever the cause, the tool used to carry out the deed was a gun.

The arguments of the powerful gun lobby aside, can anyone who saw
the  graphic images from that rural Arkansas school yard honestly doubt
that  our nation is paying a terrible price for allowing such easy access
to guns?

Yes, the Bill of Rights certainly allows Americans to keep and bear
arms.

But this is 1998, not 1776, and something about four little girls and a
teacher, shot down in cold blood in a school yard causes us to wonder
if  the Founding Fathers would feel the same about the Second
Amendment if  they were here today.

KSL knows the issue is emotional and even as we speak, gun
advocates are heading to their keyboards to pound out responses to
what we've said.  It's a powerful lobby that once again this year
successfully shot down efforts in Utah to keep concealed weapons out
of places like schools and churches, even though 90-percent of Utahns
favor such restrictions.

KSL says its time for gun lobbyists to quit being so calloused, so
obstinate.

Unless they compromise a bit on issues without serious constitutional
bearing, they're likely to face a public backlash that ultimately could result
in what they fear most...a revocation of their constitutional right to bear
arms.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 16:04:28 -0600
From: [e-mail] (Charles Hardy)
Subject: [chardy: [[The Real Lesson of the School Shootings - WSJ])]]]

I accidently deleted David's messgae about the KSL editorial against
guns.  Would someone please forward this along to KSL and/or drop me
a copy of the message so I can.  Thanks.

- ----BEGIN FORWARDED MESSGE----

From the Friday 27 March 1998 edition of the Wall Street
Journal, page A14, lower, right-hand section.  Passed along
for educational purposes.

By JOHN R. LOTT JR.

This week's horrific shootings in Arkansas have, predictably, spurred
calls for more gun control. But it's worth noting that the shootings
occurred in one of the few places in Arkansas where possessing a gun is
illegal. Arkansas, Kentucky and Mississippi--the three states that have
had deadly shootings in public schools over the past half-year--all
allow law-abiding adults to carry concealed handgun for
self-protection, except in public schools. Indeed, federal law
generally prohibits guns within 1,000 feet of a school.

Gun prohibitionists concede that banning guns around schools has not
quite worked as intended--but their response has been to call for more
regulations of guns. Yet what might appear to be the most obvious
policy may actually cost lives. When gun-control laws are passed, it is
law-abiding citizens, not would-be criminals, who adhere to them.
Obviously the police cannot be everywhere, so these laws risk creating
situations in which the good guys cannot defend themselves from the bad
ones.

Consider a fact hardly mentioned during the massive news coverage of
the October 1997 shooting spree at a high school in Pearl, Miss.: An
assistant principal retrieved a gun from his car and physically
immobilized the gunman for a full 41/2 minutes while waiting for the
police to arrive. The gunman had already fatally shot two students
(after earlier stabbing his mother to death). Who knows how many lives
the assistant principal saved by his prompt response?

Allowing teachers and other law-abiding adults to carry concealed
handguns in schools would not only make it easier to stop shootings in
progress. It could also help deter shootings from ever occurring.
Twenty-five or more years ago in Israel, terrorists would pull out
machine guns in malls and fire away at civilians. However, with
expanded concealed-handgun use by Israeli citizens, terrorists soon
found the ordinary people around them pulling pistols on them. Suffice
it to say, terrorists in Israel no longer engage in such public
shootings--they have switched to bombing, a tactic that doesn't allow
the intended victims to respond.

The one recent shooting of schoolchildren in Israel further
illustrates these points. On March 13, 1997, seven seventh- and
eighth-grade Israeli girls were shot to death by a Jordanian soldier
while they visited Jordan's so-called Island of Peace. The Los Angeles
Times reports that the Israelis had "complied with Jordanian requests
to leave their weapons behind when they entered the border enclave.
Otherwise, they might have been able to stop the shooting, several
parents said."

Together with my colleague William Landes, I have studied
multiple-victim public shootings in the U.S. from 1977 to 1995. These
were incidents in which at least two people were killed or injured in a
public place; to focus on the type of shooting seen in Arkansas we
excluded shootings that were the byproduct of another crime, such as
robbery. The U.S. averaged 21 such shootings per year, with an average
of 1.8 people killed and 2.7 wounded in each one.

We examined a whole range of different gun laws as well as other
methods of deterrence, such as the death penalty. However, only one
policy succeeded in reducing deaths and injuries from these
shootings--allowing law-abiding citizens to carry concealed handguns.

The effect of "shall-issue" concealed handgun laws--which give adults
the right to carry concealed handguns if they do not have a criminal
record or a history of significant mental illness--has been dramatic.
Thirty-one states now have such laws. When states passed them during
the 19 years we studied, the number of multiple-victim public shootings
declined by 84%. Deaths from these shootings plummeted on average by
90%, injuries by 82%. Higher arrest rates and increased use of the
death penalty slightly reduced the incidence of these events, but the
effects were never statistically significant.

With over 19,600 people murdered in 1996, those killed in multiple
victim public shootings account for fewer than 0.2% of the total. Yet
these are surely the murders that attract national as well as
international attention, often for days after the attack. Victims
recount their feelings of utter helplessness as a gunman methodically
shoots his cowering prey.

Unfortunately, much of the public policy debate is driven by lopsided
coverage of gun use. Tragic events like those in Arkansas receive
massive news coverage, as they should, but discussions of the 2.5
million times each year that people use guns defensively--including
cases in which public shootings are stopped before they happen--are
ignored. Dramatic stories of mothers who prevented their children from
being kidnapped by carjackers seldom even make the local news.

Attempts to outlaw guns from schools, no matter how well meaning, have
backfired. Instead of making schools safe for children, we have made
them safe for those intent on harming our children. Current school
policies fire teachers who even accidentally bring otherwise legal
concealed handguns to school. We might consider reversing this policy
and begin rewarding teachers who take on the responsibility to help
protect children.

Mr. Lott, a fellow at the University of Chicago School of Law,
is the author of "More Guns, Less Crime," forthcoming in early May from
the University of Chicago Press.


<http://interactive.wsj.com/edition/current/articles/SB89095813222556500.htm>

- ----END FORWARDED MESSAGE----

- --

Charles C. Hardy        | If my employer has an opinion on
<[e-mail]>            | these things I'm fairly certain
801.588.7200 (work)        | I'm not the one he'd have express it.

 A camel is a horse designed by a committee and an elephant is a mouse
 built to military specifications." -- from page 321 of "Cryptoanalysis
 for Microcomputers" by Caxton C. Foster (University of Massachusetts),
 Hayden Book Co. Inc., 1982.




- ----END FORWARDED MESSAGE----

- --

Charles C. Hardy        | If my employer has an opinion on
<[e-mail]>            | these things I'm fairly certain
801.588.7200 (work)        | I'm not the one he'd have express it.

"The prohibition is general. No clause in the Constitution could by rule
 of construction be conceived to give the Congress the power to disarm
 the people. Such a flagitious attempt could only be made under some
 general pretense by a state legislature. But if in blind pursuit of
 inordinate power, either should attempt it, this amendment may be
 appealed to as a restraint on both." -- William Rawle, 1825; considered
 academically to be an expert commentator on the Constitution. He was
 offered the position of the first Attorney General of the United States,
 by President Washington.

- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 16:49:16 -0700
From: DAVID SAGERS <[e-mail]>
Subject: [chardy: [[The Real Lesson of the School Shootings -  WSJ])]]] -Reply

Charles:

I e-mailed and faxed your WSJ article to Duane Cardall at KSL.  Thanks
for keeping that one on file, it hits the nail on the head.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 16:59:09 -0700
From: DAVID SAGERS <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Sarah Brady's Secret Attack Plan -Forwarded

Does anyone know if this is true or is it just another fund raising gimmick
from HCI?

========================================================

Hi all!

Thanks to Scott for posting this.  If anyone has an actual verifiable copy
of this fax, would you please let me know as I'd like to get a copy.
Thanks!

Sarah


At 10:22 PM 4/5/98 -0700, you wrote:
>
>On Ed Wolfe's website, Nation In Distress:
>http://www.involved.com/ewolfe/distress/
>
>06/08/14 StTN 12:35 FAX Sarah Brady
>
>Dear Handgun Control Member,
>
>I have marked this letter to you "confidential" because I am requesting
>that you avoid discussing the contents publicly for the next several
weeks.
>
>This is because we are about to initiate action that, if successful,
>will weaken the stranglehold that the gun industry, the NRA, and other
>gun fanatics have over local and national gun laws.
>
>And I am urgently requesting you to make an extraordinary gift to help
>strengthen our cause.
>
>Please let me quickly explain our plans; and then you will understand
>why both your generosity and secrecy are required.
>
>In brief, we believe there is a strong parallel between the gun industry
>and the tobacco companies! As you know, citizens at the local and
state
>level rose up in anger and demanded clean air in restaurants and
offices
>when Congress failed to take action.
>
>Here at Handgun Control Inc., it is our regrettable conclusion that this
>current Congress is not going to take the initiative on gun safety for
>America. Legislation is bogged down. The NRA and other gun industry
lobbying
>groups have multi-million dollar war chests set aside for this election
year.
>
>Consequently, it will be extremely difficult to pass any significant
>legislation this year.
>
>And so, even though we will not let up on our efforts in congress,
>our focus is going to make a dramatic shift.
>
>And we want to keep this shift as quiet as possible while we develop
our plan.
>
>In a few weeks, I will be announcing to the nation:
>
>The Citizens Campaign Against Community Gun Trafficking
>
>Even the title of this campaign will cause shockwaves to run through
>the gun industry and the NRA at local and national levels.
>
>We will be taking a page from the anti-smoking victories, where local
>ordinances banned smoking in public facilities and eventually forced
>state and national legislation to protest Americans' right to a
>smoke-free environment.
>
>And we'll remember the victories in the anti-drunk-driving movement, as
well.
>
>M.A.D.D. was formed by a small group of mothers whose children had
been
>killed by drunk drivers; they gathered supporters and strength at the
>grassroots level around the country, and before long these mothers
>started to be taken seriously everywhere, even on capitol Hill. Now,
>most states have tougher penalties for drunk drivers and the liquor
>industry is providing anti-drunk-driving messages in their advertising.
>
>In much the same way, we're going to attack the gun industry and the
gun
>pushers at the most basic point; where money is exchanged for guns.
>
>The Attack point: Local Gun Shows!
>
>Local gun shows make it extremely easy to purchase a gun for private
or
>criminal use. And that's because most of the guns at the shows are
sold
>by private individuals, not by dealers; and, therefore, in most states
>they are not covered by laws requiring background checks or
paperwork!
>
>So you can walk into a gun show, strike up a conversation with the guy
>hawking the M-l carbine, admire its light kick, repetitive fire, and
>ability to accept large magazine clips.
>
>Then you talk to that strange man parading around in his military
>fatigues, and later you meet him on the street, give him the necessary
>cash and the firearm is yours.
>
>All legal in most states, as long as that fellow is not a licensed gun
dealer!
>
>Loophole: The Second-Hand Market
>
>Right now, federal laws focus primarily on purchases of handguns
from
>licensed dealers. And the Brady Handgun violence and prevention Act
has
>stopped many criminals from buying handguns from licensed dealers.
>
>But most states have no laws preventing one individual from selling a
>weapon to another, as long as the seller is not a licensed gun dealer.
>
>"The individual purchasing the gun does not have to show identification,
>does not have to submit to background checks. And the person selling
>the gun does not need to keep a written record of the transaction or the
>buyer's address and social Security number. Also, quite obviously,
>there is no waiting period. All in all, this is the most outrageous
>loophole in our federal gun laws.
>
>And gun shows are where criminals do their shopping; where the
>second-hand gun market really thrives.
>
>And so, this is why one of our first goals in The Citizens Campaign
Against
>Community Gun Trafficking is going to be to close down the gun shows!
>
>These gun shows are most often held on public property: civic centers,
>school gymnasiums, fairgrounds, city and county convention centers.
>
>And these giant weapons bazaars have developed considerable
notoriety,
>because of such high-profile cases as Oklahoma City bomber Timothy
>Mcveigh, who was reported to have bought or sold weapons at gun
shows.
>
>A recent issue of "Shotgun News", the "bible" of the gun pushers,
>advertised over 500 gun shows for the last three months of 1997
alone.
>And this does not include many of the smaller shows and swap meets.
>
>I believe that now you can see why our Citizens campaign Against
>Community Gun Trafficking is going to result in tremendous controversy.
>
>And I wish that we could keep it secret; 100% secret; until we are
>ready to launch the campaign.
>
>But, unlike the NRA and the right-wing, gun toting fanatics, we do not
>have a multi-million dollar war chest. We depend upon grassroots
support
>from friends like you. And so I wanted to take the calculated risk and
>share this plan with you, and hope that you will step forward and send
>a significant gift to express your belief that citizens, with or without
>Congress, can get things done!
>
>In a few weeks, if you're interested, I will forward to you a 'Citizens
>Action Kit," detailing exactly what can be done in your local community.
>
>We intend to bring pressure upon mayors, city councils, school boards,
>churches, and all property owners to ban the use of any facility for gun
shows.
>
>Already, we are working with Dade county, Florida, mounting an all-out
>assault on gun shows in that area. I will be reporting to you about
>that innovative and successful initiative before long. But, as of
>now, we are not quite ready to go public with the results.
>
>But I must quickly bring this letter to a close, after I warn you that
>this is going to be a long, hard-fought campaign.
>
>After all, it took many, many years before the tobacco industry felt the
>heat of local citizens demanding a smoke-tree environment.
>
>So we must be patient, firm, determined and uncompromising.
>
>Our enemies will incorrectly and misleadingly scream about freedom of
>speech and freedom of assembly. But in turn, we will quietly remind
>them that America is involved in a gun war that is claiming 35,000
>lives each year including 9,OOO murdered by handguns.
>
>And we'll remind them that Americans must responsibly report
transactions
>involving cars, liquor and other products. Why should gun sales be
exempt?
>
>Every day 14 children, 19 years old and under, are killed by handguns.
Much
>of this mayhem is made possible by the use of public property for gun
shows.
>
>These statistics are tragic proof that a state of war exists.
>
>And, as you know, in my case, the statistic became personal
heartbreak
>when my husband Jim was grievously wounded by a bullet intended
for
>President Reagan.
>
>You and I must make America a safer place to live. Let's do it!
>
>P.S. I urge you to turn to the enclosed reply slip and write out a check
>in one of the amounts I've indicated. Or perhaps you can give more.
>But please do the best you can.
>
>I look forward to receiving your support, and I will trust in your silence
>as we prepare our citizens Campaign Against Community Gun
Trafficking.


- -

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 08:51:30 -0700
From: DAVID SAGERS <[e-mail]>
Subject: Hartley Anderson and Washington Co.Convention -Forwarded

Received: from [e-mail]
    by imo27.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 3LHVa11820;
    Tue, 14 Apr 1998 02:16:09 -0500 (EDT)
From: Chirob <[e-mail]>
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 02:16:09 EDT
To: [e-mail], [e-mail], [e-mail], [e-mail],
        [e-mail], [e-mail], [e-mail],
        [e-mail]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Subject: Hartley Anderson and Washington Co.Convention
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64

Thought you all might like to see this.
Could be very interesting.  I can not receive KWUN up here where I live.  If
any of you listen, please give me a report.

Thanks,
Lori

I received this from Richard Partridge who is a candidate in Box Elder for
Peter Knudsen's old seat.

I'll be sustitute host for Kay Henry from 2:00 PM to 4:00 PM on Tuesday, April
14 on KWUN-1230 AM

My guests will be Hartley Anderson and Gerry Arthus, who are planning a press
conference that morning to expose and denounce the duplicity of Rob Bishop,
state chair of the Republican Party of Utah.

They will cite Bishop's serving as a paid lobbyist for 12 companies (check
"Lobbyists" on the Lt. Gov's website); refusal at two county conventions to
sign a pledge supporting the GOP's state party platform; blatant favortism
towards incumbents; denial of delegate lists despite Anderson's withdrawing
his Libertarian Party filing despite Bishop's insistence and promises; and
threatening to have Anderson arrested if he spoke for more than six minutes at
the Washington County convention.

According to Gerry, Republican county delegates who have learned about
Bishop's
capitalizing on his state chair's position to be a highly paid lobbyist for
companies,
like Envirocare and TCI, whose activities run contrary to the GOP platform,
are outraged. (I am considering proposing an "ethics amendment" to our
constitution to further assure voters and members that Libertarians are not
hypocrites.) It is estimated that Bishop earns $500,000 a year from lobbying
as the head of the state GOP.

And, as noted previously, I'll be a guest on Jim Kirkwood's show from 10:00 AM
to Noon on
Wednesday, April 15 on KTKK-630 AM


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 08:52:43 -0700
From: DAVID SAGERS <[e-mail]>
Subject: Assault gun ban stalls in Assembly (fwd) -Forwarded

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Subject: Assault gun ban stalls in Assembly (fwd)
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One vote short. Just one.

- ---Forwarded Msg---
  Monday, 13 April
  Carolyn Hart <[e-mail]>:

Monday April 13 5:34 PM EDT

Assault gun ban stalls in Assembly

SACRAMENTO, Calif., April 13 (UPI) _ Legislation to strengthen and
expand California's prohibition of assault weapons has fallen one vote
short (Monday) of going to the governor. The bill failed on an
Assembly vote of concurrence in Senate amendments, but the author
received permission to try again on another day. It would replace the
current list of outlawed, military-style semiautomatic weapons with a
much broader, generic description of guns to be prohibited.
http://biz.yahoo.com/upi/98/04/13/general_news/usassault_1.html
- ---End Forwarded Msg---


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Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 08:56:48 -0700
From: DAVID SAGERS <[e-mail]>
Subject: KSL

Charles:

Assuming KSL will allow an opposing view point, do you have anyone in
mind to give the rebuttal.  Are you interested?  Perhaps Janalee?

I am still working to get an answer from KSL.


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Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 10:33:54 -0600
From: [e-mail] (Charles Hardy)
Subject: Re: KSL

On Tue, 14 Apr 1998,  DAVID SAGERS <[e-mail]> posted:

>Charles:
>
>Assuming KSL will allow an opposing view point, do you have anyone in
>mind to give the rebuttal.  Are you interested?  Perhaps Janalee?
>
>I am still working to get an answer from KSL.

I was hoping for someone better spoken and presented than myself.
Janalee might be a good choice although it was you that I had in mind.

- --

Charles C. Hardy        | If my employer has an opinion on
<[e-mail]>            | these things I'm fairly certain
801.588.7200 (work)        | I'm not the one he'd have express it.

"Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to
teenage boys." - P.J. O'Rourke

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Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 15:51:09 -0700
From: DAVID SAGERS <[e-mail]>
Subject: Duane Cardall - Anti-Gun Editorial

Many of us are aware of the less than favorable editorial Duane Cardall
gave on KSL TV.  (See below)

I spoke with Duane Cardall this morning, he was cordial and receptive to
my comments.  Mr Cardall has received mountains of responses from his
anti-gun editorial.

The purpose of my call to Mr. Cardall is that KSL used to allow people the
chance to appear on TV with a different view point, unfortunately, KSL
has discontinued this program.

Mr. Cardall is reviewing the responses and will choose from among them
and present one or more of these letters sometime in the next couple of
weeks.

He said that if anyone else wants to respond to his editorial they should
get their letters to him quickly, as he wants to narrow down the pile to
two or three letters sometime in the next week.

==========================================================

   GUNS AND LITTLE GIRLS

April 10, 1998

Before many more days dim the memory of the tragedy of Jonesboro,
let's talk about guns.

The causes of that horrible scene run deep with blame being placed on
everything from violence in the media to the breakdown of the family.
Whatever the cause, the tool used to carry out the deed was a gun.

The arguments of the powerful gun lobby aside, can anyone who saw
the graphic images from that rural Arkansas school yard honestly doubt
that our nation is paying a terrible price for allowing such easy access to
guns?

Yes, the Bill of Rights certainly allows Americans to keep and bear
arms.

But this is 1998, not 1776, and something about four little girls and a
teacher, shot down in cold blood in a school yard causes us to wonder
if the Founding Fathers would feel the same about the Second
Amendment if they were here today.

KSL knows the issue is emotional and even as we speak, gun
advocates are heading to their keyboards to pound out responses to
what we've said.

It's a powerful lobby that once again this year successfully shot down
efforts in Utah to keep concealed weapons out of places like schools
and churches, even though 90-percent of Utahns favor such
restrictions.

KSL says its time for gun lobbyists to quit being so calloused, so
obstinate.

Unless they compromise a bit on issues without serious constitutional
bearing, they're likely to face a public backlash that ultimately could result
in what they fear most...a revocation of their constitutional right to bear
arms.

=======================================================

Please call Duane Cardall at 801-575-5555, Fax [phone]

Constitutional Rights are Not Trivial

On April 10, 1998 Duane Cardall made an editorial on KSL television and
Radio where he criticized gun owners, referred to as the *gun lobby* for
their efforts to keep their rights to carry concealed weapons.  He called
such people who wanted to protect their rights names such as
calloused, and obstinate.  Mr. Cardall inferred that criminal acts of two
adolescent boys at Jonesboro were the fault of law-abiding citizens
who own firearms for personal protection and that the founding fathers
were wrong to include a constitutional right to keep and bear arms.

He said that *unless they compromise a bit on issues without serious
constitutional bearing, they're likely to face a public backlash that =
ultimately could result in what they fear most...a revocation of their
constitutional right to bear arms.*

I think it would be appropriate to remind Mr. Cardall that *the gun lobby* is
so powerful mostly because of the widespread participation of ordinary
people who are not involved in politics as a profession or enjoy access
to communication such as do journalists.

If people who protect their rights are called calloused and obstinate,
perhaps he should consider the virtues of a five-day waiting period for a
government review before he releases his next editorial opinion.  Or
perhaps his own threat is applicable here:  If the news media
*compromise a bit* on their right to bias reporting however they want,
they could lose their right to free speech.

We should remember that 60 years ago that there was a very
charismatic leader who promised the people safe streets if they would
register their firearms, wealth if government could regulate industry and
to make their country the greatest in the world if they surrender some
trivial freedoms.

Today we call that form of government fascism.

Today we have a very charismatic leader who promises safe streets if
we ban a list of firearms that grows longer every year, great economic
progress if we will submit to government regulation and to lead our
nation into a bright new millennium if we will only surrender some trivial
freedoms.  Today our leader is Bill Clinton, arguably the most corrupt
president in American history and the liberal news media is behind him all
the way.

Duane Cardall can be reached for comment at 801-535-5555 or at
[e-mail].

The text if Mr. Cardall*s editorial appears below and can be found at
http://www.ksl.com/TV/opinion.htm

========================================================

- ----BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE----

From the Friday 27 March 1998 edition of the Wall Street Journal, page
A14, lower, right-hand section.  Passed along for educational purposes.

By JOHN R. LOTT JR.

This week's horrific shootings in Arkansas have, predictably, spurred
calls for more gun control. But it's worth noting that the shootings
occurred in one of the few places in Arkansas where possessing a gun
is illegal. Arkansas, Kentucky and Mississippi--the three states that have
had deadly shootings in public schools over the past half-year--all allow
law-abiding adults to carry concealed handgun for self-protection,
except in public schools. Indeed, federal law generally prohibits guns
within 1,000 feet of a school.

Gun prohibitionists concede that banning guns around schools has not
quite worked as intended--but their response has been to call for more
regulations of guns. Yet what might appear to be the most obvious policy
may actually cost lives. When gun-control laws are passed, it is
law-abiding citizens, not would-be criminals, who adhere to them.
Obviously the police cannot be everywhere, so these laws risk creating
situations in which the good guys cannot defend themselves from the
bad ones.

Consider a fact hardly mentioned during the massive news coverage of
the October 1997 shooting spree at a high school in Pearl, Miss.: An
assistant principal retrieved a gun from his car and physically immobilized
the gunman for a full 41/2 minutes while waiting for the police to arrive.
The gunman had already fatally shot two students
(after earlier stabbing his mother to death). Who knows how many lives
the assistant principal saved by his prompt response?

Allowing teachers and other law-abiding adults to carry concealed
handguns in schools would not only make it easier to stop shootings in
progress. It could also help deter shootings from ever occurring.
Twenty-five or more years ago in Israel, terrorists would pull out
machine guns in malls and fire away at civilians. However, with
expanded concealed-handgun use by Israeli citizens, terrorists soon
found the ordinary people around them pulling pistols on them. Suffice it
to say, terrorists in Israel no longer engage in such public
shootings--they have switched to bombing, a tactic that doesn't allow the
intended victims to respond.

The one recent shooting of schoolchildren in Israel further illustrates
these points. On March 13, 1997, seven seventh- and eighth-grade
Israeli girls were shot to death by a Jordanian soldier while they visited
Jordan's so-called Island of Peace. The Los Angeles
Times reports that the Israelis had "complied with Jordanian requests to
leave their weapons behind when they entered the border enclave.
Otherwise, they might have been able to stop the shooting, several
parents said."

Together with my colleague William Landes, I have studied multiple-victim
public shootings in the U.S. from 1977 to 1995. These were incidents in
which at least two people were killed or injured in a public place; to
focus on the type of shooting seen in Arkansas we excluded shootings
that were the byproduct of another crime, such as robbery. The U.S.
averaged 21 such shootings per year, with an average of 1.8 people
killed and 2.7 wounded in each one.

We examined a whole range of different gun laws as well as other
methods of deterrence, such as the death penalty. However, only one
policy succeeded in reducing deaths and injuries from these
shootings--allowing law-abiding citizens to carry concealed handguns.

The effect of "shall-issue" concealed handgun laws--which give adults
the right to carry concealed handguns if they do not have a criminal
record or a history of significant mental illness--has been dramatic.
Thirty-one states now have such laws. When states passed them during
the 19 years we studied, the number of multiple-victim public shootings
declined by 84%. Deaths from these shootings plummeted on average by
90%, injuries by 82%. Higher arrest rates and increased use of the death
penalty slightly reduced the incidence of these events, but the effects
were never statistically significant.

With over 19,600 people murdered in 1996, those killed in multiple victim
public shootings account for fewer than 0.2% of the total. Yet these are
surely the murders that attract national as well as international attention,
often for days after the attack. Victims recount their feelings of utter
helplessness as a gunman methodically shoots his cowering prey.

Unfortunately, much of the public policy debate is driven by lopsided
coverage of gun use. Tragic events like those in Arkansas receive
massive news coverage, as they should, but discussions of the 2.5
million times each year that people use guns defensively--including
cases in which public shootings are stopped before they happen--are
ignored. Dramatic stories of mothers who prevented their children from
being kidnaped by carjackers seldom even make the local news.

Attempts to outlaw guns from schools, no matter how well meaning,
have backfired. Instead of making schools safe for children, we have
made them safe for those intent on harming our children. Current school
policies fire teachers who even accidentally bring otherwise legal
concealed handguns to school. We might consider reversing this policy
and begin rewarding teachers who take on the responsibility to help
protect children.

Mr. Lott, a fellow at the University of Chicago School of Law, is the
author of "More Guns, Less Crime," forthcoming in early May from the
University of Chicago Press.


<http://interactive.wsj.com/edition/current/articles/SB89095813222556500.htm>

- ----END FORWARDED MESSAGE----

- --

Charles C. Hardy        | If my employer has an opinion on
<[e-mail]>            | these things I'm fairly certain
801.588.7200 (work)        | I'm not the one he'd have express it.

 A camel is a horse designed by a committee and an elephant is a mouse
 built to military specifications." -- from page 321 of "Cryptoanalysis
 for Microcomputers" by Caxton C. Foster (University of Massachusetts),
 Hayden Book Co. Inc., 1982.




- ----END FORWARDED MESSAGE----

- --

Charles C. Hardy        | If my employer has an opinion on
<[e-mail]>            | these things I'm fairly certain
801.588.7200 (work)        | I'm not the one he'd have express it.

"The prohibition is general. No clause in the Constitution could by rule
 of construction be conceived to give the Congress the power to disarm
 the people. Such a flagitious attempt could only be made under some
 general pretense by a state legislature. But if in blind pursuit of
 inordinate power, either should attempt it, this amendment may be
 appealed to as a restraint on both." -- William Rawle, 1825; considered
 academically to be an expert commentator on the Constitution. He was
 offered the position of the first Attorney General of the United States,
 by President Washington.


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End of utah-firearms-digest V2 #45
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