ftp.xmission.com/2014.06.ftp.xmission.com.tar/ftp.xmission.com/pub/lists/movies/archive/movies.200008

Internet Message Format | 2000-08-31 | 335KB

From: [e-mail]
Subject: [MV] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?To=20everyone=20that's=20seen=20Pok=E9mon:=20The=20?=
Date: 01 Aug 2000 02:03:56 EDT

Whether you liked it (???) or hated it (Kids WB sucks), if you've seen it,
this is something I want you to read:

 <A HREF="http://www.fushigi.org/newhome/misc/snipika/index.html-ssi">A.U.R.A.
: Miscellaneous: Snipika! Part 1</A>

This site has a special feature showing some of the various script changes
for Mewtwo Strikes Back in the dubbing process.  Something to point out: NO
FIGHTING IS WRONG BS!!!!!  I know it's not complete, but it, for the most
part, confirms my conviction that all Kids WB employees who dubbed this movie
have no idea what they are doing.  So, for comparison's sake, please check it
out.
-Eric-

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From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Perfect Storm
Date: 01 Aug 2000 15:37:18 +0100

OK, I'm off to see Perfect Storm tonight, me and my girlfriend are
taking my parents - hey I ain't seen them for about 2 months.  Now my
dad is your average Charles Bronson fan - he turned "The Matrix" off
because he couldn't understand it.  I'll let you know my and more
importantly, their thoughts on the film tomorrow, if I'm still alive -
damn this cold.

MARK


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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Perfect Storm
Date: 01 Aug 2000 10:38:36 EDT

In a message dated 08/01/2000 7:17:32 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< OK, I'm off to see Perfect Storm tonight, me and my girlfriend are
 taking my parents - hey I haven't seen them for about 2 months.  Now my
 dad is your average Charles Bronson fan - he turned "The Matrix" off
 because he couldn't understand it.  I'll let you know my and more
 importantly, their thoughts on the film tomorrow, if I'm still alive -
 damn this cold.

 MARK >>

Well, I thought it was great.  The characters were very believable and the
storm was exciting.  Or do I just feel very good about this movie because I
kind of expected another Twister?
-Eric-

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From: Diane Christy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Perfect Storm
Date: 01 Aug 2000 10:35:13 -0500

On 8/1/00, 10:38 AM -0400, [e-mail] said so nicely:
>Well, I thought it was great.  The characters were very believable and the
>storm was exciting.  Or do I just feel very good about this movie because I
>kind of expected another Twister?

I thought the special effects made the movie.  I thought the writing
was banal and trite.  But the story was interesting (mostly because
it was based on a true story).  The storm was the star of the show!!
I'm reading the book now.  I find the life of these fishermen to be
fascinating.  It's almost like a religion!!
--
~~~~~
Diane Christy (Samantha and Joshua's Mom)
Jefferson, LA
http://www.geocities.com/~dchristy10/
mailto:[e-mail]
ICQ #12904700  <dkbc10> on Instant AOL Messenger
~~~~~

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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Perfect Storm
Date: 01 Aug 2000 12:28:59 EDT

In a message dated 08/01/2000 8:36:34 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< I thought the special effects made the movie.  I thought the writing
 was banal and trite.  But the story was interesting (mostly because
 it was based on a true story).  The storm was the star of the show!!
 I'm reading the book now.  I find the life of these fishermen to be
 fascinating.  It's almost like a religion!! >>

I didn't think it was that boring.  I mean, it's ordinary, yes, but I think
that's the point.  These are ordinary people, so why do you have to be so
original.  I did like the story too, and, quite frankly, I'm very glad it
didn't become another Twister.
-Eric-

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From: Diane Christy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Perfect Storm
Date: 01 Aug 2000 15:18:16 -0500

On 8/1/00, 12:28 PM -0400, [e-mail] said so nicely:
>I didn't think it was that boring.  I mean, it's ordinary, yes, but I think
>that's the point.  These are ordinary people, so why do you have to be so
>original.  I did like the story too, and, quite frankly, I'm very glad it
>didn't become another Twister.

I didn't say that it was boring.  I liked the story very much.  It
was the dialogue that I found to be cliche.
--
~~~~~
Diane Christy (Samantha and Joshua's Mom)
Jefferson, LA
http://www.geocities.com/~dchristy10/
mailto:[e-mail]
ICQ #12904700  <dkbc10> on Instant AOL Messenger
~~~~~

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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Perfect Storm
Date: 01 Aug 2000 17:01:53 -0700


I have a confession to make.  I haven't see that movie yet.

Dexter


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From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] Perfect Storm *Spoilers*
Date: 02 Aug 2000 09:20:39 +0100

OK, so I went to see it last night, did I enjoy it - yeah, was I
disappointed - yeah.  It may seem like a strange analogy, but it
reminded me of "Psycho" - HOW???? you cry - weeeeellll,  both films
spend so long on the set-up, that when things finally start to get
interesting, it's all over way too quickly.  Kinda F*cked up reasoning,
maybe?  Also the incidents on the boat in the storm - there aren't that
many, and they aren't that nail biting.  If Peterson had started killing
them off individually, instead of all at once, then maybe it would have
sustained tension a bit more.

I did enjoy the film, I would recommend anyone going to see it, I will
probably own it when it comes out on DVD, but for me, it just missed
that "something", an undefinable quality that would have made it a great
film instead of just a very good film.

MARK

> -----Original Message-----
> From:    [e-mail] [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> Sent:    01 August 2000 17:29
> To:    [e-mail]
> Subject:    Re: [MV] Perfect Storm
>
> In a message dated 08/01/2000 8:36:34 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> [e-mail] writes:
>
> << I thought the special effects made the movie.  I thought the
> writing
>  was banal and trite.  But the story was interesting (mostly because
>  it was based on a true story).  The storm was the star of the show!!
>  I'm reading the book now.  I find the life of these fishermen to be
>  fascinating.  It's almost like a religion!! >>
>
> I didn't think it was that boring.  I mean, it's ordinary, yes, but I
> think
> that's the point.  These are ordinary people, so why do you have to be
> so
> original.  I did like the story too, and, quite frankly, I'm very glad
> it
> didn't become another Twister.
> -Eric-
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

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From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] Perfect Storm *Spoilers
Date: 02 Aug 2000 10:21:00 -0600

> OK, so I went to see it last night, did I enjoy it - yeah, was I
> disappointed - yeah.  It may seem like a strange analogy, but it
> reminded me of "Psycho" - HOW???? you cry - weeeeellll,  both films
> spend so long on the set-up, that when things finally start to get
> interesting, it's all over way too quickly.

I believe your description is accurate for PERFECT STORM, but not PSYCHO.
PSYCHO actually spends no time at all setting up it's main plot.  The first
part of the film is not set up, it's an extended red herring.

My problem with the film was that the computerized special effects were much
too obvious, and immediately took me out of the story every time they were
used.

I compare the film to JAWS.  Both films are interesting character pieces in
the clothing of action pictures.

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From: "Roger de Borja" <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Erin Brokovich (Spoiler?)
Date: 03 Aug 2000 02:12:59 GMT

I know Erin Brokovich is a relatively old film, but to those who haven't
seen it yet, my question is a bit of a spoiler.

I don't know if its been asked before, but just in case it hasn't...

In the beginning of the film, Julia Roberts gets into her old car, drives
away...camera follows her without any cuts.....and is violently slammed by a
speeding car!

I don't think any big-time Hollywood star would be daring enough to do such
a dangerous stunt him/herself...so it must be some special effect.

My question is : how did they do that..???
________________________________________________________________________
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From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] RE: Erin Brokovich (Spoiler?)
Date: 03 Aug 2000 08:36:00 -0600

> In the beginning of the film, Julia Roberts gets into her old car, drives
> away...camera follows her without any cuts.....and is violently slammed by a
> speeding car!

That was actually two seperate shots.  Digital effects were used to hide the
cut.  I imagine that watching the film frame-by-frame, you would probably be
able to see where it was.  For similar "faux single shot" scenes, check out
the first 15 minutes of SNAKE EYES or the entirety of ROPE.

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From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Overused Movie Music
Date: 07 Aug 2000 10:51:00 -0600

Well, I was watching "The Simpsons" last night when I finally snapped.  During
a promo for "Dark Angel," they played "Escape" from the PLUNKETT AND MACLAINE
soundtrack and at that point I realized how sick I was of that track.  Do they
have to use it in EVERY trailer?  Other recent offenders are THE PATRIOT and
ROMEO MUST DIE.

Of course, "Escape" is just the latest in a series of overused (or should I
say abused) music in trailers.  Before that it was "O Fortuna" from Orff's
"Carmina Burana" and before that it was music from the end of ALIENS.  Now, I
understand that trailers are made before the score is complete, so using bits
from the actual music is impossible, but come on!  Not everything has to be
the same.  It's especially amusing when you see two trailers in a row
featuring the same music.

It seems that every movie nowadays features a scene where the characters
lip-sync a pop hit of yesteryear while brandishing a makeshift "microphone."
Do the actors in these scenes have no sense of dignity?  Do they have even the
slightest clue how stupid they look?  And it seems that they always use the
same five or six songs...

Of these lip-synced horrors, the worst is "I Will Survive."  This song was
done to perfection in PRISCELLA, QUEEN OF THE DESERT and should have been
retired right then and there.  Of course, that never happened and it turns up
most recently in THE REPLACEMENTS.  I also heard that the song is used in
COYOTE UGLY as well...which means that it will have appeared in twice in just
a couple weeks!

Another overused song is Buffalo Springfield's "For What its Worth."  The song
is about a specific event in history (the Kent State massacre), yet it is
played in every single film set in the sixties, regardless of the context.
For movies set in seventies the culprit seems to be "Stayin' Alive" (which is
always accompanied by a "hilarious" spoof of John Travolta's strut.  Not a lot
of movies about the eighties have surfaced yet, but I dread to see what anthem
is used for that decade.  I guarantee that any nostalagic movie made about the
1990's in the future will include "Smells Like Teen Spirit" in the sountrack.

Finally, I shall end my rant with "For He's a Jolly Good Fellow."  In my
entire life, I have NEVER heard ANYONE sing this song on ANY occasion, let
alone birthday parties.  Yet, in movies it's used all the time because it's
public domain and "Happy Birthday to Me" is not.  Come on, Hollywood, pony up
the bucks and get the real song.  If we can afford to digitally alter the
expressions of bad actors, we can certainly get the rights to a little song.

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From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Overused Movie Music
Date: 07 Aug 2000 11:02:59 -0700

on 8/7/2000 9:51 AM, ("Paul D  Richardson") at [e-mail]
wrote:

> Finally, I shall end my rant with "For He's a Jolly Good Fellow."  In my
> entire life, I have NEVER heard ANYONE sing this song on ANY occasion, let
> alone birthday parties.  Yet, in movies it's used all the time because it's
> public domain and "Happy Birthday to Me" is not.  Come on, Hollywood, pony up
> the bucks and get the real song.  If we can afford to digitally alter the
> expressions of bad actors, we can certainly get the rights to a little song.

According to at least one source <http://metalab.unc.edu/team/fun/birthday/>
the rights to "Happy Birthday" are owned by Warner Communications, so you'd
think that it would be used in Warner's movies, at the very least.

BTW: This same source states that "Jolly Good Fellow" (along with "Happy
Birthday" and "Auld Lang Syne") is one of the three most-often-sung songs in
the English language.  So SOMEONE must sing it, on SOME occasion!


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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Overused Movie Music
Date: 07 Aug 2000 16:36:41 EDT

In a message dated 08/07/2000 10:39:47 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< Of these lip-synced horrors, the worst is "I Will Survive."  This song was
 done to perfection in PRISCELLA, QUEEN OF THE DESERT and should have been
 retired right then and there.  Of course, that never happened and it turns up
 most recently in THE REPLACEMENTS.  I also heard that the song is used in
 COYOTE UGLY as well...which means that it will have appeared in twice in just
 a couple weeks! >>

Agreed on the part of "I Will Survive."  I don't think it's really a bad
song, but every time I see that trailer for "The Replacements," this is the
most annoying part.  Ebert says it is used in Coyote Ugly as well, but at
least they don't show it in the trailers.  Anyway, if we're getting on the
topic of these movies, is anyone going to see them?
-Eric-

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From: Al <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Overused Movie Music
Date: 08 Aug 2000 10:26:50 +1200

Isn't there a pool from which directors can choose any music for movie
trailors? This is done, I guess, because the music score is yet to be
completed, so the likelyhood is that the same music will be heard backing
different trailors.


"Mr. Bigglesworth is upset!  And when Mr. Bigglesworth is upset, people DIE!"

Mike Myers(DrEvil) - Austin Powers: International Man of Mystery




Al Dunn,
519 Great King St,
Dunedin, New Zealand.
ph 479 0106
mobile: [phone]



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From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Overused Movie Music
Date: 07 Aug 2000 16:48:00 -0600

> Anyway, if we're getting on the
> topic of these movies, is anyone going to see them?

I saw THE REPLACEMENTS and enjoyed it quite a bit.  I'll be seeing COYOTE UGLY
on the same day Satan starts walking around in a parka.

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From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Overused Movie Music
Date: 07 Aug 2000 16:52:00 -0600

> Isn't there a pool from which directors can choose any music for movie
> trailors? This is done, I guess, because the music score is yet to be
> completed, so the likelyhood is that the same music will be heard backing
> different trailors.

Trailers are usually put together by the marketing people, not by the
director.  They don't have a limited pool of music, they use whatever they
want (providing they can get the rights).  However, a lack of originality and
creative effort leads to the poor music selection.

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From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Upcoming Movies (was: Overused Movie Music)
Date: 07 Aug 2000 19:24:56 -0400

At 04.36 PM 07/08/2000 EDT, [e-mail] wrote:
>Agreed on the part of "I Will Survive."  I don't think it's really a bad
>song, but every time I see that trailer for "The Replacements," this is the
>most annoying part.  Ebert says it is used in Coyote Ugly as well, but at
>least they don't show it in the trailers.  Anyway, if we're getting on the
>topic of these movies, is anyone going to see them?

Could not pay me to watch Replacements.  Might be worth a video rental,
tho.  Caught the soon-to-video Any Given Sunday (another football movie),
and it was better than I expected.  Still, glad I did not waste money at
the theatre for it.

Coyote Ugly, just the name and the premise are intriguing, and might just
have to try to catch it, after I get to see Space Cowboys, of course:-)

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty     http://www.webz.com/gowanna
mailto:[e-mail]                  mailto:[e-mail]

419 Butler Street
PO Box 95184
Pittsburgh, PA 15223-0184
[phone]                                    [phone]
1-888-45-GOWANNA -- TOLL FREE     (1-888-454-6926)
____________________________________________
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 for!" reaction to  "Gladiator"
______________________________________________


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From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Overused Movie Music
Date: 09 Aug 2000 01:37:11 -0700

I've got a major trailer-music gripe.

Where I am they're just starting to advertise The Virgin Suicides, a
fantastic film with perhaps the best soundtrack I've heard, but for
some God unknown reason they've got a Moby track playing on the
trailer. Not very in keeping with a film set in the 70's, methinks.

Marketers.. death to them all.

OZ

"(Paul D Richardson)" wrote:
>
> > Isn't there a pool from which directors can choose any music for movie
> > trailors? This is done, I guess, because the music score is yet to be
> > completed, so the likelyhood is that the same music will be heard backing
> > different trailors.
>
> Trailers are usually put together by the marketing people, not by the
> director.  They don't have a limited pool of music, they use whatever they
> want (providing they can get the rights).  However, a lack of originality and
> creative effort leads to the poor music selection.
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

--
Kind regards,
Chris Parry

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] In Memory of Sir Alec Guiness
Date: 08 Aug 2000 13:37:14 -0700

A screen legend passed away over the weekend.  I may have missed the
e-mail but I don't believe anyone in the list talked about it.

Anyways, a great actor, his talent will be sorely missed.  Obi-Wan
Kenobi is really in spirit form now.  :)

Dexter


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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] In Memory of Sir Alec Guiness
Date: 08 Aug 2000 16:57:42 EDT

In a message dated 08/08/2000 1:29:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< A screen legend passed away over the weekend.  I may have missed the
 e-mail but I don't believe anyone in the list talked about it.

 Anyways, a great actor, his talent will be sorely missed.  Obi-Wan
 Kenobi is really in spirit form now.  :)

 Dexter >>

Yes, all fans of the Trilogy will definitely miss him.  Ewan McGregor doesn't
hold a candle to Old Ben.
-Eric-

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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Master and Apprentice (was In Memory of Sir Alec Guiness)
Date: 08 Aug 2000 15:39:40 -0700



[e-mail] wrote:

> In a message dated 08/08/2000 1:29:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> [e-mail] writes:
>
> << A screen legend passed away over the weekend.  I may have missed the
>  e-mail but I don't believe anyone in the list talked about it.
>
>  Anyways, a great actor, his talent will be sorely missed.  Obi-Wan
>  Kenobi is really in spirit form now.  :)
>
>  Dexter >>
>
> Yes, all fans of the Trilogy will definitely miss him.  Ewan McGregor doesn't
> hold a candle to Old Ben.
> -Eric-
>

Ewan is Ewan.  I think he adds a new dimension to the character.  He has a
reputation for being  a Gen-X rebel and that attitude carries over into his work
in Episode 1 and I'm sure episode 2 also.

Obi-Wan in the classic trilogy was more of a spiritual figure, a place holder for
the saga's secrets than a character so there's an aura about him that I think
shouldn't be present in Obi-Wan "the flawed teacher" in this second trilogy.

By the way, I recently got my hands on a Japanese samurai anime mini-series
called Rurouni Kenshin.   It's set at the end of the Tokugawa period, right
before the start of the Meiji era.  (The Meiji period is named after Emperor
Meiji who began Japan's period of great industrial transformation and last
roughly from 1870s through the early 1900s)  Anyways, it brought an interesting
insight to me about how Lucas may develop Episodes 2 and 3.  Being the master of
post-modern consumption that he is, he has probably seen the film also.   But a
few interesting points present in the film.

Rurouni Kenshin deals specifically with the story of a boy who loses his parents
at a young age when Japan was in turmoil as the great peace brought on by 200
years of Tokugawa Shogunate rule comes to an end.  The people who took care of
him (not his parents) are killed in a raid by maruading theives but he is saved
by a master swordsman who decides to teach the boy a special sword technique. The
story then  jumps ahead 10 or so years and the boy is now a depressed,
anti-social teenage swordsman of great skill.  There are several flashbacks from
this point on and one in particular deals with his departure from his master.

The argument begins with the young boy, Kenshin, wanting to put his skills to
use. Saying he has seem so much suffering in his life and how he was unable to
protect the people he cared about the most, he makes the case that to dedicate
his life to peace and protection of others through his sword.   His master
disagrees saying what he is doing is murder in the name of justice and that the
power he will find himself weilding in the outside world  (up to this point in
his life he is isolated in a mountain with his maste) would inevitably translate
into political power.  He refuses to listen and leaves.

To me, it serves as a very interesting and plausible relationship between Obi-Wan
and Anakin.  And several story elements also falls into place.  Anakin has
promised his mother to come back to free her.  I think her ultimate death is
certain and that will certainly have a profound impact on him.  His inability to
save her would trigger events that would force Anakin into the waiting arms of
emperor to be, Palpatine.  Perhaps Anakin, like Kenshin, decides to walk down the
path of murder in the name of justice, only in his youthful rage, he walks down
the wrong path.

Other elements in Kenshin is the political turmoil, not unlike Episode 1.  You
get the impression of a government, and era teetering on the edge of extinction,
but deperately trying to cling to power.  The interesting thing is that the anime
takes to the point of view of the other side, the enemy so to speak.  The
Tokugawa goverment's security forces are depicted as a well trained, well
equipped band of Samurai warriors, the Shinsen-gumi not unlike the Jedis.

Anyways, a few thoughts. Hehehe.

Dexter


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From: "Elmer Rico E. Mojica" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] In Memory of Sir Alec Guiness
Date: 09 Aug 2000 06:41:52 +0800 (PHT)

We will surely missed Sir Alec Guinness who will be best remembered as Obi
Wan Kenobi of the Star Wars Trilogy. But I like him best as Colonel
Nicholson in the Bridge of the River Kwai.

On Tue, 8 Aug 2000 [e-mail] wrote:

> In a message dated 08/08/2000 1:29:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> [e-mail] writes:
>
> << A screen legend passed away over the weekend.  I may have missed the
>  e-mail but I don't believe anyone in the list talked about it.
>
>  Anyways, a great actor, his talent will be sorely missed.  Obi-Wan
>  Kenobi is really in spirit form now.  :)
>
>  Dexter >>
>
> Yes, all fans of the Trilogy will definitely miss him.  Ewan McGregor doesn't
> hold a candle to Old Ben.
> -Eric-
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] In Memory of Sir Alec Guiness
Date: 08 Aug 2000 16:00:58 -0700



"Elmer Rico E. Mojica" wrote:

> We will surely missed Sir Alec Guinness who will be best remembered as Obi
> Wan Kenobi of the Star Wars Trilogy. But I like him best as Colonel
> Nicholson in the Bridge of the River Kwai.
>

Yes. I was just about to mention it myself.   While Obi-Wan is perhaps his most
memorable part, Col. Nicholson is probably his best work.

Dexter

>
> On Tue, 8 Aug 2000 [e-mail] wrote:
>
> > In a message dated 08/08/2000 1:29:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> > [e-mail] writes:
> >
> > << A screen legend passed away over the weekend.  I may have missed the
> >  e-mail but I don't believe anyone in the list talked about it.
> >
> >  Anyways, a great actor, his talent will be sorely missed.  Obi-Wan
> >  Kenobi is really in spirit form now.  :)
> >
> >  Dexter >>
> >
> > Yes, all fans of the Trilogy will definitely miss him.  Ewan McGregor doesn't
> > hold a candle to Old Ben.
> > -Eric-
> >
> > [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> > [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
> >
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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From: "Wade S" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Overused Movie Music
Date: 08 Aug 2000 18:43:34 CDT

My vote for the most overused piece of music in a movie trailer has to be
the "O Fortuna" that has been used a countless number of times in trailers
and commercials. If you can't think of what I'm talking about, it was in
Excalibur. Also, most recently in The General's Daughter (the scene where
Travolta enters James Woods' house and it's playing LOUDLY on a record
player). It's been in everything from trailers (the one I remember most was
for Glory) to coffee commercials.

It's a hauntingly beautiful piece of work from an early 20th century German
opera, but it has been used to death.

There is also a piece from Alien that is used quite a bit in trailers
nowadays.

Wade

>"(Paul D Richardson)" wrote:
> >
> > > Isn't there a pool from which directors can choose any music for movie
> > > trailors? This is done, I guess, because the music score is yet to be
> > > completed, so the likelyhood is that the same music will be heard
>backing
> > > different trailors.
> >
> > Trailers are usually put together by the marketing people, not by the
> > director.  They don't have a limited pool of music, they use whatever
>they
> > want (providing they can get the rights).  However, a lack of
>originality and
> > creative effort leads to the poor music selection.
> >
> > [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> > [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>
>--
>Kind regards,
>Chris Parry    ]



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From: ":" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Master and Apprentice (was In Memory of Sir Alec
Date: 08 Aug 2000 19:17:17 -0500

At 03:39 PM 8/8/00 -0700, Dexter Sy wrote:
>Rurouni Kenshin deals specifically with the story of a boy who loses his
parents
>at a young age when Japan was in turmoil as the great peace brought on by 200
>years of Tokugawa Shogunate rule comes to an end.  The people who took
care of
>him (not his parents) are killed in a raid by maruading theives but he is
saved
>by a master swordsman who decides to teach the boy a special sword
technique. The
>story then  jumps ahead 10 or so years and the boy is now a depressed,
>anti-social teenage swordsman of great skill.  There are several
flashbacks from
>this point on and one in particular deals with his departure from his master.

from what i can tell, lucas has made it no secret that he's taken a great
deal of the star wars storyline from a number of japanese films/stories.

i'd never heard of this film/series, but given your explanation, i agree -
it sounds as though lucas probably did base some of the basic star wars
story on it.

another film to check out - which, incidentally, i have heard lucas
specifically cite as an "inspiration" for star wars - is akira kurosawa's
"hidden fortress".  among other things, this film includes two bumbling
peasants, who wander around along with the more central characters of the
story.  i'm sure you could notice the similarities even if you weren't
looking for them, but the two peasants - both in their general manner (one
is quite whiny and acts helpless - the other, less personable one is much
more resourceful, although both of them manage to get each other in all
sorts of minor trouble) and in the way they interact with each other - are
basically C3P0 and R2D2.

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Master and Apprentice (was In Memory of Sir AlecGuiness)
Date: 08 Aug 2000 17:29:31 -0700

> from what i can tell, lucas has made it no secret that he's taken a great
> deal of the star wars storyline from a number of japanese films/stories.
>
> i'd never heard of this film/series, but given your explanation, i agree -
> it sounds as though lucas probably did base some of the basic star wars
> story on it.

Rurouni Kenshin is faily recent.  The story elements in the anime seems to
forshadow a lot of what may happen in Episodes 2 and 3, so its just a big guess on
my part.

>
>
> another film to check out - which, incidentally, i have heard lucas
> specifically cite as an "inspiration" for star wars - is akira kurosawa's
> "hidden fortress".  among other things, this film includes two bumbling
> peasants, who wander around along with the more central characters of the
> story.  i'm sure you could notice the similarities even if you weren't
> looking for them, but the two peasants - both in their general manner (one
> is quite whiny and acts helpless - the other, less personable one is much
> more resourceful, although both of them manage to get each other in all
> sorts of minor trouble) and in the way they interact with each other - are
> basically C3P0 and R2D2.

Yea.   I haven;t been able to see that film unfortunately.   I need to get it on
DVD =)


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Master and Apprentice (was In Memory of Sir Alec Guiness)
Date: 08 Aug 2000 23:22:00 EDT

In a message dated 08/08/2000 3:32:04 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< To me, it serves as a very interesting and plausible relationship between
Obi-Wan
 and Anakin.  And several story elements also falls into place.  Anakin has
 promised his mother to come back to free her.  I think her ultimate death is
 certain and that will certainly have a profound impact on him.  His
inability to
 save her would trigger events that would force Anakin into the waiting arms
of
 emperor to be, Palpatine.  Perhaps Anakin, like Kenshin, decides to walk
down the
 path of murder in the name of justice, only in his youthful rage, he walks
down
 the wrong path. >>

A good insight.  I've wondered about how the ordeal with his mother would
work out as well.  I mean, I've always been sure she'd die, but I wonder how
it'd be handled.  Whether we see this in Episode 2 or 3 is another thing I'm
wondering about.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] In Memory of Sir Alec Guiness
Date: 09 Aug 2000 13:32:45 -0700

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Yes, all fans of the Trilogy will definitely miss him.  Ewan McGregor doesn't
> hold a candle to Old Ben.

Not many could, but it's somewhat amusing how Star Wars fans hold
him so close to their hearts when he was such a vocal critic of the
series. He hated the thing, and even used to throw out Star Wars
related fanmail unopened.

No doubt a great thespian, and with the info above in mind, clearly
a man of great taste too.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au


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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Master and Apprentice (was In Memory of Sir Alec Guiness)
Date: 09 Aug 2000 00:09:22 -0700

>
> A good insight.  I've wondered about how the ordeal with his mother would
> work out as well.  I mean, I've always been sure she'd die, but I wonder how
> it'd be handled.  Whether we see this in Episode 2 or 3 is another thing I'm
> wondering about.
> -Eric-

Pernilla August is going to be in Ep2. And watching the lates "on lacation"
report on starwars.com, stunt co-ordinator nick gillard is interviewed as he is
setting up a stunt where 6 to 8 people get blown up!

Ok... i have seen this in a star wars movie yet. i bet its a bunch of poor jedis
who have a rocket locked onto them

Dexter

>
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Garrett Winters <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Perfect Storm *Spoilers*
Date: 09 Aug 2000 13:37:08 +0100

on 2/8/2000 9:20, MARK at [e-mail] wrote:

> OK, so I went to see it last night, did I enjoy it - yeah, was I
> disappointed - yeah.  It may seem like a strange analogy, but it
> reminded me of "Psycho" - HOW???? you cry - weeeeellll,  both films
> spend so long on the set-up, that when things finally start to get
> interesting, it's all over way too quickly.  Kinda F*cked up reasoning,
> maybe?  Also the incidents on the boat in the storm - there aren't that
> many, and they aren't that nail biting.  If Peterson had started killing
> them off individually, instead of all at once, then maybe it would have
> sustained tension a bit more.
>
> I did enjoy the film, I would recommend anyone going to see it, I will
> probably own it when it comes out on DVD, but for me, it just missed
> that "something", an undefinable quality that would have made it a great
> film instead of just a very good film.


I know what you mean, but you must remember that is was meant to be a
semifactual retelling of a true story. when the end came it felt like a
stone in my stomach, especially after the lighthearted exit by marky mark
and clooney. it was like "ok let's go" and you expect a big hollywood rescue
finale but no such thing happens in real life unfortunately. seeing the boat
sink was heartbreaking and showing mark just floating in those towering seas
was scary.
it was a good movie IMO but also a very sad story.
Garrett


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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Master and Apprentice (was In Memory of Sir Alec Guiness)
Date: 09 Aug 2000 09:50:54 EDT

In a message dated 08/09/2000 12:07:29 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< Pernilla August is going to be in Ep2. And watching the lates "on location"
 report on starwars.com, stunt coordinator nick gillard is interviewed as he
is
 setting up a stunt where 6 to 8 people get blown up!

 Ok... i have seen this in a star wars movie yet. i bet its a bunch of poor
jedis
 who have a rocket locked onto them

 Dexter >>

People being blown up, eh?  Nah, more satisfying to see someone crash into a
tree on a speeder bike or be eaten by the Sarlac.  Don't get me wrong, I'm
eagerly awaiting Episode 2.  I was just rather disappointed by Episode 1.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Monkey-Donkey rides
Date: 09 Aug 2000 15:19:01 +0100


    two new superheroes are in town, 2 guys of resplendent magnitude
that filmdom can only be a short way off, check them out at

    http://monkeydonkey.itgo.com

    MARK

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Perfect Storm *Spoilers*
Date: 09 Aug 2000 10:06:48 EDT

In a message dated 08/09/2000 5:42:59 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< It was a good movie IMO but also a very sad story.
 Garrett >>

Especially for those that don't know the story before they see the movie.
Apparently, it made big headlines in the news, but I was about 8 at the time,
so I didn't know.  And yes, I expected the "big Hollywood rescue."  Of Mark,
not Clooney.  Once he said, "Let's get out of here," I knew he wasn't leaving
that ship.  Looking around at the end, I saw many people sobbing their way
out of the theater.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Perfect Storm *Spoilers*
Date: 09 Aug 2000 10:06:48 EDT

In a message dated 08/09/2000 5:42:59 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< It was a good movie IMO but also a very sad story.
 Garrett >>

Especially for those that don't know the story before they see the movie.
Apparently, it made big headlines in the news, but I was about 8 at the time,
so I didn't know.  And yes, I expected the "big Hollywood rescue."  Of Mark,
not Clooney.  Once he said, "Let's get out of here," I knew he wasn't leaving
that ship.  Looking around at the end, I saw many people sobbing their way
out of the theater.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Re: In Memory of Sir Alec Guines
Date: 09 Aug 2000 10:59:00 -0600

> Not many could, but it's somewhat amusing how Star Wars fans hold
> him so close to their hearts when he was such a vocal critic of the
> series. He hated the thing, and even used to throw out Star Wars
> related fanmail unopened.

Guiness wasn't as mad at the series itself as he was the fans, who would
accost him with questions about the films, ask to see his lightsaber, that
sort of thing (see the William Shatner "Get a life!" skit on SNL for an idea
of the kind of questions he would get).  He saw the films as a fluff job to
pay the bills, and was unprepared for the reaction it got.

From what I've read, Guiness was a quiet man who liked to keep to himself.  He
was an actor, not a star.  He answered fan mail personally, and was always
quick to sign an autograph for a fan.  After STAR WARS the amount of fan mail
that came got out of control.

I'm sure it also angered him that after 40 years of film work before STAR
WARS, including an Academy Award, everything was forgotten and focused on this
one role.  Heck, even in this group most of the discussion has been about his
STAR WARS role, which is just a small part on a long distinguished career.

If I had to recommend one Alec Guiness film, it would be THE LAVENDAR HILL
MOB.  Perhaps not his greatest acting role, but a lot of fun and an enjoyable
film all-around.

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Re: Sir Alec Guinness
Date: 09 Aug 2000 10:50:41 -0700

I think that Guinness' most amazing performance was in KIND HEARTS &
CORONETS where he plays EIGHT (yes, eight!) major characters.   If you
haven't seen this movie, it's well worth renting.


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From: [e-mail]
Subject: [MV] Blue Man Group OT
Date: 09 Aug 2000 14:01:09 -0500

**********Off Topic**************
Has anyone seen The Blue Man Group and would they recommend it? Or is it way
out there?
My apologies for the off topic.

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Source - Richard" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] Monkey-Donkey rides
Date: 10 Aug 2000 09:22:05 +0100

Wow, this is great - who are these guys? Are they really making a movie?

MARK wrote:
>
>    two new superheroes are in town, 2 guys of resplendent magnitude
>that filmdom can only be a short way off, check them out at
>
>    http://monkeydonkey.itgo.com
>
>    MARK
>
>[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>
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From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] Monkey-Donkey rides
Date: 10 Aug 2000 09:51:48 +0100

These guys are the funkdoobiest characters of all time - real mammoth
smackers

> -----Original Message-----
> From:    Source - Richard [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> Sent:    10 August 2000 09:22
> To:    movies
> Subject:    RE: [MV] Monkey-Donkey rides
>
> Wow, this is great - who are these guys? Are they really making a
> movie?
>
> MARK wrote:
> >
> >    two new superheroes are in town, 2 guys of resplendent magnitude
> >that filmdom can only be a short way off, check them out at
> >
> >    http://monkeydonkey.itgo.com
> >
> >    MARK
> >
> >[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> >[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
> >
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Blue Man Group OT
Date: 10 Aug 2000 09:44:55 EDT

In a message dated 08/09/2000 11:43:19 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< **********Off Topic**************
 Has anyone seen The Blue Man Group and would they recommend it? Or is it way
 out there?
 My apologies for the off topic. >>

Blue Man Group is one of the most entertaining shows I've seen.  Very cool
and VERY funny.  One of the most highly recommended shows ever.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Blue Man Group OT
Date: 10 Aug 2000 06:58:49 -0700

on 8/9/2000 12:01 PM, [e-mail] at
[e-mail] wrote:

> Has anyone seen The Blue Man Group and would they recommend it? Or is it way
> out there?
> My apologies for the off topic.

I saw them in New York last year and thought they were great.
Very creative; lots of fun.
However, do not sit in the first few rows; things can get messy!


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Keith H. Poole" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Blue Man Group OT
Date: 10 Aug 2000 07:01:25 -0700 (PDT)

When I first moved to Chicago, one of my first activities was to see
Blue Man Group.  My fiancee and I were totally amazed and impressed!!
(there are also shows in Boston and Las Vegas)

It was by far the most original and funniest live performance I have
ever seen.  I would go again in an instant (and I am, next month)!

Go early, and check out the lobby displays.  You will not be
disappointed with the show - relax and have fun.  It is generally an
all ages show, but I would recommend 18 and over.  See if you can get
seats in the "poncho rows" at the front!

Keith

--- [e-mail] wrote:
> **********Off Topic**************
> Has anyone seen The Blue Man Group and would they recommend it?

=====
Please visit http://www.moviekites.com
Stage Two of the movie review database is now complete!

To recommend MovieKites, click here:
http://www.recommend-it.com/l.z.e?s=576234

[e-mail]

__________________________________________________
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Nathan Lemrick <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Titus
Date: 10 Aug 2000 09:42:14 -0700 (PDT)

I was wondering if anyone has seen the film Titus?  I am trying to decide if I want to buy it on DVD but I have not seen it.  In my town this film did not play for a long time.  I like Anthony Hopkins and most Shakespeare that is brought to the big screen.  I have read the play and it would seem to make a good film.  But right now I just wanted to get some opinions about the film.

Nathan

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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Shakespeare
Date: 10 Aug 2000 12:50:17 EDT

In a message dated 08/10/2000 9:47:08 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< I was wondering if anyone has seen the film Titus?  I am trying to decide
if I want to buy it on DVD but I have not seen it.  In my town this film did
not play for a long time.  I like Anthony Hopkins and most Shakespeare that
is brought to the big screen.  I have read the play and it would seem to make
a good film.  But right now I just wanted to get some opinions about the film.

 Nathan  >>

Most Shakespeare that comes to the screen?  That doesn't include DiCaprio's
Romeo + Juliet, does it?  Ugh, I couldn't stand that movie.  Anyone else
agree?  Disagree?
-Eric-

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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Shakespeare
Date: 10 Aug 2000 13:20:42 -0700

Last I heard, Titus was given a scathing review by a critic. I think it was
Ebert.  Maybe you could search the internet databases for reviews from various
sources before deciding on purchasing Titus on DVD

Dexter

[e-mail] wrote:

> In a message dated 08/10/2000 9:47:08 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> [e-mail] writes:
>
> << I was wondering if anyone has seen the film Titus?  I am trying to decide
> if I want to buy it on DVD but I have not seen it.  In my town this film did
> not play for a long time.  I like Anthony Hopkins and most Shakespeare that
> is brought to the big screen.  I have read the play and it would seem to make
> a good film.  But right now I just wanted to get some opinions about the film.
>
>  Nathan  >>
>
> Most Shakespeare that comes to the screen?  That doesn't include DiCaprio's
> Romeo + Juliet, does it?  Ugh, I couldn't stand that movie.  Anyone else
> agree?  Disagree?
> -Eric-
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
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--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Shakespeare
Date: 10 Aug 2000 13:30:22 -0700

>
>
> Most Shakespeare that comes to the screen?  That doesn't include DiCaprio's
> Romeo + Juliet, does it?  Ugh, I couldn't stand that movie.  Anyone else
> agree?  Disagree?
> -Eric-

I'm a sucker for teeny type love stories. :-P And Baz Luhrman's take on Romeo and
Juliet is quite interesting. The movie I can't stand is West Side Story, with its
dancing and whatever.  Apologies if I insult anyone here, but I'm speaking from
strickly a narrow (like/don't like) point of view.  THe worse part was that I had
to sit through a showing of West Side Story in Junior High a few years ago, it was
insufferable.

Dexter



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From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Titus
Date: 11 Aug 2000 15:57:37 -0700

Well I saw Titus yesterday and have to say it's a little surreal and
very good. It's kind of a mix of Greenaway, Luhrmann and Brannagh.
The director is a theatre legend, and so there's a heavier than
normal emphasis on performance and choreographed movement, but the
real thing that had me loving the film was Sir Anthony Hopkins
giving perhaps his finest performance ever. He's just on fire in
this film. I enjoyed the flick a lot, but it was more out of
appreciation for that performance and the original way it's put
together than anything else, and most filmgoers won't appreciate it,
I'm sure.
It's probably best summed up as Gladiator for the educated.

OZ

Nathan Lemrick wrote:
>
> I was wondering if anyone has seen the film Titus?  I am trying to decide if I want to buy it on DVD but I have not seen it.  In my town this film did not play for a long time.  I like Anthony Hopkins and most Shakespeare that is brought to the big screen.  I have read the play and it would seem to make a good film.  But right now I just wanted to get some opinions about the film.
>
> Nathan
>
> ___________________________________________________
> GO Network Mail
> Get Your Free, Private E-mail at http://mail.go.com
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
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--
Kind regards,
Chris Parry

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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Titus
Date: 10 Aug 2000 23:05:22 -0700

>
> I'm sure.
> It's probably best summed up as Gladiator for the educated.
>
> OZ

Ouch.  I really resent the modernist notion of high-art and low-art.  Instead of saying "Gladiator for the educated", its better to say "Gladiator for those who appreciate Shakespeare and theatre".

I generally just ignore reviewers and people who use education,  intellect or whatever kind of intellectual barrier, as a way to degrade some movies while elevating others. A Movie packed full of allusions and intellectual insight doesn't guarantee truth and quality, and sometimes, the most basic stories are the ones that lasts.

Dexter



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From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Titus
Date: 11 Aug 2000 17:13:58 -0700

Dexter Sy wrote:
>
> Ouch.  I really resent the modernist notion of high-art and low-art.
> Instead of saying "Gladiator for the educated", its better to say "Gladiator
> for those who appreciate Shakespeare and theatre".

No, I dispute that. Titus is a movie that relies on the viewer to
look into, rather than just at, the story. Gladiator is a film that
requires nothing more than looking at what has been computer created
on the screen. Don't get me wrong, I loved Glads, got right into it,
but I knew all along it was pap. And for the record, before watching
this film I had no knowledge of the original Shakespeare it was
adapted from, nor do I assume anything on the stage is art. I just
happen to think what's good about the stage was added here to what's
been good about previous Shakespearian filmmakers and the end result
was a thinker, not a stinker.

> I generally just ignore reviewers and people who use education,  intellect or
> whatever kind of intellectual barrier, as a way to degrade some movies while
> elevating others. A Movie packed full of allusions and intellectual insight
> doesn't guarantee truth and quality, and sometimes, the most basic stories
> are the ones that lasts.

And then there's Big Momma's House. So...

OZ

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http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Titus
Date: 11 Aug 2000 00:35:33 -0700

>
> No, I dispute that. Titus is a movie that relies on the viewer to
> look into, rather than just at, the story. Gladiator is a film that
> requires nothing more than looking at what has been computer created
> on the screen.

But of course.  You're implying that Gladiator's visuals had a lot to do with its
success. For the record, the computer generated scenes of Rome was luckluster at
best. There are shots that stank amateur.  The real brilliance of the movie is how
the artists turned a scale model fragment of the Coliseum into the real thing
without attracting attention to it.  Most people wouldn't even realize much of the
top tear of the Coliseum in the shot was totally CG.

In anycase, most of the film don't rely on computers to put on  a visual feast.  In
fact, Titus is the more visually stunning of the two.  It is assumptions like this
that peeves me.

> Don't get me wrong, I loved Glads, got right into it,
> but I knew all along it was pap. And for the record, before watching
> this film I had no knowledge of the original Shakespeare it was
> adapted from, nor do I assume anything on the stage is art. I just
> happen to think what's good about the stage was added here to what's
> been good about previous Shakespearian filmmakers and the end result
> was a thinker, not a stinker.

I'm fine with that.  But that's not what I took issue with.  We all know what you
meant when you said Titus was "Gladiator for the Educated".  And that just doesn't
sit right with me.  Intellectuals insult me.

>
> And then there's Big Momma's House. So...

That's a good movie actually, but it had nothing to do with the discussion.

DEx


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Titus Reviews
Date: 11 Aug 2000 00:58:59 -0700

I forgot who posted the question but here are some reviews of Titus (1999)
coutesy of Yahoo.

The page is a compilation of web reviews from various sources and cut through a wide
spectrum, from news papers, on-line E-zines, to web sites of popular TV shows like E!.

http://movies.yahoo.com/shop?d=hv&id=1800352711&cf=critic



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Titus
Date: 11 Aug 2000 08:10:36 -0700

I have not seen TITUS, but here's a review from "Screen It" ......


"TITUS" (1999) (Anthony Hopkins, Jessica Lange) (R)
Drama: A Roman general (Hopkins) and the mother (Lange) of a man he
earlier ceremoniously sacrificed, now the Emperor's wife, enact
revenge upon one another and those around them in this time-bending
adaptation of William Shakespeare's play.  One of the Bard's lesser
known, earlier works, this film features solid performance from a
great cast, an involving story of treachery, violence and lust, and a
highly imaginative and elaborately visualized style of presenting the
story.  Unfortunately, those latter efforts by first-time director
Julie Taymor (the Tony award winning director of Broadway's "The Lion
King") involve mixing elements from various time periods (such as
video games and 1920s era automobiles) that end up distracting the
viewer far more than enhancing the proceedings.  The results, while
interesting, prevent the film from being as good as it could have
been.  The R rating comes from lethal and bloody violence, an orgy
scene depicting nudity and sexual behavior, and some nonsexual nudity.
The film had a domestic gross of nearly $2 million.


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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 11 Aug 2000 11:17:57 EDT

In a message dated 08/11/2000 12:27:27 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< I'm fine with that.  But that's not what I took issue with.  We all know
what you
 meant when you said Titus was "Gladiator for the Educated".  And that just
doesn't
 sit right with me.  Intellectuals insult me. >>

Looking over this discussion, I have to say that I agree with Dex.  Movies
should be entertaining above all else.  Don't get me wrong.  I am not saying
that I detest movies that make you think, but I don't automatically assume
they're, for some reason, better than those that don't involve as much
thought.  Everyone's taste is different, of course, and I won't down anyone
that likes something I don't.  As I said before, there is no such thing as a
movie so good everyone likes it, or a movie so bad everyone hates it.
However, don't down a movie based on intelligence, and certainly do not down
a person's intelligence for liking something.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Drowning Mona
Date: 12 Aug 2000 07:27:13 -0700

Last night I watched the dark comedy "Drowning Mona," which was just
released on video.  While not great, it has some very funny moments.  If
you're in the mood for some fairly tasteless, sicko humor, I recommend it.


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 13 Aug 2000 00:41:17 -0700

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Looking over this discussion, I have to say that I agree with Dex.  Movies
> should be entertaining above all else.  Don't get me wrong.  I am not saying
> that I detest movies that make you think, but I don't automatically assume
> they're, for some reason, better than those that don't involve as much
> thought.

Again, I have to register my opposition to this. I guess it depends
on how you see cinema itself. I see it as a mix of several art
forms, blended together to provoke thought, take the viewer
somewhere they will never go, tell a story, get the blood pumping,
get the brain working, register a point of view, change the world...
and yes, entertain. But it seems to me that many people see cinema
as really big TV. They expect nothing but a few quick shocks,
giggles and explosions, then they toddle off home and promptly
forget about it.

Big Momma's House is a case in point. It is, quite simply, crap.
It's a ghetto Mrs Doubtfire. It's unoriginal, unfunny, and never
tries to do anything other than package a big name star into a
situation comedy. It's TV. And then people say "it's quite good
actually", while other fantastic films go virtually unseen because
they don't feature someone who says "biatch".

That's what offends me.

I don't dislike tame comedies. I really enjoyed Shanghai Noon
recently, because it did something different. It was genuinely
funny. And I've hated a lot of wanky arty farty crap (like The
Velocity Of Gary - my God, if you ever want to see art gone wrong,
go rent that pile of cruddola), but I believe that whatever you're
into, you should have high expectations, especially when we pay so
much to see films. To me, an "it was alright" is a fail. If a
filmmaker can't make something original, or rework an original idea
so it's better, then they shouldn't make the damn film in the first
place.

> However, don't down a movie based on intelligence, and certainly do not down
> a person's intelligence for liking something.

Sorry man, I don't know where this rule is written, so I'm going to
have to ignore it. If someone tells me they liked Pokemon I shall
assess that this person is either retarded or younger than 13. If
someone tells me they liked The Skulls, I shall assume they have
regular psychotherapy. If someone tells me they can't wait for The
Klumps to open in their area, or cried during Armageddon, I'll shake
my head and leave the room.

And if that makes me an intellectual wanker, then I'll gladly wear
the "intellectual wanker" t-shirt.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 12 Aug 2000 13:58:27 EDT

In a message dated 08/12/2000 7:31:07 AM Pacific Daylight Time,=20
[e-mail] writes:

<< Sorry man, I don't know where this rule is written, so I'm going to
 have to ignore it. If someone tells me they liked Pokemon I shall
 assess that this person is either retarded or younger than 13. >>

    Well, let's look at my point of view.  I like Pok=E9mon, yet I'm 17, hav=
e=20
been on the honor role all my years of high school, am in most of the higher=
=20
(AP) classes, and have been one of the higher rankers on my school math team=
.=20
 If this qualifies as being retarded, then I guess Stephen Hawking would be=20=
a=20
relatively smart individual to you.  I really resent this sort of=20
eccentricity of saying, "I scoff at the lower class movies."  Almost sounds=20
like you'd imply that you're better than some people because you're too good=
=20
for some occasional mindless fun.
    As I said, movies are meant to be entertaining.  Not to say that I hate=20
thought provoking or more clever movies.  For the most part, it's the=20
contrary.  I like movies like Saving Private Ryan, The Truman Show, and A=20
Fish Called Wanda.  However, that doesn't mean I can't enjoy something like=20
There's Something About Mary, American Pie, or Dumb and Dumber.  They may no=
t=20
be very sophisticated, but hey, they sure are fun, especially when watching=20
them with a group.
    Are there movies I hate?  Absolutely!!!  Don't Tell Mom the Babysitter's=
=20
Dead, House Arrest, Baby's Day Out, and Rock-A-Doodle are some of the worst=20
movies I've ever seen.  But, as I said, everyone has a different taste in=20
movies.  If someone likes a movie that I find to be one of the most God awfu=
l=20
creations in the history of mankind, I'm not going to insult his or her=20
intelligence, but rather say that I hate the movie and be done with it. =20
That's just my opinion on this, but I think there are many who would agree=20
with me.
-Eric-

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From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 12 Aug 2000 14:33:06 -0400

At 12.41 AM 13/08/2000 -0700, Chris Parry wrote:
>But it seems to me that many people see cinema
>as really big TV. They expect nothing but a few quick shocks,
>giggles and explosions, then they toddle off home and promptly
>forget about it.

I think you are being too hard on TV.  For all the "vast wasteland"-ness,
there are actually some good programmes on telly, that will challenge you
and make you think.  And there are many, many movies that make the most
unbearable pap on the idiot box look like PBS.

Dealing with the American Public on a daily basis (and, of course, since I
have this uncontrollable urge to look upon ALL Americans with contempt:-),
I experience people making entertainment choices with all the thought of
Pauly Shore picking out commercial endorsements.

Personally, I think the Academy, for the first time in years, made the
proper choice this year with their pick of American Beauty.  And I am
convinced that the sheep that come in bleeting about how they didn't like
it, either a) didn't understand it, or b) saw themselves in the movie.  And
it causes me intense physical pain not to be able to tell them that.

Then there are the people that won't watch The Green Mile because "it's too
long".  Well, I'm sorry, but as much as you want to slap someone for
thinking that there is any correlation betwix length and quality, I think
that if someone truly wanted their money's worth, they would go looking for
the longer movies, specifically.

Having said that, I have been plesantly surprised by the people that come
in actually looking for Magnolia.


>If someone tells me they can't wait for The
>Klumps to open in their area, or cried during Armageddon, I'll shake
>my head and leave the room.

Hey, I'll have you know that I cried during Armageddon.  Albeit they were
tears of pain, at watching such horrid acting.

>
>And if that makes me an intellectual wanker, then I'll gladly wear
>the "intellectual wanker" t-shirt.
>

Actually, wouldn't mind having one of those myself.  Perhaps there is a
market for those.  Not that it is anywhere near the size of the "Devoid of
any cultural quality" market, which is just about every t-shirt currently
on display.

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty     http://www.webz.com/gowanna
mailto:[e-mail]                  mailto:[e-mail]

419 Butler Street
PO Box 95184
Pittsburgh, PA 15223-0184
[phone]                                    [phone]
1-888-45-GOWANNA -- TOLL FREE     (1-888-454-6926)
____________________________________________
"Wow! So that is what all that extra space on the movie screen is
 for!" reaction to  "Gladiator"
______________________________________________


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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 12 Aug 2000 15:01:19 -0700

> Again, I have to register my opposition to this. I guess it depends
> on how you see cinema itself. I see it as a mix of several art
> forms, blended together to provoke thought, take the viewer
> somewhere they will never go, tell a story, get the blood pumping,
> get the brain working, register a point of view, change the world...
> and yes, entertain. But it seems to me that many people see cinema
> as really big TV. They expect nothing but a few quick shocks,
> giggles and explosions, then they toddle off home and promptly
> forget about it.

Cinema definately has elements of formulaic productions.  This is not strickly our
problem. Early cinema was based solely on thrills, a period those who study cinema
like to play down as "experimental" and a cinema based more on "novelty".  Which
is true, but I think the fact that early cinema chose thrills like the great train
robbery, or realities (documentaries) like PathΘ's short reels on The train
arriving at the station, Workers leaving Work, etc.   and slapstick humor spoke
volumes about the true appeal of films.  Films in the early days were not
considered "art" mind you.  Women's Temperance movements (our version of the
Chirstian Right) opposed the movies as an evil form of entertainment with the
notion of strangers sitting together in a darkened theatre provoked thoughts of
improprieties that scared these women senseless.  But what is often attacked is
the material on screen.   Women exposing themselves by wearing short skirts
(promtly censored by local authorities at the time) among other things all played
into the fear and rejection of movies as an acceptable medium for entertainment.

Where I'm gettign at here is that movies that tittilates our most basic senses
have been and will always be with us.  What's wrong with big explosions?  I loved
Die Hard, and I thought Armageddon raised the level of watching our civilization
disintigrated to a whole new level.

Yes, films are about the convergence of all these art forms into one as a kind of
super medium that reaches us in its visuals, theatre, aural and narritive, but I
really have to disagree with your taking of films as having the weight of
responsiblity you put on it.  As a medium, I think there ought to be films that
makes us think, but that doesn't exclude films from being just forms of
entertainment.

>

> Big Momma's House is a case in point. It is, quite simply, crap.
> It's a ghetto Mrs Doubtfire. It's unoriginal, unfunny, and never
> tries to do anything other than package a big name star into a
> situation comedy. It's TV. And then people say "it's quite good
> actually", while other fantastic films go virtually unseen because
> they don't feature someone who says "biatch".

Martin Laurence isn't a big star.  The real upset this year is how his movie
outperformed the Jim Carrey's comedy.

If that offends you, if black comedy offends you then its your problem, not mine.

>
>
> That's what offends me.
>
> I don't dislike tame comedies. I really enjoyed Shanghai Noon
> recently, because it did something different. It was genuinely
> funny.

I thought the laughs in Shanghai noon was tamed.  It was funny more on a slapstick
level. Its more physical comedy than anything.   I was laughed more while watching
Big Momma's house than I did Shanghai Noon and the former is the better comedy.

> And I've hated a lot of wanky arty farty crap (like The
> Velocity Of Gary - my God, if you ever want to see art gone wrong,
> go rent that pile of cruddola), but I believe that whatever you're
> into, you should have high expectations, especially when we pay so
> much to see films. To me, an "it was alright" is a fail. If a
> filmmaker can't make something original, or rework an original idea
> so it's better, then they shouldn't make the damn film in the first
> place.

That's an awfully high expectation.  This is where I think we part.  To me, films
have to entertain above all else because people go to see movies as an escape.
And if the movie happens to provoke more than just entertainment, then its a real
credit to the men and women behind it.   And what entertains people varies.  I
can't stand westerns, I think they are stupid.  I can't stand the Older men finds
younger women chick-flicks out in the market.  That is my personal bias, but I am
sure there are people out there who will defend these genres for what it is worth
to them, and I respect that. And so should you.



> Sorry man, I don't know where this rule is written, so I'm going to
> have to ignore it. If someone tells me they liked Pokemon I shall
> assess that this person is either retarded or younger than 13. If
> someone tells me they liked The Skulls, I shall assume they have
> regular psychotherapy. If someone tells me they can't wait for The
> Klumps to open in their area, or cried during Armageddon, I'll shake
> my head and leave the room.

If someone tells me that they look down on people based on the movies they watch,
then I shall walk out of this room in a mad rage.   I have a real moral objection
to the recent movie Gone in 60 Seconds, a film that is basically teaching people
how to steal cars with a second rate story filled in between.  I don't find the
premise particularly interesting, but people do get off on that. Good for them.  I
think respect for people's tastes is what we should practice, instead of snobbery
through proving that what you like is superior to others. And I'll admit it, I'm
not a saint. I've been a snob before and probably will continue to be one when I'm
not paying attention to myself, but I do realize what I'm doing is wrong.

What insults me above all else are people, intellectuals, who walk around with
this utter desdain for popular entertainment.   Frank McCourt, author of Angela's
Ashes, was on Canadian TV recently talking about his book. The host was asking him
about the popularity of his work and he brought up, voluntarily, the fact that
there is some suggestion in some circles that Angela's Ashes is beggining to
become "popular" and it cannot be considered literature any more.
And he added that he didn't care what people thought, that his book should be read
by as many people as possible.

What crossed my mind was the entire issue of the intellectual world versus the
popular mainstream world.  These are rather broad notions, but things that are
popular and successful with the public are often dismissed, downplayed, and
trashed by the intellectual community.  When I was younger, I used to think there
was some truth to this, that these people who seem to have the final say on what
is art and what is not have special insight into these matters.  But in recent
years, it has become painfully clear that many of their so-called decisions are
made on nothing more than a bias agaisnt popular culture, as Frank McCourt clearly
stated.

Sometimes, I see why the Bolshevik revolutionaries disliked intellectuals. They
are the enemy of the people indeed.



--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Danielle Conkle" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 13 Aug 2000 03:47:55 GMT


>     Are there movies I hate?  Absolutely!!!  Don't Tell Mom the
>Babysitter's
>Dead, House Arrest,


----Don't tell Mom the Babysitter's Dead, is a classic, what are you talking
about?  (*laughing*)

I'll have to agree with (Eric, i think?) though, everyone should be open to
enjoy what they like.  I mean, taste isn't a one-minded thing, we all get
different things out of different movies.  Be it the mood we are in, the
life we have had, or what not.  To say, "this movie is bad, and that's
that," doesn't really make sense or not.  Who made you God, and the all in
all of what defines "good/bad"?  Opinion is exactly that.  If you want to
voice it, definitly--do it!  But to say you're wrong, I'm right, no argument
here....

This isn't a yes/no issue.  It's a PERSONAL opinion.  Not a fact.

-Danielle

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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 12 Aug 2000 23:53:56 EDT

In a message dated 08/12/2000 8:48:43 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< ----Don't tell Mom the Babysitter's Dead, is a classic, what are you
talking
 about?  (*laughing*) >>

Just didn't do it for me.  For teen movies, Ferris Bueller's Day Off and
American Pie are the ones I go for.  I will admit, though, I should probably
see it again since the first time I saw it, I was about 10 and expecting
another Home Alone.  Who knows?  Maybe I'd like it now.
-Eric-

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From: "Danielle Conkle" <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 13 Aug 2000 04:36:03 GMT


><< ----Don't tell Mom the Babysitter's Dead, is a classic, what are you
>talking
>  about?  (*laughing*) >>
>
>Just didn't do it for me.  For teen movies, Ferris Bueller's Day Off and
>American Pie are the ones I go for.  I will admit, though, I should
>probably
>see it again since the first time I saw it, I was about 10 and expecting
>another Home Alone.  Who knows?  Maybe I'd like it now.
>-Eric-


Nah, it's probably terrible!  There are just some movies that get you at
that [target] age, you end up seeing them so many times, you love to poke
fun at them, and enjoy them at the same time.  I say it now, my fave
"growing up" movie is The Goonies, and I still love watching it.  Just kind
of reminds you--or at least--reminds me of times I had when I was younger.
(But I'm not that old as is, so you know....)

Speaking of movies you grew up with, what are some other people's picks?
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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 12 Aug 2000 23:23:37 -0700

Movies I grew up with


Goonies
Terminator 2
Back To The Future Trilogy
Home Alone
Star Wars Trilogy (video and tv)
King Kong (TV run)
Jaws (TV run)

and tons of serials and sci -fi movies with cheesy special effects from the 50s
and 60s as well as various, horror, drama, and comedy that I can't rememeber.


--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 13 Aug 2000 21:30:13 -0700

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> Well, let's look at my point of view.  I like PokΘmon, yet I'm 17, have
> been on the honor role all my years of high school, am in most of the higher
> (AP) classes, and have been one of the higher rankers on my school math team.
> If this qualifies as being retarded, then I guess Stephen Hawking would be a
> relatively smart individual to you.

Yeah man, you're a regular Stephen Hawking. But for the record, it's
"honor roll".
"Check out the big brain on Brad!"

> I really resent this sort of
> eccentricity of saying, "I scoff at the lower class movies."  Almost sounds
> like you'd imply that you're better than some people because you're too good
> for some occasional mindless fun.

Dude, you know what? Firstly, I admitted I enjoy mindless fun - if
it doesn't treat me like an idiot. I fail to see why, when a film
has $200m spent on it like MI:2 did, nobody bothers to actually put
together an original, well conceived storyline. Is it so hard? If
you can get Tom Cruise to do somersaults on motorbikes, surely you
can get an actual plotline. X-Men was great mindless fun, great
effects, great action... and a great story. Gladiator ditto. Matrix
ditto. Why were they such huge successes? Because when a big movie
actually bothers putting out a good story, people are so damn
surprised they see it as a second coming of Christ. Unfortunately,
the number of gormless folls who flock into a movie on opening
weekend, despite negative reviews, despite absence of story, despite
trailers that give away the ending, is just too damn large. The
idiots outnumber the thinkers. This is why great flicks like High
Fidelity aren't given a big release. It's why Go never got on more
than 500 screens. It's why Affliction never even got a release in
Australia. It's why Trainspotting only did $25m in domestic gross.
When a witless Martin Lawrence movie can pull in over $100m and
American Psycho barely scrapes $12m, something is wrong in
SmartTown.

Secondly, yes, I am better than some people. I'm better than the
people who went to see Wild Wild West even though EVERY SINGLE
SOLITARY review was overwhelmingly negative. I'm better than them
because, by going to see that movie they propigate the formula that
created it and more awful films like it are made, while film critics
(who are only there to warn you when something is crap, they are
your guardians) become less and less influential.

Let's take The Mummy as another example. A complete pile of tosh,
most people I know who went to see it said they did so because
nothing else was on. They knew it was going to stink but went
anyway. The result? The Mummy makes a fortune, and now there's not
one, but TWO sequels underway right now.

Yes, I'm better than the people who waited until the dubbed version
of Life Is Beautiful came out before they went to see it, because
they hate subtitles. I'm better than the people who watch Freddie
Prinze Jr movies. I'm better than our seventeen year old Pokemon
loving "honour role" student. I'm better than the people who go to
see movies based on trailers and not reviews. I'm better than the
people who eat loud snack food during an important part of the film,
and I'm also better than the people who have never heard the phrase
"babysitter". I'm better than the people who piled into Double
Jeopardy and came out saying it was really original, when it
contained more cliches than any other movie in history. I'm better
than the people who didn't see Boys Don't Cry because it was about
"homo stuff". I'm better than the 5% of people who actually laughed
at The Waterboy and the 95% of people who didn't laugh yet never
demanded their money back, or even worse, went to see Sandler's next
film anyway. I'm better than the geeks who cry during a Kevin
Costner romance. I'm better than the people who always pay $7 a
night to rent a new release video rental when there's shelves of
videos you can get for $1 a week that are every bit as good, but
might not star John Travolta.

Am I the best? No way. Just better than most.

It's simple enough. Cinema patrons, in the majority, are idiots. I
know it, the studios seem to know it, the marketing people know it,
the cinema owners know it, the only people blissfully unaware that
they are fed utter drivel on a weekly basis and are paying through
the nose for the privilege are the idiots themselves.

Am I wrong? Ask Jar Jar Binks, soon to return to a theatre near you
even though you all hated him last time around... You hate him, you
despise him, but you'll all line up to watch anyway.

By all means, enjoy awful, unoriginal, marketing driven, celeb
heavy, studio films. Enjoy them blissfully.  But don't complain next
time a really good film doesn't actually make it to your area. It's
your fault.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 13 Aug 2000 21:47:50 -0700

Dexter Sy wrote:
>
> I thought Armageddon raised the level of watching our civilization
> disintigrated to a whole new level.

Great. Slap it in an Imax theatre and save the rest of us the
embarassment of that awful 'story' filler.

> Martin Laurence isn't a big star.  The real upset this year is how his movie
> outperformed the Jim Carrey's comedy.

Let me fill you in... Jim Carrey talking out of his ass is
considered funny by the morons. Jim Carrey telling a story that
makes people think isn't. So what does MArtin Lawrence do with BMH?
Fat jokes. Fart jokes. The result? Big box office.

Yeah, the people are geniuses.

> If that offends you, if black comedy offends you then its your problem, not mine.

No problem with black comedy at all. Big problem with garbage.

> I thought the laughs in Shanghai noon was tamed.  It was funny more on a slapstick
> level. Its more physical comedy than anything.   I was laughed more while watching
> Big Momma's house than I did Shanghai Noon and the former is the better comedy.

Dude, give me one joke from Big Momma's House that was what you'd
call "better comedy". Perhaps the Shakespearian line "is that
another flashlight?" Perhaps Lawrence being stuck in the shower
while a fat woman does a noisy poop? Maybe Paul Giamatti being
kicked in the nuts? Rushmore is comedy. Bottle Rocket was genius
comedy. Owen Wilson wrote both, and contributed comedy to Shanghai
Noon on screen and off. If you're seriously saying a noisy fart
beats Owen Wilson, I think my point is proved.

> > To me, an "it was alright" is a fail. If a
> > filmmaker can't make something original, or rework an original idea
> > so it's better, then they shouldn't make the damn film in the first
> > place.
>
> That's an awfully high expectation.  This is where I think we part.  To me, films
> have to entertain above all else because people go to see movies as an escape.
> And if the movie happens to provoke more than just entertainment, then its a real
> credit to the men and women behind it.

I guess we do part here, because I believe that even escapist
entertainment should have a script behind it, or not be made until a
script is ready. The script is the story, man. It's why you're
there. It's essential, yet it's being phased out and replaced with
ooh aah effects. "The story was dumb, but it took wiping out
civilisation to a whole new level"... to me, that's a fail. It's an
Imax movie. "Come look a the pretty colours..."

> And what entertains people varies.  I
> can't stand westerns, I think they are stupid.  I can't stand the Older men finds
> younger women chick-flicks out in the market.  That is my personal bias, but I am
> sure there are people out there who will defend these genres for what it is worth
> to them, and I respect that. And so should you.

Can't. Won't. What other people like is of no interest to me. People
like to watch Lacrosse, do I care? No, but I would if suddenly I
couldn't get a baseball game on TV for all the damn lacrosse that
was on. And when I tell friends to go see something awesome but
small as Ghost Dog and they can't because all the local screens are
showing Pokemon or Double Jeopardy or The Mummy, I think it's
criminal.

> If someone tells me that they look down on people based on the movies they watch,
> then I shall walk out of this room in a mad rage.

Don't let the door hit ya...

> What insults me above all else are people, intellectuals, who walk around with
> this utter desdain for popular entertainment.

Why do you assume that people who want more than Brendan Fraser
swinging into a tree are intellectuals? Enemy Of The State was a
great movie, great story, great entertainment. What sets that apart
from Wild Wild West? Intellect. Doesn't mean it takes an
intellectual to enjoy Enemy Of The State. Just means it takes an
idiot to enjoy Wild Wild West.

> Sometimes, I see why the Bolshevik revolutionaries disliked intellectuals. They
> are the enemy of the people indeed.

Don't fear the thinkers. We only seek to help you.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 13 Aug 2000 08:25:50 EDT

In a message dated 08/12/2000 9:36:34 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< Speaking of movies you grew up with, what are some other people's picks? >>

One movie I watched repeatedly at age 4, believe it or not, was National
Lampoon's European Vacation.  I hardly got any of the jokes, but, at that
age, I watched mainly for the slapstick.  Following my love of slapstick
brought me to movies like Home Alone 1 and 2 and National Lampoon's Christmas
Vacation (still my favorite of the series).  I also grew up during some of
the better Disney movies.  I remember seeing Beauty and the Beast in theaters
at 10.  I saw Aladdin the year after, but never saw The Lion King.  Well, I
guess that's about all I can think of now.
-Eric-

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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 13 Aug 2000 08:41:21 EDT

In a message dated 08/13/2000 4:24:23 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< By all means, enjoy awful, unoriginal, marketing driven, celeb
 heavy, studio films. Enjoy them blissfully.  But don't complain next
 time a really good film doesn't actually make it to your area. It's
 your fault.

 OZ >>

Did I say that I go to every movie that comes out?  No.  I go to movies that
I think might interest me.  I think that's what others do as well.  Did it
ever occur to you that some people just may not have the exact same tastes as
the critics.  Let's see, the critics are paid to give their opinions of
movies, so it automatically makes them the all mighty overlords of knowing
what is good or bad, right?  By no means.  If I agreed with every review
Roger Ebert gives a movie, then I could assess that we have similar tastes,
and I would pay more attention to his reviews based on deciding whether or
not to go.  And even if people pile in to the theaters to see a movie, if
they truly like it, I don't see a problem with it.  I do, however, see a
problem with people that hate something so much that they can't except that
there are people out there that actually like it.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 13 Aug 2000 10:11:58 EDT

In a message dated 08/13/2000 4:37:36 AM Pacific Daylight Time,=20
[e-mail] writes:

> Can't. Won't. What other people like is of no interest to me. People
>  like to watch Lacrosse, do I care? No, but I would if suddenly I
>  couldn't get a baseball game on TV for all the damn lacrosse that
>  was on. And when I tell friends to go see something awesome but
>  small as Ghost Dog and they can't because all the local screens are
>  showing Pokemon or Double Jeopardy or The Mummy, I think it's
>  criminal.
>  =20

What interests people is their own business.  Now you sound like you're=20
telling people what they should like.  As I said, let them decide for=20
themselves what's good and what's not.  And, for the record, the English=20
version of Pok=E9mon: The First Movie is a horrible travesty to the original=
. =20
However, you've probably never seen it (the Japanese version), so I don't=20
think you have any right to look down on me for liking it.

> =20
>  Why do you assume that people who want more than Brendan Fraser
>  swinging into a tree are intellectuals? Enemy Of The State was a
>  great movie, great story, great entertainment. What sets that apart
>  from Wild Wild West? Intellect. Doesn't mean it takes an
>  intellectual to enjoy Enemy Of The State. Just means it takes an
>  idiot to enjoy Wild Wild West.
> =20

I've never seen Wild Wild West, so I can't comment on that.  However, I can=20
relate it to another movie.  Remember Pauly Shore's piece of crap movie=20
Biodome?  I thought it was terrible, dumb, and a waste of time.  However, I=20
know of some people at my school who liked it.  Why?  I don't know, but they=
=20
happened to find it funny.  Not idiots.  In fact, there are some I consider=20
to be pretty d*mn intelligent.  I don't understand their point of view, but=20=
I=20
can at least accept it.  Like I said, there is no such thing as a movie so=20
bad that everyone hates it or a movie so good everyone likes it.  Some peopl=
e=20
love House Arrest.  Some people hate Forrest Gump.  Apparently they don't=20
share my taste in movies, but I don't think they're morons because they=20
happen to have different opinions than mine.

> =20
>  Don't fear the thinkers. We only seek to help you.
>=20

If you're a "thinker," you don't appear to be helping anyone.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 14 Aug 2000 00:46:22 -0700

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> >  Don't fear the thinkers. We only seek to help you.
>
> If you're a "thinker," you don't appear to be helping anyone.

One can only help those who seek to help themselves.

But you should know that, honor role boy, you're smarter n'heck.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 13 Aug 2000 12:59:26 EDT

In a message dated 08/13/2000 7:39:04 AM Pacific Daylight Time,=20
[e-mail] writes:

<< One can only help those who seek to help themselves.
=20
 But you should know that, honor role boy, you're smarter n'heck.
=20
 OZ >>

Never claimed to be "smarter 'n heck," but I did say I'm not a retard.  You=20
apparently think I am since I like Pok=E9mon, but I'm older than 13.  As for=
=20
help... well, I don't see anyone on this list that needs help.  Drug addicts=
=20
and the homeless need help.  People that see movies need to have a good time=
.=20
 If their taste is rather detestable, I suppose you think they need help, eh=
?=20
 In that case, why don't you get help?  Let people like what they want to=20
like and don't call them "retarded."
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 13 Aug 2000 16:07:26 -0700

Chris,
I'm better than you because I don't think I'm better than anyone.
I'm better than you because I don't look down on people.  Yes,  there are movies I don't
like. I don't like the Mummy, but what I don't like is my business. I'm not going to
tell everybody I'm better than someone else just to get an ego trip.

Your full of yourself.

Dexter

Chris Parry wrote:

> Dexter Sy wrote:
> >
> > I thought Armageddon raised the level of watching our civilization
> > disintigrated to a whole new level.
>
> Great. Slap it in an Imax theatre and save the rest of us the
> embarassment of that awful 'story' filler.
>
> > Martin Laurence isn't a big star.  The real upset this year is how his movie
> > outperformed the Jim Carrey's comedy.
>
> Let me fill you in... Jim Carrey talking out of his ass is
> considered funny by the morons. Jim Carrey telling a story that
> makes people think isn't. So what does MArtin Lawrence do with BMH?
> Fat jokes. Fart jokes. The result? Big box office.
>
> Yeah, the people are geniuses.
>
> > If that offends you, if black comedy offends you then its your problem, not mine.
>
> No problem with black comedy at all. Big problem with garbage.
>
> > I thought the laughs in Shanghai noon was tamed.  It was funny more on a slapstick
> > level. Its more physical comedy than anything.   I was laughed more while watching
> > Big Momma's house than I did Shanghai Noon and the former is the better comedy.
>
> Dude, give me one joke from Big Momma's House that was what you'd
> call "better comedy". Perhaps the Shakespearian line "is that
> another flashlight?" Perhaps Lawrence being stuck in the shower
> while a fat woman does a noisy poop? Maybe Paul Giamatti being
> kicked in the nuts? Rushmore is comedy. Bottle Rocket was genius
> comedy. Owen Wilson wrote both, and contributed comedy to Shanghai
> Noon on screen and off. If you're seriously saying a noisy fart
> beats Owen Wilson, I think my point is proved.
>
> > > To me, an "it was alright" is a fail. If a
> > > filmmaker can't make something original, or rework an original idea
> > > so it's better, then they shouldn't make the damn film in the first
> > > place.
> >
> > That's an awfully high expectation.  This is where I think we part.  To me, films
> > have to entertain above all else because people go to see movies as an escape.
> > And if the movie happens to provoke more than just entertainment, then its a real
> > credit to the men and women behind it.
>
> I guess we do part here, because I believe that even escapist
> entertainment should have a script behind it, or not be made until a
> script is ready. The script is the story, man. It's why you're
> there. It's essential, yet it's being phased out and replaced with
> ooh aah effects. "The story was dumb, but it took wiping out
> civilisation to a whole new level"... to me, that's a fail. It's an
> Imax movie. "Come look a the pretty colours..."
>
> > And what entertains people varies.  I
> > can't stand westerns, I think they are stupid.  I can't stand the Older men finds
> > younger women chick-flicks out in the market.  That is my personal bias, but I am
> > sure there are people out there who will defend these genres for what it is worth
> > to them, and I respect that. And so should you.
>
> Can't. Won't. What other people like is of no interest to me. People
> like to watch Lacrosse, do I care? No, but I would if suddenly I
> couldn't get a baseball game on TV for all the damn lacrosse that
> was on. And when I tell friends to go see something awesome but
> small as Ghost Dog and they can't because all the local screens are
> showing Pokemon or Double Jeopardy or The Mummy, I think it's
> criminal.
>
> > If someone tells me that they look down on people based on the movies they watch,
> > then I shall walk out of this room in a mad rage.
>
> Don't let the door hit ya...
>
> > What insults me above all else are people, intellectuals, who walk around with
> > this utter desdain for popular entertainment.
>
> Why do you assume that people who want more than Brendan Fraser
> swinging into a tree are intellectuals? Enemy Of The State was a
> great movie, great story, great entertainment. What sets that apart
> from Wild Wild West? Intellect. Doesn't mean it takes an
> intellectual to enjoy Enemy Of The State. Just means it takes an
> idiot to enjoy Wild Wild West.
>
> > Sometimes, I see why the Bolshevik revolutionaries disliked intellectuals. They
> > are the enemy of the people indeed.
>
> Don't fear the thinkers. We only seek to help you.
>
> OZ
>
> http://www.efilmcritic.com
> http://www.mymovies.com.au
> http://www.tribe.com
> http://www.if.com.au
> http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
> http://www.sain.com.au
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 13 Aug 2000 16:11:01 -0700

Eric, Its really pointless arguing with this Chris dude :)

If he choose to act like this, he'll get what he dishes out in kind when the time
comes.

Dexter

[e-mail] wrote:

> In a message dated 08/13/2000 4:37:36 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> [e-mail] writes:
>
> > Can't. Won't. What other people like is of no interest to me. People
> >  like to watch Lacrosse, do I care? No, but I would if suddenly I
> >  couldn't get a baseball game on TV for all the damn lacrosse that
> >  was on. And when I tell friends to go see something awesome but
> >  small as Ghost Dog and they can't because all the local screens are
> >  showing Pokemon or Double Jeopardy or The Mummy, I think it's
> >  criminal.
> >
>
> What interests people is their own business.  Now you sound like you're
> telling people what they should like.  As I said, let them decide for
> themselves what's good and what's not.  And, for the record, the English
> version of PokΘmon: The First Movie is a horrible travesty to the original.
> However, you've probably never seen it (the Japanese version), so I don't
> think you have any right to look down on me for liking it.
>
> >
> >  Why do you assume that people who want more than Brendan Fraser
> >  swinging into a tree are intellectuals? Enemy Of The State was a
> >  great movie, great story, great entertainment. What sets that apart
> >  from Wild Wild West? Intellect. Doesn't mean it takes an
> >  intellectual to enjoy Enemy Of The State. Just means it takes an
> >  idiot to enjoy Wild Wild West.
> >
>
> I've never seen Wild Wild West, so I can't comment on that.  However, I can
> relate it to another movie.  Remember Pauly Shore's piece of crap movie
> Biodome?  I thought it was terrible, dumb, and a waste of time.  However, I
> know of some people at my school who liked it.  Why?  I don't know, but they
> happened to find it funny.  Not idiots.  In fact, there are some I consider
> to be pretty d*mn intelligent.  I don't understand their point of view, but I
> can at least accept it.  Like I said, there is no such thing as a movie so
> bad that everyone hates it or a movie so good everyone likes it.  Some people
> love House Arrest.  Some people hate Forrest Gump.  Apparently they don't
> share my taste in movies, but I don't think they're morons because they
> happen to have different opinions than mine.
>
> >
> >  Don't fear the thinkers. We only seek to help you.
> >
>
> If you're a "thinker," you don't appear to be helping anyone.
> -Eric-
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Danielle Conkle" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 02:07:06 GMT


>Goonies
>Terminator 2
>Back To The Future Trilogy
>Home Alone
>Star Wars Trilogy (video and tv)


ahh, all good!  I could add Major League, Karate Kid to my list ;)

________________________________________________________________________
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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 00:29:27 EDT

In a message dated 08/13/2000 7:07:34 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< >Goonies
 >Terminator 2
 >Back To The Future Trilogy
 >Home Alone
 >Star Wars Trilogy (video and tv)


 ahh, all good!  I could add Major League, Karate Kid to my list ;) >>

I probably should've mentioned Star Wars.  I think I was about 11 or 12 when
I saw them.  I don't remember many times when I had more fun watching a
movie.  Also, RotJ introduced me to my favorite movie monster.  Namely, the
Sarlac.  I need to know, was anyone else extremely disappointed with its
appearance in the special edition?  I know I was.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 13 Aug 2000 22:16:47 -0700

> I probably should've mentioned Star Wars.  I think I was about 11 or 12 when
> I saw them.  I don't remember many times when I had more fun watching a
> movie.  Also, RotJ introduced me to my favorite movie monster.  Namely, the
> Sarlac.  I need to know, was anyone else extremely disappointed with its
> appearance in the special edition?  I know I was.
> -Eric-

Lucas got what he was looking for with the Sarlaac pit in the Special Edition.
I first saw Return of the Jedi about the same age you did, and I remember that
little voice in my head saying "that mouth ain't right" when the Sarlaac made
the burping noise and you could see the walls of the mouth wiggle like rubber or
a peice of cloth.  The tentacles also looked really inanimate to me.  It didn't
bother me, sure, as the movie itself was gorgeous to take in for the first time.
To me, the special Edition version of the Sarlaac was a good fix.

I remember watching Jedi for the first time.  It was hyped up by the TV station
and they had spots on the TV airing like weeks in advance so i was kinda
pumped.  The only Star Wars movie I've seen before Jedi was Empire, so I had a
good grasp on the characters and all.  I enjoyed Jedi till about 13 or 14, then
I realized Empire Strikes Back was the superior movie.
--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 14 Aug 2000 15:36:42 -0700

Dexter Sy wrote:
>
> I'm better than you because I don't think I'm better than anyone.

You're not better than anyone? Nobody at all? Man, you could at
least aspire to be better than Jeffrey Dahmer or George Bush Jr.
Reach for the stars, champ!

> I'm better than you because I don't look down on people.

Nobody? Nobody at all? Crack dealers are on your level? Dude, a
little confidence. If you don't love yourself, who's gonna love you?

> Yes,  there are movies I don't
> like. I don't like the Mummy, but what I don't like is my business. I'm not going to
> tell everybody I'm better than someone else just to get an ego trip.

Clearly you haven't read my excellent reasoning, previously posted.
I object to people who go in great numbers to see ordinary movies
out of nothing more than apathy or the cult of celebrity. It means
good movies, like Boys Don't Cry for example, don't make it out to
the people who want to see them. And it breeds more awful movies. Do
you think the studios are thinking to themselves right now "hey, we
ought to make better movies with good stories and good actors,
because Boys Don't Cry won an Oscar" or are they thinking "Nobody
saw Boys Don't Cry but, gee, Martin Lawrence seems able to bring in
a $20m opening weekend no matter what he's in. Better get him into
more movies."

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.

> Your full of yourself.

Absolutely. I rule.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 13 Aug 2000 22:36:12 -0700

>
> Clearly you haven't read my excellent reasoning, previously posted.
> I object to people who go in great numbers to see ordinary movies
> out of nothing more than apathy or the cult of celebrity. It means
> good movies, like Boys Don't Cry for example, don't make it out to
> the people who want to see them. And it breeds more awful movies. Do
> you think the studios are thinking to themselves right now "hey, we
> ought to make better movies with good stories and good actors,
> because Boys Don't Cry won an Oscar" or are they thinking "Nobody
> saw Boys Don't Cry but, gee, Martin Lawrence seems able to bring in
> a $20m opening weekend no matter what he's in. Better get him into
> more movies."

Your point of view.  But you leave no room for disagreement :)




--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 09:49:12 +0100

Well, I was born in 1970, so my list goes something like

Ferris Buellers Day Off
About Last Night - (I will defend it to the death)
Goonies
Ghostbusters
Superman
First Blood
An American Werewolf in London
Beverly Hills Cop



These are just a few, I could go on.

MARK

> -----Original Message-----
> From:    [e-mail] [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> Sent:    14 August 2000 05:29
> To:    [e-mail]
> Subject:    Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
>
> In a message dated 08/13/2000 7:07:34 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> [e-mail] writes:
>
> << >Goonies
>  >Terminator 2
>  >Back To The Future Trilogy
>  >Home Alone
>  >Star Wars Trilogy (video and tv)
>
>
>  ahh, all good!  I could add Major League, Karate Kid to my list ;) >>
>
> I probably should've mentioned Star Wars.  I think I was about 11 or
> 12 when
> I saw them.  I don't remember many times when I had more fun watching
> a
> movie.  Also, RotJ introduced me to my favorite movie monster.
> Namely, the
> Sarlac.  I need to know, was anyone else extremely disappointed with
> its
> appearance in the special edition?  I know I was.
> -Eric-
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

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From: "Source - Richard" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 10:19:38 +0100

I am of similar age and as well as all the movies on your list i would
also add:

Sure Thing (and most other John Cusack teen movies)
Back to the Future
Breakfast Club
Rocky 4
Golden Child (don't hurt me!)

etc.

MARK wrote:
>Well, I was born in 1970, so my list goes something like
>
>Ferris Buellers Day Off
>About Last Night - (I will defend it to the death)
>Goonies
>Ghostbusters
>Superman
>First Blood
>An American Werewolf in London
>Beverly Hills Cop
>
>
>
>These are just a few, I could go on.
>
>MARK
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From:    [e-mail] [SMTP:[e-mail]]
>> Sent:    14 August 2000 05:29
>> To:    [e-mail]
>> Subject:    Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
>>
>> In a message dated 08/13/2000 7:07:34 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
>> [e-mail] writes:
>>
>> << >Goonies
>>  >Terminator 2
>>  >Back To The Future Trilogy
>>  >Home Alone
>>  >Star Wars Trilogy (video and tv)
>>
>>
>>  ahh, all good!  I could add Major League, Karate Kid to my list ;) >>
>>
>> I probably should've mentioned Star Wars.  I think I was about 11 or
>> 12 when
>> I saw them.  I don't remember many times when I had more fun watching
>> a
>> movie.  Also, RotJ introduced me to my favorite movie monster.
>> Namely, the
>> Sarlac.  I need to know, was anyone else extremely disappointed with
>> its
>> appearance in the special edition?  I know I was.
>> -Eric-
>>
>> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>
>[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>
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>-----------------------------------
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>Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2000 09:49:12 +0100
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 10:47:36 +0100

Yeah, but you also liked:

Soul Man
An American Tail
Beatstreet
Breakdance I & II
The Last Dragon
Footloose

So There!!

> -----Original Message-----
> From:    Source - Richard [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> Sent:    14 August 2000 10:20
> To:    movies
> Subject:    RE: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
>
> I am of similar age and as well as all the movies on your list i would
> also add:
>
> Sure Thing (and most other John Cusack teen movies)
> Back to the Future
> Breakfast Club
> Rocky 4
> Golden Child (don't hurt me!)
>
> etc.
>
> MARK wrote:
> >Well, I was born in 1970, so my list goes something like
> >
> >Ferris Buellers Day Off
> >About Last Night - (I will defend it to the death)
> >Goonies
> >Ghostbusters
> >Superman
> >First Blood
> >An American Werewolf in London
> >Beverly Hills Cop
> >
> >
> >
> >These are just a few, I could go on.
> >
> >MARK
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From:    [e-mail] [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> >> Sent:    14 August 2000 05:29
> >> To:    [e-mail]
> >> Subject:    Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
> >>
> >> In a message dated 08/13/2000 7:07:34 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> >> [e-mail] writes:
> >>
> >> << >Goonies
> >>  >Terminator 2
> >>  >Back To The Future Trilogy
> >>  >Home Alone
> >>  >Star Wars Trilogy (video and tv)
> >>
> >>
> >>  ahh, all good!  I could add Major League, Karate Kid to my list ;)
> >>
> >>
> >> I probably should've mentioned Star Wars.  I think I was about 11
> or
> >> 12 when
> >> I saw them.  I don't remember many times when I had more fun
> watching
> >> a
> >> movie.  Also, RotJ introduced me to my favorite movie monster.
> >> Namely, the
> >> Sarlac.  I need to know, was anyone else extremely disappointed
> with
> >> its
> >> appearance in the special edition?  I know I was.
> >> -Eric-
> >>
> >> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> >> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
> >
> >[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> >[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
> >
> >RFC822 header
> >-----------------------------------
> >
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From: "Source - Richard" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 10:27:57 +0100

You're darn reet.

MARK wrote:
>Yeah, but you also liked:
>
>Soul Man
>An American Tail
>Beatstreet
>Breakdance I & II
>The Last Dragon
>Footloose
>
>So There!!
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From:    Source - Richard [SMTP:[e-mail]]
>> Sent:    14 August 2000 10:20
>> To:    movies
>> Subject:    RE: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
>>
>> I am of similar age and as well as all the movies on your list i would
>> also add:
>>
>> Sure Thing (and most other John Cusack teen movies)
>> Back to the Future
>> Breakfast Club
>> Rocky 4
>> Golden Child (don't hurt me!)
>>
>> etc.
>>
>> MARK wrote:
>> >Well, I was born in 1970, so my list goes something like
>> >
>> >Ferris Buellers Day Off
>> >About Last Night - (I will defend it to the death)
>> >Goonies
>> >Ghostbusters
>> >Superman
>> >First Blood
>> >An American Werewolf in London
>> >Beverly Hills Cop
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >These are just a few, I could go on.
>> >
>> >MARK
>> >
>> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> From:    [e-mail] [SMTP:[e-mail]]
>> >> Sent:    14 August 2000 05:29
>> >> To:    [e-mail]
>> >> Subject:    Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
>> >>
>> >> In a message dated 08/13/2000 7:07:34 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
>> >> [e-mail] writes:
>> >>
>> >> << >Goonies
>> >>  >Terminator 2
>> >>  >Back To The Future Trilogy
>> >>  >Home Alone
>> >>  >Star Wars Trilogy (video and tv)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>  ahh, all good!  I could add Major League, Karate Kid to my list ;)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I probably should've mentioned Star Wars.  I think I was about 11
>> or
>> >> 12 when
>> >> I saw them.  I don't remember many times when I had more fun
>> watching
>> >> a
>> >> movie.  Also, RotJ introduced me to my favorite movie monster.
>> >> Namely, the
>> >> Sarlac.  I need to know, was anyone else extremely disappointed
>> with
>> >> its
>> >> appearance in the special edition?  I know I was.
>> >> -Eric-
>> >>
>> >> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>> >> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>> >
>> >[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>> >[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>> >
>> >RFC822 header
>> >-----------------------------------
>> >
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>> +0100
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>> >From: MARK <[e-mail]>
>> >To: "'[e-mail]'" <[e-mail]>
>> >Subject: RE: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
>> >Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2000 09:49:12 +0100
>> >MIME-Version: 1.0
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>ender: owner-movies@lists.x
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[ To lea
>> >
>>
>>
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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 09:09:25 EDT

In a message dated 08/13/2000 10:08:20 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< I remember watching Jedi for the first time.  It was hyped up by the TV
station
 and they had spots on the TV airing like weeks in advance so i was kinda
 pumped.  The only Star Wars movie I've seen before Jedi was Empire, so I had
a
 good grasp on the characters and all.  I enjoyed Jedi till about 13 or 14,
then
 I realized Empire Strikes Back was the superior movie. >>

Same here.  I saw A New Hope when my Star Wars crazy uncle gave it to me for
my birthday.  A little later, I saw RotJ on TV (the last half, actually).
Later, my uncle bought me the last two for Christmas, and I decided the last
was the best.  After a while, I realized Empire was better.  However, the
Sarlaac was still a favorite of mine.  On that one, I did like the original
better.  Why?  Well, it's more mysterious.  Think about it, aside from the
mouth, we have no idea how the thing looks (unless you base it on the Super
Star Wars game for SNES).  What we do see is this gaping mouth, and we all
know what goes on inside it, right?  The more disgusting it looked, the
better.  So, I liked the original more.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 09:10:47 EDT

In a message dated 08/13/2000 10:08:20 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< I remember watching Jedi for the first time.  It was hyped up by the TV
station
 and they had spots on the TV airing like weeks in advance so i was kinda
 pumped.  The only Star Wars movie I've seen before Jedi was Empire, so I had
a
 good grasp on the characters and all.  I enjoyed Jedi till about 13 or 14,
then
 I realized Empire Strikes Back was the superior movie. >>

Same here.  I saw A New Hope when my Star Wars crazy uncle gave it to me for
my birthday.  A little later, I saw RotJ on TV (the last half, actually).
Later, my uncle bought me the last two for Christmas, and I decided the last
was the best.  After a while, I realized Empire was better.  However, the
Sarlaac was still a favorite of mine.  On that one, I did like the original
better.  Why?  Well, it's more mysterious.  Think about it, aside from the
mouth, we have no idea how the thing looks (unless you base it on the Super
Star Wars game for SNES).  What we do see is this gaping mouth, and we all
know what goes on inside it, right?  The more disgusting it looked, the
better.  So, I liked the original more.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 14 Aug 2000 09:20:07 EDT

In a message dated 08/13/2000 10:26:15 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< Clearly you haven't read my excellent reasoning, previously posted.
 I object to people who go in great numbers to see ordinary movies
 out of nothing more than apathy or the cult of celebrity. It means
 good movies, like Boys Don't Cry for example, don't make it out to
 the people who want to see them. And it breeds more awful movies. Do
 you think the studios are thinking to themselves right now "hey, we
 ought to make better movies with good stories and good actors,
 because Boys Don't Cry won an Oscar" or are they thinking "Nobody
 saw Boys Don't Cry but, gee, Martin Lawrence seems able to bring in
 a $20m opening weekend no matter what he's in. Better get him into
 more movies." >>

As much as you can't stand it, movies with good advertising are going to make
money.  Plain and simple.  I respect the fact that your taste in movies is
based on high expectations, and I understand that you must be very annoyed.
All I'm saying is that you shouldn't look down on people for going to these
movies.  You may think they're unoriginal, and they may very well be, but if
those people that went were entertained, then I guess they got what they
wanted.  It all comes down to taste.  Some people have different tastes, but
don't look down on them for it.  If the people want to see movies like M:I2
and you want to see Boys Don't Cry, very well then.  Whatever it is that
suits your taste.
-Eric-

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From: Nathan Lemrick <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 09:32:05 -0700 (PDT)

The movies I grew up with:

The Goonies
Ghostbusters
Sound of Music
The Man from Snowy River
All the James Bond movies
Also all of the Star Trek movies

These are all I can think of at this moment.

Nathan

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From: "Source - Richard" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 17:53:24 +0100

The Man from Bloody Snowy River!!

Nathan Lemrick wrote:
>The movies I grew up with:
>
>The Goonies
>Ghostbusters
>Sound of Music
>The Man from Snowy River
>All the James Bond movies
>Also all of the Star Trek movies
>
>These are all I can think of at this moment.
>
>Nathan
>
>___________________________________________________
>GO Network Mail
>Get Your Free, Private E-mail at http://mail.go.com
>
>
>
>[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
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>
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>-----------------------------------
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>Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2000 09:32:05 -0700 (PDT)
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>Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
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From: [e-mail]
Subject: RE: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 14:29:17 -0500

Pre-video person here!
Love Story (no choice, played in the same theatre all summer)
J C Superstar
Tommy
Sat Night Fever
Jaws
Too many Charles Bronson movies
WAY too many!
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Monday, August 14, 2000 11:53 AM


The Man from Bloody Snowy River!!

Nathan Lemrick wrote:
>The movies I grew up with:
>
>The Goonies
>Ghostbusters
>Sound of Music
>The Man from Snowy River
>All the James Bond movies
>Also all of the Star Trek movies
>
>These are all I can think of at this moment.
>
>Nathan
>
>___________________________________________________
>GO Network Mail
>Get Your Free, Private E-mail at http://mail.go.com
>
>
>
>[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>
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>-----------------------------------
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+0100
>Received: from domo by lists.xmission.com with local (Exim 2.12 #2)
>    id 13ONRu-0001Yd-00
>    for [e-mail]; Mon, 14 Aug 2000 10:50:54
-0600
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> <[e-mail]> for [e-mail];
Mon,
> 14 Aug 2000 09:32:05 -0700 (PDT)
>Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2000 09:32:05 -0700 (PDT)
>From: Nathan Lemrick <[e-mail]>
>Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
>To: [e-mail]
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Diane Christy <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 14:50:55 -0500

On 8/14/00, 2:29 PM -0500, [e-mail] said so nicely:
>Pre-video person here!
>Love Story (no choice, played in the same theatre all summer)
>J C Superstar
>Tommy
>Sat Night Fever
>Jaws
>Too many Charles Bronson movies
>WAY too many!

I feel REALLY old on this list!!  Here are the movies I grew up with
(born 1961):

Bambi (re-release)
The Sound of Music
Oliver!
The Wizard of Oz (played on TV every Easter)
Willard (does anyone remember that?--I loved it!!)
Summer of '42
The Poseidon Adventure
Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory
Gone With the Wind (saw it in re-release when I was 15)
Animal House
Saturday Night Fever
The Cowboys (saw it on TV)
Oklahoma! (saw it on TV when I was about 11 and fell in love the
musicals--and Joel McCrae!!)
The Nutty Professor (the Jerry Lewis version, of course, and not to
be topped!!)

I know there are more, but these are the ones that come to me right now.
--
~~~~~
Diane Christy (Samantha and Joshua's Mom)
Jefferson, LA
http://www.geocities.com/~dchristy10/
mailto:[e-mail]
ICQ #12904700  <dkbc10> on Instant AOL Messenger
~~~~~

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 14 Aug 2000 14:55:09 -0400

At 09.20 AM 14/08/2000 EDT, [e-mail] wrote:
>Some people have different tastes, but
>don't look down on them for it.  If the people want to see movies like M:I2
>and you want to see Boys Don't Cry, very well then.  Whatever it is that
>suits your taste.

Let me interject here before Oz has a coronary:

The problem is that the original M:I, tho not very true to the television
series, at least had a plot.  However, with all the sheep bleeting that it
was "too complicated", the sequel was dumbed down to the point that it was
Tom Cruise Saves the World.

Speaking of Cruise, I thought after his hollow turn in the horrid, very
boring Eyes Wide Shut, he should not even be allowed to WATCH the Academy
Awards, much less get a nomination.  However, he did duly impress me with
his turn in Magnolia.  However, then he has to put on his superhero cape
and go do M:I2.  Also, what is it with him and our Aussie sheilas??  First
Nic, and now Thandie.... Hey, Tom, leave some for the rest of us, OK??

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty

Please support the endeavour
of a friend and fellow Australian.

Political Corrections by Michael Jaymes Cassidy
http://www.angelfire.com/ma/politicalmusings

______________________________________________
I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death,
your right to say it. -Voltaire (1694-1778)
---


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 16:59:33 -0700

Diane,   The webpage in your signature is said to be unavailable.
You may want to look into that..

Dexter

Diane Christy wrote:

> On 8/14/00, 2:29 PM -0500, [e-mail] said so nicely:
> >Pre-video person here!
> >Love Story (no choice, played in the same theatre all summer)
> >J C Superstar
> >Tommy
> >Sat Night Fever
> >Jaws
> >Too many Charles Bronson movies
> >WAY too many!
>
> I feel REALLY old on this list!!  Here are the movies I grew up with
> (born 1961):
>
> Bambi (re-release)
> The Sound of Music
> Oliver!
> The Wizard of Oz (played on TV every Easter)
> Willard (does anyone remember that?--I loved it!!)
> Summer of '42
> The Poseidon Adventure
> Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory
> Gone With the Wind (saw it in re-release when I was 15)
> Animal House
> Saturday Night Fever
> The Cowboys (saw it on TV)
> Oklahoma! (saw it on TV when I was about 11 and fell in love the
> musicals--and Joel McCrae!!)
> The Nutty Professor (the Jerry Lewis version, of course, and not to
> be topped!!)
>
> I know there are more, but these are the ones that come to me right now.
> --
> ~~~~~
> Diane Christy (Samantha and Joshua's Mom)
> Jefferson, LA
> http://www.geocities.com/~dchristy10/
> mailto:[e-mail]
> ICQ #12904700  <dkbc10> on Instant AOL Messenger
> ~~~~~
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 15 Aug 2000 11:52:16 -0700

Mel Eperthener wrote:
>
> Let me interject here before Oz has a coronary:
>
> The problem is that the original M:I, tho not very true to the television
> series, at least had a plot.  However, with all the sheep bleeting that it
> was "too complicated", the sequel was dumbed down to the point that it was
> Tom Cruise Saves the World.

Not only that, but when Robert Towne was given the brief to write
the thing, he was told about eight action sequences they wanted and
told to write a story that went with them. The cart was well before
the horse and the result was perhaps the most mind-numbing rubbish
I'd seen since Gone In 60 Seconds, which unfortunately I'd seen
earlier that day.

But there'll be a sequel because people went in big numbers without
checking if it was any good first. Did they like it? Doesn't matter
if they liked it, because the studios already had their money and
registered it as a success.

> Speaking of Cruise, I thought after his hollow turn in the horrid, very
> boring Eyes Wide Shut, he should not even be allowed to WATCH the Academy
> Awards, much less get a nomination.  However, he did duly impress me with
> his turn in Magnolia.  However, then he has to put on his superhero cape
> and go do M:I2.

Cruise is no doubt uber-talented. His role in Magnolia deserved the
award so much more than Michael Caine, in fact Cruise will never get
a role as perfect for him as in Magnolia. He was scarily good. If he
was ever going to pull an Oscar, this was the time. But hey, the
award went to someone who the academy thought was overdue for one,
so yeah, Cruise has decided to plump for the cash from now on.
But let's not start on the Oscars.. that's a whole new rant.

> Also, what is it with him and our Aussie sheilas??  First
> Nic, and now Thandie.... Hey, Tom, leave some for the rest of us, OK??

Umm, actually, she's not an aussie. Blame England for her.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Diane Christy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 14 Aug 2000 23:34:04 -0500

On 8/14/00, 4:59 PM -0700, Dexter Sy said so nicely:
>Diane,   The webpage in your signature is said to be unavailable.
>You may want to look into that..

Thanks, Dexter.  I asked about it earlier today.  Yahoo/Geocities had
a problem, but it's fixed now.  Thanks again!!
--
~~~~~
Diane Christy (Samantha and Joshua's Mom)
Jefferson, LA
http://www.geocities.com/~dchristy10/
mailto:[e-mail]
ICQ #12904700  <dkbc10> on Instant AOL Messenger
~~~~~

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 15 Aug 2000 00:38:52 -0400

At 11.52 AM 15/08/2000 -0700, Chris Parry wrote:
>> Also, what is it with him and our Aussie sheilas??  First
>> Nic, and now Thandie.... Hey, Tom, leave some for the rest of us, OK??
>
>Umm, actually, she's not an aussie. Blame England for her.

Well, she did get her start in Flirting.  (The not-quite-as-good sequel to
The Year My Voice Broke, but everyone outside Australia seems to like it
better).  Hence, we do claim her as our own.  Then again, Nic was born in
Honolulu, and Mr Gibson in Upstate NY, and they are still considered
honourary Aussies.

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty

Please support the endeavour
of a friend and fellow Australian.

Political Corrections by Michael Jaymes Cassidy
http://www.angelfire.com/ma/politicalmusings

______________________________________________
I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death,
your right to say it. -Voltaire (1694-1778)
---


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 15 Aug 2000 01:36:36 EDT

In a message dated 08/14/2000 6:42:03 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< Not only that, but when Robert Towne was given the brief to write
 the thing, he was told about eight action sequences they wanted and
 told to write a story that went with them. The cart was well before
 the horse and the result was perhaps the most mind-numbing rubbish
 I'd seen since Gone In 60 Seconds, which unfortunately I'd seen
 earlier that day.

 But there'll be a sequel because people went in big numbers without
 checking if it was any good first. Did they like it? Doesn't matter
 if they liked it, because the studios already had their money and
 registered it as a success. >>

This is all well and good, but the original discussion was not about rating
M:I2.  We were talking about not looking down upon someone because they like
something you find to be stupid.  If they're interested in seeing it, it's
their business to see it.  You're simply angered because they don't pile in
to the movies you want them to.  News flash: Not everyone thinks like you.
Let them see what they want to.  You have every right to criticize the movie,
but not one's intelligence based on their opinion of a movie.  You have every
right to debate about a movie, but not to call someone a moron because they
liked it.  And, really, whether people crowd in or not, bad movies WILL be
made.  Bad movies have always been made.  Why?  Simple: you CAN'T please
everyone.  There are people that hate Forrest Gump and The Truman Show as
well as people who loved House Arrest and Twister.  There's no such thing as
an "ideal" movie audience, so stop imagining one.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Danielle Conkle" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 15 Aug 2000 08:19:28 GMT


>The movies I grew up with:
>
>The Goonies
>Ghostbusters
>Sound of Music
>The Man from Snowy River
>All the James Bond movies
>Also all of the Star Trek movies


oh oh, and Indiana Jones!
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Nathan Lemrick <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 15 Aug 2000 12:48:09 -0700 (PDT)


-
>The Man from Bloody Snowy River!!>

Yep, my mom really likes this film so I have seen it many times growing up.  She probably watched it at least once a month.  It might be a favorite for everyone but Kirk Douglas isn't bad, in my opinion.  The film keeps me entertained and that is all I ask of any film.


>Nathan Lemrick wrote:
>>The movies I grew up with:
>>
>>The Goonies
>>Ghostbusters
>>Sound of Music
>>The Man from Snowy River
>>All the James Bond movies
>>Also all of the Star Trek movies
>>
>>These are all I can think of at this moment.
>>
>>Nathan
>>
>>___________________________________________________
>>GO Network Mail
>>Get Your Free, Private E-mail at http://mail.go.com
>>
>>
>>
>>[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>>[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>>
>>RFC822 header
>>-----------------------------------
>>
>>Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
>>Received: from lists.xmission.com ([198.60.22.7]) by
>zag.workstation.org.uk
>>          (Netscape Messaging Server 3.5)  with ESMTP id 2461
>>          for <[e-mail]>; Mon, 14 Aug 2000 17:51:57
>+0100
>>Received: from domo by lists.xmission.com with local (Exim 2.12 #2)
>>    id 13ONRu-0001Yd-00
>>    for [e-mail]; Mon, 14 Aug 2000 10:50:54 -0600
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>>    by lists.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #2)
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>>    for [e-mail]; Mon, 14 Aug 2000 10:50:52 -0600
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>> by mta01.seamail.go.com
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>> <[e-mail]> for [e-mail];
>Mon,
>> 14 Aug 2000 09:32:05 -0700 (PDT)
>>Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2000 09:32:05 -0700 (PDT)
>>From: Nathan Lemrick <[e-mail]>
>>Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
>>To: [e-mail]
>>Message-id: <2347269.966270725426.JavaMail.Ghost160@gomailjtp04>
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>
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From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 15 Aug 2000 13:15:21 -0700

A lot of science fiction...

Invasion of the Body Snatchers
The Incredible Shrinking Man
War of the Worlds
When Worlds Collide
The Time Machine
Forbidden Planet

Some Hitchcock (my dad was a big fan) ...

Vertigo
North by NorthWest
Psycho

plus ....

Bridge on the River Kwai
Night of the Hunter (even scarier than Psycho!)

(and Diane Christy thinks SHE'S old!!!)



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Diane Christy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] (movies that you) Grew up with....
Date: 15 Aug 2000 15:33:18 -0500

On 8/15/00, 1:15 PM -0700, David F. Nolan said so nicely:
>Invasion of the Body Snatchers
>The Incredible Shrinking Man
>War of the Worlds
>When Worlds Collide
>The Time Machine
>Forbidden Planet
>
>Some Hitchcock (my dad was a big fan) ...
>
>Vertigo
>North by NorthWest
>Psycho
>
>plus ....
>
>Bridge on the River Kwai
>Night of the Hunter (even scarier than Psycho!)
>
>(and Diane Christy thinks SHE'S old!!!)

Great, David!!  Just said I FELT old from some of the responses
received before.  This is a great list!  I'm not a huge science
fiction fan.  But I loved the original Star Trek series.  Great
characters!!  Not crazy about the movies or the newer series
spin-offs though.
--
~~~~~
Diane Christy (Samantha and Joshua's Mom)
Jefferson, LA
http://www.geocities.com/~dchristy10/
mailto:[e-mail]
ICQ #12904700  <dkbc10> on Instant AOL Messenger
~~~~~

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 12:19:32 -0700

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> This is all well and good, but the original discussion was not about rating
> M:I2.  We were talking about not looking down upon someone because they like
> something you find to be stupid.  If they're interested in seeing it, it's
> their business to see it.  You're simply angered because they don't pile in
> to the movies you want them to.  News flash: Not everyone thinks like you.

Dude, you were talking about not looking down on people who flock to
awful movies. I was talking about why we should. Quit lumping me
into your Pokemon loving band o'sheep.

> Let them see what they want to.  You have every right to criticize the movie,
> but not one's intelligence based on their opinion of a movie.  You have every
> right to debate about a movie, but not to call someone a moron because they
> liked it.

Wrong. I do have the right. It's called freedom of speech. You don't
choose what I can and can not think about people, nor what I can
say. If I think someone is a moron for watching MI:2 and not asking
for their money back, I'm gonna think it no matter what you tell me
I can and cannot think. And if I choose to say so, newsflash,
disagree all you like. I'm still going to say it.

> And, really, whether people crowd in or not, bad movies WILL be
> made.  Bad movies have always been made.  Why?  Simple: you CAN'T please
> everyone.  There are people that hate Forrest Gump and The Truman Show as
> well as people who loved House Arrest and Twister.  There's no such thing as
> an "ideal" movie audience, so stop imagining one.

Again with the telling me what to do! I have no problem with people
enjoying watching Twister. I have a problem with people not setting
their sights higher when describing it as a great movie. I have a
problem with the makers not bothering to develop a decent script to
go alongside the superb special effects. and I have a major problem
with Pokemon, so I clearly have a major problem with you.

Educate thyself, TV watcher.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 12:22:55 -0700

Mel Eperthener wrote:
>
> >Umm, actually, she's not an aussie. Blame England for her.
>
> Well, she did get her start in Flirting.  (The not-quite-as-good sequel to
> The Year My Voice Broke, but everyone outside Australia seems to like it
> better).  Hence, we do claim her as our own.  Then again, Nic was born in
> Honolulu, and Mr Gibson in Upstate NY, and they are still considered
> honourary Aussies.

And let's not forget New Zealand's favourite gladiator Russell Crowe
and Oscar winning director Jane Campion - both conveniently adopted
by Australia when they got successful.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 15 Aug 2000 20:15:54 -0700

Chris,

Do you play video games? or do you consider it below your brain power?   Because if
you do, I have a bigger problem with you than I first thought.

In anycase, I'm no psychologist, but your ravings seem to be indicative of someone
whose been shunned and ignored by the public (as most critics who belong to the
snob universe are there days) and you have turned your feelings of inadequacies
into pure hatred towards the public.

Dexter



Chris Parry wrote:

> [e-mail] wrote:
> >
> > This is all well and good, but the original discussion was not about rating
> > M:I2.  We were talking about not looking down upon someone because they like
> > something you find to be stupid.  If they're interested in seeing it, it's
> > their business to see it.  You're simply angered because they don't pile in
> > to the movies you want them to.  News flash: Not everyone thinks like you.
>
> Dude, you were talking about not looking down on people who flock to
> awful movies. I was talking about why we should. Quit lumping me
> into your Pokemon loving band o'sheep.
>
> > Let them see what they want to.  You have every right to criticize the movie,
> > but not one's intelligence based on their opinion of a movie.  You have every
> > right to debate about a movie, but not to call someone a moron because they
> > liked it.
>
> Wrong. I do have the right. It's called freedom of speech. You don't
> choose what I can and can not think about people, nor what I can
> say. If I think someone is a moron for watching MI:2 and not asking
> for their money back, I'm gonna think it no matter what you tell me
> I can and cannot think. And if I choose to say so, newsflash,
> disagree all you like. I'm still going to say it.
>
> > And, really, whether people crowd in or not, bad movies WILL be
> > made.  Bad movies have always been made.  Why?  Simple: you CAN'T please
> > everyone.  There are people that hate Forrest Gump and The Truman Show as
> > well as people who loved House Arrest and Twister.  There's no such thing as
> > an "ideal" movie audience, so stop imagining one.
>
> Again with the telling me what to do! I have no problem with people
> enjoying watching Twister. I have a problem with people not setting
> their sights higher when describing it as a great movie. I have a
> problem with the makers not bothering to develop a decent script to
> go alongside the superb special effects. and I have a major problem
> with Pokemon, so I clearly have a major problem with you.
>
> Educate thyself, TV watcher.
>
> OZ
>
> http://www.efilmcritic.com
> http://www.mymovies.com.au
> http://www.tribe.com
> http://www.if.com.au
> http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
> http://www.sain.com.au
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 13:56:37 -0700

Dexter Sy wrote:
>
> Do you play video games? or do you consider it below your brain power?
> Because if you do, I have a bigger problem with you than I first thought.

I have no problem with video games, enjoy them a lot. But I fail to
see how that relates to film.

> In anycase, I'm no psychologist, but your ravings seem to be indicative of someone
> whose been shunned and ignored by the public (as most critics who belong to the
> snob universe are there days) and you have turned your feelings of inadequacies
> into pure hatred towards the public.

You're right in one thing, you're no psychologist. I believe my
ravings are more indiciative of someone who has watched more movies
than most, worked on more movies than most, written about more
movies than most, and thus has a greater understanding of what
movies can and should be than most.

That's why I say educate yourself. To treat cinema like TV is to
completely underplay what it can be. It's like comparing a
rollercoatser ride to a trip on the space shuttle. They're both fun,
but one is a lifechanging event. All I'm saying is you're missing
out, and seem to be proud of it.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Blacknight <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Master and Apprentice (was In Memory of Sir AlecGuiness)
Date: 16 Aug 2000 11:59:16 -0700



Dexter Sy wrote:

> Rurouni Kenshin is faily recent.  The story elements in the anime seems to

Used to watch this anime. In English, it is called Samurai X.


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Blacknight <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Shakespeare
Date: 16 Aug 2000 12:03:09 -0700



Dexter Sy wrote:

> I'm a sucker for teeny type love stories. :-P And Baz Luhrman's take on Romeo and
> Juliet is quite interesting. The movie I can't stand is West Side Story, with its
> dancing and whatever.  Apologies if I insult anyone here, but I'm speaking from
> strickly a narrow (like/don't like) point of view.  THe worse part was that I had
> to sit through a showing of West Side Story in Junior High a few years ago, it was
> insufferable.
>

No matter how Shakespeare is translated in the movies, I always love it, the words
simply take over. And yes, I am also a sucker for teen love stories!

blacknight


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 15 Aug 2000 21:19:42 -0700

>
>
> I have no problem with video games, enjoy them a lot. But I fail to
> see how that relates to film.
>

That's fine then :-D

> You're right in one thing, you're no psychologist. I believe my
> ravings are more indiciative of someone who has watched more movies
> than most, worked on more movies than most, written about more
> movies than most, and thus has a greater understanding of what
> movies can and should be than most.

There's always the risk of being cut off from the public.    I write about video games
and I often find myself beign cut off from the public.  What I find interesting doesn't
always match with what the public finds interesting and that has to do with the fact
that I'm more hard-core than most.

> That's why I say educate yourself. To treat cinema like TV is to
> completely underplay what it can be. It's like comparing a
> rollercoatser ride to a trip on the space shuttle. They're both fun,
> but one is a lifechanging event. All I'm saying is you're missing
> out, and seem to be proud of it.

Actually, I treat cinema as entertainment.  Like it or not, TVs doesn't take the
pedestal to people of my generation.  I watch less than two hours of network TV a week,
the rest I watch are documentaries and assorted programming that isn't standard TV
programming. All in all, TV is just a small part of my entertainment.   I got cable you
and I prefer to watch Anime anyways.   I'm not stuck to network television.

I agree with you 80% of the time.  I just resent the tone.  Really, people don't need
other people telling them what to see and what not to see.  Critics are seen as just a
whining cacophony of noise, and the fall of the critic in our society says a whole lot
about why they failed... people hate snobs and it doesn't look like young people like me
will have a different opinion anytime soon.    You seem to be really passionate about
film and undoubtely have written a lot about them.  You can learn from successful
critics like Roger Ebert and see why people respect his reviews.

Dexter



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Master and Apprentice (was In Memory of Sir AlecGuiness)
Date: 15 Aug 2000 21:22:14 -0700

>
> Used to watch this anime. In English, it is called Samurai X.

I never knew that.  But then again, I prefer to watch Japanese films and
animation in its native language.


--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 00:25:02 EDT

In a message dated 08/15/2000 7:09:52 PM Pacific Daylight Time,=20
[e-mail] writes:

<< Again with the telling me what to do! I have no problem with people
 enjoying watching Twister. I have a problem with people not setting
 their sights higher when describing it as a great movie. I have a
 problem with the makers not bothering to develop a decent script to
 go alongside the superb special effects. and I have a major problem
 with Pokemon, so I clearly have a major problem with you.
=20
 Educate thyself, TV watcher. >>

Ugh.  The whole point I'm trying to make is that people have different=20
tastes.  The only thing that can be assumed by the movies one likes is one's=
=20
taste in cinema.  You apparently think one's intellect is shown.  What I've=20
been saying is that I don't think you should look down on people for liking=20=
a=20
certain movie.  It's simply a difference in taste.  Dex is probably right=20
about it being useless to argue with you if you're going to keep this=20
mindset.  And what's with you bringing up Pok=E9mon all the time?  If you ha=
ve=20
such a problem with it, why do you keep talking about it?
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Shakespeare
Date: 15 Aug 2000 21:35:55 -0700

> No matter how Shakespeare is translated in the movies, I always love it, the words
> simply take over. And yes, I am also a sucker for teen love stories!
>
> blacknight

That's what I've heard :) My experience with Shakespeare is pretty much only as deep as
what I was taught in school. Mainly  4 plays....  Romeo and Juliet, Midsummer night's
Dream, MacBeth, Taming of the Shrew.

Personally, I think for the first time in a long while, Shakespeare is being theatened
by the medium of film and other forms of visual entertainment.

I'm hesitant to say Shakespeare is going out of style as his stories are always
relevant, but the definition of entertainment itself is changing so you see Shakespeare
more and more being relegated to academia, save a couple of his plays like Romoe and
Juliet, stories that always makes good fodder for a remake with the days hot teen stars.

I recently downloaded a piano rendition of song from Final Fantasy VI, and I shared my
find with a friend. We ended up spending an hour talking about Final Fantasy VI.  We
talked about the memorable scene in the opera house, the death of important characters,
the feeling of foreboding and tension  felt in the phantom train. All that about a video
game.   While the handful of shoot them up games like Unreal, or Quake get all the
headlines about gore and the decadence of today's society,  games like Final Fantasy and
The Legend of Zelda are the counterbalance to these game, and they are pretty much the
epitome of art in video games.   You like in Japan where games are mainstream and seen
as a serious form of entertainment so you probably know better than I do.

All I can say is, Japan is the model which the United States will soon follow. Digital
entertainment is at our doorstep, and I'm not talking about filming  or porjecting a
movie digitally, that's entirely secondary to a much larger movement.


--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 00:34:04 -0400

At 12.22 PM 16/08/2000 -0700, Chris Parry wrote:
>And let's not forget New Zealand's favourite gladiator Russell Crowe
>and Oscar winning director Jane Campion - both conveniently adopted
>by Australia when they got successful.
>

Well, one thing you can say is, we know quality when we see it:-)

The Year My Voice Broke
Strictly Ballroom
Priscilla, Queen of the Desert
Evil Angels (the Yanks know it as Cry in the Dark)
Picnic at Hanging Rock
The Road Warrior
Love Serenade
Romper Stomper
Gallipoli
Phar Lap
Breaker Morant
Angel Baby

All are good movies, and there are sleepers, like Boulevard of Broken
Dreams, Don's Party (reminded me a lot of The Big Chill, without Costner
playing the stiff.... some foreshadowing there, eh??), Bad Behaviour and
even The Castle (tho how I can consider the highest grossing movie in
Australian history a sleeper....)

Let's not mention, tho, the total crap, like Welcome to Woop Woop, The
Coca-Cola Kid, The Good Wife, and Crocodile Dundee (tho they are a guilty
pleasure.... just not quality films)

As for the Kiwis, like Campion, Crowe and Sam Neill (I think he's a Kiwi,
too), well, you gotta understand they WANT to be Australian.... sort of
like the way Canadians view the Yanks:-)

Regards,

--Mel



--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty

Please support the endeavour
of a friend and fellow Australian.

Political Corrections by Michael Jaymes Cassidy
http://www.angelfire.com/ma/politicalmusings

______________________________________________
I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death,
your right to say it. -Voltaire (1694-1778)
---


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 00:47:17 EDT

In a message dated 08/15/2000 9:11:48 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< I agree with you 80% of the time.  I just resent the tone.  Really, people
don't need
 other people telling them what to see and what not to see.  Critics are seen
as just a
 whining cacophony of noise, and the fall of the critic in our society says a
whole lot
 about why they failed... people hate snobs and it doesn't look like young
people like me
 will have a different opinion anytime soon.    You seem to be really
passionate about
 film and undoubtely have written a lot about them.  You can learn from
successful
 critics like Roger Ebert and see why people respect his reviews. >>

Exactly.  Take a tip from Dex and lose the snobbish tone.  Like I said, I
don't mind you knocking movies I like.  I do mind you knocking me for liking
something.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 15 Aug 2000 21:56:52 -0700

>
> As for the Kiwis, like Campion, Crowe and Sam Neill (I think he's a Kiwi,
> too), well, you gotta understand they WANT to be Australian.... sort of
> like the way Canadians view the Yanks:-)

How true.    We're all children of the British Empire.  Though I'm glad the
empire is no more.

Republic forever :0)

--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] CD review Final Fantasy VI (Piano Collection)
Date: 15 Aug 2000 22:11:13 -0700

In case you haven't already checked it out, Final Fantasy VI Piano
Collection is pretty good.  Some of the tunes like "Decisive Battle"
--the boss battle theme in the game doesn't lend itself well to piano
since its original rendition was techno, but certain tracks like the
"Coin Toss" "Terra's Theme" or "Kids Running in the City" are
brilliantly captured with the piano.  Takes me back to my time with the
game :' )

I know where the entire album can be downloaded in mp3 format but for
legal reasons I cannot provide the link.  :) I'll see if I can upload
one track to a site for you guys to download. Maybe introduce a few
people to the music of Final Fantasy while I'm at it.  Japanese composer
Nobuo Uematsu is simply brilliant with his work on FF VI. Very moving
stuff.

A little off topic for a movie list but hey, I have to rant somewhere
and I know a couple of people here are big gamers anyways so I hope u
guys don't mind :-P

--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 15 Aug 2000 22:20:59 -0700

>
> Exactly.  Take a tip from Dex and lose the snobbish tone.  Like I said, I
> don't mind you knocking movies I like.  I do mind you knocking me for liking
> something.
> -Eric-

In his synopsis for his latest book,  "I hated, hated, hated This Movie"
Ebert wrote

"The easiest movies to write about are always the ones at the extremes. Good and
bad movies dictate their own reviews; those in the middle are more of a
challenge."

That about sums up my views.  There will be movies that demand praise from
everyone, or almost everyone, and movies that demand scorn.  But so many movies
Chris have touched on fall in the middle area and that is where the problem is.
To him, Big Momma's House is crap. To me, its a far superior comedy that other
comedies I consider to be crap, like Scary Movie... a movie that is esentially a
check list of parodies.  But will some other dude think Scary Movie is superior?
That's for sure.  Lets leave the discussion at that.

Borrowing from Ebert,  "I hated, hated, hated Snobs"


--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 01:19:57 -0400

At 08.15 PM 15/08/2000 -0700, Dexter Sy wrote:
>Chris,
>
>Do you play video games? or do you consider it below your brain power?
Because if
>you do, I have a bigger problem with you than I first thought.
>
>In anycase, I'm no psychologist, but your ravings seem to be indicative of
someone
>whose been shunned and ignored by the public (as most critics who belong
to the
>snob universe are there days) and you have turned your feelings of
inadequacies
>into pure hatred towards the public.

Uh, you may want to watch yourself here, Dex, mate.

Right now, it may be the gamerz v Oz....  but you start getting that gamerz
'tude here, you are going to find popular opinion going against you.

Not to sound like my father..... when you put down the controller and get a
job... an actual job, where you contribute something to the economy, you
will understand why the anti-gamerz attitude is so strong.

Just a fair, friendly warning to tread carefully here.  Remember, 'tis a
place to discuss movies.  Tho admittedly, some movies are easily confused
with video games (and The Matrix comes to mind here... I thought Thirteenth
Floor had the plot they missed), 'tis best to error on the side of caution.
 :-)

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty

Please support the endeavour
of a friend and fellow Australian.

Political Corrections by Michael Jaymes Cassidy
http://www.angelfire.com/ma/politicalmusings

______________________________________________
I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death,
your right to say it. -Voltaire (1694-1778)
---


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Jed Cross" <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] ask any question!!!
Date: 16 Aug 2000 01:32:44 EDT

okay,
you will need MSN messenger for this, you can add
[e-mail] to your contacts and ask it just about any
question and it will answer, and sometimes you can teach it stuff too.

-Jed
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 15 Aug 2000 22:40:55 -0700

After reading the exchanges back and forth, I'll throw in my nickel's worth.
As several people have noted, everyone's entitled to an opinion ... but that
doesn't make all opinions equally worthy of attention or respect.  Until
you've seen a lot of movies (hopefully spanning different eras, and
representing different genres) your idea of a "great" movie is of no value
to anyone, except perhaps yourself and a few of your equally inexperienced
chums. Great compared to what? And why?  To be meaningful, opinions must be
based on something more than  "Hey, I liked it!"  A month-old baby will
watch anything that moves; to him it's "entertainment" --- fascinating,
thrilling, etc.  As we grow older, our standards rise -- from "anything
bright and shiny" to Teletubbies, to Barney, Rugrats, Pokemon, Martin
Lawrence and on up the scale.  So unless you know something about the source
of an opinion, it's of little value.  And when someone says that Pokemon (or
Big Momma's House) is a "great" movie, that kind of devalues their opinions
from that point on, at least as far as I'm concerned.

Too often, the opinions posted here (and elsewhere) are "empty" opinions;
the writer simply  says "I liked this movie" or "It made me laugh" or
something along those lines.  So what?  Why should anyone care?   Tell us
WHY you liked (or disliked) a movie: the script, the acting, the characters,
production, soundtrack, message, etc.  Then we can learn something from your
post.

Along those lines, I will take issue with Mel Eperthener's assertion that
"Picnic At Hanging Rock" is a good movie.  I realize that a lot of "serious"
critics agree with him, but I thought it was awful ... one of the worst
movies I've ever watched. It's too long, boring, deliberately obscure,
pretentious, has low production values, and goes nowhere. You never DO find
out what happened to the damn girls on the picnic!  That's MY opinion; now,
Mel, tell us why you think it's good!  (And anyone else who's seen it, feel
free to chime in!)


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 01:48:50 EDT

In a message dated 08/15/2000 10:40:26 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< And when someone says that Pokemon (or
 Big Momma's House) is a "great" movie, that kind of devalues their opinions
 from that point on, at least as far as I'm concerned. >>

Yes, but the thing is that I'm not talking about the fact that everyone is
entitled to their opinion (which they are, BTW).  I understand what you're
saying, but the thing I'm talking about is how Chris calls someone a moron
for liking something.  And I know the occasional "It made me laugh" or "It
was great" isn't a very strong statement of an opinion and doesn't make one
value the opinion very highly.  However, all I'm saying is that whether you
respect our opinions or not is your business, but at least respect the fact
that we have these opinions and don't call us "morons" because of it.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 02:06:59 -0400

At 10.40 PM 15/08/2000 -0700, David F. Nolan wrote:
>Along those lines, I will take issue with Mel Eperthener's assertion that
>"Picnic At Hanging Rock" is a good movie.  I realize that a lot of "serious"
>critics agree with him, but I thought it was awful ... one of the worst
>movies I've ever watched. It's too long, boring, deliberately obscure,
>pretentious, has low production values, and goes nowhere. You never DO find
>out what happened to the damn girls on the picnic!  That's MY opinion; now,
>Mel, tell us why you think it's good!  (And anyone else who's seen it, feel
>free to chime in!)

Confession time....

Dunno.... never saw it:-)

Albeit it was the ONLY movie on that list that I never saw.

It was out of print for such a long time.... and then re-released at $100.
After taking the bath I did on Walkabout (similar time frame to Hanging
Rock, similar background, and it did nothing for me... so I didn't include
that one), I have not been willing to throw money after it.  Waiting for
the price to reduce.

However, the reason it was on the list:  It was based on a true story, it
was typical of it's time period (c 1971), especially of Australian cinema
at that point.  (I recently watched The Pallalax View, also from that time
period - and it showed that Arlington Road's ending was not as original as
I thought)  It was Peter Weir's first film. (and I was NOT about to put The
Cars that Eat People/Paris on the list... not that cruel).  And it is
considered a critical part of Australian History.  And EVERY review I have
ever read has praised the film to the Heavens.

As for never finding out what happened to the girls.  Like I said, it was a
true story.  And one of the mysteries of Australian History.

THAT is why it was on the list I submitted.:-)

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty

Please support the endeavour
of a friend and fellow Australian.

Political Corrections by Michael Jaymes Cassidy
http://www.angelfire.com/ma/politicalmusings

______________________________________________
I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death,
your right to say it. -Voltaire (1694-1778)
---


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 02:06:59 -0400

At 10.40 PM 15/08/2000 -0700, David F. Nolan wrote:
>Along those lines, I will take issue with Mel Eperthener's assertion that
>"Picnic At Hanging Rock" is a good movie.  I realize that a lot of "serious"
>critics agree with him, but I thought it was awful ... one of the worst
>movies I've ever watched. It's too long, boring, deliberately obscure,
>pretentious, has low production values, and goes nowhere. You never DO find
>out what happened to the damn girls on the picnic!  That's MY opinion; now,
>Mel, tell us why you think it's good!  (And anyone else who's seen it, feel
>free to chime in!)

Confession time....

Dunno.... never saw it:-)

Albeit it was the ONLY movie on that list that I never saw.

It was out of print for such a long time.... and then re-released at $100.
After taking the bath I did on Walkabout (similar time frame to Hanging
Rock, similar background, and it did nothing for me... so I didn't include
that one), I have not been willing to throw money after it.  Waiting for
the price to reduce.

However, the reason it was on the list:  It was based on a true story, it
was typical of it's time period (c 1971), especially of Australian cinema
at that point.  (I recently watched The Pallalax View, also from that time
period - and it showed that Arlington Road's ending was not as original as
I thought)  It was Peter Weir's first film. (and I was NOT about to put The
Cars that Eat People/Paris on the list... not that cruel).  And it is
considered a critical part of Australian History.  And EVERY review I have
ever read has praised the film to the Heavens.

As for never finding out what happened to the girls.  Like I said, it was a
true story.  And one of the mysteries of Australian History.

THAT is why it was on the list I submitted.:-)

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty

Please support the endeavour
of a friend and fellow Australian.

Political Corrections by Michael Jaymes Cassidy
http://www.angelfire.com/ma/politicalmusings

______________________________________________
I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death,
your right to say it. -Voltaire (1694-1778)
---


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 15 Aug 2000 23:35:35 -0700

> Uh, you may want to watch yourself here, Dex, mate.
>
> Right now, it may be the gamerz v Oz....  but you start getting that gamerz
> 'tude here, you are going to find popular opinion going against you.
>
> Not to sound like my father..... when you put down the controller and get a
> job... an actual job, where you contribute something to the economy, you
> will understand why the anti-gamerz attitude is so strong.

The real irony here is that movies were equally hated and feared in the early
1900s when it first started to show potential as a mass media.   Women's
Temperance movements (the same folks who advocated prohibition)  were against
it, very much like soccer moms all scream bloody murder everytime a game looks
innapropriate to them.  Movies back then were seen as low art, entertainment for
the poor and uneducated.  The patriarchal attitude towards movies are now being
repeated on games.    Granted its only been commercially viable for about 30
years, it has achieved very much.  I recently attended the  E3 convention in Los
Angeles held by the IDSA (interactive digital software association) and one
thing it immediately clear,  video games are not toys any more. Or Sony and
Microsoft wouldn't bother.  Nintendo for that matter makes more money off its
games than most Hollywood studios combined.

There's no attitude here man.   OK, there migth have been a little, directed
towards Chris because of his tone but that discussion was winding down anyways.





>
>
> Just a fair, friendly warning to tread carefully here.  Remember, 'tis a
> place to discuss movies.

Yes sir.

>  Tho admittedly, some movies are easily confused
> with video games (and The Matrix comes to mind here... I thought Thirteenth
> Floor had the plot they missed), 'tis best to error on the side of caution.
>  :-)

The Matrix I think is a movie that only people who play videogames or people who
at least understand them can truly appreciate.  The movie makes various
allusions to games and the similarity of the structure between games and the
matrix is not a coincidence.  In the training scene for example where Neo was
put into a simulator, the directors deliberately casted twins to stand in for
the "synthetic crowd".  This is a detail that may puzzle the unintiated or its
probably something that just goes in one end and comes out the other without
much thought being put into it but it was done for a good reason.  Its a well
know fact most games feature a handful of character variations and character
faces are reused hundreds of times to save time and money (there's no way a game
developer can created a thousand, or two thousand orginal characters). Were made
to believe that the person who wrote the simulation program Neo was using got
lazy, or simply didn't have the time to create original characters so he reused
designes again.  There are more, but its little details like this that I
appreciate and so do my peers.

I know for a fact that some people see the stuff in the matrix as mumbo jumbo
made up by the screen writers.   All I have to say is, the Wachowski brothers
know their stuff.

As for limiting my references to video games, you have a totally valid point.
I'll keep it to a minimum or not at all.

Cheers,
Dex


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Re: Picnic At Hanging Rock
Date: 15 Aug 2000 23:53:50 -0700

on 8/15/2000 11:06 PM, Mel Eperthener at [e-mail] wrote:

> As for never finding out what happened to the girls.  Like I said, it was a
> true story.  And one of the mysteries of Australian History.

According to one of the more recent reviews on the Internet Movie Data Base
(www.imdb.com) that's a myth.... although I don't know for sure.

From reading the IMDB comments, I think this movie is more beloved by women
than by men (although my wife hated it too!).  Words like "dreamy" and
"surreal" and "delicate" and "haunting" keep popping up (along with "slow"
and "boring" and "pretentious").   There are overtones (or is it
undertones?) of lesbian dalliances, although nothing very overt.  As I said,
a lot of people think it's just wonderful... but I hated it, for all the
reasons I gave.  I definitely wouldn't recommend it to anyone!


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn (SPOILERS for Reindeer Games at the
Date: 16 Aug 2000 02:53:02 -0400

At 11.35 PM 15/08/2000 -0700, Dexter Sy wrote:
>The real irony here is that movies were equally hated and feared in the early
>1900s when it first started to show potential as a mass media.   Women's
>Temperance movements (the same folks who advocated prohibition)  were against
>it, very much like soccer moms all scream bloody murder everytime a game
looks
>innapropriate to them.  Movies back then were seen as low art,
entertainment for
>the poor and uneducated.  The patriarchal attitude towards movies are now
being
>repeated on games.


Well, there is a learning curve.  And a development curve.  And at the risk
of going completely off-topic myself, you do realise that the game
developers already have systems that could blow what is currently available
away??  But they are milking the current platforms for all they can.

At least with movies and other programming, there was a good, economic
reason for not going to colour sooner.  The equipment was simply too
expensive.  And in the case of television, you had to have colour tellys
before you could do colour programming. (Heck, Australia didn't even start
broadcasting in colour till 1975)   We are seeing the same thing right now
with HDTV.  And just wait till you see a movie like The Matrix on DVD on a
widescreen HDTV telly.  Or any other Effects-laden movie.

(Having said that, I am most impressed with the sound on DVD.  One of my
favourites to watch on DVD is The Big Chill, because of the soundtrack.
Air Force One is also impressive, due to the sound work they did.  On the
other hand, I was very disappointed in Die Hard.  Sounded very tinny)

   Granted its only been commercially viable for about 30
>years, it has achieved very much.

Uh, I think 30 years is being kind.  Heck, Pong only came out in the
mid-to-late 70s.  (Of course, this is coming from someone looking for a
C-64, to access programmes from that time period)



>The Matrix I think is a movie that only people who play videogames or
people who
>at least understand them can truly appreciate.
<SNIP>
>I know for a fact that some people see the stuff in the matrix as mumbo jumbo
>made up by the screen writers.   All I have to say is, the Wachowski brothers
>know their stuff.

Yes, I have to give you that.  For all the pokes at the lack of plot, well
it did do the graphics very well, and did hold your attention.  I have come
to think the greatest crime, worse than bad taste, is being boring.  Heck,
even tho I do agree with a lot Oz had to say, I am sorely disappointed in
movies like Eyes Wide Shut and Eye of the Beholder (OK, Beholder had a LOT
wrong with it:-) and Holy Smoke because the committed the sin of being boring.

Having said that, anyone (Oz??) care to comment on Reindeer Games??
Possibly one of the best movies to discuss here, cause you know, for all
it's flaws, it WILL be number one in video this week.


SPOLIER ALERT!!!!




D
O
N
'T

S
A
Y

I

D
I
D
N
'T

W
A
R
N

Y
A!!!


Really, it's the cliches that got me more than anything.  And how many
times can they make us think someone is dead, only to bring them back??  It
worked in Fatal Attraction.  It worked the first time in about any horror
movie series.  But give it a bloody break now!!!!  Stop throwing red
herrings at us.

I thought the movie had SOME potential, but in it's drive to use EVERY
(yes, EVERY) cliche in the book, it just fell apart for me.

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty     http://www.webz.com/gowanna
mailto:[e-mail]                  mailto:[e-mail]

419 Butler Street
PO Box 95184
Pittsburgh, PA 15223-0184
[phone]                                    [phone]
1-888-45-GOWANNA -- TOLL FREE     (1-888-454-6926)
____________________________________________
"Wow! So that is what all that extra space on the movie screen is
 for!" reaction to  "Gladiator"
______________________________________________


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[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Re: Picnic At Hanging Rock
Date: 16 Aug 2000 02:58:29 -0400

At 11.53 PM 15/08/2000 -0700, David F. Nolan wrote:
>> As for never finding out what happened to the girls.  Like I said, it was a
>> true story.  And one of the mysteries of Australian History.
>
>According to one of the more recent reviews on the Internet Movie Data Base
>(www.imdb.com) that's a myth.... although I don't know for sure.

Well, especially with Australian history, there is a lot of myth and
superstition.  At the risk of going off-topic yet again, there is a new
book out, called In A Sunburned Country by Bill Bryson.  I'm only a few
pages into it, and it has taught me things I didn't know about my own
country.  (And I was practicularly an Australian History major, too)  Not
sure if Hanging Rock is going to be covered, but I will keep you posted.

Book is featured prominently at Borders.  That is how I found out about it,
too.

>
>From reading the IMDB comments, I think this movie is more beloved by women
>than by men (although my wife hated it too!).  Words like "dreamy" and
>"surreal" and "delicate" and "haunting" keep popping up (along with "slow"
>and "boring" and "pretentious").   There are overtones (or is it
>undertones?) of lesbian dalliances, although nothing very overt.  As I said,
>a lot of people think it's just wonderful... but I hated it, for all the
>reasons I gave.  I definitely wouldn't recommend it to anyone!

Lesbian Undertones in an Australian movie??  Say it ain't so:-)

I give to you, as two short examples, Heavenly Creatures (yes, New Zealand,
but remember what I said about Kiwis.... the Canadians of the South
Pacific:-) and Love Serenade (and sisters, too!!)  And that is just two.  I
could name heaps more.

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty     http://www.webz.com/gowanna
mailto:[e-mail]                  mailto:[e-mail]

419 Butler Street
PO Box 95184
Pittsburgh, PA 15223-0184
[phone]                                    [phone]
1-888-45-GOWANNA -- TOLL FREE     (1-888-454-6926)
____________________________________________
"Wow! So that is what all that extra space on the movie screen is
 for!" reaction to  "Gladiator"
______________________________________________


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[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Re: Picnic At Hanging Rock
Date: 16 Aug 2000 02:58:29 -0400

At 11.53 PM 15/08/2000 -0700, David F. Nolan wrote:
>> As for never finding out what happened to the girls.  Like I said, it was a
>> true story.  And one of the mysteries of Australian History.
>
>According to one of the more recent reviews on the Internet Movie Data Base
>(www.imdb.com) that's a myth.... although I don't know for sure.

Well, especially with Australian history, there is a lot of myth and
superstition.  At the risk of going off-topic yet again, there is a new
book out, called In A Sunburned Country by Bill Bryson.  I'm only a few
pages into it, and it has taught me things I didn't know about my own
country.  (And I was practicularly an Australian History major, too)  Not
sure if Hanging Rock is going to be covered, but I will keep you posted.

Book is featured prominently at Borders.  That is how I found out about it,
too.

>
>From reading the IMDB comments, I think this movie is more beloved by women
>than by men (although my wife hated it too!).  Words like "dreamy" and
>"surreal" and "delicate" and "haunting" keep popping up (along with "slow"
>and "boring" and "pretentious").   There are overtones (or is it
>undertones?) of lesbian dalliances, although nothing very overt.  As I said,
>a lot of people think it's just wonderful... but I hated it, for all the
>reasons I gave.  I definitely wouldn't recommend it to anyone!

Lesbian Undertones in an Australian movie??  Say it ain't so:-)

I give to you, as two short examples, Heavenly Creatures (yes, New Zealand,
but remember what I said about Kiwis.... the Canadians of the South
Pacific:-) and Love Serenade (and sisters, too!!)  And that is just two.  I
could name heaps more.

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty     http://www.webz.com/gowanna
mailto:[e-mail]                  mailto:[e-mail]

419 Butler Street
PO Box 95184
Pittsburgh, PA 15223-0184
[phone]                                    [phone]
1-888-45-GOWANNA -- TOLL FREE     (1-888-454-6926)
____________________________________________
"Wow! So that is what all that extra space on the movie screen is
 for!" reaction to  "Gladiator"
______________________________________________


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[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn (SPOILERS for Reindeer Games at theend)
Date: 16 Aug 2000 01:42:00 -0700

> Well, there is a learning curve.  And a development curve.  And at the risk
> of going completely off-topic myself, you do realise that the game
> developers already have systems that could blow what is currently available
> away??  But they are milking the current platforms for all they can.

I can speak with authority on this and say they are :)  The problem right now is
with PC gaming where it seems like theres a new upgrade every six months.
Ridiculous even by today's standards.  A guy who bought a PlayStation in 1995 when
it first came out will only need to upgrade later then year when PlayStation 2 is
released. If they want to.  There's still enough games out there to keep the
average casual gamer occupied until the playstation 2 hits the mass market price
range.  At $300 its hella expensive and Sony's targeting the hardcore technophiles
right now.

>
>
> At least with movies and other programming, there was a good, economic
> reason for not going to colour sooner.  The equipment was simply too
> expensive.  And in the case of television, you had to have colour tellys
> before you could do colour programming. (Heck, Australia didn't even start
> broadcasting in colour till 1975)   We are seeing the same thing right now
> with HDTV.  And just wait till you see a movie like The Matrix on DVD on a
> widescreen HDTV telly.  Or any other Effects-laden movie.

Well, I don't think just because it has a lot of effects its better suited for
HDTV.  I have always hated television for its blurry picture, its intolerable
curvature and its hard headed insistance to be a Square when moving pictures are
in rectangles.  HDTV will fix that and I'm very happy. HDTV also offers higher
resoltuion... something that will definately improve the quality of the picture
for any movie.   The major misconception is that HDTV combined with digital
mediums like DVD brings out more detail hence your reference that it is good for
effects-laden movies.  The thing is, detail is only the means to an end.   With a
sharper picture, the experience itself is closer to the original print since the
picture isn't blurred by the television.  Therefore what people really want isn't
detail, but rather the experience afforded by the amount of detail so that they
may look into a screen with a level of detail so high it can almost pass for a
window and that is afterall what a movie is, a window into a different world.  I'm
also been made aware of the of the idea that the audience is a voyeur looking
through a window, something film scholars often use as a key analytical angle for
film.  So if HDTV helps faciliate that, I'm all for it :o)

>
> (Having said that, I am most impressed with the sound on DVD.  One of my
> favourites to watch on DVD is The Big Chill, because of the soundtrack.
> Air Force One is also impressive, due to the sound work they did.  On the
> other hand, I was very disappointed in Die Hard.  Sounded very tinny)

DVD rocks... and that is that.  :o)

>
>
> Uh, I think 30 years is being kind.  Heck, Pong only came out in the
> mid-to-late 70s.  (Of course, this is coming from someone looking for a
> C-64, to access programmes from that time period)

I'd kill to have a C-64.  I was going to say 20 years when I was writing but I
felt I'd go make it 30 just to be sure.

Games have grown by leaps and bounds as you've alluded to earlier.  You're
undoubtly aware of a film being prepared by Square studios called Final Fantasy.
Very impressive CG work as the entire movie is built in the computer, even the
human characters.    Well, I'm not sure how good that movie is, and I will admit
the teasers seem to hint as a techno feast that doesn't mesh well with the movie's
namesake games, but you should check out the Final Fantasy games. They  are among
a new generation of interactive entertainment that push games on a narritive
level, so much so that the guys at Squaresoft got ambitious and decided to make a
movie :-P  Not to mention Final Fantasy is to Japan culturally what Star Wars is
to Americans.  Actually, Star Wars is pretty big in Japan too, but in anycase, the
FF games are Japans biggest "fantasy/sci-fi" export in the last ten years.

> Yes, I have to give you that.  For all the pokes at the lack of plot, well
> it did do the graphics very well, and did hold your attention.

It's not that simple you see.  I think people need to get over their preconceived
notions about effects. A movie with a lot of effects doesn't mean the effects made
the movie.  Movies like Godzilla failed miserably despite its convincing effects.

I'd be glad to have a discussion with you on the point of plot if you could
articulate what exactly about it you didn't like.  What I liked about the Matrix
was how it was subtly exploring the issues of the digital culture without being
blatant about it.    On the surface, the movie seems to deal with the issue of
"the matrix/the computer system/the synthetic world" on a very superficial level,
similar to  how New York is thrown in as a setting for a movie just because its
New York.   To some audiences, the computer environment may feel like it was just
thrown in as the setting so the directors can have fun with the action sequences.
And that may well be part of the reason.  But in the finished product, there's a
lot of aspects of the film that explores digital culture with an understanding
that is genuine and you know its not going to pull a fast one on the audience.
And trust me its not easy.  I've seen countless TV shows and movies try to pretend
they know the digital culture and fake it. But most people 25 and below can look
at it and knows its just some crappy shit made up to sell to people outside the
culture who are totally clueless.  The Wachowski's must be given credit for the
fact that everything in the Matrix are totally believable and the Matrix itself is
described as a computer program and in that sense, everything the movie pulls,
with one exception, are all technically plausible.   One thing in particular that
impressed me was their choise of  the computer A.I. as the villian in the film.
This may seem like a convinient and impersonal enemy for the audience to hat.
After all, we all kinda hated HAL too.  But while HAL explored the ethical issues
surrounding the right to self preservation with the issue of smart computers
coming in as a distant second, the A.I. creatures in the Matrix like Agent. Smith
(also note his obviously generic name) and his cronies are portrayed as hunters,
anti-virus programs going around the system hunting for bugs in the system.  They
are footsoldiers, programs within a program and they are our enemy for good
reason.  In games, the A.I. is the enemy and they can be seen as the protectors of
the program, trying to defeat the intruders (the human players) from winning  and
hence, taking over the game world or in other words, taking over the matrix.    I
have more to say but I think my hands are about to fall off.



> I have come
> to think the greatest crime, worse than bad taste, is being boring.  Heck,
> even tho I do agree with a lot Oz had to say, I am sorely disappointed in
> movies like Eyes Wide Shut and Eye of the Beholder (OK, Beholder had a LOT
> wrong with it:-) and Holy Smoke because the committed the sin of being boring.

The amazing thing is, audiences agree. Reindeer Games, Eyes Wide Shot and Eye of
the Beholder are all considered bombs.  And the former two were promoted heavily
and hyped up too.  Give the audience and general public some some credit eh?

This is a huge reply,  I am tired. Sorry if I confused anyone.. G'night.

--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Re: Shakespeare
Date: 16 Aug 2000 09:15:00 -0600

> Personally, I think for the first time in a long while, Shakespeare
> is being theatened by the medium of film and other forms of visual
> entertainment.

I must disagree.  Only yesterday, a two-disc Special Edition of TITUS came out
on DVD.  This is a film based on one of Shakespeare's lesser-known plays, and
has received quite a bit of critical acclaim.  In addition, there have been at
least two Shakespeare adaptations for the big screen released this year
(HAMLET and LOVE'S LABOURS LOST).  Shakespearean festivals around the country
continue to sell out.  He isn't going anywhere.  He certainly has a larger
audience than when he was alive.

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Re: OT Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 09:20:00 -0600

> As for the Kiwis, like Campion, Crowe and Sam Neill (I think he's a Kiwi,
> too), well, you gotta understand they WANT to be Australian.... sort of
> like the way Canadians view the Yanks:-)

Canadians do not want to be associated with Americans (for lack of a better
word for those of us living in the US).  Right now there is a beer commercial
that is enormously popular called "My name is Joe" that is all about asserting
Canadian individuality and deflating stereotypes ("I say about, not
'aboot'!").  Another example would be Canadian backpackers in Europe, who sew
Canadian flags on their backpacks so that they aren't mistaken for "Ugly
Amercians."

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Re: Reindeer Games
Date: 16 Aug 2000 09:29:00 -0600

> I thought the movie had SOME potential, but in it's drive to use EVERY
> (yes, EVERY) cliche in the book, it just fell apart for me.

If you think REINDEER GAMES was cliche-driven, wait until you see WHAT LIES
BENEATH.  It makes REINDEER GAMES look like BEING JOHN MALKOVICH in terms of
originality.  There is not one element of that film that isn't derived from an
earlier picture.  And, of course, audiences are raving about it.  *sigh*

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Diane Christy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 10:43:41 -0500

On 8/16/00, 1:48 AM -0400, [e-mail] said so nicely:
>Yes, but the thing is that I'm not talking about the fact that everyone is
>entitled to their opinion (which they are, BTW).  I understand what you're
>saying, but the thing I'm talking about is how Chris calls someone a moron
>for liking something.

My turn to chime in!  Eric, that's his opinion.  He may truly feel
that way.  You may feel that's wrong, but I bet if you asked everyone
on the list whether or not they had some kind of snob attitude (I'm
using this as a descriptive adjective and not as a judgement) toward
people who watch certain kinds of movies there would be these
"opinions" all over the place.  I know I have them.  I have to
realize that I'm operating out of this attitude and suspend it to
give people and the movie a fair shake.  It's just a way of operating
as a human being.  So give your arguing companion a break and let him
have his attitude.  Trying to convince him otherwise doesn't seem to
be getting anywhere.  Oh, and Chris, please don't get the idea I'm
ganging up on you.  I'm not.  I'm just trying to help restore
harmony.  Not everyone agrees with everything all the time, and
that's ok!
--
~~~~~
Diane Christy (Samantha and Joshua's Mom)
Jefferson, LA
http://www.geocities.com/~dchristy10/
mailto:[e-mail]
ICQ #12904700  <dkbc10> on Instant AOL Messenger
~~~~~

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Re: Reindeer Games
Date: 16 Aug 2000 13:32:27 -0400

At 09.29 AM 16/08/2000 -0600, Paul D  Richardson wrote:
>If you think REINDEER GAMES was cliche-driven, wait until you see WHAT LIES
>BENEATH.  It makes REINDEER GAMES look like BEING JOHN MALKOVICH in terms of
>originality.  There is not one element of that film that isn't derived
from an
>earlier picture.  And, of course, audiences are raving about it.  *sigh*
>

Funny you should mention that.  I just had a customer in here trying to
convince me that What Lies Beneath was an excellent film, and I should go
see it.  And I used to respect her opinion, at least until she told me she
didn't like American Beauty:-)

Even worse (which was my position in the discussion just ended) is that
they give away EVERY MAJOR plot point in the trailers.  But I have already
seen rants about this, so I will stop here.

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty     http://www.webz.com/gowanna
mailto:[e-mail]                  mailto:[e-mail]

419 Butler Street
PO Box 95184
Pittsburgh, PA 15223-0184
[phone]                                    [phone]
1-888-45-GOWANNA -- TOLL FREE     (1-888-454-6926)
____________________________________________
"Wow! So that is what all that extra space on the movie screen is
 for!" reaction to  "Gladiator"
______________________________________________


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Re: OT Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 13:39:35 -0400

At 09.20 AM 16/08/2000 -0600, Paul D  Richardson wrote:
>> As for the Kiwis, like Campion, Crowe and Sam Neill (I think he's a Kiwi,
>> too), well, you gotta understand they WANT to be Australian.... sort of
>> like the way Canadians view the Yanks:-)
>
>Canadians do not want to be associated with Americans (for lack of a better
>word for those of us living in the US).

Please don't tell me you really believe that:-)  The commercials and such
are just a backlash.  Besides, it is great fun to ask a Canadian if they
are a Yank.  They get really peeved about the confusion.  However, having
abdicated their culture to the Americans, they have pretty much cast their
lot with the country to the South.

Both countries (Canada and New Zealand) are dependent on their bigger
neighbour for culture and trade.  Both have allowed homegrown culture to
stagnate because of the overwhelming influence of the dominate culture.
And citizens of both countries are moving in droves to the neighbouring
country because of a higher standard of living.  (Kiwis actually can get
more dole money (welfare benefits) from the Australian government than
their own government!!!)  Just like Crowe, Campion, et al are confused for
Australians, I think you would be hard pressed, if given a list of actors,
to tell which are Yanks and which are Canadians (more Canadians than you
realise).

Heck, it is so bad that Canadian movies can't even really be differentated
from US productions.  (There, to get everything back on topic:-)

Having said that, the My Name is Joe spot is one of the funniest things I
have ever seen.  And it is shown in theatres all over Canada.

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty

Please support the endeavour
of a friend and fellow Australian.

Political Corrections by Michael Jaymes Cassidy
http://www.angelfire.com/ma/politicalmusings

______________________________________________
I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death,
your right to say it. -Voltaire (1694-1778)
---


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Jed Cross" <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] bye
Date: 16 Aug 2000 17:07:13 EDT

Okay
Well I am leaving the movies list, bye.


-Jed
MSN messenger: [e-mail]
AIM:jedcross
Yahoo pager: jedcross
ICQ: 83842545

________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Diane Christy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] bye
Date: 16 Aug 2000 16:20:29 -0500

On 8/16/00, 5:07 PM -0400, Jed Cross said so nicely:
>Well I am leaving the movies list, bye.

How come??
--
~~~~~
Diane Christy (Samantha and Joshua's Mom)
Jefferson, LA
http://www.geocities.com/~dchristy10/
mailto:[e-mail]
ICQ #12904700  <dkbc10> on Instant AOL Messenger
~~~~~

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Re: Shakespeare
Date: 16 Aug 2000 17:01:31 -0700

>
> I must disagree.  Only yesterday, a two-disc Special Edition of TITUS came out
> on DVD.  This is a film based on one of Shakespeare's lesser-known plays, and
> has received quite a bit of critical acclaim.  In addition, there have been at
> least two Shakespeare adaptations for the big screen released this year
> (HAMLET and LOVE'S LABOURS LOST).  Shakespearean festivals around the country
> continue to sell out.  He isn't going anywhere.  He certainly has a larger
> audience than when he was alive.

WEll I really don't want to get into a protracted discussion about this.  My main
observation in the e-mail I wrote is that he is being carted off into academia,
for the most part.  The aforementioned films didn't have huge audiences.

that's it.  I'm not saying anything else about it.




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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Re: OT Brains vs. Brawn
Date: 16 Aug 2000 17:10:56 -0700

> Please don't tell me you really believe that:-)  The commercials and such
> are just a backlash.  Besides, it is great fun to ask a Canadian if they
> are a Yank.  They get really peeved about the confusion.  However, having
> abdicated their culture to the Americans, they have pretty much cast their
> lot with the country to the South.

The thing I'd like to say is that Canadians aren't ethnically different from the
Americans.  We all pretty much came from the same place so the part on
abdicating our culture may be a little bit misleading.  I think stories that are
local to Canada, you know, a movie set in Toronoto not Toronto dessed up to be
New York or Vancouver dressed up to be San Francsico  are lacking. I will give
you that much.  But there's so much in common between the two cultures to begin
with its inevitable that the Americans do take over the job of telling some of
the more redundant stories which I'm fine with.   A love Story is a love story,
and its going to be more or less the same whether its in Vancouver or its in
Seattle.  Both cities are practically sister cities.  The thing that I think can
be improved is that more localized movies about Canadians should be made
available.  We don't really need to see another football movie when a hockey
movie may be more fitting.

As for Culture, I'll have to say the relationship between Canada and the U.S. is
more regional in the sense that the western cities have more in common with
their western neighbors down south than they do with cities accross in the
east.  Im fron Vancouver and I can relate to Seattle, San Francisco and Portland
a lot more than I can to New York.  Conversely, my friends from Toronto feel
more at home in the big East Coast cities than they do in the west.    Relatives
from the Canadians plains in Alberta, and Minbota feels more connection with the
folks in Idaho and Montana than they do with us folks here in Vancouver who are
a mountain range away.



--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] 20 replies combined into one blamange.
Date: 17 Aug 2000 14:38:47 -0700

Diane Christy wrote:
>
> My turn to chime in!  Eric, that's his opinion.  He may truly feel
> that way.  You may feel that's wrong, but I bet if you asked everyone
> on the list whether or not they had some kind of snob attitude (I'm
> using this as a descriptive adjective and not as a judgement) toward
> people who watch certain kinds of movies there would be these
> "opinions" all over the place.  I know I have them.

Well said, and they're valid, even if they're about you yourself.
Personally I like to know if someone thinks I'm a moron, rather than
have them smile and keep it to themselves. So in a way, Eric, I'm
doing you a favour. And it's nothing personal. Anyone who is into
Pokemon I consider to be a moron. That's just the way it is. I
thought all those kids who invested thousands in baseball cards a
few years back were morons too, and I think history proved me right
on that one.

> Oh, and Chris, please don't get the idea I'm
> ganging up on you.  I'm not.  I'm just trying to help restore
> harmony.  Not everyone agrees with everything all the time, and
> that's ok!

How right you are, missus! Next reply:

Mel Eperthener wrote:
>
> Uh, I think 30 years is being kind.  Heck, Pong only came out in the
> mid-to-late 70s.  (Of course, this is coming from someone looking for a
> C-64, to access programmes from that time period)

I just sold a C-64. Got an Intellivision somewhere if you're looking
for one of those. In fact, I have a Hanimex Pong system that my dad
bought me in 1977 and still works. Pong, Atari, Intellivision, C-64,
Apple ][ clone, 286 clone, 386, 486-33, pentium.. it's been a steady
progression in technological upgrades throughout my life. The
problems Playstation people have with continually needing to upgrade
have been with us many many years. And console systems are more
prone to this than computers, because computers can be built on.
Consoles need to be replaced. They own your ass...

> Having said that, anyone (Oz??) care to comment on Reindeer Games??
> Possibly one of the best movies to discuss here, cause you know, for all
> it's flaws, it WILL be number one in video this week.

Umm, I'm not allowed to slag this flick off publicly. Someone I know
who is close to it (to say the least) would get mighty peed off with
me and, to be fair, there were external forces that stopped this
film from being what it was originally intended to be. Cryptic
enough? Good. Figure it out yourself.

Next!

"David F. Nolan" wrote:
>
> A month-old baby will
> watch anything that moves; to him it's "entertainment" --- fascinating,
> thrilling, etc.  As we grow older, our standards rise -- from "anything
> bright and shiny" to Teletubbies, to Barney, Rugrats, Pokemon, Martin
> Lawrence and on up the scale.  So unless you know something about the source
> of an opinion, it's of little value.

Trust Davey boy to put in one paragraph what's taken me four days to
get across. By all means, love Big Momma's House, just understand
that you're at the bottom end of the spectrum when doing so, and
will be dubbed a goof by people who expect more.

Should you be labelled? Probably not. Will you be anyway? Oh yeah.

> Along those lines, I will take issue with Mel Eperthener's assertion that
> "Picnic At Hanging Rock" is a good movie.  I realize that a lot of "serious"
> critics agree with him, but I thought it was awful ... one of the worst
> movies I've ever watched.

I have to disagree here. If watched in the context of the time it
was made, Picnic has to be seen as a wonder. It's like watching
Citizen Kane and saying "I don't get all the fuss." You have to
realise the things that, at the time it was made, made this film
genius. Never before had sets included ceilings. Never had the
camera moved in such a way. If seen in today's terms, Kane is a good
movie, but if seen in terms of what film was back then it's a
masterpiece. Such is the way with Picnic. If we compare it to films
like Sixth Sense that use all of today's tricks, it's easy to
denigrate. But if seen as a mid 70's spooky-art film that manages to
portray the spooks through nothing more than sound, atmosphere and
inference, it's a real achievement. A Blair Witch for the 70's?
Let's not go there.

Next!

Dexter Sy wrote:
>
> In his synopsis for his latest book,  "I hated, hated, hated This Movie"
> Ebert wrote
> "The easiest movies to write about are always the ones at the extremes. Good and
> bad movies dictate their own reviews; those in the middle are more of a
> challenge."

Certainly they are. Any critic can tell you this. Middle range
movies are a challenge because there's nothing to say other than
blah. To me, blah is a fail. I'll agree I have harder views than
most and when rating a movie I tend to start from zero stars and
make the film earn each star it gets, whereas many other critics
start with five and take one off every time something is awful. I
can't abide by that.
To me, movies are far too expensive. For a family of four to hit the
flicks, the average dad has to set aside $60 or more. The filmmaker,
in my opinion, needs to consider this when making the film. They
need to ask if what they are making is going to be worth that money,
or is it going to be a strictly commercial exercise aimed at
extracting that cash in the quickest possible way? To me, if a film
is like Return To Me, strictly by the numbers, never trying anything
new, just churning out a product with some names attached, that's
bordering on criminal. And when people accept that as "okay" because
it's not awful as such, just not very good, it really annoys me.

It's not that hard to at least try to be original. You don't have to
succeed, you don't have to make a Being John Malkovich, you just
need to try. If I see a film like Tim Roth's The War Zone, which
tries something really difficult and botches it up, I'll give that
film a ton more cred than something like Big Momma's House, a film
that just follows already proven formulas, hits the lowest rung in
every department, tries absolutely nothing different and is
basically engineered to seperate us from our cash in such a way that
we don't complain.

> Borrowing from Ebert,  "I hated, hated, hated Snobs"

You have to understand, there's degrees of snobbery. Is Ebert a snob
when he says his favourite film is Battleship Potempkin (a Russian
film from early in the century)? Am I a snob when I say Big Momma's
House is sludge? I don't think so. Both opinions are not only valid,
but probably in the majority. In my eyes, a snob is someone who
won't see a film without subtitles, or who can't enjoy a good action
film just because it's an action film. A snob is also someone who
won't go and see a movie BECAUSE it has subtitles, or because it
doesn't star anyone he/she knows by name.

We're all snobs for something. I'm a snob against crap. I hate,
hate, hate crap. If you love, love, love crap, we're going to be on
a different page. To be fair, I think more often than not we'll be
in agreeance. I don't automatically dislike something because it's
low-grade. I saw Loser last night and, aside from an ending that
came out of nowhere and some of the most out of place music I've
ever witnessed in a film, it was a pretty enjoyable tame sort of a
flick. Would I consider it crap? Mostly. Would I say it occupies the
middle ground? Almost. Would I consider someone who gave it five
stars a moron? Most definitely.

If that now means some of you are morons in my eyes and you object
to that... life's tough. Wear a helmet.

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] 20 replies combined into one blamange.
Date: 17 Aug 2000 01:06:08 EDT

In a message dated 08/16/2000 9:28:50 PM Pacific Daylight Time,=20
[e-mail] writes:

<< Well said, and they're valid, even if they're about you yourself.
 Personally I like to know if someone thinks I'm a moron, rather than
 have them smile and keep it to themselves. So in a way, Eric, I'm
 doing you a favour. And it's nothing personal. Anyone who is into
 Pokemon I consider to be a moron. That's just the way it is. I
 thought all those kids who invested thousands in baseball cards a
 few years back were morons too, and I think history proved me right
 on that one. >>

Yes, I suppose they're valid opinions, but I just never have seen the sense=20
in judging anything but a person's taste in movies by the movies they like o=
r=20
don't like.  And, with the baseball card remark, if you must know, I gave up=
=20
on Pok=E9mon cards a long time ago when I realized I was never going to be=20
interested in playing the card game.  My liking of Pok=E9mon stems from the=20
videogame.  I originally thought the anime series was for the Pok=E9mon crow=
d=20
that was under 6.  I don't know how I got into it so easily, but I thought i=
t=20
was surprisingly good.  All I can say is that it's for the fans of the game.
As for your comments on "TV watchers," I know that movies work on different=20
levels.  Believe me on that one.  I know there are differences between the=20
kind of entertainment that is Forrest Gump to the kind that is Frasier.  I=20
think TV shows that go to film are getting a rather bad rap because people=20
assume that they don't know how to successfully translate something to the=20
big screen.  The only movie I think of as more of a long television episode=20
is Pocket Monsters: Revelation Lugia (known as Pok=E9mon the Movie 2000 here=
),=20
which didn't have the greatest plot or villain, but was a lot of fun for fan=
s=20
of the series.  Two movies I'd think of that made a rather successful=20
translation to movie theaters were South Park: Bigger, Longer, and Uncut=20
(brilliant move on making it a musical as well) and Pocket Monsters: Mewtwo'=
s=20
Revenge (villain is a breath of fresh air from the rather cliche "all=20
powerful wants to take over the world villain" that Warner Bros. turned him=20
into).  My $.02 on that issue.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] 20 replies combined into one blamange.
Date: 16 Aug 2000 23:28:12 -0700

>  The
> problems Playstation people have with continually needing to upgrade
> have been with us many many years. And console systems are more
> prone to this than computers, because computers can be built on.
> Consoles need to be replaced. They own your ass...

Actually given PlayStation now cost $99 and have at or under $200 for most of its
lifespan, its at a price no computers can beat.  You get a  lot of processing bang for
your buck and people can bear replacing a PlayStation because its cheap.  What can you
get for $99, or lets be fair and assume I bought one several years ago at the higher
$200 price range.  At the price, I won't be getting much of a computer I'll tell you
that.

Anyways, this is way out of the movie discussion, but Microsoft has decided to enter
the console business for one thing and one thing only. Consoles won.
--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] 20 replies combined into one blamange.
Date: 16 Aug 2000 23:31:44 -0700

> <snip>
> I just never have seen the sense in judging anything but a person's taste in
> movies by the movies they like or  don't like.

> My liking of PokΘmon stems from the
> videogame.  I originally thought the anime series was for the PokΘmon crowd
> that was under 6.  I don't know how I got into it so easily, but I thought it
> was surprisingly good.  All I can say is that it's for the fans of the game.
> As for your comments on "TV watchers," I know that movies work on different
> levels.  Believe me on that one.  I know there are differences between the
> kind of entertainment that is Forrest Gump to the kind that is Frasier.  I
> think TV shows that go to film are getting a rather bad rap because people
> assume that they don't know how to successfully translate something to the
> big screen.

Sorry Eric, had to snip 2/3 of your reply so that my reply isn't buried six feet
under yours.

I can't really speak on behalf of PokΘmon because it is my understanding that
even in Japan, the cartoons are created as tie-ins to the video games so the
story is going to sound really convulted, lame and outright cryptic to most
people who aren't into PokΘmon.

end transmission... :)
--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] 20 replies combined into one blamange.
Date: 16 Aug 2000 23:36:34 -0700

>
> We're all snobs for something. I'm a snob against crap. I hate,
> hate, hate crap.

Fair enough.  I deleted most of your post because I thought its best to make it
brief.  I think the positions are well drawn out now.

Very cool discussion.


--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] FESTEN - ( The Celebration)
Date: 17 Aug 2000 12:45:37 +0100


    Saw "Festen" for the first time on Tuesday night, I absolutely
loved it.  I thought the whole Dogme 95 process created a wonderfully
vibrant vision, and the story was thoroughly original and entertaining.

    Lars Von Triers' "The Idiots" is on on Saturday, can't wait.

    MARK

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: [MV] The Simpsons go to Hollywood
Date: 17 Aug 2000 15:25:07 EDT

In a recent news report from IMDb, it was stated that Matt Groening is
producing a Simpsons movie.  I know we've been having discussions on TV to
movie, so I thought this one would be good to ask about.  So, what's the
first impression on this one?  Excited or skeptical?
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] RE: The Simpsons go to Hollywood
Date: 17 Aug 2000 14:19:00 -0600

> In a recent news report from IMDb, it was stated that Matt Groening is
> producing a Simpsons movie.  I know we've been having discussions on TV to
> movie, so I thought this one would be good to ask about.  So, what's the
> first impression on this one?  Excited or skeptical?

Well, rumors about a "Simpsons" movie have been around for 10 years, so I'm
not expecting to see anything anytime soon.  I will say that any given 22
minute episode of "The Simpsons" is funnier than any given recent 90 minute
comedy.  However, I'm not sure that "The Simpsons" could substain a 90-minute
story.  They've only done one 44 minute story ("Who Shot Mister Burns") in the
entire run of the show.  If a movie ever is released, which I doubt, I'd go
see it...but I'd rather watch the show for free!

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Blacknight <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Master and Apprentice (was In Memory of Sir AlecGuiness)
Date: 18 Aug 2000 11:54:23 -0700



Dexter Sy wrote:

> >
> > Used to watch this anime. In English, it is called Samurai X.
>
> I never knew that.  But then again, I prefer to watch Japanese films and
> animation in its native language.
>

I might go into that, of course I want to compare the original and the
translation. I will buy some manga comics and try to read them when I go to
Japan this year. Speaking of anime, my favorite would be the Robotech series
when I was a kid, I had palpitations whenever I missed an episode. Never got
to see it in its entirety and there were the spinoffs and I guess I lost
interest after.

blacknight


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Blacknight <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Shakespeare
Date: 18 Aug 2000 11:58:21 -0700



Dexter Sy wrote:

> That's what I've heard :) My experience with Shakespeare is pretty much only as deep as
> what I was taught in school. Mainly  4 plays....  Romeo and Juliet, Midsummer night's
> Dream, MacBeth, Taming of the Shrew.
>

I taught myself how to read Shakespeare after watching Baz Luhrmann's Romeo and Juliet.
Maybe because I have never seen a real Shakespeare play that is why I appreciate any movie
adaptations of the Bard.

blacknight


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Gene Ehrich <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Apes
Date: 20 Aug 2000 19:45:49 -0400

We received our new 6 DVD set of the Planet of The Apes series yesterday
and today we watched the first movie on our large screen TV. We were
delighted that the movie was shown is letterbox format. Great copy, great
movie, great science fiction. It makes all kinds of statements about our
current society. We greatly look forward to watching the other four movies
and then the sixth DVD with all of the tours, interviews and out-takes. The
cover of the first DVD gives away the surprise ending of the first film for
anyone who has not seen the movie before.

After watching the film and then a current political show we had an
interesting discussion. We thought it would be fun to see how you would
answer the same question if you like.

If you had to assign one of todays political parties to each of the species
in the movie which party would be assigned to each of the following?

Gorilla =
Orangutang =
Chimpanzee =
Human =



-----------------

[e-mail]
[e-mail]
P.O. Box 3365   Spring Hill Florida   34611-3365

http://www.voicenet.com/~generic
Computer & Video Game Garage Sale






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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Apes
Date: 21 Aug 2000 01:53:06 -0400

At 07.45 PM 20/08/2000 -0400, Gene Ehrich wrote:
> The
>cover of the first DVD gives away the surprise ending of the first film for
>anyone who has not seen the movie before.

Well, if you are referring to what I THINK you are referring to (the
"discovery" that Heston makes at the end).... it was on the video cover,
too (released back in 1997 or 98)... at this point, it may very well no
longer be a spoiler.

Speaking of Spoilers, and the recent comments on how movies such as What
Lies Beneath have their plots ruined by the trailers, I have read at least
two recent op/ed type pieces in the paper that point out what CBS has done
with Survivour is just amazing.  The show has pretty much been done since
the first episode aired, winner was decided MONTHS ago, and try as they
might, no one has been able to conclusively ruin the surprise of who
won.... yet.  (Tho there are rumours, nothing concrete).  In today's
society, would the surprise of The Crying Game remain a surprise today??
How rare is it that a movie like The Sixth Sense can surprise anyone??  --
NB, someone RUINED the damn movie for me by telling the major plot
point!!!!!!)
>

>After watching the film and then a current political show we had an
>interesting discussion. We thought it would be fun to see how you would
>answer the same question if you like.
>
>If you had to assign one of todays political parties to each of the species
>in the movie which party would be assigned to each of the following?

NEVER discuss politics or religion.:-)  Having said that, I will not touch
the first two, except to say that the party you follow are the Orangutangs
(as they tend to be smarter:-) and the opposing party are teh Gorillas,
wanting to effect great changes (throwing their weight around like a 500lb
gorilla - groan!!)

>
>Gorilla =
>Orangutang =
>Chimpanzee =  They throw the faeces around and scream alot.  Yep, must be
the Reform party:-)

>Human =  Hopelessly out of date and left behind by changes - hmm, all I
can think of (that is safe:-) are the Whigs

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty     http://www.webz.com/gowanna
mailto:[e-mail]                  mailto:[e-mail]

419 Butler Street
PO Box 95184
Pittsburgh, PA 15223-0184
[phone]                                    [phone]
1-888-45-GOWANNA -- TOLL FREE     (1-888-454-6926)
____________________________________________
"Wow! So that is what all that extra space on the movie screen is
 for!" reaction to  "Gladiator"
______________________________________________


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] X-Men and Soldier
Date: 21 Aug 2000 11:19:29 +0100


    X-Men opened here in the U.K. on Friday, and I saw it yesterday
- it was o.k., not groundbreaking, and I didn't get the feel with it
that I did when I watched the first Batman.  However, that's not to say
I didn't enjoy it, I did, and I will now await the next part of the
franchise to see how the story unfolds.

    The Kurt Russell film "Soldier" was on our digital movie channel
last night, now in my time I have watched some crap, (Wild, Wild West
anyone?), but after 45 minutes I did something that I haven't done in
god knows how long, I turned it off.  It dragged along at a snails pace
and I couldn't see where it was going.  I felt dirty after watching
those 45 minutes.  Kurt Russell's stupid "constipated" look just
compounded things for me.  Truly a waste of my time and of film that
could have been used for printing anything else on.

    My advice - Avoid like a bag lady covered in boils.

    MARK

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Recommendations?
Date: 21 Aug 2000 11:22:17 +0100

    Well, after 30 years of my life going by I finally fly out to
the States on Wednesday for 2 weeks swanning around california and then
a week in Maui.  I know I am going to definitely seek out The Hollow Man
whilst I am over there, does anyone have any suggestions on any other
films that haven't opened in the U.K. yet that I can see on my travels.

    MARK

    P.S. Eric - DON'T YOU DARE SUGGEST THE 2ND POKEMON FILM!!!  :-)

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Source - Richard" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] X-Men and Soldier
Date: 21 Aug 2000 11:21:28 +0100

I too saw X-Men at the weekend and was relieved to discover that at last
we have another comic book adaptation to stand alongside Batman (first
film) and Superman (one and two).

It is true to its heritage and for once let me inside the pain and
insecurity of the characters. OK, so maybe it concentrated a little too much on
setting up a sequel, but hey - bring it on!

As for Soldier - haven't seen it, don't want to see it, don't care!

MARK wrote:
>
>    X-Men opened here in the U.K. on Friday, and I saw it yesterday
>- it was o.k., not groundbreaking, and I didn't get the feel with it
>that I did when I watched the first Batman.  However, that's not to say
>I didn't enjoy it, I did, and I will now await the next part of the
>franchise to see how the story unfolds.
>
>    The Kurt Russell film "Soldier" was on our digital movie channel
>last night, now in my time I have watched some crap, (Wild, Wild West
>anyone?), but after 45 minutes I did something that I haven't done in
>god knows how long, I turned it off.  It dragged along at a snails pace
>and I couldn't see where it was going.  I felt dirty after watching
>those 45 minutes.  Kurt Russell's stupid "constipated" look just
>compounded things for me.  Truly a waste of my time and of film that
>could have been used for printing anything else on.
>
>    My advice - Avoid like a bag lady covered in boils.
>
>    MARK
>
>[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Recommendations?
Date: 21 Aug 2000 08:35:01 EDT

In a message dated 08/21/2000 3:04:05 AM Pacific Daylight Time,=20
[e-mail] writes:

<<  Well, after 30 years of my life going by I finally fly out to
 the States on Wednesday for 2 weeks swanning around california and then
 a week in Maui.  I know I am going to definitely seek out The Hollow Man
 whilst I am over there, does anyone have any suggestions on any other
 films that haven't opened in the U.K. yet that I can see on my travels.
=20
    MARK
=20
    P.S. Eric - DON'T YOU DARE SUGGEST THE 2ND POKEMON FILM!!!  :-) >>

Well, Pok=E9mon is playing and... :-).  OK, seriously, I'd suggest going to=20=
see=20
Space Cowboys.  Not very historically accurate (not that it claims to be),=20
but very fun.  I'm not really sure if that one's opened in the UK or not yet=
,=20
but I assume it isn't.  How long does it usually take?
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] Recommendations?
Date: 21 Aug 2000 14:05:20 +0100

Not opened here yet, I think it opens end sep, early oct.

> -----Original Message-----
> From:    [e-mail] [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> Sent:    21 August 2000 13:35
> To:    [e-mail]
> Subject:    Re: [MV] Recommendations?
>=20
> In a message dated 08/21/2000 3:04:05 AM Pacific Daylight Time,=20
> [e-mail] writes:
>=20
> <<  Well, after 30 years of my life going by I finally fly out to
>  the States on Wednesday for 2 weeks swanning around california and
> then
>  a week in Maui.  I know I am going to definitely seek out The Hollow
> Man
>  whilst I am over there, does anyone have any suggestions on any =
other
>  films that haven't opened in the U.K. yet that I can see on my
> travels.
> =20
>     MARK
> =20
>     P.S. Eric - DON'T YOU DARE SUGGEST THE 2ND POKEMON FILM!!!  :-) =
>>
>=20
> Well, Pok=E9mon is playing and... :-).  OK, seriously, I'd suggest =
going
> to see=20
> Space Cowboys.  Not very historically accurate (not that it claims to
> be),=20
> but very fun.  I'm not really sure if that one's opened in the UK or
> not yet,=20
> but I assume it isn't.  How long does it usually take?
> -Eric-
>=20
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] THE CELL/BUT I'M A CHEERLEADER
Date: 21 Aug 2000 10:01:00 -0600

I managed to catch two theatrical releases over the weekend.  Here are some
brief thoughts:

THE CELL -- Remember your prom date?  You know, the one that looked pretty or
handsome but didn't have much going on upstairs?  Well, THE CELL is just like
that.  Outstanding visuals, but not much else.  I half expected the booming
voice of the director to say "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!"
 The visuals alone are reason enough for me to recommend the film...they are
that good.  Unfortunately, there aren't enough of them, and the film keeps
returning us to the "real world" where the acting and storyline are only so-so.

As a side note, poor Dylan Baker!  I had a very hard time shaking my image of
him from HAPPINESS, even though he plays a nice guy in this film.  It didn't
help that this film deals a bit with child molestation.

BUT I'M A CHEERLEADER -- This is a highly enjoyable comedy, but it's clearly
not for all tastes.  Not to be confused with the Kirsten Dunst vehicle BRING
IT ON, this film deals with a cheerleader who is sent to camp to cure her
"lesbian tenancies," even though she insists (even to herself) that she is
straight.  Hilarity ensues at the camp when she does in fact find her true
identity, but it's not what her parents had hoped for...

This film is preaching to the choir, and is not going to change any opinions
(in other words, homophobes stay away!)  The characters are two dimensional at
best, and some of the jokes fall flat.  However I still recommend it as a
funny, refreshing comedy.  Special note: seeing this film marks the first time
that I've ever been the only male in a theater.

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Diane Christy <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Straight Story
Date: 21 Aug 2000 14:25:52 -0500

Anyone see "The Straight Story"?  I thought it was wonderful!!
--
~~~~~
Diane Christy (Samantha and Joshua's Mom)
Jefferson, LA
http://www.geocities.com/diane507/
mailto:[e-mail]
ICQ #12904700  <dkbc10> on Instant AOL Messenger
~~~~~

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: [MV] Gattaca
Date: 21 Aug 2000 15:11:53 -0500

Gattaca was rented this weekend by mistake and I was pleasantly surprised
that I liked it.
Set in the "not too distant Future" starring Ethan Hawke, Uma Thurman and
Jude Law.
Ethan Hawke is Vincent who is conceived naturally in a world where parents
can choose only the best of their genes. Vincent is born with a weak heart.
His parents choose the other method for his younger brother.
Vincent dreams of a career in space but he is an In-Valid blood type so he
settles for a job as a janitor at the space center Gattaca.
Frustrated, he contacts a man who will help him switch identities with a
Valid blood type, Jerome. Jerome has everything it takes to be in the
Gattaca program but he is paralyzed. The methods these two use to become
each other are facinating and the moments I thought they would surely get
caught kept me on edge.




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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "jaybob" <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Re: [film] Gattaca
Date: 21 Aug 2000 14:08:49 -0700


----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 1:11 PM

   I am gald yu liked this lil gem of a sci fi flic. It sure was   a
pleasant suprise from the usual  special effect movies with skimpy stories.
Igave a  ***1/2  rating,

Thanks
'
Jay Harris





> Gattaca was rented this weekend by mistake and I was pleasantly surprised
> that I liked it.
> Set in the "not too distant Future" starring Ethan Hawke, Uma Thurman and
> Jude Law.
> Ethan Hawke is Vincent who is conceived naturally in a world where parents
> can choose only the best of their genes. Vincent is born with a weak
heart.
> His parents choose the other method for his younger brother.
> Vincent dreams of a career in space but he is an In-Valid blood type so he
> settles for a job as a janitor at the space center Gattaca.
> Frustrated, he contacts a man who will help him switch identities with a
> Valid blood type, Jerome. Jerome has everything it takes to be in the
> Gattaca program but he is paralyzed. The methods these two use to become
> each other are facinating and the moments I thought they would surely get
> caught kept me on edge.
>
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------<e|-
> Failed tests, classes skipped, forgotten locker combinations.
> Remember the good 'ol days
> http://click.egroups.com/1/8012/9/_/15561/_/966888653/
> --------------------------------------------------------------------|e>-
>
>
>


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Garrett Winters <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] FESTEN - ( The Celebration)
Date: 21 Aug 2000 22:58:52 +0100

on 17/8/2000 12:45, MARK at [e-mail] wrote:

> Saw "Festen" for the first time on Tuesday night, I absolutely
> loved it.  I thought the whole Dogme 95 process created a wonderfully
> vibrant vision, and the story was thoroughly original and entertaining.
>
> Lars Von Triers' "The Idiots" is on on Saturday, can't wait.

I caught a bit of Festen the other night, strange film indeed but watchable.
( mostly to see where it was going) the woman who played the sister was also
in the Idiots as the woman who comes to look at the house. I thought the
whole plot for the Idiots was pathetic, I'm sure I could do better in my
sleep.
Garrett


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Garrett Winters <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] The Simpsons go to Hollywood
Date: 21 Aug 2000 22:58:53 +0100

on 17/8/2000 20:25, [e-mail] at [e-mail] wrote:

> In a recent news report from IMDb, it was stated that Matt Groening is
> producing a Simpsons movie.  I know we've been having discussions on TV to
> movie, so I thought this one would be good to ask about.  So, what's the
> first impression on this one?  Excited or skeptical?
> -Eric-

I'm hoping that this film will set the standard for animated feature films
to come but only if the story is up to the animation ( which I'm sure will
be fantastic on the big screen). I'm hoping for an epic story, a
rollercoaster adventure story like Indiana jones et al. judicious use of
time travel would be a great way to see future versions of the family and if
really clever they could go forward 1000 years and run into Fry and co. from
futurama. Homer should be the star of the film and every character from the
series should be used, maybe even a cameo from all the dear departed (
bleeding gums, dr. monroe, maude flanders).
I don't know how anyone can be skeptical about it as they have had over a
decade to hone their writing skills and now is the perfect time to come out
with it as can be seen by the success of several animated films in the last
few years.
and for those who even doubt it being made a recent interview with groening
made it clear that it is well under way.
Garrett


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Straight Story
Date: 21 Aug 2000 20:32:04 EDT

In a message dated 08/21/2000 12:26:44 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< Anyone see "The Straight Story"?  I thought it was wonderful!! >>

Had the chance when flying to Seatle on a choir trip (in flight movie), but,
at that time, found myself more interested in Zelda.  I might see it in the
future.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] The Simpsons go to Hollywood
Date: 21 Aug 2000 20:41:10 EDT

In a message dated 08/21/2000 3:00:07 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< I don't know how anyone can be skeptical about it as they have had over a
 decade to hone their writing skills and now is the perfect time to come out
 with it as can be seen by the success of several animated films in the last
 few years.
 And for those who even doubt it being made a recent interview with Groening
 made it clear that it is well under way.
 Garrett >>

Personally, I'm not too skeptical about it.  Cartoon sitcoms have not made
many movies.  The only other one I can think of is South Park, which was very
funny.  I wouldn't count The Flintstones, since they were made in real life
(pretty bad movies, too).  If The Simpsons sticks to animation (ha, is there
any doubt about that happening?), I think they could succeed very well.  As
for the Futurama tie in, I think they should stick to the Simpsons characters
and just make a separate Futurama movie.
-Eric-

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] FESTEN - ( The Celebration)
Date: 22 Aug 2000 09:15:30 +0100

After enjoying Festen, I missed The Idiots on Saturday, will have to
wait now to see it.

MARK

> -----Original Message-----
> From:    Garrett Winters [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> Sent:    21 August 2000 22:59
> To:    [e-mail]
> Subject:    Re: [MV] FESTEN - ( The Celebration)
>
> on 17/8/2000 12:45, MARK at [e-mail] wrote:
>
> > Saw "Festen" for the first time on Tuesday night, I absolutely
> > loved it.  I thought the whole Dogme 95 process created a
> wonderfully
> > vibrant vision, and the story was thoroughly original and
> entertaining.
> >
> > Lars Von Triers' "The Idiots" is on on Saturday, can't wait.
>
> I caught a bit of Festen the other night, strange film indeed but
> watchable.
> ( mostly to see where it was going) the woman who played the sister
> was also
> in the Idiots as the woman who comes to look at the house. I thought
> the
> whole plot for the Idiots was pathetic, I'm sure I could do better in
> my
> sleep.
> Garrett
>
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "geeg23" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] FESTEN - ( The Celebration)
Date: 22 Aug 2000 09:41:28 +0100

Why don't you just rent the video!

Gerry T.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: 22 August 2000 09:15


> After enjoying Festen, I missed The Idiots on Saturday, will have to
> wait now to see it.
>
> MARK
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Garrett Winters [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> > Sent: 21 August 2000 22:59
> > To: [e-mail]
> > Subject: Re: [MV] FESTEN - ( The Celebration)
> >
> > on 17/8/2000 12:45, MARK at [e-mail] wrote:
> >
> > > Saw "Festen" for the first time on Tuesday night, I absolutely
> > > loved it.  I thought the whole Dogme 95 process created a
> > wonderfully
> > > vibrant vision, and the story was thoroughly original and
> > entertaining.
> > >
> > > Lars Von Triers' "The Idiots" is on on Saturday, can't wait.
> >
> > I caught a bit of Festen the other night, strange film indeed but
> > watchable.
> > ( mostly to see where it was going) the woman who played the sister
> > was also
> > in the Idiots as the woman who comes to look at the house. I thought
> > the
> > whole plot for the Idiots was pathetic, I'm sure I could do better in
> > my
> > sleep.
> > Garrett
> >
> >
> > [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> > [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] FESTEN - ( The Celebration)
Date: 22 Aug 2000 10:21:14 +0100

I will, but until I rent it I will HAVE TO WAIT :)

> -----Original Message-----
> From:    geeg23 [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> Sent:    22 August 2000 09:41
> To:    [e-mail]
> Subject:    Re: [MV] FESTEN - ( The Celebration)
>
> Why don't you just rent the video!
>
> Gerry T.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "MARK" <[e-mail]>
> To: <[e-mail]>
> Sent: 22 August 2000 09:15
> Subject: RE: [MV] FESTEN - ( The Celebration)
>
>
> > After enjoying Festen, I missed The Idiots on Saturday, will have to
> > wait now to see it.
> >
> > MARK
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Garrett Winters [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> > > Sent: 21 August 2000 22:59
> > > To: [e-mail]
> > > Subject: Re: [MV] FESTEN - ( The Celebration)
> > >
> > > on 17/8/2000 12:45, MARK at [e-mail] wrote:
> > >
> > > > Saw "Festen" for the first time on Tuesday night, I absolutely
> > > > loved it.  I thought the whole Dogme 95 process created a
> > > wonderfully
> > > > vibrant vision, and the story was thoroughly original and
> > > entertaining.
> > > >
> > > > Lars Von Triers' "The Idiots" is on on Saturday, can't wait.
> > >
> > > I caught a bit of Festen the other night, strange film indeed but
> > > watchable.
> > > ( mostly to see where it was going) the woman who played the
> sister
> > > was also
> > > in the Idiots as the woman who comes to look at the house. I
> thought
> > > the
> > > whole plot for the Idiots was pathetic, I'm sure I could do better
> in
> > > my
> > > sleep.
> > > Garrett
> > >
> > >
> > > [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe
> ]
> > > [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]
> ]
> >
> > [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> > [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
> >
>
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: MARK <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] The Simpsons go to Hollywood
Date: 22 Aug 2000 10:40:28 +0100

The Simpsons doesn't need to even make a nod to Futurama.  The Simpsons
is still consistently funny after 10 years and multiple viewings, so why
it should accede to Futurama is puzzling.  Homer and Co. manage to keep
the programme fresh and funnier than any sitcom there has ever been on
the t.v.  I live for "Homerisms" that man is a god.

Mark Dainty

Email: mailto:[e-mail]
Website: http://www.monkeydonkey.itgo.com



> -----Original Message-----
> From:    [e-mail] [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> Sent:    22 August 2000 01:41
> To:    [e-mail]
> Subject:    Re: [MV] The Simpsons go to Hollywood
>
> In a message dated 08/21/2000 3:00:07 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> [e-mail] writes:
>
> << I don't know how anyone can be skeptical about it as they have had
> over a
>  decade to hone their writing skills and now is the perfect time to
> come out
>  with it as can be seen by the success of several animated films in
> the last
>  few years.
>  And for those who even doubt it being made a recent interview with
> Groening
>  made it clear that it is well under way.
>  Garrett >>
>
> Personally, I'm not too skeptical about it.  Cartoon sitcoms have not
> made
> many movies.  The only other one I can think of is South Park, which
> was very
> funny.  I wouldn't count The Flintstones, since they were made in real
> life
> (pretty bad movies, too).  If The Simpsons sticks to animation (ha, is
> there
> any doubt about that happening?), I think they could succeed very
> well.  As
> for the Futurama tie in, I think they should stick to the Simpsons
> characters
> and just make a separate Futurama movie.
> -Eric-
>
> [ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
> [ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Apes
Date: 22 Aug 2000 14:31:01 -0700

Gene Ehrich wrote:
>
> If you had to assign one of todays political parties to each of the species
> in the movie which party would be assigned to each of the following?

I prefer assigning individuals.

Gorilla = Hillary Clinton
Orangutang = George Bush Jr
Chimpanzee = Bill Clinton
Human = Bill Bradley (and that's why he didn't get the nomination)

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] Apes
Date: 22 Aug 2000 17:04:24 EDT

In a message dated 08/22/2000 1:08:36 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< I prefer assigning individuals.

 Gorilla = Hillary Clinton
 Orangutang = George Bush Jr
 Chimpanzee = Bill Clinton
 Human = Bill Bradley (and that's why he didn't get the nomination) >>

As another person said, please, no politics on this list.

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Garrett Winters <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] The Simpsons go to Hollywood
Date: 23 Aug 2000 00:17:57 +0100

on 22/8/2000 10:40, MARK at [e-mail] wrote:

> The Simpsons doesn't need to even make a nod to Futurama.  The Simpsons
> is still consistently funny after 10 years and multiple viewings, so why
> it should accede to Futurama is puzzling.  Homer and Co. manage to keep
> the programme fresh and funnier than any sitcom there has ever been on
> the t.v.  I live for "Homerisms" that man is a god.


well I only suggested it as a possiblility which would make a nice segue way
to a futurama movie ( which I would enjoy as well) but not really have them
make an impact on the simpsons movie. imagine the sort of thing where homer
pops in to the middle of one their meetings and just saying "huh" before
vanishing again and you see puzzled looks on the faces of the futurama team
before the professor just continues talking like nothing happened. it might
encompass 15 seconds and not otherwise affect the movie. of course I have no
idea what shape the move will take so it was just an idea I had.
Garrett


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: manuel morrens <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] old movies on tape
Date: 23 Aug 2000 13:50:50 +0200


--------------3C3B386D6D2957185F709288
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Does anyone here know a site or something where you can order old and
hard-to-find-movies on tape (VHS) ?

Manuel Morrens                  [e-mail]
Department of Medicine          http://minf.vub.ac.be/~mmorrens/eighties
Brussels Free University        (lyrics of the eighties)



--------------3C3B386D6D2957185F709288
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<HTML>
Does anyone here know a site or something where you can order old and hard-to-find-movies
on tape (VHS) ?
<PRE></PRE>

<PRE>
Manuel Morrens                  [e-mail]
Department of Medicine          <A HREF="http://minf.vub.ac.be/~mmorrens/eighties">http://minf.vub.ac.be/~mmorrens/eighties</A>
Brussels Free University        (lyrics of the eighties)
 </HTML>

--------------3C3B386D6D2957185F709288--


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: manuel morrens <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Le SCANDALE  Claude Chabrol
Date: 23 Aug 2000 13:53:28 +0200

I'm looking for this movie. Does anyone have it, or does anyone know how
to get a copy?
It's a movie from 1966 known in the states as The Champagne murders.

thanks



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "David Lee" <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Which movie for paper??
Date: 23 Aug 2000 21:19:57 +0800

Dear all,

I've recently taken up a course in college/university called
Introduction to Filmic Narratives. As part of the course, we have a term
paper - choose any movie and talk about either (a) cinematography; (b)
mise-en-scene; (c) editing; (d) sound.

Was thinking of this German movie - which is like Sliding Doors, except
that there are four endings... can anybody recall the title?

Any other suggestions would be most appreciated.

Many thanks.

Regards,
David

---------Included Message----------
|Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2000 13:53:28 +0200
|From: manuel morrens <[e-mail]>
|Reply-To: [e-mail]
|To: [e-mail]
|Subject: [MV] Le SCANDALE  Claude Chabrol
|
|I'm looking for this movie. Does anyone have it, or does anyone know
how
|to get a copy?
|It's a movie from 1966 known in the states as The Champagne murders.
|
|thanks
|
|
|
|[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
|[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
|
---------End of Included Message----------



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] RE: Which movie for paper??
Date: 23 Aug 2000 08:40:00 -0600

> Was thinking of this German movie - which is like Sliding Doors, except
> that there are four endings... can anybody recall the title?

The only German movie I can think of that is like SLIDING DOORS is RUN LOLA
RUN.  It doesn't have four endings, however, but three twenty minute segments.
 Hope this helps...

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "David Lee" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] RE: Which movie for paper??
Date: 23 Aug 2000 22:45:09 +0800

Thanks, Paul! That was what I was looking for...

Any other films that you would recommend? I'm not sure if a
non-Hollywood movie (after all, it's just an 'introductory' course) will
go down well with the tutors...

Sigh..

Many thanks once again, for the quick response.

Regards
David

---------Included Message----------
|Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2000 08:40:00 -0600
|From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
|Reply-To: [e-mail]
|To: [e-mail]
|Subject: [MV] RE: Which movie for paper??
|
|> Was thinking of this German movie - which is like Sliding Doors,
except
|> that there are four endings... can anybody recall the title?
|
|The only German movie I can think of that is like SLIDING DOORS is RUN
LOLA
|RUN.  It doesn't have four endings, however, but three twenty minute
segments.
| Hope this helps...
|
|[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
|[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
|
---------End of Included Message----------



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Source - Richard" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] RE: Which movie for paper??
Date: 23 Aug 2000 15:52:54 +0100

How about Pokemon the Movie?

David Lee wrote:
>Thanks, Paul! That was what I was looking for...
>
>Any other films that you would recommend? I'm not sure if a
>non-Hollywood movie (after all, it's just an 'introductory' course) will

>go down well with the tutors...
>
>Sigh..
>
>Many thanks once again, for the quick response.
>
>Regards
>David
>
>---------Included Message----------
>|Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2000 08:40:00 -0600
>|From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
>|Reply-To: [e-mail]
>|To: [e-mail]
>|Subject: [MV] RE: Which movie for paper??
>|
>|> Was thinking of this German movie - which is like Sliding Doors,
>except
>|> that there are four endings... can anybody recall the title?
>|
>|The only German movie I can think of that is like SLIDING DOORS is RUN
>LOLA
>|RUN.  It doesn't have four endings, however, but three twenty minute
>segments.
>| Hope this helps...
>|
>|[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>|[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>|
>---------End of Included Message----------
>
>
>
>[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
>
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] RE: Which movie for paper
Date: 23 Aug 2000 08:59:00 -0600

> Any other films that you would recommend? I'm not sure if a
> non-Hollywood movie (after all, it's just an 'introductory' course) will
> go down well with the tutors...

While I'm not in your class and don't know your tutors, somehow I don't feel
RUN LOLA RUN would be a problem for them.  I'm sure they're going to get a ton
of papers talking about THE MATRIX, and your paper would be a breath of fresh
air.

When I was in film school and had to write papers on films I chose for myself,
I always chose films that I had already seen and enjoyed.  That way, when I
watched the movie to analyse it I wasn't caught up in the story and other
distracting elements.  Rather than recommend any one specific film, I would go
that route.

Paul

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Which movie for paper??
Date: 23 Aug 2000 14:43:06 -0400

At 09.19 PM 23/08/2000 +0800, David Lee wrote:
>I've recently taken up a course in college/university called
>Introduction to Filmic Narratives. As part of the course, we have a term
>paper - choose any movie and talk about either (a) cinematography; (b)
>mise-en-scene; (c) editing; (d) sound.
>
>Was thinking of this German movie - which is like Sliding Doors, except
>that there are four endings... can anybody recall the title?
>

That was Run Lola Run (Lola Rennt was the original German title) - I am
sure that you have gotten a tonne of replies about that, tho.

>Any other suggestions would be most appreciated.
>

Funny you should ask.  I have a friend that just graduated from SDSU film
school (he loved that film), as well as a friend who had to do this exact
same paper last semister at her University.  (Against our protests, she
went with Blair Witch Project).

If you are looking for a powerful movie, that will almost write the paper
for you, might I suggest one of the classics??  Casablanca and Vertigo
(amongst many others) highlight all of these facets.

Really, there are simply so many movies to choose from, it is hard to tell
which to use.  My gut feeling is if you pick a movie the prof hasn't seen
done to death, it could be good for your grade.

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty     http://www.webz.com/gowanna
mailto:[e-mail]                  mailto:[e-mail]

419 Butler Street
PO Box 95184
Pittsburgh, PA 15223-0184
[phone]                                    [phone]
1-888-45-GOWANNA -- TOLL FREE     (1-888-454-6926)
____________________________________________
"Wow! So that is what all that extra space on the movie screen is
 for!" reaction to  "Gladiator"
______________________________________________


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] old movies on tape
Date: 23 Aug 2000 18:46:19 EDT

In a message dated 08/23/2000 4:49:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< Does anyone here know a site or something where you can order old and
 hard-to-find-movies on tape (VHS) ? >>

Only thing I can think of is eBay.

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Mark J. Mills" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] old movies on tape
Date: 23 Aug 2000 19:02:19 -0400



[e-mail] wrote:

> In a message dated 08/23/2000 4:49:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> [e-mail] writes:
>
> << Does anyone here know a site or something where you can order old and
>  hard-to-find-movies on tape (VHS) ? >>

    Try the following link to Movies Unlimited in Philadelphia; I actually
went to their store while I lived in Philly, and they were flat-out amazing
in the depth and range of stock they had on hand -- and they assured me
that, if it wasn't in the store but was otherwise available, that they could
get it.

http://www.moviesunlimited.com/dum2.htm

Cheers, Mark Mills


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: [MV] RE: Which movie for paper??
Date: 23 Aug 2000 19:08:47 EDT

In a message dated 08/23/2000 7:54:25 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< How about Pokemon the Movie? >>

Don't put yourself through that torture.

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] RE: Which movie for paper??
Date: 23 Aug 2000 16:43:52 -0700



[e-mail] wrote:

> In a message dated 08/23/2000 7:54:25 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> [e-mail] writes:
>
> << How about Pokemon the Movie? >>
>
> Don't put yourself through that torture.

Hahahah.  BTW, any comments on "The Cell"
--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Jason Cormier" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] Gattaca
Date: 24 Aug 2000 07:38:53 -0400

I enjoyed this movie - moreso because I saw it a few years ago at the
Toronto Film Festival and right beside me sat none other than David
Cornenberg!!!  It was wild - we got to talk for 20 minutes before the movie
started.  Apparently he was there to see if Jude Law was any good
(apparently he was as he then signed on for eXistenZ).  Good movie too!

-----Original Message-----
[mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf Of
[e-mail]
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 4:12 PM


Gattaca was rented this weekend by mistake and I was pleasantly surprised
that I liked it.
Set in the "not too distant Future" starring Ethan Hawke, Uma Thurman and
Jude Law.
Ethan Hawke is Vincent who is conceived naturally in a world where parents
can choose only the best of their genes. Vincent is born with a weak heart.
His parents choose the other method for his younger brother.
Vincent dreams of a career in space but he is an In-Valid blood type so he
settles for a job as a janitor at the space center Gattaca.
Frustrated, he contacts a man who will help him switch identities with a
Valid blood type, Jerome. Jerome has everything it takes to be in the
Gattaca program but he is paralyzed. The methods these two use to become
each other are facinating and the moments I thought they would surely get
caught kept me on edge.




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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Olaf Adam" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] old movies on tape
Date: 15 Aug 2000 11:02:08 +0200

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_004A_01C006A8.410E4320
Content-Type: text/plain;
    charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Try the VIDEO HUNT service at blackstar (www.blackstar.co.uk)

Don't know if this search is any good, though

Cheers

Olaf
  -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----=20
  Von: manuel morrens=20
  An: [e-mail]=20
  Gesendet: Mittwoch, 23. August 2000 13:50
  Betreff: [MV] old movies on tape


  Does anyone here know a site or something where you can order old and =
hard-to-find-movies on tape (VHS) ?=20

Manuel Morrens                  [e-mail]        =20
Department of Medicine          http://minf.vub.ac.be/~mmorrens/eighties
Brussels Free University        (lyrics of the eighties)
   =20

------=_NextPart_000_004A_01C006A8.410E4320
Content-Type: text/html;
    charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2614.3500" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Try the VIDEO HUNT service at blackstar (<A=20
href=3D"http://www.blackstar.co.uk">www.blackstar.co.uk</A>)</FONT></DIV>=

<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Don't know if this search is any good, =
though</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Cheers</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Olaf</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">-----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht----- =
</DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>Von:</B>=20
  <A href=3D"mailto:[e-mail]" =
title=[e-mail]>manuel=20
  morrens</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>An:</B> <A=20
  href=3D"mailto:[e-mail]"=20
  title=[e-mail]>[e-mail]</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Gesendet:</B> Mittwoch, 23. August =
2000=20
  13:50</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Betreff:</B> [MV] old movies on =
tape</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>Does anyone here know a site or something where you can =
order=20
  old and hard-to-find-movies on tape (VHS) ? =
<PRE></PRE><PRE>---------------------------------------------------------=
------------
Manuel =
Morrens           =
       <A =
href=3D"mailto:[e-mail]">[e-mail]</A> =

Department of =
Medicine          <A =
href=3D"http://minf.vub.ac.be/~mmorrens/eighties">http://minf.vub.ac.be/~=
mmorrens/eighties</A>
Brussels Free University        =
(lyrics of the eighties)
E> =20
</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_004A_01C006A8.410E4320--


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Nathan Lemrick <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] Irish Films
Date: 24 Aug 2000 15:35:30 -0700 (PDT)

I was wondering if anyone knows films that have to deal with Ireland?  The only films I can think about are The Boxer, In the Name of the Father, Micheal Collins, and Far and Away to a certain extent.  But I am trying to find more on Ireland for a class I am taking.  Thanks,

Nathan

___________________________________________________
GO Network Mail
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Diane Christy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Irish Films
Date: 24 Aug 2000 18:31:16 -0500

On 8/24/00, 3:35 PM -0700, Nathan Lemrick said so nicely:
>I was wondering if anyone knows films that have to deal with Ireland?

How about "The Quiet Man"
--
~~~~~
Diane Christy (Samantha and Joshua's Mom)
Jefferson, LA
http://www.geocities.com/diane507/
mailto:[e-mail]
ICQ #12904700  <dkbc10> on Instant AOL Messenger
~~~~~

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Wade S" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] old movies on tape
Date: 24 Aug 2000 20:41:40 CDT

one place to check is     www.about.com

And check the movies-classics site and look in that category and see if
there's a marketplace or something... you could also email the guide there,
he's a relatively nice guy! jk-kidding He's a good guy, very knowledgeable.

Wade


>From: "Mark J. Mills" <[e-mail]>
>Reply-To: [e-mail]
>To: [e-mail]
>Subject: Re: [MV] old movies on tape
>Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2000 19:02:19 -0400
>
>
>
>[e-mail] wrote:
>
> > In a message dated 08/23/2000 4:49:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> > [e-mail] writes:
> >
> > << Does anyone here know a site or something where you can order old and
> >  hard-to-find-movies on tape (VHS) ? >>
>
>     Try the following link to Movies Unlimited in Philadelphia; I actually
>went to their store while I lived in Philly, and they were flat-out amazing
>in the depth and range of stock they had on hand -- and they assured me
>that, if it wasn't in the store but was otherwise available, that they
>could
>get it.
>
>http://www.moviesunlimited.com/dum2.htm
>
>Cheers, Mark Mills
>
>
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From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Irish Films
Date: 24 Aug 2000 19:25:51 -0700

Waking Ned Devine is set in Ireland, I believe.


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From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] old movies on tape
Date: 24 Aug 2000 19:26:41 -0700

Critics' Choice Video (www.ccvideo.com) has a lot of older movies.


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From: "David F. Nolan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] old movies on tape
Date: 24 Aug 2000 20:36:39 -0700

Here's a message I received recently from Critics' Choice Video. As I noted
in an earlier message, they have a pretty good selection of older movies.

Dear Movie Collector,

How'd you like to save $10 on your favorite movies on VHS or DVD? Click on
the link below and you'll do just that--save $10 on any order of $50 or mor=
e
at Critics' Choice Video
http://www.ccvideo.com/from.cgi?index.html|august_10dollar, the premier Web
site for classic films and new releases on VHS and DVD!

Right now, we're featuring an exciting new addition to the ever-growing
family of great movies available on DVD. 1995's "Braveheart," winner of fiv=
e
Oscars including Best Director (Mel Gibson) and Best Picture, is now
available on DVD for the first time, complete with lots of fantastic DVD
extras.

The DVD--priced at $29.95 but on sale at Critics' Choice Video for only
$23.77! =97is loaded with special features, including exclusive commentary
with Mel Gibson, the documentary "Mel Gibson's Braveheart: A Filmmaker's
Passion--The Making of an Epic Adventure," two original theatrical trailers
and much more!

The "Braveheart" DVD won't become available until August 29--but Critics'
Choice Video is taking orders now! To pre-order your copy of Braveheart on
DVD just click here
http://www.ccvideo.com/from.cgi?o.cgi/vid_search?v_id=3D160653/|august_10doll=
a
r

With our current offer to save $10 on any order of at least $50, there's
never been a better time to visit us at
http://www.ccvideo.com/from.cgi?index.html|august_10dollar.

We've got a database of over 50,000 films and features on VHS and DVD, with
new titles added daily--plus special profiles and features on Hollywood's
top stars and films, both classics and contemporaries. See you soon!

This offer expires September 18th, so visit us today!


 This offer may not be combined with any other promotion or discount from
Critics' Choice Video.
To unsubscribe from this email list, visit us at:
http://www.ccvideo.com/newsletter.html Replace [e-mail] with the
email address that received this newsletter, check unsubscribe and click
submit.





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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mel Eperthener <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Irish Films
Date: 24 Aug 2000 23:13:31 -0400

At 03.35 PM 24/08/2000 -0700, Nathan Lemrick wrote:
>I was wondering if anyone knows films that have to deal with Ireland?  The
only films I can think about are The Boxer, In the Name of the Father,
Micheal Collins, and Far and Away to a certain extent.  But I am trying to
find more on Ireland for a class I am taking.  Thanks,
>

The Quiet Man
The Commitments
The Snapper
The Van (those three are all connected)
Circle of Friends
I Went Down
The Brylcreme Boys
The Secret of Roan Inish
The Matchmaker
Darby O'Gill and the Little People (?)

and to stretch it a bit:

Blown Away
Patriot Games
The Devil's Own
Mary Reilly (Ugh!!)

And those are just off the top of my head.  Check out imdb.com for even more.

Regards,

--Mel


--Mel Eperthener
president, Gowanna Multi-media Pty     http://www.webz.com/gowanna
mailto:[e-mail]                  mailto:[e-mail]

419 Butler Street
PO Box 95184
Pittsburgh, PA 15223-0184
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Chris Parry <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Irish Films
Date: 25 Aug 2000 14:41:29 -0700

Adding to Mel's list:

The Nephew
Divorcing Jack
Felicia's Journey (kinda)
Angela's Ashes
The Butcher Boy
My Left Foot
The General
Ordinary Decent Criminal
The Last Of The High Kings
Moll Flanders

Mel Eperthener wrote:
>
> The Quiet Man
> The Commitments
> The Snapper
> The Van (those three are all connected)
> Circle of Friends
> I Went Down
> The Brylcreme Boys
> The Secret of Roan Inish
> The Matchmaker
> Darby O'Gill and the Little People (?)
> Blown Away
> Patriot Games
> The Devil's Own
> Mary Reilly (Ugh!!)

OZ

http://www.efilmcritic.com
http://www.mymovies.com.au
http://www.tribe.com
http://www.if.com.au
http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
http://www.sain.com.au

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From: "Source - Richard" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Irish Films
Date: 25 Aug 2000 09:36:06 +0100

I recommend The General and Butcher Boy.

Chris Parry wrote:
>Adding to Mel's list:
>
>The Nephew
>Divorcing Jack
>Felicia's Journey (kinda)
>Angela's Ashes
>The Butcher Boy
>My Left Foot
>The General
>Ordinary Decent Criminal
>The Last Of The High Kings
>Moll Flanders
>
>Mel Eperthener wrote:
>>
>> The Quiet Man
>> The Commitments
>> The Snapper
>> The Van (those three are all connected)
>> Circle of Friends
>> I Went Down
>> The Brylcreme Boys
>> The Secret of Roan Inish
>> The Matchmaker
>> Darby O'Gill and the Little People (?)
>> Blown Away
>> Patriot Games
>> The Devil's Own
>> Mary Reilly (Ugh!!)
>
>OZ
>
>http://www.efilmcritic.com
>http://www.mymovies.com.au
>http://www.tribe.com
>http://www.if.com.au
>http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
>http://www.sain.com.au
>
>[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
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>
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Nathan Lemrick <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] Irish Films
Date: 25 Aug 2000 11:32:50 -0700 (PDT)

Thanks for all the suggestions.  I did not know there was so many films that pertained to Ireland.  Now I just have to go and try to find these and watch some of them.

Nathan

>I recommend The General and Butcher Boy.>
>Chris Parry wrote:
>>Adding to Mel's list:
>>
>>The Nephew
>>Divorcing Jack
>>Felicia's Journey (kinda)
>>Angela's Ashes
>>The Butcher Boy
>>My Left Foot
>>The General
>>Ordinary Decent Criminal
>>The Last Of The High Kings
>>Moll Flanders
>>
>>Mel Eperthener wrote:
>>>
>>> The Quiet Man
>>> The Commitments
>>> The Snapper
>>> The Van (those three are all connected)
>>> Circle of Friends
>>> I Went Down
>>> The Brylcreme Boys
>>> The Secret of Roan Inish
>>> The Matchmaker
>>> Darby O'Gill and the Little People (?)
>>> Blown Away
>>> Patriot Games
>>> The Devil's Own
>>> Mary Reilly (Ugh!!)
>>
>>OZ
>>
>>http://www.efilmcritic.com
>>http://www.mymovies.com.au
>>http://www.tribe.com
>>http://www.if.com.au
>>http://ifmagazine.ifctv.com
>>http://www.sain.com.au
>>
>>[ To leave the movies mailing list, send the message "unsubscribe ]
>>[ movies" (without the quotes) to [e-mail]          ]
        ]


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From: ("Paul D  Richardson") <[e-mail]>
Subject: [MV] THE CREW & CROUPIER
Date: 28 Aug 2000 10:36:00 -0600

This weekend, I went out and saw these two similarly-titled releases.  Here
are some brief thoughts:

THE CREW -- I have no excuse for seeing this film...the trailer made it look
hilarious.  Unfortunately, the film is anything but.  It's actually
well-directed and the cast is great, but the screenplay is poor and the
chemistry is non-existent.  Too bad, because the film could've had a lot of
potential.  The best jokes come from the subtle parodying of GOODFELLAS,
including a funny take-off on the "entrance through the kitchen" scene.  But
even these don't quite work.  If you really must see a film about 4 geezers,
check out SPACE COWBOYS instead...it is far superior.  Not recommended.

CROUPIER -- This English film from 1998, directed by veteran Michael Hodges,
is one of the best films I've seen this year.  Many thanks to those of you who
have recommended this film.  Clive Owens plays the title character, a would-be
author who takes a job as a croupier (a dealer in a casino) in order to make
ends meet.  He learns that having a day job can actually help his "real"
career, although it weighs heavily on his personal life.  It's hard to
describe this film, since it can't really be pigeonholed into a genre.  It's a
very-focused, very-interesting character study.  Highly recommended.

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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Source - Richard" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] SPIELBERG - A SIMPLE LOOKBACK
Date: 31 Aug 2000 11:03:07 +0100

Many of you may disagree, but personally I believe Steven Spielberg to be
one of the greatest filmmakers of all-time. He may not reflect the times,
have a political message or raise intellectual issues (apart from some of
his more recent 'historical' movies), but for sheer entertainment, he
cannot be beat!

I thought it would be interesting to just do a quick and simple rating on
each of his films (yes, I know it's not from the film theory school of
moving picture dissection  but, if like me, you are at work, it's just a way
to kill five minutes and let off some steam). Anyway, feel free to
elaborate if you have the time but in the meantime...

* Jaws - 10/10 - Without a doubt, the forerunner to every 'good' movie
blockbuster of the last 20 years (I don't believe summer blockbusters are a
'bad' thing. They are just as important as arthouse, foreign, independent
or any other genre in keeping movies alive).

* Close Encounters of the Third Kind - 10/10 - Wow, this movie stays with
me to this day. A lesson in how to achieve complete wonder. Contact is
one of my favourite movies but could not have been made without this.

* 1941 - 5/10 - A case of self indulgence as Spielbergs new found praise
and fame maybe forced him into a corner and go against his better
judgement. A brave effort but most incoherent and basically a series of sketches.

* Raiders of the Lost Ark - 10/10 - It may appear that I am being too
generous with my scores, but I think this is just a reflection of what a
winning streak Spielberg was on (1941 excepted as 3 out of 4 ain't bad).

To be continued when i get a minute.................

R


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From: "Source - Richard" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: [MV] SPIELBERG - A SIMPLE LOOKBACK
Date: 31 Aug 2000 18:11:52 +0100

And i continue...

* ET  - 10/10 - Spielbergs masterpiece. A work of pure wonder and
enjoyment which says more about our inner child and lost innocence than any movie
before or since.

* Poltergeist - 8/10 - Sorry Tobe, but I don't believe for a minute that
you directed this movie! Jam packed with Spielbergisms that you will not
find in ANY other Tobe Hooper movies, this definitely stemmed from
Spielbergs darker side that began to seep through in Raiders of the Lost Ark.

* Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom - 7/10 - Disappointing following
the first Indy movie, and maybe this could have been seen as a classic if
it had come first as it had all the thrills and excitement that made the
first movie great - thing is, Raiders was just SO good. This is where
Spielberg maybe went too far with his dark side which may have occurred from the
press at the time calling him a kids movie director.

* The Color Purple - 7/10 - Possibly the point at which Spielberg lost
his way. He didn't want to continue being known as a 'fantasy' filmmaker,
yet 'fantasy' was what he did best and what the public wanted! This is a
wonderful and moving movie with a strong message - but where was our magical
fantasy going to come from now?

* Empire of the Sun - 8/10 - Undeterred by the lack of Academy
recognition with Purple, Spielberg continued with his adult themes, but the twist
was that this was an adult theme from a child's point of view, and, as with
ET, he nails it perfectly.

* Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade - 9/10 - The second best Indy film.
The nastiness of Temple has been replaced with pure comedy and slapstick
and it works a treat. Sean Connery as Indys dad was a casting stroke of
genius.

* Always - 6/10 - One of Spielbergs mosts understated films. This movie
is thoroughly enjoyable for what it is, but any number of accomplished
Directors could have achieved much the same effect. Speilberg on auto-pilot.

* Hook - 5/10 - Mmmm, interesting one this. No other Spielberg film seems
to split the audience like this one. People either appreciated a return
to the innocence of his earlier family movies or hated the sugary
sentiment. Me? I fall into the former but appreciate the latter issues. Best to
watch with an open mind on a rainy Sunday afternoon. Not his best.

* Jurassic park - 9/10 - This was more like it! A pure rollercoaster ride
of a movie (if you'll excuse the clichΘ). The effects are absolutely
groundbreaking and amaze even to this day. Lack of character development let
down an almost perfect movie.

* Schindlers List - 10/10 - The most successful of Spielbergs adult
movies. Who would have thought that someone who was so adept and showing new
worlds and possibilities could also reveal the horrors of war so powerfully.
A revelation.

* The Lost World - 6/10 - It was quite baffling to watch this movie when
it first came out as I'm sure most people anticipating a sequel had their
own idea of what it could be like (whether they had read the book or not).
It turns out that this was basically more of the same and didn't expand
on the original enough to make it a classic. Again, Spielberg on auto-pilot
(JP3 although not directed by Spielberg, looks set to be the story that
Lost World should have been).

* Amistad - 6/10 - Probably the least memorable of all Speilbergs films
(yes even Hook and Always). Although an extremely well-made, acted and
scripted movie that would warrant rave reviews from lesser directors, Amistad
just seems too forgettable! It feels like a stop-gap between bigger and
better things.

* Saving Private Ryan - 8/10 - Shocking, moving, masterful and deeply
disturbing...but that was only the first half an hour. The rest of the movie
doesn't quite live up to this first section but is still Spielberg on
form. The main problem is that Speilbergs weakest trait has always been
character development, and SPR is basically a character study, a story of
bonding and the effects of war on young men.

Coming soon - AI and Minority Report. Reasons to be excited as, not since
Jurassic Park has Spielberg tackled pure fantasy  with major success.
These could be the ones we have been waiting for!

Final note - Although I think Spielberg is one of the greats, as with
other legends, it is also the people who surround the genius that help
elevate the work. I am of course talking about John Williams who has turned a
number of great films into classics. Can you imagine Jaws without the
'dum-dum-dum-dum' theme? ET without the soaring theme as Elliot and ET
silhouette against the moon? Close Encounters without the sign-language theme tune?
Or Indy without his rousing overture? Thought not.

R



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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Dexter Sy <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: [MV] SPIELBERG - A SIMPLE LOOKBACK
Date: 31 Aug 2000 22:02:04 -0700


--------------FA90F828ABF9E9AC7BF54327
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> Final note - Although I think Spielberg is one of the greats, as with
> other legends, it is also the people who surround the genius that help
> elevate the work. I am of course talking about John Williams who has turned a
> number of great films into classics. Can you imagine Jaws without the
> 'dum-dum-dum-dum' theme? ET without the soaring theme as Elliot and ET
> silhouette against the moon? Close Encounters without the sign-language theme tune?
> Or Indy without his rousing overture? Thought not.

Of course detractors will claim that Spielberg, the populist, is turning out nothing
more than sentimental crap pretending to be to serious films for his dramatic works,
and dismiss his action flicks are "yet more examples of the popcorn culture that is the
new hollywood"

And trust me, Hollywood has a lot of enemies in the so called serious film going
community and their target #1 is Spielberg.

That's not to say I disagree with you.  I actually agree with you wholeheartedly, but
there is that line of reasoning out there.  You probably won't find it in the
mainstream, this stuff is written more in as a subtext in most of the intellectual
circles.   I am studying film history so I  took the liberty to flip through the pages
of my film text, Oxford History of World Cinema,  to see what they wrote of Spielberg.
The book is basically a collection of essays from various contributors strung together
by a handful of editors. Anyways, the editors  of the book were level headed enough to
give him a special box (a privilege reseved only for the important figures/directors
the book talks about) but the essay attached to spielberg (written by a contributing
writer) was rather stilted and pretty much dismissed Spielberg as a populist popcorn
director who happened to do Schindler's List.  His previous works like Empire of the
Sun and the Color Purple were ignored all together.


--
Dexter S.
Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
Http://www.tendobox.com


--------------FA90F828ABF9E9AC7BF54327
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>

<blockquote TYPE=CITE>
<br>Final note - Although I think Spielberg is one of the greats, as with
<br>other legends, it is also the people who surround the genius that help
<br>elevate the work. I am of course talking about John Williams who has
turned a
<br>number of great films into classics. Can you imagine Jaws without the
<br>'dum-dum-dum-dum' theme? ET without the soaring theme as Elliot and
ET
<br>silhouette against the moon? Close Encounters without the sign-language
theme tune?
<br>Or Indy without his rousing overture? Thought not.</blockquote>

<p><br>Of course detractors will claim that Spielberg, the populist, is
turning out nothing more than sentimental crap pretending to be to serious
films for his dramatic works, and dismiss his action flicks are "yet more
examples of the popcorn culture that is the new hollywood"
<p>And trust me, Hollywood has a lot of enemies in the so called serious
film going community and their target #1 is Spielberg.
<p>That's not to say I disagree with you.  I actually agree with you
wholeheartedly, but there is that line of reasoning out there.  You
probably won't find it in the mainstream, this stuff is written more in
as a subtext in most of the intellectual circles.   I am studying
film history so I  took the liberty to flip through the pages of my
film text, <i>Oxford History of World Cinema, </i> to see what they
wrote of Spielberg.  The book is basically a collection of essays
from various contributors strung together by a handful of editors. Anyways,
the editors  of the book were level headed enough to give him a special
box (a privilege reseved only for the important figures/directors the book
talks about) but the essay attached to spielberg (written by a contributing
writer) was rather stilted and pretty much dismissed Spielberg as a populist
popcorn director who happened to do Schindler's List.  His previous
works like Empire of the Sun and the Color Purple were ignored all together.
<br>
<p>--
<br>Dexter S.
<br>Tendo Box - Nintendo e-zine
<br><A HREF="Http://www.tendobox.com">Http://www.tendobox.com</A>
<br> </html>

--------------FA90F828ABF9E9AC7BF54327--


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