<DIV></DIV>>Subject: Re: MtMan-List: new tread - horses
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<DIV></DIV>>Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 07:37:05 -0700
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<DIV></DIV>>Sue,
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<DIV></DIV>>I am changing internet companies and just found out my site will be off line until later today or tomorrow...sorry.
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<P>> Ned </P>
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<P><FONT face="Garamond, Times, Serif">Thank you Ned sweetie,</FONT></P>
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<P><FONT face=Times> My brother, a trainer of horses for a decade, has said around the dinner table discussions that the morgan was a good mountain man's horse. He used to debate with Dad that the myth of the stallion used by trappers would have been both dangerous and have worn out the rider. Of course, many fiction based novels would have the public accepting this as contrary to many book's mythic enchantment. Have you ran across many references to stallions being rode?</FONT></P>
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<P><FONT face=Times>Sue</FONT></P>
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<DIV></DIV></div><br clear=all><hr>Join the worldÆs largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. <a href='http://go.msn.com/bql/hmtag4_etl_EN.asp'>Click Here</a><br></html>
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Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 15:14:18 -0700
From: "BARRY CONNER" <conner_one@email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: a later day buckskinner
Frank,
There have been several books written about Sylvan Hart and dozen of
articles about him and his life style on the Salmon River in Idaho, Dick
"Keelboat" Whitmer (AMM brother, now gone to the other side with Sylvan) was
a personal friend of Hart's, Dick showed me several muzzle loading pistols
and a couple of knives that Sylvan had made and gave him. His work was not
the neatest, but when one considers the working conditions and material he
had at hand - then they where probably pretty darn good.
Take care,
Buck Conner
"Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty" Thomas Jefferson 1771
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank Fusco" <frankf@cox-internet.com>
To: "hist_text-digest" <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2002 11:45 AM
Subject: MtMan-List: a later day buckskinner
> An interesting story in the March issue of Hunting Magazine about a
> fellow nicknamed Buckskin Bill who died in 1980. The story is by Grits
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
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Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 18:32:20 EST
From: CTOAKES@aol.com
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Riding a "Stallion"
<<debate with Dad that the myth of the stallion used by trappers would have been both dangerous>>
I don't know about any record of mountain man riding "Stallions" but I have to agree with the potential for a dangerous ride. My wife and I ride horses in company (Fox Hunting with Hounds) and Stallions are not appreciated in the hunt field. All it takes is one mare in season to create all kinds of havok. You just can't believe what it is like to have a Stallion (read that stud) try to mount the horse you are on. And when they (Mare and Stallion) get wind of each other they can be quite noisey which might attract unwanted attention from others. Another problem can occur if you get two or more stallions together as they need to establish alph domanance and that can get to be a mess on a picket line.
So if it were me I would ride a mare or a gelding and leave the stallions out on the range.
Y.M.O.S.
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Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 17:16:04 -0800
From: "De Santis, Nick" <nick.de.santis@intel.com>
Subject: MtMan-List: looking for a ball mold
Sorry if this is not the place for this, but I am having a time finding a
.520 round ball mold. Anybody got a idea?
Thanks, Nick
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Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 20:28:23 EST
From: GazeingCyot@cs.com
Subject: MtMan-List: -horses of the fur trade & Stallion
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Ned said:
(I have not run across any reference to Mountain Men using other than Indian
horses until horses and mules were used to bring supplies to the rendezvous)
Ned if you mean Spanish Barbs when you say Indian horses were used by the
Mountain Men your absolutely right.
But even after horses and mules were used to bring supplies to the Rendezvous
they were most likely to be of Spanish Barb blood lines. For the stock that
was used was out of St. Louis. Which was getting most of there stock out of
Santa Fe. and Taos area. Why even the Missouri Mule early beginnings came out
of the Santa Fe area. During the fur trade there was a lot of Horse trading
and stealing going on in California. With the horses all headed for the
Rockies. Read about Ewing Young, Jedediah Smith, Peg leg Smith, Beckworth and
Walker just to name a few the men that engaged in this trade at one time or
another. These horses too were of the Spanish Barb Blood.
As for Stallions being used well I haven't read of any being used. But I
haven't read of them not being used ether. Them Indians sure did have a lot
of horses for not having any Studs around. (BG)
I have used a Spanish Barb Stud on a couple of four and five day rides with a
mix bunch of horses. With little to no problems. In fact I had him at the AMM
Nationals this year. Course he is a good horse and you have to be aware of
what your ridding at all times. So I think it would depend on the horse and
ones ability to handle it. If it's a problem fix it!
I also think a horse was used at all times. Trapping or whenever for if you
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="FIXED" FACE="Courier New" LANG="0">(I have not run across any reference to Mountain Men using other than Indian horses until horses and mules were used to bring supplies to the rendezvous)
<BR> Ned if you mean Spanish Barbs when you say Indian horses were used by the Mountain Men your absolutely right.
<BR>But even after horses and mules were used to bring supplies to the Rendezvous they were most likely to be of Spanish Barb blood lines. For the stock that was used was out of St. Louis. Which was getting most of there stock out of Santa Fe. and Taos area. Why even the Missouri Mule early beginnings came out of the Santa Fe area. During the fur trade there was a lot of Horse trading and stealing going on in California. With the horses all headed for the Rockies. Read about Ewing Young, Jedediah Smith, Peg leg Smith, Beckworth and Walker just to name a few the men that engaged in this trade at one time or another. These horses too were of the Spanish Barb Blood.
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<BR>As for Stallions being used well I haven't read of any being used. But I haven't read of them not being used ether. Them Indians sure did have a lot of horses for not having any Studs around. (BG)
<BR>I have used a Spanish Barb Stud on a couple of four and five day rides with a mix bunch of horses. With little to no problems. In fact I had him at the AMM Nationals this year. Course he is a good horse and you have to be aware of what your ridding at all times. So I think it would depend on the horse and ones ability to handle it. If it's a problem fix it!
<BR>I also think a horse was used at all times. Trapping or whenever for if you were without a horse you were on hard times.
<BR>Just my two Cents worth.
<BR>See ya on the trail.
<BR>Crazy Cyot </FONT></HTML>
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Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 18:49:18 -0800
From: "SUE RAVEN" <blond40ddqhearts@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Sue MtMan-List: new tread - horses
>From: "Ned Eddins" <neddins@silverstar.com>
>Reply-To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com
>To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com>
>Subject: Re: Sue MtMan-List: new tread - horses
>Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 15:16:00 -0700
>
>I have not found any specific reference to the use of stallions by Mountain
>Men.
I found one meager reference:
From "Three Years among Indians and Mexicans", by Thomas James, chapter 6,
he writes:
"This was the work of a few minutes, during which both horses and men were
intermingled together in apparently inextricable confusion. The whole drove
was taken at the first onset,
except a fine black stud which flew like the wind, pursued by a
hundred Indians, and in about two hours was brought back tamed and gentle.
He walked close by the Indian who had captured him, and who led him by a
rope and wished to sell him to me. I feared his wild look and dilated eye,
but his Indian master and protector said he was gentle and gave me the end
of the rope with which he led him, when the noble animal immediately came
near to me as to a new friend and master. He seemed by his manner to have
ratified the transfer and chosen me in preference to the Indian. In
twenty-four hours after their capture these horses became tamed and ready
for use, and keep near to their owners as their only friends. I could
perceive little
difference between them and our farm horses."
Like many have said, even James initially feared the idea of riding the
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Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2002 22:28:04 EST
From: CTOAKES@aol.com
Subject: MtMan-List: Re: not historical just for grins, but true of how we all treat history at one time or another
Forgive me but sometimes we all, myself included get a little up tight and need a smile concerning our historical hobby. My wife forwarded this to me on the road > >From the pages of Field and Stream.
>
> (R-R-R-I-I-N-N-N-G-G-G)
>
> MAN: Hello, Lone Wolf Blackpowder Emporium, "Lobo" speakin'. What
can I do
for ya' pilgrim?
> CALLER: Hi Lobo. Filbert-"Big Griz" Stemmish here. A fella I met at
a
rondezvous said i should call your outfit next time I need to buy some
authentic gear.
> LOBO: Okay, whatcha need, Big Griz?
> GRIZ: Well, quite a bit. My outfits are showing a lot of trail
wear, what
with all the blackpowder hunting I do, plus the rondezvous and
reenactments
and such. Thing is though, I'm a real purist, so all the stuff I use
has to
be legit, you know, authentic. It's all gotta be done the old way,
nothing
modern or phony, just the real mccoy.
> LOBO: You've come to the right place, big Griz. That's our
specialty--
Exact reproduction in everything! What's your first item?
