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hist_text-digest      Thursday, January 21 1999      Volume 01 : Number 223




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 18:20:01 -0700
From: Allen Hall <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Wet weather

Hello the list,

Seveal of us are getting ready for a winter camp on the Lewis Fork of the
Snake River, right near where Osborne Russell described a hot spring.
Anyway, the forecast is for wet weather, not winter weather.  In getting
ready for this I thought it would be interesting to hear how different folks
deal with wet, sloppy weather.

Looking forward to your answers,

Allen Hall in Fort Hall country

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 22:24:06 -0600
From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <[e-mail]>
Subject: [none]

Does anyone know of a source of tin foil?  Tin foil was being used in =
various ways during the 1820's (but I don't know how much earlier) and =
it might be interesting to explore how we might legitimitely use it.
Lanney Ratcliff

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 19:53:40 -0800
From: Dennis Fisher <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #221

Mike Rock wrote:

> We should note that honey bees were not introduced to this country
> before approd.1622 on the east and 1850 on the west coast.  They do not
> migrate rapidly without human intervention.  Thus 'bee trees' all over
> is rather a overstatement.  I am trying to trace the historical spread
> of the honey bee. I do not have a chronological contour map done yet .

I've noted when reading old journals that any honey bee sightings seemed to
provoke comments on how far west they were sighted.  People knew that bees
were slowly moving west and thought it worth noting.  If I can locate some
of those comments, I will post them to the list.

                Dennis Fisher

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 21:10:42 -0600
From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Fw: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #221

Date: Sunday, January 17, 1999 4:59 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #221


Mike
Exactly!!  This is why the common honeybee is called the European honey =
bee.  I was vaguely aware of your facts but did not know the dates.  =
Thanks.  Give us a follow up when you can.
Lanney Ratcliff
- -----Original Message-----
From: Mike Rock <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Saturday, January 16, 1999 11:31 PM
Subject: MtMan-List: Re: hist_text-digest V1 #221


>We should note that honey bees were not introduced to this country
>before approd.1622 on the east and 1850 on the west coast.  They do not
>migrate rapidly without human intervention.  Thus 'bee trees' all over
>is rather a overstatement.  I am trying to trace the historical spread
>of the honey bee. I do not have a chronological contour map done yet .
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 17:23:32 -0600
From: Jeff Powers <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Canvas lodges

   >John L. Allen wrote:
   >> During the last month or so, I've been doing some archival
   >>research that has  led me to a bunch of old (1850-1900)
   >>photographs of the central and northern  Great Plains and the
   >>northern Rockies. In virtually all of the photos  showing Indian
   >>villages, the lodges appeared to me to be of something other  than
   >>buffalo or other hide because they were so very bright. Or,
   >>alternately,  are all my assumptions above wrong and have I really
   >looking at hide lodges  that were somehow bleached white by the
   >elements? The hide teepees are pretty easy to spot in a photograph
   >or painting.  The hides are irregular in shape and you can see from
   >the patterns formed from sewing them together.  The canvas ones
   >have straight seams.  There are probably other clues to watch for
   >but the seams are a dead give away.
   >Dennis Fisher
 Shall I toss in some confusing information from the 18th century? This is
from a friend in the Indian Dept.(rev war) And I (cannot find it right now)
also have period documentation of natives using canvas during the French &
Indian Wars. Natives have always been great at borrowing from all contacts
they had so it is not odd that some would begin to use canvas as soon as
they could get their hands on it. Remember,I didn't claim that there was any
documentation for the Rocky Mountains,I think there is but I do not have it
available right now. Also note the conical lodge below,its become my
favorite type for speed and efficency,but when I use it at mountain man
events most people do try to call it a "Sloppy tipi." When I go to the
hassle of setting up a wigwam people recognize it immediatly. Rather strange
since I have seen several paintings that have both wigwams and conicals  in
the same picture and some were all or partially covered with sail canvas!
As far as shelters are concerned we use various types of shelters depending
the site ect.  a bit of history first:  The Loyal Confederated Valley was a
native refugee camp near Niagra, the folks were from many tribes.  We in the
Loyal Confederacy use this village as our documentation so to speak for havi
folks of different tribes camped together.  We know that the residents of th
village appropriated the Tents belonging to Butlers Rangers and used them,
they also appropriated or were given worn out sails from the ships working t
lakes and smaller pieces of canvas used to wrap bails of goods.  The Indian
Department Stores at Niagra also had 20-30 oilcloths for issue to officers o
party with the natives.  having said all that you can see why we have no
problems with tents and ect.  Many folks make an actual wigwam frame and cov
it with blankets and canvas/oilcloths.  Others, myself included make a conic
lodge.  Everyone thinks its a teepee but there are many differences.  teepee
are tailored, conicals are not, you put up the frame same as a teepee but th
put the canvas on just like you would bark pieces, IE overlaping pieces and
then some smaller poles or brush to hold everything down.  The conical is th
fastest shelter to put up, requires the least equipment ect and is perfectly
authentic for the northeast.  Actually the Penn/Virginia/NC area is a little
south  for its use but my 18th Century Character and my modern self are stuc
in the south by circumstance not because of any great love for the area so t
speak.


Jeff Powers,Rogue & Ne'er do Well

Is Disney World a people trap operated by a mouse?

Net-Tamer V 1.08.1 - Test Drive

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 23:50:59 -0700
From: Steve Clapper <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Cedar Creek Outfitters

What/who is cedar creek outfitters & where can I find them?  Web site?

Thanks

Steve
C BAR 3 Connected

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Steve Clapper
HorseCraft & LeatherCraft
C BAR 3 CONNECTED

"Serenity is not freedom from the storm,
But peace amid the storm."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 15:00:52 -0800
From: Roger Lahti <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather

Allen,

Don't get much wet weather in eastern WA but when  we do we take shelter. If we
don't we swell up like a sponge cause we are so ordinarily dehydrated. As to
being in sloppy weather, we get sloppy. <G>

So what exactly are you asking? Cloths, shelter, foot ware, etc.? I remain....

YMOS
Capt. Lahti'

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 17:53:43 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pipe smoke

In a message dated 99-01-20 17:42:27 EST, you write:

> Are bear berries and wintergreen the same thing?

I think that bear berries and teaberries are the same thing.  Wintergreen is
different.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 19:21:16 -0600
From: "Douglas  Hepner" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: pre-1840 toilet tissue

    Ok, I'm just going to go ahead and ask! Does anyone have any references
to what was used as toilet tissue (for lack of a better word) when in the
woods or mountains pre-1840? Did they pack paper, use leaves, or just stop
at streams a lot?

Douglas

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 17:46:52 -0800
From: Pat Quilter <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Wet weather

Well I see this question has drawn our usual high level of discourse, so
I'll just sail in with my lame pilgrimish thoughts. Being from California,
we don't get THAT much wet weather, although last year was a notable
exception. What we get is typically cold rain (during the winter). I've
never experienced warm muggy rain like they get back East so I'll let them
boys comment. The real experts are probably the Canot du Nord fellows from
the Northwest, who favor wool and wouldn't hardly know what to do if it
didn't rain during an outing. As for me, I abandon all hopes of dry feet
during the day, but save a dry pair of socks or mocs for sleeping. If there
is any real question of freezing, it's important not to get soaked. I talked
my sponsor into a several day cross-country trek some years ago, in Nov,
despite the prediction of rain, thinking that we could make it over to our
state doings before it got too bad, and if we were caught out, we would
"just get wet" like he said happened during his long ride. No such thing.
When the mist settled into a drizzle during Day 3, we held up on the bank of
a gully under my canvas, and spent the next 24 hours slowly improving our
shelter. It did indeed freeze that night and he wasn't going to risk being
soaked. I have been out for several hours in spitting rain with my capote,
and my serape, both of which did a remarkable job of keeping me dry above
the knees, at least. I wear buckskins, and I can move about some in the
mist, but frankly I stay out of hard rain. So far, when caught out, my
overgarments seem to do the job. A good fire and any kind of shelter seems
to be the trick for me.
For What It's Worth (not much)
Pat Quilter 1658

- -----Original Message-----
From: Allen Hall [mailto:[e-mail]]
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 1999 5:20 PM
To: [e-mail]
Subject: MtMan-List: Wet weather


Hello the list,

Seveal of us are getting ready for a winter camp on the Lewis Fork of the
Snake River, right near where Osborne Russell described a hot spring.
Anyway, the forecast is for wet weather, not winter weather.  In getting
ready for this I thought it would be interesting to hear how different folks
deal with wet, sloppy weather.

Looking forward to your answers,

Allen Hall in Fort Hall country

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 19:45:03 -0600 (CST)
From: [e-mail] (Henry B. Crawford)
Subject: MtMan-List: Traps-Milwaukee Public Museum

>Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 20:09:03 -0800
>From: "Bz" <[e-mail]>
>Subject: MtMan-List: re Bonner and Hedges
>
>Tony
>    Found a mention of the Bonner and Hedges trap in Russell's Fire Arms
>Traps and Tools of the Mountain Man on page 141.
>    Says there is a trap in the Milwaukee Public Museum stamped Bonner and
>Hughes. Think is was made in Canada. Seems to say that it was made after
>1848.
>    Later
>    Buzz


That's a great museum with a very fine collection.  I was a member of their
professional staff until I moved to Texas in 1990.  The Leman trade rifle
on p. 72 of Russell's book is a fine specimen (and fun to hold, I might ad)
One of the perks of the museum profession.  Further info may be had from
my old friend John Lundstrom, Curator of Americana at the Milwaukee Public
Museum.  Reach him at 414/278-2784.  Give him my regards.

BTW, my 1986 paperback edition of Russell does not have a drawing of a trap
on p. 141.  I haven't found the picture.  Make sure you tell John which
edition you're using and check the page number.

Cheers,
HBC


*****************************************
Henry B. Crawford        Curator of History
[e-mail]     Museum of Texas Tech University
806/742-2442           Box 43191
FAX [phone]             Lubbock, TX  79409-3191
               WEBSITE: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum
******   Living History . . . Because it's there!   ******

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 17:49:30 -0800
From: Pat Quilter <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: MtMan-List: pre-1840 toilet tissue

There was somebody who found a pre-1840 reference to "bum fodder" so they
had SOMETHING, but one suspects the field solutions involved "all of the
choices".
Pat Quilter.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Douglas Hepner [mailto:[e-mail]]
Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 5:21 PM
To: [e-mail]
Subject: MtMan-List: pre-1840 toilet tissue


    Ok, I'm just going to go ahead and ask! Does anyone have any references
to what was used as toilet tissue (for lack of a better word) when in the
woods or mountains pre-1840? Did they pack paper, use leaves, or just stop
at streams a lot?

Douglas

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 20:56:58 -0500 (EST)
From: [e-mail]
Subject: MtMan-List: First Flint and Steel Fire

Okay gents this is great.  I have been kind of hesitant about making fire
with flint and metal.  Last night we had a fire so I grabbed an old tin can
and poked a small hole in the top.  I then cut up an old t-shirt and put it
in the can and stuck it in the fire.  about 15 min later pulled it out and
let it cool.

So tonight the little lady wants a fire so I break out the flint and steel
and some of the char cloth I made.  I put the char cloth on a little paper
and started to strike flint and steel.  Wala, the char cloth starts glowing
and next thing I have a fire.  This is great.  I mean throwing a knife and
hawk is fun but this is excellant.

Frank V. Rago

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 18:26:49 -0800
From: JW Stephens <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: pre-1840 toilet tissue

In the northwest especially, the plant "Mullein" makes excellent "bum
fodder" and I recall seeing an oblique reference to it's use. It is also
good for use in a smoking mixture (no reference) and as an infusion for
sore throat (no reference found yet). The plant is easily recognizable
by its soft, lancate leaves and the "fur" on the leaves does a better
job than other, slick leaves. Equally important, the leaves are big and
fairly tough. I get the impression that "bum fodder" was less for bush
lopers and more for tourists, though.

Douglas Hepner wrote:
>
>     Ok, I'm just going to go ahead and ask! Does anyone have any references
> to what was used as toilet tissue (for lack of a better word) when in the
> woods or mountains pre-1840? Did they pack paper, use leaves, or just stop
> at streams a lot?
>
> Douglas

- --

JW "LRay" Stephens, Squadron Commander; Lobo Solo Squadron
EPP Technician, Primary Color Systems, Inc., Irvine, CA
...
ICQ# 20564775   "mean people suck"

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 21:39:07 -0600
From: "yellow rose/pendleton" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: First Flint and Steel Fire

Frank,
  Cool ! ! ! Sounds like your on your way. Next thing you know you'll be
runnin around the woods in funny lookin clothes and shootin outdated guns.
It's a great hobby that turns into a great lifestyle and eventually a
totally new attitude. Glad to have you onboard.
Pendleton

- ----------
> From: [e-mail]
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: MtMan-List: First Flint and Steel Fire
> Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 7:56 PM
>
> Okay gents this is great.  I have been kind of hesitant about making fire
> with flint and metal.  Last night we had a fire so I grabbed an old tin
can
> and poked a small hole in the top.  I then cut up an old t-shirt and put
it
> in the can and stuck it in the fire.  about 15 min later pulled it out
and
> let it cool.
>
> So tonight the little lady wants a fire so I break out the flint and
steel
> and some of the char cloth I made.  I put the char cloth on a little
paper
> and started to strike flint and steel.  Wala, the char cloth starts
glowing
> and next thing I have a fire.  This is great.  I mean throwing a knife
and
> hawk is fun but this is excellant.
>
> Frank V. Rago
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 22:14:19 -0600
From: "yellow rose/pendleton" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather

Pat,
  Here in East Texas, we get a lot of rain in the spring, fall, and winter.
Since it is way too hot to do much in the summer, we camp mostly in those
seasons. The real key is to thoroughly grease your mocs using something
that will really stay on them. Keep an extra pair of dry socks to sleep in.
In cold weather wear wool socks. When you are buying wool socks pay close
attention. Buy only the ones that are 100 percent wool. There are many of
them that are labeled as wool, but are some kind of blend. 100 percent wool
is always the best way to go since wool retains it's insulating value much
better when it is wet. This is also true in choosing your upper garments. I
always dress in layers, wearing a flannel shirt next to the skin and a
muslin shirt or fustian shirt over that. A good choice over that is a caped
frock. The cape will really shed water well. In extreme cold I wear a
blanket shirt instead of the frock or sometimes a capote, both are 100
percent wool. The bottom line is if it rains long enough you are going to
get soaked no matter what you do. Just keep the fire going, try to stay
warm, eat plenty of high energy food, and guard against hypothermia. Wet
weather in 35 to 40 degree temps can be really tough sometimes you just
have to hunker down. I hope these tips will help.
Pendleton
BE SAFE  HAVE FUN

- ----------
> From: Pat Quilter <[e-mail]>
> To: '[e-mail]'
> Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Wet weather
> Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 7:46 PM
>
> Well I see this question has drawn our usual high level of discourse, so
> I'll just sail in with my lame pilgrimish thoughts. Being from
California,
> we don't get THAT much wet weather, although last year was a notable
> exception. What we get is typically cold rain (during the winter). I've
> never experienced warm muggy rain like they get back East so I'll let
them
> boys comment. The real experts are probably the Canot du Nord fellows
from
> the Northwest, who favor wool and wouldn't hardly know what to do if it
> didn't rain during an outing. As for me, I abandon all hopes of dry feet
> during the day, but save a dry pair of socks or mocs for sleeping. If
there
> is any real question of freezing, it's important not to get soaked. I
talked
> my sponsor into a several day cross-country trek some years ago, in Nov,
> despite the prediction of rain, thinking that we could make it over to
our
> state doings before it got too bad, and if we were caught out, we would
> "just get wet" like he said happened during his long ride. No such thing.
> When the mist settled into a drizzle during Day 3, we held up on the bank
of
> a gully under my canvas, and spent the next 24 hours slowly improving our
> shelter. It did indeed freeze that night and he wasn't going to risk
being
> soaked. I have been out for several hours in spitting rain with my
capote,
> and my serape, both of which did a remarkable job of keeping me dry above
> the knees, at least. I wear buckskins, and I can move about some in the
> mist, but frankly I stay out of hard rain. So far, when caught out, my
> overgarments seem to do the job. A good fire and any kind of shelter
seems
> to be the trick for me.
> For What It's Worth (not much)
> Pat Quilter 1658
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Allen Hall [mailto:[e-mail]]
> Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 1999 5:20 PM
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: MtMan-List: Wet weather
>
>
> Hello the list,
>
> Seveal of us are getting ready for a winter camp on the Lewis Fork of the
> Snake River, right near where Osborne Russell described a hot spring.
> Anyway, the forecast is for wet weather, not winter weather.  In getting
> ready for this I thought it would be interesting to hear how different
folks
> deal with wet, sloppy weather.
>
> Looking forward to your answers,
>
> Allen Hall in Fort Hall country

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 20:38:28 -0700
From: "Eldon L Ayers" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather

To tell the truth I do not deal with wet sloppy weather well.  First I get
wet and then I stay wet until I dry out.  It is only a real inconvenience at
first, then it becomes drudgery.  Kind of like Clyman refers to in his
biography when he talks about the first weeks out of Independence in
non-stop rain and drizzle.  Have fun and forget about staying dry.  When we
have a wet doin's up here in Montana we always fill a container with water
and put it where everyone can get their feet in it if we start to dry out.
Get up in the morning, dip your feet in the water and proceed with your day.

Adios
2Badger

- -----Original Message-----
From: Allen Hall <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 3:39 PM
Subject: MtMan-List: Wet weather


>Hello the list,
>
>Seveal of us are getting ready for a winter camp on the Lewis Fork of the
>Snake River, right near where Osborne Russell described a hot spring.
>Anyway, the forecast is for wet weather, not winter weather.  In getting
>ready for this I thought it would be interesting to hear how different
folks
>deal with wet, sloppy weather.
>
>Looking forward to your answers,
>
>Allen Hall in Fort Hall country
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 22:30:23 -0600
From: "yellow rose/pendleton" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather

Eldon,
  You are not  wrong. I'll try to get Lanney Ratcliff to put his journal
entries on the list refering to our stay on the Red River west of Whichta
Falls in mid Feb. It rained everyday for a week, was cold as your
mother-in-laws love, and even had a hail storm. One guys false teeth stayed
frozen in a cup for two or three days. We had a large time and learned more
in that camp in a week then a lot of guys learn about survival in years.
Pendleton

- ----------
> From: Eldon L Ayers <[e-mail]>
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather
> Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 9:38 PM
>
> To tell the truth I do not deal with wet sloppy weather well.  First I
get
> wet and then I stay wet until I dry out.  It is only a real inconvenience
at
> first, then it becomes drudgery.  Kind of like Clyman refers to in his
> biography when he talks about the first weeks out of Independence in
> non-stop rain and drizzle.  Have fun and forget about staying dry.  When
we
> have a wet doin's up here in Montana we always fill a container with
water
> and put it where everyone can get their feet in it if we start to dry
out.
> Get up in the morning, dip your feet in the water and proceed with your
day.
>
> Adios
> 2Badger
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Allen Hall <[e-mail]>
> To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
> Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 3:39 PM
> Subject: MtMan-List: Wet weather
>
>
> >Hello the list,
> >
> >Seveal of us are getting ready for a winter camp on the Lewis Fork of
the
> >Snake River, right near where Osborne Russell described a hot spring.
> >Anyway, the forecast is for wet weather, not winter weather.  In getting
> >ready for this I thought it would be interesting to hear how different
> folks
> >deal with wet, sloppy weather.
> >
> >Looking forward to your answers,
> >
> >Allen Hall in Fort Hall country
> >
> >
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 22:05:21 -0600
From: "Ron and Gayle Harris" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather

- -----Original Message-----
From: yellow rose/pendleton <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 9:33 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather


>Pat,
>  Here in East Texas, we get a lot of rain in the spring, fall, and winter.
>Since it is way too hot to do much in the summer, we camp mostly in those
>seasons. The real key is to thoroughly grease your mocs using something
>that will really stay on them. Keep an extra pair of dry socks to sleep in.
>In cold weather wear wool socks. When you are buying wool socks pay close
>attention. Buy only the ones that are 100 percent wool. There are many of
>them that are labeled as wool, but are some kind of blend. 100 percent wool
>is always the best way to go since wool retains it's insulating value much
>better when it is wet. This is also true in choosing your upper garments. I
>always dress in layers, wearing a flannel shirt next to the skin and a
>muslin shirt or fustian shirt over that. A good choice over that is a caped
>frock. The cape will really shed water well. In extreme cold I wear a
>blanket shirt instead of the frock or sometimes a capote, both are 100
>percent wool. The bottom line is if it rains long enough you are going to
>get soaked no matter what you do. Just keep the fire going, try to stay
>warm, eat plenty of high energy food, and guard against hypothermia. Wet
>weather in 35 to 40 degree temps can be really tough sometimes you just
>have to hunker down. I hope these tips will help.
>Pendleton
>BE SAFE  HAVE FUN
>
>---Something I like to do is keep Lanney Ratcliff very handy!!!!
In cold, wet, miserable weather, he is the BEST!!!!
The boy has the metaboplism of a 300 pound shrew!!!
Son, if you hug up to him, you will be warm.
No kidding, he realy saved my life at a doins on the Red.
I was sick and wet and about done.
Spent about 24 hours up against him.

ron "litefoot" harris
P.S. thanks "Zwey"!!

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 22:54:12 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pipe smoke

close as i can see, the following def's show that teaberry (checkerberry) is
the same as American Wintergreen, which isn't to say its the same as the form
of  wintergreen we refer to today.

BEAR-BERRY, n. A plant, a species of Arbutus.

TEABERRY, n.  [from the use of its leaves as a substitute for tea]
First appeared 1818  aka CHECKERBERRY  check*er*ber*ry (noun)
[checker wild service tree + berry] First appeared 1776  1 : the spicy red
berrylike fruit of an American wintergreen (Gaultheria procumbens) 2 : a plant
producing checkerberries

WINTER-BERRY, n. [winter and berry.] A plant of the genus Prinos.

WINTER-GREEN, n. [winter and green.] A plant of the genus Pyrola, useful as a
vulnerary.  VULNERARY, a. Any plant, drug or composition, useful in the cure
of wounds. Certain unguents, balsams and the like, are used as vulneraries

these came from Noahs 1828 and the modern M-W dictionaries.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 22:45:54 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather

wet weather? pray for snow <G>.  or try making an oil cloth poncho; wear lots
of wool to stay warm even when wet, and keep something dry to wear when
sleeping. oh yeah, having some anti-freeze in your jug (and then your belly)
will help you forget about how wet it is, well at least until you wake up in
the middle of the night FROZEN cuz you drank it and forgot to put on the dry
stuff.  yhs   Barney Fife

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 20:39:32 -0800
From: Chris Sega <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: pre-1840 toilet tissue (Mullein)

JW Stephens wrote:

> In the northwest especially, the plant "Mullein" makes excellent "bum
> fodder" snip

Mullein can be found almost anywhere in the US and is especially common in the
west.  As For TP I have had the odious task of chopping out an acre of mullein in
an area which was to be reclaimed.  The stuff caused burning and irritation from
the fine pubescence (hair) which covers the plant.  I itched and burned for quite
some time. These plants were green. I have heard of Mullein being used as TP
several times.  Although I have not done so, I would imagine that the dry leaves
should be used and not green plants.  Anyone who has actually done so, Please
tell us if you used green or dry Mullein.  On another note Mullein can be
pulverised and used to stun fish in dammed up streams and the fibrous stalks can
be used to make cordage, and I have been told, fire drills.

Your most onry' and disobedient hivernant
Sega

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 20:59:04 -0800 (PST)
From: Lee Newbill <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Cedar Creek Outfitters

On Tue, 19 Jan 1999, Steve Clapper wrote:
> What/who is cedar creek outfitters & where can I find them?  Web site?

Steve, the last address I had for them was;
http://pages.prodigy.com/cedarcreekoutfitters/

it's dead now.  They did specialize in Saddles, clothing (leather and
cloth), brain tanned leather, and more.

Dat's all folks

Regards

Lee Newbill
Viola, Idaho
email at [e-mail]
Keeper of the "Buckskins & Blackpowder!" Webpage
http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Gorge/7186

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 00:03:44 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Cedar Creek Outfitters

Dont know if this is the right one, but...
<A HREF="http://www.blueridge.net/~cedarcreek/index.html">Cedar Creek Stables
and Outfitters</A>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 22:35:24 -0800
From: "john c. funk,jr" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather

Eldon,

Please contact me off line.  Need some info.  Thanks
John Funk         [e-mail]


- -----Original Message-----
From: Eldon L Ayers <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 8:38 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather


>To tell the truth I do not deal with wet sloppy weather well.  First I get
>wet and then I stay wet until I dry out.  It is only a real inconvenience
at
>first, then it becomes drudgery.  Kind of like Clyman refers to in his
>biography when he talks about the first weeks out of Independence in
>non-stop rain and drizzle.  Have fun and forget about staying dry.  When we
>have a wet doin's up here in Montana we always fill a container with water
>and put it where everyone can get their feet in it if we start to dry out.
>Get up in the morning, dip your feet in the water and proceed with your
day.
>
>Adios
>2Badger
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Allen Hall <[e-mail]>
>To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
>Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 3:39 PM
>Subject: MtMan-List: Wet weather
>
>
>>Hello the list,
>>
>>Seveal of us are getting ready for a winter camp on the Lewis Fork of the
>>Snake River, right near where Osborne Russell described a hot spring.
>>Anyway, the forecast is for wet weather, not winter weather.  In getting
>>ready for this I thought it would be interesting to hear how different
>folks
>>deal with wet, sloppy weather.
>>
>>Looking forward to your answers,
>>
>>Allen Hall in Fort Hall country
>>
>>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 02:52:52 EST
From: Ted A Hart <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather

Where in East Texas do you live?  I have family in the Tyler area and
have been trying to find a job thereabouts...let me know if you happen to
know of several job possiblities....since this isn't pertaining to the
list please contact me off the list.  Thanks.

Ted Hart
[e-mail]

___________________________________________________________________
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or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 05:57:41 -0600
From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather

And neither of us have been the same since.  I gotta go to work now but =
I will post parts of my journal from the Red River Rendezvous tonight.  =
Memorable.
Lanney Ratcliff
- -----Original Message-----
From: Ron and Gayle Harris <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 9:58 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather


>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: yellow rose/pendleton <[e-mail]>
>To: [e-mail] <[e-mail]>
>Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 9:33 PM
>Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Wet weather
>
>
>>Pat,
>>  Here in East Texas, we get a lot of rain in the spring, fall, and =
winter.
>>Since it is way too hot to do much in the summer, we camp mostly in =
those
>>seasons. The real key is to thoroughly grease your mocs using =
something
>>that will really stay on them. Keep an extra pair of dry socks to =
sleep in.
>>In cold weather wear wool socks. When you are buying wool socks pay =
close
>>attention. Buy only the ones that are 100 percent wool. There are many =
of
>>them that are labeled as wool, but are some kind of blend. 100 percent =
wool
>>is always the best way to go since wool retains it's insulating value =
much
>>better when it is wet. This is also true in choosing your upper =
garments. I
>>always dress in layers, wearing a flannel shirt next to the skin and a
>>muslin shirt or fustian shirt over that. A good choice over that is a =
caped
>>frock. The cape will really shed water well. In extreme cold I wear a
>>blanket shirt instead of the frock or sometimes a capote, both are 100
>>percent wool. The bottom line is if it rains long enough you are going =
to
>>get soaked no matter what you do. Just keep the fire going, try to =
stay
>>warm, eat plenty of high energy food, and guard against hypothermia. =
Wet
>>weather in 35 to 40 degree temps can be really tough sometimes you =
just
>>have to hunker down. I hope these tips will help.
>>Pendleton
>>BE SAFE  HAVE FUN
>>
>>---Something I like to do is keep Lanney Ratcliff very handy!!!!
>In cold, wet, miserable weather, he is the BEST!!!!
>The boy has the metaboplism of a 300 pound shrew!!!
>Son, if you hug up to him, you will be warm.
>No kidding, he realy saved my life at a doins on the Red.
>I was sick and wet and about done.
>Spent about 24 hours up against him.
>
>ron "litefoot" harris
>P.S. thanks "Zwey"!!
>
>
>

------------------------------

End of hist_text-digest V1 #223
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