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hist_text-digest      Sunday, December 28 2003      Volume 01 : Number 1290



In this issue:

-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help
-áááááá MtMan-List: beginner needs help
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 17:33:24 -0600
From: John Dearing <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help

Thanks Dennis. Everything I posted came through experience. I wish that
someone had imparted some of that wisdom on me when I started too. ;-)
J.D.

>Damned fine advice John.... Wish I would have had all those many Winters
>ago...
>D
>
>Double Edge Forge
>www.bright.net/~deforge1
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "John Dearing" <[e-mail]>
>To: <[e-mail]>
>Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2003 11:57 PM
>Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help
>
>
> > The good Captain gives good advice, but there is more.
> >
> > 1 Take your time.
> > 2 Decide what time period and geographic area you want to portray.
> > 3 Read everything you can get your hands on about that time period.
> > 4 Ask more questions of KNOWLEDGEABLE people.
> > 5 DO NOT take peoples advice at rendezvous for what you need. Most don't
> > know beans about history,   but are more than willing to sell you some
> > item, or another, that you WON'T need.
> > 6 Don't believe what anyone tells you about "common knowledge history".
> > 99.99% of it is wrong. Ask for a source of that item or information, and
> > then RESEARCH that item before you buy. Researching an item before you buy
> > will save money in the long run. Especially big ticket items.
> > 7 Avoid the gottahaves. For the most part, you don't gottahave nothing,
> > other than basic clothing and camp equipment.
> > 8 learn to sew, both leather and cloth.
> > 9 buy GOOD patterns for complicated items, pants, knee britches, etc.
> > Simple things like shirts or hunting pouches don't require
> > patterns...usually. Depending on your knowledge of sewing.
> > 10 Beg, borrow, or buy GOOD books on making clothing and equipment. Making
> > your own gear is allot less expensive than buying those items, and you
>will
> > probably come to appreciate good hand made items. Not to mention time and
> > fabric saved by using GOOD patterns and instructions.
> > 11 DO NOT mix clothing from different time periods. It looks hokey, and
> > identifies the wearer as someone who either doesn't know their history, or
> > doesn't care.
> > 12 search the Internet for instructions for making clothing, moccasins,
> > camp gear, guns etc.
> >
> > Here are a few sites to get you started. I like the colonial period,can
>you
> > tell? ;-)
> >
> > http://members.aol.com/liv18thc/index.html
> >
> > http://digital.library.pitt.edu/cgi-bin/t/text/text-idx?c=pitttext
> >
> > http://www.aspecialplace.net/MariesCookbook/18th_century_recipes.htm
> >
> > http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/award99/icuhtml/fawhome.html
> >
> > http://www.nativetech.org/
> >
> > http://www.liming.org/alra/
> >
> > This last page has an outstanding reading list, but don't let my emphasis
> > on research deter you from getting involved in the sport. Not everyone has
> > to become an amateur historian to participate, but it does increase the
> > enjoyment of the rendezvous/re-enactment experience to know the history
> > surrounding your chosen time period.
> >
> > By adhering to the advice given by the good Captain, myself, and a few
> > others on this list, you will gather good items that you will need without
> > spending lots of hard earned cash. And get what you need on the first
> > purchase as opposed to buying something you don't need and having to trade
> > that item off to acquire a more proper one.
> >
> > J.D.
> >
> >
> > >I see that several others have posted on your question and given some
>good
> > >advice. I like to recommend "The Book Of Buckskinning" series put out by
>the
> > >publishers of Muzzle Loader magazine. I think it is up to about 8 volumes
> > >now. A new volume came out every few years over the past couple decades
>with
> > >the idea to answer questions such as yours. While they are not cheap in
> > >their total, going for somewhere around $16 per volume give or take a
>couple
> > >bucks, they are just jam packed with good useful info on virtually any
>topic
> > >you might be interested in concerning this hobby.
> > >
> > >I would also direct your attention to the work of Rex Allen Norman who
>has
> > >added to the Mt. Man Sketch Book series (a less expensive series of
>magazine
> > >sized books that deal with virtually every type of Persona from the
> > >matchlock era to the Mt. Man era). Rex has come up with a fairly well
> > >researched "sketch book" on specifically the Mt. Man, what his gear was
> > >like, what he wore, what he shot, on and on. It's probably the cheapest
>bit
> > >of info you could come up with right off.
> > >
> > >Most of the suttlers that you would find at Rendezvous or on line will
>sell
> > >such books and more. I'll add that one in your position might do some
> > >reading before doing any buying or making. Though you can make most of
>your
> > >gear, you can also make gear that is not correct to the period by copying
> > >what you see at most rendezvous/shoots. A lot of new information has come
> > >out in recent years on what it really was like way back but many already
> > >have spent much time, effort and not a little money on their gear and are
> > >loath to throw it out and make new. You won't hurt yourself by going
>slow.
> > >
> > >YMOS
> > >Capt. Lahti'
> > >
> > >
> > >----------------------
> > >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
> >
> >
> > ----------------------
> > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>
>
>----------------------
>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html


- ----------------------
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 15:53:46 -0800
From: "Kim-Ken Carpenter" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help

A good book I haven't seen referenced for beginners to research is
Firearms, Traps and Tools of the Mountain Men, by Carl P. Russell.  Lots of
good pics, drawings and written info.

Carp

> [Original Message]
> From: John Dearing <[e-mail]>
> To: <[e-mail]>
> Date: 12/28/2003 3:16:23 PM
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help
>
> Well bb and list,
> The point I tried to make, maybe not as well as I would have liked, was
for
> him to decide what time period and area he wanted to recreate BEFORE he
> spent allot of money on clothing and equipment that he might later find
> that can't use. It doesn't take years to do some basic research and
acquire
> some knowledge of history before jumping into the sport. Yes, the details
> can wait for a while, but how many of us have spent allot of time,
effort,
> and money on incorrect clothing and equipment before we decided to
recreate
> a specific time period, only to re outfit ourselves once we settled on a
> time period and geographic area?
>
> The area where one lives might affect what time period and persona they
> want to recreate.
> Someone living east of the Mississippi might want to do eastern
longhunter,
> militiaman, scout, or ranger of the F&I  period, while someone living in
> the west might want to do western mountain man.
>
> And yes, yard sales, flea markets and Salvation Army stores can be a good
> source of camp items and raw materials for clothing and equipment.
Nothing
> wrong with that.
>
> Most rendezvous in MO/Ill allow new folks to compete while wearing street
> clothes. Nothing wrong with that either. There are also modern camping
> areas, at most events, to allow newcomers to participate in local events
as
> they put their clothing and gear together.
>
> My advice stands, though slightly modified.
> 1 Decide what time period and area you want to recreate.
> 2 Do some basic research.
> 3 Get your hands on some GOOD books.
> 4 Get some GOOD patterns.
> 5 Learn to sew.
> 6 Ask questions of knowledgeable people. Just because someone looks good
at
> rondy doesn't mean they know anything about correct clothing and
equipment
> for any given time period. Ask for sources.
> 7 Beware of friendly traders trying to sell you something you may not
want.
> 8 Avoid the gottahaves, also known as impulse buying
> 9 Go have fun.
>
> J.D.
>
>
>
> >    Yes, that is great advice if you want to be in an outfit in a couple
of
> >years and you were not a boy.
> >    His boy won't care about the era by time he does all that research.
> >    Go to a rendezvous, get a cheap outfit, have fun and get more serious
> >from there if you want to.
> >    Strike while the iron is hot. The boy has the rest of his life to
argue
> >over what is authentic and what is not with everyone.
> >    I used to get real serious with beginners on primitive trekking and
> >trapping now I just want them to have fun. They will get more into it
> >if they enjoy it first. The boy needs to have fun and he is on a
> >budget.
> >    just my opinion,
> >       bb
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > The good Captain gives good advice, but there is more.
> > >
> > > 1 Take your time.
> > > 2 Decide what time period and geographic area you want to portray.
> > > 3 Read everything you can get your hands on about that time period.
> > > 4 Ask more questions of KNOWLEDGEABLE people.
> > > 5 DO NOT take peoples advice at rendezvous for what you need. Most
don't
> > > know beans about history,   but are more than willing to sell you some
> > > item, or another, that you WON'T need.
> > > 6 Don't believe what anyone tells you about "common knowledge
history".
> > > 99.99% of it is wrong. Ask for a source of that item or information,
and
> > > then RESEARCH that item before you buy. Researching an item before
you buy
> > > will save money in the long run. Especially big ticket items.
> > > 7 Avoid the gottahaves. For the most part, you don't gottahave
nothing,
> > > other than basic clothing and camp equipment.
> > > 8 learn to sew, both leather and cloth.
> > > 9 buy GOOD patterns for complicated items, pants, knee britches, etc.
> > > Simple things like shirts or hunting pouches don't require
> > > patterns...usually. Depending on your knowledge of sewing.
> > > 10 Beg, borrow, or buy GOOD books on making clothing and equipment.
Making
> > > your own gear is allot less expensive than buying those items, and you
> > > will
> > > probably come to appreciate good hand made items. Not to mention time
and
> > > fabric saved by using GOOD patterns and instructions.
> > > 11 DO NOT mix clothing from different time periods. It looks hokey,
and
> > > identifies the wearer as someone who either doesn't know their
history, or
> > > doesn't care.
> > > 12 search the Internet for instructions for making clothing,
moccasins,
> > > camp gear, guns etc.
> > >
> > > Here are a few sites to get you started. I like the colonial
period,can
> > > you
> > > tell? ;-)
> > >
> > > http://members.aol.com/liv18thc/index.html
> > >
> > > http://digital.library.pitt.edu/cgi-bin/t/text/text-idx?c=pitttext
> > >
> > > http://www.aspecialplace.net/MariesCookbook/18th_century_recipes.htm
> > >
> > > http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/award99/icuhtml/fawhome.html
> > >
> > > http://www.nativetech.org/
> > >
> > > http://www.liming.org/alra/
> > >
> > > This last page has an outstanding reading list, but don't let my
emphasis
> > > on research deter you from getting involved in the sport. Not
everyone has
> > > to become an amateur historian to participate, but it does increase
the
> > > enjoyment of the rendezvous/re-enactment experience to know the
history
> > > surrounding your chosen time period.
> > >
> > > By adhering to the advice given by the good Captain, myself, and a few
> > > others on this list, you will gather good items that you will need
without
> > > spending lots of hard earned cash. And get what you need on the first
> > > purchase as opposed to buying something you don't need and having to
trade
> > > that item off to acquire a more proper one.
> > >
> > > J.D.
> > >
> > >
> > >>I see that several others have posted on your question and given some
> > >> good
> > >>advice. I like to recommend "The Book Of Buckskinning" series put out
by
> > >> the
> > >>publishers of Muzzle Loader magazine. I think it is up to about 8
volumes
> > >>now. A new volume came out every few years over the past couple
decades
> > >> with
> > >>the idea to answer questions such as yours. While they are not cheap
in
> > >>their total, going for somewhere around $16 per volume give or take a
> > >> couple
> > >>bucks, they are just jam packed with good useful info on virtually any
> > >> topic
> > >>you might be interested in concerning this hobby.
> > >>
> > >>I would also direct your attention to the work of Rex Allen Norman who
> > >> has
> > >>added to the Mt. Man Sketch Book series (a less expensive series of
> > >> magazine
> > >>sized books that deal with virtually every type of Persona from the
> > >>matchlock era to the Mt. Man era). Rex has come up with a fairly well
> > >>researched "sketch book" on specifically the Mt. Man, what his gear
was
> > >>like, what he wore, what he shot, on and on. It's probably the
cheapest
> > >> bit
> > >>of info you could come up with right off.
> > >>
> > >>Most of the suttlers that you would find at Rendezvous or on line will
> > >> sell
> > >>such books and more. I'll add that one in your position might do some
> > >>reading before doing any buying or making. Though you can make most of
> > >> your
> > >>gear, you can also make gear that is not correct to the period by
copying
> > >>what you see at most rendezvous/shoots. A lot of new information has
come
> > >>out in recent years on what it really was like way back but many
already
> > >>have spent much time, effort and not a little money on their gear and
are
> > >>loath to throw it out and make new. You won't hurt yourself by going
> > >> slow.
> > >>
> > >>YMOS
> > >>Capt. Lahti'
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>----------------------
> > >>hist_text list info:
http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
> > >
> > >
> > > ----------------------
> > > hist_text list info:
http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
> > >
> >
> >
> >----------------------
> >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html



- ----------------------
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 18:35:52 -0600
From: "Frank Fusco" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: beginner needs help

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C3CD71.6BF89E80
Content-Type: text/plain;
    charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<<<A good friend of mine has introduced my son and I to the world of the
> mountain men this past summer and we really enjoyed.  In fact is has =
come
to
> be something special between my son and I along with helping him with =
his
> reading problem as we read everything we can get our hands on...even
started
> our own collection of stories that really enjoy.
>
> Anyway, he and I want to get starting in gear & clothing but with so =
much
to
> do and so many things to get, I don't know where to start.  Money =
doesn't
> grow on tress in our camp.  I have wanted to start with some of the =
fun
> items (rifles, hawks, knives, etc.) but I know that the clothing makes =
a
> difference as well.
>
> Where should we start?
>
> ED>>>

        Ed
    You have already received a lot of good advice from some really =
knowledgeable folks.
    I'll throw in my slant on things.
    First, the advice about getting a couple good books, very good. The =
MM series is excellent, start with #1.
    Second, I know this list is devoted to the Mountain Man of the Rocky =
Mountain Fur Trade era (RMFT), but do keep in mind that there are many =
aspects to early American history. Pick the persona that most interests =
you. At the same time, where you live can be an important influence. =
i.e. Showing up at a rendezvous in Wyoming wearing the fine linens and =
silks of an eastern gentleman just wouldn't work.
    Third,contrary to what others have said, listen to everyone. But do =
it with both an open and skeptical mind. Use common sense and then lean =
on those you learn to trust as being truly knowledgeable in their given =
persona.
    Fourth, try to attend rendezvous that have 'open' days for tourists. =
This is usually on weekends. You can then enter a rendezvous in modern =
clothes without a problem. Spend as much time as possible talking to =
participants. Visit traders but be slow to purchase items you are not =
sure about. The advice about buying patterns and making you own is =
excellent. While some reenactors are stringent about types of leather =
and cloth, personally, I believe anything that will pass the 'arms =
length' test is usually acceptable. One of my favorite coats is made of =
a cotton/poly blend. My wife made it for me and I believed it was all =
natural fabric for almost ten years until she told me. When I took my =
daughter to a ronny when she was only seven I made her a capote from an =
all synthetic blanket material. It looked good, passed the arms length =
test and even felt like wool. It was cheap and she rapidly outgrew it. =
But it served its purpose.
    Good luck and let us know how things work out.
Frank

- ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C3CD71.6BF89E80
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<DIV><<<A good friend of mine has introduced my son and I to =
the world=20
of the<BR>> mountain men this past summer and we really =
enjoyed.  In=20
fact is has come<BR>to<BR>> be something special between my son and I =
along=20
with helping him with his<BR>> reading problem as we read everything =
we can=20
get our hands on...even<BR>started<BR>> our own collection of stories =
that=20
really enjoy.<BR>><BR>> Anyway, he and I want to get starting in =
gear=20
& clothing but with so much<BR>to<BR>> do and so many things to =
get, I=20
don't know where to start.  Money doesn't<BR>> grow on tress in =
our=20
camp.  I have wanted to start with some of the fun<BR>> items =
(rifles,=20
hawks, knives, etc.) but I know that the clothing makes a<BR>> =
difference as=20
well.<BR>><BR>> Where should we start?<BR>><BR>>=20
ED>>></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>        Ed</DIV>
<DIV>    You have already received a lot of good advice =
from some=20
really knowledgeable folks.</DIV>
<DIV>    I'll throw in my slant on things.</DIV>
<DIV>    First, the advice about getting a couple good =
books,=20
very good. The MM series is excellent, start with #1.</DIV>
<DIV>    Second, I know this list is devoted to the =
Mountain Man=20
of the Rocky Mountain Fur Trade era (RMFT), but do keep in mind that =
there are=20
many aspects to early American history. Pick the persona that most =
interests=20
you. At the same time, where you live can be an important influence. =
i.e.=20
Showing up at a rendezvous in Wyoming wearing the fine linens and silks =
of an=20
eastern gentleman just wouldn't work.</DIV>
<DIV>    Third,contrary to what others have said, listen =
to=20
everyone. But do it with both an open and skeptical mind. Use common =
sense and=20
then lean on those you learn to trust as being truly knowledgeable =
in their=20
given persona.</DIV>
<DIV>    Fourth, try to attend rendezvous that have =
'open' days=20
for tourists. This is usually on weekends. You can then enter a =
rendezvous in=20
modern clothes without a problem. Spend as much time as possible talking =
to=20
participants. Visit traders but be slow to purchase items you are not =
sure=20
about. The advice about buying patterns and making you own is excellent. =
While=20
some reenactors are stringent about types of leather and cloth, =
personally, I=20
believe anything that will pass the 'arms length' test is usually =
acceptable.=20
One of my favorite coats is made of a cotton/poly blend. My wife made it =
for me=20
and I believed it was all natural fabric for almost ten years until she =
told me.=20
When I took my daughter to a ronny when she was only seven I made her a =
capote=20
from an all synthetic blanket material. It looked good, passed the arms =
length=20
test and even felt like wool. It was cheap and she rapidly outgrew it. =
But it=20
served its purpose.</DIV>
<DIV>    Good luck and let us know how things work =
out.</DIV>
<DIV>Frank<BR></DIV></BODY></HTML>

- ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C3CD71.6BF89E80--


- ----------------------
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 20:10:17 -0500
From: "Addison Miller" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help

>The point I tried to make, maybe not as well as I would have liked, was for
> him to decide what time period and area he wanted to recreate BEFORE he
> spent allot of money

Most definately make up your mind before you start buying lots of "stuff"!!
At the Alafia I will have mucho goodies out on my trade blanket from just
such a goof, many years ago. I figure if it ain't been out of the trailer in
three
years, then I didn't need it in the first place!!  For a good "Beginners"
guide,
go to my web site, www.geocities.com/ronnyvous and read the part about
START here... Gives a pretty good guide of what to do and not to do
when you first start out. As I say in the text, I have made ALL of the
mistakes... that's why I am have the Mountain Man version of a good
old fashioned garage sale... make that "Lean-To Sale"... *grins*

>And yes, yard sales, flea markets and Salvation Army stores can be agood

I have found Whitney and HBC blankets... NEW in the GW stores, plus some
GREAT buys on pewter.... Wife decided I needed to be more of a gentleman
and we should have a "gentle-persons" camp... *grins* ... Ah well, ya gotta
keep 'em happy... I still wear my skins more than not, but now and then she
dresses me up for various reasons... Point is, if you have good GW stores in
the area, you can really get some good buys there. Have even found Green
River knives, and carving set at one... They are mine now.

Regards,

Ad Miller



- ----------------------
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 17:43:24 -0800
From: "roger lahti" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help

bb,

Your though on giving some promising youngster something they won't out grow
is right on the money too.

I'm not ready for a dirt bath just yet but I got lots of "things" that
probably need giving away over the next few years of Rendezvous. I think
I'll keep my eyes peeled for those "upstarts" that don't look like they'll
be " a flash in the pan" and potlatch something nice on the closest one from
time to time.

Let's see now. I got me way too many double barrel percussion shot guns,
probably three flint lock rifles too many, a couple smoothbore flint locks
that ain't gonna get much more use, a couple nice flint smooth pistols that
could go to a good home, more powder horns than I can carry, quill work that
should be hanging around some pretty young ladies neck or holding up some
young bucks legg'ens. I know someone will get use out of my linen haversack
and knap sack and the copper pots and copper flasks will be well used by the
right newbie. I can only use one favorite knife at a time so no sense in me
hanging on to all of them. And that brain tan long coat and leggings need to
go to just the right person.

Guess it will boil down to who's closest to me fetching my wood and water
and fluffing up my bed roll at night when I get in the give'in mood. <G>

Be see'in you youngsters come green up I imagine. Winter well and may
visions of full stocks dance in your heads.

YMOS
Capt. Lahti'


- ----------------------
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 18:59:14 -0700
From: James and Sue Stone <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help

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Hi all,
I like the way this conversation string is going.  I just want to add
how easy it can be to get hooked as a youngster, and how simple it is
from a re-enactor standpoint.  Granted, this is for a different time and
period, but the principal is the same for all of it.

I went to school in VA and happened to end up at a North-Sourth Scrimage
Assn. meet.  That's where people pick a unit and match  their gear,
frequently down to the model year of the gear (1862 bullseye canteen,
for instance).  I was talking with guys from a Maryland unit for a long
time.  Even though I didn't have a firearm, and wouldn;'t have one for
the foreseeable future, one of them gave me one of their paper
cartridges.  Their version was just a cardboard tube with powder using a
greased Minie' ball for a plug.  I still have that minie, unless I shot
it from either my 1861 model (contract) Springfield
original, or my replica pattern 1853 Enfield rifle-musket.  I have the
gear to do that era, but it took years to sprout the planted seeds, and
of course I had to have a little more money.

Now I actively reenact the period of 1807 with the ALRA...post L&C St.
Louis as a drygoods merchant, as my wife is a historical textile and
clothing expert.

This is fun.  Maybe someone can pass this message to the Maryland N-S
Scrimage Assn. and say thanks for me.
With this age of electronic communication, maybe I'll surf them up and
thank them myself!  Mind you, that free Minie' ball was given to me
about 1965 or 1966.

Sparks






[e-mail] wrote:

>Capt.,
>  Your right, JD's post is great, I saved it for my own use.
>  New comers can't be overwhelmed with things like thread counts, brain
>tanned etc... especially young kids. They want to have fun with guns,
>leggings, throwing axes and sleeping with just a few blankets under the
>stars! Now that is living for a boy!!! That's adventure!
>  I remember going to my Grandmothers farm as a child in the Missouri
>woods. We would hike to the back field at night and see the darkest,
>biggest sky I ever saw! And stars like I never saw in my life!! I was
>hooked on the great outdoors!
>  His boy will outgrow any outfit he makes him before he is done with it
>anyway! It's fun just exploring a rendezvous too! I love seeing them
>kids running pell mell through camp tripping on tent ropes and shooting
>them stupid pop guns. They are the future of this great era.
>  Go out, have fun and worry about types of buttons, small details, etc...
>latter.
>  And anyone of us "old timers" that meet a young boy or girl at a
>rendezvous that shows real promise, give them something that they won't
>out-grow like a haversack, throwing axe, candle lantern or something
>like that.
>       bb
>
>
>
>>bb,
>>
>>Ya know it's hard to do some times but I'm thinking that your take on
>>"advice" is more on the money than the way most of us go about it. I'm
>>guilty too. I liked JD's list and advice, don't get me wrong. But throwing
>>too much at a newcomer right off is probably not the best way to make them
>>a
>>life long participant.
>>
>>Not, at least, unless they ask for it. <G>
>>
>>Capt. Lahti'
>>
>>llist.html
>>
>>
>>----------------------
>>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>----------------------
>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>
>
>


- --------------000409060007050208090004
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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
  <title></title>
</head>
<body>
Hi all,<br>
I like the way this conversation string is going.  I just want to add how
easy it can be to get hooked as a youngster, and how simple it is from a
re-enactor standpoint.  Granted, this is for a different time and period,
but the principal is the same for all of it.<br>
<br>
I went to school in VA and happened to end up at a North-Sourth Scrimage
Assn. meet.  That's where people pick a unit and match  their gear, frequently
down to the model year of the gear (1862 bullseye canteen, for instance).
 I was talking with guys from a Maryland unit for a long time.  Even though
I didn't have a firearm, and wouldn;'t have one for the foreseeable future,
one of them gave me one of their paper cartridges.  Their version was just
a cardboard tube with powder using a greased Minie' ball for a plug.  I still
have that minie, unless I shot it from either my 1861 model (contract) Springfield
<br>
original, or my replica pattern 1853 Enfield rifle-musket.  I have the gear
to do that era, but it took years to sprout the planted seeds, and of course
I had to have a little more money.<br>
<br>
Now I actively reenact the period of 1807 with the ALRA...post L&C St.
Louis as a drygoods merchant, as my wife is a historical textile and clothing
expert.  <br>
<br>
This is fun.  Maybe someone can pass this message to the Maryland N-S Scrimage
Assn. and say thanks for me.<br>
With this age of electronic communication, maybe I'll surf them up and thank
them myself!  Mind you, that free Minie' ball was given to me about 1965
or 1966.<br>
<br>
Sparks<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[e-mail]">[e-mail]</a> wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
 cite="[e-mail]">
  <pre wrap="">Capt.,
  Your right, JD's post is great, I saved it for my own use.
  New comers can't be overwhelmed with things like thread counts, brain
tanned etc... especially young kids. They want to have fun with guns,
leggings, throwing axes and sleeping with just a few blankets under the
stars! Now that is living for a boy!!! That's adventure!
  I remember going to my Grandmothers farm as a child in the Missouri
woods. We would hike to the back field at night and see the darkest,
biggest sky I ever saw! And stars like I never saw in my life!! I was
hooked on the great outdoors!
  His boy will outgrow any outfit he makes him before he is done with it
anyway! It's fun just exploring a rendezvous too! I love seeing them
kids running pell mell through camp tripping on tent ropes and shooting
them stupid pop guns. They are the future of this great era.
  Go out, have fun and worry about types of buttons, small details, etc...
latter.
  And anyone of us "old timers" that meet a young boy or girl at a
rendezvous that shows real promise, give them something that they won't
out-grow like a haversack, throwing axe, candle lantern or something
like that.
       bb

  </pre>
  <blockquote type="cite">
    <pre wrap="">bb,

Ya know it's hard to do some times but I'm thinking that your take on
"advice" is more on the money than the way most of us go about it. I'm
guilty too. I liked JD's list and advice, don't get me wrong. But throwing
too much at a newcomer right off is probably not the best way to make them
a
life long participant.

Not, at least, unless they ask for it. <G>

Capt. Lahti'

llist.html


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    </pre>
  </blockquote>
  <pre wrap=""><!---->

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  </pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>

- --------------000409060007050208090004--


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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 18:03:59 -0800
From: "roger lahti" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help

John, et. al.,

Again, none of use who've been in this a while can fault your list unless
it's to say it's too short. There is always something else we would have
like to throw out and forgot. And your logic is not faulty either. What your
listing/saying is our collective best advice to a newcomer.

What the newcomers who read all this need to remember is that "THIS IS OUR
BEST ADVICE". And your all free to take it or leave it. Following the advice
is gonna save you money if you think your at all serious about "playing the
game". But I for one recognize that there are many new people coming to a
list like this who actually do not want to get as serious about all this as
some of us have, they just want to blend in to the local rendezvous scene
and not look out of place.

While a list like John and many of us could put together may or may not keep
you looking out of place it will start you towards looking historically
correct or as close as any of us can guess is correct. And that may actually
make you look out of place at most friendly local events. Cause many just
don't care. That's perfectly all right too. It's a choice they make and
nothing wrong with it until they want to join in with a group who are
serious about how it's done. Then having to play by a different set of rules
draws them up short. Kinda like my favorite advice to start out with a flint
lock and a good quality one at that. Anyone who gets serious about this is
going to migrate to that point eventually, may as well start out right. But
that can be a bit pricy for a new person so it doesn't always happen.

Do the best you can. Fit in where you want to play. Don't sweat it.

Capt. Lahti'


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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 19:15:26 -0700
From: "Wynn Ormond" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help

Capt
You are a very wicked and plotting man.

Wynn

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "roger lahti" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Sunday, December 28, 2003 6:43 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help


> bb,
>
> Your though on giving some promising youngster something they won't out
grow
> is right on the money too.
>
> I'm not ready for a dirt bath just yet but I got lots of "things" that
> probably need giving away over the next few years of Rendezvous. I think
> I'll keep my eyes peeled for those "upstarts" that don't look like they'll
> be " a flash in the pan" and potlatch something nice on the closest one
from
> time to time.
>
> Let's see now. I got me way too many double barrel percussion shot guns,
> probably three flint lock rifles too many, a couple smoothbore flint locks
> that ain't gonna get much more use, a couple nice flint smooth pistols
that
> could go to a good home, more powder horns than I can carry, quill work
that
> should be hanging around some pretty young ladies neck or holding up some
> young bucks legg'ens. I know someone will get use out of my linen
haversack
> and knap sack and the copper pots and copper flasks will be well used by
the
> right newbie. I can only use one favorite knife at a time so no sense in
me
> hanging on to all of them. And that brain tan long coat and leggings need
to
> go to just the right person.
>
> Guess it will boil down to who's closest to me fetching my wood and water
> and fluffing up my bed roll at night when I get in the give'in mood. <G>
>
> Be see'in you youngsters come green up I imagine. Winter well and may
> visions of full stocks dance in your heads.
>
> YMOS
> Capt. Lahti'
>
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html


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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 21:10:21 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beginner needs help

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In a message dated 12/28/03 5:45:59 PM, [e-mail] writes:


> Guess it will boil down to who's closest to me fetching my wood and water
> and fluffing up my bed roll at night when I get in the give'in mood. <G>
>

aaaah.... I got plenty of wood and water at my camp Capt... and looks like
yer gonna get the guest bed too! <G.
Magpie

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<HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><HTML><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" FACE=3D"Gen=
eva" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" SIZE=3D"2"><BR>
In a message dated 12/28/03 5:45:59 PM, [e-mail] writes:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE CITE STYLE=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px;=20=
MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px" TYPE=3D"CITE"></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#0=
00000" FACE=3D"Geneva" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" SIZE=3D"2">Guess it will boil do=
wn to who's closest to me fetching my wood and water<BR>
and fluffing up my bed roll at night when I get in the give'in mood. <G&g=
t;<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" FACE=3D"Geneva" FAMILY=3D"SANSSE=
RIF" SIZE=3D"2"><BR>
<BR>
aaaah.... I got plenty of wood and water at my camp Capt... and looks like y=
er gonna get the guest bed too! <G.<BR>
Magpie</FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" FACE=3D"Geneva" FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" SI=
ZE=3D"2"></FONT></HTML>

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