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From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #1234 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Monday, September 8 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1234 In this issue: -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? -áááááá Fw: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: rifles -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? -áááááá MtMan-List: Chiggers & Flea collars -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Chiggers! -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Chiggers! -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: rifles -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Chiggers! -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: rifles -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Chiggers! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2003 18:31:00 -0500 From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <lanneyratcliff@charter.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? OK, I'll ask. What is a Hutterite??? Sounds like some kind of obscure mineral. Lanney - ----- Original Message ----- From: <beaverboy@sofast.net> To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2003 6:22 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? > Thats a good one! No Cajuns in our country, maybe I'll tell the Hutterites > that! > > > That's easy, Pigeon Boy, locate all the Cajuns in your area, tell 'em > > about > > all those pigeons and tell 'em that the season is closed. > > Lanney > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2003 17:30:21 -0600 From: James and Sue Stone <jandsstone@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? Beaverboy, My sister had an apartment in Seattle where the delightful rock doves took to nexting on her balcony, as well as defecating. She had an owl...same experience as yours. She had a snake like you are considering, they liked the snake as much as the owl. They didn't do pointy things on the balcony, but they did try using a big "herring dodger" as centerpiece in a windchime...I think they enjoyed looking at their reflection. I know that won't help you find an answer, but it might certainly same you some time and effort. By the way, a herring dodger is a big flasher rigged in front of a cut herring for use in trolling for salmon. It is shiney metal about 3 inches wide and 10 inches long. Sparks beaverboy@sofast.net wrote: >Dear List, > I know this is kind of off of the MM subject(though it does involve >trapping) but I need help keeping pigeons off of our work shop. > I've trapped over 25 up there so far in a bobbin trap which is fine and >dandy but I want to keep them from roosting there in the first place. > Does anyone know how to keep pigeons from roosting where they're not >wanted? We have two plastic owls up there now and they roost next to >them! >We can't use pointy wire like they do on statues as it is a 20,000 square >foot roof. I can't shoot them on the roof like I do inside the shop as I >don't think it is a good idea to be on a rooftop,in town, with a gun >during Code Orange! I heard rubber snakes will scare them away? Any ideas >would be greatly appreciated. > Between the 25+ I've trapped on the roof and the countless ones I've >shot inside the shop I should be called Pigeonboy! > Thanks a ton in advance. > > PS And to any pigeon lovers out there, I'm sorry but after you crawl >around a pigeon infested area and see what a disgusting mess they make, >you kind of loose your love for them. And don't tell me to eat them, I >have when I was younger, but after crawling around in thier piles of crap >the last thing you think about is cooking one! > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2003 18:34:45 -0500 From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <lanneyratcliff@charter.net> Subject: Fw: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? Never mind........down here we just call them Mennonites. There are more Mennonites in central Texas than you might imagine. They come down here and operate dairies, etc, work hard and save their money to by property back home. Lanney - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <lanneyratcliff@charter.net> To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2003 6:31 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? > OK, I'll ask. What is a Hutterite??? Sounds like some kind of obscure > mineral. > Lanney > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <beaverboy@sofast.net> > To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> > Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2003 6:22 PM > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? > > > > Thats a good one! No Cajuns in our country, maybe I'll tell the Hutterites > > that! > > > > > That's easy, Pigeon Boy, locate all the Cajuns in your area, tell 'em > > > about > > > all those pigeons and tell 'em that the season is closed. > > > Lanney > > > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2003 17:39:05 -0600 From: James and Sue Stone <jandsstone@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: rifles - --------------020503080108090502010805 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have seen some of the short rifles, convenient for using from a horse...also heavy enough you wouldn't want one unless the horse was carrying it! I think thewe were plains percussion rifles (1845-55). One I remember was .50 caliber or so, but had been bored out and the barrel 'relined' because the old one was shot...barrel was octagonal, but must have measured AT LEAST two inches across the flats at the muzzle (I don't even think it was swamped). ...and it was short, maybe not even belly-button high. Accurate? He was the second person in a round to split a roundball on an ax blade at 25 yards...I was first and was also shooting an original. Sparks roger lahti wrote: >> From what I have been reading it appears that starting around 1822 or so >>that trade rifles were fairly common with the trapping brigades in the >>west, with the Lancaster or american rifle and the English rifle being the >>most common. >> >> > >Rick, > >Not that I am the list expert but I'll say your on the right track. >Lancaster's, JJ Henrys, NW trade guns, anything else that was in use by the >common man prior to your time frame are ok. Full stock and flint at that >time. Many young men signed on for the fur trade who did not have a rifle >and were issued or sold a rifle from company stock as needed. > > What about rifles carried west by the individual > > >>trapper/mountaineer, was the Lancaster style fairly common, how about >>Southern , iron mounted types. >> >> > >I'm not sure but what the "Southern Mt. Rifle" you mention isn't a later >rifle but I'm thinking there were more hired hands than experienced hunters >going west around then. A trade rifle as Hanson and others mention would be >on the mark in any case. A late 1700's long gun would too and it fits an >earlier time period if your a cross dresser. <G> > > > > From what I gather most of the trade rifles were made > > >>with barrel lengths of between 40"-44". If I have a rifle made I was >>thinking of having the barrel shortened to be more convenient for me while >>mounted. My idea is to have it look as if it had been converted from its >>original longer barrel length by a gunsmith. >> >> > >I don't know that that was done or felt necessary by mounted men or >vertically challenged men. The long rifle was carried through eastern forest >by Boone and his contemporaries so why not a relatively long trade rifle >going west? Gun length did shorten towards the end of the Rendezvous period >into the pioneer and miner eras but actually not all that much. > > Is there any documentation on > > >>this being done, I have seen a few references to rifles with barrels >>shortened but most were of later Hawkins. >> >> > >I think you answered your own question there. > > > >>And finally, if I do go with a shorter barrel, is there a point where it >> >> >will > > >>start to affect the accuracy of the rifle, ie: 30", 32",34". >> >> > >Not in a practical sense. Rifles as short as 25" can be very accurate. Just >not very pretty or authentic to the period. There is a bit of loss of power >from the powder and you loose off hand stability with a shorter gun and a >shorter sight radius. I've got a 32" half stock flinter that I just moved >the rear sight forward about 6" so I could see both sights clear along with >the target and now there ain't much distance between the front and rear. >That's a consideration if you like traditional sights and have slowly ageing >eyes like the rest of us. > >Hope this was of some help Rick. Kinda quiet on the list at the moment. > >YMOS >Capt. Lahti' > > > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > - --------------020503080108090502010805 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1"> <title></title> </head> <body> I have seen some of the short rifles, convenient for using from a horse...also heavy enough you wouldn't want one unless the horse was carrying it! I think thewe were plains percussion rifles (1845-55). One I remember was .50 caliber or so, but had been bored out and the barrel 'relined' because the old one was shot...barrel was octagonal, but must have measured AT LEAST two inches across the flats at the muzzle (I don't even think it was swamped). ...and it was short, maybe not even belly-button high. Accurate? He was the second person in a round to split a roundball on an ax blade at 25 yards...I was first and was also shooting an original. Sparks roger lahti wrote: <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid001101c37585$474bb570$e9037444@x2d1a5"> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap=""> From what I have been reading it appears that starting around 1822 or so that trade rifles were fairly common with the trapping brigades in the west, with the Lancaster or american rifle and the English rifle being the most common. </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> Rick, Not that I am the list expert but I'll say your on the right track. Lancaster's, JJ Henrys, NW trade guns, anything else that was in use by the common man prior to your time frame are ok. Full stock and flint at that time. Many young men signed on for the fur trade who did not have a rifle and were issued or sold a rifle from company stock as needed. What about rifles carried west by the individual </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">trapper/mountaineer, was the Lancaster style fairly common, how about Southern , iron mounted types. </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> I'm not sure but what the "Southern Mt. Rifle" you mention isn't a later rifle but I'm thinking there were more hired hands than experienced hunters going west around then. A trade rifle as Hanson and others mention would be on the mark in any case. A late 1700's long gun would too and it fits an earlier time period if your a cross dresser. <G> From what I gather most of the trade rifles were made </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">with barrel lengths of between 40"-44". If I have a rifle made I was thinking of having the barrel shortened to be more convenient for me while mounted. My idea is to have it look as if it had been converted from its original longer barrel length by a gunsmith. </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> I don't know that that was done or felt necessary by mounted men or vertically challenged men. The long rifle was carried through eastern forest by Boone and his contemporaries so why not a relatively long trade rifle going west? Gun length did shorten towards the end of the Rendezvous period into the pioneer and miner eras but actually not all that much. Is there any documentation on </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">this being done, I have seen a few references to rifles with barrels shortened but most were of later Hawkins. </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> I think you answered your own question there. </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">And finally, if I do go with a shorter barrel, is there a point where it </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">will </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">start to affect the accuracy of the rifle, ie: 30", 32",34". </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> Not in a practical sense. Rifles as short as 25" can be very accurate. Just not very pretty or authentic to the period. There is a bit of loss of power from the powder and you loose off hand stability with a shorter gun and a shorter sight radius. I've got a 32" half stock flinter that I just moved the rear sight forward about 6" so I could see both sights clear along with the target and now there ain't much distance between the front and rear. That's a consideration if you like traditional sights and have slowly ageing eyes like the rest of us. Hope this was of some help Rick. Kinda quiet on the list at the moment. YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</a> </pre> </blockquote> </body> </html> - --------------020503080108090502010805-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2003 17:43:49 -0600 From: James and Sue Stone <jandsstone@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? - --------------030507080504050908090409 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dave, I think that only works with mice cuz they fight. Decon contains an anti-coagulant so they bleed to death, from what I understand. Probably the best method would be to contact your county Extension Agent for advice. I think they are listed under USDA in your phone book and are frequently assiciated with a university. If people start finding too many dead birds in your area they may start having them mailed to the state epidimeologist for West Nile Virus testing! Sparks dnelson wrote: >How about feeding them decon. The mice die. Dale Nelson > >beaverboy@sofast.net wrote: > > > >>Dear List, >> I know this is kind of off of the MM subject(though it does involve >>trapping) but I need help keeping pigeons off of our work shop. >> I've trapped over 25 up there so far in a bobbin trap which is fine and >>dandy but I want to keep them from roosting there in the first place. >> Does anyone know how to keep pigeons from roosting where they're not >>wanted? We have two plastic owls up there now and they roost next to >>them! >>We can't use pointy wire like they do on statues as it is a 20,000 square >>foot roof. I can't shoot them on the roof like I do inside the shop as I >>don't think it is a good idea to be on a rooftop,in town, with a gun >>during Code Orange! I heard rubber snakes will scare them away? Any ideas >>would be greatly appreciated. >> Between the 25+ I've trapped on the roof and the countless ones I've >>shot inside the shop I should be called Pigeonboy! >> Thanks a ton in advance. >> >> PS And to any pigeon lovers out there, I'm sorry but after you crawl >>around a pigeon infested area and see what a disgusting mess they make, >>you kind of loose your love for them. And don't tell me to eat them, I >>have when I was younger, but after crawling around in thier piles of crap >>the last thing you think about is cooking one! >> >>---------------------- >>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html >> >> > > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > - --------------030507080504050908090409 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1"> <title></title> </head> <body> Dave, I think that only works with mice cuz they fight. Decon contains an anti-coagulant so they bleed to death, from what I understand. Probably the best method would be to contact your county Extension Agent for advice. I think they are listed under USDA in your phone book and are frequently assiciated with a university. If people start finding too many dead birds in your area they may start having them mailed to the state epidimeologist for West Nile Virus testing! Sparks dnelson wrote: <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid3F5BBAF4.85280124@wizzards.net"> <pre wrap="">How about feeding them decon. The mice die. Dale Nelson <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:beaverboy@sofast.net">beaverboy@sofast.net</a> wrote: </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">Dear List, I know this is kind of off of the MM subject(though it does involve trapping) but I need help keeping pigeons off of our work shop. I've trapped over 25 up there so far in a bobbin trap which is fine and dandy but I want to keep them from roosting there in the first place. Does anyone know how to keep pigeons from roosting where they're not wanted? We have two plastic owls up there now and they roost next to them! We can't use pointy wire like they do on statues as it is a 20,000 square foot roof. I can't shoot them on the roof like I do inside the shop as I don't think it is a good idea to be on a rooftop,in town, with a gun during Code Orange! I heard rubber snakes will scare them away? Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. Between the 25+ I've trapped on the roof and the countless ones I've shot inside the shop I should be called Pigeonboy! Thanks a ton in advance. PS And to any pigeon lovers out there, I'm sorry but after you crawl around a pigeon infested area and see what a disgusting mess they make, you kind of loose your love for them. And don't tell me to eat them, I have when I was younger, but after crawling around in thier piles of crap the last thing you think about is cooking one! - ---------------------- hist_text list info: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</a> </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> - ---------------------- hist_text list info: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</a> </pre> </blockquote> </body> </html> - --------------030507080504050908090409-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2003 16:50:30 -0700 From: "busterize" <busterize@oldwest.net> Subject: MtMan-List: Chiggers & Flea collars Geesh! If an animal flea & tick collar can down a U.S. Marine, you know they must be downright poison for the pets we put them on! I'm convinced those collars were the cause of cancer and death of two of my good dogs. I'll never use them on an animal again, much less a human! Geri - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2003 21:40:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Samuel Keller <wolftalk_98@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Chiggers! When I was a little kid (Brat), my Dad would put a diluted solution of Lysol on the Chigger Bites to relieve the itching. Always seemed to help. Sam - --- Lanney Ratcliff <lanneyratcliff@charter.net> wrote: > Allen > One thing.....the best thing..... to learn is to > avoid their preferred > habitat......mainly tall grass and/or weeds, > especially when it's about > waist high. The little varmints crawl up and leap > off on you as you brush > past them, much like their cousins, the ticks do. > If high grass can't be > avoided protect your skin from attack by wearing > shoes with tall socks. > Wear long sleeved shirts & keep you shirt tail > tucked in If you are in a > particularly infested region dust your feet and > lower legs, waist band and > shirt cuffs with sulfur flour (or better, a spray > repellent with as much > DEET as you can tolerate). However, short grass can > also be thick with the > little sob's so avoid sitting directly on the ground > if possible. If you're > not sure if there are lots of chiggers present > suspend a piece of black > paper the weeds and inspect it in good light. You > will see the little > critters.......they're red and vanishingly small. > Look closely for > movement. If you suspect you have been dosed take a > hot shower or bath as > quickly as possible using strong soap. Most > remedies that are used after > exposure have limited effect on the chiggers if you > wait too long. Chiggers > search for a spot to attack and that might take a > while. Like I said the > best way to avoid trouble is to keep out of tall > grass and use an insect > repellent with the highest DEET percentage as > possible. However, strong > DEET products can bother some people so follow the > directions found on the > package. I have been told many time to dab grease > on the bumps to > suffocate the critters but I've never had much luck > doing that. Scratching > can lead to skin problems so do you best to avoid > doing that.......rubbing > is better. > good luck > Lanney in Texas.......chigger country > click here for more informed data and some really > scary close-up photos > http://insects.tamu.edu/extension/bulletins/L-1223.html > http://lancaster.unl.edu/enviro/pest/factsheets/008-96.htm > http://www.conservation.state.mo.us/nathis/arthopo/chiggers/ > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Allen Hall" <allenhall@srv.net> > To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> > Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2003 11:42 AM > Subject: MtMan-List: Chiggers! > > > > Hello the Camp, > > > > I'm interested in hearing how you that live in > chigger country deal with > the > > bites of them nasty little critters. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Allen, in Fort Hall country > > > > > > > > ---------------------- > > hist_text list info: > http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 00:53:16 -0400 From: "Fred A. Miller" <fmiller@lightlink.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Chiggers! On Monday September 08 2003 12:40 am, Samuel Keller wrote: > When I was a little kid (Brat), my Dad would put a > diluted solution of Lysol on the Chigger Bites to > relieve the itching. Always seemed to help. [snip] I'd think that the suggested sulfur powder is MUCH better than what my grandfather used when I was a kid, which was kerosene. It worked, but depending on "where" the little critters were, the cure could be MUCH more greater than the itch of the little buggers. Fred - -- "...Linux, MS-DOS, and Windows XP (also known as the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly)." - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 06:49:49 EDT From: NaugaMok@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: rifles - --part1_3d.34910284.2c8db8cd_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 9/7/2003 5:07:12 AM Pacific Daylight Time, rickg@oregontrail.net writes: > Ok, now for part two: I am a rather small man, 5'9". 130 lbs after a big > meal. I try to spend most of my time forked over the back of a mule or if > I have to a horse. From what I gather most of the trade rifles were made > with barrel lengths of between 40"-44". If I have a rifle made I was > thinking of haveing the barrel shortened to be more convienant for me while > mounted. I was about your size (5' 8", 145 lbs -- added some balast in the last couple of years) & from my experience with my Dixie "Poor Boy", it's 42" straight barrel gets a mite heavy on a 20 shot walk through. I do use it quite successfully in the field on mule deer. I also have a custom rifle with a 42" swamped barrel & there's as much difference in the two rifles as night & day in the way they hold & balance. That swamped barrel is a real pleasure to shoot. However, finding docs for a swamped barrel in a trade rifle will be difficult if not impossible. A friend carries a Poor Boy that's barrel has been shortened to 38" & it's much more comfortable for me. I'd look for a barrel that's 15/16" to 1" across the flats in .54 cal & 34" to 38" in length. The 38" lenght works nicely with a full stock, but the 34" looks a mite strange with that much wood. Makes it look "stubby" to my eye. As far as to how short you can go, my wife shoots a .45 cal that's barrel is only 25". 'Course, it has a 12 1/2" pull too, so it's full stock looks rather dimunitive. When I first put it together for her, it would put five out of five through the same hole at 25 yds. That was before I shortened the pull so dang short to fit her, I can't shoot it very well. Nauga Mok - --part1_3d.34910284.2c8db8cd_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <HTML>In a message dated 9/7/2003 5:07:12 AM Pacific Dayligh= t Time, rickg@oregontrail.net writes: <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT= : 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Ok, now for part two: I a= m a rather small man, 5'9". 130 lbs after a big meal. I try to spend most of my time forked over the back of a mule or= if I have to a horse. From what I gather most of the trade rifles were ma= de with barrel lengths of between 40"-44". If I have a rifle made I was <= BR> thinking of haveing the barrel shortened to be more convienant for me while=20= mounted.</BLOCKQUOTE> I was about your size (5' 8", 145 lbs -- added some balast in the last coupl= e of years) & from my experience with my Dixie "Poor Boy", it's 42" stra= ight barrel gets a mite heavy on a 20 shot walk through. I do use it q= uite successfully in the field on mule deer. I also have a custom rifl= e with a 42" swamped barrel & there's as much difference in the two rifl= es as night & day in the way they hold & balance. That swamped= barrel is a real pleasure to shoot. However, finding docs for a swamp= ed barrel in a trade rifle will be difficult if not impossible. A frie= nd carries a Poor Boy that's barrel has been shortened to 38" & it's muc= h more comfortable for me. I'd look for a barrel that's 15/16" to 1" a= cross the flats in .54 cal & 34" to 38" in length. The 38" lenght=20= works nicely with a full stock, but the 34" looks a mite strange with that m= uch wood. Makes it look "stubby" to my eye. As far as to how sho= rt you can go, my wife shoots a .45 cal that's barrel is only 25". 'Co= urse, it has a 12 1/2" pull too, so it's full stock looks rather dimunitive.= When I first put it together for her, it would put five out of five t= hrough the same hole at 25 yds. That was before I shortened the pull s= o dang short to fit her, I can't shoot it very well. Nauga Mok</HTML> - --part1_3d.34910284.2c8db8cd_boundary-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 08:08:03 -0600 From: Ole Jensen <olebjensen@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? Lanny, I would build them a pigeon house, feed them and eat them. I think George Washington had one and as I have eaten them they are tastey. Ole - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2003 09:35:00 -0500 From: "Lanney Ratcliff" <lanneyratcliff@charter.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? Ole I have cousins who used to routinely shoot them from under overpasses and ate every one. Claimed they were essentially big doves. They ARE just adult squab. Lanney - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ole Jensen" <olebjensen@earthlink.net> To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:08 AM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Pigeon Free Work Area? > Lanny, > I would build them a pigeon house, feed them and eat them. > I think George Washington had one and as I have eaten them they are tastey. > Ole > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 13:34:32 -0500 From: John Kramer <kramer@kramerize.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Chiggers! Allen, I have found nothing that will keep MO or KY chiggers off including pure DEET. Short period long sleeves socks and pants tucked in boots with a soon hot shower no problem. Live on the ground a few days and you are food. Keeps us humble as we know we are not the top of the food chain. Pure alcohol swabbed on liberally helps stop the itching, for short periods. Folks say not to scratch the bites, I just ain't figgered out how to not scratch. Anti-itch cremes and such don't work one bit better or longer than alcohol on me. Wait till a few MO spiders take a bite and leave large purple festering wounds that take months to heal and leave permanent scars. John... At 11:40 PM 9/7/03, you wrote: > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Allen Hall" <allenhall@srv.net> > > To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> > > Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2003 11:42 AM > > Subject: MtMan-List: Chiggers! > > > > > > > Hello the Camp, > > > > > > I'm interested in hearing how you that live in > > chigger country deal with > > the > > > bites of them nasty little critters. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Allen, in Fort Hall country > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------- > > > hist_text list info: > > http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > > > > > If it ain't exactly right, it's wrong. john <kramer@kramerize.com> Take a look at all the prime plunder being auctioned for the benefit of the American Mountain Men http://amm-auction.com/ - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 13:55:49 -0600 From: Allen Hall <allenhall@srv.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: rifles Rick, I've been packing a 42" Lancaster on horses for several years now, through woods as well as open country here in the Rocky Mountains. I figure if the original guys got used to is, so could I. When I started into the world of flintlocks I asked an experienced guy for recommendations. His reply was simple, "get a good one". What he meant was don't buy a cheap flinter, hoping it'll work. Buy a good one from a reputable maker. Jump in, you'll like it! Eventually maybe you'll even get cured from mules.......<bg> Allen in Fort Hall Country At 05:06 AM 9/7/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Hello to the camp, I'm coming in slow and easy looking for some information >to help me find the correct path . > >I have basicly a 3 part question concering rifles of the 1800-1840 >period. I am looking to purchase a new rifle of the period and thought it >best to do some research before I make the commitment both in dollars and >rilfe style. > > From what I have been reading it appears that starting around 1822 or so >that trade rifles were fairly common with the trapping brigades in the >west, with the Lancaster or american rifle and the English rifle being the >most common. Most of my information cmae from Hanson's "The Hawken Rifle: >it's place in History. Several other sources I read appeared to have >stated the same information as Hanson. Any thought on these trade rifles, >I am looking for the earlier style which is the reason I keyed on these two >types. What about rifles carried west by the induvidual >trapper/mountaineer, was the Lancaster style fairly common, how about >Southern , iron mounted types. > >Ok, now for part two: I am a rather small man, 5'9". 130 lbs after a big >meal. I try to spend most of my time forked over the back of a mule or if >I have to a horse. From what I gather most of the trade rifles were made >with barrel lengths of between 40"-44". If I have a rifle made I was >thinking of haveing the barrel shortened to be more convienant for me while >mounted. My idea is to have it look as if it had been converted from its >original longer barrel length by a gunsmith. Is there any documentation on >this being done, I have seen a few references to rifles with barrels >shortened but most were of later Hawkins. > >And finally, if I do go with a shorter barrel, is there a point wre it will >start to affect the accuracy of the rifle, ie: 30", 32",34". > >I look forward to hearing your comments. By the way the question on saddle >bags is a one that is long overdue. Since I do spend most of my time >mounted I have been also searching for the right type of gear. > >Rick > > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2003 15:27:09 -0500 From: John Dearing <jdearing@brick.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Chiggers! > > >I have found nothing that will keep MO or KY chiggers off including pure >DEET. Permanone from Waly world does an outstanding job of keeping me tick and chigger free. Follow the directions on the spray can. Costs about six bucks a can. One application to clothing will last about two weeks, through two washings. Permanone is the ONLY thing I have found to keep ticks and chiggers off. I even spray my ground cloth when I go out in warm weather. J.D. in east central MO. where the little red beggars thrive. >> > > I'm interested in hearing how you that live in >> > chigger country deal with >> > the >> > > bites of them nasty little critters. >> > > >> > > Thanks, >> > > >> > > Allen, in Fort Hall country >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ---------------------- >> > > hist_text list info: >> > http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html >> > > >> > >> > > >If it ain't exactly right, it's wrong. >john <kramer@kramerize.com> > >Take a look at all the prime plunder being auctioned for the benefit of >the American Mountain Men >http://amm-auction.com/ > > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #1234 ******************************** - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message.