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From: owner-glencook-fans-digest@lists.xmission.com (glencook-fans-digest) To: glencook-fans-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: glencook-fans-digest V1 #149 Reply-To: glencook-fans-digest Sender: owner-glencook-fans-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-glencook-fans-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk glencook-fans-digest Wednesday, December 19 2001 Volume 01 : Number 149 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 11:46:02 +0000 From: Troy Lefman <tslefman@ctcis.net> Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) A matter of time SPOILERS - --------------416DA764434CF37A0BFF4CA8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SPOILERS . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Don't read past this line if you haven't read the book. I really enjoyed this tale. Time travel and alternate history are some of my favorite types of story. I had a few questions. What happened for sure to the first O'Brien? I assume he was killed and stuck in Fian's basement like the intruders. What is the ODESSA? It is mentioned at the end of the book. Was Otho involved at the first of the story? I'm too lazy to go back and reread yet. Didn't the ending leave a wide margin for a sequel? Sure, the State could have been prevented, but there were other agents and they could still be awakened. Snake's death/attempted assassination could have a huge bearing on this. All in all, I really liked this story. Don wrote: > Thanks everyone, I don't feel so rejected now. I can pull the razor > away from my jugular now.(heh heh)I enjoyed the way WWII lasted longer > because of the colonel's warning. If anyone has knowledge of the > politics around the time of Vietnam with regards to China and the US, > it would be interesting to here what you thought of the references in > the book. If you have read it of course. Don > "In time, what's deserved always gets served."- COC > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Matthew Roche > To: 'glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com' > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 7:30 PM > Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) A matter of time > (Don - I must have been napping when your first message > came in)I've read "A Matter of Time" three times so far and > have really enjoyed it each time. It seems that Mr. Cook's > habit of pursuing multiple timelines concurrently (he does > it so often - Shadowline and the first Dread Empire book, > the name of which I can't remember off the top of my head, > both leap to mind) was taken to a new extreme in this one, > because I also found it very disorienting. With that said, > however, it seems to work every time he does it, even though > it can make the plotline(s) more difficult to follow the > first time through a book...I agree completely with your > amazement watching all of the plotlines come together at the > end of the book. I KNEW what was going to happen the first > time I read it and was so far off it's scary. (Although in > retrospect I can't quite remember what it was I thought was > going to happen...) I also missed all of the political > references...As a side note, it is because of this book that > I was completely psyched to learn that Cook's next book is > going to be a mystery. Although the Garret books are almost > mysteries, A Matter of Time went all the way... > > -----Original Message----- > From: Don [mailto:dfgarcia@stic.net] > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 4:28 PM > To: glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com > Subject: (glencook-fans) A matter of time > > So has no one read a matter of time, or did no one > care about my earlier message. Don > "In time, what's deserved always gets served."- > COC I know I shouldn't leave myself wide open like > that. > - --------------416DA764434CF37A0BFF4CA8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"> <html> <body bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> SPOILERS . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Don't read past this line if you haven't read the book. I really enjoyed this tale. Time travel and alternate history are some of my favorite types of story. I had a few questions. What happened for sure to the first O'Brien? I assume he was killed and stuck in Fian's basement like the intruders. What is the ODESSA? It is mentioned at the end of the book. Was Otho involved at the first of the story? I'm too lazy to go back and reread yet. Didn't the ending leave a wide margin for a sequel? Sure, the State could have been prevented, but there were other agents and they could still be awakened. Snake's death/attempted assassination could have a huge bearing on this. All in all, I really liked this story. Don wrote: <blockquote TYPE=CITE><style></style> Thanks everyone, I don't feel so rejected now. I can pull the razor away from my jugular now.(heh heh)I enjoyed the way WWII lasted longer because of the colonel's warning. If anyone has knowledge of the politics around the time of Vietnam with regards to China and the US, it would be interesting to here what you thought of the references in the book. If you have read it of course. Don "In time, what's deserved always gets served."- COC <blockquote dir=ltr style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px"> <div style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----</div> <div style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black">From: <a href="mailto:MatthewR@CerebusCorp.com" title="MatthewR@CerebusCorp.com">Matthew Roche</a></div> <div style="FONT: 10pt arial">To: <a href="mailto:'glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com'" title="glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com">'glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com'</a></div> <div style="FONT: 10pt arial">Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 7:30 PM</div> <div style="FONT: 10pt arial">Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) A matter of time</div> (Don - - I must have been napping when your first message came in)I've read "A Matter of Time" three times so far and have really enjoyed it each time. It seems that Mr. Cook's habit of pursuing multiple timelines concurrently (he does it so often - Shadowline and the first Dread Empire book, the name of which I can't remember off the top of my head, both leap to mind) was taken to a new extreme in this one, because I also found it very disorienting. With that said, however, it seems to work every time he does it, even though it can make the plotline(s) more difficult to follow the first time through a book...I agree completely with your amazement watching all of the plotlines come together at the end of the book. I KNEW what was going to happen the first time I read it and was so far off it's scary. (Although in retrospect I can't quite remember what it was I thought was going to happen...) I also missed all of the political references...As a side note, it is because of this book that I was completely psyched to learn that Cook's next book is going to be a mystery. Although the Garret books are almost mysteries, A Matter of Time went all the way... <blockquote dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <div class="OutlookMessageHeader" dir="ltr">-----Original Message----- From: Don [<A HREF="mailto:dfgarcia@stic.net">mailto:dfgarcia@stic.net</A>] Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 4:28 PM To: glencook-fans@lists.xmission.com Subject: (glencook-fans) A matter of time </div> So has no one read a matter of time, or did no one care about my earlier message. Don "In time, what's deserved always gets served."- COC I know I shouldn't leave myself wide open like that.</blockquote> </blockquote> </blockquote> </body> </html> - --------------416DA764434CF37A0BFF4CA8-- ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 02:43:57 -0500 (EST) From: schew@interzone.com (Steve Chew) Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) [SPOILERS for She is the Darkness] > >Okay, so I've finished _She is the Darkness_. > >I'm struck by the total lack of commentary on the nature of the >Shadowgate before they actually enter it -- sure we know that it was >guarded, the ward incorporated Longshadow's true name, etc., but we are >never told that the gate has anything to do with Khatovar until they >gaggle through. Why such a huge gap in the narrative? > I guess I just assumed that they felt they had to pass through the gate to get to Khatavar. Why else spend all that effort on defeating Longshadow? I guess Cook never comes out and explains why they didn't just bypass it and keep going south. For a long time the implication was that the land beyond the gate *was* Khatovar. Near the end of the book, Murgen asks Croaker whether the fortress was Khatovar. Croaker said "I'll tell you later." I took this to mean that Croaker didn't really know. The facts were lost with the original annals. Keep reading. :) Steve ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 14:01:32 -0500 From: "Trinixx of Westmarch" <trinixxofwestmarch@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) Steve Chew wrote: >Why else spend all that effort on defeating Longshadow? 1. Longshadow controlled the volume of undead shadows in the world coming through the shadowgate; there was a fair bit of apocalyptic talk in the book of what would happen if the gate was thrown wide. Only when the gate was actually taken was it certain the gate wasn't even in Overlook! 2. Longshadow was the overlord of the Shadowlanders, and the contract with the Taglians (Drah/Radisha) was to get rid of him. (These two points alone are always the brought up as to why the war was going on; never once was it stated or implied the war was over control of the gate as the portal *to* Khatovar.) 3. The Black Company had made an enemy of Longshadow long before they reached anywhere near Overlook. You don't let an enemy like that hang around with a grudge against you if you can help it. 4. Since Khatovar was somewhere "south," the journey there passed by Overlook. A good general wouldn't leave garrisoned strongholds behind his front line of advance. >I guess Cook never comes out and explains why they didn't just bypass >it and keep going south. "South" for a long time was Khatovar. I think you're right they had no idea what or where it was, having gone forward without consulting those hidden annals. They seemed to be exploring where the gate went when they came across the fortress -- even then it's precise nature was not revealed, or even that it was Khatovar. (But if Croaker didn't know where he was going, why take with him only the Old Crew?) And if they got caught in Catcher's trap, the annals should end when the Company entered the gate... :) Okay, enough belli-aching for now, I'll take your advice and assume there's more on it in _Water Sleeps_. Just MHO. Take it easy all, - -- Trinixx of Westmarch "The Master said, "When someone doesn't say: 'What do I do about this? What do I do about that?'" I have no idea what to do about him." -Confucius, _Analects_ XV.16. The Hellfire Campaign Rules Interpretation Archive http://travel.to/TheHellfireCampaign _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 13:42:30 -0600 From: Steve Harris <harrissg@SLU.EDU> Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) Steve, Trinixx, My take on the Shadowland War was this: The Company knew they had to "go south" to find Khatovar. (Why was Croaker so obsessed about Khatovar? For him, a personal odyssey, intimately connected with the mystique of the annals. For the rest of the Company: Well, those staying with Croaker, and the ones he picked up along the way, were the ones who thought he had a better plan for earning a living--i.e., continuing the mercenary tradition of the BC--than they could work out for themselves. Others quit to go home and raise turnips.) Along the way south, they encountered the Shadowlanders--a growing empire threatening to take over everything around. There simply was no going around it, as it was both sitting on the only roads south and also spreading faster than anyone could hope to make progress against, going a really long ways around. So accomadation of some sorts was obligatory. That accomadation shortly took the form of open warfare, as Taglios was willing to help them on their way south if they would help Taglios overcome the Shadowlanders. (And besides, some of the Shadowland "allies" were already in league against the Company, simply on the basis that they were old Taken and the Lady was part of the Company.) Once that committment was entered into, the final conflict with Longshadow was inevitable--as Tinixx says, you just don't leave someone like that sitting around once you've made him your enemy. So then the question becomes: Once Longshadow was defeated, why bother with Overlook and/or "the Gate" at all? Why not just "continue south" away from the all the shadow stuff? Why suppose that the way to Khatovar--or profitable mercenary-ing of any sort--is through the Shadowgate? These thoughts come to mind: The obvious road south--and the only road in those parts--leads right up to the Shadowgate. Clearly, this is worth investigating, since it's right there. You really don't want to leave a mystery on your backtrail if it might turn around and bite you. I also got the impression that there was no plain way to avoid the Shadowgate; the land about it was fraught with sorcerous/shadowy dangers, so that the only possible "safe" way through was to navigate somehow through the Gate (and even then one needed magical senses to detect a possibly safe path). Furthermore, there *is* a connection with the Company: The Company Lance reacts to the Shadowgate, suggesting that one of the two "knows" the other--so this likely is, indeed, the true path to Khatovar. Steve ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 15:50:14 -0500 From: "Trinixx of Westmarch" <trinixxofwestmarch@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) Steve Harris wrote: >So then the question becomes: Once Longshadow was defeated, why bother >with Overlook and/or "the Gate" at all? Why not just "continue south" >away from the all the shadow stuff? Why suppose that the way to >Khatovar--or profitable mercenary-ing of any sort--is through the >Shadowgate? Precisely. While Murgen and a few Old Crew express surprise that Croaker did intend to go after Khatovar, everyone, (including the annalist) expected them "to just to go south" *away* from Overlook. Then all of a sudden everyone's packing up to go through the gate? (!?) >These thoughts come to mind: The obvious road south--and the only road >in those parts--leads right up to the Shadowgate. Clearly, this is >worth investigating, since it's right there. You really don't want to >leave a mystery on your backtrail if it might turn around and bite you. Rather than the strategic situation, I was speaking primarily of the jump in the narrative. In the manner there was likely a huge real-world chronological gap between the books where Croaker became Captain and Murgen annalist (profound literary stylistic difference, enough to irritate me into not wanting to adjust to the new flow of narrative) there seems to have been a point near the end of _She is the Darkness_ where Glen put it down and wandered away for a while, not sure how to finish it. It also looked like the end when it was written might have tentatively stood as the end to the series, book two of Glittering Stone or no. >I also got the impression that there was no plain way to avoid the >Shadowgate; the land about it was fraught with sorcerous/shadowy >dangers, so that the only possible "safe" way through was to navigate >somehow through the Gate (and even then one needed magical senses to >detect a possibly safe path). Or perhaps more simply, I've looked at the maps on the website, and south of Overlook there is only ocean. What is the basis for that cartography? >Furthermore, there *is* a connection with the Company: The Company >Lance reacts to the Shadowgate, suggesting that one of the two "knows" >the other--so this likely is, indeed, the true path to Khatovar. Yes, I had "overlooked" this (snicker.) But on the lance we've been told little to date as well. And now I have to adjust to another annalist... :) Just MHO. Take it easy all... - -- Trinixx of Westmarch "Our earth is degenerate in these latter days. There are signs that the world is speedily coming to an end. Bribery and corruption are common." - -Early Dynastic period Akkadian clay tablet, ca. 2800 BC The Hellfire Campaign Rules Interpretation Archive http://travel.to/TheHellfireCampaign _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 12:59:59 -0800 From: Michael Llaneza <maserati@speakeasy.net> Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) The question of Croaker's obsession with Khatovar and the Shadowgate is explained quite satisfactorily in later books, most notably in Soldier's Live. If you've only read up to Water Sleeps you really only have 75% of the pieces to put everything together, and those pieces aren't really intact. Steve Harris wrote: >Steve, Trinixx, > >My take on the Shadowland War was this: > >The Company knew they had to "go south" to find Khatovar. (Why was >Croaker so obsessed about Khatovar? For him, a personal odyssey, >intimately connected with the mystique of the annals. For the rest of >the Company: Well, those staying with Croaker, and the ones he picked >up along the way, were the ones who thought he had a better plan for >earning a living--i.e., continuing the mercenary tradition of the >BC--than they could work out for themselves. Others quit to go home and >raise turnips.) > ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 16:21:12 -0600 From: Stacey Harris <harrissg@SLU.EDU> Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) Tinixx, "I was speaking primarily of the jump in the narrative. In the manner there was likely a huge real-world chronological gap between the books where Croaker became Captain and Murgen annalist (profound literary stylistic difference, enough to irritate me into not wanting to adjust to the new flow of narrative)" I agree and sympathize. In real-life terms: Glen thought _Glittering Stone_ was going to be the next book. He wrote, tore it up as unsatisfactory, rewrote it as two books, tore it up again, and _Glittering Stone_ finally emerged as *four* books. It represents a very significant shift in his vision as author and in his craft. "I've looked at the maps on the website, and south of Overlook there is only ocean. What is the basis for that cartography?" Fannish imagination--or lack thereof :) It ain't authoritative. My picture is of a largely unpopulated area with essentially only one road that leads to anything of substance (i.e., eventually to larger communities); north one gets eventually to Taglios, and south is the Shadowgate. Originally, south led to somewhere productive, but Longshadow established the Shadowgate there, as well as all the dangers attendant on trying to go around the Gate (which gets you munched, apparently). Steve ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 17:58:44 -0500 (EST) From: schew@interzone.com (Steve Chew) Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) >> >>"I've looked at the maps on the website, and south of Overlook there is >>only ocean. What is the basis for that cartography?" >> >Fannish imagination--or lack thereof :) It ain't authoritative. My >picture is of a largely unpopulated area with essentially only one road >that leads to anything of substance (i.e., eventually to larger >communities); north one gets eventually to Taglios, and south is the >Shadowgate. Originally, south led to somewhere productive, but >Longshadow established the Shadowgate there, as well as all the dangers >attendant on trying to go around the Gate (which gets you munched, apparently). > As far as I can remember, Cook doesn't discuss what is outside the land of the gate, other than the immediate surroundings and the road leading directly to the gate. Unless that land encompasses the entire south pole there must be a way around it to continue further south. Also, there's never a discussion about going around it to see whether there are other ways in. Honestly, while reading it didn't bother me. It was obvious to me from the flow of the story that to reach Khatovar they had to go through the gate. So, everything hinged on that point. Steve ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 17:19:00 -0600 From: Stacey Harris <harrissg@SLU.EDU> Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) Steve, "Unless that land encompasses the entire south pole there must be a way around it to continue further south." My impression was that it was not navigable and/or unsafe to try to go around. The road leads up to a plain. It's easy to imagine that that plain is the only flat land anywhere around--that the mountain the road is going up is entirely representative of the land all about for miles'n'miles. Think of the way the Rockies suddenly jut up out of nowhere in the middle of the mid-western plains. Translate "south" in Croaker's narrative to "west" in the mid-west: You go west, and you end up at nearly impassable mountains. Suppose the one road you know of goes up to the one level area you can see, and everything else is jagged and fit only for mountaineers. Then it's that road to the plain or you stop going in the direction you want. Steve ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 18:23:24 -0500 (EST) From: schew@interzone.com (Steve Chew) Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) > >"Unless that land encompasses the entire south pole there must be a way >around it to continue further south." > >My impression was that it was not navigable and/or unsafe to try to go around. > >The road leads up to a plain. It's easy to imagine that that plain is >the only flat land anywhere around--that the mountain the road is going >up is entirely representative of the land all about for miles'n'miles. >Think of the way the Rockies suddenly jut up out of nowhere in the >middle of the mid-western plains. Translate "south" in Croaker's >narrative to "west" in the mid-west: You go west, and you end up at >nearly impassable mountains. Suppose the one road you know of goes up >to the one level area you can see, and everything else is jagged and fit >only for mountaineers. Then it's that road to the plain or you stop >going in the direction you want. > Perhaps, though I don't remember getting that impression. Still, you would think a general would try to use whatever means he has (flying carpet, etc) to do a bit of investigation. Steve ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 19:38:29 -0500 From: "Trinixx of Westmarch" <trinixxofwestmarch@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) Steve Chew wrote: >As far as I can remember, Cook doesn't discuss what is outside the >land of the gate, other than the immediate surroundings and the road >leading directly to the gate. Unless that land encompasses the entire >south pole there must be a way around it to continue further south. Here's the strange part: in _She is the Darkness_ the gate appears to be dimensional, not transportational. It's specifically stated that Overlook is visible to the Black Company from *inside* the gate. Thus, the Company seemingly does travel geographically south, but not in the "real" world, so to speak. This leads me to suspect the geography is there in the real world, unless that hypothesis is invalidated in the later books. Could the gate have been temporal? (Feel free to tell me to shut up if this isn't addressed in _Water Sleeps/Soldiers Live_ -- doesn't seem to be, as I assume you're all up to date on your reading.) Just MHO. Take it easy all... - -- Trinixx of Westmarch, "Zi Xia said, 'If you excel at your office, then study; if you excel at your studies, then take office.'" - -_Analects_ XIX.13 The Hellfire Campaign Rules Interpretation Archive http://travel.to/TheHellfireCampaign _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 16:49:53 -0800 From: "Brooke A. Wheeler" <bawheeler@mediaone.net> Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) They DID that, IIRC. One of the two wizards (can't remember whether it was One-Eye or Goblin) took an expedition south by boat along the coast and it was all uninhabited desert as far as they could tell, after they got south of the "Shadow Plateau". At that point, they figured that maybe they should check out the plateau and see what was up there. Steve Chew wrote: >>"Unless that land encompasses the entire south pole there must be a way >>around it to continue further south." >> >>My impression was that it was not navigable and/or unsafe to try to go around. >> >>The road leads up to a plain. It's easy to imagine that that plain is >>the only flat land anywhere around--that the mountain the road is going >>up is entirely representative of the land all about for miles'n'miles. >>Think of the way the Rockies suddenly jut up out of nowhere in the >>middle of the mid-western plains. Translate "south" in Croaker's >>narrative to "west" in the mid-west: You go west, and you end up at >>nearly impassable mountains. Suppose the one road you know of goes up >>to the one level area you can see, and everything else is jagged and fit >>only for mountaineers. Then it's that road to the plain or you stop >>going in the direction you want. >> >> > > Perhaps, though I don't remember getting that impression. Still, > you would think a general would try to use whatever means he has (flying > carpet, etc) to do a bit of investigation. > > Steve > > > ======================================================================= > To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, > visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. > > ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2001 01:45:28 -0600 From: Steve Harris <harrissg@slu.edu> Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Shadowgate? (SPOILER) Steve, "you would think a general would try to use whatever means he has (flying carpet, etc) to do a bit of investigation." I think they had none left by then. Am I wrong? Steve ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>. ------------------------------ End of glencook-fans-digest V1 #149 *********************************** ======================================================================= To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list, visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.