ftp.xmission.com/2014.06.ftp.xmission.com.tar/ftp.xmission.com/pub/lists/glencook-fans/archive/glencook-fans.200102

Internet Message Format | 2001-02-27 | 113KB

From: Stacey Harris <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) Re: ADD TRANSGEN [e-mail] Jack Lloyd
Date: 01 Feb 2001 17:58:45 -0600

ADD TRANSGEN [e-mail] Jack Lloyd

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From: Stacey Harris <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Re: ADD TRANSGEN [e-mail] Jack Lloyd
Date: 01 Feb 2001 18:03:50 -0600

Sorry about that message; I have no idea how it got sent to this list.

Something in the portal stream??

Steve

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From: Eric Herrmann <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) Monthly Mailing List Update
Date: 01 Feb 2001 23:30:00 -0700

The January mail archive has been posted.

This mailing list is sponsored by The Glen Cook Fan Page at:
<http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/ >.

The mailing list archives and instructions of how to subscribe or
unsubscribe can be found at:
<http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html >.

The mailing list FAQ can be found at:
<http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/Mail/glencook-fans-FAQ.txt >.

The mailing list exclusive Glen Cook Bibliography can be found at:
<http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GCBiblio.txt >.

--
Eric Herrmann
<[e-mail]>
<[e-mail]>


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From: Troy Lefman <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) Garrett Files
Date: 02 Feb 2001 07:08:23 +0000


I've finally plunged into the Garrett Files.  I'm reading Sweet Silver
Blues.  What is the correct order of the books?  I don't want to jump ahead
yet.


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From: David George <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) Garrett Files
Date: 02 Feb 2001 22:10:27 -0600

I'm pretty sure that the Glen Cook fan site that Our Fine Host Eric
maintains lists them in order.

Go to: http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/Books/GC-Biblio.html and then
scroll down to the Garrett section on the right hand side of the page.

-----Original Message-----
Sent:    Friday, February 02, 2001 1:08 AM


I've finally plunged into the Garrett Files.  I'm reading Sweet Silver
Blues.  What is the correct order of the books?  I don't want to jump ahead
yet.


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From: Richard Chilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Garrett Files
Date: 03 Feb 2001 03:05:00 -0400

Sweet Silver Blues is the first one.

Hope you enjoy it!  It was a fun read.

Richard

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From: Matthew Cutter <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) OOP Short Fiction
Date: 07 Feb 2001 16:32:40 -0600

Does anybody know if Glen Cook still retains publishing rights
to his short fiction?  Since so many of these stories were
published in fanzine or serials, they're hard to get ahold of.

I think they would make excellent canidates for online
pulishing, in the spirit of Baen Book's Free Library.

-Matt C.

Matthew C. Cutter
Support Analyst
Epicor Classic Support
[e-mail]

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From: "Scott Vandenberg" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) OOP Short Fiction
Date: 07 Feb 2001 17:53:21 -0500

i'd buy a published copy of collected strories if somebody published one!
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2001 5:32 PM


> Does anybody know if Glen Cook still retains publishing rights
> to his short fiction?  Since so many of these stories were
> published in fanzine or serials, they're hard to get ahold of.
>
> I think they would make excellent canidates for online
> pulishing, in the spirit of Baen Book's Free Library.
>
> -Matt C.
>
> Matthew C. Cutter
> Support Analyst
> Epicor Classic Support
> [e-mail]
>
> =======================================================================
>  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.
>


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From: David George <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) OOP Short Fiction
Date: 07 Feb 2001 18:10:11 -0600

It might vary according to where the story is published.  I would assume
that if the copyright is not still held by the publisher, it is held by
Glen Cook.  In The Wind (in Space Dogfights anthology) for example is
copyrighted to Glen and printed with the author's permission.  But Song
From a Forgotten Hill (in Clarion anthology) is copyrighted to Worlds of
Tomorrow (and who knows where the copyright has landed since then, assuming
that Worlds of Tomorrow is no longer a corporate entity).

I've seen the stuff on Baen's free library and I agree with the sentiment,
but for such publishing to happen, Glen would have to agree with the
sentiment and moreover, I think he'd have to be convinced that free short
fiction on the web would turn into book sales. With Mercy Toward None is
the only Baen pub that Glen has that I know of and I believe it is also
OOP.  Is anyone other than Baen trying out the free library idea.

I am in the process of trying to collect the various short pieces as it is
and it is slow going.  A lot of these pubs are pretty hard to find.  Found
a copy of the first Clarion anthology the other day and based on the
various markings on the book, I've gotta be owner number 3 or 4 for this
copy.  Pages are pretty yellow, getting that old paperback aroma about it.
 I would not mind seeing these stories collected in a single volume, I'd
gladly pay for that.

DG

-----Original Message-----
Sent:    Wednesday, February 07, 2001 4:33 PM

Does anybody know if Glen Cook still retains publishing rights
to his short fiction?  Since so many of these stories were
published in fanzine or serials, they're hard to get ahold of.

I think they would make excellent canidates for online
pulishing, in the spirit of Baen Book's Free Library.

-Matt C.

Matthew C. Cutter
Support Analyst
Epicor Classic Support
[e-mail]

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From: "PrimalChrome" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) The Captain
Date: 08 Feb 2001 12:18:08 -0600

I was sitting at a red light on the way to work this morning when something
popped into my head...

Raven and the Captain were tight.  Croaker gets the feeling that they are
kindred spirits.  Speculation is as follows :

1.  Educated
2.  Held military position either past or present (Raven under the
Limper/Lady)
3.  Mid-high birth (this is an assumption based off the way the Cap's
character is painted as well as the fact he is educated)
4.  Sorcerous training?

#4 is what hit me.  All their time together, private conversations, etc...
Raven never did openly display sorcerous ability until he displayed his
knowledge while reading Bomanz's writings.

The Captain never did display any ability.....except in a single situation.
He flew a carpet.  Albeit poorly.  But he flew a carpet.  If I recall
correctly, he's the only non-sorceror ever to fly one.  (flying sticks don't
count as they appear to be magically embued mechanical devices)

This was spurred by curiosity and has no real research to back it up, so
feel free to shoot it down or support the theories as you see fit.  I'm just
sticking a spoon in and stirring things up to see what settles out.






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From: "Timothy P. Taylor" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) The Captain
Date: 08 Feb 2001 13:46:38 -0500

I find it an interesting thread, but I seem to remember earlier instances
where both showed (albiet minor) displays of magical talent...I think one
such reference was when the Captain had smoke literally pouring out of his
ears.  And Raven seemed to have some small talent as he could produce a
knife with uncanny speed, even when he was weak as a kitten.

tt

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [e-mail]
> [mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf Of PrimalChrome
> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 1:18 PM
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: (glencook-fans) The Captain
>
>
> I was sitting at a red light on the way to work this morning when
> something
> popped into my head...
>
> Raven and the Captain were tight.  Croaker gets the feeling that they are
> kindred spirits.  Speculation is as follows :
>
> 1.  Educated
> 2.  Held military position either past or present (Raven under the
> Limper/Lady)
> 3.  Mid-high birth (this is an assumption based off the way the Cap's
> character is painted as well as the fact he is educated)
> 4.  Sorcerous training?
>
> #4 is what hit me.  All their time together, private conversations, etc...
> Raven never did openly display sorcerous ability until he displayed his
> knowledge while reading Bomanz's writings.
>
> The Captain never did display any ability.....except in a single
> situation.
> He flew a carpet.  Albeit poorly.  But he flew a carpet.  If I recall
> correctly, he's the only non-sorceror ever to fly one.  (flying
> sticks don't
> count as they appear to be magically embued mechanical devices)
>
> This was spurred by curiosity and has no real research to back it up, so
> feel free to shoot it down or support the theories as you see
> fit.  I'm just
> sticking a spoon in and stirring things up to see what settles out.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> =======================================================================
>  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.


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From: Jay DeSimone <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) The Captain
Date: 08 Feb 2001 13:43:25 -0500

That's an interesting point, and it makes sense, too.  I don't remember
much about the posts, though, but wasn't there some discussion about how
they differed from carpets?  Plus, there was never any indication of verbal
commands to make the carpets take off...they just did so at the will of the
one commanding it.  Hmmm...

Jay

-----Original Message-----
Sent:    Thursday, February 08, 2001 1:18 PM

Raven and the Captain were tight.  Croaker gets the feeling that they are
kindred spirits.  Speculation is as follows :
4.  Sorcerous training?
#4 is what hit me.  All their time together, private conversations, etc...
Raven never did openly display sorcerous ability until he displayed his
knowledge while reading Bomanz's writings.
The Captain never did display any ability.....except in a single situation.
He flew a carpet.  Albeit poorly.  But he flew a carpet.  If I recall
correctly, he's the only non-sorceror ever to fly one.  (flying sticks
don't
count as they appear to be magically embued mechanical devices)


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From: Jay DeSimone <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) The Captain
Date: 08 Feb 2001 14:40:13 -0500

The smoke was a trick of goblin or one eye, not his own.

-----Original Message-----
Sent:    Thursday, February 08, 2001 1:47 PM

I find it an interesting thread, but I seem to remember earlier instances
where both showed (albiet minor) displays of magical talent...I think one
such reference was when the Captain had smoke literally pouring out of his
ears.  And Raven seemed to have some small talent as he could produce a
knife with uncanny speed, even when he was weak as a kitten.

tt

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [e-mail]
> [mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf Of PrimalChrome
> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 1:18 PM
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: (glencook-fans) The Captain
>
>
> I was sitting at a red light on the way to work this morning when
> something
> popped into my head...
>
> Raven and the Captain were tight.  Croaker gets the feeling that they are
> kindred spirits.  Speculation is as follows :
>
> 1.  Educated
> 2.  Held military position either past or present (Raven under the
> Limper/Lady)
> 3.  Mid-high birth (this is an assumption based off the way the Cap's
> character is painted as well as the fact he is educated)
> 4.  Sorcerous training?
>
> #4 is what hit me.  All their time together, private conversations, etc...
> Raven never did openly display sorcerous ability until he displayed his
> knowledge while reading Bomanz's writings.
>
> The Captain never did display any ability.....except in a single
> situation.
> He flew a carpet.  Albeit poorly.  But he flew a carpet.  If I recall
> correctly, he's the only non-sorceror ever to fly one.  (flying
> sticks don't
> count as they appear to be magically embued mechanical devices)
>
> This was spurred by curiosity and has no real research to back it up, so
> feel free to shoot it down or support the theories as you see
> fit.  I'm just
> sticking a spoon in and stirring things up to see what settles out.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> =======================================================================
>  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.


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From: "Kal" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) The Captain
Date: 08 Feb 2001 06:39:55 -0800

I know that Croaker used a minor cantrip to explode the flying logs.
It may be that he is not magically incline naturally but being around mages
so much,
he feels comfortable enough in some of it's principles to work very minor
magic.

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 11:40 AM


> The smoke was a trick of goblin or one eye, not his own.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Timothy P. Taylor [SMTP:[e-mail]]
> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 1:47 PM
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) The Captain
>
> I find it an interesting thread, but I seem to remember earlier instances
> where both showed (albiet minor) displays of magical talent...I think one
> such reference was when the Captain had smoke literally pouring out of his
> ears.  And Raven seemed to have some small talent as he could produce a
> knife with uncanny speed, even when he was weak as a kitten.
>
> tt
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [e-mail]
> > [mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf Of PrimalChrome
> > Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 1:18 PM
> > To: [e-mail]
> > Subject: (glencook-fans) The Captain
> >
> >
> > I was sitting at a red light on the way to work this morning when
> > something
> > popped into my head...
> >
> > Raven and the Captain were tight.  Croaker gets the feeling that they
are
> > kindred spirits.  Speculation is as follows :
> >
> > 1.  Educated
> > 2.  Held military position either past or present (Raven under the
> > Limper/Lady)
> > 3.  Mid-high birth (this is an assumption based off the way the Cap's
> > character is painted as well as the fact he is educated)
> > 4.  Sorcerous training?
> >
> > #4 is what hit me.  All their time together, private conversations,
etc...
> > Raven never did openly display sorcerous ability until he displayed his
> > knowledge while reading Bomanz's writings.
> >
> > The Captain never did display any ability.....except in a single
> > situation.
> > He flew a carpet.  Albeit poorly.  But he flew a carpet.  If I recall
> > correctly, he's the only non-sorceror ever to fly one.  (flying
> > sticks don't
> > count as they appear to be magically embued mechanical devices)
> >
> > This was spurred by curiosity and has no real research to back it up, so
> > feel free to shoot it down or support the theories as you see
> > fit.  I'm just
> > sticking a spoon in and stirring things up to see what settles out.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > =======================================================================
> >  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
> >  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.
>
>
> =======================================================================
>  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.
>
> =======================================================================
>  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.
>


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Horky, Roger" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) Croaker's magic ability
Date: 08 Feb 2001 21:06:26 -0600

SPOILER ALERT
(soldiers live)
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
Are we talking about the broomsticks used by the natives of Khatovar
(the incident that damaged the Khatovar gate)?

I don't think Croaker set the broomsticks off himself--he just took
advantage of the Khatovarans' tendency to remotely trigger the brooms'
self-destruct, much to their dismay.

-----Original Message----

I know that Croaker used a minor cantrip to explode the flying logs.
It may be that he is not magically incline naturally but being around mages
so much,
he feels comfortable enough in some of it's principles to work very minor
magic.

--

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From: "Horky, Roger" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) Sweet Silver Blues
Date: 08 Feb 2001 21:28:01 -0600

Somebody suggested the next book we discuss should be SWEET SILVER BLUES.

Okay, I'll go first.

As the first book in a series, it's a good 'un--gets you hooked and wanting
to hear more about Garrett PI. TunFaire as a setting is captured well, as is
the historical/political setting of the Venageti/Karentine Cantard War. As
I've mentioned before, TunFaire is so well developed through the series that
most readers could probably get around town pretty well if they suddenly
found themselves there.

Introduces elements that keep throughout the series--kingpin, morley's joy
house/the safety zone, tinnie tate, other tates, old man weider,
dojango/doris/marsha, the hill, saucerhead, playmate, glory mooncalled, the
Cantard war--all the things we like about garrett, tunfaire, and Karenta.

The concept is wonderful--a sam spade-type detective in a fantasy world. "I
knew she was trouble the moment she blew through the door. She wore a dress
from the planet Kissme and carried a pair of dangerous-looking
thirty-eights. She also had a gun."  (Sophomoric sexist humor--sorry)

But the one thing I remember most about my first reading, almost fifteen
years ago, was wondering, "how did Garrett ever run into the Dead Man?"

Man! what a story that would be!

(Another question: "how did Garrett and Morley hook up?")

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From: Lee Childs <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) The Captain
Date: 08 Feb 2001 20:21:58 -0800

I agree.  The Captain had to have had some small sorcerous tallent.  No other
non-magic user ever guided a magic carpet.  However, there were no other acts of
magic, real or implied.
Lee Childs
THE BLACK COMPANY page 60
"The Captain directed us into a forest.  While we pitched camp, he talked to
Raven."
"Curious.  There was a bond developing there."
"He was born in the Jewel Cities.  He was a professional soldier.  Something
overturned his personal life."  "He abandoned commission and titles and became a
wonderer.  Eventually he hooked up with our band of spiritual exiles."
SHADOWS LINGER page 251
"And not a word was spoken by any member of the Company.  For as that carpet had
torn through the rigging, we had all glimpsed the face of it rider.  The
Captain."
"But he had failed his personal goal.  He had died in the North."


PrimalChrome wrote:

> I was sitting at a red light on the way to work this morning when something
> popped into my head...
>
> Raven and the Captain were tight.  Croaker gets the feeling that they are
> kindred spirits.  Speculation is as follows :
>
> 1.  Educated
> 2.  Held military position either past or present (Raven under the
> Limper/Lady)
> 3.  Mid-high birth (this is an assumption based off the way the Cap's
> character is painted as well as the fact he is educated)
> 4.  Sorcerous training?
>
> #4 is what hit me.  All their time together, private conversations, etc...
> Raven never did openly display sorcerous ability until he displayed his
> knowledge while reading Bomanz's writings.
>
> The Captain never did display any ability.....except in a single situation.
> He flew a carpet.  Albeit poorly.  But he flew a carpet.  If I recall
> correctly, he's the only non-sorceror ever to fly one.  (flying sticks don't
> count as they appear to be magically embued mechanical devices)
>
> This was spurred by curiosity and has no real research to back it up, so
> feel free to shoot it down or support the theories as you see fit.  I'm just
> sticking a spoon in and stirring things up to see what settles out.
>
> =======================================================================
>  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.




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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) The Captain
Date: 09 Feb 2001 00:53:27 EST

In a message dated 2/8/01 10:22:13 AM Pacific Standard Time, [e-mail]
writes:

<< The Captain never did display any ability.....except in a single situation.
 He flew a carpet.  Albeit poorly.  But he flew a carpet.  If I recall
 correctly, he's the only non-sorceror ever to fly one >>

This was quite an interesting point.  Never occured to me and now that you've
pointed it out, I'll have to look for more occurences whenever I go back and
reread TBC.   Perhaps the Captain had some really minor talent that he never
had to tap before, or it was more of an instinctive thing.

Donna

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From: "Joseph McGrath" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) The Captain
Date: 09 Feb 2001 09:44:45 -0000

I think the captain got a little bit of know how from watching whisper,
journey and limper fly. I'm not sure but i think that there was some minor
alluding to the idea of him catching on in Juniper, but it was in another
part of the series. The reference was very oblique though and it probably
can't be found unless you're constantly watching for it while you read the
whole series.
Joseph
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 6:18 PM


> I was sitting at a red light on the way to work this morning when
something
> popped into my head...
>
> Raven and the Captain were tight.  Croaker gets the feeling that they are
> kindred spirits.  Speculation is as follows :
>
> 1.  Educated
> 2.  Held military position either past or present (Raven under the
> Limper/Lady)
> 3.  Mid-high birth (this is an assumption based off the way the Cap's
> character is painted as well as the fact he is educated)
> 4.  Sorcerous training?
>
> #4 is what hit me.  All their time together, private conversations, etc...
> Raven never did openly display sorcerous ability until he displayed his
> knowledge while reading Bomanz's writings.
>
> The Captain never did display any ability.....except in a single
situation.
> He flew a carpet.  Albeit poorly.  But he flew a carpet.  If I recall
> correctly, he's the only non-sorceror ever to fly one.  (flying sticks
don't
> count as they appear to be magically embued mechanical devices)
>
> This was spurred by curiosity and has no real research to back it up, so
> feel free to shoot it down or support the theories as you see fit.  I'm
just
> sticking a spoon in and stirring things up to see what settles out.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> =======================================================================
>  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.


=======================================================================
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Matthew Cutter <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) OOP Short Fiction
Date: 09 Feb 2001 11:26:08 -0600

> -----Original Message-----
>
> It might vary according to where the story is published.  I
> would assume
> that if the copyright is not still held by the publisher, it
> is held by
> Glen Cook.  In The Wind (in Space Dogfights anthology) for example is
> copyrighted to Glen and printed with the author's permission.
>  But Song
> From a Forgotten Hill (in Clarion anthology) is copyrighted
> to Worlds of
> Tomorrow (and who knows where the copyright has landed since
> then, assuming
> that Worlds of Tomorrow is no longer a corporate entity).

That's exactly what I mean.  Do the right to these stories
belong to Glen, or are they the property of the editor/publisher
of the anthology.  Funny; I just picked up a copy of Space
Dogfights, and that's what got me thinking about this.

> I've seen the stuff on Baen's free library and I agree with
> the sentiment,
> but for such publishing to happen, Glen would have to agree with the
> sentiment and moreover, I think he'd have to be convinced
> that free short
> fiction on the web would turn into book sales. With Mercy
> Toward None is
> the only Baen pub that Glen has that I know of and I believe
> it is also
> OOP.  Is anyone other than Baen trying out the free library idea.

Baen won't touch anything from an author who is not
theirs.  Their website says so, and I agree.  The Baen
Free Library exists to push Baen's stable of writers.

I wonder if publishing rights to short fiction could be
purchased.

I wonder if *electronic* publishing rights to short
fiction could be purchased...

> I am in the process of trying to collect the various short
> pieces as it is
> and it is slow going.

Pain in the butt, isn't it?  I don't have the time or
the money to track down everything.  That's why
I was thinking aloud about this.

> DG

-Matt C.

Matthew C. Cutter
Support Analyst
Epicor Classic Support
[e-mail]

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From: Matthew Cutter <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) OOP Short Fiction
Date: 09 Feb 2001 11:29:56 -0600

> -----Original Message-----
>
> i'd buy a published copy of collected strories if somebody
> published one!

So would I.  But I doubt there's enough of a market for one.

Hmm.  NEFSA does small print run, prestige hardcovers.
Their HC version of Shards of Honor by Lois McMaster
Bujold is fabulous.  I wonder if *they* could be approached.

-Matt C.

Matthew C. Cutter
Support Analyst
Epicor Classic Support
[e-mail]

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From: David George <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: (glencook-fans) OOP Short Fiction
Date: 09 Feb 2001 14:56:03 -0600



-----Original Message-----
Sent:    Friday, February 09, 2001 11:26 AM

[]  snip

I wonder if publishing rights to short fiction could be
purchased.

I wonder if *electronic* publishing rights to short
fiction could be purchased...

[] Almost certainly.  First place to start: does Glen Cook have an agent?
 If anyone knows who currently holds copyright on Glen's short fiction it
would be Glen himself and/or an agent.  next question would be how much for
the rights?  This is basically what NESFA would have to do if they
published a GC shorts anthology.

Frosting on the cake: getting Glen Cook to write short introductions,
nothing big, just a little color commentary, here's what was going on at
this time in life or here's what I wanted to do, etc.  More money for that
I suppose.  But as long as we're wishing, let's go for the whole pony.

Publishing short stories is typically the lowest end of the economic scale,
pennies a word.  Republishing may be a little different.  Also, Glen is
definitely a bigger draw than he was when the stories first went to press.
 Not sure what the electronic rights might be like.

There is always print-on-demand to consider.  I think this will be a big
deal in a few years, though I don't have any access to it at my local
bookstore yet.

 > I am in the process of trying to collect the various short
> pieces as it is
> and it is slow going.

Pain in the butt, isn't it?  I don't have the time or
the money to track down everything.  That's why
I was thinking aloud about this.

[]  Yes it is.  Especially some of those shorts published in magazines I
never even heard of.

> DG

-Matt C.

Matthew C. Cutter
Support Analyst
Epicor Classic Support
[e-mail]

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From: "Don" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Sweet Silver Blues SPOILERS
Date: 10 Feb 2001 11:35:41 -0600

SPOILERS
I agree,
SSB was a "good 'un". For any of you hesitant to read Garrett, this will
change your outlook. I avoided Garrett Books when I started reading GC. I
didn't like the idea or the concept. The covers turned me off. However, once
you read the first one, you'll want the rest. I haven't finished the series.
I have only read the first four. They were all very good.
There are enough side stories and interesting characters to make you wish
you wander off from your guided tour to find out how the rest of them lived.
I found myself wanting to hear about Morely and the Triplets more the
Garrett sometimes. Morley, who's part elf, isn't some shining super being on
the verge of being feminine due to his gracefulness and mannerisms. He's
ruthless and deadly with a certain honor and loyalty to his friends, albeit
sometimes a twisted loyalty.
In my opinion, this is Fantasy writing at it's highest level (just like BC
with a different tone). In GC fashion, none of the good guys are all good.
Anyone can die. You are supposed to like the bad guys. Hell Morely is a bad
guy. Sicking a vampire on some one for personal gain sounds pretty bad to
me, even if the guy is the head of the underworld.

Don
"In time, what's deserved always gets served."- COC



----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 9:28 PM


> Somebody suggested the next book we discuss should be SWEET SILVER BLUES.
>
> Okay, I'll go first.
>
> As the first book in a series, it's a good 'un--gets you hooked and
wanting
> to hear more about Garrett PI. TunFaire as a setting is captured well, as
is
> the historical/political setting of the Venageti/Karentine Cantard War. As
> I've mentioned before, TunFaire is so well developed through the series
that
> most readers could probably get around town pretty well if they suddenly
> found themselves there.
>
> Introduces elements that keep throughout the series--kingpin, morley's joy
> house/the safety zone, tinnie tate, other tates, old man weider,
> dojango/doris/marsha, the hill, saucerhead, playmate, glory mooncalled,
the
> Cantard war--all the things we like about garrett, tunfaire, and Karenta.
>
> The concept is wonderful--a sam spade-type detective in a fantasy world.
"I
> knew she was trouble the moment she blew through the door. She wore a
dress
> from the planet Kissme and carried a pair of dangerous-looking
> thirty-eights. She also had a gun."  (Sophomoric sexist humor--sorry)
>
> But the one thing I remember most about my first reading, almost fifteen
> years ago, was wondering, "how did Garrett ever run into the Dead Man?"
>
> Man! what a story that would be!
>
> (Another question: "how did Garrett and Morley hook up?")
>
> =======================================================================
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>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.


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From: Richard Chilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Sweet Silver Blues SPOILERS
Date: 10 Feb 2001 14:16:23 -0400

Don wrote:
>
> SPOILERS
> I agree,
> SSB was a "good 'un". For any of you hesitant to read Garrett, this will
> change your outlook. I avoided Garrett Books when I started reading GC. I
> didn't like the idea or the concept. The covers turned me off. However, once
> you read the first one, you'll want the rest. I haven't finished the series.
> I have only read the first four. They were all very good.

One of the nice things about this book is Cook tried to capture the feel
of the 30s - 50s detective novels as opposed to modern.  Chandler and
the other hardboiled types come to mind - and while it is a fantasy book
it has a completely different tone from the Black Company and Dread
Empire.

For example - when Garrett finds Rose with the stake on the trip home
and spanks her with it - definately something you won't find in a modern
detective novel, and very out of place in either the BC or DE.  Little
anachronisms like that are sprinkled throughout the novel.

Richard

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From: "Peter Donald" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) OOP Short Fiction
Date: 09 Feb 2001 21:19:40 -0400

On Fri, 9 Feb 2001 11:29:56 -0600, Matthew Cutter wrote:

>So would I.  But I doubt there's enough of a market for one.

    Meisha Merlin might be a better bet - they do small(ish) print
runs of stuff with die-hard fan followings - they've reprinted some of
Janet Kagan, Miller & Lee's Liaden novels (including three new ones),
P.C. Hodgell - I think a GC collection might be right up their line.
--
Moderation is for monks.



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From: "Edward Bilodeau" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) The Black Company of 1525
Date: 11 Feb 2001 00:28:51 -0500

My brother forwarded the following link to me, telling the story of a real
Black Company that existed in Germany in the 1500's. I wonder (as does the
author of this page) if there is any link with the novels.

In any case, thought some of folks here might find this interesting.

(Also, I'm fairly new to the list, and while I have read the FAQ, I haven't
read all the archives. My apologies in advance if this is old news ;)

Tks

Ed Bilodeau

http://www.calebos.org



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From: Douglas Bishop <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) Re:The Black Company of 1525
Date: 10 Feb 2001 21:53:21 -0800 (PST)

Did I miss something?  I did not see any reference to
the BC.  Perhaps the correct link is off this page you
sent us???

D.

--- Edward Bilodeau <[e-mail]> wrote:
> My brother forwarded the following link to me,
> telling the story of a real
> Black Company that existed in Germany in the 1500's.
> I wonder (as does the
> author of this page) if there is any link with the
> novels.
>
> In any case, thought some of folks here might find
> this interesting.
>
> (Also, I'm fairly new to the list, and while I have
> read the FAQ, I haven't
> read all the archives. My apologies in advance if
> this is old news ;)
>
> Tks
>
> Ed Bilodeau
>
> http://www.calebos.org
>
>
>
>
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> of this list,
>  visit
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From: Craig Dutton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Re:The Black Company of 1525
Date: 11 Feb 2001 03:52:33 -0800 (PST)


--- Douglas Bishop <[e-mail]> wrote:
> Did I miss something?  I did not see any reference to
> the BC.  Perhaps the correct link is off this page you
> sent us???

I suspect he just didn't send the link.

A quick websearch found this:
http://www.angelfire.com/bc/blackcompany/bc1525.html


>
> D.year!  http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/


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From: "Kal" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Croaker's magic ability
Date: 11 Feb 2001 11:23:32 -0800

Spoiler....Soldier's Live.
!
!
!
!
!
!
!
!
!
!
!
!
Actually , when One-Eye used the spear against Kina, he was riding a post.
Croaker had the First Father's book and read some minor spell to trigger the
explosion. Thus destroying Kina.
Croaker referred to it as a cantrip. Chapter 136, page 459 hardback.

He also tried setting one off after they rescued, Arkana. Chapter 146, page
491 hardback.
Though in this passage he refers them as setting off "codes".


> Are we talking about the broomsticks used by the natives of Khatovar
> (the incident that damaged the Khatovar gate)?
>
> I don't think Croaker set the broomsticks off himself--he just took
> advantage of the Khatovarans' tendency to remotely trigger the brooms'
> self-destruct, much to their dismay.
>
> -----Original Message----
>
> I know that Croaker used a minor cantrip to explode the flying logs.
> It may be that he is not magically incline naturally but being around
mages
> so much,
> he feels comfortable enough in some of it's principles to work very minor
> magic.
>
> --
>
> =======================================================================
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From: Troy Lefman <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) The Captain
Date: 12 Feb 2001 07:01:29 +0000

Wasn't Croaker's ear smoke a part of Goblin's or One-eye's magic?

"Timothy P. Taylor" wrote:

> I find it an interesting thread, but I seem to remember earlier instances
> where both showed (albiet minor) displays of magical talent...I think one
> such reference was when the Captain had smoke literally pouring out of his
> ears.  And Raven seemed to have some small talent as he could produce a
> knife with uncanny speed, even when he was weak as a kitten.
>
> tt
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [e-mail]
> > [mailto:[e-mail]]On Behalf Of PrimalChrome
> > Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 1:18 PM
> > To: [e-mail]
> > Subject: (glencook-fans) The Captain
> >
> >
> > I was sitting at a red light on the way to work this morning when
> > something
> > popped into my head...
> >
> > Raven and the Captain were tight.  Croaker gets the feeling that they are
> > kindred spirits.  Speculation is as follows :
> >
> > 1.  Educated
> > 2.  Held military position either past or present (Raven under the
> > Limper/Lady)
> > 3.  Mid-high birth (this is an assumption based off the way the Cap's
> > character is painted as well as the fact he is educated)
> > 4.  Sorcerous training?
> >
> > #4 is what hit me.  All their time together, private conversations, etc...
> > Raven never did openly display sorcerous ability until he displayed his
> > knowledge while reading Bomanz's writings.
> >
> > The Captain never did display any ability.....except in a single
> > situation.
> > He flew a carpet.  Albeit poorly.  But he flew a carpet.  If I recall
> > correctly, he's the only non-sorceror ever to fly one.  (flying
> > sticks don't
> > count as they appear to be magically embued mechanical devices)
> >
> > This was spurred by curiosity and has no real research to back it up, so
> > feel free to shoot it down or support the theories as you see
> > fit.  I'm just
> > sticking a spoon in and stirring things up to see what settles out.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > =======================================================================
> >  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
> >  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.
>
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From: "Edward Bilodeau" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) RE: glencook-fans-digest V1 #82
Date: 12 Feb 2001 10:49:52 -0500

Thanks, Craig, Yup, this is the link:
http://www.angelfire.com/bc/blackcompany/bc1525.html

(Note to self: No more posting to list in the wee hours of the morning... ;)

Sorry about that.

Ed


> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 21:53:21 -0800 (PST)
> From: Douglas Bishop <[e-mail]>
> Subject: (glencook-fans) Re:The Black Company of 1525
>
> Did I miss something?  I did not see any reference to
> the BC.  Perhaps the correct link is off this page you
> sent us???
>
> D.
>


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From: Richard Gruver <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 17 Feb 2001 03:19:15 -0800

I Don't often get my reading materials and my musical taste mixed together
but something occurred to me the other day. I've read the Black Co. several
times now and occasionally while reading I found a scrap of an old tune
running around in my head. I didn't even recognize it the first three or
four times but eventually I remembered it and dug out the old vinyl album (
"Forgotten Songs and Unsung Heroes" by John Kay). The Song is called "Bold
Marauder" and was originally written and recorded by Richard Farina. I
haven't heard his version but John Kay's version is kind of a cross between
a ballad and a chant. (For you Gen X'ers John Kay was formerly the lead
singer of Steppenwolf). With the exception of the mention of Christ in the
lyrics it could have been written with the Black company in mind. I am
including the lyrics here. The MP3 I found on Napster without too much
trouble. It might even make good background music for a BC web page. Just
thought I would throw something different in the Mix.
Richard

>"BOLD MARAUDER"
>Written by Richard Farina
>
>Well it's HI, HO, HEY...
>I am a bold maruder.
>And it's HI, HO, HEY...
>I am a white destroyer.
>
>For I will show you silver and gold
>and I will bring you treasure.
>I will wave a widowing Flag and
>I will be your lover.
>
>And I will show you grotto and cave
>and sacrificial alter.
>And I will show you blood on the stone.
>And I will be your mentor.
>And night will be our Darlin'
>And Fear will be our name.
>
>And it's HI, HO, HEY...
>I am a bold maruder.
>And it's HI, HO, HEY...
>I am a white destroyer.
>
>For I will lead you out by the hand
>and lead you to the Hunter.
>And I will show you thunder and steel
>and I will be your teacher.
>
>And we will dress in helmet and sword
>and dip our tongues in slaughter.
>And we will sing the Warrior's Song
>and lift the praise of murder.
>And Christ will be our Darlin'
>and Fear will be our name.
>
>And it's HI, HO, HEY...
>I am a bold maruder.
>And it's HI, HO, HEY...
>I am a white destroyer.
>
>For I will sour the winds on high
>and I will soil the rivers.
>And I will burn the grain in the fields
>and I will be your mother.
>And we will go to ravage and kill
>and we show go to plunder.
>And I will take a Fury to wife
>and I will be your father.
>And death will be our Darlin'
>and Fear will be our name.


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From: "Ryan MacClanathan" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 17 Feb 2001 02:17:37 -0800

damn, that's nice and cheery. I think i remember singing that around the
campfire when I was in the Boy Scouts.

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 3:19 AM


> I Don't often get my reading materials and my musical taste mixed together
> but something occurred to me the other day. I've read the Black Co.
several
> times now and occasionally while reading I found a scrap of an old tune
> running around in my head. I didn't even recognize it the first three or
> four times but eventually I remembered it and dug out the old vinyl album
(
> "Forgotten Songs and Unsung Heroes" by John Kay). The Song is called "Bold
> Marauder" and was originally written and recorded by Richard Farina. I
> haven't heard his version but John Kay's version is kind of a cross
between
> a ballad and a chant. (For you Gen X'ers John Kay was formerly the lead
> singer of Steppenwolf). With the exception of the mention of Christ in the
> lyrics it could have been written with the Black company in mind. I am
> including the lyrics here. The MP3 I found on Napster without too much
> trouble. It might even make good background music for a BC web page. Just
> thought I would throw something different in the Mix.
> Richard
>
> >"BOLD MARAUDER"
> >Written by Richard Farina
> >
> >Well it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a bold maruder.
> >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a white destroyer.
> >
> >For I will show you silver and gold
> >and I will bring you treasure.
> >I will wave a widowing Flag and
> >I will be your lover.
> >
> >And I will show you grotto and cave
> >and sacrificial alter.
> >And I will show you blood on the stone.
> >And I will be your mentor.
> >And night will be our Darlin'
> >And Fear will be our name.
> >
> >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a bold maruder.
> >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a white destroyer.
> >
> >For I will lead you out by the hand
> >and lead you to the Hunter.
> >And I will show you thunder and steel
> >and I will be your teacher.
> >
> >And we will dress in helmet and sword
> >and dip our tongues in slaughter.
> >And we will sing the Warrior's Song
> >and lift the praise of murder.
> >And Christ will be our Darlin'
> >and Fear will be our name.
> >
> >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a bold maruder.
> >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a white destroyer.
> >
> >For I will sour the winds on high
> >and I will soil the rivers.
> >And I will burn the grain in the fields
> >and I will be your mother.
> >And we will go to ravage and kill
> >and we show go to plunder.
> >And I will take a Fury to wife
> >and I will be your father.
> >And death will be our Darlin'
> >and Fear will be our name.
>
>
> =======================================================================
>  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.
>


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From:    "Marcin Welnicki" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 17 Feb 2001 18:18:34 +0100


----- The MP3 I found on Napster without too much  trouble.

But since Napster is no more...could u give me an adress where i could
download it?

Mocker



--


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From: Richard Gruver <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 17 Feb 2001 12:11:52 -0800

Napster is still up and running folks and probably will be for awhile. I am
downloading the Richard and Mimi Farina version as I am writing this. I've
never heard that one. If someone wants to post the MP3 on a website I could
upload it there or I could post it to one of the MP3 newsgroups if that is
more available to all. I
  just listened to the Farina version and it is done a little more up tempo
and with Mimi being the dominant voice it doesn't have the same effect as
the deep, rather harsh voice of the John Kay version.
Richard



At 06:18 PM 2/17/01 +0100, you wrote:



>But since Napster is no more...could u give me an adress where i could
>download it?
>
>Mocker
>
>
>
>--
>
>
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From: Douglas Bishop <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 17 Feb 2001 10:33:23 -0800 (PST)

This ditty would make a good theme song for a BC
movie.

D.

--- Ryan MacClanathan <[e-mail]>
wrote:
> damn, that's nice and cheery. I think i remember
> singing that around the
> campfire when I was in the Boy Scouts.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Richard Gruver" <[e-mail]>
> To: <[e-mail]>
> Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 3:19 AM
> Subject: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching
> Song???
>
>
> > I Don't often get my reading materials and my
> musical taste mixed together
> > but something occurred to me the other day. I've
> read the Black Co.
> several
> > times now and occasionally while reading I found a
> scrap of an old tune
> > running around in my head. I didn't even recognize
> it the first three or
> > four times but eventually I remembered it and dug
> out the old vinyl album
> (
> > "Forgotten Songs and Unsung Heroes" by John Kay).
> The Song is called "Bold
> > Marauder" and was originally written and recorded
> by Richard Farina. I
> > haven't heard his version but John Kay's version
> is kind of a cross
> between
> > a ballad and a chant. (For you Gen X'ers John Kay
> was formerly the lead
> > singer of Steppenwolf). With the exception of the
> mention of Christ in the
> > lyrics it could have been written with the Black
> company in mind. I am
> > including the lyrics here. The MP3 I found on
> Napster without too much
> > trouble. It might even make good background music
> for a BC web page. Just
> > thought I would throw something different in the
> Mix.
> > Richard
> >
> > >"BOLD MARAUDER"
> > >Written by Richard Farina
> > >
> > >Well it's HI, HO, HEY...
> > >I am a bold maruder.
> > >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> > >I am a white destroyer.
> > >
> > >For I will show you silver and gold
> > >and I will bring you treasure.
> > >I will wave a widowing Flag and
> > >I will be your lover.
> > >
> > >And I will show you grotto and cave
> > >and sacrificial alter.
> > >And I will show you blood on the stone.
> > >And I will be your mentor.
> > >And night will be our Darlin'
> > >And Fear will be our name.
> > >
> > >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> > >I am a bold maruder.
> > >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> > >I am a white destroyer.
> > >
> > >For I will lead you out by the hand
> > >and lead you to the Hunter.
> > >And I will show you thunder and steel
> > >and I will be your teacher.
> > >
> > >And we will dress in helmet and sword
> > >and dip our tongues in slaughter.
> > >And we will sing the Warrior's Song
> > >and lift the praise of murder.
> > >And Christ will be our Darlin'
> > >and Fear will be our name.
> > >
> > >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> > >I am a bold maruder.
> > >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> > >I am a white destroyer.
> > >
> > >For I will sour the winds on high
> > >and I will soil the rivers.
> > >And I will burn the grain in the fields
> > >and I will be your mother.
> > >And we will go to ravage and kill
> > >and we show go to plunder.
> > >And I will take a Fury to wife
> > >and I will be your father.
> > >And death will be our Darlin'
> > >and Fear will be our name.
> >
> >
> >
>
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> >  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives
> of this list,
> >  visit
> <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.
> >
>
>
>
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From: "Joseph McGrath" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 17 Feb 2001 15:52:13 -0000

Tunes like that are cool especially when you're on the way to a battle. That
guy from Steppenwolf was out of his mind. Thing is there isn't that many
times when you're on the way to a battle. Time was, there weren't any other
songs but that kind.
joe
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 11:19 AM


> I Don't often get my reading materials and my musical taste mixed together
> but something occurred to me the other day. I've read the Black Co.
several
> times now and occasionally while reading I found a scrap of an old tune
> running around in my head. I didn't even recognize it the first three or
> four times but eventually I remembered it and dug out the old vinyl album
(
> "Forgotten Songs and Unsung Heroes" by John Kay). The Song is called "Bold
> Marauder" and was originally written and recorded by Richard Farina. I
> haven't heard his version but John Kay's version is kind of a cross between
> a ballad and a chant. (For you Gen X'ers John Kay was formerly the lead
> singer of Steppenwolf). With the exception of the mention of Christ in the
> lyrics it could have been written with the Black company in mind. I am
> including the lyrics here. The MP3 I found on Napster without too much
> trouble. It might even make good background music for a BC web page. Just
> thought I would throw something different in the Mix.
> Richard
>
> >"BOLD MARAUDER"
> >Written by Richard Farina
> >
> >Well it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a bold maruder.
> >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a white destroyer.
> >
> >For I will show you silver and gold
> >and I will bring you treasure.
> >I will wave a widowing Flag and
> >I will be your lover.
> >
> >And I will show you grotto and cave
> >and sacrificial alter.
> >And I will show you blood on the stone.
> >And I will be your mentor.
> >And night will be our Darlin'
> >And Fea
r will be our name.
> >
> >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a bold maruder.
> >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a white destroyer.
> >
> >For I will lead you out by the hand
> >and lead you to the Hunter.
> >And I will show you thunder and steel
> >and I will be your teacher.
> >
> >And we will dress in helmet and sword
> >and dip our tongues in slaughter.
> >And we will sing the Warrior's Song
> >and lift the praise of murder.
> >And Christ will be our Darlin'
> >and Fear will be our name.
> >
> >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a bold maruder.
> >And it's HI, HO, HEY...
> >I am a white destroyer.
> >
> >For I will sour the winds on high
> >and I will soil the rivers.
> >And I will burn the grain in the fields
> >and I will be your mother.
> >And we will go to ravage and kill
> >and we show go to plunder.
> >And I will take a Fury to wife
> >and I will be your father.
> >And death will be our Darlin'
> >and Fear will be our name.
>
>
> =======================================================================
>  To unsubscribe, subscribe, or access the archives of this list,
>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.


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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From:    "Marcin Welnicki" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 18 Feb 2001 16:03:29 +0100


 Could someone, who has the song( Bold Marauder) be on Napster, today(
18.2.01 ;)) at 10 pm( 22:00) CET?

Mocker



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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 18 Feb 2001 12:58:46 EST


In a message dated 2/18/01 8:57:09 AM, [e-mail] writes:

> Could someone, who has the song( Bold Marauder) be on Napster, today(
>18.2.01 ;)) at 10 pm( 22:00) CET?

So who did this song, and why do you call it a BC song? I always have felt
that Nick Cave's song "White Rose," could have been a perfect BC song, after
a few centuries of distortion (hard to reconcile the felt that she dies in the
song by her lover's hand otherwise).

Where the wild roses grow

They call me the Wild Rose
But my name was Elisa Day
Why they call me it I do not know
For my name was Elisa Day.

From the first day I saw her I knew she was the one
As she stared in my eyes and smiled
For her lips were the colour of the roses
That grew down the river, all bloody and wild

When he knocked on my door and entered the room
My termbling subsided in his sure embrace
He would be my first man, and with a careful hand
He wiped at the tears that ran down my face

They call me the Wild Rose
But my name was Elisa Day
Why they call me it I do not know
For my name was Elisa Day.

On the second day I brought her a flower
She's more beautiful than any woman I've ever seen
I said "Do you know where the wild roses grow
So sweet and scarlet and free?"

On the second day he came with a single red rose
Said "Will you give me your loss and your sorrow?"
I nodded my head, as I lay on the bed
He said "If I show you the roses will you follow?"

They call me the Wild Rose
But my name was Elisa Day
Why they call me it I do not know
For my name was Elisa Day.

On the third day he took me to the river
We knelt on the bank, and we kissed
And the last thing I heard was a muttered word
As he knelt above me with a rock in his fist.

On the last day I took her where the wild roses grow
And she lay on the bank, the wind light as a thief
And I kissed her goodbye, said "All beauty must die"
And I leant down and planted a rose 'tween her teeth.

They call me the Wild Rose
But my name was Elisa Day
Why they call me it I do not know
For my name was Elisa Day.

Nick Cave, Murder Ballads


Besides, how can you go wrong with a duet and a disc about killing?

christopher....



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From: "C.L. Yona" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 18 Feb 2001 14:28:09 -0500

>In a message dated 2/18/01 8:57:09 AM, [e-mail] writes:
>
>>  Could someone, who has the song( Bold Marauder) be on Napster, today(
>>18.2.01 ;)) at 10 pm( 22:00) CET?
>
>So who did this song, and why do you call it a BC song? I always have felt
>that Nick Cave's song "White Rose," could have been a perfect BC song, after
>a few centuries of distortion (hard to reconcile the felt that she dies in the
>song by her lover's hand otherwise).

I've always thought of Queen's "Hammer to Fall" as a good tune for
the Black Company. Just have to change the one line about the
"mushroom cloud."

yer dog
www.thegriffin.com

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From: Richard Chilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 19 Feb 2001 00:25:32 -0400

Combining two replies:

>
> So who did this song, and why do you call it a BC song? I always have felt
> that Nick Cave's song "White Rose," could have been a perfect BC song, after
> a few centuries of distortion (hard to reconcile the felt that she dies in the
> song by her lover's hand otherwise).
>
> Where the wild roses grow
>

This is a beautful song - if anyone here uses napster I'd urge you to
download it.  A beautful duet, but the female singing is often
mislabeled.  I've seen this song with three different woman listed - all
of them the same song with the same singer (Kyle something).

> I've always thought of Queen's "Hammer to Fall" as a good tune for
> the Black Company. Just have to change the one line about the
> "mushroom cloud.

I see that one as a bit too up tempo for the Black Company...

One I think would work is "The Leader" from Chris de Burgh.  It's part
one of a three part song (the other two being The Vision and What About
Me?) that is wrapped around an upcoming apocalyptic battle - one they
will win, but pay too high a price for.  [Note - if you download it
expect it to cutoff mid note - the three songs are supposed to fit
together seemlessly.]
Since The Leader is never assigned a gender, the song could easily be
about the coming of the White Rose.  Or it could be Smoke's warning
about Croaker coming to help with the war against the Shadow Masters.

The Leader:
  I looked to the North, and I turned to the West,
  For a sign, a light in the sky,
  Oh the message is clear, that the time is near,
  For a leader to come again;

  A circle of stones on the head of a hill,
  Tonight is where it will be,
  In this desolate place, we all stand and wait,
  For a leader to come again, yes a leader will come again,

<some dramatic sounding kettle drums start up here>
  For it is written, that a leader will be here,
  And then a vision, left me blinded by the light,
  And it started right in front of my eyes.

The Vision - his vision of the coming battle.
What About Me? - after seeing how the battle will end (in victory, but
with their land in flames) the singer asks "what about me, and you, and
the ones that we love?"


Richard

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From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 19 Feb 2001 23:24:45 EST

In a message dated 2/18/01 8:24:48 PM Pacific Standard Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< One I think would work is "The Leader" from Chris de Burgh.  >>

Another Chris de Burgh fan?   *thud!*

I'd suggest the "Revolution" trilogy over "The Leader", especially since he
mentions the "years of domination" along the way.  Also the final part,
"Liberty" reminds me a lot of Croaker and his conscience.

The Revolution

Wake up boys, there's a light at the window
I can hear someone knocking on the door
There are voices in the street
And the sound of running feet
And they whisper the word 'Revolution'

There are men coming down from the valleys
There are tall ships lying off the coast
And they carry the light
In the dark of the night
Like a whisper in the wind - 'Revolution'

Bring my gun and a handful of silver
By the sea we will gather for the fight
It's been so many years, so many tears,
We have lost once before
Now we'll settle the score
When our cannons will roar - 'Revolution!'

LIGHT A FIRE

Watch and wait, get ready for the sign
There are many here among us now
Who have not see the light
We must send the word to all the people in the land
Go to every hill and mountain
For the time is now at hand to light a fire!

Let us march the road up the rocky hill tonight
Under cover of the darkness we will slip behind the lines
We will take the men who have stolen our land
For the years of Domination
Hit them right between the eyes
And light a fire
They will see through the world

LIBERTY

Roll away the dawn
Roll away the dawn and let me see
The land of the free
Has anything changed at all?

Sweet liberty
Sweet liberty is in our hands
It's part of the plan
Or is a state of mind?

Horses and men
Horses and men are on the field
They didn't yield
Many have fallen here

Never forget
Never forget what they have done
The time will come
When it will change again
Never forget!

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From: Richard Chilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 20 Feb 2001 01:36:32 -0400

Note - there are a few spoilers for Solder's Live near the bottom.

[e-mail] wrote:
>
> In a message dated 2/18/01 8:24:48 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> [e-mail] writes:
>
> << One I think would work is "The Leader" from Chris de Burgh.  >>
>
> Another Chris de Burgh fan?   *thud!*
>

There's more of us in Canada.  I'm usually on napster sharing his first
15 albums while looking for the 3 of his CDs I lack.

> I'd suggest the "Revolution" trilogy over "The Leader", especially since he
> mentions the "years of domination" along the way.  Also the final part,
> "Liberty" reminds me a lot of Croaker and his conscience.
>

There are a few other songs that come close as well,

Crusader - telling a very one sided version of the Crusades, ending
with:
There is only gread and evil in those who fight today,
The song of the Crusader has long since gone away.
This Song For You - a letter home to a loved one from a person who knows
he is about to die in battle,
The Traveller - well, a lot of 'dead' people came back after their
murder, and the Black Company often got the same warm welcome the
Traveller did.

While it's great to talk about this wonderful singer / song writer, I
think I may have wandered off the topic.

<spoilers below>

Back to to a Black Company Marching Song - I don't think they had any.
If they had a traditional song, Croaker would have mentioned it -
specially in the last book when he was thinking about all the things
that he was the sole surviving witness to.  When he realized he was the
last person who remembered the old (pre Soulcatcher) standard - that
would have been the perfect time to mention the old marching song if
there was one.  The only time I can recall any sort of song was in the
first book - when Goblin (or was it One-Eye?) changed the words to a
song to re-start the feud.

It could just be me but I don't see the men singing.

Richard

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From: Steve Harris <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 20 Feb 2001 12:57:54 -0600

Richard,

Black Company Marching Song??

As you say,

"I don't see the men singing."

More to the point:  I don't see them marching!  This is not an outfit
that goes on parade or does boot-camp-like training exercizes.  And if
they ever did close-order battle drill (which is where marching comes
from), none of the chroniclers we've read have mentioned it.

For my part, the best war song I know of is the Partisaner Lied of the
Jewish Resistance Movement in WWII.  Very dark, but honest:  "These
words are writ in blood and not with lead."  Not really a marching song,
though--the Resistance didn't march.

Steve

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From: Richard Chilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 20 Feb 2001 16:03:41 -0400

Steve Harris wrote:
>
> Richard,
>
> Black Company Marching Song??
>
> As you say,
>
> "I don't see the men singing."
>
> More to the point:  I don't see them marching!  This is not an outfit
> that goes on parade or does boot-camp-like training exercizes.  And if
> they ever did close-order battle drill (which is where marching comes
> from), none of the chroniclers we've read have mentioned it.
>

I see them marching - anytime you have sargents you have solders
marching more or less in straight lines.  It's been a while since I read
the books of the South, but when the Black Company was putting together
the defense force the main goal was to get the new recruits marching in
the same direction at the same time.

As for parade - I've heard it said that no combat ready force ever
passed parade (or was it dress inspection?) and I can't see any Captain
more concerned with how the company looked then how it fought.

The Black Company did form ranks and march in several places - I just
can't see them singing a traditional battle or marching song as they
did.  It doesn't seem to fit their esprit de corps.

Richard

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From: Steve Harris <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 20 Feb 2001 14:22:12 -0600

Richard,

"when the Black Company was putting together
the defense force the main goal was to get the new recruits marching in
the same direction at the same time."

I read that as meaning "headed in the same direction at the same time,
staying more or less together", and not at all marching, as in, all left
feet come down at the same time, then all right feet come down at the
same time.  And without that last, it's impossible to have a marching
song (that's what marching songs are for--to coordinate the feet; like
sailors' chanteys, they are music designed in aid of work, to coordinate
mass movement).

Steve

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From: "Joseph McGrath" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 20 Feb 2001 18:47:50 -0000

Hey steve? yeah, there was a few tunes sung in the BC series. The main one
that comes to mind is during the Jewel Cities campaigns. (I think) Something
about how one of the guys started belting out a marching song that was old
and the whole force joined in and it made everbody feel better because, you
know, it's the company against the world. It's either in Shadows Linger or
White Rose. I'm going to have to check though and i've lent out Shadows
Linger. Which brings to mind this cool thing that happened to me
yesterday...
    I walked into a used book store that was going out of buisiness in
Cambridge Ma. (I live on the North Shore of Boston.) I picked up 1 copy of,
"A Shadow of All Night Falling," 2 copies of , "October's Baby," each one
has a slightly different cover from each other. One is a Berkley Showcase,
the other's just a Berkley. One copy of, "Sweet Sliver Blues." (When we
tried to do the Book of the Month Club thing I couldn't find my original. It
was dog eared and falling apart anyway) I'm on pg. 90 of that and on pg. 38
of A Shadow Of All Night.
    Plus a copy of Cold Copper, Sliver Spike, White Rose and Black Company.
Total cost $9.20. Yee Hah! I've never read the first two of Dread Empire,
only Ill Fate. Psyched.
If anybody still wants to do the Sweet silver thing. I'm at where the
Triplets just scared off the mob after only being allowed to drink a bucket
of beer apiece.
Thanks for everybody's time,
Joseph

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 6:57 PM


> Richard,
>
> Black Company Marching Song??
>
> As you say,
>
> "I don't see the men singing."
>
> More to the point:  I don't see them marching!  This is not an outfit
> that goes on parade or does boot-camp-like training exercizes.  And if
> they ever did close-order battle drill (which is where marching comes
> from), none of the chroniclers we've read have mentioned it.
>
> For my part, the best war song I know of is the Partisaner Lied of the
> Jewish Resistance Movement in WWII.  Very dark, but honest:  "These
> words are writ in blood and not with lead."  Not really a marching song,
> though--the Resistance didn't march.
>
> Steve
>
> =======================================================================
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>  visit <http://www.xmission.com/~shpshftr/GC/GC-Mail.html>.


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From: David George <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 20 Feb 2001 19:27:22 -0600

Not claiming any personal military experience (have none) but everything
I've ever read about it indicates that marching (i.e. close order drill) in
infantry outfits (certainly up to the Mid 19th century) is not just for
show and that getting the men to more or less go the same direction at the
same time would not have been enough for the new recruits in the Black
Company (an infantry unit IIRC).  Not by a long stretch.

Basically, the more choreographed your outfit is (i.e. coordinated
movements, controlled spacing, not just "roughly the same place at the same
time") the better you will do in close combat.  It is often ascribed as one
of the reasons that Roman infantry kicked everyone else's ass for so many
years--discipline, drill, and good maneuvering in the field--i.e.
coordinated mass movement.  The most notorious outfit that damaged the
Romans (until the late empire) was Hannibal's and he had a strong, hard
core of veteran infantry who, after the first few battles, were equipped
with Roman gear.  Elephants and cavalry would not have meant dick without a
solid core of infantry.

Ditto the English Redcoats and the Napoleonic infantry.  Discipline, drill,
and marching made them able to maneuver.  And maneuver is where it is at in
massive infantry struggles.  A lot of effort goes into keeping lines
dressed.  Too far away from each other, you get no support from your shield
brother, too close and you are stepping on each other.  Dressing the line
means gap control--enough room to fight in a coordinated line, not enough
room to let the enemy through the unit.  It also means keeping the shape of
the line, no bowing or salients unless they are ordered--salients are
points the enemy can exploit to break the line.  Break the line and it is
over: the enemy will get through, get behind you, widen the gap, and push
you into two groups and roll up your line.

Shifting formation would also be an important survival skill, depending on
the enemy you faced, particularly cavalry.  The Romans did not have to deal
with cavalry as much because until the late Empire, cavalry was largely a
scouting and harrassing force.  But heavy infantry in the 18th-19th century
had a big impact on what formation your infantry would take.  Against other
infantry and advancing or defending the field, you'd be set up in a long
line, facing the same direction.  Against cavalry, you'd form a square that
could face outward, with massed weapons and mutual support.  Trained
cavalry against a strung out line would lead to lots of dead infantrymen
and not much of a line.  They'd just ride up and down the line, wacking
with swords for all they were worth.  Get an infantryman to run and a
horseman will cut him down from behind.  Cavalry sabers are made for just
that sort of attack, heavy blades to cut open infantrymen's backs.  The
same tactical concerns would hold true for the Romans, if they faced
powerful cavalry forces.

The ability to walk together (it ain't easy for a big group) to stay the
correct distance from each other (dress that line, soldier) and to shift
direction or change the shape of ranks without chaos is really hard.  It
takes a lot of practice.  As to the relative value of marching together,
left-right-left vs. simply keeping the line dressed, it could be pretty
intimidating to see a well-coordinated outfit coming at you, especially if
your lines aren't dressed and you can see the gaps in your own outfit.

I suspect the primary purpose of close order drill in modern forces is
probably more for unit-building and discipline (but someone correct me if
I'm wrong).  Rifled firearms make it pretty devastating to advance in a
line (look at Civil War battles as examples--musket tactics in a rifled
firearms reality).  It would be pretty harrowing with muskets, but at least
you could get fairly close before they could range on you.  Rifles have the
range to put more than a couple rounds of massed fire into a charge over
 open ground.  I think that is ultimately why marching became more drill
and less battle practice.

Would songs help?  On the road, definitely.  Anything to relieve the
monotony of the view of the next guy's back (or his horse's ass).  In
drill, also they would help.  Convince these young men they are the baddest
dudes on life.  Give them a song to reinforce the idea.  Sing it a lot.

I know the Black Co. are not Romans, nor are they Redcoats or Napoleon's
infantry.  Glen tends to gloss over a lot of these details in the battle
sequences.  But tactics are tactics.  I would have a hard time seeing the
company as guys who, in a fight, just managed to go the same direction at
the same time.

DG

-----Original Message-----
Sent:    Tuesday, February 20, 2001 2:22 PM

Richard,

"when the Black Company was putting together
the defense force the main goal was to get the new recruits marching in
the same direction at the same time."

I read that as meaning "headed in the same direction at the same time,
staying more or less together", and not at all marching, as in, all left
feet come down at the same time, then all right feet come down at the
same time.  And without that last, it's impossible to have a marching
song (that's what marching songs are for--to coordinate the feet; like
sailors' chanteys, they are music designed in aid of work, to coordinate
mass movement).

Steve

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From: Richard Gruver <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 21 Feb 2001 12:47:29 -0800

I'm not sure why I used the phrase "marching song" in my original post
other than the fact that it was 4am and I couldn't think of anything more
appropriate. I am sure there are lot of other songs that would remind
people of the BC. That one just came to mind several times while I was
reading. It's more like a recruiting song than anything else I guess. Kind
of a call to adventure for those of a darker bent.
Richard


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From: Steve Harris <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 21 Feb 2001 15:19:39 -0600

David,

Your points are well-taken on the uses of close-order drill in battle
formations.

What I had observed was that there are practically no descriptions of
such in the BC canon.  Most of the well-described fights are urban or
are small skirmishes.  The largest battle described--the battle at
Charm--has the BC pretty much just staying put on the ramparts of the
Lady's citadel (or retreating up it).  The only example that comes to
mind of a described battle where close-order drill on the part of the BC
might have had a part, is the disastrous affair at Dejagore--and even
then I don't recall the BC itself being described as using such tactics.
 (Was there a massed battle in the Shadowlands?  I don't clearly recall;
if there was, it wasn't described in a lot of detail.)

The BC having developed a reputation for success over a period of
centuries argues for their having available to them the tactics
necessary to succeed in a variety of contexts, including massed infantry
battles facing various types of opponents.  But we just don't see the
sort of tactics that lead to the development of marching as a company
tradition.

Maybe they started to rely too much on Tom-Tom, One-Eye, Silent, and
Goblin, in the years leading up to Croaker?  Perhaps they once were
masters of infantry tactics of the standard sort, but once through
Gle-Xle (or whatever it was), picking up Tom-Tom and One-Eye, they got
to liking the edge of socery.  And they eventually acquired Goblin and
Silent--and they got the knack of using all manner of subterfuges to
avoid having to engage in massed infantry attacks (except where they had
an overwhelming advantage to start with).  Remember, they weren't in
very good shape in Opal:  They were actually losing, and things would
have become very sticky without the fortuitous out afforded them by Soulcatcher.

Just some possibilities to consider.

Steve

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From: "Amy Weathers" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 21 Feb 2001 19:43:21 -0700


>    I walked into a used book store that was going out of buisiness in
>Cambridge Ma. (I live on the North Shore of Boston.) I picked up 1 copy of,
>"A Shadow of All Night Falling," 2 copies of , "October's Baby," each one
>has a slightly different cover from each other.

Oh sure, I look for October's Baby for like ten years and you find two
copies at one time.   Life is cruel.     Now that I have a copy, I have not
had time to read it.


As to the Black Company Music, I took a vote of the three other people
currently sitting in my house and they all suggested Metallica's _For home
the Bell Tolls_  or _Razorback_.  Either of which you could probally find on
Nabster, much to their dismay.   I am not sure if I agree with either of
those two suggestions but I agreed to post my poll findings to the list.  I
guess I would be more inclined to pick something like, Bad Company's _Bad
Company_  but I would have to think about it more.


Amy




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From: Richard Chilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Odp: (glencook-fans) Black Company Marching Song???
Date: 22 Feb 2001 00:18:16 -0400

Amy Weathers wrote:

>
> As to the Black Company Music, I took a vote of the three other people
> currently sitting in my house and they all suggested Metallica's _For home
> the Bell Tolls_  or _Razorback_.

If we are looking at Metallica, one from their first big album comes to
mind - Disposable Heroes.  Less for the way the Black Company saw itself
then the way their employers treated them.  The first verse and the two
verse chours sums up how much many of their employers cared about.

     Bodies fill the fields I see, hungry heroes end
     No one to play soldier now, no one to pretend
     Running blind through killing fields, bred to kill them all
     Victim of what sex should be
     A servant `til I fall

     Soldier boy, made of clay
     Now an empty shell
     Twenty one, only son
     But he served us well
     Bred to kill, not to care
     Just do as we say
     Finished here, Greeting Death
     He's yours to take away

     Back to the front
     You will do what I say, when I say
     Back to the front
     You will die when I say, you must die
     Back to the front
     You coward
     You servant
     You blindman

 <snipping some>

     I was born for dying

<snipping some more>

Richard Chilton

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From: "Don" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 19:42:23 -0600
Date: 26 Feb 2001 18:59:10 -0700

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C0A02C.3D404040
Content-Type: text/plain;
    charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hey Eric,
are the covers for Red Iron Nights and Cold Copper tears really switched =
in the Russian Publications. My ignorance of the Russian language =
prevent me from figuring this out on my own. Is anybody else really =
annoyed by Garrett always dressed in a suit and trench coat. I know he's =
a finder of secrets, but I can't stand the way the covers depict him. =
Love the books though. I do kind of like the weird Polish covers though.

Don=20
"In time, what's deserved always gets served."- COC



------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C0A02C.3D404040
Content-Type: text/html;
    charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2614.3500" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hey Eric,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>are the covers for Red Iron Nights and =
Cold Copper=20
tears really switched in the Russian Publications. My ignorance of the =
Russian=20
language prevent me from figuring this out on my own. Is anybody else =
<EM>really=20
</EM>annoyed by Garrett always dressed in a suit and trench coat. I know =
he's a=20
finder of secrets, but I can't stand the way the covers depict him. Love =
the=20
books though. I do kind of like the weird Polish covers =
though.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Don <BR>"In time, what's deserved =
always gets=20
served."- COC</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C0A02C.3D404040--


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From: Igor Filippov <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 19:42:23 -0600
Date: 27 Feb 2001 01:02:29 -0500 (EST)

Hey Don,

I speak Russian, is there any way I can help ?

Igor


On Mon, 26 Feb 2001, Don wrote:

> Hey Eric,
> are the covers for Red Iron Nights and Cold Copper tears really switched in the Russian Publications. My ignorance of the Russian language prevent me from figuring this out on my own. Is anybody else really annoyed by Garrett always dressed in a suit and trench coat. I know he's a finder of secrets, but I can't stand the way the covers depict him. Love the books though. I do kind of like the weird Polish covers though.
>
> Don
> "In time, what's deserved always gets served."- COC
>
>
>


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From: Steve Harris <[e-mail]>
Subject: (glencook-fans) Faded Steel Heat
Date: 27 Feb 2001 01:49:41 -0600

Hi, all,

Well, I've finished the latest of the Garrett books, the first one I've
read (it was the only one available in the bookstore).  And I'm leaving
it nearly as confused as when I began it :)  Seems to be an enormous
number of extraneous side-characters, popping in in the last quarter of
the book (Saucerhead, Winger, etc.), obvious hold-overs from earlier
novels--and doing nothing of any import, putting in an appearance for no
discernible reason.  And correct me if I'm wrong:  There was no clearing
up of the basic political questions raised at the beginning.

I suppose it's a mistake to get into a series in the middle.  But that
didn't stop me from enjoying the Dread Empire books immensely, though I
got into them with only the recent ones.  (And they, too, end in media
res, with things all unresolved--but still I liked them.)  At least with
DE, I was fortunate enough eventually to collect them all--and I like
the last ones the best, much more mature.

Steve

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From: Eric Herrmann <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (glencook-fans) Cover Pictures (was Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001
Date: 27 Feb 2001 08:20:48 -0700


> are the covers for Red Iron Nights and Cold Copper tears really switched in
> the Russian Publications. My ignorance of the Russian language prevent me from
> figuring this out on my own.

I don't know the Russian language either, but I know several Russians. There
is also a fairly good online translation page at <www.rustran.com>.

My good friend Jack Rogov who runs The Russian Glen Cook Page
(http://lavka.cityonline.ru/cook.htm) has told me that there was a mix-up in
the covers by the publisher.

While we're on the topic, I'm missing cover scans for about 6 Russian
editions. If anyone can provide these please contact me privately.

> Is anybody else really annoyed by Garrett always dressed in a suit and trench
> coat. I know he's a finder of secrets, but I can't stand the way the covers
> depict him. Love the books though. I do kind of like the weird Polish covers
> though.

As I've said before, I really like the new Polish covers. However, I think a
worse anachronism is the dwarves-with-guns on "Sweet Silver Blues."

Anyone in Poland know when MAG is going to continue publishing these?

--
Eric Herrmann
<[e-mail]>


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From: Thereidos <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re[2]: (glencook-fans) Cover Pictures (was Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 19:42:23 -0600)
Date: 27 Feb 2001 18:31:10 +0100

> As I've said before, I really like the new Polish covers. However, I think a
> worse anachronism is the dwarves-with-guns on "Sweet Silver Blues."

> Anyone in Poland know when MAG is going to continue publishing these?

What do you mean by 'dwarves with guns'. Where is it? On the cover?

And about MAG :
As far as I know 'Sweet Silver Blues', 'Bitter Gold Hearts', 'Cold
Copper Tears', 'Old Tin Sorrows' have been published in Poland by MAG.
But this publisher (I must admit it isn't too good publisher, I
personally don't like them) haven't said anything about next Garrett
novels' publications....
--
pozdrawiam
Thereidos
[e-mail] | http://thp.civ.pl
ICQ# 75745884 Gadu-Gadu # 169903



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From: Eric Herrmann <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: (glencook-fans) Cover Pictures
Date: 27 Feb 2001 11:02:16 -700


> What do you mean by 'dwarves with guns'. Where is it? On the cover?

On the cover of every edition of "Sweet Silver Blues" but MAG, there
is a member of the Tate family in front holding some sort of modern
military weapon. At least that's what it has always looked like to me.
(You can click on the thumbnails to get the full cover scan of almost
all of the books.)

There's probably someone on this list that can identify its make and
model.

Another anacronism is the Garrett cover with a car.

> And about MAG : As far as I know 'Sweet Silver Blues', 'Bitter Gold
Hearts', 'Cold
> Copper Tears', 'Old Tin Sorrows' have been published in Poland by
MAG.
> But this publisher (I must admit it isn't too good publisher, I
> personally don't like them) haven't said anything about next Garrett
> novels' publications....

They must be selling well. I was only able to get a Wydanie I of "Old
Tin Sorrows".
Well at least they got farther than Alfa-Wero.

I really liked their covers and was waiting to see what elements would
get used for the covers of the remaining books.

--
Eric Herrmann
<[e-mail]>

o

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From:    "Marcin Welnicki" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: (glencook-fans) Cover Pictures (was Date: Mon, 26 Feb 200119:42:23 -0600)
Date: 27 Feb 2001 20:17:13 +0100


 I do kind of like the weird Polish covers though.

You mean those from the first edition?
>
> As I've said before, I really like the new Polish covers. However, I think
a
> worse anachronism is the dwarves-with-guns on "Sweet Silver Blues."
>
heh
> Anyone in Poland know when MAG is going to continue publishing these?
>
they're lazy- probably in 2-3 months...

Szyd



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From:    "Marcin Welnicki" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Odp: Re[2]: (glencook-fans) Cover Pictures
Date: 27 Feb 2001 20:19:47 +0100

>
> I really liked their covers and was waiting to see what elements would
> get used for the covers of the remaining books.

Yeah, I like the idea of the 3 characters on every cover.

Szyd( a short for Mocker ;))



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From: Thereidos <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Re: Re[2]: (glencook-fans) Cover Pictures
Date: 28 Feb 2001 18:45:27 +0100

> On the cover of every edition of "Sweet Silver Blues" but MAG, there
> is a member of the Tate family in front holding some sort of modern
> military weapon. At least that's what it has always looked like to me.
> (You can click on the thumbnails to get the full cover scan of almost
> all of the books.)


Well, yeah... now I see this - on cover of 'Sweet Silver Blues' by
Alfa-Wero :))


> There's probably someone on this list that can identify its make and
> model.

For me it looks like an UZI....

> Another anacronism is the Garrett cover with a car.

??
This I haven't seen :))

>> And about MAG : As far as I know 'Sweet Silver Blues', 'Bitter Gold
> Hearts', 'Cold
>> Copper Tears', 'Old Tin Sorrows' have been published in Poland by
> MAG.
>> But this publisher (I must admit it isn't too good publisher, I
>> personally don't like them) haven't said anything about next Garrett
>> novels' publications...

> They must be selling well. I was only able to get a Wydanie I of "Old
> Tin Sorrows".
> Well at least they got farther than Alfa-Wero.

:)
Saying you've got 'Old Tin Sorrows' you mean a scan of it's cover or
the book it self?

> I really liked their covers and was waiting to see what elements would
> get used for the covers of the remaining books.

Yeah. I also think their covers are interesting and eye-catching :)

> --
> Eric Herrmann
> <[e-mail]>
 [e-mail]--
pozdrawiam
Thereidos
[e-mail] | http://thp.civ.pl
ICQ# 75745884 Gadu-Gadu # 169903



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From: Eric Herrmann <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Re: Re[2]: (glencook-fans) Cover Pictures
Date: 28 Feb 2001 11:13:18 -700


>> Another anacronism is the Garrett cover with a car.
> ?? This I haven't seen :))

Keep looking... <g>

>> They must be selling well. I was only able to get a Wydanie I of
"Old
>> Tin Sorrows".
> Saying you've got 'Old Tin Sorrows' you mean a scan of it's cover or
> the book it self?

The book itself. I own a copy of all the Polish editions. That is all
except for an edition of "The Black Company" with the horse running to
the left. It is a mirror image of the current cover.

Anybody have a copy of this? I'd like to get a cover scan.

--
Eric Herrmann
<[e-mail]>>

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From: "Joseph McGrath" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Re: Re[2]: (glencook-fans) Cover Pictures
Date: 28 Feb 2001 14:36:25 -0000

Hey Guys,
    Yeah, all the Garrett novels have the Hildebrandt brothers. You'd think
that with all their experience in illustrating Fantasy that they would get
accurate with their interpertations. I haven't really liked every one of
their pieces, they are just too hokey looking for me, too many rosy cheeks
and all that. I mean look at all the 70's Tolkien calanders they did.
Granted I was in Junior High and happy to have any interpertation of
Tolkiens work. But they weren't anything like Tolkiens own interpertaions
were. And His drawings were available for Them to get ideas from.
    Perhaps the publishers told them how to do their work. Or maybe that's
what Cook wanted but i tend to doubt that. It seems to me that the last
illustrations Cook was psyched for was Keith Berdak's, but far be it for me
to words in his mouth. He did dedicate a book, something like, "For Keith,
because I like his style." I liked Berdak's interpertations myself because
there was a kind of sinuous humor to some of them. Especially the Silver
Spike, Toad Killer Dog's face just cracks me up.

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2001 6:13 PM


>
> >> Another anacronism is the Garrett cover with a car.
> > ?? This I haven't seen :))
>
> Keep looking... <g>
>
> >> They must be selling well. I was only able to get a Wydanie I of
> "Old
> >> Tin Sorrows".
> > Saying you've got 'Old Tin Sorrows' you mean a scan of it's cover or
> > the book it self?
>
> The book itself. I own a copy of all the Polish editions. That is all
> except for an edition of "The Black Company" with the horse running to
> the left. It is a mirror image of the current cover.
>
> Anybody have a copy of this? I'd like to get a cover scan.
>
> --
> Eric Herrmann
> <[e-mail]>>
>
> =======================================================================
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