I think the guilt complex about colonialism mentioned in the post below is in itself another manifestation of the colonialist spirit. Of course, no one is going to dispute the attrocities committed all over the world because of colonialist thinking... But in that sense, if have to blame a musical genre for all the colonial sins you should try national anthems or military songs.
But, come on... Exotica is also a manifestation of human curiosity towards other cultures and inventiveness when the information available is not enough. And those are two characteristics of humankind that are not culture-specific.
Music in South America is a clear example of this. It is not European, it is not African, it is not native... It's a complex mix of all the cultures involved, that evolved at least in part because of mutual curiosity. Should we see this kind of music as the evil results of Spanish and Portuguese colonization? I think that would be incredibly absurd.
And now I have moved and I am back in Colombia. So I know (because I live it day by day) that stereotypes get digested in mixed cultures, and turn into something else. Something that is not threatening nor insulting.
So... There is no need for preaching the evils of exotic music.
And I also think that in this argument there is also an implicit, politically correct, moral high-ground that reminds me very much of the actual colonial ways of thinking (the thinking that all other worldviews were not only ilogical but morally wrong...) Scary.
Cheers,
Manuel
> First of all, I wanted to deal with the very essence of Exotica (as a
> musical genre and idea), its darker and more reactionary aspects; I
> wanted to dismantle the romanticizazion of the so called "Orient" (being
> it Africa or Polynesia) filtering through hundreds of 50's-60's Exotica
> records. To retrace this idea I plunged into exotic cinema, literature
> and even classical music. I also spent months in Rome's national library
> to study how through centuries colonial countries turned exoticism into
> a monstrous lethal machine. For instance in the 20's, during Fascism,
> cities like Naples were turned into "under-glass jungles" with Africans
> directly "imported" from Ethiopia and exhibited as if they were
> creatures from another world. Not to speak of how Italian soldiers
> "sexually studied" natives on the spot for the sake of exoticism.
# Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list?
# Send the command "info exotica" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com.
# To post, email exotica@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 20:14:58 -0500
From: Matt Marchese <mjmarch@charter.net>
Subject: Re: (exotica) Are we afraid of this topic?
"m.ace" wrote:
> So I suppose the question is what you see happening down on that level. An
> exploitative
> fantasy? Or a sweet dream that seduces the listener in unintended ways?
Oh, I think that's a false dichotomy. I consider cultural appropriation to be a
necessary part of human evolution. Our dreams become our memes and vice-a the
verse-a.
> I've always wondered how much of the jungle imagery might have been spurred
> by a Freudian (or would it be Jungian?) "jungle in the mind" concept. You
> know... it's not about real jungles, but about the primitive aspects
> lurking inside modern man... bla, bla, bla, etc, etc. That line of thought
> was somewhat in vogue at the time.
Definitely Jungian. I think that it definitely represents an element of
primitive liberating sexuality in the repressive culture of the 1950s, but I
also see it as yet another variation of the Noble Savage stereotype that's
cropped up in Western culture many times over last couple-hundred years or so.
> How do you see the cultural imperialism issue? How bad is it to swipe art
> ideas from other cultures? The thing is, the opposite extreme is to keep
> all forms free of impure influences from other cultures... ethnic purity...
> which frightens me much more. Art (and people) thrives on mixing.
Cultural imperialism is a strawman. It's not a case of the strong preying on
the weak. All cultures steal from one another. From what I've seen, the
culturally conquered steal far more from their so-called "oppressors" than the
other way around.
Having lived in many different parts of the world, I can think of nothing more
boring than a totally heterogeneous culture in which no cross-pollination ever
occurs. What would Western music be like if it had never interacted with any
other forms? I'm having a scary vision of a world filled with Michael Flatley
clones doing the "Riverdance" now. Ack!
- --
Matt Marchese
mjmarch@charter.net
http://reality.sgi.com/mattm_americas/
"Lucky Fruit, the dried corpse is horrible!" -Peacock King
Subject: Re: (exotica) Je t'aime moi non plus / KPM reissues
>>"je t'aime moi non plus"
>>actually, the exact translation would be :
>>"i love you, neither do i"
>>poetic contradiction between one assertion and a
>>negative term
a little curiosity: a 1970s version I mentioned in here before, performed by a certain Brigitte and a mysterious "famous italian actor" (Alberto Lupo? Arnoldo Foa'?) from that period, sounds like "Ti amo e io di piu'" i.e. "I love you... And I (love you) even more".
DjB
p.s. prepare for a couple of little surprises on mp3.com in the next hours ;)
# Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list?
# Send the command "info exotica" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com.
# To post, email exotica@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender.
That would be "Tropicando" by Les Baxter and the 101 Strings. From the
album "Que Mango".
Paul
Nathan wrote:
> .....jingle.............it's for some yuppie pants (Dockers I
> think)......this guy enters a fancy dining room with his date and meets mom
> and dad. Mom shows an interest in him as well, and there's someone rubbing
> their foot against his leg during dinner..........is it his gal, his gal's
> mom OR her DAD who's looking at him funny as well.
>
> Fun commercial and a great E-Z song in the background - what is it?
>
> - Nate
# Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list?
# Send the command "info exotica" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com.
# To post, email exotica@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 10:50:09 -0400
From: Ross Orr <mambofrenzy@earthlink.net>
Subject: (exotica) Re: Mondo Exotica
Francesco wrote:
>I wanted to deal with the very essence of Exotica (as a
>musical genre and idea), its darker and more reactionary aspects; I
>wanted to dismantle the romanticizazion of the so called "Orient" (being
>it Africa or Polynesia) filtering through hundreds of 50's-60's Exotica
>records.
This is a whole fascinating subject, and it goes right to the heart
of "what is exotica?"
For me "romanticizing the Other" IS the crucial element--but I would
qualify that by saying The Other does not even have to be from
another culture: a similar thing happens when Marty Gold decides it's
a good idea to do a "groovy" Moog Beatles album (an LP which has been
warping my mind all week).
Now that the Lounge Revival seems to have made its most lasting mark
on advertising, graphics, etc. (where it is used in an uncritical
way), I think it is valid to remind people that a 50's American
fantasy of Africa or Polynesia had some severely racist dimensions.
However you might underestimate the fact that for many of us earlier
re-discoverers of this music, we were completely conscious of that
element. In fact, when it comes to hearing Ken Griffin murder some
Hawaiian classic on the Mighty Wurlitzer, that is pretty much the
only reason for keeping the record.
A few years back on this list we found that there seemed to be one
age-cluster of people who were born around 1960, and had come to
Exotica after listening to a lot of punk and "authentic" World Music
at earlier times in their life. (That's my own history, anyway.) So
at least that group came to exotica with a bit more critical distance
than you might think, given some of the shallower manifestations of
the "lounge revival." (Of course, irony and shock value may draw you
in--but ultimately what keeps you interested is a sincere
appreciation for energetic and talented people pushing themselves to
try new things.)
Just to go back specifically to Martin Denny for a second, why do you
think Scamp reissued _Afro-Desia_ as its first Denny CD, and the only
one which was not a twofer? Perhaps Ashley is still out there and
could comment--but I would say that outrageousness of the
faux-Swahili lyrics sung by perky white people was the reason for the
special interest in that title.
The other thing I would say is that even for the original 50s/60s
audience, there was at least *some* aspect to these other cultures
which people found alluring--so I think you can't see this imagery in
100% negative terms. As many have suggested, even while regarding
other cultures as "primitive" Americans were imagining a life that
was somehow more free and passionate (in all senses!)
Anyway, in the course of 500 pages you probably say all this and
more! Sounds like an amazing effort, and I hope to see it someday. .
. any plans for translated editions yet?
cheers,
--Ross
|| Ross "Mambo Frenzy" Orr <mambofrenzy@earthlink.net>
|| Ann Arbor, Michigan USA
# Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list?
# Send the command "info exotica" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com.
# To post, email exotica@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 09:54:55 -0400
From: Ross Orr <mambofrenzy@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: (exotica) Tipsy in NY & Boston
>our first shows since (finally!) finishing the new album.
Hey! What is it called, and when is it be available?
a fan,
--Ross
|| Ross "Mambo Frenzy" Orr <mambofrenzy@earthlink.net>
|| Ann Arbor, Michigan USA
# Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list?
# Send the command "info exotica" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com.
# To post, email exotica@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 11:06:36 -0400
From: "Nathan Miner" <nminer@jhmi.edu>
Subject: Re: (exotica) Another commercial......
Ah yes, that Les Baxter 101 Strings album............I didn't really like =
a lot of the cuts but "Tropicando" sounds grooooovy babe!
What're others reactions to this slab 'o wax?
Thanks - what a fount of useless knowledge this list contains!! :-)
- - Nate
# Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list?
# Send the command "info exotica" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com.
# To post, email exotica@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 18:58:41 +0200
From: ultrasuoni <ultrasuoni@ilmanifesto.mir.it>
Subject: (exotica) Re: Mondo Exotica
Francesco wrote:
>I wanted to deal with the very essence of Exotica (as a
>musical genre and idea), its darker and more reactionary aspects; I
>wanted to dismantle the romanticizazion of the so called "Orient" (being
>it Africa or Polynesia) filtering through hundreds of 50's-60's Exotica
>records.
ROSS WROTE: This is a whole fascinating subject, and it goes right to
the heart
of "what is exotica?"
MANUEL WROTE:
>So I know (because I live it day by day) that stereotypes get digested in mixed cultures, and turn into something else. Something that is not threatening nor insulting.
>So... There is no need for preaching the evils of exotic music.
Hi Carl, Manuel, Matt, Robert, Ross and all the other "exotica denizens"
getting involved in this "Exotica/Colonial/Racism" debate. This is for
you Robert, as you know "Mondo Exotica" is available through
www.plastic.it which is an Italian exotica/soundtrack/lounge record
label selling my book abroad; when you contact 'em they'll send you all
the possible info about the text, how to order and buy it. Hi Ross, nice
to know you, the book won't be soon translated into English. So far
people from the States, Canada, England and Japan are buying basically
because of the vast discography; maybe this will trigger a chain
reaction attracting some foreign publishing group, who knows. Yes, I
agree with you when you confirm that "I think it is valid to remind
people that a 50's American fantasy of Africa or Polynesia had some
severely racist dimensions". But I'm not so sure that "for many of us
earlier re-discoverers of this music, we were completely conscious of
that element". For instance I decided to write "Mondo Exotica" because I
wasn't so sure, I perceived that there was something wrong but I had to
go to the "Heart of Darkness" of Exotica to find some confirmations. I
found them. I agree with you when you say "I would say that
outrageousness of the
faux-Swahili lyrics sung by perky white people was the reason for the
special interest in that title (Afro-Desia, by M. Denny)". The point is:
I feel much more at ease when someone - you Ross, in this case -
stresses that, beacuse this is the real question, knowledge, by no means
a passive acceptance of stereotypes (leopard skin, black/oriental woman
as vagina dentata, pure sexual instrument etc.) that also through the
rediscovery of Exotica and Space Age Pop are back into advertisements
and tv. That is to say: free your mind and your stereotype will follow.
Hey Manuel, I am afraid to hear that stereotypes can become
unthreatening and not insulting. A stereotype is a stereotype, even
under disguised forms. When they supposedly become "not threatening nor
insulting", it means that dominant cultures have already exterted their
perverse and annihilating influence.
francesco adinolfi
# Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list?
# Send the command "info exotica" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com.
# To post, email exotica@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 19:01:47 +0200
From: Johan Dada Vis <quiet@village.uunet.be>
Subject: (exotica) Re: Surf Exotica
i wouldn't file Laika under "surf", there much closer to Brit
"outer space" INSTRO from the late 50's early 60's. think Meek, but
with heavier guitars.
Johan
-----
>From: bobbyspacetroup@mindspring.com
>I have to agree that Laika and The Cosmonauts may just be the
>best new surf act around.
# Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list?
# Send the command "info exotica" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com.
# To post, email exotica@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender.
