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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 10:57:51 +0100
From: Mo <exotica@munich.netsurf.de>
Subject: Re: (exotica) Re: That early?
Thanks! It's great to get some real information about this. I see my theory confirmed by this.
Kristjan Saag wrote:
> Baroque music on record, at that time, was extremely unusual. (In the 1913 US record catalogue: two titles by Bach...) The Bach-Haendel-Vivaldi etc vogue came much later.
> And symphonies were hard to record with acoustic equipement - it wasn't until electric recording began (around 1925) that symphonies were released on a larger scale.
> My theory is: Hawaiian music was fool-proof to play on the early phonographs - you never had to worry about the record swaying...
Mo
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 10:59:01 +0100
From: Mo <exotica@munich.netsurf.de>
Subject: Re: (exotica) MOOG CD's!!
Dear Keith
> >If anyone on the list would like a copy of any or all of them, here's how
> you can do it.
>
> 1) Email me to get my address.
> NOTE: You'll have to send them to me down here in Australia, since I've
> moved from the states...
> 2) Send me the appropriate number of blank CD-R's.
> 3) Please send me one or two extra blank CD-R's for each one you want, as
> the packaging I've made uses expensive paper and lots of color ink. This
> amounts to 'payment' for me, but no money need change hands.
> 4) Please send adequate $ for return shipping back to you.
Thanks for the offer; I'd sure like copies of those; but does it make sense to
send you both CDs and money? It will only increase the total costs, as CDs are
kind of heavy and will need quite much postage. Instead I'd propose to send
you just money, enough to pay all your expenses. I would do that by airmail
and it would arrive within 2 weeks.
> BTW, I haven't done ANY 'audio-clean-up' to the vinyl...in fact, the comps
> begin with the sound of the stylus hitting the record, and each disc ends
> with the needle coming up! Gives you that veriteeee experience.
Sounds woofy!
Mo
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 11:00:56 +0100
From: Mo <exotica@munich.netsurf.de>
Subject: Re: (exotica) That early?
M H Jemmeson wrote:
> I was listening
> for the first time to Felix Mendelsohn and his Hawaiian Serenaders
> earlier today, and he was the grandson or great grandson of the other
> Felix Mendelsohn (as in Fingal's Cave etc)...
> A bit sunnier in Hawaii than the Hebrides perhaps...
Where did you get that? Is it on CD? Never heard about it.
Mo
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 11:02:15 +0100
From: Mo <exotica@munich.netsurf.de>
Subject: Re: (exotica) That early?
Rcbrooksod@aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 11/10/99 1:30:23 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> Kalnenekweirdomusic@wxs.nl writes:
>
> << Don't forget someone like Claude Debussy, who was influenced by Indonesian
> Gamelan music (among other things) at the end of last century.>>
>
Yes and no. There are definitely influences, but the music is basically still
"classic". No jazz, no beat, no drums, no screaming voices... Or do you know
something I don't know?
Mo
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 11:02:38 +0100
From: Mo <exotica@munich.netsurf.de>
Subject: Re: (exotica) That early?
Rcbrooksod@aol.com wrote:
> and believe me, there is some crazy sounding recordings on 78's from the
> teens and 20's. stuff that would be considered in the exotica genra today
> for sure.
>
> there are some great crying, laughing and yelling records where the people
> did just that.
I just ran upon a really great song by the Comedian Harmonists (a German group
that was pretty popular even overseas), called "Blume von Hawaii". It's from the
20s and starts with a wild rum intro that could make Perez Prado turn green. The
history of Exotica is indeed a constant evolution.
Mo
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:16:17 EST
From: Rcbrooksod@aol.com
Subject: Re: (exotica) That early?
In a message dated 11/10/99 2:18:47 PM Pacific Standard Time,
michael@jemmeson.freeserve.co.uk writes:
<< I was listening
for the first time to Felix Mendelsohn and his Hawaiian Serenaders
earlier today, and he was the grandson or great grandson of the other
Felix Mendelsohn (as in Fingal's Cave etc)...
A bit sunnier in Hawaii than the Hebrides perhaps... >>
I have lots of 78's by Mendelsohn and the Hawaiian Serenaders. I hate to say
it but most of them sound the same. And while I obviously love Exotica
music, I do not particularly like Hawaiian music (OK, maybe one or two tunes
occasionally).
I had Denny's "Hawaiian Tattoo" playing in my office yesterday and one of my
staff came in and said "Oh, you are listening to Hawaiian music to get ready
for your trip."
(I am going to Hawaii in Jan). Now this same staff member hears me listening
to other Denny music all the time but never associates those tunes with
Hawaii.
And of all the different types of songs, tunes, etc. that Denny did,
"Hawaiian Tattoo" is the only one that really sounds Hawaiian.
On a slightly different note, I have a version of Bing Crosby's "Sweet
Leilani" on some CD comp and it I can't stand it at all.
Funny how taste can vary so peculiarly,
TB
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:24:32 EST
From: Rcbrooksod@aol.com
Subject: Re: (exotica) Re: That early?
In a message dated 11/10/99 6:39:53 PM Pacific Standard Time,
kristjansaag@swipnet.se writes:
<< Baroque music on record, at that time, was extremely unusual. >>
I was breaking the term Classical Music down into Classical, Romantic and
Baroque because I do not like when people lump all three categories into
"Classical Music".
And there was a comment that it was hard to record symphonic performances. I
disagree. A single microphone pick up could be placed at a strategic
acoustical point in the concert hall and very easily record the mono version.
(BTW, they would often have a few mikes and then take the one they like the
best)
tb
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 12:25:26 GMT
From: Peter Hipwell <petehip@cogsci.ed.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: (exotica) Syd Dale
> From: G.R.Reader@bton.ac.uk
>
>
> Can anyone tell me about Syd Dale? I'd always had them down as one of the
> swathe of Orchestras doing fairly run of the mill stuff English big band
> stuff and not particularly worth searching out. The only things I've seen
> knocking about down here have been Syd Dale does Glenn Miller and such like.
Syd Dale does Glenn Miller? Are you sure you're not getting him
confused with the tiresome Syd Lawrence?
> His tracks on the Russ Meyer Comp were better than most of the other tracks,
> but then, cover aside I think that its a piss poor comp.
>
> But a friend gave me a compilation with 3 tracks, 'Portobello Market',
> 'Boogaloo' and 'Lucky Seven' and they are really good. Particularly
> Portobello, punchy brass, great rhythm section, bongo's and a crunchy fuzz
> guitar lick.
>
> So, whats the good stuff? Any comments?
>
Yeah, I first cottoned onto his name via the Sound Gallery (he's got a
track on there somewhere, or my mind's going).
I don't think I've actually ever seen an album with "Syd Dale" in big
letters on the cover, he always only appears in the small
print. Having said that, I've only got a couple of commercially
released albums by him. "Swinging Christmas" or somesuch by "The Dali
Caldis Ensemble" (totally appalling), and "The Chaplin Collection" on
Windmill Records.
The Chaplin record is music from Chaplin's films, BUT given a
fantastic cheese-funky 70s spin, hammond organ, wah-wah guitar, the
works, something not made entirely clear by the sparse liner
notes. You may well have skipped over this one, especially if you've
got the dull Johnny Howard Chaplinmusic LP. Snap it up if you find,
hear the jet-propelled "Smile" (with jet-propelled chorus) and its
scorching hammond organ solo, "Carefree", "Paperhangers"... it's a
goodie, absolutely no reverence at all for the originals.
But Dale was mainly involved in recording library music. On the
website for the "Sound Stage" company, there is this snippet:
"Between 1963 and 1964 Syd Dale contributed to more than 300 commercial
recordings and by the end of the decade had established himself as one
of the best and most valued composers for the first of the new
production music companies. So as to represent his own compositions in
the early 70's Syd decided to "go it alone" and founded Amphonic
Music. In 1980 the label "Sound Stage" was established to provide the
highest quality recordings."
So, the compilation (Boogaloo something, right?) is taken from the
Amphonic music library, which Dale actually owned as well as composed
for. I only have only Amphonic LP, by the Otto Klemperer Band (The OK
Band), which is Dale-composed and good in parts (titles like "Marching
Mr. Magoo", compositions described in terms such as "hippy hoedown
with calliope music").
I also have a couple of earlier recordings from the mid 60s, 10" LPs
of library music on the Audio Music label (IIRC). One of these is
"suspense" music, y'know for eerie and threatening situations, with
lots of solo bass, drones, chilling silences. The other is mostly
happy light jazz, very much of its vintage, but with one
monsterthunderbastardmother track called "Percussidness". This is
incredible, starts off bonkers with a kettledrum beat, then we get a
cowbell joining in and the melody on heavy-heavy fuzz guitar (and this
is 1965 or so) and/or brass, back to a kettledrum break and so
on. Totally mental piece, totally brilliant.
Anyway, that's probably more than enough on Dale. Seems like most of
his work was library music, tough to get hold of. Let me know what you
find, I'd be interested to know more.
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 99 13:32:39 +0100
From: Bissia <eyecon@dma.be>
Subject: (exotica) Astroslut cd
I'd like to have it to but I do only Vinyls !
Is that possible ?
>6) You really DO want the Astroslut cd. Mine arrived today and it's a
>blast(off). That Quinn Martian is such a prankster.
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:17:56 +0100
From: Mo <exotica@munich.netsurf.de>
Subject: Re: (exotica) That early?
Rcbrooksod@aol.com wrote:
> And of all the different types of songs, tunes, etc. that Denny did,
> "Hawaiian Tattoo" is the only one that really sounds Hawaiian.
>
Yeah, of all things the one instrument that M.D. hardly ever uses is the
Hawaiian guitar...
Mo
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 09:49:18 -0500
From: mimim@texas.net (Mimi Mayer)
Subject: Re: (exotica) Didn't RealAudio ask for it?
>Some time last night, the agile-minded and genial Paul Moshay wrote:
>i don't think the more fair distribution would go as far as the artist
>receiving a majority of profits, for the average artist at least.
Agreed. Quite reluctantly. But that's the way it'll probably shake out.
>how does making your music available to freely copy infinitely at no
>cost, benefit an artist monetarily? if artists feel they do not get
>a fair shake from the familiar record deal, how is giving away their
>recorded songs unprotected from unlimited piracy going to better
>their situation?
Two words: Audience building. Three more words: Extremely high risk. For an
artist in it for the long haul, MP3 files at least a way get the music out
there. Then when artists have new product, they may be able to exert
tighter controls. I'm probably naive here. I don't mess with MP3s so I
don't really know the technology.
Disclaimer here: I don't do MP3s because of piracy--that's my decision and
I don't impose it on anyone. But this from someone who suffers pangs of
guilt when swapping tapes of new CDs with pals or buying used books still
in print. I remain guilt free only when music or books I buy are not
otherwise available.
I liken MP3s to building audience by tour...but much more efficiently in
terms of time and costs than actually touring. (Won't say the obvious about
the Net reaching wider audiences...whoops, just did!) Or maybe a better
analogy would be distributing promo CDs to the college/noncommercial radio
markets. Aren't those markets a shrewd way for emerging, offcenter artists
to build their followings? I assume these distribution channels are ahead
of the curve with music--their noncommercial formats allow programmers to
play the music commercial radio won't. A tune hits on college/noncommercial
markets then possibly the commercial stations pick it up...or a musician
can at least earn enough to continue doin' music.
An recent NYT story reported that the biggest market for MP3s are college
students, who have the Net connections and time to scour the net for
pirated music files and the equipment to capture it. Don't college students
also buy the widest variety of music? Perhaps in this way, posting MP3s
samples from a CD then becomes a method for artists to reach their biggest
potential market of listeners while sidestepping the majors and other
commercial distribution channels.
Another thought about risk: Risk is the artists' meat and drink. Good
creative work requires risk. I once worked with a PhD in education who did
a lot of research on teaching creativity. He concluded that
creativity--talent--can't be taught, but risk-taking could. Perhaps MP3s
are a calculated risk musicians should take to build their audiences.
>is the unstated notion that giving away the music, acts would make
>money selling concert tix or teeshirts, etc. ? this is the part that
>bewilders me. in a pure digital transmission world without copyright
>piracy protection, where does the artist 'earn a living' exactly ?
>i'm confused, enlighten me.
Just tried, Paul. Must say, I can't help but laugh that a Wharton MBA poses
this question to an Michigan MFA in, for god sakes, poetry. Really
appreciate your generosity. :) I have no illusions about ever making a
living on my poetry. But the odds are better for musicians, painters,
photographers, filmmakers, novelists--they have a shot at big enough
markets of people who are willing to pay for their creations. And I hope
Nat is right with his point that people actually want objects. It means
artists have access to another source of income through royalties.
>possibly, though most artists are not successful economically and the
>ones that are have generally have short lifespans... pop music is like
>talking about perishables in a sad sense. therefore majors know that
>and that there are thousands of artists out there willing to sign for
>a shot at mass success that they would almost never have otherwise.
Tis true, tis sad.
>>> of music industry don't include a provision for 10, 20, or 30 percent of
>>> the aggregate demand for prerecorded music in the us to be satiated
>>> by piracy. ...
>
>bear in mind that
>many majors also support their acts lifestyles to one degree or another
>with the notion that it is worth it to allow them freedom to write/record/
>tour...and keep their lives intact while doing so.
Please school me on this, teacher. I know publishing, not music. Are these
payments like the advances publishers pay to writers? Or are they ongoing
life-support payments beyond royalties? Sort of on the principle that the
public will support a rock star if the musician is publicized as living
like a rock star?
>labels' will eventually have to give a bigger share of profits to artists'
>i believe. the bigger acts' ability to run their own careers over the net
>without label support....
Yeah!
>if the major/indies cannot exploit the masters' of their artists'
>releases they pay to create, they'd put their money in other ventures.
Perhaps. But that would entail pricey rebuilding and repositioning of the
majors as brandnames. By "other ventures" do you mean different artists? Or
different lines of business?
>Up to a "certain" executive level in these companies these are really
>music people that like yourself want to earn a living by doing something
>they love...but that can't continue if as a company they're giving away
>their output.
Agreed.
Mimi
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 09:53:24 -0500
From: mimim@texas.net (Mimi Mayer)
Subject: Re: (exotica) The Heintje/Heino story, pt. 2
Sorry, digesters and bandwidth guardians. Taking lots of space. Promise to
shut up now. beside, I'm lovin' the That Early thread.
Mo wrote:
>I like this idea too much! I wish I
>could write screen plays. I see it all in front of my inner eye...
>Little Heintje grows up in a very flat part of Holland....
I'll be happy to write the screenplay, Mo. But to do the job this biopic
would demand, I'd suggest a bit of tweeking for the tale. The most
compelling part of the Heintje/Heino story is yet to be told.
I'm talking about Heintje/Heino in love.
A little-known aspect of his biography involves the former Maharajah of
Rajput, or rather, his son, Prince Ben-Al Bezuise, revered throughout the
world among dog breeders for his championship apricot toy poodles. The
story I heard is, they met in Paris while Ben-Al was on a dog-buying
trip....Andy Warhol was sponsoring a Happening and issued a special invite
to Heino/Heintje and Ben-Al Bezuise, sensing the two would spark with the
rare chemistry of true love. Besides, Andy wanted a personal introduction
from Heino to his wigmaker--even in New York, a good wig was hard to come
by in those days. Fab visuals with the Velvets grinding away in the
background and some of Andy's special silver helium balloons floating
nearby.
Of course Andy's matchmaking worked in an explosion of toy poodles,lust,
wiggery, and yodeling music in both the Alpen and Himalayan styles. Imagine
the footage we could get! I suggest we shoot this scene from the POV of the
barkeep who witnesses the historic meeting. And the followup--a soft-focus
montage of the formidable Ben-Al, garbed in a vivid kaftan, trailing a
small flock of poodles on their leads as Heintje/Heino coos endearments to
all. Ben-Al plucking a sarangi as Heintje/Heino growls in the recording
studio. The two of them in a high-style kitchen perfecting HH's recipes for
almond cake and dog biscuits.
But alas, HH and B-AB shared only two brief years of bliss. No matter how
he plied HH's mother with gifts of blue-blood dogs and frothy beverages of
geniver shaken--not stirred!--with pomegranate juice, no matter how much he
praised her Limburger served on rye rusk crackers, Ben-Al can't defrost the
ice blasted at him by HH's mother. In fact, the guy who told me the story
said Mama detested her son's companion. She was maddened by jealousy that
another had supplanted her in her son's affections, according to my source.
Mo, this part of the story troubles me. I can't believe a good Dutch mama
would be anything other than loving, generous, warm to Ben-Al. On the other
hand, well-constructed drama requires conflict, so for the needs of the
picture, this is how I see the breakup scene:
Cut: the dramatic showdown between Ben-Al Bezuise and Mama, positioned amid
the tulip beds, backlit by a sunset marred with gathering storm
clouds...they scream, the mother and the lover battling for Heintje/Heino's
heart, while HH weeps, his wig askew. The 25 poodles yap in distress.
Thus ecstasy came to an end. Heintje/Heino soothed his broken heart by
escaping into his music, becoming an even huger star than before,
conquering the German charts and sweets markets at the same time with
records and his Heino Brand Mandelkuchen. Mama retreated to her cottage
until she took up with the Italian cheese maker, eventually inventing Umido
del poodles, a new cheese that is even stinkier than Limburger. As for the
postscript about Ben-Al Bezuise, we'd need to shoot on location in Vegas,
where Ben-al currently is housekeeper for and caretaker of Sigfried, Roy
and their white tigers. Surely Ben-Al will sign on as a consultant if we
pay him enough. Perhaps sweeten the deal with an uncredited cameo?
Isn't it time to break the silence about this neglected segment of the
Heintje/Heino story? There's only one problem: I think it may be
apocryphal.
Still, I'll have my girl buzz your girl so we can take a meeting and work
out the particulars.
Mimi
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Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:37:24 -0500
From: George Hall <GeorgeH@rounder.com>
Subject: (exotica) RE: exotica-digest V2 #539
Arjan Plug wrote...
> > << Well..., this article says that in the 10s of this
century
> > Hawaiian music was a national (USA) craze....
> > >>
> >
> > Oh yeah, and I have tons of old 78s to prove it. The
Hawaiian ukulele
> > actually was played in many other orchestral
arrangements.
>
> There was a Dutch CD compilation called "Haring & Hawaii"
(herring & hawaii)
> published in 1992 chronicling the history of hawaiian
music in the
> Netherlands. The earliest recording on it is a 1941 tune
by the Kilima
> Hawaiians although the accompanying book that was
published simultaneously
> starts as early as 1925. Mostly traditionals as I can
gather from the
> credits, very few originals. Haven't a clue if it sounds
like the real thing
> though!
>
> Arjan
>
Not Only But...by the 20's, the Hawaiian music craze had
gone as far as Nigeria, where records imported from Europe were enjoyed by
middle class black families who could afford a record player, years later
leading to King Sunny Ade w/a steel guitar.
> Anyone knows if there ever was a soundtrack release of
"Across 110th
> Street"? I only know Bobby Womack's title track of the
movie (which can be
> found on the Jackie Brown OST) and wondered if the rest
might be in the same
> superior class.
>
Yes, on Rykodisc, who've released a number of great titles
- -Johnny Mandel's "I Want to Live," Quincy Jones' Heat of the Night & Mr.
Tibbs as a 2-fer, etc.... Hopefully these will stay in print following the
label's move to NYC (where it's been folded into parent company Palm
Pictures). The Womack tracks are all pretty great, & jazz great J.J.
Johnson's incidental music is the highest quality wacka-wacka cop-jazz.
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Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 19:58:56 -0800
From: "Stephen W. Worth" <bigshot@spumco.com>
Subject: (exotica) Re: exotica-digest V2 #539
I'm a big fan of Hawaiian Guitar from the 20s and 30s... It's
a great blend of jazz and native Hawaiian sounds... not at all
