Hall of Fame/HallofFameCDROM.cdr/open/hardware.lzh/HARDWARE.CNF

Text File | 1988-09-20 | 616KB | 15,726 lines

P = pause/unpause, S = abort

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1351  06-15-88  07:41  (Read 145 times)
   from: GARY CORBIN
     to: ALL
subject: NEW COMPUTER

Can anyone help with some advise as to the best deal in a 286 clone?
I would like a 20 or 30 Meg hard drive, and one 1.2 Meg floppy.  Also VGA
graphics.  Any help offered would be appreciated.  Thankyou
Gary Corbin
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1352  06-15-88  18:46  (Read 162 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SEAGATE ST-251  Reply to #1350

Bob, I have never heard of the SUPERPROM.  What's the benefit?

Frankly, when DOS 3.4 comes out and supports drives up to 512MB, I'll be a
happy guy.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1354  06-16-88  06:47  (Read 159 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SEAGATE ST-251  Reply to #1352

JOE,  SUPERPROM is a product from ONTRACT (the Disk Manager people) that
plugs into the PROM sockets on your motherboard.  The info they gave me
when I called ( it is mentioned in one of their doc files with DM ) was it
supports most disk drives out there as "standard IBM" drives in the tables.
Aside from the need for partitioning larger than 32MBs, it does away with
the need for the DM device driv ( they sai  The thing comes in several
different sizes dependent upon the make and model of your machine. Cost
$100 approx.
     What do you think of the Model 70 now that it has been announced?
Still going to try for a purchase?
                                Bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1352 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1360  06-16-88  18:31  (Read 167 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SEAGATE ST-251  Reply to #1354

SUPERPROM sounds interesting.  If I keep my AT (don't think I can bear to
part with it -- it's like an old buddy), I wouldn't mind paying the $100
just to clean things up.

Re: the PS/2 Model 70 -- being a genuine IBM bigot, I love it!  Of the
models available, I would probably opt for the 20mhz box and wait for the
3rd-party market to provide larger disks.  However, that 25mhz baby looks
pretty good, and the 20mhz Model 80, with the price reduction to
approximately the price of a small home, is also attractive.  It's not
"if," it's "when."

On July 1, IBM will announce a "trade-in" policy for XTs and ATs on PS/2s.
The BoCoEx Index as of June 3 on an AT Model 339 is $3,400!  Can you
believe that?  If IBM's trade-in allowance is even close to $3,400 (not
likely, but one can hope) and considering the discount I get on hardware,
the Model 70 would be VERY affordable.  Watch this space!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1352 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1364  06-17-88  06:47  (Read 164 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SEAGATE ST-251  Reply to #1360

     We will eagerly await any developments in the PS/2 #70 market.  Please
post your travails.  You give me some food for thought 'cause I hadn't
heard about the trade-in policy.  Thanks.
     Yeah, the SUPERPROM sounds good.  I need to take this box apart and
discover the correct size PROM so I can try an order.
                            Bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1352 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1353  06-15-88  20:29  (Read 152 times)
   from: SYSOP
     to: GABE CECI (Rcvd)
subject: R: ALTOS CONSULTANT  Reply to #1348

Altos is a nice, solid, high speed Unix system.  It is also very expensive.
If you buy hard disks as part of a standard priced Altos system, you will
be ripped off with per-megabyte prices about 4 times that of a PC network.

The question is, what is the custom software written in, and could it be
easily converted to a PC environment.

Keep something in mind:  You can either buy a new car for $15,000 all in
one chunk, or you can buy a beater and put $20,000 into it in the next 5
years.  In other words, if the old software is 100% transportable to a new
Altos system, it might be reasonable to spend $10,000+ to avoid years of
conversion headaches.

I have been receiving a newsletter from an Altos users group and
distributor.  I will try to dig one up and give it to you.  They have
classified ads with used Altos systems, plus cheap aftermarket hard drives
for Altos, etc.

You might also want to try calling Lodden Technology in Michigan at
313-685-3877.  Ask for John Lodden, and tell him I sent you.  Explain the
situation and I am SURE he will have some interesting opinions on the
situation.  It is worth the long distance call.  He might be able to help
your friend out of the jam.

Here it is:  Computer Support of Sioux City, Ltd.  Phone number
712-277-0095.  They publish the newsletter.  Give them a call and explain
the situation.
bob
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1357  06-16-88  11:28  (Read 148 times)
   from: STEVE SHATTUCK
     to: GABE CECI (Rcvd)
subject: R: ALTOS CONSULTANT  Reply to #1348

Gabe,
     You didn't give the type of altos system, but as long as you know the
controller type, you should be able to expand the disk capacity.  This
could mean replacing the 40meg with a larger one, or the controller may
have a provision for a second drive.  If the response time on the altos (I
assume it is a Xenix 68000 system) is OK, that should do it.
                                          Steve

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1353 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1358  06-16-88  18:11  (Read 145 times)
   from: GABE CECI
     to: SYSOP (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ALTOS CONSULTANT  Reply to #1353

Bob, thanks for the quick reply.  I'll put the people in touch with both
sources and then I'll post whatever results they get.  My only interest in
this is to keep someone who isn't too knowledgeable [even less than I am]
from being ripped off and having a bad taste about computer people.  Gabe.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1353 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1359  06-16-88  18:13  (Read 147 times)
   from: GABE CECI
     to: STEVE SHATTUCK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ALTOS CONSULTANT  Reply to #1357

Thanks, Steve.  That is what I assumed [that disk capacity could be
expanded], but I've been told that it depends on which Altos box they have.
 I'm going to find out and I'll post additional info.
Gabe.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1353 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1355  06-16-88  11:17  (Read 169 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JOHN WERMUTH (Rcvd)
subject: R: PACKARD BELL - DAK  Reply to #1249

Sorry about taking awhile to respond, but I've been overseas for a while.

RE your DAK PackBell system: I have one or two comments.

The logitec mouse is the best mouse i've ever run into. The menuing
software, while it needs a few more features to be really great, is
nonetheless the best in the business right now. Unless you go to the grreat
agony of installing Windows or something like it. In that case, the
Logitec mouse is only slightly better than the others. But still better.
It's just that windows does (with considerably more trouble, expense, disk,
and memory) what Logitec's menu software would.

Unless I miss my guess, that processor has only 4 expansion slots left
free. Better check if the processor has serial and parallel on-board, since
you'll need a serial port for the mouse, you may be left without a  free
Serial port. With out at least 2 serial and 1 parallel, some easy
expansion paths are pretty blocked off.

$1999 sounds a little high, if you are a roll-your-own kind of guy. If
you'd rather open the box, plug it in, and play, that price might be ok.
I'm not up on prcing to really comment.

I've seen a few mail order computers of a similar nature. They do a stunt
with hard disks that make the hard disk performance better than an XT, but
significantly slower than a regular AT. One such popular system used an
8-bit RLL controller, similar to that found in a lot of XTs these days, and
an ST-238R drive. That's a good combination, but an AT-Class machine can do
better.

DAK is not in the computer business. They are in the merchendising
business. You can count on next to zero technical support from them of any
usefull nature.

I'd say you should check into the things I've raised re hard disk acess
time and ports and free slots and then make a decision. Some degree of free
tech support is avalable here, of course. Perhaps you should call packard
bell and see how much is available there. This machine is likely to be a
phase-out, if DAK is selling it.

BTW, hard disk access times of 40ms and lower are normally considered
AT-class. 60-70 or 80ms is the slower PC or XT type of drive.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1367  06-17-88  18:26  (Read 163 times)
   from: JOHN WERMUTH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PACKARD BELL - DAK  Reply to #1355

Tom, that is a really complete answer, and I have captured it to
read off-line.  Very interesting comment..  I will probably  not
use DAK if a similar machine is available thru regular channels..
Thanks again.
John W.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1355 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1356  06-16-88  11:22  (Read 167 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOBBY NATHAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" DRIVE ON XT  Reply to #1295

Sorry to take so long to reply; been overseas for a few weeks.

Absolutely not. The Toshiba 1.44mb drive is a very special animal. The
Toshiba (or anyother) 720k drive cannot write data at a high enough density
to get 1440k on a disk. Get the right hard ware if you need 1.44mb. It also
takes a special controller. The drive and controller in kit form from us is
about $260, or about $300 installed by us. That's if your existing floppy
ontroller can be disabled easily.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1384  06-20-88  01:56  (Read 160 times)
   from: BOBBY NATHAN
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" DRIVE ON XT  Reply to #1356

hat about Western Digital's WD1003 WA2 or NCL's 5425 controllers?
Thanks Bobby

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1356 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1387  06-20-88  11:00  (Read 159 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOBBY NATHAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" DRIVE ON XT  Reply to #1384

Don't understand the question, Bobby. What about those two controllers? I
haven't run into either one.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1356 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1388  06-20-88  17:09  (Read 160 times)
   from: DAVE PINGEL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" DRIVE ON XT  Reply to #1387

I have an NCL controller on my machine and am very pleased with it.   The
setup routine (I have an AT clone) has 360kb, 1.2 meg, 720kb and 1.44 meg.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1356 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1391  06-20-88  21:54  (Read 162 times)
   from: BOBBY NATHAN
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" DRIVE ON XT  Reply to #1387

Sorry, those are the two controllers I use in building my sytems.
The western digital WD1003WA2 I use in AT cases and the NCL
5425 I use in Baby AT cases. Both controllers support dual Floppies
and Dual Hard drives. THey both will support 1.2 meg 5.2{" and 720k 3.5"
drives as long as the CMOS supports their use. Drivparm or Driver.sys
are not required. I was curious if your 1.44 meg drive will work with
those cards. Thanks Bobby

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1356 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1397  06-21-88  10:58  (Read 164 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOBBY NATHAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" DRIVE ON XT  Reply to #1391

Most controllers that support 1.2mb format also support 1.44mb format. Even
if the setup program doesn't support the 1.44mb format, you can still use
such a drive. The drives we sell come with driver software and you may or
may not have to use it. We haven't yet run across a case where a 1.44mb
could not be used.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1356 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1446  06-25-88  22:54  (Read 164 times)
   from: BOBBY NATHAN
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" DRIVE ON XT  Reply to #1397

Are you speaking of Driveparm?
If Drivparm is set to /d:1/t:160/h:2/f:2 then the drive will try to format
160 tracks ...
Bobby

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1356 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1458  06-27-88  18:01  (Read 167 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOBBY NATHAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" DRIVE ON XT  Reply to #1446

I'm sorry-- I forgot the context of our discusion. If we were talking about
using 1.44mb or 720k drives with non 3.3 versions of DOS, then YES drivparm
will work. With the 1.44mb drives and some drives of other types, a driver
will usually be included. That would be used instead of DRIVPARM. (Don't
spell that with an E, DOS won't like it...). I think it was DOS 3.10 that
had something called DRIVER.SYS that did something like what DRIVPARM does.
Or maybe just certain DOS oems used driver.sys, I dunno.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1356 reply #7  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1361  06-16-88  22:25  (Read 150 times)
   from: DAVID NYE
     to: THOMAS ATKINSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ALIGNING FLOPPY DR  Reply to #1347

Thanks for the info.  Will look for the file.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1362  06-16-88  22:30  (Read 154 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: DON RANDALL (Rcvd)
subject: R: TELEPHONE PACKAGE  Reply to #1349

Give a call to 1-800-6-WATSON, and follow through the VIS (Voice
information system) information.  If this is what you are looking for i can
get you one for half price (mine, and unused (a long story))...
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1365  06-17-88  12:43  (Read 148 times)
   from: MARTIN COX
     to: ALL
subject: RLL/ADAPTEC

CAN ANYONE TELL ME A GOOD RLL CONTROLLER TO USE WITH AN ST277R, EXCEPT THE
ADAPTEC. I HAVE THE FORMER AND ITS JUST NOT RELIABLE !!!!!!
ANY HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED.
THANKS.
MARTIN COX.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1366  06-17-88  17:44  (Read 146 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: MARTIN COX (Rcvd)
subject: R: RLL/ADAPTEC  Reply to #1365

What kind of a machine is it for?  sometimes can make a big difference.
What model of the Adaptek are you having problems with?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1365 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1370  06-18-88  03:22  (Read 148 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: MARTIN COX (Rcvd)
subject: R: RLL/ADAPTEC  Reply to #1365

I have used the OMTI RLL since the beginning of March on ST225's and it
works great on those so i would think the 277R should operate nicely with
it.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1365 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1373  06-18-88  06:58  (Read 145 times)
   from: MARTIN COX
     to: JOHN REDFORD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: RLL/ADAPTEC  Reply to #1366

OOP's left reply in SPEEDUP conf. Must be asleep this morning.
Martin.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1365 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1375  06-18-88  18:53  (Read 139 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: MARTIN COX (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: RLL/ADAPTEC  Reply to #1373

thats where my reply is too.  I answere em as i see em, lest i get really
screwed up.  anyway, try another low level format just in case and see what
happens.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1365 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1368  06-17-88  21:50  (Read 143 times)
   from: JOHN UTRIE
     to: ALL
subject: RESET

IS ANYONE FAMILAR WITH A PRODUCT THAT CAN BE HOOKED UP TO AN XT CLONE THAT
WILL PERMIT REBOOTING WITHOUT POWERING DOWN WHEN THE KEYBOARD LOCKS UP?
I HATE HAVING TO DO "COLD BOOTS" WHEN THIS SITUATION OCCURS.

                            THANKS,  J.W.U.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1371  06-18-88  03:24  (Read 147 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: JOHN UTRIE (Rcvd)
subject: R: RESET  Reply to #1368

Scan Mahoney for reset or switch, you could build a reset switch or
probably find one for a few bucks...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1368 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1369  06-18-88  00:04  (Read 147 times)
   from: KAAN BAMAUNG
     to: ALL
subject: MODEM PROBLEMS

I bought a NEC Multisynch II about three weeks ago and since then I have
gotten nothing but problems with my Modem ( strange huh? ). I used to use
a monochorome monitor coupled with a Paradise EGA 480 card and for six
monthss or more without any problems.
    I use a Maxum 2400 internal card. What happens now is this:
 After I installed the NEC monitor the phone lines went dead. All I
could hear was the swishing sound that a modem makes after it has been
turned on. The trouble is I did not even turn the machine on yet! AAfter
fiddling around and calling the phone company I finally got the idea of
unplugging the jack attached to the modem from the phone line. And guess
what, I got back the dialtone. If I plug the modem back on tho, the
dialtone will last for only a few seconds beforthe line goes dead again.
Since then I can use the modem only if I can dial with two to three seconds
after plugging the jack in. At other    s               times I leave it
unplugged.
     Can anyone help me with this problem? Is it the monitor, the modem
the graphics card or some combination of the three ?
    Any hint/help will be appreciated .
                                              Kaan
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1372  06-18-88  03:28  (Read 149 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: KAAN BAMAUNG (Rcvd)
subject: R: MODEM PROBLEMS  Reply to #1369

Put the mono monitor back up and see if the modem works again.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1369 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1376  06-18-88  20:35  (Read 141 times)
   from: KAAN BAMAUNG
     to: THOMAS ATKINSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MODEM PROBLEMS  Reply to #1372

 I did that but no dice. I have a feeling that it might be the modem now.
 I turned on the PC while there were no monitors connected I still got
 the same problem.  What is strange is why I didn't have this problem
before.
 Now I have to unplug the modem from the phone line when it's not being
used and after each time I hang up from a BBS so that I can dial another
BBS or to keep the line free.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1369 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1385  06-20-88  02:08  (Read 145 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: KAAN BAMAUNG (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MODEM PROBLEMS  Reply to #1376

If you have an internal modem and you changed cards for the monitor i would
think that you could have moved the modem card out of alignment when you
were in there.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1369 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1587  07-19-88  20:48  (Read 142 times)
   from: KAAN BAMAUNG
     to: THOMAS ATKINSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MODEM PROBLEMS  Reply to #1385

Sorry for the long delay in replying but I have been away and haven't
been using the modem too often ( for obvious reasons ).  I checked the
alignment of the card and it wasn't misaligned. One message that I
got form another BBS was that the on-off switch in the modem could possibly
be stuck in the open position. After trying to shake it loose by rapping
the modem ( upside down ) I have given up trying.
    Now I'm looking for a new internal card and I would like to know which
 one I should look at. ( my budget is around 320 bucks ). Any suggestions?

               Thanks for your help
                                             Kaan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1369 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1588  07-19-88  22:14  (Read 140 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: KAAN BAMAUNG (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MODEM PROBLEMS  Reply to #1587

If i were to purchase a new modem i suppose i would  desire the Hayes,
Multi Tech, or US robotics brands.  Check out the want ads to see what is
available.  Every one talks about MNP, i have an older MNP modem, level 3
that i never use with MNP on.  I think they have upgraded the level on the
MNP modems about 3 times in two years.  My own belief is that a quality
modem is one that is capable of picking up weak carriers and has the
ability to hold the connection.  You get what you pay for i guess.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1369 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1602  07-22-88  22:19  (Read 145 times)
   from: KAAN BAMAUNG
     to: THOMAS ATKINSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MODEM PROBLEMS  Reply to #1588

  Thanks, I'll give it a look see.

                                                Kaan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1369 reply #6  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1374  06-18-88  10:03  (Read 140 times)
   from: DANIEL DAVIDSON
     to: ALL
subject: IMAGEWRITER II

I have an Apple Imagewriter II I would like to use with my IBM 286 XT.  Is
~>there any other piece of hardware or software that I need other than a
serial or parallel port?  All information about this will be greatly
appapreciated{
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1392  06-20-88  23:25  (Read 143 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DANIEL DAVIDSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: IMAGEWRITER II  Reply to #1374

As I understand it, you will need a serial port, rather than a parallel
port.  But the serial cable may need to have a different connector on the
end that plugs into the printer than a standard serial cable.  Look at the
cable connector on the printer before ordering the cable.

      Nick


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1374 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1377  06-18-88  15:34  (Read 140 times)
   from: JAMES LEVIN
     to: ALL
subject: NORTHGATE 286

     cc: DAVID ZAR

Has anyone had experience with this company and their AT class machine?
Back in March David Zar left a negative review of thier customer service,
has this changed, or are there suporting/conflicting experiences?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1378  06-19-88  15:48  (Read 136 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: ALL
subject: MEMORY REFRESH RATES

Volume 7, number 13, of PC Magazine contains an article, "Instant Speedup
for Your PC," by Brian Roemmele, president of Ariel Computer Corp., the
speed-crazed PC people (in other words, perfectly typical PC users).

The article tells how to reset the memory refresh rate so that memory
refresh happens less frequently.  This minimizes the time spent in doing
memory refresh and frees up more time for REAL work.

I incorporated his logic into a QB 4.0 program I wrote to do the port
writes he specified using a couple of command line arguments for the high
and low bytes which specify the refresh rate.  I found that I began to get
parity errors somewhere around 0,144 (high,low byte) but could run reliably
at 0,128.  I also found that I reached a point of diminishing return
somewhere around 0,96.  For all of the comparisons, I used PC Magazine's
"PCBENCH 4.0" series.

I'm running an 8mhz true-blue IBM PC/AT.  I would be very interested in
hearing about others' experiences on other PCs.

BTW, my parity errors always occurred in add-on memory, most of which I'm
using as a RAM disk (about 2MB worth); some fills out my lower 640K.  The
extra memory is on a Tecmar Maestro board.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1393  06-20-88  23:29  (Read 138 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: MEMORY REFRESH RATES  Reply to #1378

Volume 7, Number 13???!!!   Why is it that I am always so far behind in
getting PC Mags?  Usually it takes a couple weeks for me to get mine after
the utilities show up here on the board.  Now I'm two issues behind.  I'm
definitely calling someone at PC Mag on this one!

           Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1378 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1408  06-21-88  18:52  (Read 147 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MEMORY REFRESH RAT  Reply to #1393

PC Magazine is a bit complacent about delivery to their paying subscribers.
I can always find the latest issue on the stand at B. Dalton well before it
shows up in my mailbox.  Don't feel bad about seeing the utilities show up
on Exec before your magazine arrives.  The utilities are posted on their
BBS about the same time as the magazines are mailed out.  Somebody on Exec
must call their BBS every hour looking for the latest utilities because
there is less than a 24-hour delay after posting on their BBS before
they're posted here.

If you call PC Magazine about late delivery, and they respond to you the
same way they respond to the letters they publish from readers, they'll
have some smart-aleck answer for you.  They've become as arrogant as Lotus
and Ashton-Tate.  Notice how they turned a reader service (their IRS) into
another way to squeeze another dime out of their readership (PC Mag-net)?
I'm disillusioned -- I thought they were different.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1378 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1417  06-21-88  23:41  (Read 148 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MEMORY REFRESH RAT  Reply to #1408

Yeah, I thought that was pretty funny, PC Mag-net, designed to "attract"
more money out of their readership.  Har, Har.  So funny I forgot to laugh!

      Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1378 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1379  06-19-88  17:54  (Read 136 times)
   from: DAVID KRILL
     to: BILL NEWKIRK (Rcvd)
subject: ENHANCE 3194

Bill,

I'm interested in editting the autokey (recording) files on the 3 1/2" disk
for the 3194.  This will allow me to merge recordings and edit recordings
in order to save time and not have to retype the whole recording over
again.  Have you ever worked with editting recordings from the 3194?  And,
do you think that it is feasible to move these .AUT files over to a PC to
edit them?  If yes, what would you suggest I use to edit the files with?
They do not appear to be ASCII.  Also, have you heard anything about the
3194 being specially designed for use at Aetna Life Insurance?  I also
thought I'd like to reprogram the function keys (PF keys on top of
keyboard) with different functions.  Now my company thinks I might bring
the national system down if I try too much experimentation.  What do you
think the chances are of doing something like that by experimenting with
editing recording files to enhance the recording feature of the 3194?  Any
suggestions you can supply would surely be appreciated.  Thanks much!!!
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1380  06-19-88  18:11  (Read 141 times)
   from: DAVID KRILL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: 3.5" DRIVE

Tom,

I read a message or two with your name on re: 3.5" drives.  Let me get this
straight.  Does a person need a special controller card in order to connect
up a 3.5" drive to a PC or PC AT?  If the standard card can be used, can it
still support a 5 1/4" drive too?  Also, can the same 3.5" drive run on
both an AT and PC (XT) with the same controller card?  Thanks for clearing
this up for me.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1386  06-20-88  10:58  (Read 149 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID KRILL (Rcvd)
subject: R: 3.5" DRIVE  Reply to #1380

1. Depends
2. Yes
3. Usually

1. Does a person need a special controller to run 3.5" drives? Your
question is incomplete. There is a very critical difference between the IBM
PS/2 style 3.5" drives, and the 3.5 drives used in a lot of portables
these days.

DRIVE             SPECIAL CONTROLLER?            CAPACITY
========================================================================
3.5" DSDD 720K    No!                            737280 bytes, or 2x that
(E.G. Toshiba)    (need DRIVPARM= in             of 5.25" DSDD IBM drives
                  your CONFIG.SYS, or DOS 3.3

3.5" 1.44m        YES! Need driver & format      1.44 megabytes
                  software, usually included.

The 720k drives run in place of a 5.25" 360k format drive, same controller.
The 1.44mb drives are a pain to install in some machines, because the same
card that does the floppy control also does half a dozen other things too,
like memory, SP, PP, clock, whatever. You have to be able to disable ONLY
the floppy controller, in order to easily install a 1.44mb drive. I've done
it, in a system that used a multifunction floppy (etc) controller card, but
I'm not going to do it again.

2. You can mix 3.5" 720k format drives with 5.25" 360k drives if you setup
your config.sys properly.

3. The drive for the AT and the XT (3.5" drives I mean) are the same. The
controller usually isn't. That's because a lot of AT's support 1.44mb
format directly, via the 1.2mb 5.25" floppy controller. Now 720k format
3.5" drive are anotherstory. If the XT or AT has 5.25" 360k format drives
already, it supports 3.5" 720k drives. Most AT's support 1.2mb, 1.44mb,
720k, and 360k format drives, all directly, without a different controller
card.

Does that answer your questions?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1380 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1437  06-24-88  00:04  (Read 150 times)
   from: DAVID KRILL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" DRIVE  Reply to #1386

Tom,

Thank you very much for your answer on 3.5" drives.  My intention is to put
one in an IBM XT clone.  Hard to believe a different controller card
wouldn't be needed, but then again I would need DRIVPARM or DOD 3.3 in my
CONFIG.SYS file then.  Thanks!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1380 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1381  06-19-88  18:12  (Read 137 times)
   from: DAVID KRILL
     to: BILL NEWKIRK (Rcvd)
subject: 3194 BOOT DOS?

Can the 3194 boot a 3.5" DOS disk?  And, do you know what microprocessor is
in the 3194?  Thanks! (I forgot to ask earier).
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1382  06-18-88  19:31  (Read 136 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: ALL
subject: 3.5 EXTERNAL DRIVE

A little advice would be much appreciated.  It looks like I will have
to break down and buy a 3.5 external drive. ( I call the 3.5 floppys
"stiffys" ).  I have an AT style PC's Limited (Dell) with the
controller and ROM already installed. We need to go external because
the B: slot has the tape backup. Can we cable the DC power out the
back as well as the control and data signals.  Cheapest would be to
buy a box and an internal drive.  Is that possible.  What do I have
to do about EMI problems, (I dont want to see the FCC).  Any suggestions
would be very much appreciated.    Dave Clay
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1383  06-18-88  20:07  (Read 132 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: ALL
subject: PROM BURNER

Looking for advice and information on PROM burners at less than $500.
Any suggestions or experience would be much appreciated.
We need to burn NMOS like Toshiba's TMM27256-15  and similiar types.
Thanks for the help!               Dave Clay
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1389  06-20-88  17:18  (Read 133 times)
   from: PHIL PUCCI
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: PROM BURNER  Reply to #1383


Dave,

Look at the PROM blaster offered by JDR.  It has a card that plugs into
your PC (no external PS required) along with software to select EPROM
family, size, etc.  It is VERY inexpensive and a friend of mine has had
good things to say about it (and JDR).

PdP


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1383 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1390  06-20-88  20:36  (Read 138 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: ALL
subject: SECOND HARD DISK

I have a Seagate ST238 controlled by the infamous Adaptec 2070a.  I would
like to add a second 30 meg drive and have heard good things about the
Miniscribe 3438.  Is this different from the 8438 disk?  Is it possible to
add a second 30 meg drive AND Western Digital controller, copy the contents
of the first(C) adaptec/seagate to the second(D) WD/Miniscribe, then
disconnect the loathsome Adaptec and connect the Seagate to the WD? While
also juggling an orange an apple and a banana?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1394  06-20-88  23:38  (Read 141 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: SECOND HARD DISK  Reply to #1390

I don't know anything about juggling, but if you haven't had any trouble
yet with your Adaptec/Seagate combination, you probably won't now.  But if
you want to change your controller, then you should know that you can't put
two controllers in a computer at once.  But you MAY be able to connect two
hard disks to the Adaptec controller.  The ones I've seen have provisions
for that.  Then you can copy what you want, run a backup and change
controllers.  I've personally never been able to get a WD controller to
talk to either a Seagate drive or a Miniscribe drive, and have not had any
real problems with the Adaptec/Seagate combination, as long as the release
was late enough.

         Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1390 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1406  06-21-88  12:23  (Read 145 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SECOND HARD DISK  Reply to #1394

Did you say you've NEVER goten a WD controller to work with either a
Seagate or Miniscribe drive? You must have greatly offended St. Vidicon of
the Cathode Ray Tube. We use WD controllers all the time and it works just
peachy.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1390 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1410  06-21-88  20:07  (Read 146 times)
   from: GARY BREUCKMAN
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: SECOND HARD DISK  Reply to #1390

I've used both the miniscribe and seagate 30mb disks with the western
digital 27X controller, both work with no problem.
Regarding the miniscribe model numbers,
3438 is a 30MB disk with 85MS average seek time
3438P (or 3438+) is the same disk with a 55MS average seek, get that if
you can.  Miniscribe seems, to me, a bit noisier than the seagate, but
I've heard better things about reliability.  I've also heard that most
of the other miniscribe models, like the 40MB 3650, can be used just fine
with RLL controllers (do so at your own risk, I wouldn't!).
The 8438 is a 3.5-inch hard drive with 68MS avg seek.  The drive is
compatible with the 5.25-in models as far as cables, etc., and comes with
a 5.25 inch frame so you can mount it in a standard slot.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1390 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1413  06-21-88  23:26  (Read 144 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SECOND HARD DISK  Reply to #1406

Yeah, I know, it's strange, but true.  I mean, I haven't tried hundreds or
anything, but one supplier I had switched to WD from Adaptec back when it
seemed that everyone's Adaptec/Seagate was crashing.  I tried THREE
different WD controllers and TWO different ST238s and one 8438, and EACH
time I would get to the end of the format process and get the ugly "Track 0
bad, Format Failure" message.  Client was getting a little upset.  I
swapped in an Adaptec controller, et Voila! no problem!

        I daresay that if your first three experiences with WD controllers
had been like mine, you wouldn't have any installed either.

             Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1390 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1395  06-21-88  06:49  (Read 149 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: MARK SIMMONS (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVES  Reply to #1328

MARK,

       Well the anchor is back, and it is running. If appearances
account for anything the drive looks great. Practical Repair replaced the
logic board, and the stepper motor. Unfortunately it cost $162 total that
includes shipping. It seems as though they did very good work though. The
phone for Peripheral Repair is [phone]. So if you want a guaranteed
fix then Peripheral Repair is the place for the CMI's. Brockway Disk
Technologies is a little less expensive, but they couldn't fix my CMI.
Brockway specializes in the Miniscribe and the Seagate lines.

             Good luck with your drive,
               If you can remember leave me a message on the results,
               Steve Morgan
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1396  06-21-88  09:50  (Read 135 times)
   from: PAT PFAFFL
     to: ALL
subject: KEYBOARD ERROR

I recently purchased an IBM-PC (256K) which apparently had an improper
keyboard connected to it.  I have replaced the keyboard and everything
functions fine, except I get a "AA 301" error on bootup.  The manual says
that a ?? 301 error code indicates a keyboard defect.  The keyboard works
fine, but the error message annoys me.  Is there really a problem I should
be concerned with?  Is there any way (short of replacing the motherboard)
to eliminate the error message?  Any assistance will be apppeciated.
Pat
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1411  06-21-88  21:32  (Read 143 times)
   from: BRIAN KIEHNAU
     to: PAT PFAFFL (Rcvd)
subject: R: KEYBOARD ERROR  Reply to #1396

Pat

I also get that AA301 error on startup, it's because of the new key
board that you are using. Some of the newer keyboards will work with
PC class machines as well as AT class machines but it takes them some
time for the keyboard to set up for the machine that it is pluged in to
resulting in the keybord error.

Brian

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1396 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1430  06-23-88  10:53  (Read 140 times)
   from: PAT PFAFFL
     to: BRIAN KIEHNAU (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: KEYBOARD ERROR  Reply to #1411

Brian,
Thanks for the info.  I was afraid that whoever had used a non-compatable
keyboard on the system prior to me had done some damage to the system.  Now
I can relax knowing it's nothing serious. Thanks again.
Pat

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1396 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1398  06-21-88  11:06  (Read 144 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: TIM NESHAM (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 2 HARD DRIVES  Reply to #1154

I doubt you can wreck your drives by hooking them up wrong. Just to clarify
and expand, if there is a twist in the drive cable, both drives are pinned
to the same drive select, often 1, sometimes 2. If no twist, the first
drive is pinned as drive 1 and the second as drive 2.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1399  06-21-88  11:08  (Read 142 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: PASCAL ROY (Rcvd)
subject: R: ZENITH 181 UPGRADE  Reply to #1155

Zenith Data Systems, 1-312-562-7300, or 616-982-3188 for end-user technical
support. Better yet, find a local dealer.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1450  06-26-88  09:30  (Read 150 times)
   from: PASCAL ROY
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ZENITH 181 UPGRADE  Reply to #1399

Thank you for the info, Tom; I'll contact them.
Pascal

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1399 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1400  06-21-88  11:14  (Read 151 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: CARRA BUSSA
subject: R: KEYBOARDS (GOOD ONES)  Reply to #1157

Well, that loud click that you feel when you bash keys on an IBM is hard to
find. I suggest you get a program call "KEYCLIK" or something like it. It
makes your computer click when you hit keys. Then you can get a keyboard
with the right feel for you and not worry about tactile feedback. I have a
Keytronic KB5151 which I like because of the layout. It has a separate
arrow keypad and a separate numeric pad, great for spreadsheets. But the
keyboard I like even better is the MaxiSwitch ME101 by EECO. It even has a
switch on the bottom that allows you to swap the control and caps lock
keys. And it has a nice feel. Which of course is a matter of taste.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1412  06-21-88  22:05  (Read 150 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: KEYBOARDS (GOOD ON  Reply to #1400

Tom,

Not the dreaded "keyclick", please!!!  I can't stand machine that attempt
to make up for a mushy keyboard with sounds coming from another part of the
room.  A key-snap should be felt, not heard.  Any sound should be through
bone conduction.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1400 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1414  06-21-88  23:32  (Read 150 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: KEYBOARDS (GOOD ON  Reply to #1412

While I agree that it is not as good as feeling the keyclick, hearing it
from across the room is better than nothing at all.  I have a Keytronics
5150jr for (obviously) my jr.  There IS no click in the keyboard, but I'd
be hard pressed to replace the keyboard with anything else.  So I set it to
click from the computer.  Some goofy programs disable the click (the ATERM
program of PCAnywhere, for instance) and it really slows down my typing.

           Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1400 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1420  06-22-88  15:24  (Read 149 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: KEYBOARDS (GOOD ON  Reply to #1412

I LIKE my keyclick program. It lets me know that the computer is still
more-or-less alive.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1400 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1401  06-21-88  11:21  (Read 150 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: RUPERT MURPHY (Rcvd)
subject: R: BOOT FAILURE  Reply to #1161

I think you are remembering a message I left some time ago. There should be
an 8284 or 82284 clock chip near the 8088 or whatever processor the Tandy
uses. Pin 10 or 11 (11 I think) is the reset pin. There is usually a
network connected between +5 vdc, ground, and pin 11. The network is
usually just a resistor and a capacitor. If you turn your box on and it
locks up and fails to boot, take a small screwdriver and short pins 10&11
together for half a second. If it boots, you have trouble with that little
network. If the tandy already has a reset button, use that instead. If you
power-up and it fails to boot, press the reset button. That will boot it if
your only problem is that little reset circuit. Of course, some computers
use a one-shot chip or a counter instead of the little RC network.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1402  06-21-88  11:36  (Read 150 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GARY EIDE (Rcvd)
subject: R: HELP WITH XT  Reply to #1201

Any relation (by marriage maybe?) to Dick Northouse?

My 286 machine crashes out on stack failure messages too. I think its my
EMS memory board or memory resident software. Might look into STACK=
commands in your config.sys file.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1418  06-21-88  23:46  (Read 152 times)
   from: GARY EIDE
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HELP WITH XT  Reply to #1402

No, no relation to Dick Northouse.  (At lease not that I know of.)

Someone, has already suggested that I try a STACKS=24,256 in the CONFIG.SYS
file.  Strangely enough since posting the message I have not had another
"stack" crash,  so have not put that statement in the CONFIG file.   Will
try it when/if I start having the problem again.   Thanks for the info.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1402 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1422  06-22-88  15:35  (Read 149 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GARY EIDE (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HELP WITH XT  Reply to #1418

I tried a similar STACKS= statement to no avail. I then tried STACKS=60,512
also to no avail. I then removed all STACKS= statements from my CONFIG.SYS
file. It still crashes every once and a while.

Dick Northouse had a cousin that ran a large dairy farm in Minnesota. His
name was Gary Eide. No relation huh?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1402 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1426  06-22-88  23:59  (Read 150 times)
   from: GARY EIDE
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HELP WITH XT  Reply to #1422

No, no direct relation that I know of.  The Eide's in my family all come
from the Oseo, WI.  area.  My granfather was a direct immigrant.  He did
run a farm in Oseo for quite some time.

Interesting, that the STACKS statement does not work.  I assume what you
are doing with that statemetn is setting apart memory for the stack.   have
looked in my manual and can find nothing on that statement,  so I am just
guessing as to the purpose.


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1402 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1403  06-21-88  11:42  (Read 151 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: LARRY EDWARDS (Rcvd)
subject: R: MONOCHROME MONITORS  Reply to #1212

Open your monitor up (unplug it first) and look for a screwdriver
adjustable sub-bright or contrast control. MAybe you  can make it brighter.
We ususally can on our samsungs, xtrons, zeniths, etc.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1415  06-21-88  23:36  (Read 153 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MONOCHROME MONITOR  Reply to #1403

Is there ever a screwdriver adjustment for moving the image sideways on the
screen?  I have a new Everex 14 inch monochrome monitor, and in 132 column
mode the 1 character or 2 are cut off the left side.  The only screws that
ARE reachable from the back are focus and sub-brightness.

         Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1403 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1421  06-22-88  15:32  (Read 150 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MONOCHROME MONITOR  Reply to #1415

If your monochrome monitor's screen image is skewed off one edge, try
twiddling the horizontal hold knob. Most monochrome monitors can be
adjusted to move the screen anywhere from 1/16" to nearly 1/2" depending on
the monitor.

But, the better solution is to use the setup program that comes with your
video card. Most such programs have an option to shift the 132 column mode
a few dots left or right, so that it lines up with the 80 column mode and
thus removes the need to tweak the monitor.

Some programs (very few) let you move the 80 col mode until it lines up
with the 132 col mode.

Adjusting the card is better because adjusting the monitor may make it
loose sync when switching modes. Mine did. That was until I set the card up
right.

But yes, I'd think there'd at least be a horizontal width coil on the video
board inside the monitor. You'd need to take the housing off the monitor to
get at it.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1403 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1404  06-21-88  11:53  (Read 152 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GARY SCHULTZ (Rcvd)
subject: R: MITSU  Reply to #1246

Hey you lazy (married) bum, how are you? I'm great, just got back from
France/Germany/Bavaria/Austria. I needed a vacation.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1407  06-21-88  13:02  (Read 154 times)
   from: GARY SCHULTZ
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MITSU  Reply to #1404

  So how was the trip? Did you learn anything?   What does Computerese
sound like in GERMAN?

  @??*Lazy*??!! I been busy.  Between this new hardware and learning new
softwary (DesQview), and marrying off friends in Michigan, and California,
and Eau Claire, and myself, and Where am I ?

<gary>

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1404 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1409  06-21-88  19:39  (Read 152 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MITSU  Reply to #1404

Tom,

I found it interesring that you listed Germany/Bavaria in your list. THEY
seperate them, too! Nice country, tho...

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1404 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1416  06-21-88  23:38  (Read 153 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MITSU  Reply to #1404

Hey, Bavaria?  Did you happen to notice a little town there called Trier?
That's where my family came from in the 1860s.

        Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1404 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1419  06-22-88  15:22  (Read 151 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GARY SCHULTZ (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MITSU  Reply to #1407

Computerese would appear to be the same the world over. My buddy Ingo, who
lives near Stuttgart, speaks the same language as me, even tho his english
isn't real good.

What's desqview good for?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1404 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1423  06-22-88  15:38  (Read 153 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MITSU  Reply to #1416

Sorry, Trier I missed. I missed a lot, having only a few weeks to see it
all. I also missed Oberlooken, where my family is from. That's alleged to
be somewhere in Germany.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1404 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1424  06-22-88  16:39  (Read 161 times)
   from: GARY SCHULTZ
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MITSU  Reply to #1419

     cc: SYSOP
     cc: DAN JUDGE

RE: DesQview

  Well, running on a 386, I use QEMM 4.1 to control all of the extended
ram.  Two interesting things that it can do:first : it uploads slow video
bios into faster (much faster) ram.  Secondly, it sorts Ram by speed (this
of course, I take by faith).

  DesQview then allows me to run several windows at once.  For instance, I
run 123 and my old Revelation dbs. Or, Arev & 123. Or Arev, Rev, and Qmodem
downloading in the background.  Coupled with EGA in 43 line mode, I can see
the download in the background while seeing the full 25x80 Arev screen.

  True multi-tasking, in other words.  I really enjoy the Arev & Rev
sessions 'cause I can see the old system while I design the new.  Even cut
& paste fields.  It has the text c&p, and a built-in macro program sort of
similar in operation to Newkey.  Basically, I have unloaded all of those
nice little TSR's in favor of  TRUE   multitasking. and I am singing
again.   Actually I accidentally  pushed <ctrl-n> and got . Cute.

  Having fun in more ways than one (all at once)...

     __ __ __
 == /_//_//  /_/==
  ___/    ____/


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1404 reply #6  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1405  06-21-88  12:08  (Read 146 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DEAN RUTK (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DRIVES  Reply to #1278

My tables don't even list a Tandon model HH 725A drive. If I knew how many
heads and cylinders it had, I could tell you what other drive its like. Are
you sure that you have the model # right?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1442  06-24-88  22:54  (Read 146 times)
   from: DEAN RUTK
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVES  Reply to #1405

Tom, probably my mistake, I just figured because the drive was shipped back
in a Tandon box that it was a Tandon drive.  Now looking at the drive I see
that it must be a Microscience (does that sound right??) sorry for any
inconvenience that this may have caused ,  see if you can find out anything
about this drive now.   Thanks                        Dean_____________

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1405 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1457  06-27-88  17:57  (Read 147 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DEAN RUTK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVES  Reply to #1442

MicroSci drives are fairly common, unfortunately. They te3nd to fail more
than I'd like. Here's the only table I could find. Is this one of your
drives?

MODEL  HEADS CYL  RWC  WP
HH612  4     306  306  306  10 MEG?
HH725  4     612  612  612  20 MEG?

An HH725 looks somewhat like a Seagate ST-225 and may work in place of it.
That help?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1405 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1476  07-01-88  00:12  (Read 158 times)
   from: DEAN RUTK
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVES  Reply to #1457

Tom,
Yea I think that should do it , really appreciate you taking the time to
help!!   That's what I love about this BBS.  there is always someone out
there who can help when you need it.  Be talking to you again I'm sure.
Thanks again!!                                    Dean_______________

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1405 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1425  06-22-88  19:27  (Read 146 times)
   from: PETER FORMAINI
     to: ALL
subject: CRT DISPLAY PROBLEMS

I am having a problem with the display of lazerdisc-based video on my
CRT.  Anyone familiar with lazerdiscs could be extremely helpful if they
would read message #243 in the INTERACTIVE VIDEO section of the board
and leave me a message relating to this problem.
Many thanks!!
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1429  06-23-88  08:15  (Read 141 times)
   from: BOB STOUT
     to: ALL
subject: HELP WANTED

   Help!!!!! Does anyone have any technical information pertaining to
Tandy's Model 100 Portable Disk Drive or Disk Drive II? I could use any
information including technical docs, source code from a disk manager
program utilizing that drive or ??? please leave a note here if you can
help.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1480  07-01-88  07:26  (Read 154 times)
   from: DAN ROBBINS
     to: BOB STOUT (Rcvd)
subject: R: HELP WANTED  Reply to #1429

Bob,

I'm sorry that I can't help you out with the technical info you want on the
Tandy portable disk drive.  But maybe you could help me!

I have a very complete Tandy 200 (including a disk drive) which I'd like to
sell.  Might you know anyone who'd be interested?

Thanks in advance for your help.

   Dan...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1429 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1495  06-07-88  07:01  (Read 154 times)
   from: BOB STOUT
     to: DAN ROBBINS (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HELP WANTED  Reply to #1480

Dan, what are you looking for your model 200 setup? Would you be interested
in any type of trade for ????

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1429 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1496  06-07-88  07:54  (Read 156 times)
   from: DAN ROBBINS
     to: BOB STOUT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HELP WANTED  Reply to #1495

First, Bob, before I tell you what I want for the Tandy 200 system, let me
tell you what it is.

The memory is fully expanded (3*24K).  There is a plug-in ROM called
"Ultimate ROM II" with greatly enhanced word processing, a database
program, an outline processing program and a program to better utilize the
portable disk drive (I hesitate to call it an operating system!).  Of
course, there is the portable disk drive unit.  I also have the carrying
case, direct-connect & acoustic-connect cables for the 300 bps modem, AC
adapters and all the manuals.

I'd like to get $500 for the lot, but I'd consider a slightly lower offer.

As far as trade goes, I now have a Leading Edge "D" at home; I'd consider
a color monitor for it plus some $$$.

Let me know what you think.

   Dan...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1429 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1431  06-23-88  10:58  (Read 137 times)
   from: PAT PFAFFL
     to: ALL
subject: PARITY 2 ERROR

One of our Compaq 286 machines occasionally locks up while word processing,
giving a "parity check error 2  ?????" message (or something like that).
It seems to lock up upon keyboard input, although that could be
coincidental.  It is loaded with 2MB RAM (I thought that might be important
since most parity check errors are RAM related).  Any help would be
appreciated.
Pat
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1432  06-23-88  17:28  (Read 141 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: PAT PFAFFL (Rcvd)
subject: R: PARITY 2 ERROR  Reply to #1431

Pat, I just finished reading a very interesting article in PC Magazine
Volume 7, Number 13, which discusses adjustment of memory refresh rates.
Although the thrust of the article was decreasing of memory refresh
frequency to achieve an apparent increase in CPU speed, one can also
*increase* memory refresh frequency if parity errors are popping up and
there is not really anything wrong with the memory chips.

Since you have 2MB of RAM and only 64K of RAM is refreshed per memory
refresh cycle, you might be "on the edge" if your RAM chips are 150ns chips
or slower.  Assuming that you don't have any marginal chips, which could
also account for sporadic parity checks, you might read the PC Magazine
article and try increasing the memory refresh frequency; if the problem
disappears, you've got it.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1431 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1433  06-23-88  19:31  (Read 147 times)
   from: PAT PFAFFL
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PARITY 2 ERROR  Reply to #1432

Joe,
Thanks for the input.  I'll look up the article and give it a try.
Pat

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1431 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1435  06-23-88  23:16  (Read 139 times)
   from: BRIAN KIEHNAU
     to: PAT PFAFFL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PARITY 2 ERROR  Reply to #1433

Pat

Yoy might try extending the refresh time to get more frequent
faults and then try changing one bank of ram at a time untill
the fault stops. Do all 9 chips in each bank at a time because it
could be the parity chip as well as 1 of the other 8 which are the
actual memory. Party check2 is menory on a expansion board(s) not
on the system board. A parity check on the system board will give
you a parity check1 error msg.

Brian

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1431 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1528  07-12-88  12:06  (Read 130 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BRIAN KIEHNAU (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PARITY 2 ERROR  Reply to #1435

I don't have access (easily) to the PC magazine you memntion. Can you
describe briefly how to alter refresh rates in PCs? Is this a hardware
solution or does one tweak the programming of certain chips with a little
assembler code? This could be just the thing for certain marginal memory
problems I've run into.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1431 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1537  07-12-88  20:02  (Read 140 times)
   from: BRIAN KIEHNAU
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PARITY 2 ERROR  Reply to #1528

Tom

The Pc magazine that I spoke of was volume 7 number13  July 1988
if any one is interested and wants to find it.

The way pc magazine changes the memory refresh time is with a short
assembly program that resets the value of a register in the 8253 timer.

Here is the program listing without comments.


N QFRESH.COM
A 100
MOV AL,74
OUT 43,AL
MOV AL,LL
OUT 41,AL
MOV AL,HH
OUT 41,AL
INT 20
(blank line)
R CX
E
W
Q

The LL and HH are the values that are used to set the timer register
so they need to be given a value depending on the refresh time disired.
Start with 30h in LL and 00 in HH as you increase LL the amount of time
between refresh will increase up to FF and if you need more time start
increasing  HH from 00 for more time.

Save this listing as a ASCII file with name of qfresh.scr and then
run it through debug like this "DEBUG < QFRESH.SCR and you will get
QFRESH.COM.

You will have to reassemble the program each time you want to change
the values of LL and HH. Also PC mag. did not say what values would give
normal refresh values so you will have to run some bench marks to see
if the values are doing what you want them to do.


Brian

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1431 reply #5  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1436  06-23-88  23:21  (Read 142 times)
   from: JACK SHAW
     to: ALL
subject: DELL

Has anyone out there had, or know anyone who has had any experience with
the DELL Computer out of Texas?  Everything I've read has been positive,
but it seems it may have been written by the DEL people.

The units they have sound too good to be true for the price.  Anyone?????

Thanks,
Jack Shaw
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1440  06-24-88  13:10  (Read 140 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: JACK SHAW (Rcvd)
subject: R: DELL  Reply to #1436

Jack,

      Well, I don't think they are too good to be true for the price, since
you can get PC clones from other suppliers for less.  But the Dell
computers used to be sold under the PCs Ltd label and, after a beginning
that was a LITTLE rocky, have built a reputation for a pretty good computer
for the price.  Especially if you compare the prices to the big names.

        Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1436 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1441  06-24-88  13:25  (Read 139 times)
   from: MARK MONSON
     to: JACK SHAW (Rcvd)
subject: R: DELL  Reply to #1436

I have a computer that was manufactured by Dell..under the PC'S LTD label.
It is a 286 running at 8 MHZ and has served me well for almost 2 years now.
I recently purchased an enhanced keyboard from them, it came with both the
keyboard ROM chip as well as the latest update for the system ROM which
gives support for all the new drives (3.5" and more H.D. types).  The price
was good, and the tech service has been o.k..  I would most certainly buy
from them again if I was in the market for a new machine.  I hope that this
gives you some of the info you need..    Mark...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1436 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1454  06-27-88  12:39  (Read 138 times)
   from: JACK SHAW
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DELL  Reply to #1440

Nick,

Thanks for the input.  I was not aware that they were the old PCs Limited
since I am still reading ads for PCs Limited.

Jack

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1436 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1444  06-25-88  08:12  (Read 134 times)
   from: DALE REID
     to: DAVE PINGEL (Rcvd)
subject: NCL CONTROLLERS

Dave    In message 1423 you were discussing controller cards and said
that you like NCL controllers.  Who are they?  Do you know of any ads
in the popular literature for them? I know OMTI, WD, Adaptac,  but NCL
is a new one for me.  The particular comment that intrigued (sp?) me was
that you mentioned that you had ALL FOUR types of floppy drives connected.
All at one time, or at various points in playing with the hardware did
you have all four types, two at a time, connected?  I very much would
like to have a 360, a 1.2, and a  3 1/2 1.44 all on line at the same time,
yet I don't know of anything except CompataCard's add on that might do it.
Also, I start screwing around with device drivers and that non-standard
stuff with possible incompatabilities that I tend to shy away from.
Also I have heard occassional grumblings about the Infamous Adaptac 2072
card.  Was that one screwy?  Rob Greenberg had played with the 2372 and
I finally located a good price on one and it is the FIRST RLL card that
can drive my Priam V185 to DOS 3.3's theoretical limit on space.  WD's
1003RA2 card looked all the world like a MFM card to all my stuff,
including
Disk Manager from Ontrack.  It took a card with on-board
ROM to get away from the limitations in CMOS type tables not recognizing
RLL type drives to get this to work.  I realize that there must be ssome
sort of kludge in the startup, (something I just said I wasn't too fond of)
but now I have almost three full sized dos partitions to play with.  Also,
if and when dos 3.4 comes out, I'll be able to get almost 15 megs more
on the drive.  Now I get the feeling that maybe Adaptac ISN"T such a
wonderful board supplier.  I should listen to my experience, which haas
been flawless so far, but I also learn a lot from other's experience and
comments on this board and it seems like people don't like Adaptac.
Commentson this?   Dale
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1447  06-25-88  23:23  (Read 137 times)
   from: DAVE PINGEL
     to: DALE REID (Rcvd)
subject: R: NCL CONTROLLERS  Reply to #1444

Who is NCL????  I don't have the slightest idea.  I only know that when I
bought my AT clone I was told it would be coming with an NCL HD/Floppy
controller.  I was told that it worked better than Western Digital at the
12 MHZ speed of the CPU.  I have not been disappointed.

I may have misunderstood one of my comments.  The controller can handle two
floppys and two hard drives.  The floppys can be 360, 1.2, 720 or 1.44.
Any two, not four.

Did I answer all your questions?????

Dave

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1444 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1451  06-26-88  12:04  (Read 142 times)
   from: DALE REID
     to: DAVE PINGEL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NCL CONTROLLERS  Reply to #1447

dave    that's what I thought, only two at a time.  too bad.  thanks anyway
   dale

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1444 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1445  06-25-88  19:34  (Read 139 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: JACK SHAW (Rcvd)
subject: DELL

Jack,  I too have a Dell 286-8 and it has worked well for 2- years.
I suggest that you might like to look at the messages on the Dell
BBS.  That is a good way to see if they are still answering trouble
calls.  The number was 512 338-8528.  If you get a voice recording,
the voice will usually give the new number if it has changed.  before
putting you money on the line, make sure that you are going to get
the Pheonex bios.  I have their own bios and it is ok for DOS and
it it will run the 3.5 inch "stiffys" but will not run OS/2 I am
told. Dell makes the bios upgrade to out of warrentee users for
about $350.  In the first year I got bios upgrades free. My last one
cost about $75. I think Dell is past all those growing pains by now.
                   I hope this helps, good luck
                    Dave Clay

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1456  06-27-88  12:46  (Read 138 times)
   from: JACK SHAW
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: DELL  Reply to #1445

Dave,

Thanks a bunch for the information.  I definitely will give the Dell BBS a
call.  It is good to hear that the product is good.  I now probably will
make it a major consideration when I buy.

Thanks agan,
Jack

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1445 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1448  06-25-88  23:31  (Read 148 times)
   from: DAVE PINGEL
     to: ALL
subject: ATI VGA WONDER

I recently noticed the ad for the new ATI VGA Wonder in PC Magazine.  I
know it isn't being shipped yet, it is expected to ship in July, but does
anyone have an opinion based on the sales pitch???

I think the ad said it could produce VGA on a Multisync monitor.  Is that
possible???  I would be interested in any opinions as to whether this is
really good.

Thanks in advance,
Dave
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1449  06-25-88  23:44  (Read 140 times)
   from: RONALD ZORKO
     to: ALL
subject: IBM-XT

Anyone know what the last update for the BIOS on an IBM-XT was, and where
can I get a replacement?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1453  06-27-88  10:58  (Read 134 times)
   from: ALLAN BECKER
     to: ALL
subject: PRINTERS,DAISY

I WANT TO BUY A DINOSAUR  (No offense IBM, but even yours becomes old)

I can make use of a used IBM 5218 printer. This is a letter quality
daisy wheel printer, useful but clearly outdated by newer technology
in many offices whose word processing department has been using the
original IBM Displaywriter, Displaywrite I thru Displaywrite 4 soft-
ware.  I would prefer to find one in the Milwaukee Metro (if you've
ever carried one of these you know it could cost more to ship than
the used price!!)  One other thing it must work, if it's on it's last
leg, I don't want it.  Costs too much to service.

Please check the word processing folks at your place of employ to see
if any of these DINOS are locked up in closets.
My phone number follows, or respond to my mailbox on this board:

              Allan Becker
              [phone]

Thanks for the help.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1461  06-28-88  10:59  (Read 158 times)
   from: FLIP TROIANO
     to: LARRY EDWARDS
subject: R: R: PC BRAND  Reply to #1265

LzV
Larry,
    We unpacked our pc-brand yesterday. Setup allways takes longer than
expected, but things are going well. The configuration we're using is their
286/12, withthe fast seagate 40mb drive, a necmultinc II monitor
and the Paradise vga Plus card. Everything appears to work properly now.
The case say PC Brand and the mou arrived intact.
               Hope you have betterluck second try.
               If we have any problems I'll let you know.
               How r{sponsive have theyeen to your problems?
FLIP
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1462  06-28-88  13:00  (Read 147 times)
   from: GARY CORBIN
     to: ALL
subject: VENDEX COMPUTER

If anyone has any inside information on the new Vendex 286 model coming out
this fall, please give me your comments.  Also if you have any pricing
infor, please advise.
Thankyou
Gary Corbin
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1463  06-29-88  18:13  (Read 140 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: ALL
subject: 3-SPEED CPU?

The new kaypro processors run at 4.77, 7.??, and 9.45 mhz. Nice. A dip
switch selects whether it boots up at 7 or 9 mhz.

The only way to change speed in actual operation is to press CTRL/ALT/1 or
CTRL/ALT/2 or CTRL/ALT/3. Each selects a different speed of operation.

I would assume that the speed change operation is implemented as an i/o
port, and that the bios watches for those keystrokes and slams the
appropriate data out the apporopriate port.

Can anybody think of a way to figure out what the port and data are for the
different speeds? The goal here is to write a little piece of code to do
the speed switch in a program. Any/all help appreciated.

There is a BIG VLSI chip by Faraday, and the BIOS is a Phoenix custom
design for Kaypro.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1464  06-29-88  18:18  (Read 141 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: PHIL KATZ (Rcvd)
subject: HELP: CPU SPEED?

I have a 3-speed cpu board that switches speed by using hot keys. Trouble
is, I want to write a program to do it. I'd assume that they use an i/o
port to implement the speed change, and that the bios watches the keyboard
for the 3 hot keys and zaps certain bytes out certain ports. Is there any
way to finger out what those ports and bytes are? I have a call into
Phoenix, who would seem to have developed it for Kaypro, and I will
call faraday, who's large VLSI chip appears on the board, but they may not
talk to me. Any ideas?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1466  06-29-88  21:07  (Read 143 times)
   from: PHIL KATZ
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: HELP: CPU SPEED?  Reply to #1464

Tom,

Well, about the best suggestion I would have would be to disassemble
the INT 9 code in the BIOS.  Try and find where the BIOS traps the
hot-keys, and what the BIOS does to change the CPU speed.

>Phil>

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1464 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1492  07-05-88  10:31  (Read 149 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: PHIL KATZ (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HELP: CPU SPEED?  Reply to #1466

I figured out some of it, and then got hold of Faraday Electronics, who
makes the VLSI core logic chip that forms the basis of the processor card.
They gave me enough hints to write my program. The chip is really a neat
piece. You can program operating speed, wait states, all kindsa stuff, just
by slamming bits out i/o ports. I can't seem to read back the speed bits,
however, the other address is supposed to be readonly status
information, but the speed bits don't stick. I decided it didn't matter
and wrote a mini-benchmark program to clock it and set the limits for each
speed by observation. They're supposed to send me a spec sheet and
programming information.

B.T.W. I went to my 10 year Nicolet reunion this weekend. You remember Glen
Shires? I used to hang out with him. Turns out that he designed the Mach 20
accelerator board, as well as the Breakthru 286 board. He worked for Intel
for a couple years and then designed one of the boards by himself and sold
the design to the big boys. He also wrote bunches of Intel databooks.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1464 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1467  06-30-88  01:15  (Read 141 times)
   from: DAVID NYE
     to: ALL
subject: CLOCK

  Does anyone know which port the CMOS clock chip (MM58167A) on a DTK
Multi-I/O board uses?  Or have a clock driver they could upload for such a
board?  I never got one when I got the board and lost the one I'd copied
from a friend when my hard drive crashed.  I've tried all of the ones I
could find here but none works on my machine.  Unfortunately there is no
standardization in the clone world of the clock port.  If your clock driver
is not public domain, perhaps you would consider disassembling it to find
the port address.  Thanks.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1468  06-30-88  03:04  (Read 142 times)
   from: PETER EIBL
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PC FOR SALE  Reply to #1465

Hi Glen, Before I start breaking the system up I wnat to give it some time
as a complete unit...if I get no response in a week or two I will consider
splitting it..Will need $100.00 for the tape drive and 6 tapes. The unit is
1/2 hight and uses the floppy controller as a card, if you have a
controller that can handle 4 floppies you will not have to give up your 2nd
floppy...it's also possible a cable can be made up with 3 connectors but I
have not tried this so it's a shot in the dark
    Pete
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1478  07-01-88  03:27  (Read 151 times)
   from: PETER EIBL
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PC FOR SALE  Reply to #1471

Hi Glen, will let you know..give me about 2 weeks
 Pete

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1468 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1469  06-30-88  11:10  (Read 146 times)
   from: BENTLY TURNER
     to: ALL
subject: UPGRADING NEC EL LAPTOP

Hi all,
  I have a friend with a problem and we are looking for help.
He has a NEC Multispeed EL Laptop Computer with 2 3.5" (720K)
disk drives. He is looking to increase storage capacity using
a harddrive or 1.44Meg Floppy Disk Drive. Questions:

 1) Does anyone know of a source where these items can be added to
    this machine. (NEC, the original vendor, can't do it because
    the built-in power source won't support a HD and no controller
    card exists to add a HD.

 2) If you know of any sources what types of warranty information
    can you give me about these add-ons?

 He would really appreciate any information that you might have.

Thanks,

Bently Turner
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1529  07-12-88  12:15  (Read 130 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BENTLY TURNER (Rcvd)
subject: R: UPGRADING NEC EL LAPT  Reply to #1469

If NEC won't upgrade your 720k stiffy drives to 1440k, then you can't do
it. They require a much faster transfer rate (like 1.2mb 5.25" floppies)
and the existing controller electronics oon the NEC motherboard won't do
it.

As far as a hard disk goes, there are now advertised in Byte and Computer
shopper various 3.5" hard disks that have super-low power requirements. But
you still need a controller. The Multispeed has NO expansion slots, as far
as I know, true? HOW does one add the hard disk controller to such a
machine? Buy a Zenith Z-183...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1469 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1538  07-12-88  23:56  (Read 134 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: UPGRADING NEC EL L  Reply to #1529

Tom,

The NEC's have a FD controller port on the rear panel.  If a unit was
designed for the NEC it could take advantage of this facility.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1469 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1544  07-13-88  10:26  (Read 136 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: UPGRADING NEC EL L  Reply to #1538

Right, the NEC has a FD controller, that brings its i/o pins out to an
external jack, but the man wanted to know if he could put a 1.44 mb floppy
drive on, and that's just not plug'n'play on the 720k style controller. Ya
gotta have a more capable controller. I doubt he can do what he wants
.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1469 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1555  07-14-88  22:51  (Read 141 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: UPGRADING NEC EL L  Reply to #1544

Tom,

Your're right.  I missed the 1.44M requirement.  Best I think you will get
on a NEC is 720K drive.  Hope I didn't miss lead any one.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1469 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1561  07-15-88  20:09  (Read 144 times)
   from: BENTLY TURNER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: UPGRADING NEC EL L  Reply to #1529

Tom,
  Thanks for responding to my hardware question.  I was seeking this info
for a friend of mine who bought the NEC.  Alas, he will kick himself for
not taking into account expansion capabilities....But he is a neophyte in
the PC world.  If he would have considered this all important issue, he
may have went with the Zenith....or a desktop XT or AT.  I will relay
your comments to him.   Question....do you own a Zenith?

   Bently Turner

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1469 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1571  07-18-88  11:19  (Read 140 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BENTLY TURNER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: UPGRADING NEC EL L  Reply to #1561

As I am up to my armpits in computers at work, I do not actually own a PC
of any make. The only computer I own is a circa 1975 DEC LSI 11/02 mini
computer. But we did sell a lot of Zenith equipment, and I like the Z-183.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1469 reply #6  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1470  06-30-88  18:44  (Read 150 times)
   from: BENJAMIN LANKHEET
     to: ALL
subject: FORMATING DRIVE D PROBLE

I have a western dig controller card and am trying to install a new
(actuallyy used) 10 meg Miniscribe as drive D.  It has 611 cyl and 2 heads
and ll of my format software thinks it has 4 heads and won't format it.
I think the problem is on the board and the jumper settings but cannot
figure out how to set them to allow a low level format of my drive D.
Anyone have any help out there?  I am really stuck.  Spent about 8 hours
so far trying to figure it out.    Benjamin Lankheet
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1562  07-16-88  12:42  (Read 145 times)
   from: BENJAMIN LANKHEET
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FORMATING DRIVE D  Reply to #1530

Tom, thanks for the note.  We called WD and got the propper jumper settings
that the contorller needed to find the D drive.  All works well now.
I appreciate your interest.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1470 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1472  06-30-88  20:40  (Read 149 times)
   from: RICHARD AKESON
     to: ALL
subject: WHAT THINK RE: TANDY

A friend of mine is thinking of purchasing 3-5 computers
for his engineering department.  He needs to run AutoCAD
occasionally, and run some database, spreadsheet, and word
processors most of the time.  He is thinking of buying
Tandy 3000 or 4000 models because they are inexpensive and
Tandy will be here to service them, whereas other clone
vendors may not.

I have NO knowledge of the Tandy line.  Any information
that you could provide me re: the reliability of these
machines and how well suited to the above applications
(especially AutoCAD) they are would be greatly appreciated.

Any of you AutoCAD vendors want to do a package deal on 3++
ACAD packages with or without some good clones to run it on?

-RCA-

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1475  06-30-88  23:40  (Read 161 times)
   from: DON RANDALL
     to: ALL
subject: ZEOS 286 & REFRESH CHANG

Well, the ZEOS 286 arrived yesterday.  I tested it and sure enough it was
12Mhz with no wait states on the read but one wait state on the write.
The DRAMS were faster then what the 286 called for and I asked ZEOS about
it and they said that since I selected the 28Ms drive the faster ram was
necessary to avoid wait states from the hard disc.  Nice that they knew
that.  The unit had one lose connector and the keyboard seems wrong in
that the function keys are on top and the ctl-esc-etc keys are different
The total cost was $1,700 with 512K of ram.

I read the same PC Mag article on the refresh rate change.  Sysinfo went
up to 8.2 on my Sperry 286 put then seemed to fall back again.  I can only
surmise that two DMAs work together in refreshing the memory and changing
the timer on one didn't effect the other.  It seemed to take a few seconds
before it caught.

Edit a file and put the following in it without the comments.
Replace the LL with '00' and the HH with '50' to start.


N QFRESH.COM          ;NAME = QFRESH.COM
A 100                 ;Start Assembler
MOV AL,74             ;Select timer #1 for a 16 bit
OUT 43,AL             ; number to count down in binary
MOV AL,LL             ;Insert low byte value
OUT 41,AL
MOV AL,HH             ;Insert the high byte value
OUT 41,AL
INT 20                ;Exit to DOS
                     ;Stop assembler line number (blank line req)
R CX                  ;Call CX register
E                     ;Tell how many bytes to write to disk
W                     ;Write the file
Q                     ;Quit debug and exit (this is last line)


then enter

DEBUG<the above file's name.
QFRESH has now been created.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1477  07-01-88  03:14  (Read 152 times)
   from: CHRIS GOODEY
     to: ALL
subject: QFRESH -PC MAG

Anyone have any experience with the QFRESH utility from PC Magazine?
I tried it with my 10Mhz 1 W/S Everex 1800 AT clone, and got very,
very minor improvement. I used several speed checking routines
(but not the infamous Norton SI, which is not only worthless but
a terrible disservice to the entire industry because it is so misleading,
)  anyway, using PCTOOLS my speed went from a 4.75 to a 4.85 with
a minor QFRESH change, above that no change until finally the machine
just started locking up.
   Is their something different about my hardware, or is this QFRESH
idea just worthless of only for very specific machines?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1482  07-01-88  12:27  (Read 157 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: CHRIS GOODEY (Rcvd)
subject: R: QFRESH -PC MAG  Reply to #1477

Chris,

I tried it on my IBM mod 339 with similar results.  Norton's SI (it was
handy) went from 7.7 to 8.0 and held steady there until I increased the
wait enough to get a parity error.

The speed up was about half what I expected.  I haven't tried it on my old
PC at home yet.  Since it has a PC-Sprint board, I don't know how much room
I have to improve.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1477 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1483  07-01-88  19:41  (Read 154 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: CHRIS GOODEY (Rcvd)
subject: R: QFRESH -PC MAG  Reply to #1477

Chris, rather than use the cumbersome approach to QFRESH used in PC
Magazine, I wrote a quick-and-dirty QB 4.0 program which accepts command
line arguments for the high byte and low byte to set the memory refresh
rate.  This made it easy to experiment with various settings. I'm running
an 8mhz true-blue AT.  I quickly found that any high-byte setting other
than "0" produced a parity error.

Using the PC Magazine "BENCH4" benchmarking series, I played around with
the low-byte setting and learned several things.  First, a low-byte setting
of 26 approximates the value set at bootup (i.e., the performance you could
expect to see if you didn't alter the memory refresh rate at all).  Second,
I didn't see parity errors until I reached a low-byte setting of about 144.
Third, I continued to see performance improvements up to a low-byte setting
of about 112; after that, I saw either no improvement or deterioration.

I finally selected a low-byte setting of 96.  This was a value beyond which
performance improvement was trivial and was comfortably within the
reliability envelope.

Oh, yes, Norton's SI did, indeed, go from 7.7 to 8.0.

I now execute my QFRESH reset in my AUTOEXEC.  Perhaps the improvement
isn't that substantial, but it's absolutely free.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1477 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1484  07-01-88  19:52  (Read 156 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: QFRESH -PC MAG  Reply to #1483

Joe,

Could we interest you in uploading your QB effort? I have been using a file
from Micro Cornucopia of about a year ago. It is here in another form as
"NREFRESH.ARC" as I recall. I got a boost in SI from 3.8 to 4.2 using it
but, as you pointed out, it is a pain to modify the thing. And as you also
said, it is free!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1477 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1487  07-02-88  11:17  (Read 168 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: QFRESH -PC MAG  Reply to #1484

Steve, when I said "quick and dirty," I wasn't kidding.  I'm reluctant to
upload the program without adding some elegance (e.g., checking command
line parameters) and some documentation, but I have no problem with
including it in this message to use at one's own risk, so here 'tis:

DEFINT A-Z
' Get command line parameters and extract low/high byte reset values
CommandLine$ = COMMAND$
BlankPos = INSTR(CommandLine$, " ")
HighByte = VAL(LEFT$(CommandLine$, BlankPos - 1))
LowByte = VAL(RIGHT$(CommandLine$, LEN(CommandLine$) - BlankPos + 1))
' Display extracted values
PRINT "HighByte = "; HighByte
PRINT " LowByte = "; LowByte
' Reset memory refresh rate
OUT 67, 116                           ' Select timer 1 for a 16-bit number
                                      '  and to count down in binary
OUT 65, LowByte                       ' Insert low byte value
OUT 65, HighByte                      ' Insert high byte value
PRINT : PRINT "Memory refresh reset.": PRINT
END

Once you've compiled the program (although it could be made to work as a
BASICA program), you execute it from the DOS command line as:

     QFRESH 0 96

assuming that you've named the program "QFRESH" and want to use "0" and
"96" as your high-byte and low-byte parameters, respectively.  Of course,
you can specify whatever values you want.  Once I finished my tweaking, I
placed the above line in my AUTOEXEC.

Since there is absolutely NO checking of command line parameters, you must
be VERY careful to enter two all-numeric parameters separated by a blank.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1477 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1488  07-02-88  20:32  (Read 160 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: QFRESH -PC MAG  Reply to #1487

Joe,

Thanks, that will simplify things a great deal. I really didn't expect you
to enter it that way, but I sure do appreciate it. Thanks again

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1477 reply #5  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1479  07-01-88  03:46  (Read 154 times)
   from: PETER EIBL
     to: ALL
subject: AT MEMORY CARD

I just recently aquired a 4 meg memeory card forn an AT called a RAMBANK
what I need to find out is the dip switch settings for this card and if it
requires any software..don't know if this is a Extended or expanded memry
card..all the card says is RAMBANK REV2 made in Taiwan any help will be
appreceated
                Pete
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1531  07-12-88  12:27  (Read 132 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: PETER EIBL (Rcvd)
subject: R: AT MEMORY CARD  Reply to #1479

Try calling PMA @ 415-968-5755 and asking for the number for the tech
support people. Tell them you think you may have a #7200 board, or a
MEMO200AT board.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1479 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1540  07-13-88  03:33  (Read 140 times)
   from: PETER EIBL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: AT MEMORY CARD  Reply to #1531

Thanks for the Number Tom, will give it a shot
  Pete

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1479 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1481  07-01-88  07:36  (Read 149 times)
   from: DAN ROBBINS
     to: ALL
subject: HP VECTRA KEYBOARD

We have 5 HP Vectras and would like to look at alternative keyboards.  Can
anyone tell me if the "standard" 101-key units could be adapted to HP's
machine?  My concern is that HP uses such an unusual plug that I suspect
compatibility problems with "generic" key{oards.

Thanks for the help.


   Dan...
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1486  07-02-88  09:26  (Read 153 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: ALL
subject: CUSTOMER ENGINEERING TRK

     Does any one know how to un-mark the Customer Engineering track which
I marked as bad but don't have a program to un-mark it?

  "Curiosity killed the cat" and some day it is going to get me too. While
unassembling a copy of the "Pakistan" virus, I got very tired and may have
executed it.  My next evenings activity was to do my semi-annual low level
format of all hard disks.  While playing with various disk managing program
s,
I marked the "Customer Engineering" tracks on both hard disks as bad. Norto
n
doesn't support FAT editing of the FAT for the CE track.  Where is the FAT
for the CE tack?  Is there a shareware program that will edit the CE  FAT?
Can I read the CE track to see if the bulk (or hulk) of a virus is stored
there?  Does Norton's WIPEDISK also wipe the CE track?  I have the DOS
Technical Reference  and the IBM AT Technical Reference books, but don't
know where to look.  Any help would be much appreciated.
     BTW the "Pakistan" virus works by making a very small modification
to the boot record (which is a .COM file).  The bulk of the mischief is
stored on 3 consecutive sectors which are first marked as "bad".  If
CHKDSK suddenly notes a an additional 1.5k of bad sectors, LOOK OUT!
                                 Thanks,  Dave Clay


---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1532  07-12-88  12:30  (Read 130 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: CUSTOMER ENGINEERING  Reply to #1486

The bad track data is not stored in the FAT as far as I know. Not low-level
anyhow. Try a program called MARK*.* or something-- it has MARK and UNMARK
options.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1486 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1490  07-03-88  04:52  (Read 160 times)
   from: PETER EIBL
     to: DAN MEISSNER
subject: R: AT MEMORY CARD  Reply to #1489

Hi Dan, thanks very much for the info and software..will notify Bob to get
rid of the file....
  Pete
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1491  07-04-88  01:55  (Read 162 times)
   from: RICK PODRAZA
     to: TOM DULLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 386 TESTS  Reply to #497

Tom,
  I've got an old AT style keyboard I'll sell you for $40.  Soap & Water?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1493  07-05-88  23:19  (Read 158 times)
   from: TOM DULLER
     to: RICK PODRAZA (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 386 TESTS  Reply to #1491

Rick,
    Thanks but no thanks. I ended up tearing the whole thing apart and
cleaned it out good. No more problems so far.
                               ==Tom==

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1491 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1498  07-08-88  11:20  (Read 150 times)
   from: RICK PODRAZA
     to: TOM DULLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 386 TESTS  Reply to #1493

Glad to hear it. Good luck.
                      --->Rick<---

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1491 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1494  06-07-88  03:47  (Read 148 times)
   from: PETER EIBL
     to: ALL
subject: PC FOR SALE

                               F O R   S A L E

IBM CLONE....Xt Turbo (8Mhz) 640k No Monitor (see Note)
AT style case..........
1   360K Floppy
1    30 meg hard drive (full Hight RLL)
1    10 meg Irwin Tape Backup
     (internal with 3 tapes $90.00 value)
Clock/Calender/Parrallel/Serial/Game port
Choice of 10 or 12 function key Keyboard (AT STYLE)

$800.00....or offer

note: for an additional $125 will include
Hercules Mono Card and SamSung Monitor (Amber)

CALL..476-6447 after 5:00pm weekdays
after 10:30am Sat. and any time Sundays or leave message here

            Pete Eibl


---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1497  07-08-88  09:10  (Read 144 times)
   from: DON ELLIOTT
     to: ALL
subject: INTEL INBOARD/PC

Has anyone out there successfully integrated an Intel Inboard/PC 386
card into a Leading Edge Model D?  For us cheapskates, or rather those
with kids looking tuition in the face, this looks to be an attractive
speedup choice, but I hate to fly blind.  Any data?
Thanks in advance
Don Elliott
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1499  07-09-88  16:07  (Read 143 times)
   from: CHRISTOPHER OTTO
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: FLAKY CHIP

     cc: CADD PLUS

Hiya Tom....

Sometimes, when my Everex AT clone runs for a while on these really hot
days, my computer will reboot when I don't want it to. It's just as if I
had pressed Ctrl-Alt-Del, and it seems like it happens in response to some
other keystroke.

I know that everyone is going to tell me to go in there with a can of Freon
and start freezing chips to find the bad one(s), but I'd like to know which
would be the most likely offenders...

Thanks,
Chris
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1500  07-09-88  23:41  (Read 144 times)
   from: PHIL KATZ
     to: CHRISTOPHER OTTO (Rcvd)
subject: R: FLAKY CHIP  Reply to #1499

Your Spiritualessness,

Before you go rumaging around in your hardware (hopefully in the
privacy of your own home), have you ruled out software as the
cause of your problem?  Do you have more memory resident programs
than bOB has files??  Have you recently installed any new software
or upgraded any programs?

It's been my experience that most hardware faults will cause
the machine to simply lock up tight.  Rebooting is basically
a software activity, unless the hardware fault is actually
toggling the reset signal on the system board.

>Phil>

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1501  07-10-88  00:13  (Read 141 times)
   from: CHRISTOPHER OTTO
     to: PHIL KATZ (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FLAKY CHIP  Reply to #1500

No, Phil, I haven't changed any of my software. Sometiems, when it's really
bad, it'll reboot several times while trying to complete the POST. Sounds
like hardware to me. Could it be a power supply problem, maybe???

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1502  07-10-88  12:42  (Read 140 times)
   from: JOSEPH NEIBRAND
     to: CHRISTOPHER OTTO (Rcvd)
subject: R: FLAKY CHIP  Reply to #1499

Chris,
    I had a similiar problem with one of my computers. It would decide to
reboot itself whenever it felt like it. The warmer the unit the more often
it would do it. It turned out to be a faulty power supply that would drop a
couple of cycles which is all it needed to reboot. Being that the power
supply is probably the greatest heat producer in the box it would stand to
reason that it would get the hotest. Make sure you are not restricting the
air flow in any way.
    I replaced the power supply in my computer and that took care of the
problem for me. I ran it for six months after that without a single reboot.
                                                  Joe

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1507  07-10-88  23:51  (Read 136 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: CHRISTOPHER OTTO (Rcvd)
subject: R: FLAKY CHIP  Reply to #1499

I agree with Joe Niebrand and your hunch that it probably IS the power
supply.  Similar to Joe's experience, I had a computer that would reboot
spontaneously, whether I was typing a key or not.  The thing that tipped me
off was that when the computer was restarting, like going through POST, the
power supply fan stopped and stayed stopped.  The fan didn't restart until
I manually turned off the big red switch and turned it back on again.  But
I think the PS is the first place to check.

           Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1508  07-11-88  00:14  (Read 138 times)
   from: PHIL KATZ
     to: CHRISTOPHER OTTO (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FLAKY CHIP  Reply to #1501

Chris,

Yes, the power supply is one of the few hardware devices in the
system that controls the "power good/reset" line as a matter
of normal operation.  If the power supply decides that the power
level isn't good, it can reboot the computer for you.

>Phil>

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1512  07-11-88  13:13  (Read 136 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: CHRISTOPHER OTTO (Rcvd)
subject: R: FLAKY CHIP  Reply to #1499

Look for an 8284, sorry, for an AT clone that will be an 82284. But if it
really happens when you push a key, borrow another keyboard and run that
for a week or so. There is an 82xxx chip, or 82xx or 81xxx or something
(real precise, eh?) that does the receiving of keyboard data. I can
t remember what chip that is. Maybe somebody else knows.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1514  07-11-88  17:45  (Read 135 times)
   from: CHRISTOPHER OTTO
     to: PHIL KATZ (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FLAKY CHIP  Reply to #1508

re: "...it can reboot your computer for you."

How very thoughtful of it...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1522  07-11-88  22:27  (Read 134 times)
   from: JOSEPH NEIBRAND
     to: CHRISTOPHER OTTO (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FLAKY CHIP  Reply to #1514

Chris,
    I would like to suggest one thing to do before you opt. for a new power
supply. When my computer started giving me intermitant reboots, I opened it
up AFTER I disconnected it from the power source. Take off the ribbon cable
CAREFULLY that comes from the power supply to one of the boards and clean
all those contact pins with a soft eraser, the type you use to erase a
pencil line. After a thorough cleaning, replace the cable and try it. I was
able to get it to work for several weeks after such a cleaning whereas
before it would reboot almost daily. I limped along like this for several
months till I got tired of all this fooling around and had the power supply
replaced. Good luck!
                                                  Joseph Neibrand

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1524  07-11-88  23:23  (Read 133 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: CHRISTOPHER OTTO (Rcvd)
subject: R: FLAKY CHIP  Reply to #1499

Chris,

I had a Compaq power supply with the systems you describe.  Eventually, I
had it replaced, but for a few years, I inhibited the problem by regularly
vacuuming out the power supply.  Normally, a lot of dust collects around
this area of the machine (because of the fan) and reduces the cooling
ability of various critical parts.

Remember to unplug the machine from the wall before beginning.  Vacuum
cleaners (and vacuum cleaner operators) don't like 120 VAC from
unauthorized sources.

If nothing else, it doesn't cost anything to try.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1533  07-12-88  12:34  (Read 134 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: PHIL KATZ (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FLAKY CHIP  Reply to #1500

Gee, phil, I dunno. It still sounds like it could be hard ware, although
I'm sure a big pile of TSRS could make the guys computer reboot, if one ran
amuck. But don;t you have to load a register and execute a jump or interupt
just right to get a clean reboot? I wonder if he's cold-booting and going
thru a POST or just getting warm boots. He seems to say that he's warm
booting, which sounds a little more like a software problem.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1534  07-12-88  12:38  (Read 134 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: CHRISTOPHER OTTO (Rcvd)
subject: REBOOTS  Reply to #1512

On reflection, phil & Joe are right, there is a "DC ok" line that watches
the powersupply and reboots if it gets weird. Try hanging a meter on the +5
line and watch it under various loads (floppy running, etc. ). Get a good
digital meter. Or just swap the power supply.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1499 reply #11  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1503  07-10-88  15:25  (Read 137 times)
   from: TIMOTHY BOWSER
     to: ALL
subject: COMPAQ PARTS

     Looking for a Compaq or equivalent power supply for a 286 motherboard
that is being used as the basis for a BBS upgrade. Any help in this area,
including a power pinout for the 286 board is appreciated. E-mail either
here or on the Enterprise BBS in Marquette, Mi. [phone]. Thanks
                                                     Tim Bowser
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1504  07-10-88  17:32  (Read 135 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: ALL
subject: ALLCARD / DV

Does anyone have any knowledge of the ALLCARD being sold by Quarterdeck to
regisstered DV users? Am I to understand that it takes control of expansion
memory boards (pre 4.0 EMM, non-hardware 4.0 EMM, etc.) and allows their
use with DV as if the boards were hardware 4.0 or EEMS boards? This all
seems too good to be true, especially for the price! The ads I've seen are
somewhat less than clear on this point. Thanks in advance for any
assistance.

-[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1510  07-11-88  10:02  (Read 135 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: ALLCARD / DV  Reply to #1504

Steve,

The AllCharge Card does what it says.  It's for 286 machines and basically
gives them 386 type memory management.  Another user on this board, Tom
Bruce, has installed one on his AT clone and it makes Desqview run like it
was meant to.   Leave Tom a message if you want more details.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1504 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1517  07-11-88  20:35  (Read 136 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ALLCARD / DV  Reply to #1510

Glen,

Thanks yet again. I'll do that.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1504 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1594  07-20-88  14:57  (Read 146 times)
   from: JAMES LAPOINTE
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ALLCARD / DV  Reply to #1510

What type of performance does the Allcharge card give you when you work
with Desqview?  Are there any compatibility problems that you are aware of?
Would you consider buying another?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1504 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1596  07-20-88  20:26  (Read 147 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: JAMES LAPOINTE (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ALLCARD / DV  Reply to #1594

James,

I don't have an Allcharge card.  Tom Bruce does.  Since I have an oldie
goldie PC, I just run Desqview with EEMS memory (an AST Rampage).  To date
Tom has not mentioned any significant problems with the card.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1504 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1505  07-10-88  20:36  (Read 137 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: ALL
subject: HEAT?

After recently installing a Miniscribe 3675 60 meg hard disk above
my Seagate St238, I began to get problems accessing either drive after
running for about an hour.  If I rebooted, I was suddenly back to the
Wonderful World of the 2 Floppy System with an invalid drive message
when I would try C, D, or E.  I suspect that this may be a heat problem,
with either the 135 watt power supply or the infamous Adaptec 2070A
controller combining with the recent weather.  Would it be possible or
practical to install a second muffin fan externally over the exhaust
port of the power supply?  Can anyone suggest an alternate explanation for
suddenly being unable to access either drive?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1509  07-11-88  06:34  (Read 137 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: HEAT?  Reply to #1505

David,

Two fans should help. There was a discussion on here about that about a
year ago and a few guys reported doing it. But I think your main problem
comes from the fact that the MiniScribe is ON TOP of a 238. Try moving the
floppies to the bottom and BOTH hard drives to the top, next to each other.
That way the heat from one drive, which rises, will not add to the heat
from the drive above it but will be drawn off by the fan/fans. This should
help. Also, if heat is a problem, you might try to re-format the drives
after two hours or so of use, after they get good and warm.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1505 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1516  07-11-88  19:42  (Read 137 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HEAT?  Reply to #1509

Thanks, Steve, but out of four half height drive bays, only two are
open at the front for floppy drives.  The hidden ones have the hard disks.
I don't know why most of the case manufacturers close off those bays;I'd
like to put a 3.5" floppy in one and keep my two 5.25" drives, too.
Also, reformating after the disks heat up probably wouldn't work, because
once they're hot, I usually can't access them at all.  I ran last night
for about 3.5 hours to see when I'd be denied access("invalid drive..."),
and when I finally decided to shut down, I did a three finger salute and
THEN got denied access.  Till then, no problem.  If the external fan
doesn't work(saw some REAL cheap at American Scientific, about 54th&
Layton), I may go to an external drive box with power supply, and then I'll
have room for another floppy, too. Thanks again and wish me luck!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1505 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1518  07-11-88  20:46  (Read 134 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HEAT?  Reply to #1516

David,

Sorry about that, I ass_u_me'd that you had four exposed bays.That's a
mistake I won't make again! I do think that reformatting the drives hot
will work, tho, because I once did it at the suggestion of another user
here for the exact same reason. The heat apparently expands the media or
deforms it in such a manner that it can no longer be read. But if you boot
from floppy and then lo-level, format and fdisk it the drive will (should)
work when hot as well as when cold. I'm not sure if this explaination is
understandable but the results WERE! Anyone care to jump in here? I believe
Arny Kreuger (sp?) recommended it to me about a year ago when three drives
dumped on me within a month due to Seagate's problems.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1505 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1521  07-11-88  22:11  (Read 134 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: HEAT?  Reply to #1505

You could look into one of those Turbo Cool power supplies.  $150 i think
is the price, but they have 2 fans on top and the top of the power supply
is slanted towards the front of the computer to allow greater flow. That
same company also make just an add on fan that straps to the back of the
power supply.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1505 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1539  07-12-88  23:56  (Read 135 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HEAT?  Reply to #1516

Actually, formatting the disk when warm, while there is no reason it
shouldn't work, won't solve all your problems either.  I know someone who
did just that, and now her computer won't boot at all some days, until she
lets it warm up for about half an hour.  Then everything is fine for the
rest of the day.  I keep telling her she should do something about it, but
she considers it not really "broke", so she's not fixing it.

         Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1505 reply #5  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1506  07-10-88  21:53  (Read 131 times)
   from: DANIEL DAVIDSON
     to: ALL
subject: APRICOT F-1

I am looking for any hardware information on an Apricot F-1 computer.  The
one that I have does not have any video to the monitor and I don't have the
schematics on the thing.  The company has since quit making this computer
and nothing is available as far as internal schematics go.  If anyone has a
set of schematics or an address where I might obtain some information
please drop me a line.
                THANX,  Dan
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1511  07-11-88  12:19  (Read 144 times)
   from: DAVID BANOCY
     to: ALL
subject: VEGA VGA CARD

I have a NEC Multisync and a Vega VGA display card. The pinout on the
monitor allows only for a DB-9 connector, however the multisync does have a
switch that can be toggled to change from digital to analog mode (I.E. True
VGA). My problem comes from the fact that my video card has two places in
which a video cable can be connected; the 1st is a DB-9 (Which I am
currently using), but it is only for Hercules, CGA, EGA, and digital VGA.
If I do want to use the Analog aspect of the Vega card I must connect my
video cable to a rather strange connector. The connector is about size of a
DB-9 connector, but has 3 rows of 5 pins. I have tried calling various
people about obtaining a cable, but everyone that I have spoken to needs a
pinout of the cable crossing from the 15 pin connector to the nine. I do
know that it is possible to use this card with my monitor, since the manual
that came with the card specifically mentions the NEC Multisync. One last
thing, from what I have heard so far the 15 pin connector may be the same
one that is used on the new PS/2 line, but I'm not sure of that.
Does ANYONE have any idea, or any suggestions on what I can do to obtain,
or even make this cable ???

Thanks

David Banocy
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1513  07-11-88  17:35  (Read 150 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: DAVID BANOCY (Rcvd)
subject: R: VEGA VGA CARD  Reply to #1511

Check with NEC.  the multisyncII has the same cable, BUT NEC supplies a
9-15 pin adaptor with each monitor, so you can take advantage of either the
Analog or TTL type video adaptors.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1511 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1523  07-11-88  22:33  (Read 141 times)
   from: JOSEPH NEIBRAND
     to: DAVID BANOCY (Rcvd)
subject: R: VEGA VGA CARD  Reply to #1511

David,
    I am running a NEC Multisync Plus on my Vega VGA and the monitor came
with both cables. I would suggest you check with a dealer as they should be
able to supply you with one.
                                             Joseph Neibrand

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1511 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1543  07-13-88  09:49  (Read 147 times)
   from: DAVID BANOCY
     to: JOSEPH NEIBRAND (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: VEGA VGA CARD  Reply to #1523

I will contact NEC today about obtaining the cable that I need to do the
conversion from 9 -> 15 pins. Thanks for your help.
David Banocy

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1511 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1515  07-11-88  18:47  (Read 134 times)
   from: LEONARD BEWERSDORF
     to: ALL
subject: MONITOR HOOKUP

I have an XT clone with a CGA card connected via a 9 pin connector to the
RGB port of a Sears TV/MONITOR. I'd like to connect the PC to the color TV
to get additional colors for Flight Simul. etc. but am not sure what I
need.
The TV/MONITOR has a three way toggle, TV,video, and RGB and two RCA female
plugs for the video input and the standard cable and  reg. TV connectors.
Any idea what I need and/or where to get it?  Thanks..
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1520  07-11-88  21:28  (Read 139 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: LEONARD BEWERSDORF (Rcvd)
subject: R: MONITOR HOOKUP  Reply to #1515

Leonard,

Get an RCA type patch cord.  The same one that you use for your stereo.
Connect it from the RCA plug on the CGA card to the video input on the tv.
Leave the RGB cable in place.  You can now switch between RGB mode and
composite video mode.  Flight simulator will show better scenes in video
mode, while text programs will look better in RGB mode.  You might have to
spend $1.79 for the cable.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1515 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1526  07-12-88  01:49  (Read 134 times)
   from: LEONARD BEWERSDORF
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MONITOR HOOKUP  Reply to #1520

Glen - the CGA card doesn't have an RCA jack. It's got a 9 pin and a
printer interface. I had an old 9 pin male from a kaput joystick and a male
RCA jack with wiring and tried each and/or all the individual wires from
the 9 pin with the RCA jack plugged into the video RCA female. I got a
black and white, somewhat distorted picture with one configuration but not
much else. I wonder if there might me a cable with a 9 pin connector and an
RCA jack? If I knew more about what I was doing, I suppose I could try and
make a direct wiring connection to the CGA card....but...any further
suggestions now that I've given you more complete info about the CGA?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1515 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1535  07-12-88  18:10  (Read 137 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: LEONARD BEWERSDORF (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MONITOR HOOKUP  Reply to #1526

Leonard,

Oh boy, you've got one of the clone CGA cards like the Hercules.  If you
have any doumentation, see if it mentions any way to get composite video
off the card.  It's a little tough to map the RGB to composite video in a
connector.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1515 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1536  07-12-88  18:44  (Read 136 times)
   from: LEONARD BEWERSDORF
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MONITOR HOOKUP  Reply to #1535

I have a booklet written in Taiwanese English. I'll take a look and see
if it refers to composite video...thanks again.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1515 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1519  07-11-88  20:50  (Read 132 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM BRUCE (Rcvd)
subject: ALL CHARGE CARD

Tom,

You were recommended to me, so here goes. I have read all of the ads AND
the thread here regarding the subject card. Conspicuously absent was any
mention of an XT or clone. Does this card only work on an AT class machine?
If so, is there anything which will do the same deed for an XT class
machine?

Thanks in advance...
 -[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1563  07-16-88  12:46  (Read 140 times)
   from: TOM BRUCE
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: ALL CHARGE CARD  Reply to #1519

Steve,

Yep, the All ChargeCard is for ATs and compatibles only.  However, I know
that All Computers also makes a card for PCs and XTs.  I believe that it
gives you many of the same functions as the ChargeCard; but I am not
certain of its exact capabilities since I through out the marketing
literature from them some time ago.  Suggest calling All Computers, Inc.
at [phone].

P. S.  The ChargeCard will run on PS/2 and XT-286 machines.

Regards,

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1519 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1566  07-16-88  20:24  (Read 145 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM BRUCE (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ALL CHARGE CARD  Reply to #1563

Tom,

Thanks for the reply. Actually, I found the answer to my first question in
the fine print at the bottom of the ad when I read it again. Sorry! But I
am glad to hear that they may have a card that will function in an XT
machine. Thanks for the number also, will call them on Monday.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1519 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1527  07-12-88  11:59  (Read 126 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: ALL
subject: KEYBOARD

I took my keytronics 5151 off my machine and put a different "enhanced"
101-key type on it. Surprise, surprise, some of the keys don't work!
Certain keys beep twice (press and release) and may or maynot transmit the
keystroke expected.

The keys that don't work are the special ones. Example, the new kbd has
separate arrow and numeric keypads. The numeric pad works fine, the
separate arrows do not. The new kbd has 2 CTRL keys, and 2 ALT keys. The
second of each don't work on my computer. It has F11 and F12 keys, normally
ignored, on my computer they scream at me. It has other keys that don't
conform to the scancode standards (I guess) and therefore (apparently)
don't work right.

The keyboard has a switch labeled AT on one side and PC/XT on the other. I
don't remember which way it worked, but in one position it was totally
stone dead, and the other way it worked as above.

Any ideas? Keep my KB5151? Punt?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1541  07-13-88  04:24  (Read 139 times)
   from: ROB GREENBERG
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: MYLEX?

Tom,

I was just reading through past messages in this conference and ran across
a message from you talking about various replacement motherboards.  In this
message, you mentioned negative aspects of the Mylex motherboard.

You mentioned that it was impossible to toggle the speed (16 mhz vs 6 mhz)
through software.  You also mentioned that the board only had 1 32 bit
slot, not compatible with an Intel 32 bit slot.

I know there are more than 1 model of the Mylex motherboard shipping.  The
most common one, (the one Steve Gibson talked about in Infoworld) has no 32
bit slots and the speed can be switched easily through
software (by pressing <CTRL> <ALT> <-> to slow down, <CTRL> <ALT> <+> to
speed up).

Mylex says that there is no standardization for 32 bit slots, and the only
boardthat really benefits from a 32 bit path is memory boards.  Since their
cache has about a 90% hit rate, the 32 bit slot wouldn't make *that* much
difference.

By the way, if I added a resistor to my speaker circuit, would that quiet
it down?  Right now I've wired an on-off switch to the speaker circuit for
quiet operation, but would really like my speaker quieter.  Cardboard
didn't muffle the speaker enough.

Can I simply wire a resistor into the on-off switch?  If so, what resistor?

Rob
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1542  07-13-88  06:13  (Read 133 times)
   from: BRIAN KIEHNAU
     to: ROB GREENBERG (Rcvd)
subject: R: MYLEX?  Reply to #1541

Rob

Try a 100ohm pot or a 50ohm pot and then set it for the volume you like.

Brian

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1541 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1545  07-13-88  10:33  (Read 132 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: ROB GREENBERG (Rcvd)
subject: R: MYLEX?  Reply to #1541

The data I uploaded about motherboards was posted quite a while ago. I
posted it for the interesting fact that a major computer manufactor was
having discussions over motherboard choice, and we mere mortals are not
usually privy to such.

If you want, you could take your switch out completely and replace it with
a 100 ohm potentiometer. ("pot"). A value that small will be hard to come
by, I know radio shack only goes down to 10k or so, but they used to have
trimmer pots designed to mount on edge on a pc board. Those can be had in
smaller values. The smaller the better, but below 20 ohms (impossible to
get anyhow) you won;t be able to make it quiet enough. Solder one end lead
to the center lead, and then to the speaker lead from the computer. Connect
the remaining end lead to the speaker. Using a fixed resistor would be an
incredible amount of trial-and-error, mostly error. Unless you happend to
have a lot of small value resistors laying around.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1541 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1548  07-13-88  19:55  (Read 135 times)
   from: ROB GREENBERG
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MYLEX?  Reply to #1545

     cc: BRIAN KIEHNAU

Thanks, Tom, Brian.

I'll give it a shot.

Rob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1541 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1546  07-13-88  19:40  (Read 128 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: ALL
subject: SURGE PROTECTORS

I'm new to using Surge protectors, could someone please tell me which of
the following ways is the best way of assuring maximum protection of
equipment and briefly why.
  1) Leave Surge Protector always on and only turn off equipment.
  2) Turn off both equipment and Surge Protector when not in use.
  3) Leave equipment turned on and turn off by switch on Surge Protector.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1577  07-19-88  16:06  (Read 129 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BRIAN KIEHNAU (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SURGE PROTECTORS  Reply to #1550

We just picked up a new line of surge supression equipment that's more
economical to sell. They range in price from $36 to $50 and the better ones
have EMI/RFI filtering, and modem protection jacks as well. Some have nice
little remote power switches. We sell several units for under $25. At thise
prices, playing the odds isn't very smart anymore.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1546 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1581  07-19-88  19:37  (Read 130 times)
   from: BRIAN KIEHNAU
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SURGE PROTECTORS  Reply to #1577

Tom

I still feel that people that sell that stuff feed on peoples fears
and not there actual needs for protection. This is my personnal opinion
from my experience working with Industrial Electronics and all the noise
spikes and dips that is common place in a factory setting.

Brian

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1546 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1547  07-13-88  19:49  (Read 131 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: ALL
subject: NEW HARD DISK

Well, I've been fighting the space problem on my Seagate ST225 too long now
and have decided to upgrade it.  One of the drives I'm considering is a
Microscience 3650, a 40 MB unit.  PC Source/Compu-Add has it for $375  but
for $40 more they have an RLL controller that boosts the space to 60 MB.
Not a bad deal for $40.  When I called, they said the controller was a
Western Digital but I didn't know that WD made any RLL controllers.  Anyone
have any comments on the combination?  Is the 3650 ok for RLL?  Am I better
off sticking with MFM?  A lot of people sell the MS drive for about the
same price but I haven't seen anyone selling it with an RLL controller.

Any help towards this decision will be greatly appreciated.

glen
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1551  07-13-88  22:16  (Read 136 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1547

  To the best of my knowledge the 3650 is a 40 MB 61 M.S. drive.  The
Miniscribe 3675 is 65 Meg 61 M.S.  The 3675 is RLL certified and 65 Meg is
with RLL coding.  You can get the 3675 mail order for about $350.  You may
also want to consider the Seagate 277R.  The Seagate is 65 Meg 40 M.S.
using RLL coding (it is RLL certified) and you can get it for as low as
$409.  I'm using the Seagate on a 12 MHZ AT Clone with the Adaptec 1:1
controller with the Drive formatted at a 1 to 1 interleave, and I have no
problems at all.  By the way I pulled CORE27 off the Mahony section (it
measures Hard Drive Access times) and it says the data is being transferred
at 752 KB/Second.              Harold Woodward

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1556  07-14-88  22:55  (Read 135 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1554

I just installed a Miniscribe 3675 above my Seagate ST238 and am running
them off the notorious Adaptec 2070A RLL controller and so far the only
problem has been excessive heat.  I used the software that came with the
drive to make two 31 meg partitions.  WD makes a half card RLL called
the 27X.  I've been helping a friend upgrade a PC and we're putting in
a 27X and Miniscribe 8438 drive.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1557  07-14-88  22:58  (Read 137 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1556

David,

Thanks for the info.  I've been a little hesitant about RLL since some
people reported problems with the first controllers and drives.  But by now
I figured that all the bugs would have been worked out.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1564  07-16-88  14:34  (Read 136 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1554

  Just looking through the August issue of Computer Shopper, Quick
Electronics has an add on page 387 for the 277R for $379 this will be about
the lowest you will get.  As far as an RLL Controller card for a PC they
generally run about $50 To $100 in the Shopper I'd more or less just pick a
place with a large add.  I didn't like the partitioning software it came
with (ontrack) fortunately I had a controller card and a version of DOS
(3.3) that supports making "logical drives" on a hard drive.  With DOS I
made 2 drives C: and D: both taking up 32 Meg.  The Reason I didn't like
Ontrack was how it made the "split", it came up with three options some
thing like this:
  1) 1 Meg/64 Meg
  2) 32 Meg/20 Meg
  3) 40 Meg
Lastly, when you order the controller make shure you specify you want to
use a 65 Meg Hard Drive With it.  There are some Controllers that Have Size
Restrictions.  If your not familiar with Low Level Formatting a Hard Drive
it is implemented using Debug, at the prompt type G=C800:5 and follow the
prompts.  Good Luck
--------------------------------------------Harold Woodward

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1573  07-18-88  22:49  (Read 133 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: HAROLD WOODWARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1572

Actually, what I think he's asking is what is the smallest file possible on
your hard disk.  That is, do a DIR on some directory.  Write down the
number of bytes free.  Then do a COPY CON TEST.FIL on one line, then type a
"1" or some other single character, hit F6 (and see a ^Z appear on screen)
and return.  Then do a DIR again and subtract to find the difference.  That
will be your cluster size.  For instance, if you have 8K clusters, even a 1
byte file will take up 8K (8192 bytes).

        Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1578  07-19-88  16:09  (Read 130 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1547

I personally don't like uSci drives. I've had troubles with them. Just for
comparison, our shop will install a WD RLL controller with a Seagate
ST-238R drive (30mb formatted) for $360, including formatting, tetsting,
and loading DOS and utilities.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1582  07-19-88  19:56  (Read 131 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1578

Tom,

Based on my and other's experience with Seagate, I decided on the Seagate
277R.  With controller it was $460.  Now the only problem will be backing
up all that space.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1598  07-22-88  00:19  (Read 140 times)
   from: BENTLY TURNER
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1547

Like you I have a Seagate ST-225.  I can relate to using up 20MB real easy.
In an effor to upgrade, I 've looked at trading my Seagate for a 30/40 MB
unit.  You mentioned going with MFM or RLL encoding for Controller Cards.
What are pro's / con's of each... I know RLL can squeeze more storage onto
a drive (i.e. 30Mb on 20Mb unit)... How much can RLL squeeze on a 40Mb
unit?

I also have been looking into purchasing a HARDCARD. I see prices are some
what competitive, easier installation (I have open slots on P.C. and not
enough room in XT for additional half-height unit without giving up 1 of
my 2 floppies....which I wish to keep.

Bently Turner

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1610  07-23-88  23:23  (Read 141 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: BENTLY TURNER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1598

RLL can squeeze 50% more onto any hard disk with which it works.  But the
drive has to be rated properly before it will work.  So, for instance, the
ST277R is a 60 meg drive which is just like an ST251 40 meg, rated for RLL.
But normally you pay more for the higher rating.

        Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1626  07-25-88  11:53  (Read 137 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: BENTLY TURNER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1598

Bently,

From everything I've heard here, one must make sure that a drive is
certified for RLL before attempting to use it as such.  If you don't, There
are grave problems ahead.

Seagate makes this easy by suffixing an 'R' to the drive identifier to
indicate that is is RLL certified.  The ST-238 is not while the ST-238R is.
The drive I'm getting is a ST-277R.  It's a 40 MB drive that formats out to
60+ MB.  That should be plenty of space.  System unit space is not a
problem since I plan on selling my ST-225 and freeing up its slot and drive
bay.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1627  07-25-88  12:03  (Read 135 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1626

It's a little hard to tell if a ST-238 is RLL rated or not. New ST-238R
drives ARE rated for RLL, New ST-238 are NOT, but older ST-238s might be.
Seagate changed the way it marks some drives and for a while ST-238's were
not marked with an R but were RLL rated and worked well.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1634  07-25-88  18:23  (Read 131 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1627

I think all the st238's are RLL rated.  They have always been advertised as
30mb drives and the only way you are going to get 615 cyls and 4 heads to
30mb is with RLL format.  With MFM they format out to 20mb just like the
st225.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1637  07-25-88  21:08  (Read 133 times)
   from: BENTLY TURNER
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1626

Thanks for the clarifying the distinguishing identifiers foregate Hard
Disks (....R - rating for RLL compatiblity).  I've shopped around and am
considering adding another Seagate ST-225 (20MB) to my existing ST-225.
Thus I'll get a total of 40 MB.  The place I bought mriginal hard disk
is giving me a good price on a second unit if I buy from them.  They priced
the ST-238~QlwvMEO7$oR and the ST-277 but they wanted a little more than I
was willing to pay.

Bently Turner

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1648  07-26-88  16:53  (Read 131 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JOHN REDFORD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1634

I'm not so sure. I think there were ST-238's that were not reliable for
RLL, tho there were not nearly as bad as trying to format ST-225's under
RLL encoding. I think they thought the plated media was good enough, but it
wasn't in some cases.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #14

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1652  07-26-88  21:33  (Read 135 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: BENTLY TURNER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1637

Bently,

I considered adding another ST-225 to my system but decided against it for
a few reasons.  The cost of another ST-225 was about $230.  I can sell my
old disk and controller for $175.  A new 40MB with RLL controller is about
$400.  That makes it a few dollars cheaper to get a complete new disk.
With the 60MB going for just over $400, It's like 20 MB free.

My existing ST-225 is a bit noisy so I'm hoping for a quieter drive.  The
ST-277R is a 39msec access drive which should give the system a slight
boost in speed.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #15

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1655  07-26-88  22:26  (Read 130 times)
   from: BENTLY TURNER
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1652

Glen,
  Looks like sound reasoning to me.... Go For It!!!!!

Bently Turner

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #16

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1673  07-27-88  22:16  (Read 132 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1626

  Just thought I'd mention something about that 277R.  I have an AT Clone
with the Adaptec Controller.  I've had a 277R installed for about a month.
I have had no problem whatsoever.  I have it formatted at a 1:1 interleave
and it really screams (752KB/SEC at 12 MHZ).  I'm shure you'll be pleased
with the drive.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #17

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1970  08-22-88  06:02  (Read 124 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1578

READERS,
    I'm NOT TRYING TO STARRT A WAR. There is already one on other boards,
but the Seagate drives especially their half height RLL's have been known
to have problems. I could NEVER recommend a ST-238 and Adaptec when for $30
or $40 more I could purchase the Miniscribe 8438. For those of you who have
fast computers the 8438 F (40 MS. drive) can be purchased for a little
more. The major problem with many of the Seagate half heights is they over
rate their stepper chips and eventually they die. This is a very common
problem with the ST-251, ST-238, ST-225. I was told this by a Techie at a
Hard drive repair shop.  My suggestion is be safe and DON'T buy Seagate.

                                         Steve Morgan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #18

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1974  08-22-88  12:33  (Read 124 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: STEVE MORGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1970

Steve, I would never tell you not to express an opinion, but we have been
thru this and more or less arrived at the consensus that Seagate's eralier
problems with the ST-238R have been fixed. We ourselves got stung by a few,
but we now sell little else, and they don't come back for service. Any
other opinions, people?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #19

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1979  08-22-88  22:19  (Read 123 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1974

Well gee, I sure hope Steve Morgan is mistaken about the 251s anyway.  I'm
responsible for the placement of dozens of those suckers around the area
and if they all go bad I'm in deep ____!  And it makes you wonder how
Seagate can advertise now suddenly that the ST225s are now field proven to
give 30,000 hours MTBF.  Why would they suddenly now start advertising that
unless they just had a few top that mark without failure.  Of course they
can say whatever the heck they want in their advertising, but you'd think
we would have seen something more in the trade press.  Maybe it's like
marijuana leading to heavier drugs.  About 99% of heroin users say they
started with pot, but that doesn't tell squat about what percent of pot
smokers went on to heavier stuff.  In the same way, a disk repairman saying
that all Seagates come in with dead stepper chips doesn't mean that a lot
of drives have bad stepper chips, just that the drives that do go fail in
that way.

       Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #20

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1980  08-22-88  23:47  (Read 123 times)
   from: DAVE PINGEL
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1979

I am surprised that anyone would make such far ranging statements regarding
the reliability of Seagate drives, the most price competative drives on the
market, and recommend Miniscribe.

My office is right next to the PC room at work,  You should have heard the
nois the Miniscribe made as it crashed.  Based on my experience, I would
recommend that no one ever buy a Miniscribe (Snicker).

Dave

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #21

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1981  08-22-88  23:48  (Read 122 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: STEVE MORGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1970

Steve,

What do you mean by "overrate their stepper chips"?

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #22

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1985  08-23-88  06:44  (Read 121 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1974

Tom,
     The main reason I barked about the Seagate half heights is because of
their return policies. I know of a sysop here in Longmont that purchased 10
ST-238's and all of them went bad. Seagate refused to refund his money and
they are presently fighting it out in court in Boulder. I also have run
into a problem with the ST-238's running O.K. for three or four months and
just crapping out. I just couldn't just sit here passivly and read about
all of the Seagate recommendations without putting in my two cents. My
personal experience with Seagate is just average. It took Seagate 3 tries
before they send me a good warranty return from Florida. Once they returned
a ST-225 stating there was nothing wrong with it. I sent it to
Brockway and I was told the stepper chip was bad, they replaced it and it
is running with no problems today. To sum it up in my opinion Seagate is
NOT the top of the line. If those buying hard drives would spend $10 - $30
more they can purchase the Miniscribe drive, preferably the 8000 series.
Which I consider to be superior & 8425 & 8238 are 3 1/2" drives.  The drive
that made Miniscribe the 40 meg full height tanks are slowly being phased l
out by the new 1/2 heights. Miniscribe claims their new 1/2 height 40 meg.
has a service life of 40,000 hours. That rates with CDC and CORE.

                                    Steve Morgan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #23

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1986  08-23-88  06:51  (Read 123 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1981

Mark,

      According to Paul at Brockway Disk Technologies Seagate used one
basic microprocessor to control the stepper functions while most other
drive manufacturers use two one for input one for output. Cronically the
half height Seagate die of the stepper chip dieing before any other symtom.
The bearings are aircraft quality beaings and rarely go bad unless the
drive aborbs alot of shock. You can tell a Seagate half height is near
death by if it sounds as though something is rapping inside the drive when
it starts up.

                           Steve Morgan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #24

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1987  08-23-88  07:15  (Read 122 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: DAVE PINGEL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1980

Nick,

     One man's heaven is another's hell. I'm sorry to hear of your
Miniscribe crashing. Was it less than a year old? Did you know if it was
that Miniscribe would replace the drive no questions asked? All you need is
a RMA #. They have been really good to me and Seagate acts as though they
couldn't care less. As far as the ST-251's go I have seen one fail in
maybe twenty, but I thing the guy using it was trying to RLL the drive.
Seagate incorporating an autopark feature sure is an improvement. The
ST-251's seem to be alright so far. I hope Seagate is using their new
stepper chips on them.
                        Steve Morgan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #25

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1990  08-23-88  19:31  (Read 122 times)
   from: DAVE PINGEL
     to: STEVE MORGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1987

All the people I know who have recently purchased hard drives have
purchased Seagate 251's.  Mine is over a year old... works great has good
speed.  None of the people I know have ever had a failure.  I am a real
Seagate fan.  But then I like PCTOOLS too. (snicker snicker)
Dave

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #26

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1997  08-24-88  06:12  (Read 119 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: DAVE PINGEL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1990

DAVE,

       Yeah I like PC Tools too their rebuild facility is great. For those
of you interested in reading more on the Seagate drives please call the
Sparta board 1-201-729-7056 and participate in the hard drive confrence.
One  other thing I liked about the Miniscribe products is they test their
MFM drives on the Perstore controller and provide support to those who do
try a Perstore on a Miniscribe MFM drive.

                       Steve MOrgan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #27

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2003  08-24-88  14:56  (Read 128 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1979

Agreed. Ever see a book called _101 ways to lie with statistics_? MTBF
figures are pretty useless, as a rule. MIPS really stands for "Meaningless
Information for Purposes of Sales hype".

And I too have placed a lot of Seagates around town. The best deals I've
able to get for my customers have often, nay usually, Seagates. I do
business with one of Seagate's original "super-VAR's" and they do good by
me.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #28

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2006  08-24-88  19:59  (Read 131 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #2003

Tom,

Any idea where a guy can get that book? I read it years ago (actually 'HOW
TO LIE WITH STATISTICS') and I would love to have a copy for my own. After
all those years I get a little rusty on some of the tricks. Really a very
interesting book, tho. Used widely by the print and broadcast media today,
I'm sure.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #29

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2026  08-26-88  16:49  (Read 126 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #2006

Walden's can order anything in print. I tried to get an old John
Christopher trilogy (The Tripods Trilogy) for a long time before having
them order it. They looked it up on a micro-fishie and had it for me in 10
days.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #30

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2029  08-26-88  23:51  (Read 126 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #2026

Thanks, Tom. I'll give Waldens a try. I'm in there at least once a week
anyway.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #31

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2057  08-29-88  14:16  (Read 120 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #2029

If you read science fiction/fantasy/fact, check into the otherworlds club
at Waldens. Free to join, and 10% off on s/f purchases over $5. I think.
I just bough a book called "Who Censored Roger Rabbit?" that seems to be
the original source for the movie "Who Framed...". Havent read it yet.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #32

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2069  08-29-88  20:25  (Read 123 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #2057

Tom,

Thanks for the tip. I'll check on that one also. Sounds interesting!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #33

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2122  09-04-88  04:14  (Read 120 times)
   from: JIM DUNNIGAN
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEW HARD DISK  Reply to #1979

I wondered about those Seagate 30,000 mtbf ads also. I suspect they
are being a little cute. The figure was probably derived from estimates
of current HD use versus repair rates. The 30,000 hour figure could
vary quite a lot depending on what the use figure was. However, they
may have called a sample of users and gotten hours of use estimates
from users. Whatever the case, the 30,000 hour figure probably isn't
too out of whack with reality.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1547 reply #34  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1549  07-13-88  20:48  (Read 135 times)
   from: BILL PREW
     to: ALL
subject: COURIER HST MODEMS

  Can anyone who knows where I can get Courier HST modems at low prices
leave me a message with the name, address, number and price info.  I'd like
to purchase a couple, but don't want to pay more than I have to.

Thanks,
  Bill
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1553  07-14-88  19:45  (Read 138 times)
   from: BOB BELL
     to: ALL
subject: ORC TECHNOLOGIES

I'm considering  purchasing an IBM AT clone from a Mass. company called
ORC Technologies.  They offer:  6/10 mhz; .5 meg; 101 kyboard; Toshiba
1.2 meg floppy; parallel/serial/game port; EGA + Samsung 14" monitor;
60 meg Seagate w/controller; full 3 yr. warranty; for $1988.  I can't
find a better deal, but I'm weary of getting what I pay for (very little)!
I would appreciate hearing about anyone's experiences with the company,
good or bad.  Thank you.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1565  07-16-88  14:51  (Read 140 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: BOB BELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: ORC TECHNOLOGIES  Reply to #1553

  In general it seems like a reasonable deal.  However be advised I have a
Toshiba 1.2 Meg floppy and when I format at 1.2 Meg non-Toshiba 1.2 Meg
drives can not read it.  I've been told tha this is a common problem with
the 1.2's, however in another machine I have a Mitsubischi that seems to do
fine reading other drives except the Toshiba.  As far as other features,
does it have a "click" keyboard, what's the interleave on the Hard Drive.
I know of two other Computers in this Price area you may want to consider.
They are from Zeos International and Northgate Computer Systems you can
check them out in any recent issue of Computer Shopper.  A friend of mine
has the Northgate and I have the Zeos.  In general they will run about 500$
more but I suspect these companies have been around a lot longer, take a
close look at the support on their warrantees.  Also be advised that If you
got the $1988 from a magazine it is probably about $200 more now.
Magazine adds are generally made up at least 3 or 4 months ahead of time so
it takes awhile for a price hike to catch up with them.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1553 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1558  07-15-88  02:32  (Read 136 times)
   from: ROB GREENBERG
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: LESS SOUND

Tom, I looked at the local Radio Shack for a 100 ohm potentiometer, but
couldn't find one.  I bought a 500 ohm pot, a 33, 68, and 100 ohm
resistors.

The 500 ohm pot was too large (I figured it probably would be when I bought
it).  I tried the resistors and the 33 ohm resistor worked perfectly.  It
neatly cuts in half the sound from my speaker.

Thanks again,

Rob
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1559  07-15-88  11:04  (Read 135 times)
   from: GEORGE KOFMAN
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: ESDI HD

Tom,

I am thinking of getting an Everex Step 386/20 with a Micropolis 1355 ESDI
Hard Drive and WD 1005 ESDI controller.
Since you are the in-house (or in-exec-pc) hardware expert, I wanted to get
your opinion of this combination. This system will be used to run SCO
Xenix/386.

Let me know what you think.
George M. Kofman.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1560  07-15-88  12:27  (Read 137 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GEORGE KOFMAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: ESDI HD  Reply to #1559

Being the conference leader doesn't make me an expert on anything. And in
mathematics an X is an unknown quantity, and in plumbing a spurt is a drip
under pressure, so an expert is really just some unknown drip under
pressure. I'm not the conference leader for my ability, just my
availability. Ask Bob, he knows.

Anyhow, the Everex box you mention is quite often mentioned in connection
with SCO Xenix 386, the two are supposed to be a good match.

You really have to need all that speed real bad to spend all that money. Do
you? If you really gotta have the performance of a 386 box that is that
quick, then that machine has a reputation for one of the better
price/performance ratios in the business. That's this week, of course.
Tomorrow, somebody will market a 80486 based box that runs at 26.77 mHz, no
wait states, 32 mb of RAM, 320mb of 6ms hard disk, and costs $1k.

What I'm saying is that all I know about the box is that it's supposed to
be a heck of a lot of bang for your buck.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1559 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1567  07-17-88  15:33  (Read 140 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: ST-277R

  Also, check out Computer Products Corp page 140 August Shopper $459 kit
Drive, Controller, Cables, Software and Instructions.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1568  07-17-88  21:39  (Read 139 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: ALL
subject: AST XFORMER

Does anyone have any info on this motherboard? To be specific, does it
enable you to define ALL memory as EEMS like their computers alledgedly do?
Any idea on a price? I have seen a picture of it(!) and that is about all.
Any first hand experience would sure help. Thanks...

-[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1570  07-18-88  07:48  (Read 138 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: ALL
subject: COMPAQ HD'S

I'm thinking about getting a new Compaq 386S.  Would like to add a second
HD to the system.  Can the Conner HD that Comapq uses be purchased from
other sources besides authorized dealers.  I'm thinking about a 40 or 110
meg 3 1/2 HD (ESDI capable).  Any ideas??  Thanks, AL --
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1579  07-19-88  17:12  (Read 132 times)
   from: PHIL PUCCI
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: COMPAQ HD'S  Reply to #1570


Al,

I have only seen ads for the Conner HD, but, for what it's worth, Compaq
owns a big chunk of Conner Peripherals.

PdP


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1570 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1584  07-19-88  20:41  (Read 134 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: PHIL PUCCI (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COMPAQ HD'S  Reply to #1579

     cc: AL HANSEN

Phil & Al,

I was talking to some Compaq reps today and they said that the Conner disks
are now appearing in a number of clones.  They figured that if they were
gonig to lose the system sale, they might as well get something from the
components.  They didn'tmention where the drives were available.

Got to see the 386/25 today, a super fast machine.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1570 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1585  07-19-88  20:43  (Read 133 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: PHIL PUCCI (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COMPAQ HD'S  Reply to #1579

Phil,
    Where did you see the Conner ads ?  Thanks for your reply.  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1570 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1586  07-19-88  20:47  (Read 135 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COMPAQ HD'S  Reply to #1584

glen
    This must be the NEW EXEC-PC ON-LINE chat mode!  It would be great if
you could find out a couple names for me.  Compaq dealers closely guard all
of their trade secrets, must have something to do with a margin.
.
    I'd like something that idles along at 25 mhz, but it's too much for my
personal funds, so I'm looking at the 386S instead.  The 386 for the rest
of us!  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1570 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1589  07-19-88  22:38  (Read 138 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COMPAQ HD'S  Reply to #1586

Al,

Got to try the 386s for a little while.  Since it was at the dealers, I
didn't have all my test routines to see how well it does.  It felt like a
zippy 286/12.  The big advantage willbe the 386 architecture in a
reasonable priced box.  I think we will stop buying 286s in favor of the
386s.

Did learn one interesting thing about the Compaq keyboards.  They are all
interchangable.  The Compaq III and 386 can be unplugged and a real desktop
keyboard put in place.  The 386s has a new keyboard with a much better
feel.  A lot more tactile feel.  It still has the keyclick that can be
turned off with Ctrl-Alt-Minus.  Now to figure out how to get one.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1570 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1590  07-20-88  07:29  (Read 139 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COMPAQ HD'S  Reply to #1589

glen,
    I haven't had an opportunity to actually get my hands on a 386s, they
are hard to come by in this area.  I'm working with a local dealer, who
says he can get one in two or three weeks, sure would like to try it out
first.  I've read three reviews on it, two (PC Mag/PC Week) sound very
positive.  I didn't get much from the PC World article, maybe thats why I'm
letting that one lapse into non-renewal.  Let me know if you get one.  AL

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1570 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1591  07-20-88  08:29  (Read 141 times)
   from: PHIL PUCCI
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COMPAQ HD'S  Reply to #1585


Al,

Mini-Micro Systems.  It is a journal oriented to systems integrators.
Very impressive ad!  I clipped it for a friend when they announced their
IPO.

PdP


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1570 reply #7  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1574  07-18-88  22:58  (Read 133 times)
   from: RICK PODRAZA
     to: ALL
subject: TANDY 1000 MODEMS

Perhaps someone knows.......
I'm considering 2400 internal modems for an IBM XT now being used by one
of my clients.  Now here's the dumn question.  They also have a Tandy 1000
If we were to decide later to use the Tandy instead of the IBM, would the
internal modem work (even fit?) in the Tandy.
                   ----->Rick<-----
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1575  07-19-88  11:52  (Read 134 times)
   from: PETER OZOLINS
     to: RICK PODRAZA (Rcvd)
subject: R: TANDY 1000 MODEMS  Reply to #1574

Rick,
  I own a Tandy 1000 and use an external US Robotics Courier 2400 baud
modem.  I think that any half slot internal modem would work.  If I was you
I'd just get an external, since the T-1000 only has 3 expansion slots.

Talk later,
Pete

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1574 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1576  07-19-88  14:08  (Read 132 times)
   from: DON BOYLAN
     to: ALL
subject: COMPAQ PARTITION

OUR COMPANY JUST PURCHASED A COMPAQ 386/25 WITH A 110 MB HD PARTITIONED TO
ONE LOGICAL DRIVE. I WAS WONDERING IF THIS WAS THE MOST EFFICIENT (FASTEST)
PARTITION POSSIBLE? ALSO, WOULD THE COMPAQ VIDEO CARD FIT IN ANY PC OR IS
OPTIMIZED FOR THE 386? BY THE WAY IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THE VGA ON THE COMPAQ
25MHz,  SIMPLY INCREADIBLE. THANKS.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1580  07-19-88  17:15  (Read 132 times)
   from: PHIL PUCCI
     to: DON BOYLAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: COMPAQ PARTITION  Reply to #1576


Don "UPPER CASE" Boylan,

The Compaq VGA card will .NOT. work in ANY PC.  It is a 16-bit card which
requires a 16-bit bus (AT-style) found on 286 and 386-based PC's.

PdP


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1576 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1583  07-19-88  20:34  (Read 131 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: PHIL PUCCI (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COMPAQ PARTITION  Reply to #1580

PdP,

The Compaq VGA should work in all PC's since it can be set for 8 bit mode.
I haven't actually tried it yet so I can't guarantee it.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1576 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1592  07-20-88  09:19  (Read 144 times)
   from: CHUCK CONNOR
     to: ALL
subject: PARADISE AUTO EGA AND OS

My name is chuck connor.  I have been trying unsuccessfully to boot/load
OS/2 IBM's version on an IBM AT with a Paradise AutoSwitch EGA card the
operating system seems to load up to the point of displaying some messages
that are in color on the monitor at which point the monitor goes blank
the initial messages from OS/2 the copyright etc. are displayed fine but
after the operating system has loaded or so it seems the screen goes blank
and only a warm boot will allow you to continue.
                    HELP   HELP       HELP      HELP
Is the paradise autoswitch EGA compatible with OS/2.  !!!!!!!!!!!
My voice line is [phone] (w)
My voice line is [phone] (h) after 8:00 pm EST
           Thanks in advance for your help
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1595  07-20-88  16:03  (Read 144 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: CHUCK CONNOR (Rcvd)
subject: R: PARADISE AUTO EGA AND  Reply to #1592

Chuck,
    As you suspect the Paradise card may be the culprit.  EGA cards MUST
have register levecompatibility with the IBM EGA card in order to function
properly with IBM OS/2.  You do have the IBM version of OS/2, right?
AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1592 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1662  07-27-88  07:49  (Read 125 times)
   from: CHUCK CONNOR
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PARADISE AUTO EGA  Reply to #1595

Al thanks for the reply I talked to the Paradise people and they told
me that I would have to disable the autoswitch feature on the board
they told me that I needed to turn switches 2+3 on and everything
else off.  unless their switch is marked wrong or I read it wrong
this didn't work.  I reversed all of the switch positions and now its
workining fine with OS/2.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1592 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1664  07-27-88  14:54  (Read 122 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: CHUCK CONNOR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PARADISE AUTO EGA  Reply to #1662

Chuck,
    How do you like being a beta test site for OS/2 ??  Glad Paradise was
able to help, at least now we know their board works on OS/2 1.0 ...
You may want to check into the program in the Mahoney collection for a nice
os/2 app. LOGICOMM.ARC.   AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1592 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1593  07-20-88  12:58  (Read 149 times)
   from: RICHARD SEASTRAND
     to: ALL
subject: MONITOR/VGA HOOK UP

 I OWN A 'MAGAVOX MULTIODE' MONITOR AND WISH TO BUY A VGA GRAPHICS CARD TO
DRIVE IT. BUT LOOKING THROUGH LITERATURE AND REVIEWS ON VARIOUS BOARDS I
SEE THAT MOST ARE EQUIPPED WITH A 9-PIN DIGITAL OUTPUT AND A 15-PIN ANALOG
OUTPUT. MY MONITOR HAS A 9-PIN INPUT AND AN ANALOG/DIGITAL SWITCH. I WAS
WONDERING IF I CAN RUN VGA USING THIS MONITOR AND IF SO 1) HOW WOULD I HOOK
IT UP AND 2) WOULD I HAVE TO SWITCH THE MONITOR TO ANALOG WHEN RUNNING VGA
AND TO DIGITAL WHEN RUNNING EGA, CGA, ETC.  ALL COMMENTS WELCOME.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1597  07-20-88  21:03  (Read 154 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: RICHARD SEASTRAND (Rcvd)
subject: R: MONITOR/VGA HOOK UP  Reply to #1593

Richard,

First, if you turn off the damned caps-lock, you'll get a lot more replies
to your questions.

The VGA card outputs analog signals on a 15 pin connector.  The EGA uses a
digital 9 pin connector.  Your monitor can accept either signal, depending
how the switch is set.  The VGA card will always output analog signals,
even when emulating EGA or CGA modes.  You may need a different cable,
Maganovox may make one or you might have to build one yourself.  The manual
should list the pinouts for it.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1593 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1599  07-22-88  00:34  (Read 134 times)
   from: BENTLY TURNER
     to: ALL
subject: HARDCARD

I am looking to add a hard disk card to my XT compatible.... I have read
several PC Magazine Reviews on hardcards.  I was wondering if any of you
are currently using hard disk cards.  If so, I'd like your opinions of
them.  I will be using the hard disk card as Drive 2 ... I already have a
20 MB Seagate ST-225 installed in my machine. Will I have any compatibility
problems between hard disk card and hard disk drive?  How about reliability
especially if hard disk card uses RLL technology?

Any replies will be greatly appreciated.

Bently Turner
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1628  07-25-88  12:12  (Read 132 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BENTLY TURNER (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARDCARD  Reply to #1599

I'm not real keen on drivecards, and if you have an existing drive, it
would be quite difficult to add a drive card. You'd have two controllers,
and that's hard to do.

We can add a drive to your existing controller, if you have space to mount
it. A 20mb drive is $323 if you install yourself, but that's with a
controller. I haven't got a price w/o controller at my fingertips.

For $400 (installed) we can put a 30 RLL controller in, with a ST-238R
drive. You'd get 32 meg of space and faster performance.

You don't have a drivecard type drive now, do you?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1599 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1638  07-25-88  21:19  (Read 132 times)
   from: BENTLY TURNER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARDCARD  Reply to #1628

Tom,
  I currently don't have a hard card installed in my unit, but I do have a
Seagate ST-225.  It may be possible to install a second half height drive
in my box above my existing hard drive.  I know I could remove a floppy
and place the second drive in its place.  However I would like to keep my
original floppy drives.
  You mentioned that "you" could install a second unit in my computer.  Who
are "you"....A local store? If so which one and where are you located?  How
much would an install of the following Cost:

  1) A 20MB hard drive as a 2nd Drive in My existing configuration?

  2) Would the $400 30MB Drive be installed as a 2nd Drive or as a replace
     ment?  I really don't want to spend $400 for an addition 10MB.  Is it
     possible for an ST-238 to coexist with an ST-225?

  I'll be waiting to hear from you as I am looking to add on within the
next few weeks.


Bently Turner

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1599 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1649  07-26-88  17:02  (Read 131 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BENTLY TURNER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARDCARD  Reply to #1638

Depends a little on your DOS version. Some versions don't support the
second drive directly, and we have to do a little messing around. That
costs more. If you have room to mount another hard disk, your second ST-225
will cost you $315 installed and tested. Open your machine up and see if
you might perhaps have some hidden equipment bays next to the ones your
floppy drives are in. You could put a hard disk there.

Putting ST-238's on the same controller with a 225 doesn't work unless both
are formatted to 21mb which implies an MFM controller which is a waste of a
ST-238.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1599 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1654  07-26-88  22:24  (Read 127 times)
   from: BENTLY TURNER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARDCARD  Reply to #1649

Tom,
  I am currently running MS-DOS 3.2 and I have my ST-225 installed in the
bay next to my floppy disks.  The bay appears to be large enough to add a
second hard drive. I currently have a Commodore PC 10-2 (640k , 2 360k
floppy disk drives, XT compatible) and the drive bay is extremely large.
The first drive went in like a champ, although adding a second drive looks
like it may be a little cramped...(But I may have an untrained eye). The
2 floppy bays are accessible from the front of my machine.  The hard drive
is located inside my chasis and is not accessible from the front of my
unit.  I think it would be a breeze to install a half-height unit in one of
my existing floppy bays, but I would really like to keep both my floppies.
In addition, I may upgrade one of them to either 3.5 inch or High-Density
5 1/4 floppy.  Thus, the second drive must be mounted internally above
my existing hard drive.....Question is it good for 2 hard disk units to
physically rest upon one another....Are there problems with heat build-up?

Bently Turner

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1599 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1666  07-27-88  16:56  (Read 122 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BENTLY TURNER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARDCARD  Reply to #1654

You won't upgrade one of your floppies to a 5.25" high denisty drive-- it
isn't possible with the existing controller. But the second HD should be o
sorry, no problem at all.

It won't rest on the other- it's have mounting screws of its own. And heat
build-up it not supposed to be a problem, but I've never worked on a
Commondore PC before. That's why the install cost is not fixed, but is
likely to float between $50 and $75. It depends on what we have to do to
get it to go.

Call (voice) 414-964-6330 if you want to set up a time to do the work.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1599 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1669  07-27-88  19:55  (Read 123 times)
   from: BENTLY TURNER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARDCARD  Reply to #1666

Tom,
  You've been real helpful in helping me assess the addition of a 2nd hard
drive.  You' mentioned several factors related to cost.  Can you give me an
itemized breakdown of what you would charge to install this unit.  You say
that install cost ranges between $50 - $75 (What does that include). Also
factor in controller and hard disk unit cost.  I'd like the worst and best
possible scenarios as close as you can get, if that's possible.

  Bently Turner

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1599 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1723  08-01-88  11:03  (Read 125 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BENTLY TURNER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARDCARD  Reply to #1669

$270 FOR THE DRIVE, $50 TO INSTALL, FORMAT, TEST, AND LOAD YOUR DOS, AS
WELL AS A LARGE SELECTION OF THE BEST PROGRAMS FROM THIS BOARD. FOR A
SECOND DRIVE WE DON'T INSTALL DOS. UNLESS YOU WANT. THE INSTALL COST CANNOT
BE PINNED DOWN BECAUSE I'VE NEVER BEEN INSIDE THE EXACT MACHINE YOU OWN.
ITS LIKE ANYTHING ELSE, WE HAVE TO PAY A TECHNICIAN BY THE HOUR, EVEN THO
HIS SUPERVISOR (ME) IS ON SALARY. YOU PAY FOR WHAT IT TAKES TO DO THE JOB.
I COULD CHARGE A FLAT $100, BUT WHY NOT GIVE YOU A BREAK IF WE DON'T SPEND
2 HOURS ON THE JOB? I CAN'T SEE IT TAKING MOR THAN 1.5 HOURS, AND IF IT
DOES, WE'LL EAT IT. OR GIVE UP AND NOT DO THE INSTALL.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1599 reply #7  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1600  07-22-88  18:58  (Read 138 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: WELCOME!

Congratulations on your upgraded PC.  I'll call as soon as I get offline.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1601  07-22-88  21:25  (Read 146 times)
   from: HOWARD RUBINSTEIN
     to: ALL
subject: DELL SYSTEM 310

Well, my new PC limited 368-20 mghz machine has finally arrived (after 3
months) and I thought that I would upload some performance tests on it.
The
three tests were performed using 4.77, 8.0, and 20 mghz speeds
respectively.
The machine is performing very nicely so far.  The only complain other than
the backorder situation is that even though the machine does come with 1
meg
of ram onboard, only 640K is accessable.  The other 384K is used for BIOS
routines.  So if you need a ramdisk, you must immediately purchase
additional
ram.  The tech department is getting all kinds of heat about this since
Dell
makes a big deal out of putting 1 meg in the machine.  Other than that, it
is
a very well built machine both in and out.  If anyone has any questions
about
it, please just leave me a note.





                                   4.77 mghz

IMMMMMMMMMMKMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMKMMMMMMMMM
MM;
: fDESIGNS :         IBM COMPATIBLE PERFORMANCE ANALYZER         : (C)
1986 :
HMMMMMMMMMMJMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMJMMMMMMMMM
MM<
                    Copyright (C) 1986 Richard B. Johnson


      Checking memory block write   ticks: 333 compared to IBM/PC 151%
      Checking register to memory   ticks: 360 compared to IBM/PC 136%
      Checking memory to register   ticks: 360 compared to IBM/PC 136%
      Checking register to register ticks: 357 compared to IBM/PC 154%
      Checking divide by register   ticks: 79 compared to IBM/PC 648%
      Checking divide by memory     ticks: 176 compared to IBM/PC 343%
      Checking multiply by register ticks: 93 compared to IBM/PC 517%
      Checking multiply by memory   ticks: 116 compared to IBM/PC 480%
      Checking stack operations     ticks: 412 compared to IBM/PC 108%
      Checking far jumps, far calls ticks: 499 compared to IBM/PC 104%

   Total time is: 2785 clock ticks, (154 seconds) compared to IBM/PC 185%



                                    8 mghz
IMMMMMMMMMMKMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMKMMMMMMMMM
MM;
: fDESIGNS :         IBM COMPATIBLE PERFORMANCE ANALYZER         : (C)
1986 :
HMMMMMMMMMMJMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMJMMMMMMMMM
MM<
                    Copyright (C) 1986 Richard B. Johnson


      Checking memory block write   ticks: 165 compared to IBM/PC 306%
      Checking register to memory   ticks: 179 compared to IBM/PC 274%
      Checking memory to register   ticks: 179 compared to IBM/PC 273%
      Checking register to register ticks: 179 compared to IBM/PC 307%
      Checking divide by register   ticks: 39 compared to IBM/PC 1312%
      Checking divide by memory     ticks: 89 compared to IBM/PC 678%
      Checking multiply by register ticks: 46 compared to IBM/PC 1045%
      Checking multiply by memory   ticks: 58 compared to IBM/PC 960%
      Checking stack operations     ticks: 226 compared to IBM/PC 196%
      Checking far jumps, far calls ticks: 251 compared to IBM/PC 206%

   Total time is: 1411 clock ticks, (78 seconds) compared to IBM/PC 365%



                                    20 mghz
IMMMMMMMMMMKMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMKMMMMMMMMM
MM;
: fDESIGNS :         IBM COMPATIBLE PERFORMANCE ANALYZER         : (C)
1986 :
HMMMMMMMMMMJMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMJMMMMMMMMM
MM<
                    Copyright (C) 1986 Richard B. Johnson


      Checking memory block write   ticks: 61 compared to IBM/PC 827%
      Checking register to memory   ticks: 44 compared to IBM/PC 1115%
      Checking memory to register   ticks: 52 compared to IBM/PC 942%
      Checking register to register ticks: 53 compared to IBM/PC 1039%
      Checking divide by register   ticks: 24 compared to IBM/PC 2133%
      Checking divide by memory     ticks: 33 compared to IBM/PC 1830%
      Checking multiply by register ticks: 19 compared to IBM/PC 2531%
      Checking multiply by memory   ticks: 34 compared to IBM/PC 1638%
      Checking stack operations     ticks: 51 compared to IBM/PC 872%
      Checking far jumps, far calls ticks: 67 compared to IBM/PC 774%

   Total time is: 438 clock ticks, (24 seconds) compared to IBM/PC 1176%
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1603  07-23-88  01:45  (Read 142 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: ALL
subject: FDISK?

     cc: DUANE KONKEL

We have installed a Western Digital 27X RLL controller with a Miniscribe
8438 hard drive.  Using the included Ontrack software or debug and fdisk,
we get a 32meg partition called E instead of C.  We don't want to use DOS
to redirect programs from E to C; we want to know why we get the wrong
drive letter and what we can do about it, if anything.  We can live with E
but would prefer to know what is going on.  Can anyone offer suggestions or
help?  Thanks in advance!
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1605  07-23-88  12:11  (Read 141 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: FDISK?  Reply to #1603

 What is the capacity of the 8438 (32MEG)?  If it is why not use DOS to
format/install it?  That would automatically give it a drive designation of
"C:".  Why are you trying to use Ontrack in the first place?  There are
only two reasons I would use it:
  1) If you are trying to format a hard drive with a capacity of greater
than 32 MEG and you are NOT using DOS 3.3.
  2) On an "AT" none of the drive parameter tables in the bios came close
to the specifications on the hard drive I was trying to install.
 I have DOS 3.3 and I recently installed a 65 MEG drive.  Since I had "3.3"
I only had to look into "2" fortunately I had one set of parameters that
was close.
  DOS has a 32MEG partition size limit.  On versions before 3.3 there was
no way of getting around it using DOS.  With 3.3 they made a way.  If you
format to greater than 32 MEG DOS starts separating it into "logical
drives" which can be as large as 32 MEG.  That's what I did.  Now I have a
drive C: and a drive D: they are both on the same hard drive.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1603 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1607  07-23-88  17:55  (Read 139 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: FDISK?  Reply to #1603

Check the switch's in your computer.  I'll bet you have the switches set to
tell the beastie that you have 4 floppy drives.  Be honest and say that
there are only 2 floppys and the hard disk will automatically become drive
"C".

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1603 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1613  07-23-88  23:58  (Read 139 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: HAROLD WOODWARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FDISK?  Reply to #1605

     cc: JAN HARWELL

Hello, Harold.
I've been working with Jan on upgrading her PC.  We used debug to call up
the low level format procedure on the Western Digital 27x RLL controller,
ran that with no problems, found that we seemed to have unformatted
partitions C, D and E. We tried to format each as a bootable partition on
the Miniscribe 8438 and got a response from E which chkdsk showed to be a
32 meg bootable partition.  The Ontrack software came with her drive kit,
and I had just used another copy which I got when I added a Miniscribe 3675
disk to my system.  The WD card seems far superior to the Dreaded Adaptec
I've been using, I think I'm about to get one, too. Anyway, Ontrack gave us
the same result as the DOS procedure, and I'm now wondering if the low
level format run by the controller BIOS might expect some command or
parameter that we didn"t give it, although we gave appropriate response to
all the prompts.  So we have all the storage we expected, just not where we
expected to find it!  Like she said,"No biggie, we'd just like to know
why?" Share water.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1603 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1629  07-25-88  12:14  (Read 134 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: FDISK?  Reply to #1603

Your hard disk is called E instead of C most likely because you have other
drivers in CONFIG.SYS that load first. Re-arrange CONFIG.SYS so ontrack's
driver loads first.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1603 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1671  07-27-88  21:03  (Read 125 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: JOHN REDFORD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FDISK?  Reply to #1607

     cc: JEFFREY HOWELL

John, your suggestion worked!  I was able to get some information on the
correct settings from another ExecPC'er.  My machine's ROM bios makes it
think it is an XT.  Anyway, Elmer is gone and Charlie has taken up
residence.  Very grateful to you for the assistance.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1603 reply #5  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1604  07-23-88  09:17  (Read 140 times)
   from: BILL KENNEDY
     to: ALL
subject: ZAISAN

Does anyone have any info on, or know where I can get info on Zaisan ES.1
or ES.3 computers ??

Nice little machine, I have several that have various problems and am tring
to get one working out of the parts, I am expecially interested in the
error codes that appear during the powerup self test, as they are not
documented in the rather poor guide to operations that came with them

They were made by Zaisan in 1984 in Houston

thankx      Bill Kennedy
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1608  07-23-88  17:58  (Read 145 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: HAROLD WOODWARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: INTEL 80386SX MICROPR  Reply to #1606

From what Ive heard, the 80386sx is not at all compatable with the 80286
sockets.  Your cheapest method of getting close is the ALL chargecard
(presently available from Quarterdeck for $200) It will at least give you
the 386 virtual addressing capibility.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1611  07-23-88  23:32  (Read 144 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: HAROLD WOODWARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: INTEL 80386SX MICROPR  Reply to #1606

PC World has a short review of Compaq's 386s, which uses the 80386SX chip.
They say that it does indeed give 386 functionality, such as by running
Desqview with QEMM-386 or Windows/386.  It is cheaper than Compaq's other
386 systems, but then slower, too.  But the chip is NOT socket compatible
with the 80286.  The latter must have REALLY been brain-damaged, like
everyone says.

      Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1617  07-24-88  16:03  (Read 139 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: HAROLD WOODWARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: INTEL 80386SX MICROPR  Reply to #1606

Harold,
     The 386SX is NOT slot comaptible with either the 80286 or the 80386.
It does have an internal 32 bit bus, and is thus capable of running all 386
specific software, and of course 286 software (like OS/2).  In development
it was called the P9 chip (the 80286 was the P3), and will probably be the
replacement for a lot of 286 clones.  Compaq is the only company to a the
386SX in a production box, their 386S running at 16 mhz.  I'm considering
purchasing one for use at home, since I've got a 32 bit bus box at work (a
model 80), and would like to run some OS/2 jobs at home when more OS/2 apps
are available.  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1631  07-25-88  12:19  (Read 139 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JOHN REDFORD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1608

Could you please describe the ALL Chargecard, its function and what it
requires to use/install it?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1636  07-25-88  21:07  (Read 136 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1631

     cc: JOHN REDFORD

Tom,

I'll second that! I got a package from Quarterdeck last week and spent the
better part of two days trying to get some info from them. They kept trying
to refer me to Canada. I figure that if they are trying to sell me the
thing, they should know SOMETHING about it. It does sound TOO good! I am
particularly interested if knowing if it will make my AboveBoard-286 into
an EMS4.0 board (a REAL one).

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1656  07-26-88  22:28  (Read 132 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1636

     cc: JOHN REDFORD
     cc: TOM PETERS
     cc: TOM BRUCE

Everyone,

The All Chargecard does do what it says.  Another user here, Tom Bruce, has
been using one for a while.  It adds true 386 type memory management to a
286, providing what Intel should have in the first place.

Any memory in the AT becomes usable in any way.  You can create large DOS
sessions, use Desqview with as many large sessions as you want, etc.
Regular extended memory works fine with it, no need for EMS or EEMS boards.

Tom Bruce - correct me if I'm wrong on anything here.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1661  07-27-88  06:29  (Read 129 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1656

Glen,

Thanks for the info. I was worried about the Above Board working properly
with it. Do not want to make a $260. mistake by buying one. And I could
find no information on the board (except here) that was helpful. Thanks
again.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1667  07-27-88  16:59  (Read 125 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1656

Forgive me, but I am utterly unfamiliar with the all chargecard.

Is this a coprocessor or processor replacement? Or is it a memory board
product? or is it jst a memory management product? Does one pull his 80286
and run a cable to the charge card, or just drop in it the nearest open
slot, and run some software?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1677  07-28-88  12:05  (Read 131 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1667

Tom,

The All ChargeCard is a daughterboard that plugs into the 80286 socket and
the 80286 plugs into a socket on the ChargeCard.  The added chips on the
ChargeCard add all sorts of useful memory management features to the 286
processor.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1680  07-28-88  18:17  (Read 130 times)
   from: TOM BRUCE
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1656

     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     cc: JOHN REDFORD
     cc: TOM PETERS

That's a fair assessment.  The only drawback I've experienced with the card
was installing it in the first place:  It helps to have very small hands
with very long fingers and double-joined elbows.

Regards,

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1682  07-28-88  20:04  (Read 128 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM BRUCE (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1680

     cc: GLEN THOMPSON

Tom,

thanks for confirming what Glen had to say. NOW I know! I have heard so
many wild stories about hardware capability that I'm a little gun-shy. And
I've bought and returned enough incompatible hardware that the type of info
I got from you and Glen is truly invaluable. Thanks again...

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1690  07-29-88  07:34  (Read 138 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1677

Glen,

Did you mean to say that the All Charge Card plugs into the 80286 socket
and that the 8 0 2 8 6 plugs into the All Charge Card (or did you mean to
say the 8 0 3 8 6 S X plugs into the board)?????

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1691  07-29-88  17:43  (Read 134 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1690

The 80286 plugs into it Mark.  It has Yxternal chips and logic that make
the thing act like the 80386sx as far as virtual addressing goes.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1692  07-29-88  18:18  (Read 134 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1690

Mark,

The 80286 plugs into the ChargeCard.  The added chips on the daughterboard
provide 386-like memory management.  As yet I haven't heard of anyone with
a 80386sx daughterboard but I'm waiting.

With AT motherboards selling for about $300, I wonder how long it will be
before 386sx motherboards come on the market at a reasonable price, $500
range.

signoff

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1698  07-30-88  10:04  (Read 128 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1692

Glen & John,

I'm waiting for someone to announce a plug in 80386SX daughter board for my
Compaq 286.  I know I'll still only have the 16 bit bus, but I retain all
of the Compaq capabilities and would gain the multitasking capabilities of
the 80386.  Time will tell if and when a product like this will be offered.
I remember reading something (in PC Week, I think) that some expert didn't
think that their would be a big market for 286'ers wanting to take their
machines to a 386SX with a adapter board.  Me thinks him wrong.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #14

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1706  07-30-88  23:13  (Read 132 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1698

I agree with you.  Something in PC Mag said that there would probably be
such daughterboards available by the end of the year, and probably for $500
or less.  That would be something.

       Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #15

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1722  07-31-88  22:34  (Read 130 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1698

Mark,

I agree with you on the marketability of a 386sx daughterboard.  While
you'll only see about a 10 to 20% speed invrease, you get all the
advantages of the 386 architecture.  That will then signal the end of OS/2
as we know it and pave the way for a real 386 OS.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #16

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1724  08-01-88  11:07  (Read 128 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1677

So the charge card must have memory on it that isn't addressed thru the
normal (bus) hardware, and is therefore faster...? Maybe you can use 100ns
chips and get good advantage from them?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #17

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1726  08-01-88  18:07  (Read 130 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1724

Tom,

The Chargecard doesn't have any memory on it.  It maps the addresses
specified by the 286 into the actual addresses in the bus address space.
It does this in a similar manner to the 386 on-board memory management
hardware.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #18

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1728  08-01-88  23:24  (Read 125 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1722

Nick & Glen,

I hope the 386sx plug-ins are available before year end and they better be
LESS than $500.00.  As I understand it from many minutes of reading, the
card needs to be little more than a socket & plug, a 386SX chip and the
printed circuit board.  This is needed to convert the pin out of the 386SX
chip to that of the 286 chip.  Anyone received any more substantial
technical information to confirm or rebutt this?

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #19

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1787  08-05-88  09:40  (Read 125 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1728

mark,

The only other thing to add to a 386sx daughterboard is an additional
clock.  Might as well run it at 16 MHz and make sure that the IO bus is
guaranteed to be the only bottleneck.  A 80387sx socket might be nice too
but only if the 386sx wouldn't run well with the 287.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #20

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1795  08-05-88  22:20  (Read 125 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1787

Glen,

Your bring up a good point about the 386SX / 287 coprocessor compatibility.
As far as running at 16MHz, I think it would be best to leave the designed
speed of the unit under consideration to be left alone.  There are way to
many places for timing problems to develop for the uP to be sped up without
analyzing the rest of the system.  Actually, I've never found a need for my
home machine to need a 287, and wouldn't consider a 386SX board without a
co-processor option to be a draw back.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #21

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1803  08-06-88  09:40  (Read 128 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1787

Glen,
    I picked up a new Compaq 386s on Thursday night.  The base 40 meg
version with 1 meg of RAM, the 40 meg conner 3.5 HD, and the Compaq VGA
monitor.  Have set it up and already run into a couple of problems.
1) Norton Advanced Utility Sort Directory dosn't work
2) Fastback Plus won't get past the DMA test
Have not had a chance to test very much though, will give a full report
later, and I may even write a review for upload here.  A *REAL* review,
until those "paid" reviews in the magazines!  A half-dozen page ad does
wonders for a product.  Overall I'm very impressed with the construction
and the design of the system.  The VGA demo is very impressive, and it has
the VGA on the mother board, along with all FD/HD controllers.
I have not taken out the I/O chassis to see the complete motherboard layout
yet, but it looks like Compaq farms it out, just like ole' blue shorts
does.  I thought Compaq had all those engineering types like myself for a
purpose other than R&D.  More later ....    AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #22

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1808  08-06-88  18:53  (Read 125 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1803

What date was your Norton Utilitys,  They have now come out with at least 3
versions of version4.  the original, a Feb 88 version which is supposed to
handle the compaq large sector disks, and now a version that is supposed to
handle the Dos 4.0 FATs.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #23

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1809  08-06-88  19:56  (Read 124 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1803

Al,

You're going to have the Norton problems on any Compaq with Compaq's 3.31
DOS and a single partition over 32 MB.  I think that there is a new version
of the Norton Utilities available to handle DOS 3.31.  Since Dos 4.0 is
out? I would wait until Norton could handle it before upgrading.

Can't comment on the Fastback Plus problem.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #24

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1812  08-06-88  20:37  (Read 124 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1795

Mark,

Not need a 80x87 at home???  You mean you don't do finite element analysis
at home?  How can you ever build anything without worrying about all those
stress points?

About the only area of work done at home that would really need a x87 is
graphics.  They can eat up some cycles and I had slow redisplay times.

I was commenting on it for people that wanted to upgrade ATs in situations
where a x87 was useful, like our engineering department.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #25

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1820  08-07-88  02:13  (Read 123 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1812

Glen,

Your absolutely right!  If I did finite element analysis at home or could
afford $2500 (approx.) for AutoCAD, then I would gladly pay for the added
cost of the math coprocessor.  But. . . .

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #26

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1827  08-07-88  12:49  (Read 123 times)
   from: HYONG BANG
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1803

A review would be really, great, especially, some  real performance
oriented on, using some sort of virtual machine/supervisor set up
like VM/386, Windows 386, etc and the Pharlap dos extender, as well
as OS2 also.  By the way, has anyone thought to write a OS2
performance benchmark?  If all these OEM versions are really semi
customs like the magazines say, there may be significant
differences in performance, just like the different versions of
unix have even on the same machine.

Hyong

P.S.  I'm still looking for the right 386 machine...is this one
(or something very much like it, the one?)

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #27

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1828  08-07-88  12:51  (Read 124 times)
   from: HYONG BANG
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1812

Right on, and how about those of us who solve Navier-Stokes equations
in 4-d for fun?   In any case, what is the marginal cost of adding an
empty 387s socket?

Hyong

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #28

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1835  08-07-88  20:58  (Read 124 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: HYONG BANG (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1827

Hyong,

I would say that the Compaq 386/25 and the Everex 386/25 are the "right"
386 machines if you've got the bucks.  Oh, you have price constraints?
Compaq's 386s is still a bit pricey compared to what could be done.  I'm
waiting for 386sx motherboards to become available like the current 286 and
386 boards are.  Hopefully they will price out somewhere in between, say
$600.  That makes building a 386 system affordable.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #29

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1841  08-08-88  11:14  (Read 125 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: JOHN REDFORD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1808

John,
    Thanks for the reply, I'll have to go and eyeball the origianl
diskette.  I am having problems with Compaq MS-DOS 3.31, and as I suspected
with PC DOS 4.0 this morning.  Having a ball ....  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #30

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1842  08-08-88  11:18  (Read 126 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1809

glen,
    Had to do two installs on PC DOS 4.0 this morning, Norton Utils DS will
not work as I suspected.  Will call Pete later for a fix.  Hey, this PC DOS
4.0 is really NICE!  Works OK with emulation in general, will get specific
later.  Have already talked with level 1 this am, have an insufficient
memory error on the PC side when running DW/4 through the 36 as my wp
program of choice.  later ...  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #31

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1843  08-08-88  11:24  (Read 127 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: HYONG BANG (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: INTEL 80386SX MICR  Reply to #1827

Hyong,
   I don't have any of the programs you mentioned, BUT the 386s is SUPPOSED
to run them all from what I've read so far.  Have only had it for a few
days, and it has already passed a major hurdle, I've run it on-site for
some race scoring work that I do.  Comapares to a Compaq 386 40 that I had
on rental a year ago, and at a greatly reduced price!  It will handle up to
13 meg of RAM in the proprietary 32 meg slot on the mother board.  There
are other third-party companies that supposedly have boards available to
fit this slot, so Comapq must ahve released the specs to vendors, gues it's
not so proprietary after all.  I don't know if this is the machine you are
looking for though, it does not have any 32 bit slots, just the standard AT
type 16 bit ones.  My Everex 2400 modem (8 bit) fits in OK.  more later ...
AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1608 reply #32  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1612  07-23-88  23:36  (Read 139 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: HAROLD WOODWARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: 2 HD'S ON ADAPTEC 237  Reply to #1609

It's got nothing to do really with the termination resistors, although the
last drive in the chain should have one.  With a non-twisted cable, you
must set jumpers on the drives themselves so that the drive you want to be
C, which is connected to the END of the big cable, is set as drive select
one, and the other one, connected to the MIDDLE of the big cable, is set as
drive select two.  Have you also connected separate 20 pin data cables for
each drive to the controller?

         Nick
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1618  07-24-88  17:49  (Read 134 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: JOHN REDFORD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 2 HD'S ON ADAPTEC  Reply to #1615

  Thanks, I dug through my own literature and found the pin designations
myself.  I did it the way you suggested, it does work.  However the way it
works is the first 277R partition is C: the 238R is D: and the second
partition on the 277R is E:.  I can live with that.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1612 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1623  07-24-88  23:32  (Read 133 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: HAROLD WOODWARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 2 HD'S ON ADAPTEC  Reply to #1614

Well, I can't describe from memory or any reference available to me right
now how the jumpers are for the drive select on the drive, but a safe
assumption would be that they are both in the drive select 1 position right
now, making them at one particular end of the jumper block.  Try moving the
jumper over one position for the drive you want to connect as drive D, and
that should put it in drive select 2 position.  Does that help any?

           Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1612 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1672  07-27-88  22:03  (Read 124 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: JOHN REDFORD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 2 HD'S ON ADAPTEC  Reply to #1632

Thanks for the input.  I'll give it a try and see what happens.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1612 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1620  07-24-88  21:49  (Read 135 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: ROB RAPP (Rcvd)
subject: HARD DRIVE ON 1000TX

I have a friend, Tom Frederichs(MFHS'68) who wants to put a hard disk in
his Tandy 1000tx.  Seems that THEY told him some Fabulous price to do so
with Tandy components($1000+) so of course he is seeking other options.  Do
you know if other controllers will fit the slots and function?  I know the
WD 27X RLL half card doesn't have to align with the opening in the back of
a case.  Would that card work with maybe a Segate ST238 or Minisrcibe 8438
in the 1000TX? Would a hardcard be a better bet?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1624  07-24-88  23:35  (Read 134 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000TX  Reply to #1620

If you are interested in hard cards for a Tandy, both CompuAdd and
Shamrock, both with ads in PC Mag, carry special stuff for the Tandy.  Come
to think of it, I think CompuAdd even had regular hard disks for the Tandy,
and they run less than $100 more than the box standard stuff.

            Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1625  07-24-88  23:49  (Read 135 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000TX  Reply to #1620

Standard Hard Cards will not fit that computer.  The slots are 2/3 or 3/4
inch length.  You need a slightly different controller card from a standard
XT type.  If you take a look in Computer Shopper you will find more and
more companys are offering "Kits" for these Computers.  Offhand Tulin
Company and Sunnyvale Memories.  Sunnyvale Memories even sells the special
controllers separately.  A friend bought one of the Tulin ones and had a
minor problem that wasn't covered in the instructions.  You have to change
one of the interupt switches on the motherboard to get it working properly.
This should get you going.  By the way to give you an idea of price.  For
that $1,000 that Tandy charges for a 20 Meg you can get a 63 Meg with
Controller from Sunnyvale for $605 all you sacrifice is one of the floppys.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1639  07-25-88  22:14  (Read 131 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1624

Thanks, Nick.  I'll relay this to Tom.  I know I've seen ads for some of
this stuff, but trying to find products in Computer Shopper when you don't
know the vendor can be endless, especially when I keep floating off in
fantasies about MY ULTIMATE SYSTEM.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1642  07-26-88  01:41  (Read 133 times)
   from: ROB RAPP
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000TX  Reply to #1620

Dave -

Either will do.  I have a hard card, but it is a 27RLL WD with the
mentioned Miniscribe 8438, so who cares where and how it is connected? The
trick with the 1000 (and 2000, for that matter) is that the interrupt for
the HD is 2, not 5, and must be changed in two places on the controller. If
you have the docs for the controller it is in there.  The one place is on
the bottom of the board, some cards have jumpers, some do not.  W9???  My
memory fails me.  In any case, if there is a jumper, it has to be moved to
the other possible combination, and if not, the trace has to be cut, and a
jumper put across the other two pins.  The other place is at the bracket
side of the card, where there are a number of jumpers.  There is another
jumper that needs to be put on, I think at #2, but look at the docs.  Also,
be sure that the firmware translation is disabled, as it otherwise tries to
fool the computer into thinking it is an MFM drive.

Alternately, find Shamrock Computers in a magazine and order one of theirs.
They charge about $20 more for the mods, and their prices are reasonable,
about $390 for a 32 meg hardcard.  Perhaps less by now.

I loaned one set of my docs to a friend, so I would have to look to give
you the exact procedure, but I am sure I can do so if you like (i.e. you do
not have the docs!)

Rob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1653  07-26-88  21:58  (Read 129 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: ROB RAPP (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1642

Thanks,Rob.  I think Tom would be leery of surgery on his controller, as I
would be of performing it.  Shamrock would be a better alternative or some
thing like it.  I'm still not sure what he has in mind, so for now I'll
just show him the ads.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1658  07-26-88  23:14  (Read 129 times)
   from: ROB RAPP
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1653

It is really too bad; I had a WX2 controller board with the required
surgery, but sold it.  To someone who had to reverse the changes!  It
really is not that big a deal; the one change is in a non-critical area,
and the other changes are jumper moving.  If he changes his mind (as long
as he has a controller, he might as well use it), let me know.  Of course,
most of the time they almost through the controller in on the deal, anyway.

Rob

P.S.  Call me at Anonymous sometime!!!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1684  07-28-88  20:42  (Read 130 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: ROB RAPP (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1658

I've been trying to get on your board since you posted the number, using
Telix212 at 1200 baud and the same settings as Exec-PC on an Avatex 1200i,
but I never get a connect.  I suspect the modem dipswitch settings may need
resetting, but know nothing about this.  I've had erratic success with
other boards, some of which I've called on the phone, heard the carrier
after connect, but been unable to get online when I use the computer.  I'm
going out to MF Saturday afternoon to see if my hard drives behave just as
strangely on my Dad's XT clone as they do on mine, and planned to bring the
modem to show him how it works.  Could I drop in if I call first?  Maybe
you could hit it with a different precision BFH than the one I use.  BTW,
my friend Tom has no HD controller as yet, he just was asking a bout
sources other than overpriced Tandy.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1686  07-28-88  21:51  (Read 130 times)
   from: ROB RAPP
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1684

Dave -

Sure, be my guest!  I do have a theory on the modem thing.  You are
calling at 1200 baud; I init at 2400.  Therefore, we need to agree (or our
modems do) on the baud rate.  The way that RyBBS figures this out is from
word connect messages, rather than numeric.  You may have to change that
setting on your modem (could be a dip switch, otherwise, v1 is verbal, v0
is numeric).  Check that out.  If, for example, you do not have trouble
witn Wildcat! boards, it is because they support numeric.  Worth a try.

See you Saturday, perhaps!

Bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1736  08-02-88  16:20  (Read 120 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1684

This may sound stupid, but most modems will abort the connection if you hit
any key at all after the dial command and before it either connects or
times out. You wouldn't be typing anything before a CONNECT message or a NO
CARRIER mesasge, would you? Naw...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1744  08-02-88  19:05  (Read 122 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1736

Nothing so simple, I'm afraid.  I just sit here watching Telix count
down the seconds until I get no connect.  I appreciate the input, though,
I've still not enough experience to always recognize the obvious!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1758  08-03-88  15:12  (Read 119 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1744

PROCOMM 2.42 IS STILL FREE and works better than a lot of commercial
packages. You might try that.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1767  08-03-88  20:51  (Read 118 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1758

I have PCPLUSTD, Qmodem, PC-TalkIII and Telix212 and 30 and like Telix best
so far, I just need to learn more about it.  I think my problems revolve
around the modem, rather than the software.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1844  08-08-88  18:36  (Read 125 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1767

I still like Procomm 2.42 for comm software. Jerry Pournell, science
fiction author and columnist in Byte, does too. He used it a lot before the
commercial version came out. Still, to each his own. Find something you
like and use it...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1847  08-08-88  21:24  (Read 125 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1844

When I was having problems with my cursed Adaptec HD controller, the only
shareware comm program I could configure without crashing was Telix212.
The user interface is similar to Procomm and Qmodem, scripts are easy to
write and it doesn't take much room on the Seagate...Telix30 may be another
story but I don't intend to install it until my WD 27X HD controller
arrives(Please, SOON, Please!!).  Have you read "The Mote in God's Eye" by
Niven and Pournelle?  Good HARD SF of the old school.  Wish I still had
time to read fiction.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #14

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1855  08-09-88  16:43  (Read 131 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1847

I LIKED "The Mote..." and agree: good old SF. I liked the Ringworld books
as well. Did you try "The Integral Trees" and the sequel? I though the
original was good, but "The Smoke Ring" wasn't. It just kinda starts up and
goes for a while, then stops. I also liked the Heechee books a lot, and got
to meet the author at a convention.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #15

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1858  08-09-88  21:04  (Read 128 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1855

I've enjoyed the Ringworld series, Inexplicably didn't read "...Trees" when
it was in Analog, was unmoved by "Smoke Ring" and just figured I should
have read the first to like the second.  I used to knock off 3 or 4 novels
a week, now my time is so limited that I actually hadn't finished an Analog
when the next one showed up.  Much of my current leisure is doing what I'm
doing right now, I think I've become a modem junkie and I need regular
fixes of DOS utilities to keep me amused...at least I still find time for
XCon.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #16

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1870  08-10-88  15:10  (Read 126 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1858

I missed XCON this year, having been in Bavaria during the first part of
June. Ever been to Triangulum? I was last year but I'm not going back. It
gets worse every year.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #17

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1874  08-10-88  19:06  (Read 121 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DRIVE ON 1000  Reply to #1870

I hit one Triangulum and it was enough.  I heard yesterday there would be
no more.  Hit Bavaria,too, some time ago.  Got drunk in Munchen as all good
tourists do.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1620 reply #18  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1622  07-24-88  23:30  (Read 132 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: JOHN REDFORD (Rcvd)
subject: FDISK

     cc: DAVID BIRCH

John, your suggestion that the problem may be in the dip switch settings
makes sense to me.  My experience with the insides of my pc is very
limited.  I am checking some of my reference materials but if you can give
me some idea of what the settings should be that would help alot.  Thanks
for the reply and suggestion.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1633  07-25-88  18:20  (Read 127 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: FDISK  Reply to #1622

Dont have any Info on the ST or PC switch settings here at home, will try
to look em up tomorrow and let you know.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1622 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1635  07-25-88  20:39  (Read 128 times)
   from: RICHARD CARLSON
     to: ALL
subject: OSBORNE TERMINAL PROGRAM

     cc: SYSOP

i HAVE A FREIND THAT HAS AN OSBORNE COMPUTER. IT IS CPM BASED. SHE IS
WRITING A BOOK ON IT AND WANTS TO TRANSFER THE TEST TO HER AGENT IN NEW
YORK. AS CAN BE EXPECTED SHE IS NOT ROLLING IN BUCKS. IS ANYONE AWARE OF A
PROGRAM THAT IS AVAILABLE FOR HER TO USE?? PLEASE WRITE AND TELL ME.
SIGNED,
EXPECTED TO KNOW EVERYTHING
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1710  07-31-88  05:36  (Read 128 times)
   from: JIM DUNNIGAN
     to: RICHARD CARLSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: OSBORNE TERMINAL PROG  Reply to #1635

There's a nationwide Orborne Users Group called FOG which could probably
help you out. Download one of the BBS listings files and you may find
a listing for one of their BBS's (I believe at least one is in SF).
There is also one or more programs in the file collections that allows
IBM PC's to read and write CP/M disks.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1635 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1725  08-01-88  17:44  (Read 124 times)
   from: RICHARD CARLSON
     to: JIM DUNNIGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OSBORNE TERMINAL P  Reply to #1710

thanks for the information.
by any chance do yo know of the names that writer and read to the ibm from
cp/m disks?

your friend in need

ricahrd.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1635 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1730  08-02-88  02:56  (Read 121 times)
   from: JIM DUNNIGAN
     to: RICHARD CARLSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OSBORNE TERMINAL P  Reply to #1725

Somehow the name "NEWMMS" pops into my head, but you had best do a search
in the file libraries under CP/M and CPM. You might also check out a
recent copy of Computer Shopper magazine, they still carry lots of
CP/M info.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1635 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1746  08-02-88  20:20  (Read 117 times)
   from: RICHARD CARLSON
     to: JIM DUNNIGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OSBORNE TERMINAL P  Reply to #1730

thank you for the name.

i hope to be of service to you some day.
your friend
richard

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1635 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1643  07-26-88  07:00  (Read 130 times)
   from: MARK SIMMONS
     to: ALL
subject: RLL ST-4096

Hello, I have been watching a interesting debate about whether or not
a ST-4096 can be run reliable on a RLL controller. There are many people
who say that this is possible, and many who don't feel RLL even on a RLL
certified drive is reliable. I would therefor like to solicit any
comments or thoughts any one may have in this matter.

Thank You,
-Mark Simmons-


---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1650  07-26-88  19:49  (Read 131 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: MARK SIMMONS (Rcvd)
subject: R: RLL ST-4096  Reply to #1643

Mark,

Have never worked with an ST-4096, but from personal experience I can tell
you that RLL with RLL drives is reliable. Have been running three of them
for a year+ with no problems. That is after an early bout with bogus
controllers. RLL with non-RLL drives is NOT relaible. Many have tried it
and SOME have been lucky. I have not! My advice is "if the drive is not
rated for RLL there IS a reason". But it is your data, you must decide
whether you want to tempt fate or argue with the drive manufacturers.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1643 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1663  07-27-88  10:47  (Read 124 times)
   from: MARK SIMMONS
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: RLL ST-4096  Reply to #1650

Steve,
 Do you feel the proublem is simply a matter of lost data? Or is there
possible problem with the mechanical side of the drive?
Thanks,
-Mark Simmons-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1643 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1894  08-13-88  08:04  (Read 121 times)
   from: MARK SIMMONS
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: RLL ST-4096  Reply to #1668

Steve,
And interesting thing came up about this whole thing. I talked to many
hard drive repair shops and the basic thought was that the ST-4096 is not
quit as reliable as there newer units. Because of this, it was recomended
not to tempt fate by trying to RLL them.
While thay had in fact RLL'ed them,  thay felt that the risk of mechanical
failure was the real reason. The RLL prosses won't cause the breakdown,
it's just that the drives are just plain unreliable. (I told them Thanks A
lot for that tidbit of news!)
SO I of course am not going to tempt a crash. Thanks for you input.
-Mark Simmons-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1643 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1895  08-13-88  09:05  (Read 118 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: MARK SIMMONS (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: RLL ST-4096  Reply to #1894

     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL

I beg to differ with you regarding the reliabilty of the ST-40XX series
drives.  They will not reliably run RLL because they are not plated media,
not because the drives are un-reliable.  The company that I work for uses
many differnt types of drives including the ST-40XX series, and I have
found them to be some of the best drives that we have.  I myself use a
ST-4038, and an ST-4051 that have been on my system for a few years with no
problems.  I feel that these drives are far superior to the ST-2XX series
of drive which are proven to be more unreliable.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1643 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1897  08-13-88  23:18  (Read 118 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: RLL ST-4096  Reply to #1895

Keith,

That was my original point. I have never heard of the 4096 being unreliable
mechanically. But I would not try to run one RLL because of the media. The
225's that I saw burned out running RLL would not format, period. Not RLL
or MFM! It has been suggested that the high density recording from RLL has
actually burned the coating from the platters. I don't know if I believe
this or not, but I do know that the drives were SHOT! I cannot recommend
that anyone try it with ANY non-RLL rated drive, although many people have
done it. Just not on my advice!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1643 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1898  08-13-88  23:30  (Read 118 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: RLL ST-4096  Reply to #1897

Please read message # 1796 RE: ST-225's and RLL

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1643 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1900  08-14-88  09:51  (Read 119 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: RLL ST-4096  Reply to #1898

Keith,

I did, and I couldn't agree more! At least with your final comment.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1643 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1944  08-18-88  09:30  (Read 122 times)
   from: MARK SIMMONS
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: RLL ST-4096  Reply to #1895

Keith,
I hope your right, I have no great love of recovering from crashes!
I will take your information to heart and hope that the first crash I had
after a mere 60 days was a fluke. Thanks for the support.
Thanks Mark Simmons

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1643 reply #8  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1644  07-26-88  10:46  (Read 132 times)
   from: DWIGHT SISK
     to: ALL
subject: PS/2 MONITOR WANTED

I NEED A COLOR OR MONO PS/2 MONITOR LEAVE MESSAGE OR CALL 816-923-9900
ASK FOR DWIGHT
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1645  07-26-88  10:47  (Read 129 times)
   from: DWIGHT SISK
     to: ALL
subject: 16BIT LAN CARDS F/SALE

I HAVE SOME NEW RACORE 16BIT LANPAC II CARDS FOR SALE $150 EA. THEY RETAIL
FOR $425 LEAVE MESSAGE OR CALL DWIGHT 816-923-9900
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1646  07-26-88  11:00  (Read 140 times)
   from: DUANE KONKEL
     to: ALL
subject: ST-238 CERT & RLL DRIVES

     cc: GLEN THOMPSON
     cc: TOM PETERS
     cc: BENTLY TURNER

*       SEAGATE         HARD            DRIVE           CONFUSION       *
*                                                                       *
There has been alot of confusion as to the designation
of the the Seagate ST-238 and the ST-238R.
First off lets dispell some of the mis-information on that.
Seagate created the ST-238, the first series was plated media.
Plated media was not extremely reliable, and per Seagates strict
quality control standards they didn't deal in that area too long.
Using a better media they continued building ST-238's.
*
ALL, I REPEAT  ** ALL **  ST-238'S ARE RLL CERTIFIED !!!!!!!
THIS IS STRAIGHT FROM SEAGATE TECHNOLOGIES !!!!!!!!
Now let me explain their numbering sequence.
Example
ST-238R
ST  -  Seagate Technologies
2   -  5 & 1/4 " half height
38  -  38 meg (unformatted capacity)
R   -  RLL Certified
I know that means an ST-238 isn't RLL Certified --  WRONG !!
Seagate in creating a numbering standard added the R in their
sequence to be consistent.  The ST-238 was created before
Seagate came up with the consistent numbering sequence.
Lets dispell with one other theory.
RLL certified
The data Rate an RLL drive is 50 faster than in an MFM drive.
The Envelope in a MFM drive is similiar to this
*         r         *
| - 200 nanoseconds-|
The Envelope in an RLL drive is similiar to this
*      r      *
|-   150 ns  -|
The drive must be able to read the data within that window space
leaving the tolerance much tighter in the RLL Series.
What does all this mean to you???
In Seagates own words
Q: Can I use my MFM drive with an RLL controller to gain extra capacity ?
A: No, there are design differences between Seagate's RLL and MFM
   drives.  Putting an MFM drive on a RLL card is a recipe for
   disaster and may void your warranty.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You may (Although I wouldn't justify it) use your RLL certified with
an MFM controller card.  You will just get 33% less storage.
For example you could use your RLL ST-238 (remember an ST-238
is an RLL certified drive) with a standard MFM controller and get the
same results as having hooked up an ST-225.
WITHOUT ANY PROBLEMS WHATSOEVER !!!!!!
YOU CAN USE AN RLL DRIVE IN AN MFM ENVIRONMENT,
BUT SHOULD NOT USE AN MFM DRIVE IN AN RLL ENVIRONMENT.
*
Should you have any questions or disputes with what I have presented
here, I would be glad to field any questions or discrepancies you may
feel there are.
Either leave an email here or feel free to call
Duane Konkel
DAK TEKnologies
549-1220
*
Happy Hard Drives !!!!!!!!!!
DAK TEK is an authorized Seagate Technologies dealer.


---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1647  07-26-88  16:17  (Read 125 times)
   from: PHIL PUCCI
     to: ALL
subject: C64 PRINTER I/O


Does anyone know what the printer I/O capabilities are for a
COMMODORE 64 computer?  Will it support the CENTRONICS interface
using the same cable as an IBM clone?

Any information would be helpful as the question comes from a friend
of a friend of a friend ...

PdP

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1651  07-26-88  20:02  (Read 123 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: PHIL PUCCI (Rcvd)
subject: R: C64 PRINTER I/O  Reply to #1647

Phil,

Definately not! You can use an IBM Centronics cable as an extension cord
but that is all. The normal serial output is via a 5 pin DIN plug on the
rear of the machine. Sorry, that should be 6 pin DIN. The output is then
fed into an "interface" that has the 6 pin input and a Centronics output
cable. This must be purchased seperately.

Another interface is (or was) available that connected the "user port" to a
Centronics connector directly but it required a software driver to operate
properly and never went over very well. Sold mostly to folks who HAD an IBM
/Centronics printer that they wanted to connect to the C64. But the
interrupt driven printer driver conflicted with many software packages and
thus caused more problems than it solved. It was a real pain in the butt! I
made one and know only too well!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1647 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1660  07-27-88  01:21  (Read 123 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: PHIL PUCCI (Rcvd)
subject: R: C64 PRINTER I/O  Reply to #1647

The C-64 has a serial output port that is used to communicate with a
printer; unless you use an adaptor card you will not be able to use a
parallel ported printer.
The Centronics compatible port on printers is a parallel type interface. I
hope that helps, Phil, if it doesn't give me a shout back and we can get
more specific.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1647 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1657  07-26-88  22:37  (Read 123 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: FDISK  REPLY TO #1629

Tom, thank you for replying to my call for help with a misnamed hard drive.
 Will be experimenting with some solutions tomorrow evening and will
certainly give your suggestion a try.  Appreciate your help!
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1665  07-27-88  16:23  (Read 119 times)
   from: MARK DELAGUARO
     to: ALL
subject: HARD DRIVE

HARD DRIVE FOR SALE -  REFURBISHED 4038 (30 MEG)
ALL REASONABLE OFFERS WILL BE LOOKED AT.
GUARANTEED TO WORK!
CALL DELAS PLACE BBS AT [phone] AND LEAVE A MESSAGE TO THE SYSOP
IF INTERESTED.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1670  07-27-88  19:59  (Read 121 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: CHARGE CARD

     cc: TOM BRUCE

Glen,

One more question from me, if I may. In your earlier message carboned to
me, you mentioned that there was no NEED to purchase EMS/EEMS boards for
use with the Chargecard. What I need to know is if I already have one (or
more) will they still work with the Chargecard? Your help will be most
appreciated.

-[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1678  07-28-88  12:09  (Read 116 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: CHARGE CARD  Reply to #1670

Steve,

Since the ChargeCard provides a better form of memory management than the
EMS/EEMS boards, it's better to configure your Intel AboveBoard as EXtended
memory and let the ChargeCard handle all the mapping.  You get more
benefits that way.  The ChargeCard then allocates the memory as needed.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1670 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1681  07-28-88  18:27  (Read 124 times)
   from: TOM BRUCE
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: CHARGE CARD  Reply to #1670

     cc: GLEN THOMPSON

Steve,

Although I only have extended memory in use with the ChargeCard, I
understand that it integrates all of your memory (extended, expanded, and
enhanced expanded) seamlessly, more or less.

Regards,

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1670 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1683  07-28-88  20:05  (Read 121 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM BRUCE (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: CHARGE CARD  Reply to #1681

Tom,

That's what I wanted to hear! Thanks again...

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1670 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1674  07-27-88  22:42  (Read 129 times)
   from: RICK PODRAZA
     to: ALL
subject: 3.5 DISC DRIVE

  I suppose this is naive, but what is the advantage of a 3.5 disc drive
over a 1.2 meg drive.  I seem to see lots of messages from folks
having problems getting them to work, they're kind of expensive, and
the discs appear to be priced a bit higher than the .49/disc I get from
MEI Micro for the high density.  On the other hand, I'm always looking
for an excuse to buy new equipment.

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1675  07-28-88  00:59  (Read 127 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: RICK PODRAZA (Rcvd)
subject: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1674

I assume you are talking about the difference between the 1.2 MEG 5 1/4
inch disks and the 1.4 MEG 3.5 inch disks.  There are two main advantages
to all 3.5 inch disks.
 1) Size--you can fit a number of them in your shirt pocket.
 2) They are protected a whole lot better-hard plastic case, magnetic media
never exposed.  On the 5 1/4 inch disks you have an open slot where the
head reads the disk--dust and dirt can easily get in that way.  On the 3.5
inch disks there is a shutter that is only open when the disk is in the
drive.
You are right in there being a significant price difference.  Discounted
mail order for the 1.2's $.50 each for the 1.4's $3.50-$4.50.
I am not positive about this next part and if I'm wrong I apoligize and
someone please correct me.
I have heard/seen compatability problems (read, write, format) on on 1.2
MEG disks in relation to being read by a drive from another manufacturer
(IE my toshiba 1.2 will not read disks formated on my mitsubichi 1.2).  I
don't believe this problem exists with the 1.4's.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1676  07-28-88  06:42  (Read 129 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: RICK PODRAZA (Rcvd)
subject: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1674

Rick,

I like them because the put a lot of data in a very small, durable package.
It is possible to carry the contents of a ten meg hard drive in your coat
pocket. Makes it nice to transport large quantities af information when
traveling. Also, using them for backups cuts down on the disk count as well
as the space needed to store them. Smart shopping keeps the disk cost
problem to a minimum.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1688  07-29-88  01:37  (Read 132 times)
   from: RICK PODRAZA
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1676

Steve,
   Thanks for your input.  After I posted the message, another thought
occurred to me.  I recently read an article (from this board I believe)
that all floppies and magnetic tape degrade with age because of the
proximity of one magnetic coating to the other.  Do you have any info
if this might be less of a problem with the 3.5's.  Correct me if
I'm wrong, but they are much thicker than a floppie.  I have a need
for relatively long term data storage (3 to 4 yrs) and if the
3.5's are more stable, it would very much influence my decision.
                                     ----->Rick<-----

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1689  07-29-88  07:32  (Read 136 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: RICK PODRAZA (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1688

Rick,

That is one thing that I had never considered! But, you are right, I think,
in your assessment. It should provide some measure of security in that
respect. But I have tapes recorded in the middle sixties on VERY thin mag
tape that have suffered no noticeable printthrough in 20+ years. So it
really may not be all that important. I also have disks (5.25 inch) that
are seven or eight years old and they still work fine. But for important
data one can't be too careful!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1693  07-29-88  21:00  (Read 136 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1689

Mag tape is not as suseptible to the problem as floppies are.  The very
fact that the particles on the surface of the floppy are magnetic can, in
time, alter the magnetice particles on the other side of the floppy.
Because mag tape is recorded on only one side, this is not a problem.  The
only problems that can arise is that the bits are close enough together on
the same side to affect each other.  The only way to circumvent the entire
problem is to go back to the old fashioned paper tape punch/reader.
Sometimes you can't beat old technology for reliability (Rember core
memory??).

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1694  07-29-88  21:12  (Read 136 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1693

Keith,

Thanks for clearing that up. It was just a theory on my part, but I have
heard that one before, pertaining to the proximity of one disk to another.
Judy Getts once wondered aloud if maybe viruses could be transmitted that
way (tongue in cheek, actually!). But I can also see your point. Tahnks
again.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1695  07-29-88  21:19  (Read 135 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1694

Some time ago, someone asked if data could be stored on 5.25 inch floppies
for an extremely long period of time (IE > 20Yrs).  Someone came up with an
interesting theory.  Why not ever few years bring the disks out of storage
and copy them to another recently formated disk, thereby rewriting each bit
onto the floppy before it degrades.  My only question is why would someone
want to keep data for that long of an amount of time.  I have problems
remembering the usefulness of a disk that is less than 2 months old.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1697  07-29-88  23:47  (Read 134 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1695

Keith,

I know what you mean! I have the same trouble. The only reason I could
think of would be tax records (7 years, I think) and data pertaining to tax
'basis' for capital gains tax on a real estate purchase. That you need for
as long as you own the property or until you have to sell it to pay the
ever increasing property taxes on it! That could be RSN, at that rate they
are going.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1700  07-30-88  16:06  (Read 136 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1693

I am not familiar with the magnetic tape used in computers, but I've had
problems with "print through" on high quality audio tapes. It gets worse
with age; the layers are very close to each when on the reel. If your into
audio and listen closely to one of these tapes, you will hear the upcoming
notes very faintly in the background a fraction of a second before its
"played".
-JTI-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1702  07-30-88  17:03  (Read 138 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: JAMES IRVING (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1700

Yes, I know what you are talking about.  I have heard that on audio tapes
before.  Forunately there is a threshold level for digital recording that
elminates most of those problems.  That is unless the strength of the
signal is above a certain point it will be ignored as noise.  That is one
of the advantages of digital recording.  I wonder what problems will arise
from the used of DAT recorings in the future.  Unlike the CD, I do not
think the DAT tape will last forever.  It will have the same problems that
occur with long term storage of data.  Since we typically hold on the music
longer than we hold onto data, this could be a much worse problem.  I still
think that there will be a superior type of recording in  the future,
beyond our current CD's and DAT.  Something that is perhaps all electronic,
with no moving parts, or magnetic media to wear out.  Perhaps in 20 years
the way that memory chips are expanding in size, we will be purchasing
digital music on chips, istead of on some other type of media.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1703  07-30-88  21:25  (Read 139 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1702

Thanks for the comeback. I agree with you that everything is going digital
and in that direction of chip storage. I wonder if the music associations
that are trying to get DAT recorders "outlawed",or with decoder chips in
them, will try to do the same with computers. I've heard some very good
"recordings" lately, and the future should bring large amounts of memory at
very cheap prices.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1712  07-31-88  08:42  (Read 137 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: JAMES IRVING (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1703

I don't know what there problem is with DAT.  It is really no different
than a CD in quality, and if someone wanted a master they could purchase
either DAT or a CD.  I have made cassette recording from my CD's for some
time for the car.  I like the fact that when it wears out, or gets caught
in the mechanism, that I can simply make another copy.  I don't think that
DAT would change my philosophy regarding my recording habits, but I may
simply have better quality in the car.  Because of all the delays, I'm not
sure DAT is going to make as big of a hit as first suggested, but then
again I could be wrong.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1714  07-31-88  12:31  (Read 136 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1712

No, I don't think your wrong. DAT may be dead and obsolete before it has a
chance; it may not be suitable for use in cars anyway.
My cassette recordings from CD's are done with Dolby C; by the time the
volume is loud enough to hear soft passages, the loud parts rattle doors
and windows. For auto use,perhaps a little compression would be in order to
avoid problems with dynamic range.
My auto stereo does not have DBX encoding, but the home system does. I've
given up doing A/B tests on CD vs.a copy with Dbx encoding on metal tape; I
can't tell any difference. I probably don't have the famous "golden ears",
but they're not bad.
DAT may be a great "tour de force" in a technology, but perhaps it really
has no practical or economical advantage over what is now available.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1715  07-31-88  17:59  (Read 131 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: JAMES IRVING (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1714

I too have been using dolby c in the car, and find it good enough for me.
Sometimes I wish that I could use my CD's in the car, but I don't likjke
the players for the car yet.  Most of them are either to expense, or of
poor quality.  I have looked at the Sony multi unit, but I can see it now.
Evertime I want a CD in the house, it will be sitting in the back of my
car.  Especially if its raining.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #14

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1731  08-02-88  03:45  (Read 125 times)
   from: RICK PODRAZA
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1695

Kieth,
  Tax record need to be retained for three years (four if you're a
resident of Wisconsin)  That's the statute of limitations, fraud
exempted.
  Capital gains property info must be retained until sold (for basis)
and then three (or four) years after.
  I deal with financial info for many companies, and some of my
floppies are seeing their 5th birthday.  20 years?  That I can't
imagine.
----->Rick<-----

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #15

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1735  08-02-88  12:59  (Read 123 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: RICK PODRAZA (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1731

RCIK,
     That's what I was questioning.  Someone was wondering what effects
there would be to the data by keeping them around for extended periods od=f
time.  For myself I keep daily stock data for all of the stocks that I own.
 The oldest data is around 4 years old, but I'm not real worried about it
since it can be gotten from my Dow Jones service so easily.  As for tax
records, and property records, I still prefer paper documents.  I do have
some information regarding properties on disk, but it is countinously
updated and therfore re-written.  By the way have you ever heard of the old
saying I before E, except after C and in the name KEITH.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #16

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1743  08-02-88  18:48  (Read 124 times)
   from: RICK PODRAZA
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1735

Keith,
  Sorry about the spelling, but it's really my typing thats
the culprit.
                               ----->Rick<-----

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #17

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1753  08-03-88  03:40  (Read 121 times)
   from: JIM DUNNIGAN
     to: RICK PODRAZA (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1731

I'm still using 5.25 inch floppies from my TRS-80 Mod I days (some
go back to 1978). I use them for data transfer amd have noted no
exceptional problems. When I reformatted a bunch recently (they had
been sitting in an odd corner with TRSDOS stuff on them), I lost
a few k on some during the formatting. Remember, though, that these
are rated single sided, single density (for 89k TRS-80 drives). Ah, the
good old days really sucked, didn't they?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #18

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1773  08-03-88  23:06  (Read 122 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: RICK PODRAZA (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1743

Rick,
      Thats alright, I get used to it.  It's a bother sometimes to correct
problems in the line on EXEC.  You have to retype the entire line.  Oh
well.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #19

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1791  08-05-88  21:21  (Read 124 times)
   from: RICK PODRAZA
     to: JIM DUNNIGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1753

Jim,
  Thanks for responding, and thanks for the info.  The 5.25's still have
the advantage of making a smaller "stack" when piled up.  I have an
extensive collection of 1.2meg floppies, and your experience with low
data loss is reassuring.
----->Rick<-----

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #20

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1792  08-05-88  21:22  (Read 123 times)
   from: RICK PODRAZA
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 DISC DRIVE  Reply to #1773

Keith,
  To forgive is divine>
----->Rick<-----

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1674 reply #21  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1685  07-28-88  21:11  (Read 125 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: ALL
subject: PLUS HARDCARD

I ran into a strange problem with a pair of Plus Hardcards today.  We had a
Xerox PC with a Hardcard 20 that has been working fine.  We received a new
Hardcard 40 that was to replace the 20 with the 20 going in an old Compaq
luggable.  Put the new 40 in the Xerox and got a 1701 disk controller
error.  Took it out and put it in the Compaq and it worked fine.  Put it
back in the Xerox and we got the same 1701 error.  Tried all the
combinations of one or two hardcards with the switches set various ways.
Still no success.  Finally went back to using the 40 in the Compaq and the
20 in the Xerox.

Anybody got any idea why the 40 wouldn't work in the Xerox?

glen
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1737  08-02-88  16:25  (Read 116 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: PLUS HARDCARD  Reply to #1685

You might get the same problem if you format a drive on a Zenith and
another on a clone, and swap them.

I would run the Xerox partition program and see what it says. Some OEM's
require that the bootable partition be #1 and others would call that
partition #4. If you don't mind wiping out the 40mb partition, that would
probably fix it. If not, do a low-level format and then a partition setup.
The important thing is to do it on the mchine it will be used on.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1685 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1788  08-05-88  09:44  (Read 116 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PLUS HARDCARD  Reply to #1737

Tom,

The Xerox partition program says that there isn't a fixed disk in the
system.  With the 1701 error, the system is ignoring the existence of the
controller and drive.  We've got the 40 MB unit in the Compaq semi-portable
and the Xerox user will just have to suffer with limited disk space for a
while longer.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1685 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1687  07-28-88  21:54  (Read 126 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: ALL
subject: HARDWARE FOR SALE

***********************************************************************
*                                                                     *
*                                                                     *
*                         HARDWARE FOR SALE                           *
*                                                                     *
*                                                                     *
***********************************************************************


 1 - 4 X 4416-12 (256K 120NS VIDEO CARD MEMORY SET) ........ $ 20.00 SET
 1 - TALLGRASS TG-3012 (20MB TAPE/12MB HARD DISK) .......... $ 300.00
 1 - EXTERNAL 3.5 INCH 720K DRIVE (WITH CABLE,CASE,CARD) ... $ 150.00
 1 - PACKARD BELL AMBER MONITOR WITH NEW MG-150 CARD ....... $ 125.00
 5 - 12 FOOT, 25 PIN FULL SHIELD EIA EXTENSION CABLES ...... $ 20.00 EACH
 1 - HERCULES COMPATIBLE MONO/GRAPHICS/PRINTER CARD ........ $ 25.00
 1 - MPI 5.25 INCH 720K DRIVE (FULL HEIGHT) ................ $ 50.00
 1 - CERMETEK 1200 BAUD ASYNC/BISYNC HAYES COMPATIBLE MODEM  $ 175.00
 1 - HEWLETT PACKARD 1200 BAUD MODEM (NOT HAYES COMPATIBLE)  $ 50.00
 1 - 1 KVA CONSTANT VOLTAGE/ISOLATION TRANSFORMER ...........$ 200.00

     The four 4416'S are used to expand a video card which did not come
populated with 256K of memory (4X4X16=256).  The chips were purchased for
that purpose, but I bought another card instead.  The Tallgrass is about 3
years old and in good working condition.  The Tallgrass unit will only work
on a 4.77 Mhz PC or XT (or a faster machine switched into the 4.77 Mhz
mode).  Included are 4 - 20MB tapes, the software, the operations manual,
and the technical manual for the unit.  The unit does allow you to back up
from any drive on the system and is very easy to install and use.  It is an
excellent unit for anyone who wants a hard drive, and does not want to
bother having to back up on floppies.  I have been unable to use the
Tallgrass since I switched to an AT.  The external 3.5 inch drive is for
someone who wishes their XT to be 3.5 inch compatible.  It comes with a
real IBM 4 port floppy controller for an XT, and uses the power supply
inside the XT.  The IBM card supports the two internal standard drives with
the standard edge connector.  The Packard Bell is less than 6 months old,
and in excellent condition.  The hercules graphics card is a new diamond
flower MG-150 with printer port, still in the box with unopened software
and manual (I switched to an EGA setup).  The EIA extension cables are
premium quality, full shield cables with all 25 pins.  The Cermetek modem
is an external, fully Hayes compatible, 1200 baud modem, which can run
async or bisync with the flip of a switch. The HP modem is a model 35016A
1200 baud modem.  It does not support autodial, but is a great modem  for
the beginner.

     If you have any questions, please contact me here, or in the private
board section.

                 Keith Beckmann

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1699  07-30-88  15:21  (Read 123 times)
   from: DOUG POUND
     to: ALL
subject: CLONE HARDWARE MILWAUKEE

I have a friend in the Milwaukee area and would like to know the names of
some good Ibm Clone makers. Can I get some help?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1701  07-30-88  16:34  (Read 128 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: ALL
subject: APPLE PRINTER INTERFACE

I have five printer interface cards for an Apple computer, and I have a
problem. The cards are all new and in boxes ,have cables, a software disk,
and instruction manuals. What I don't have is an apple computer to test
them out on; in addition, the cable has 34 pin header sockets( ?, the
female part?) on both ends. They boxes carry a Bell and Howell part
number,but the cards were actually made by a company named Micro
Peripherals, Inc..
The card was intended for use with the Apple II+, Apple IIe, and Franklin
Computer; the printers mentioned are Bell & Howell models P100, p150, and
pp150. The connection to the printer does not follow the Centronics
standard, I've checked. I would appreciate any information on pinouts of
the cable or the wiring of the mentioned printers.
Better yet, if someone in Milwaukee would help me sort out the wiring and
test the little devils, they can have one for their efforts. Yes, I know
its not IBM and MS-DOS, but it does keep me off the streets !
Thanks for your time.
-JTI-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1704  07-30-88  21:45  (Read 132 times)
   from: RONALD ZORKO
     to: ALL
subject: PCXT

I have an IBM PCXT and want to add a controller for 1.2 and 1.44meg
drives. I was told that it would not work because my BIOS was not
resent enough. Can i upgrade to a different BIOS like Pheonix even
though the board is IBM?
HELP!!!!!!!
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1711  07-31-88  06:37  (Read 133 times)
   from: RON OSTROWSKI
     to: RONALD ZORKO (Rcvd)
subject: R: PCXT  Reply to #1704

Ron:

Re your question: The IBM rom chip has a different number of pins comapred
to the clones. BUT if you are sure that the Bios doesn't support a harddisk
etc, RUN, DON"T walk to a magazine store and buy the latest version of
Computer Shopper. The current issue has ads for genuine IBM roms. Of course
you may alos find a supplier for a Phoenix Bios which is available for the
IBM.
                                 zero

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1704 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1713  07-31-88  11:54  (Read 133 times)
   from: RONALD ZORKO
     to: RON OSTROWSKI (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCXT  Reply to #1711

It does support a hard disk. I called  a company that sells this
COMPATII CARD. They said it would work on TRUE BLUE. I,m going to give
it a shot.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1704 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1718  07-31-88  19:46  (Read 131 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: RONALD ZORKO (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCXT  Reply to #1713

Ronald,

I was under the impression that the COMPATICARD was a Floppy controller.
I'll be anxious to find out if it will run a hard drive. Please let me/us
know, OK?

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1704 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1721  07-31-88  22:17  (Read 128 times)
   from: RON OSTROWSKI
     to: RONALD ZORKO (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCXT  Reply to #1713

     cc: NICK KEES

Ron:

I think that Nick Kees knows what Bios date on Pcs or Xts support a hard
drive. Maybe there is another way but does Compati-Card allow you to boot?

To find the date, use Norton's Sysinfo (SI) utility.

                                  zero

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1704 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1738  08-02-88  16:37  (Read 118 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: RONALD ZORKO (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCXT  Reply to #1713

We install 3.5" 1.44mb drives, and I bet it would work in your box. If it
likes hard disks it's probably good enough.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1704 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1748  08-02-88  22:07  (Read 117 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: RON OSTROWSKI (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCXT  Reply to #1721

     cc: RONALD ZORKO

All but the very earliest PCs had the BIOS to support a hard drive.  I
think the date of the first BIOS to support a hard drive was 10/27/82.  I
would bet that any BIOS of that date or later would also support 3.5 inch
drives.

       Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1704 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1768  08-03-88  21:32  (Read 112 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCXT  Reply to #1748

I just helped upgrade a PC with BIOS date of 10/27/82 with a harddrive and
3.5 720k "stiffie" drive.  The mother board dipswitch dealing with # of
diskdrives had to be reset to the XT configuration or the Hard drive would
come up as E instead of C.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1704 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1890  08-12-88  16:32  (Read 121 times)
   from: RONALD ZORKO
     to: RON OSTROWSKI (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCXT  Reply to #1721

I know the date of my Ibm Pc XT Bios. And I know it supports a hard driver.
My Question was is there a Ibm Xt Bios That supports high density
controllers for 1.2 meg drives
Ron

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1704 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1891  08-12-88  21:00  (Read 117 times)
   from: RON OSTROWSKI
     to: RONALD ZORKO (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCXT  Reply to #1890

Ron:

As far as I know, there is no problem using a 1.2 meg drive in an XT

IF you get a high speed controller. I have seen them for as low as $50 but
the normal price is a little higher. And they will support your 360K drive
also. A friend put in a 1.2 meg as drive A>.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1704 reply #9  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1705  07-30-88  23:06  (Read 128 times)
   from: DAN KEMP
     to: ALL
subject: 5.25 DRIVE AND PS/2

Hi. A friend obtained the IBM PS/2 System 50 with standard
equipment of 3.5 A: drive and 30meg C: drive. She also purchased,
separately, a peripheral 5.25 drive B:. The drive B:(360k) came
with a program FIXFORM.EXE designed to "correct certain bugs
which PS/2 has when dealing with a B: add-on". This does not
apparently correct the problem - one cannot successfully format
a 360k disk in drive B: from the C: drive(it formats up to
track 13 and then FREEZES all). If one boots from the A: drive
however - there is no problem formatting drive B:.
   If anyone has a suggestion for correcting this glitch, and
or could just explain the problem, it might save my pard some
trivial agony. Thanks.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1707  07-30-88  23:59  (Read 127 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: DAN KEMP (Rcvd)
subject: R: 5.25 DRIVE AND PS/2  Reply to #1705

 I've seen a similar hangup happen on a PS 2 at a customer site. COMPUTER
SHOPPER recently ran an article on the bugs in the current DOS; if I can
hear:here
-JTI-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1705 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1708  07-31-88  00:04  (Read 128 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: DAN KEMP (Rcvd)
subject: DOS BUGS  Reply to #1707

Sorry, I've got to learn to use that editor. The last line should be that I
will leave a message hear.
-JTI-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1705 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1709  07-31-88  02:20  (Read 131 times)
   from: DAN KEMP
     to: JAMES IRVING (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS BUGS  Reply to #1708

thanks, james. any info will be more.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1705 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1716  07-31-88  18:19  (Read 130 times)
   from: JEFFREY WALLACH
     to: ALL
subject: HARD DISK - TYPE UNKNOWN

I just received a gift of a Full height hard disk which is of unknown type.
Of course, it came with no documentation, configuration, nor info regarding
compatible controller.

It is called a Model 6426-S manufactured by Computer Memories, Inc. I
believe it is 20 meg size but not certain what parameters it uses.

I would also be interested in purchasing a compatible controller card if
anyone has one and knows whether it will work.

Any help is appreciated.

Jeff Wallach
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1717  07-31-88  19:17  (Read 127 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: JEFFREY WALLACH (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DISK - TYPE UNKN  Reply to #1716

I'm resonably shure that Computer Memories Inc. normally uses the trade
name CMI.  CMI does have a hard drive model 6426.  This has to be one of
them.  You are right the capacity is 20 MEG.  I would not pursue using this
drive unless you are absolutely shure it works fine.  CMI drives are well
known for having problems.  I suggest you contact A-1 Peripheral Service,
21900 Plummer Street, Chatsworth, CA 91311  [phone].  Tell them that
you have a CMI 6426-S and you want a controller for it for your computer-
AT XT whatever.  I bought some CMI drives a while back.  These are the
people I ended up going to.  They know the CMI drives.  Mine needed repair
and I could not get them to work with the controller cards I bought.  These
people repaired them.  Later when I couldn't get them to work they told me
their controller would work and it did.  If it wasn't for their technical
support I would never have got them working.  I just looked at their add
and they do list a CMI 6426-S so it is a CMI drive.  Good Luck!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1719  07-31-88  20:04  (Read 125 times)
   from: JEFFREY WALLACH
     to: HAROLD WOODWARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK - TYPE U  Reply to #1717

Thanks for your kind and prompt response. We are already having trouble
runnung this drive in an XT Clone withn Microtek Boardwalk HDC 1000
controller card and all seems hopeless with frequent disk crashes, lost
sectors,etc.

Jeff WAllach

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1720  07-31-88  20:18  (Read 128 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: JEFFREY WALLACH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK - TYPE U  Reply to #1719

I forgot to mention.  It is an MFM type drive.  Don't even think of trying
an RLL controller.  They have a hard enough time with MFM.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1739  08-02-88  16:43  (Read 116 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JEFFREY WALLACH (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DISK - TYPE UNKN  Reply to #1716

The CMI drives have a high flake rate, that is, a lot of them turn up
flakey and unreliable. The 6426S is 4 head, 640 cylinder, write precomp and
reduced write current at cylinder 256. I also have a note in my tech data
that says "wedge servo- do not use on IBM XT controller" and I can't tell
you what that means.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1740  08-02-88  16:45  (Read 117 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JEFFREY WALLACH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK - TYPE U  Reply to #1719

make sure you differentiate between the -S model and the one without.
Different number of cylinder.
s

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1747  08-02-88  21:47  (Read 117 times)
   from: JEFFREY WALLACH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK - TYPE U  Reply to #1740

Tom,
Thanks for your reply. I have done some further investigation into this
drive and discovered that this drive was pulled from an original IBM AT
circa 1984. It even has the original "Manufactured for IBM" plate on the
case. It clearly will not work in my XT with a standard controller or under
Disk Manager. It was sold to a friend of mine from a mail order company
from California as part of a NEW SYSTEM. My friend could not get it to go
in the system (XT) and wanted a half-height instead, so gave the drive to
me.

I'm not sure what I'm going to do with it. ..? nice  paperwight.

Jeff Wallach

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1751  08-03-88  00:18  (Read 119 times)
   from: JEFFREY HOWELL
     to: JEFFREY WALLACH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK - TYPE U  Reply to #1747

JEFFREY,
.     What would you take for the CMI drive (as a paperweight,
that is)?
.                                     JEFFREY

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1756  08-03-88  07:18  (Read 115 times)
   from: JEFFREY WALLACH
     to: JEFFREY HOWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK - TYPE U  Reply to #1751

Right now my friend is so inflammed about being sold a "lemon" drive for a
new XT system, and not even a drive designed for an XT configuration, that
he is demanding replacement for this one with a NEW half-height drive more
in the mainstream of PC (XT) computing. Will let you know if we are still
stuck with it after all is said and done.

Jeff Wallach

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1760  08-03-88  15:23  (Read 116 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JEFFREY WALLACH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK - TYPE U  Reply to #1747

I disagree. You might actually get it to work on an XT. I dunno about that
"wedge servo" stuff, though. Maybe somebody else do.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1774  08-03-88  23:38  (Read 117 times)
   from: JEFFREY HOWELL
     to: JEFFREY WALLACH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK - TYPE U  Reply to #1756

OK - THANKS

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1777  08-04-88  17:28  (Read 116 times)
   from: HYONG BANG
     to: JEFFREY WALLACH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK - TYPE U  Reply to #1756

Would you care to name the guilty party? We all need to stay away from,
and discourage any business with people like that!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1971  08-22-88  06:51  (Read 120 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: HYONG BANG (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK - TYPE U  Reply to #1777

HYONG, JEF, READERS,

       I own two of the CMI 6426 drives and yes they are flaky, but I
haven't crashed them yet. First CMI is no longer in business and all of
their testing equipment was sold to Peripheral Repair Corp. They can be
reached at 818-700-8482, I had one of my cmi's that was opened I sent it in
for repair and what I got back was vertually a brand new drive. Plated
media new circuit board for $165. I am using the drives with the Western
Digital 1002 WX1 controller with the Super Bios and they work pretty well.
Just recently I installed the CMI with the plated media in a AT clone with
the WD 1003 WA3 controller and it runs fine. I park the drive every time I
turn it off and this seems to help. One thing I noticed about the drives if
you run a park program you should hear an audible CLICK when you park the
drive  If you park the drive and don't get a click then the heads aren't
parked properly. Good Luck!

                           Steve Morgan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1716 reply #12  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1727  08-01-88  20:06  (Read 121 times)
   from: TOM PEARSON
     to: ALL
subject: COLOR

     cc: PHIL KATZ

I am trying to use a composite color monitor with a genaric color
card. The card works fine with RGB monitor but will not give me
color out the video rf rca jacks. My card has two rca jacks one
apears to be inverted video. I suspect there is a way to enable
the burst signal which is what I feel is lacking since it displays
16 shades of grey. Anyone know if there is an address I can write
too to enable burst and is this address common to all cards?

-Thanx for any help

                   -Tom
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1729  08-02-88  00:19  (Read 124 times)
   from: PHIL KATZ
     to: TOM PEARSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: COLOR  Reply to #1727

Tom,

I would guess that there would be a switch or jumper on the
CGA card to enable the color burst signal.  Before you go
hacking up the card though, try running the MODE program with

mode CO80

and see if that clears things up.

>Phil>

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1727 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1733  08-02-88  10:26  (Read 117 times)
   from: TOM PEARSON
     to: PHIL KATZ (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COLOR  Reply to #1729

For the record I've tried CO80 I've also run a program called color.com
that switches from the mono card to the color card it works but no color.
I,m going to locate the book that came with it to check about a jumper.

Thank's for the help.

  -Tom

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1727 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1741  08-02-88  16:48  (Read 119 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: TOM PEARSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COLOR  Reply to #1733

Two RCA jacks and a DB-9? Sounds a little like an ATI card, in which case
you need MS.COM or SMS.COM

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1727 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1749  08-02-88  22:22  (Read 117 times)
   from: TOM PEARSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COLOR  Reply to #1741

ms.com + smscom what are these?  Now to top it all of I just
took a color card out of a leading edge that I seen put out color
composite put it in and NO COLOR! I don't get it. I have an ibm
compatible 512k and dtk bios never had a problem with any softwear.
The card I have now is not a leading edge card but another generic
with 1-rca 1-9pin and has ibm rom on it. Is it possible that some
cards don't offer composite color. But I seen this one work hummm...

    -Tom

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1727 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1754  08-03-88  06:45  (Read 113 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PEARSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COLOR  Reply to #1749

Tom,

I think COMPOSITE is the operative word here. Most I've seen don't! That
could well explain why you get no color. If the signals aren't there,
neither is the color.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1727 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1761  08-03-88  15:27  (Read 114 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: TOM PEARSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COLOR  Reply to #1749

MS.COM (mode switch) is for cards that emulate color on monochrome or vice
versa, or for cards that run color or mono monitors at the flick of a bit.
It's for ATI cards, but maybe works on others. If that card has a real IBM
rom on it, I doubt it's anything that advanced. It there a switch on your
processor board for color/mono?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1727 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1772  08-03-88  22:11  (Read 115 times)
   from: TOM PEARSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COLOR  Reply to #1761

It might just be a switch on the mother board since I just put another
one in and no color. Anyone know if the 3.58 burst is derived on the card
or the mother board?

-Tom

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1727 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1845  08-08-88  18:38  (Read 123 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: TOM PEARSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COLOR  Reply to #1772

But I'm pretty sure that color burst for color composit monitors in
generated on-card, not on the motherboard.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1727 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1864  08-09-88  23:22  (Read 124 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COLOR  Reply to #1845

Tom,

My understanding of why IBM chose 4.77 MHz for the PC was to accomodate the
color burst signal.  Doug Severson had to take that into account when
designing the PC-Sprint board.  That's why it's a daughterboard, not a
crystal replacement.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1727 reply #9  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1732  08-02-88  05:08  (Read 118 times)
   from: RUPERT MURPHY
     to: DAN KEMP (Rcvd)
subject: PS/2 DRIVE B:

Dan, I tried to format a disk in drive B: on a PS/2 with
a rom dated 02/13/87. I had no problems at all. Does the
drive work to read tracks above 13 on an old disk ? It does
sound like a hardware problem with the drive.
Murf


---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1849  08-08-88  23:06  (Read 121 times)
   from: DAN KEMP
     to: RUPERT MURPHY (Rcvd)
subject: R: PS/2 DRIVE B:  Reply to #1732

Murf, it seems the problem was one of botched handling of interrupts
caused by the use of AUTOPARK, intended for parking of XT/AT hard drives
but, apparently, not for the PS/2.  I am a TSR fiend and I probably
caused an interrupt-handling overload or sumthin. Anyhow, removal of
this particular TSR removed the problem. Trial and error for all that.
Thanks for the response - Dan (chugging at 4.77 still, me.)

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1732 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1851  08-09-88  05:03  (Read 126 times)
   from: RUPERT MURPHY
     to: DAN KEMP (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PS/2 DRIVE B:  Reply to #1849

Dan, thanks for the line to explain the solution. Happy putering !
Murf

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1732 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1734  08-02-88  11:41  (Read 119 times)
   from: DUANE KONKEL
     to: ALL
subject: HARD DRIVE SPECIALS

*********************************************************
*                                                       *
*               Hard Drive Specials                     *
*                                                       *
*********************************************************
*                                                       *
*       Seagate Technologies                            *
*                                                       *
*       ST-225 bare........................$235.00      *
*       ST-225 w/cont,cables...............$295.00      *
*       ST-238 bare........................$265.00      *
*       ST-238 w/cont,cables...............$335.00      *
*********************************************************
*                                                       *
*       New  Miniscribe August Special Pricing          *
*                                                       *
*       3650 (40 meg mfm) bare.............$329.00      *
*       3675 (60 meg rll) bare.............$375.00      *
*                                                       *
*********************************************************
*                                                       *
*       If you have any questions on these or other     *
*       drives or other configurations, leave a         *
*       private email here or please call               *
*                                                       *
*       DAK TEKnologies                                 *
*       @ 549-1220                                      *
*                                                       *
*********************************************************
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1742  08-02-88  16:50  (Read 118 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DUANE KONKEL
subject: R: HARD DRIVE SPECIALS  Reply to #1734

It might be better to advertise items for sale in the buy/sell conference,
rather than in the hardware conference, unless answering a specific
question.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1734 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1745  08-02-88  19:58  (Read 113 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: ERROR MESSAGES

Tom,

While digging thru my collection of messages from this conference, I ran
across one in which you alluded to other things that cause the "parity
error at ssss:oooo" from the Phoenix bios. Would you care to list a few of
them. I've never encountered it, but who knows. It never hurts to be
prepared just in case. Sure would appreciate the info.

-[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1759  08-03-88  15:22  (Read 112 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: ERROR MESSAGES  Reply to #1745

I'm to not what you refer to, maybe a long treatise I did on meory errors a
while back..? That should be posted on the Mahoney collection. As far as
other causes for parity errors, I guess the obvious ones are bad RAMs
(including bad Parity row RAMs which make the computer lie about where the
actual bad chip is) and bad address decode, or refresh, chips. Lots of
computers today are running at 8 or 10 mhz with parts that can only run
that fast stone cold. Get them a little hot, or a little old, and things
can get flakey. Some programs seem to corrupt things so badly that parity
errors result, although I can't think of a way to cause it from a program.

I have seen, however, power line garbage cause RAM parity errors. A glitch
can come and go so fast that your lights don't even flicker, yet your
computer is in a dimension not of sight or sound, but of crash: The
Twilight Zone. We here on the upper east side have real dirty power. We had
to put in a $1400 UPS to keep our big computer from crashing 4 times a
day.

None of this seems specific to the Phoenix BIOS though. It all applies to
nearly all types. Personally, I'd take the Phoenix bios over this ERSO and
DTK stuff I hear about. Phoenix really seems like the most solid one
around, by far.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1745 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1766  08-03-88  19:50  (Read 111 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ERROR MESSAGES  Reply to #1759

Tom,

I have made about a dozen copies of the description you gave on locating
the offending row or chip. Just want to be sure I don't loose it. The
Message I referred to said, out of context, "The good (?) news is that
other things can cause this message, especially the Phoenix version of the
message".  I yhink it was an earlier version of the message that prompted
you to leave the longer reply. You went on to suggest a 6-8 hour run of
"Ramtest".

I agree with your assessment of the Phoenix bios in general. As long as I
am able to get it that is what I will run.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1745 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1750  08-02-88  22:24  (Read 115 times)
   from: DOUG WILKINS
     to: ALL
subject: ANSWERING MACHINE

I am considering purchasing a PC Board answering machine.  There are three
I know of.  WATSON, THE COMPLETE PC, and BIGMOUTH.  I was wondering if
anybody has any good or bad comments about any of the products.

I am not going to use it for business.  It is for personal use.  However I
will have a need to call certain groups and deliver messages and possibly
obtain responses sometimes.

I will also want to dial my pager and pass
Pass my phone number or
a number the caller leaves that they wish me to call.  I have one of those
digital pagers.

If anyone has any ideas, I would be happy to hear them.

Doug Wilkins - Louisville, KY
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1778  08-04-88  20:23  (Read 112 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: DOUG WILKINS (Rcvd)
subject: R: ANSWERING MACHINE  Reply to #1750

Call 1-800-6-WATSON to hear that card in operation.  That is the
manufactures demo, nice professional voice and all.  Call the Motor Vehicle
department in Milwaukee before hours to hear what they sound like after a
user programs it.

The MVD uses one, they do not manufacture one.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1750 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1752  08-03-88  00:39  (Read 117 times)
   from: ROBERT REED
     to: ALL
subject: EXPANDED MEMORY

I HAVE A TANDY SX 1000, WITH 640K ON THE MOTHERBOARD, A ST 238 SEAGATE
HARDDRIVE, A 2400 B ZOOM MODEM (INTERNAL). HAS ANYONE OUT THERE WENT BEYOND
THE 640K BARRIER ON AN SX AND IF SO WHAT WITH. ALSO IS POSIBLE TO UPGRADE
MY POWER SUPPLY FROM 67W TO A 150 WATT P0WER SUPPLY. SUGGESTIONS GREATLY
APPRECIATED. THANKS!!
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1764  08-03-88  15:43  (Read 117 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: ROBERT REED (Rcvd)
subject: R: EXPANDED MEMORY  Reply to #1752

Tandy and other somewhat off-beat stuff has one typical problem with power
supplies: physical size & mounting concerns. If you can find one that fits
in the case, it should work. Assuming the connectors mate up, of course. If
you have IBM pc compatible slots, you can probably stick 2mb of ram in
there on an EMS card. That can be used for cache, ramdisk, and print
spoolers. And extra spreadsheet space, if you have a recent version of
Lotus 123 or Supercalc.

One more thing: TAKE YOUR (*&^%$#@$%&^%$%&^&^ CAPS LOCK KEY OFF!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1752 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1770  08-03-88  21:39  (Read 110 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: ROBERT REED (Rcvd)
subject: R: EXPANDED MEMORY  Reply to #1752

The physical size of the power supply on the Tandy 1000 prohibits swaping
powerr supplys with a standard XT type.  By looking closely through some of
the surplus adds in Computer Shopper you may find a replacement.  Or f
you're electronically minded you may be able to "gut" an XT type power
supply and place it inside the case to the power supply on the 1000.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1752 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1755  08-03-88  06:49  (Read 113 times)
   from: BILL KISSE
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DRIVE TYPES  Reply to #796

I've been using an ST225 with RLL controller for six months with
no problems (my Miniscribe RLL drive bit the dust an I found an
"old" ST225 in the shop and decided "what the heck").  I originaly
wanted to use the ST225 until the Miniscribe came back from service
but have kinda been interested in seeing how long it would last.
A detailed analysis of the drive reveals NO BAD SECTORS even after
this six months. I'd like to hear your thoughts on this.
Of course, I back up to tape daily.
Thanks for your response....Bill.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1762  08-03-88  15:32  (Read 115 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BILL KISSE (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DRIVE TYPES  Reply to #1755

Ten minutes to seven in the blessed AM? What kind of fanatic are you???!!!
(grin)

DO NOT FAIL FOR EVEN ONE DAY TO BACK UP TO TAPE.

You're lucky. You seem to have found an exceptional drive, one that exceeds
the written specs for read/write timing by a wide margin on all counts.
ST-225 drives that meet and do not exceed Seagates specs for 225's fail
miserably under convential RLL controllers. They usually format up and by
the time you have finished loading DOS and applications, start developing
bad sectors. More and more crop up, until its unusable. Took 2 days for one
I tried and two hours for another.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1755 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1796  08-05-88  22:25  (Read 126 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DRIVE TYPES  Reply to #1762

     cc: BILL KISSE

I have done some extensive research into the area of using the ST-225, with
an RLL controller, and have concluded a few things.  Early generation 225's
will typically not runn RLL consistently.  They can be idenified by
observing the top outer case of the drive.  If it has what looks to be a
button towards the front, near the warning label, it is an early
generation.  The next 2 generation 225's appear to have the same media as
it's brother the 238.  It can be identified, again by looking at the top
cover of the drive.  It will have 7 small holes in a circular pattern.
The second generation is a little harder to identify.  The board must be
removed form the drive, and it must be noted if a crystal exists on the
board next to the 80007-001 chip.  If it does have a crystal, you have a
second generation 225.  This drive will work RLL, but may cause problems
down the road.  Typically you will notice that the drive will get slower
access times when tested with a reliable program such as coretest.  The
third generation 225 does not have a crystal on the board.  It should be
noted that the board is almost identical to the one that comes on a real
238, in fact if you carefully lift the blue plastic cover off the PC board,
it might actually say "CONTROL ST-238".  Be very careful not to bend up the
copper tab that is under the blue plastic cover.  That copper tab is the
only thing keeping static away from your platter.  Most of you will find
that you do have the second generation drive.  But for the chosen few you
may find that Seagate was short of 225 boards one day and substituted the
238 board in its place.  Looking at it from the standpoint of the
manufacturer, would it make sense to produce two physically the same
drives, except that the platters were different?  Of course not.  If they
could put the same platters in either drive, or in fact use the same
module, coming from the same factory in singapore, you could save yourself
a bundle of money.  Just look at the ST-40xx series.  Even the lowly 4026
has the same number of platters as the 4096, even though they are not all
used.  Just a word of caution, I don't recomend using the ST-225 RLL, and
the information that I have given is purely speculative.  I have had many
problems in finding out some of the things that I know.  If I had to do it
over again, I think I start with the Maxtor 1140, and be happy.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1755 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1801  08-06-88  09:26  (Read 117 times)
   from: BILL KISSE
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DRIVE TYPES  Reply to #1796

Thanks for taking the time to respond regarding my questions about
the ST-225's.
Your thoughtfulness is appreciated.
The info was extremely helpful.......Bill.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1755 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1815  08-06-88  22:53  (Read 117 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: BILL KISSE (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DRIVE TYPES  Reply to #1801

I have been running ST225's with RLL since March 1988, no problems, i
bought the drives about 6 months before getting the RLL.  One drive is 3
meg from full the other about 6 meg.  I have had them both  under 1 meg
free and no loss of data, have run optimizers (Norton, PCtools), no
problems.  About the worst that has happened is a slow sector but no loss.
I am running an IBM PC/2, OMTI RLL controller.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1755 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1757  08-03-88  07:56  (Read 115 times)
   from: GARY LIPP
     to: ALL
subject: PRODUCT RECOMMENDATION

I would like to request information regarding a product
which will enable a user to password protect his hard disk.
The program should also be able to prevent access to the
hard disk from booting off of Drive A.  If anybody has any
suggestions please drop me a line.
Thank you.
Gary Lipp
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1765  08-03-88  15:45  (Read 117 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GARY LIPP (Rcvd)
subject: R: PRODUCT RECOMMENDATIO  Reply to #1757

Get on the Mahoney collection and do a scan for "password". It seems to me
I've seen several programs go by that do that.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1757 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1780  08-04-88  20:27  (Read 117 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: GARY LIPP (Rcvd)
subject: R: PRODUCT RECOMMENDATIO  Reply to #1757

PCLOK for a scan in Mahoney...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1757 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1763  08-03-88  15:38  (Read 113 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: SYSOP (Rcvd)
subject: PK361.EXE

Bob, what is PK361.EXE? A Phil Katz update? or somebody elses? Is it really
something you checked out, as the description seems to imply?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1771  08-03-88  21:45  (Read 114 times)
   from: PHIL KATZ
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: PK361.EXE  Reply to #1763

     cc: SYSOP

Tom,

Do a "Who uploaded" that file for PK361.EXE.  It should report
back "Phil Katz".  PK361.EXE in the file section here is legit.

>Phil>

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1763 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1789  08-05-88  12:45  (Read 119 times)
   from: SYSOP
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: PK361.EXE  Reply to #1763

Yes, it is an official upload from Phil Katz himself.
bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1763 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1769  08-03-88  21:37  (Read 110 times)
   from: PAT PFAFFL
     to: ALL
subject: SHADOW RAM

Does shadow RAM simply copy the ROM from the graphics board into RAM to
speed things up, or is there more to it?  Does this work for VGA, or only
EGA?  Any input would be appreciated.
Pat
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1775  08-04-88  06:02  (Read 108 times)
   from: DAVE NELSON
     to: ALL
subject: MDA AND PRINTER PORT

I have an old, no name, far eastern Mono display addapter [adapter  board
which has a printer port hardwired as LPT1. It has been
able to co-exist with my system by turning off the printer port on the
multiffunction card.
I am now using OS/2, and of there are problems with the printer port on the
mono card. Is there a quick and dirty way to disable the printer port as
far as the system is concerned ?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1776  08-04-88  10:46  (Read 109 times)
   from: SCOTT CHAMBERLAIN
     to: ALL
subject: ROM MYSTERY!

For all you hardware geniuses out there, and owners of Leading Edge Model
M's, please see message #25446 in the IBM General area with the same title.
You may save a desperate balding programmer's hair!

Thanks,
   Scott
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1779  08-04-88  20:25  (Read 114 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: HYONG BANG (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SPEED 4 ARC  Reply to #819

Hyong, even if a VAR was on the board, they would be foolish to advertise
blowing hardware out the door. I work for a VAR that got nailed doing it
last year (before my time). Needless to say, the top dogs that were
involved in it are no longer with us. Now if you would like to get into
some used systems (I'm assuming you're interested in S/3x) give me a call.
Prices are going to drop through the floor once we start shipping AS/400's
and you will be able to get hardware at unbelievable prices.

Call me if you're interested. at 784-9099.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1781  08-04-88  21:39  (Read 111 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: ALL
subject: NEC APC

I have a friend who has an NEC APC with 8" disk drives, a 8086 processor
running at 5Mhz using 2.11 MSDOS, with an integral 800x640 8 color monitor.
Is there any practical way to either add or substitute a 5.25 or 3.5" disk
drive to this system to let it use current software?  If so, what about
adding a hard disk?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1786  08-05-88  08:06  (Read 115 times)
   from: STEVEN KEY
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: NEC APC  Reply to #1781

David,

Speaking as a person with 4 8" disk drives on CP/M at home, and having
written my own disk driver software for them, I would say probably not. I
believe that you might POSSIBLY get a 1.2 MB 5 1/4 or 1.44 MB 3 1/2 to work
with DOS 3.2.  The problem with the 360k and 720k drives is that they have
a differnt data speed going to and from the drive.  The problem with the
DOS 2.11 is that it doesn't let you use custom drive tables for different
drives.  It might be possible to use a loadable device driver in the
CONFIG.SYS file to take care of this.

If NEC or some of their dealers can't help you, the chances are that you
could buy a nice AT clone for what it would cost to modify the APC.

Steve

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1781 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1790  08-05-88  19:19  (Read 115 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: STEVEN KEY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEC APC  Reply to #1786

Thanks, Steve.  I suspected this would be the case.  I think the system's
owner just wants to see if it can be done; I believe he's been offered an
AT clone by someone upgrading.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1781 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1782  08-04-88  21:42  (Read 117 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: ALL
subject: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE

     cc: STEVE SHATTUCK
     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     cc: ERIK DUFEK

       I sure could use some of that good old EXECPC advice.

Can any one tell me the what the jumper blocks are for on a Toshiba
"stiffie" drive?  The bottom row selects the drive #, but what does
the top row do?  On my new ND-356T-A, FDD 4603; I found the top block
in the center position.  In that position, I think the density switch
is active.  In the front position, I can format any stiffie to either
1.44mb or .72mb.  The trouble is, my 1.2mb A: quits working.

   I want to be able to format the factory second (excellent
quality but mis-packaged) 3M  HD 1.44mb stiffies that I bought for
$1.25 each.  They do not have the second hole.  Also, my friends like
to HD format the DD stiffies and I want to be able to read them w/o
adding an override switch to my brand new drive.

   What I have done is remove the jumper block completely.  The question
is, what risk am I taking?  ( I am the only person who will ever format
on this drive).  Preliminary testing gives no errors.

                         Any comments are greatly appreciated,
                         Dave Clay

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1783  08-04-88  22:25  (Read 116 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1782

Dave,

I have some docs here for a Toshiba drive, but not that one. If you are
unable toget any info from your request, let me know and I will try to come
up with something. Sorry.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1784  08-04-88  23:05  (Read 114 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1783

Steve,

I'm starting to install the same 3.5" drive as Dave.  My documentation is
also lacking.  If you have a source to some info, I would also be
interested.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1785  08-05-88  06:21  (Read 116 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1784

     cc: DAVE CLAY

Mark and Dave,

Right now the only thing I can offer is a number for Toshiba Tech Support.
They are at 714-583-3139 from 9-5 Pacific time. Or at least they were the
last time I called!

The Main reason I didn't reply to Dave's earlier message is that I wasn't
sure exactly what he was asking. He mentioned the "top row" of jumpers. I
wasn't sure if he meant the A-B jumper for changeline support or just what.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1793  08-05-88  22:04  (Read 119 times)
   from: WILLIAM BIRD
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1782

     cc: MARK TELLIER
     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL

I called Toshiba to get the documentation on the drive
you're asking about.  They sent it without any problem.
First, I ran the drive without the density select jumper
for about a month with no problem.  I assume you can leave
it that way with no problem.  If you want to do it right,
here's the scoop.
.
First the drive that I have has the jumper block vertical
relative to the location of disk mechanism, the documentation
draws the jumper block the other way, like you describe yours.
.
Second, they did no make the jumpers simple like device select
on bottom row, density select top row.  Thats the same thing
I assumed before I got the document but couldn't get it to
work.
.
With the intro, I will try to describe how its supposed to work.
.
.
                     DISK


                 pin    1  2  3  4
                        8  7  6  5


The way the disk was probably shipped you had jumpers between
2 and 3 and between 5 and 6.  The jumper between 5 and 6
specifies the drive select and should not be changed (4-5
is DS1, 5-6 is DS2).  The other jumper (2-3) indicates
density select by media, the thing you don't want.  The
options for this jumper are:
   1-2   Host select reverse logic (not what you want)
   2-3   Density select by media
   2-7   Host select standard logic (this is the one you want)
   7-8   Not documented (your guess is as good as mine)

Hopefully this is clear enough.  If not, let me know and
I will go into it further.
Have a good day....Bill

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1794  08-05-88  22:14  (Read 114 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1785

     cc: DAVE CLAY
     cc: WILLIAM BIRD

Steve,

Thanks.  I called information today and recieved the same information that
Bill has posted.  I've installed the drive and it works with the device
driver supplied with the drive.  It does rigorously follow the media select
switch on the diskette and requires the use of the supplied program to
format a diskette.  I've had no luck in formatting 720K diskettes to 1.44M.
I have tried setting the jumpers in the 2-7 position (as Bill numbered his
jumper block), but no go.

- mwt -

PS.  I think I will cc Bill and Dave on this.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1797  08-05-88  23:24  (Read 115 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1782

Sorry I didn't have any input for you but this thread seems to have most of
the basics covered.  I still own a 4.77 MHz machine and haven't even
thought about installing a 3.5 drive.  My only interest in the subject is
because we have a 1.4Mb drive in our new machine at work and I bought some
disks to use on it.  But the boss won't let me open up his new toy so my
"cheap" floppies will have to remain formatted to 720K.

.....That is unless I could modify the floppies themselves.  They came out
with notchers for single sided floppies, why couldn't the same principle
apply here?  The square is marked but it doesn't appear that it could
easily be punched out.  I thought of using a Dremel tool and grinding it
out but discarded that idea as producing too much plastic dust on the
inside of the disk carrier.  The only other thing I can think of is melting
a hole in the carrier.  No dust and it looks like it won't be too close to
the edge of the disk.  But will a single hole round hole suffice or would
the entire square have to be removed?  Haven't gone any further with the
idea.  Not yet anyway.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1798  08-06-88  00:00  (Read 113 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: ERIK DUFEK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1797

Erik,

I've been thinking along the same line as you are.  I was thinking of
setting up a drill press with a vacuum cleaner and drilling some round
holes in the appropriate location.  I just may experiment with a couple of
diskettes and see what happens.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1800  08-06-88  09:24  (Read 120 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: WILLIAM BIRD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1793

Bill,

Thanks, I'm sure that it will help all of us. As you know, I drew heavily
on information you provided in the past in getting my setup working and the
insight you provided is most appreciated. It has been suggested that
someone capture the thread in "General" regarding the 1.44M drives. If you
have no objection, I'd like to include your earlier messages as well. Any
problem with that?

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1802  08-06-88  09:32  (Read 118 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1794

Mark,

That was my problem. I didn't want to have to resort to a device driver,
especially since the one supplied by the vendor of the drive didn't work! I
now have it running w/o a driver except for DRIVPARM in a modified PC
DOS3.3 and it works with PCTools backup, Formatmaster, and DOS format. That
is all that I really care about. The fact that I can use cheap stiffies
relaibly is really just a fringe benefit.

Glad you got it working. They are nice once you get them set up.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1804  08-06-88  09:43  (Read 120 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: ERIK DUFEK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1797

Erik,

Actually it is quite easy to open the hole safely. You are mostly accurate
about the Dremel making too much dust, but it can be controlled by using a
vaccuum cleaner held close to the disk as the hole is drilled thru. But
even easier is to use a n electric drill at slow speed or a hand drill to
do it, using the vaccuum cleaner here as well. The hole can be round as
long as the pin in the drive will fit easily through it. It need not be
square, just in the right place. Give it a try on one disk and see what
happens.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1816  08-06-88  23:00  (Read 118 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1798

  I'm not sure a vacumn would collect all the dust.  Once the drill went
through the first layer of plastic is where you would have the problem.  I
think the dust would migrate between the layers.  You may not have problems
right away but I think eventually a piece of plastic would migrate to where
it would do some damage.  That's why I thought melting would work better.
I think the only way to find out is to experiment.  Let us know how yours
turns out.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1817  08-06-88  23:05  (Read 116 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1804

  Not having seen the inside of the drive how big is the pin?  About the
size of a pencil lead or the size of a paperclip?  I still think a vacumn
wouldn't be able to do the job sufficently to prevent damage.  Maybe Mark
Tellier will find out.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1819  08-07-88  02:10  (Read 114 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1802

Steve,

Please tell me a little about your set up with the 1.44M drive.  I would
like to dump the device driver if that was an option.  What type of machine
do you have, what did you modify in DOS 3.3, and please clarify the comment
on DRIVPARM; I thought DRIVPARM was only available in MS DOS and not in PC
DOS (as you mentioned in your message).  I look forward to your response.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1823  08-07-88  08:09  (Read 110 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: ERIK DUFEK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1817

Erik,

The pin is about .060 in diameter, but I found a 1/8 or slightly larger bit
worked well. And if the dust generated by drilling the hole with a Dremel
causes any problem, it hasn't happened yet. The first disk I did it to I
used a Dremel and that disk has been formatted and writen to and erased
more than anyone is ever apt to. And it still works great. If the dust
worries you, use a drill press or even a hand drill. PLEASE don't try to
melt a hole through. That WILL give you problems.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #14

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1825  08-07-88  08:40  (Read 112 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1819

Mark,

Great! I hoped someone would catch that. Yes PC-DOS 3.3 had to be patched.
As I recall only one or two bytes needed changing to activate DRIVPARM. The
code was always there, it had just been patched to NOT work. Another great
idea from Big Blue. Anyway, there is a file in Mahoney called "DRIVPRM3" (I
think) which contains the info on how to do it. Try a scan for DRIV and if
it is not there, let me know and I'll u/l it. The guy who developed the
patch is a real friend to all of us who are trying to get 1.4M drives to
function since it will eliminate the driver in MOST cases. At least that
has been my experience. Then, there was an article in that fine technical
publication "Computer Shopper" that described another one byte patch to
IBMBIO.com to change the head settle time in the disk base table which
helped a great deal. It eliminated a lot of "invalid media or track zero
bad" errors which I had suspected all along were not valid errors or not
being accurately described by the message.

My machine is a generic XT clone at 10Mhz. I have put 1.4M drives in
several AT machines and MINE in several AT class machines and have not had
any problems. Setup took care of it on them. But there is a guy that I've
been working with that has had problems on an AT class machine. So it may
not be an easy thing in all AT class machines. But the DRIVPARM patch is
worth the effort. I'm sure that you could pull it off without a hitch. I
suppose if there was some interest I could develop a debug script to do all
the work for both patches.

Hope this helps.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #15

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1829  08-07-88  13:19  (Read 111 times)
   from: WILLIAM BIRD
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1800

I have no problem with the capture.  Let me know when it
has been uploaded and I will look at it.
Have a good day....Bill

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #16

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1831  08-07-88  20:25  (Read 112 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1823

  Two questions.  Where does the hole need to be?  In the center of the
square or in one of the corners.
  Why is melting such a NoNo?  Is the disk too close?  I was thinking of
using a temperature controlled soldering iron to do the dirty work.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #17

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1834  08-07-88  20:57  (Read 112 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: ERIK DUFEK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1831

Erik,

The hole should be in the center of the "ghosted" square. Another way would
be to open the write protect tab on another disk and lay it on top of the
"drillee" and trace the outline with a fine tipped permanent ink felt pen.
Then drill in the center of that.

The big problem with melting a hole through is the plastic that would flow
into the disk cavity while doing the melting. AND the media itself is very
close to the hole. I'm afraid of what the heat might do to the media. But
with a drill bit, the chips are drawn out by the flutes on the bit, so none
will get inside. I used a Dremel with a 3/32 drill bit in it and it worked
sweet. But my Dremel has variable speeds. It's your dime, go fo it!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #18

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1836  08-07-88  21:19  (Read 116 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1834

  Ok you've convinced me for now.  I'll get a variable speed and put a hole
in the vacumn cleaner.  Wait that's not right.  Vacumn up the media detect
hole.  Almost but that's not it either....  Too much time staring at a CRT.
 Those RGB's are dangerous.  I'll experiment on a few and let you know what
happens.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #19

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1838  08-07-88  21:40  (Read 114 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1825

Steve,

Do you remember the issue of Computer Shopper that contained the article
you referenced.  I also subscribe to this technical wonder  (:-). and could
look up the article.

Do you know of any one with Compaq's who have used your DRIVPARM patch with
success????  That's what I have and would be interested in knowing if its
worth the effort.   I understand the Compaq has an upgrade for the BIOS
ROM's for my machine that will allow 1.44M's to boot as the A: drive, but
they want over $100.00 for them.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #20

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1839  08-08-88  06:55  (Read 113 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1838

Mark,

The patch to activate DRIVPARM is contained in a file in Mahoney called
"DRIVPRM3.ARC". The other patch for the disk base table was in the either
July or August Shopper. I can't remember which but one of those. I'll find
it if you can't. Both patches can be done on a 'system' disk and just
sys'ed to your boot HD. If it doesn't do you any good, just sys in another
copy from your DOS original. And if you are using a virus detector, don't
forget to tell it about the changes.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #21

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1848  08-08-88  21:38  (Read 120 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1804

I have an XT clone with the drive controller on a passive backplane
motherboard, which I may or may not be able to disable.  I want to add a
3.5" floppy, but fear the 720k format may not be around as long as the
1.44meg.  I have read much about and experienced problems with 360k disks
from 1.2meg drives; is there a similar problem with 7.20/1.44
read/writeability?  Can I install the Compaticard(?) to run one 360k 5.25"
drive and one 1.44meg 3.5" and still have no problems with 720k stiffies?
Do I need vendor drivers to get 1.44meg with MSDOS3.2?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #22

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1852  08-09-88  07:10  (Read 127 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1848

David,

As far as I know the problem of changing formats in a 1.4M drive does not
exist. At least not in a PROPERLY working 1.4M drive. At least I have not
heard of it, or experienced it with my setup. You will need EITHER DOs3.3
or a device driver to use 1.4M drives at 1.4M and the CompatiCard may be
the way to go. I have heard good things about. My only objection to it is
the price. Far to expensive. But if a guy wanted to read/write a bunch of
exotic CP/M formats, I guess it would be worth it. I don't!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #23

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1857  08-09-88  20:55  (Read 123 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1852

Thanks, Steve.
Things I've heard about DOS3.3 have made me a bit wary.  Where would I get
a device driver for a specific drive, assuming I mailorder it?  Would the
manufacturer or dealer be able to supply it, or is there something on
Mahoney that could be used with DOS3.2?  I'm not eager to sacrifice a slot
for a card that more than double the cost of the single floppy it would be
used with.  I've been trying to follow the 1.44 thread, but so many people
are having different results with different hardware, not to mention
modifying drives and stiffies.(Now if I fold a 8" 1.2meg CP/M floppy into
quarters and trim it just a little...)  Anything you can do to dispell the
confusion is appreciated!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #24

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1860  08-09-88  21:54  (Read 126 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1857

David,

The driver SHOULD be available from the vendor of the drive. If not, there
are several places advertizing them in the Shopper and most of the PC mags
. I have heard of all the problems with DOS 3.3 but have not experienced
any of them. That makes me suspicious, since if anyone is going to happen
to anyone it will be me (a variation on Murphy #4). There is nothing here
that I know of that will work with 3.2, but most of the third party drivers
are advertised as working w/ 3.2. However, buying a driver from the vendor
of the drive does not assure you that it will work with the drive. Use
whatever method is necessary to insure that you can return anything you buy
if it will not work. As an example, early on I bought a drive and a driver
as a package and they would not work. I questioned the vendor and they said
I must have a WD-FOX controller for it to work. I got one of those for
a good price and it still wouldn't work. The vendor then got the whole
thing back and I got my money. The next time, I ordered all the stuff from
another vendor in the same box and it didn't work either! Different drive
make, different driver, same results. I've been at this for nearly a year,
trying to get it going and last month I made it!! I have also done a bit of
"trying" with other hardware with mixed results.

I must admit that things get a little confusing. But when you concider that
two Mitsibishi drives purchased 3 months apart are completely different and
the same holds for Toshiba, you can see how it could. What works with one
won't necessarily work with the next one. It really is fun. Can't wait to
do it again.Most of the current discussion involves trying to get the QD
drives to use media advertised as DD. That is where the modified disks come
in. But if you are willing to spend $3.50+ for a 1.4M QD or HD or whatever
they choose to call it, you should have no real problem  with DOS3.3 and a
compatible combination.

Sorry, but I don't seem to be able to dispell the confusion. I have finally
accepted the confusion.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #25

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1861  08-09-88  22:08  (Read 122 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1860

Is this the new CHAT mode already?  What combination worked, and did it
still require 3.3?  And while I'm tugging your ear, I've been seeing
reviews of VGA cards that seem to indicate that BIOS and register
compatibility have arrived.  I'm using an 8Mhz XT clone, and would a VGA
card with multiscan monitor be hampered by 8088-2 speed?  Assuming ALL
reviews are taken with salt grains, a June issue of Infoworld seemed to say
the Paradise card was a good value, but nothing I've seen talks about speed
while they all seem to test the cards in 386 boxes.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #26

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1867  08-10-88  06:29  (Read 126 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1861

David,

I'm using a Mitsubishi drive and a controller from QIC Research. It is a
DTK product and only runs two drives but they may be mixed. It DOES require
DOS 3.3, but I was using it anyway. This setup works well in anything I
have tried it in.

As for the VGA board, there are a lot of people who can be of more help
than I. I am using EGA, and find it acceptable. May never upgrade. But ALL
the reviews I have seen seem to like the Paradise card. Sorry I can't help
here.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #27

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1873  08-10-88  19:02  (Read 119 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1867

Thanks, Steve.  Maybe I should reconsider 3.3, but first I have to find out
if my integral floppy controller can be disabled.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #28

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1878  08-11-88  15:06  (Read 118 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1848

1. I don't understand why people are so uneasy about device drivers for
3.5" 1.44m drives. Everybody has device drivers, from ANSI.SYS to VDISK.SYS
and my second hard drive doesn't even work without the driver. To answer
your question: YES you need a driver for dos 3.2 or anything less than 3.3.
As to the other question, it depends. Is the NEC 765 floppy controller chip
in  socket or soldered in? Sometimes just yanking that chip will disable
it. Or maybe you can set the switch that controlls the number of floppies
to zero.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #29

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1883  08-11-88  21:27  (Read 119 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1878

Tom,

I have an aversion to device drivers for the 1.4M drives for two important
reasons. First, they eat up useable memory unnecessarily. I've proven that.
Second, I have purchased and returned for credit three of them that didn't
work. One of these came from the same vendor that I purchased the drive
from and they wanted to charge me 40% restocking to prove that the driver
would not work with the drive. That was until I whipped the 'implied
warranty that the product would do something worthwhile' on them. Then they
were only too happy to refund all my money! Hope this helps to explain my
position.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #30

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1892  08-12-88  22:53  (Read 118 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1878

I'm not leeery of device drivers, DOS 3.3 is what bothers me, having heard
reports of bugs; have obtained a copy of Compaq 3.31 to experiment with.  I
will check for the specified NEC 765 chip and ask the manufacturer what
they recommend.  If the chip is there its likely to be soldered like my
8088-2.  I also use a device driver to give me 31meg drives D and E on my
second HD.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #31

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1920  08-16-88  12:29  (Read 119 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1883

We have installed several 1.44mb drives, using device drivers, and our
usual class of customer is quite happy. We don't switch to DOS 3.3 to do
the same thing because 1. its more expensive 2. DOS 3.3 is buggy 3. DOS 3.3
takes more space anyhow.

To each 'is own!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #32

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1922  08-16-88  12:38  (Read 121 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1892

If you can't get the 765 out, see if the switches that determine the number
of floppy drives can ne set to zero. Else you have to pull the board that
has the floppy controller and get other boards to replace its other
functins. I did some cut and solder work on one combo board, and I'm not
anxious to repeat it. Cut the wrong trace, overheat a chip, or make some
other mistake, and it's all over. Besides, every design is different.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #33

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1926  08-16-88  20:38  (Read 129 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1922

I talked to a local rep for the manufacturer, who told me there is an NEC
765, and that I may be able to disable the FDC by pulling the chip; he hads
never done it so he wasn't sure.  In my backplane system, the motherboard
sits in a slot with integral FDC and 640k RAM on a half card in a nother
slot.  I don't want to risk frying the motherboard to disable the FDC, so
I'll try pulling the chip first.  Second sentence is ambiguous; FDC is on
M'board, 640k not.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #34

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1929  08-16-88  23:14  (Read 128 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1920

Tom,

To each, indeed. I find the advantages Dos3.3 far outweigh the reports of
bugs that I have read but never experienced. But I got it to replace Dos3.2
which had a zillion bugs, several of which I did experience. If a guy just
plain doesn't want to uprgrade, I guess the device driver is a good way
out. But, as I said before, I had three of them; two of them HUGE and none
of them worked! That was enough to convince me to look for another way out.
And to me, the CALL batch function was worth the upgrade price if that was
ALL I got.

Perhaps a good topic for a thread would be the reported 'bugs' in Dos3.3...
what do you think?

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #35

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1932  08-17-88  06:57  (Read 126 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1929

     cc: TOM PETERS

Like you I have yet to experience these bugs in DOS 3.3.  And also really
appreciate the ability to CALL other batch files.  What are these bugs?
                           Bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #36

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1934  08-17-88  08:25  (Read 127 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1932

Bob,

Darned if I know. I have read all sorts of reports on 'buggy DOS 3.3' but I
don't remember seeing any listing of what they are. That is why I suggested
a new thread, so you and I and others could find out what kind of evil
lurks there. I really hope that we can get it started. If my data or
system is in mortal danger from using 3.3, I for one would like to know
what to look for. But the reported bugs in 3.2 are very real, I've
experienced several of them myself. Version 3.21 is supposed to fix all of
that, but by the time I got around to that, I had scrapped it for version
3.3.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #37

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1936  08-17-88  16:51  (Read 124 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1926

Pulling the NEC 756 usually doesn't work becuase the addressing/bus
decode/handshake logic is done by ttl chips in the neighborhood of the 765.
I had to cut and solder to keep them from responding to the bus. If they
did, the NEC would never generate the ACK signals and the machine would
lock up.

But go ahead and try it anyhow. You need another floppy controller to try
in its place, nearly any type will do, even a simple 360k 5.25" only type.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #38

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1937  08-17-88  16:54  (Read 126 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1929

Sure, I'd like to know what to look out for with DOS 3.3. I have not heard
any real solid info on DOS 3.3 bugs. I do know that DOS 3.21 is a very
solid release; I have sold over 30 machines with it and no problems.
Version 3.20 was big trouble tho. So yes, a DOS 3.3 thread would be a good
idea. Wanna start one?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #39

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1939  08-17-88  21:34  (Read 129 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1936

Rhanks, Tom, I'll have to see if I can get something or other, the only way
I could see if pulling the chip would work would be if there was some
alternative to the original FDC present.  I believe I saw another message
from you about a 1.44meg drive kit you offer to EXEC-PC users for $225,
what specifically does this include as far as manufacturers, model #s and
so forth?  Are you a vendor or do you work for one?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #40

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1946  08-18-88  14:42  (Read 126 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1939

I work at Stevenson's Office Equipment, 414-964-6330. We sell the 1.44mb
kits installed or as a do-it-yerself. If you buy it without our
installation, the technical assistance we can offer is kinda limited.
The $225 offer is the 1.44mb kit for XT class machines, controller and
drive. The drives are Toshiba, the controllers are WD -FOX cards.

NOTE: that is subject to change. The last info I had from my vbendor is
that the WD -FOX cards are on short allocation, and may be hard to get.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #41

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1948  08-18-88  19:36  (Read 125 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1946

Will the WD-FOX control one 1.44mb 3.5" and two 360kb 5.25" drives?  Would
I have to disable any current FDC?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #42

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1951  08-18-88  22:56  (Read 128 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1946

Hi Tom,

Have you had any experience with the Toshiba drive in Compaq's (with ROM
upgrades / no device drivers)?  I'm finding the Toshiba drive won't work
out of the box in a upgraded Compaq.  Any ideas?

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #43

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1957  08-19-88  16:40  (Read 127 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1948

1. Yes, the WD FOX card will controll a mix of 360k, 720k, 1.44m, and maybe
even 1.2mb drives, but I've never tried more than 2 drives. I'm not sure
how to hook 'em up, but it might work. Two drives is easy. 2. Yes, you must
disable the current floppy controller. If the NEC 765 chip is in a socket,
that can be done, but whether it is or not, it isn't easy. Unless it uses
the same 756 and PAL that kapyro does. Then you just pull the nec 756 and
the PAL. Otherwise, I have some wiring diagrams and instructions I drew
when I did one.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #44

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1958  08-19-88  16:45  (Read 130 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1951

No. Did you say you aren't using the included device driver? Why not? Also,
is this an AT style machine, with CMOS ram and a setup program? If so,
change the drive type for floppy 2. Believe it or not, some machines MUST
have that drive set to 360k 5.25" even tho its a 1.44m 3.5" drive! Some
other machines we used had to have floppy 2 set as a 1.2mb 5.25" because it
uses the same transfer rate.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #45

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1960  08-19-88  20:11  (Read 135 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1957

Tom,

The -FOX board, feature 002 and feature 004 will control 4 drives, two
internal and 2 external thru the rear connector. The older -FOX will work
well with a 1.44m drive on an AT but not too well on an XT, even tho it
should. The new 1002A-FOX with the bios chip option does work well on an XT
as well as an AT. In fact, that is why there is an A-FOX. They had to re-do
the thing to handle the many varied drives that are being sold. I'm told
the new board will work with ANY 1.44M drive, but obviously I haven't tried
it with all of them. But Toshiba and Mitsubishi do work.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #46

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1961  08-19-88  20:15  (Read 136 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1958

Tom,

I have also noticed the situation requiring seting floppy 2 to 5.25". I
suspect that the problem is the way the controller handles pin 34. But that
is a guess on my part. Sure would like to know for sure tho, would make a
number of things a lot easier.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #47

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1963  08-19-88  21:22  (Read 135 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1957

Will this never end?  Arghhhhhh...OK, I'm better now, so please tell me
what a PAL is and how would I identify it.  I'm told the 765 is socketed,
but haven't had time to locate and check it.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #48

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1966  08-20-88  00:34  (Read 138 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1958

Tom,

First, I solved the problem with my Toshiba installation.  I've CC'ed you
in the GENERAL conf.  Second, I didn't like the device driver approach
because:  1) it uses more memory;  2)  the disk drive device drivers seem
to be a bit on the hacked side (implementation wise);  3)  I still needed a
special QFORMAT command (NON DOS) to format a diskette.

Third, the CMOS RAM was set to indicate a 3.5" drive with a diagnostics
diskette from Compaq.  The ROM upgrade to use the 3.5" diskettes prevented
having to fake out the BIOS with 5.25" setting for other type of equipment.
I like things to be designed and maintained with a clean order to them.  I
don't like band-aid patches to "get it to run".  I know, I know, most
people will say if it works, it ain't broke.  I have found out to many
times, that in the long run, clean and ordered is much less trouble.

- mwt -

PS  When the Toshiba was set as a 5.25" drive (360K), it would really
format 360K on a 720K or 1.44M diskette.  Not a concept that my mind would
dream up without some help.


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #49

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1973  08-22-88  12:29  (Read 124 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1963

Um, like I said at the PC-NIC, PALS are numbered according to 3 things, and
they are typically imprinted PAL16L8 or PAL8L8  or even maybe PAL8L16.
There are other characters used besides the L in the middle. Often the PAL
part is omitted. PAL16L8CN is a common one, the CN part meaning "improved"
and "epoxy plastic". Since they are field-programmable, (once) the OEM will
often slap his own label on it so he knows what is was prgrammed for. Most
PALs are 18-pin dips, or 20-pin, same width as a 41256 RAM chip but longer.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #50

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1978  08-22-88  20:58  (Read 125 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1973

Thanx, will search for any of these as soon as I can.  Share water.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1782 reply #51  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1799  08-06-88  04:20  (Read 110 times)
   from: BOB BARRIE
     to: ALL
subject: COMPAQ POWER SUPPLY

ANYONE KNOW IF A HIGHER WATTAGE COMPAQ I POWER SUPPLY EXISTS?  THE ONE THAT
IT COMES WITH HAS PROVEN TO BE TOO LOW POWERED?     BOB
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1806  08-06-88  17:11  (Read 111 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE

     cc: MARK TELLIER

Steve,
    Thanks for the technical support phone # of Toshiba.  Their
documentation was very careful to omit it.  I really dig their "friendly"
remark:  "Toshiba *WILL NOT* accept technical support calls directly from
the end user." on page 4 of the supplement.

    BTW, how about the bundled system driver by Bastech being copy
protected, isn't that a crock?
                               Thanks to all for the help,
                               Dave Clay
.

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1811  08-06-88  20:15  (Read 110 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1806

Dave,

You are right, it IS a crock. But what is worse, it doesn't work! A few
short sessions with an option board will allow all the copies you need,
I've done it many times. Managed to get back to the original 5 installs by
copying and restoring the key to the copy repeatedly. But I finally gave up
on it because it ate some memory and didn't work anyway. The trick for you
is to let Toshiba know that you are not the end user.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1806 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1822  08-07-88  02:42  (Read 108 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1806

     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL

Dave (and Steve),

My Toshiba drive came with software from Franklin Telecommunications.  My
manual also said that Toshiba wouldn't talk to end user's in one place and
in another gave an address to "call" if help was needed.  No phone number
was given.  The telephone company gave me the Toshiba central number and
the operator gave the phone number posted in the previous message, no
questions asked.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1806 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1826  08-07-88  08:43  (Read 106 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1822

Mark,

I'm sure that will help Dave. End user status is not a problem for me, and
they told me NEARLY everything I wanted to know.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1806 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1807  08-06-88  17:15  (Read 110 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: WILLIAM BIRD (Rcvd)
subject: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE

     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     cc: MARK TELLIER
     cc: ERIK DUFEK

Bill,
    Thanks a whole bunch for the data on the Toshiba drive.  You and
the rest of the folks on EXEC-PC really help make "Impossible Dreams"
come true with your expert advice.  I tried your suggested 2-7 jumper
and all works very well.  Both IBM PC-DOS 3.3 and Pctools can format
either HD or DD stiffies to 1.44 mb and both programs format the DD
stiffies to .72 mb.
    The following data is for the benefit of others who may be following
this thread and can use a little extra data.
    Only one of my stiffies has the density hole, but all can be formatted
to 1.44 mb. I have installed the Toshiba in its own little box on top of
my CPU cabinet using the CPU,s internal power supply and the CPU's internal
WD controller.  Preliminary tests indicate very little EMI.  I am not
using any special driver. The Dell D-11 ROM-BOIS picked up the extra drive
just fine.
    After formatting .72 mb stiffies to 1.44 mb, they are very hard
to reformat to the correct density.  I suggest using a big magnet on them
first.  They then format without bad sectors.
    BTW, most of the machines at work have a little extra 3 position switch
wired to the media sensing switch.  One position is for media sensing,
the other positions are for forced .72 mb and forced 1.44 mb. That way,
no messing with drilling of holes and no messing with the cabling is
required.
                              Thanks again for all the help,
                              Dave Clay

.

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1818  08-06-88  23:16  (Read 112 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1807

     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     cc: MARK TELLIER
     cc: WILLIAM BIRD

  The only reason I got into this thread is because the machine at work
uses a 3.5 drive.  But now after using it for awhile I'm considering
getting one for my machine at home.  What kind of machine do you have XT or
AT?  Would I be able to get a 3.5 to format to 1.4Mb using an XT if I went
to DOS 3.3?  As you can tell I really haven't been paying all that much
attention to this thread.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1807 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1824  08-07-88  08:19  (Read 105 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: ERIK DUFEK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1818

Erik,

I have an XT clone and have used a 1.4M drive in it. You will need DOS3.3
or some sort of device driver that will let the drive work with DOS3.2 but
I recommend upgrading. Then you will need a controller that will operate
the drive. It is unlikely that your current floppy controller will work,
unless it is something special.

There is a thread in "general" that has gotten so long I'm surprised we
haven't gotten evicted. There many of the problems and solutions have been
discussed, but that tread is more concerned with one make of drive and one
set of circumstances.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1807 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1830  08-07-88  13:28  (Read 110 times)
   from: WILLIAM BIRD
     to: ERIK DUFEK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1818

I have an IBM version XT using PC DOS 3.3.  The 1.44 meg drive is
connected as drive A.  The only problem that I have is that I have
to boot from the 1.44 meg to get it to work right.  I believe that
that is a problem with PC DOS 3.3.  If you have a choice, the MS
version may work better.  I am looking for PC DOS 4.0 to see if that
helps.  If you want more info, let me know.
Have a good day....Bill

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1807 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1832  08-07-88  20:33  (Read 110 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1824

  Naw, I doubt Bob would evict us.  Might ban us to some nether conference
though.

  If I remember correctly the discussion was on the Toshiba drive.  I also
doubt if my current controller would work.  Looks like I'll have to start
doing a little shopping around in Computer Shopper.  Maybe this is a good
reason to think about an upgrade for the entire system.  That VGA and the
multitasking of the 386 are starting to look real good.  Thanks for the
info.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1807 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1833  08-07-88  20:36  (Read 111 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: WILLIAM BIRD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1830

  Well I've decided to start looking into the price of a 1.44Mb drive since
it will work on my XT.  But then I'll need to update my DOS also.  Maybe
I'll just start looking into a 386.  Thanks for the info.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1807 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1837  08-07-88  21:32  (Read 110 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: ERIK DUFEK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1832

Erik,

Take a look in the Shopper for an outfit called QIC Research. The
controller I have came from them and it works on an XT or an AT class
machine. Or, if money is no object (it IS in my case!) then the 386 does
sound like the way to go. Or we can wait till Nick, Glen, et al get their
386SX board out. That could be REALLY appealing to a guy with no bucks!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1807 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1850  08-08-88  23:42  (Read 120 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1837

  At the moment money is an object.  At least tile I make my first 2 or 3
million.  When I said 386 I should have said 386SX but I couldn't remember
the initials.  When they do come out I suppose I should wait awhile to let
the market shake out the rough stuff and let the price settle.  I'll check
into QIC Research.  I'll also be looking into some sources I've used in the
past.  I probably won't decide on whether to get a new computer or just the
drive for a good 6 months.  Right now I'm car shopping.  There the decision
is whether to buy a new one or a used.  Decisions, decisions!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1807 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1879  08-11-88  15:17  (Read 113 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: ERIK DUFEK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1832

$260 installed in most computers: 1.44mb drive and controller. We include
batch files for formatting.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1807 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1884  08-11-88  23:02  (Read 115 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1879

  How much if I do the installation?  Can I just set the drive parameters
or do I need a special driver?  What do the batch files do beyond calling
FORMAT.COM?

  How about a price for an external 5 1/4 to be connected to a PS/2?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1807 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1921  08-16-88  12:35  (Read 116 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: ERIK DUFEK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MB DISK DRIVE  Reply to #1884

If i understand you questions: 1.44mb kit with controller for XT's: $250
for the general public, $225 for EXEC-pc people. It's less if you have an
AT. The batch files invoke QFORMAT with 2 or 3 options required for the
four common formats on 2 different sizes (5.25 & 3.5"). You could memorize
the parameters and skip the batch files if you want.

DOS 3.3 is supposed to support 1.44mb 3.5 format directly, but people have
reported problems. We typically run DOS 3.21 or similar and use the device
driver. It works pretty good.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1807 reply #10  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1810  08-06-88  20:01  (Read 107 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: ALL
subject: 1.4 MEG DRIVES

  From glancing through these messages, most of you people out there that
have 1.4 MEG drives have the Toshiba.  I am considering buying one.  I
would like to make shure I get one that I can format double sided disks to
1.4 Meg.  Reading the responses it looks like the Toshiba can do this for
me, is this correct?  Anyone know of any other drive that will do this?  If
I may suggest, I believe if you use a single hole hole punch for "loose
leaf" binders I beleive that will work to make a clean hole if you muscle
it.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1880  08-11-88  15:20  (Read 113 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: HAROLD WOODWARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.4 MEG DRIVES  Reply to #1810

I doubt you could punch a hole thru all that plastic on a 3.5" stiffy with
a paper punch. Most won't open up big enough to get the disk into its maw.
Even if it could, you'd likely mangle the shell so bad it would be useless.
Besides. the hole is WAY too big.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1810 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1893  08-13-88  06:50  (Read 115 times)
   from: HAROLD WOODWARD
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 MEG DRIVES  Reply to #1880

Thanks for the info.  I'll try it tonight and see what happens.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1810 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1813  08-06-88  20:57  (Read 112 times)
   from: GEORGE BARTI
     to: ALL
subject: HELP WITH COMPAQ VGA CAR

ANYONE WITH A COMPAQ VGA CARD PLEASE LEAVE ME A MESSAGE AND I WILL GET BACK
TO YOU WITH A MORE DETAILED REQUEST.
                                        THANKS
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1814  08-06-88  21:32  (Read 113 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: GEORGE BARTI (Rcvd)
subject: R: HELP WITH COMPAQ VGA  Reply to #1813

George,

I have a Compaq VGA but I will reply to future requests only if you turn
the caps lock key off.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1813 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1840  08-08-88  07:27  (Read 110 times)
   from: NEIL WOOD
     to: ALL
subject: 1.4 ON 720K CONTROLLER

I know the high density drives (1.2 and 1.44M) require a special controller
and I presume that this is because the disk run at different speeds. But
what about those of us who have built in controllers that only drive 360k's
and 720k's. Do we have an option. Any comments or suggestions would
appreciated.
Thanks Neil Wood
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1846  08-08-88  20:19  (Read 115 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: NEIL WOOD (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.4 ON 720K CONTROLLE  Reply to #1840

Neil,

Hope someone can answer that one! I've been wondering about that myself. I
assume that the onboard controller would have to be disabled somehow. This
is NOT easy to do unless some provision is made for it by the board
manufacturer. Suggest you leave a note for Doug Severson. If anyone can
tell you, he can.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1840 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1881  08-11-88  15:22  (Read 116 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: NEIL WOOD (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.4 ON 720K CONTROLLE  Reply to #1840

I have disabled the floppy controller part of a multifunction board, with
difficulty, but it is reliable and leaves the other finctions untouched. If
the NEC 765 is socketed, and also some of the address decode and other
chips, it should be possible.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1840 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1882  08-11-88  15:49  (Read 115 times)
   from: NEIL WOOD
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 ON 720K CONTRO  Reply to #1881

Don't know if there is a NEC 765 con the mother board (where the controller
is) but will check. At any rate the only socketed chips are the BIOS and
CPU. This is not a big issue with me but it seems like an area where someo
ne with some electronic smarts could make some money. Perhaps a small
daughterboard like device the plugs into the edge connector of the drive
and essentially partitions the 1.44M into two 720K jobs.
Thanks for the response anyway>
Neil

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1840 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1919  08-16-88  12:26  (Read 115 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: NEIL WOOD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4 ON 720K CONTRO  Reply to #1882

There is no way to partition a 1.44mb drive into two logical 720k pieces
unless you can read the 1.44mb format. THIS IS NOT A DOS LIMITATION
PROBLEM! Understand this, the 1.44mb format is PHYSICALLY different from
the 720k format, as the 1.2mb 5.25" format is from the 360k format.
Remember the CP/M days? Those of us with Kaypro II machines wanted Kaypro
IV models because they had double density drives. Oops, bad analogy, the
issue there was number of sides. But you get the idea. The transfer rate os
wrong for 1.44mb drives on the old controllers. You can't get there from
here.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1840 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1853  08-09-88  07:16  (Read 122 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: DOS 3.3 PATCH

Mark,

The patch you are looking for is on page 310 of the August shopper. The
article also has a few other neat patches, like "ECHO<sp><sp." to get a
blank line, etc. I didn't use them, but the disk base thing is handy. I
have been searching thru IBMBIO and IBMDOS for about a year and wasn't able
to find it. Sure thank the guy who did!

-[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1854  08-09-88  07:35  (Read 119 times)
   from: NEIL WOOD
     to: DOUG SEVERSON (Rcvd)
subject: 1.4M ON 720K CONTROLLER

     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL

I know the high density drives (1.2 and 1.44M) require a special controller
and I presume that this is because the disk run at different speeds. But
what about those of us who have built in controllers that only drive 360k's
and 720k's. Do we have an option. Any comments or suggestions would
appreciated.
This is a copy of a memo I posted to ALL. Steve M. replied and suggested I
I ask you. The integral controller seemed like a good idea when I bought
the machine, but now I'm not so sure. The documentation makes no mention
about being able to disable the controller. Maybe someone will develope a
1.4m drive with the necessary circuitry internal to it to allow 1.4m
operation on a conventional controller.
Neil Wood
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1862  08-09-88  22:28  (Read 117 times)
   from: DOUG SEVERSON
     to: NEIL WOOD (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.4M ON 720K CONTROLL  Reply to #1854

Other than changing the controller to something like the "compticard" -
which can suposedly handle any mixture of floppy types - I don't know of
any way out of your delemma.
Doug

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1854 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1869  08-10-88  08:19  (Read 117 times)
   from: NEIL WOOD
     to: DOUG SEVERSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.4M ON 720K CONTR  Reply to #1862

Thanks, thats what I was afraid of.
neil

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1854 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1856  08-09-88  16:48  (Read 122 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: ALL
subject: MATH CHIP SPEED

     cc: PHIL KATZ
     cc: DOUG SEVERSON

I have this strange 80286 based machine, with an XT (8 bit) bus. One of the
shareware 80287 speed checkers says that the 80287 in it runs at about 3.9
mHz or so, despite the machine's 8 mHz clock speed.

Here's the big question: For AT type machines in general, what speed 80287
do I need to pay for? I now have to get an 80287 for a 16 mHz machine. Do I
have to pay for a 16 mhz math chip? Will it really be run that fast? I
don't fancy paying for all that speed if the computer will only push the
math chip to 10 mHz.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1863  08-09-88  22:39  (Read 120 times)
   from: DOUG SEVERSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: MATH CHIP SPEED  Reply to #1856

In 8088 based machines, the 8087 MUST run off the exact same clock as the
8088, so what speed 8087 you need is easy to figure out. The 80287 however,
can run off a completely  different clock than the 80287 - to complicate
things even more, the 80287 can be set via a pin to use the incoming clock
directly or divide it by two. Just to save money, most AT clones seem to
just feed the 287  with the processors clock and set it to divide by 2 -
which seems to be your case. With some of the newer 286's running at 12 mhz
& up, I would doubt that they would use the processors fastest speed clock,
but rather the lower speed that most can switch back to. The best thing to
do is to measure the 287's clock with a 'scope or freq  counter.
Doug

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1856 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1865  08-09-88  23:24  (Read 118 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: DOUG SEVERSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MATH CHIP SPEED  Reply to #1863

The 8088 based machine has the clock of the 8087 tied to the clock of the
8088.  Since the clock is common to both chips a 10Mhz motherboard runs the
8087 at 10Mhz also.  The clock is typically generated from a 8284 which is
a divide by 3 clock generator for the 808X processor line.  The crystal
feeding into the 8284 will be 3 time higher than the frequency of the clock
which is driving the 8088.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1856 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1866  08-10-88  02:19  (Read 116 times)
   from: DOUG SEVERSON
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MATH CHIP SPEED  Reply to #1865

Correct - I designed my first 8086 based system about 7 or 8 years ago -
back when the fastest 8087 was 5 mhz.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1856 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1868  08-10-88  07:52  (Read 116 times)
   from: STEVEN KEY
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: MATH CHIP SPEED  Reply to #1856

Tom,

I don't have any thoughts on your '87 speed, but I am interested in your 8
bit '286 system. Is it a replacement motherboard like the Bullet 286 or
someting like that? Is it a plug in accelerator card?  I've been thinking
about going the Bullet route, and would like to hear from some who have
done it.

Steve

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1856 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1871  08-10-88  15:18  (Read 118 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DOUG SEVERSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MATH CHIP SPEED  Reply to #1863

Thanks for your informed reply. Could you expand on a few things for me and
everybody else who cares?

1. Can any 80287, even a 8 mhz one, handle an incoming clock up to twice
its rated freq, provided its pinned to divide by two? I guess I wonder if
the flipflop that does the /2 in an 8mhz 80287 can cope reliably with a
16mhz clock. Is that designed in?

2. Switchable speed processors in particular and PC/XT/AT type machines
in general must have a heck of a lot of clock signals floating around
inside. Is it true that all of these are generated separately in some
machines? Processor clock, clocks for the cards in the expansion slots,
color burst for composit video, clock from which to generate baud rates,
clocks for math coprocessors? What's the common arrangement for XT's and
also for AT's- One master clock from which everthing else is derived?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1856 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1872  08-10-88  15:20  (Read 112 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: STEVEN KEY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MATH CHIP SPEED  Reply to #1868

It's not a Bullet ;286 (whatever that is) or any sort of replacement MB.
It's an original ITT XTRA/XP. It was, at the time, a cheaper faster
alternative to the IBM PC/AT. That's no longer true of course.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1856 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1877  08-10-88  23:02  (Read 111 times)
   from: DOUG SEVERSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MATH CHIP SPEED  Reply to #1871

Tom,
I gave you some slightly incorrect info - the 287 can be set to use the
incomming clock directly or divide it by 3, not 2 as my faulty memory gave
me. That relates to your first question. If you set the 287 to divide by 3,
the clock can't be quite 3 times the rated speed - if you look at the 287
spec sheet for clock period for the 8 mhz version, it gives a min period of
125 ns as expected for an 8 mhz part when the clock is direct. When divided
by three, the min period is 50 ns., not the 42 you'd expect.

Older designs tended to use the least number of crystals possible, adding
another crystal only when you couldn't derive a desired frequency off an
existing one. That's why so many older machines like the PC run the
processor at seemingly odd rates - the processor speed was usually derived
from the video. In those days, that tended to reduce costs, not only by
eliminating crystals (very expensive then), but also reduced synch
circuitry needed to interface to the video, since both used the same
timebase. These days, crystals are cheap and VLSI eliminates the worry need
reduce chip count. Also, the use of multiple, local crystals reduces the
total path lengths that clock signals have to travel, which is virtually
necessary to meet FCC EMI specs.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1856 reply #7  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1875  08-10-88  21:33  (Read 114 times)
   from: DALE REID
     to: STEVE SHATTUCK (Rcvd)
subject: 1.44 DRIVES

Steve... I have been following your discussion with some interest.   YOu
were of help to me earlier in the evolution of 1.44's when I was trying
to get mine up and running.  ISN"T IT FRUSTRATING to NOT be able to get
reliable information on any attempt at a standard?  I spent countless time
on the phone to Western Digital and Adaptac TRYING, PLEADING to get a
programmers manual to find out just what the data lines, pin-outs and
register designations would do.  Invariably I got the answer that there
were manuals, but they were for INTERNAL use only, and the general
public couldn't get ahold of them.  The local reps were intially helpful
in telling me they could be of service, but eventually they came up with
nothing, too.  I really would like to know WHY a jumper on a drive does
what it does.  What does pin #34 do on the back of a drive , on the edge
connector.  HOW does the controller interpret that?  Why is it that the
early Teac 1.44 drives would not give a whit about whether or not thee
was a hole in the disk case and just go ahead and put 1.44 on the floppy,
and the new ones now have a sense switch to detect the difference.  How
does DOS or the BIOS sense the type of drive out there?  I know pin 34
must have something to do with it, but how?  My AMI BIOS needs me to tell
it if the high density drive is a 3.5" or 5.25", and then the controller
seems to get the message as to whether or not a 1.44 or 720 is in place.
The most configurable drive I have found so far is the Mitsubishi 1.44.
It has pins that can tell it that it is either a 720 or a 1.44.  You also
can disable or enable the little sense switch that asks if the inserted
disk is a HD or a regular.  The nice thing about this is that if you take
a bit of wire and a switch or two, you can make it LOOK almost like any
thing.  My TEAC frustrated me so much (and my backup programs, and my
format programs) that I finally took a bit of wire, a hot soldering pen,
and lifted the soldered on terminal of the sense switch so I can now
controll
the drive from my front panel.  But as things get smaller and smallerl
and more an more surface mount wave soldering is done, that modification
is more risky and dangerous.  Certainly the information MUST be out there
somewhere.  How else could Gibson write SpinRite?  How can PCTOOLS get
PCBACKUP or FASTBACK to work?  How do the guys that write the device
drivers that we seek so desparately come up with the right addresses or
registers to write to?  The libraries are not repleat with info on this
subject.  Does anyone know of a techinical reference that makes this
all so clear?  I agree with you, I hate device drivers when something
could be included with the original BIOS or DOS.  Apart from looking for
an intermittant memory error, the most time , the most frustrating time,
I have spent with this hobby/work, is trying to get the (*&(%$^%#  3.5"
drives to work.  Even with a 16 bit controller card that is in a 386
machine with the latest BIOS, I have a kludged panel with a user installed
switch on the front panel.  By the way, I cant get a 1.2 5.25" floppy to
read on a 360 drive. Ever.  Does anyone have experinece with the COPYPCAT
or whatever program that lists for $79  that says it will write two tracks
onto a 360 to make it readable?  Has anyone seen a Public Domain program
that does this for a lot less?     Dale
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2005  08-24-88  18:14  (Read 133 times)
   from: STEVE SHATTUCK
     to: DALE REID (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.44 DRIVES  Reply to #1875

Dale,
     The 1.2 on a 360 drive is probably the width of the written track
rather than anything you are doing.  The 1.2 drive writes a track about 48%
as wide as the 360 drive.  Thus the signal gathered by the 360 drive is
inadequate and probably mixed with noise in the area around the track that
is not erased by the heads on a 1.2 drive.  Some combinations work and some
do not.  It doesn't even seem to be consistent within drives of the same
brand.
                                       Steve

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1875 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1876  08-10-88  22:26  (Read 112 times)
   from: RICHARD AKESON
     to: RON OSTROWSKI (Rcvd)
subject: C/SHOPPER & ROMS

Ron,

I happened across a message of yours to Ron Zorko re: Genuine IBM ROMS
advertised in Computer Shopper Magazine.  I was recently unable to up the
speed on one of my ATs because of the "speed trap" rom it contains.

I regret the imposition, but do you think you could find that ad and post
the address/phone here.  I'd sure appreciate it.

Thanks.

-RCA-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1888  08-12-88  05:17  (Read 116 times)
   from: RON OSTROWSKI
     to: RICHARD AKESON (Rcvd)
subject: R: C/SHOPPER & ROMS  Reply to #1876

RCA:

Re your request:" I happened across a message of yours to Ron Zorko re:
Genuine IBM ROMS advertised in Computer Shopper Magazine.  I was
recently unable to up the speed on one of my ATs because of the "speed
trap" rom it contains".

I haven't looked for Rom chips for ATs. The question was Roms for PCs so
that they could use harddrives. But they may have chips for ATs also.
HI-TECH Electronics, 216-951-1884, $25 each, 16 for $15 each -hard drive
compatible bios for IBM Pcs. 7686 St Clair C, Mentor, Ohio 44060.

There are other ads for Phoenix rom chips for AT class machines. Let me
know if you want those addresses.

                                          zero


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1876 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1885  08-11-88  23:09  (Read 118 times)
   from: GUY HUSSUSSIAN
     to: ALL
subject: PC- HARD DISK

 I am planning on installing a hard disk on my IBM-PC and am wandering if
there are any hardware limitations on having one. (Besides having to
replace the power supply).  The model I Have is a IBM-PC model 5150.

 Any help would be appreciated.

                   Thanks,

                             GUY
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1889  08-12-88  07:25  (Read 116 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: GUY HUSSUSSIAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: PC- HARD DISK  Reply to #1885

Make sure your BIOS is the latest version, your chassis may have a "B"
stamped on the back.  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1885 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1887  08-12-88  02:38  (Read 120 times)
   from: ROD DODD
     to: ALL
subject: WHICH 386 ?

I am looking to invest in a 386 system. Can anyone give me their feedback
on  which systems to seriously consider. I am planning to remove my ST-251
and EGA card from an existing system, so I basically need the 386 box
with a floppy hard disk controller.
Thanks for any input,
 Rod
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1896  08-13-88  21:46  (Read 111 times)
   from: RUDY UNDERKOFLER
     to: ALL
subject: PARITY CHECK ERROR

I have a parity check error which appears at times.  How can I determine
the faulty chip so it can be replaced on my IBM PC-XT.  Appreciate the info
from anyone who can advise.  Thanks.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1899  08-13-88  23:43  (Read 114 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: RUDY UNDERKOFLER
subject: R: PARITY CHECK ERROR  Reply to #1896

Write down the error number and let us know that bit of information.  Soome
Someone here should be able to tell you which chip is the culprit once we
have the error number.

    Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1896 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1901  08-14-88  16:05  (Read 119 times)
   from: DERRICK NORRIS
     to: ALL
subject: HARD DISK PROBLEM

I am having a problem with my Seagate ST-277R disk drive.  I just finished
building an AT compatible consisting of a 16 MHz 80286 motherboard made by
Tanny Computer Inc. (ATS-20), a Western Digital RA2 controller, EGA by
Boca, a Teac 1.2 meg 5-1/4" floppy, and the ST-277.

No matter what I try, Disk Manager (version 3.20) will not format my drive
to 26 sectors per track.  It always gives me "Unrecoverable I/O Error" at
head 4 of the first cylinder of my write/read partition.  After exiting, I
cannot access this drive:  I get a General Failure Error.  My ROM Bios does
not support 26 sectors per track, but Disk Manager is supposed to override
this.  I have Phoenix Bios Version 3.10 00, bios date 01/15/88.

Until I get this figured out, I have the drive formatted to 17 sectors per
track (the exact parameters for an ST-251 [820 cylinders, 6 heads]:  maybe
a 277R is a 251 in disguise?).  This gives me 40 megs out of the 65 I paid
for.  Any help would be eternally appreciated.  If anyone may have a hint,
but needs more information, just let me know.

By the way, I called the On Track BBS and downloaded their bulletin
describing how to format on an RA2 controller.  It does not work for me.

Thanks to anyone in advance.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1907  08-15-88  07:36  (Read 118 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: DERRICK NORRIS (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DISK PROBLEM  Reply to #1901

The 277R IS a 251 in disguise.  The RA@ is a weird controller.  Regardless
of what you tell Disk Manager, any DOS partition made on the RA@ will
probably be only 17 sectors per track.... Make a small dos partition and
then ther rest of the disk write/read partition(s). you will find that the
w/r partitions are indeed using 26 sectors per track.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1901 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1911  08-15-88  21:39  (Read 114 times)
   from: DERRICK NORRIS
     to: JOHN REDFORD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK PROBLEM  Reply to #1907

John, thanks for your reply.

I found out from Ontrack Systems, the makers of Disk Manager, that my RA2
card is designated F001, which means it operates in "translate mode only."
What this means is that the disk controller ignores all information sent to
it by Disk Manager, and reads only the ROM BIOS drive table on my
motherboard.  Therefore, I can only access 17 sectors per track.  (The RA2
supplies "ghost sectors" to itself in order to access the drive as 17
sectors).

I have left a message on Ontrack's BBS asking about their SUPERPROMS.  They
supposedly have a drive table that holds 255 drives.  I may be able to
solve my problem using this.

Again, thanks for the reply.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1901 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1924  08-16-88  18:10  (Read 120 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: DERRICK NORRIS (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK PROBLEM  Reply to #1911

Probably not, with the f001 mod.  you really wanted the F000 version of the
RA2 controller.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1901 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1902  08-14-88  16:14  (Read 114 times)
   from: TOM CANTARINE
     to: ROD DODD (Rcvd)
subject: #1887

  I Use an Everex Step386/20 with 4 meg of RAM.  The system was shipped
with a 1:1 controller.  Maxi-Swith Keyboard, Everex I/O, AMI BIOS.
Everything runs on it, and runs very well indeed!  Can't praise the
machine too highly.  I added a Paradise 480 EGA, Maxtor 70Meg 28ms
Incomm internal 2400 Bps modem, Mouse Systems Mouse, etc.  Running
Windows 386, QEMM 386.  Everything is flawless.  No idea what they
sell the system for over the counter.  My company is a dealer for the
machine, which really doesn't affect my view of the quality of the
equipment.
  Only problem, which QEMM solved, EVEREX at that time (April) did
not have a memory manager as part of the system.
  You simply can't go wrong with this machine.  Fast (4.91 MIPS) faster
than all the 20 mhz machines on the market, 5 device bays, etc.


---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1903  08-14-88  19:33  (Read 115 times)
   from: LEE BREGER
     to: ALL
subject: PCTOOLS FORMAT

I am using pctools deluxe v4.11 to try and format 3 1/2 disks at both 720
and 1.44 I have been getting error messages when attempting to do so.  Does
anyone know of any bugs with this part of pctools?  The computer is a 286
clone with a 1.2 and the 1.44 drive.  I haven't had any problems with the 5
1/4 drive.
Does this sound like a hardware problem or software.  Using the dos format
command seems to work ok.  Any help would be appreciated.
Lee
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1906  08-15-88  00:05  (Read 117 times)
   from: DAVE PINGEL
     to: LEE BREGER (Rcvd)
subject: R: PCTOOLS FORMAT  Reply to #1903

Any time you have a problem with Central Point software it is a good idea
to call their help line.  If they are aware of any problems they will tell
you and ship you an update with the problem corrected.
Dave

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1903 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1931  08-17-88  06:54  (Read 120 times)
   from: LEE BREGER
     to: DAVE PINGEL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCTOOLS FORMAT  Reply to #1906

Thanks for the information Dave.  I haven't heard of any problems by other
people, but it has consistently not been able to format and/or read my 3
1/2 hd drive.  It doesn't happen every time, but about ever third time.  Is
their help line number the same as the one on back of their doc
503-244-5782?  I will give them a call.
Thanks again,
Lee

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1903 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1935  08-17-88  09:36  (Read 116 times)
   from: DAVE PINGEL
     to: LEE BREGER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCTOOLS FORMAT  Reply to #1931

That number agrees with the number I have.  Good luck with your problem.
The consultants at Central Point are usually VERY helpful.
Dave

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1903 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1940  08-17-88  23:46  (Read 117 times)
   from: LEE BREGER
     to: DAVE PINGEL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PCTOOLS FORMAT  Reply to #1935

Thanks again Dave, I'll give them a call tomorrow.  I'll drop you a message
with what I find out.
Lee

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1903 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1904  08-14-88  19:44  (Read 115 times)
   from: CHARLES MCDOUGAL
     to: ALL
subject: 1.2 FORMAT

I hope someone can help me with this problem.  I have an AT/286 with a WD 10
03-WA2 controller.  I had a Miniscribe 6053, a 1.2mb floppy (a:) and a 360kb
 floppy (b:).  The drive was formatted with OnTrack software as 2 22mb drive
s, c: and d:.  All worked well.

I recently added another drive, a 251-1, formatted as 2 22mb drives, e: and
 f:.  I also upgraded to Phoenix AT BIOS 3.07, up from 2.01.  Everything see
med to work ok also, until today.  I tried to format some disks in the 1.2mb
 drive and could not.  I get the message "Invalid Media or Bad track 0 - Dis
k unusable".  After that I cannot format the disk at all, any way nor read i
t if it was good.  I can format 360kb disks using the /4 parameter on the 1.
2 drive.  This has me puzzled!  Could it be something wrong with the Bios?

Any help would be much appreciated.  Thanks!

=CM=

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1905  08-14-88  23:40  (Read 114 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: CHARLES MCDOUGAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.2 FORMAT  Reply to #1904

Try this once.  Try to format the disk and when it comes up with the error
message it will ask you if you want to format again, before the drive ready
light goes off, type in "Y" and enter to get right back into the format.  I
have had the exact same problem ever since I got my AT, and have narrowed
it down to a timing problem, I think from my hard disk controller.  I tried
a different motherboard, floppy controller, floppies, power supply, and no
difference.  It seems like something doesn't wait long enough when it tries
to format.  The error message pops up right away when I start the format,
and in other machines that I have looked at it actually hesitates when
trying to fromat track zero.  Hope this helps.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1904 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1908  08-15-88  08:25  (Read 113 times)
   from: DON ELLIOTT
     to: ALL
subject: SEAGATE 251-1

I have seen ads that allege to supply a Seagate 251-1 drive into an XT.
Does anyone out there have experience with that configuration?
Thanks in advance.
Don Elliott
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1913  08-15-88  22:35  (Read 114 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DON ELLIOTT (Rcvd)
subject: R: SEAGATE 251-1  Reply to #1908

There is no reason that a Seagate ST251-1 shouldn't work in an XT.  The
ST251 is an MFM drive and, with partitioning software should yield 40+ megs
with any normal controller that would be found in an XT.

        Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1908 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1917  08-16-88  08:13  (Read 111 times)
   from: DON ELLIOTT
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SEAGATE 251-1  Reply to #1913

thanks.  the slightly higher speed might help out in some applications
and the greater capacity looks attractive.
next question:  can i keep my hard card in the system with the new disk
and controller???  it is alleged around here that the bus arbitrates down
the rows, so that one can use two controllers.  That would be neat!
regards.
don elliott

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1908 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1928  08-16-88  23:00  (Read 121 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DON ELLIOTT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: SEAGATE 251-1  Reply to #1917

I have no idea whether "the bus arbitrates down the rows" or not, but I do
know that almost any controller you put in your machine is going to want to
use the same interrupts as every other controller, and so dual controllers
won't work.  Couldn't the hard card controller be used, or is it missing a
second place to connect a data (20 pin) cable or is it an RLL controller?
You will really want to use the same controller for both drives unless the
hard card won't allow that.

        Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1908 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1909  08-15-88  20:18  (Read 112 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: CHARLES MCDOUGAL (Rcvd)
subject: 1.2 FORMAT

Charles
       Just a wild guess, but try this one.
First go to C:   Do not try to format A: while it is the default drive.
Then give:   FORMAT A:
       That may be helpfull, maybe not. It is the best I can think of
       at the moment.            Good Luck
                                 Dave Clay
.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1910  08-15-88  20:55  (Read 111 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: ALL
subject: ST238 IN AT

Does anyone know what the drive type is for a ST238 in an AT when it
formats to 940 cylinders/ 16 sectros? Or do you just use 615x26, which is
what I'm told it really is?

-[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1914  08-15-88  22:40  (Read 115 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: ST238 IN AT  Reply to #1910

Steve,

      The ST238 is an RLL drive, and formats to 30 megs only with an RLL
controller.  IF you have an RLL controller, you will get 25 sectors per
track and 30 megs.  Otherwise you will get 17 sectors per track and 20
megs.  But in either case, you have a drive that has 4 heads and 615
cylinders.  No amount of fooling with the drive type will make a difference
as to the number of heads or cylinders.

      Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1910 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1918  08-16-88  08:25  (Read 116 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ST238 IN AT  Reply to #1914

Nick,

That is what I thought till I installed it in an XT. I am using an RLL
controller (WD-1002-27X). Imagine my surprise when I did a format and the
cylinder numbers kept going right past 615, all the way out to 940! The
BIOS does some fancy conversion of the cylinder numbers so it will work
with software (caches, etc.) that won't recognise 26 sectors. The number of
tracks/sectors really is 615/26 but they are renumbered to appear to be
940/17. Simple, huh? My problem is what do I tell setup, and what if the
table doesn't include an entry for 940/17? BTW, I have stayed with this
BIOS because the last RLL controller I had (WD) that formatted 615/26 ate
two drives in four days. This setup has lasted over a year with no problems
at all. Maybe I'm just superstitous, but I also don't want to tempt fate!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1910 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1923  08-16-88  18:07  (Read 116 times)
   from: JOHN REDFORD
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: ST238 IN AT  Reply to #1910

That 940 cyl/16 sector Jazz sounds like one of the WD rll controllers which
usually does some translation (I really don't know why).  The st238 is a
type 2 (615 cyl, 4 heads)..

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1910 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1930  08-16-88  23:19  (Read 119 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: JOHN REDFORD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ST238 IN AT  Reply to #1923

John,

It is just that. I was told (and it seems logical) that the translation is
done to allow the RLL drives with disk caches and other software (lotus,
for one) which had trouble with 26 sectors. Now, don't everyone jump on me
at once if Lotus works with 26 sector drives. This is what I was told, not
what I claim!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1910 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1912  08-15-88  22:22  (Read 116 times)
   from: BILL TINSLEY
     to: ALL
subject: 1.44 MEG DRIVES

Here is another "head scratcher". Any suggestions would be appreciated:
    [DI have installed a Toshiba ND-356 drive in my older Compaq portable.
I'm trying to use the Disk Plus controller, a daughterboard for the
Microsoft Mach 20. I'm using IBM DOS 3.3. Everything works fine with
720 K drives, but I'm having very little luck with 1.44 Meg disks.
I'm using the M20DRV.SYS driver and the recommended jumper settings. It
will read fairly well, but has problems with writing and formatting.
About half of the time I get the "bad track 0" message. The rest of the
time I get about 400K of bad sectors!
   Now for the fun part. I pulled everything out of the COMPAQ and
installed it in by boss's XT. Everything worked perfectly!! I even
booted both systems from the same floppy, so there can be no difference
in DOS versions, drivers, or the CONFIG.SYS and AUTOEXEC.BAT files.
    [DThe COMPAQ is fairly old, but has been upgraded to the newest
(rev. J) ROM. Any ideas?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1916  08-15-88  23:19  (Read 117 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: BILL TINSLEY (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1.44 MEG DRIVES  Reply to #1912

Bill,

See the 1.44 meg thread in the General Conf.  I'm having similar problems
with the same drive you have in my Compaq 286.  I thing latest ROM's are
upto rev P.1.  Do you know for sure if Rev J supports 3.5" (or is that the
reason for the device driver)?  I'll let you know how I make out.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1912 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1927  08-16-88  20:48  (Read 123 times)
   from: BILL TINSLEY
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1.44 MEG DRIVES  Reply to #1916

Actually, the Disk Plus controller has its own ROM. It installs itself
at boot time in the same way as hard disk controllers do in an XT class
machine. Microsoft was concerned about communications between the
disk controller ROM and the main system ROM. The device driver is used
only for formatting. (I have to remember to FORMAT D: even though I can
call it drive B: for everything else).
    The ROM version letters for the portable (8088 based) and for the
portable 286 don"t correspond to each other as far as I know. None of
the versions for the original portable are supposed to handle 3 1/2 inch
drives without the special controller.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1912 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1925  08-16-88  20:03  (Read 116 times)
   from: PATRICK KELLER
     to: ALL
subject: COMPUTERS FOR DISABLED

     Do any firms or agencies donate old/dated hardware for use by disabled
or handicapped persons?  I have a friend who is a quadraplegic, and who has
been trained as a draftsman, but now is told he needs to learn CAD to be
employable or useful as an outside contractor.  He can't afford a computer,
so I was wondering if used equipment is ever made available to such
persons.
     This is no put-on, and certainly not humorous to the individual
involved.  Sincere respnses are appreciated.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1933  08-17-88  07:02  (Read 118 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: BOARD PROTECTION

     What is the best way to protect boards that aren't currently being
used in a system.  I have several around, some of which have the "plastic"
sleeves and others with nothing (that is correctable with some sound
advice).  Pointers please.
                                Bob
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1938  08-17-88  17:23  (Read 123 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1933

That's a very good question, since many failed boards can be traced to
mishandling.

There are 3 or 4 types of plastics that one might be tempted to wrap his
boards and components in to protect them from dust and static. Some are
good, some are guaranteed to KILL your parts, especially CMOS parts.

BLACK POLY: An opaque black polyethelyne (or polypropoline? I forget)
substance with a kind of almost rubbery feel to it. This is probably the
best stuff. I think 3M invented it.

PICK POLY: Translucent pink tinted stuff. Also good, and you can see the
product. This is the stiff that's softer and not very shiny.
Sorry, line 12 should read PINK POLY...

GRAY 3M: Smoke/grey translucent plastic. This stuff will have a shine on
its surface and not be as soft. I dunno how this material compares to the
black stuff, but it's probably almost as good. None of use work in labs or
other strange environments where stray high voltages, static, rf, or other
stuff is likely to be a problem, so I can't see where it matters much.

CLEAR CELOPHANE or polystyrene. BAD, BAD, BAD. This stuff generates
zillions of electron volts worth of static charge when you stare at it
hard. Wrap a board in this, even if it's bipolar (not MOS) and it'l
probably fail mysteriosly.

WHITE POLYSTYRENE WRAP: Have you seen this white or tinted 1/4" thick foam
wrap? I see it as an inner wrap on monitors and stuff. VERY BAD. Generates
static.

PINK PEANUTS: Shipping peanuts made from pink poly. Much prefferable to
white peanuts, but still, always use an anti-static bag around the board or
parts, carefully taped shut.

WHITE PEANUTS: Real bad. You could use them if the part was carefully
sealed in a black poly bag, but we don't. We save our pink poly peanuts for
such things. Can't hurt to be carefull...

BLACK FOAM: For small parts with pins, like MEMORY CHIPS and other chips.
If you take a part out of a socket, stick in it some black foam. You can
get it at Radio Shack if desparate. Never let a chip sit anywhere besides
its socket or in black foam.

Anti-static wraps or bags really address 2 issues: 1. generating static 2.
dissipating static. If the stuff you wrap the board in makes static, issue
number 2 never even comes up. If the wrap doesn't make static, but doesn't
have the right surface conductivity (etc) to dissipate safely static that
already exists, it isn't suitable either.

HANDLING PRECAUTIONS: Contrary to popular belief, servicing a PC is best
done with the unit PLUGGED IN. This is assuming you know what you are
doing. Look real close at the plug on your PC. See that third prong in the
middle? The round one? That's called a GROUND. You didn't cheat and use an
adapter, so you could plug into a 2-wire outlet, now did you? Because if
you did, you threw away some of the best static protection you could have.
That's where the static charge goes, when it gets transferred to the PC
from your body after you walk accross the carpet. Thats also where surges
and spikes get shunted to when (not "if"!) Wisconsin Electric sends all
kinds of garbage down your power line. So ground your equipment!

Even walking across a tile floor can build up a static charge on your body,
and even a small charge can do damage under the right condidtions. One
should always touch something large and metal on the computer, like the
case, before hitting the switch or the keyboard. Consider: The keyboard
sends serial data and clocks back and forth to/from the PC. These are
usually TTL signals, and they vary from near zero volts to 5 volts. You
walk to the PC and try to touch a key. A small spark jumps from your finger
to a trace between two keys, and frys the encoder chip. Perhaps a spark
jumps from that trace to one connected to the computer. In a fraction of a
second, one smoked keyboard and maybe a new motherboard, or atleast some
new chips.

If you service computers, invest in an anti-static mat, and ground in per
instructions.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1942  08-18-88  07:05  (Read 114 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1938

Now that's what I call a reply.  I'll read thru this as time is available
and will probably understand "static" and protection.  Sounds as tho you
have some experience with this Tom.
Thanks,                        Bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1947  08-18-88  14:43  (Read 112 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1942

Experience? Yes, I've killed a few boards.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1949  08-18-88  21:12  (Read 115 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1947

How would you like to play with mini/mainframe boards. Touchy stuff. Toast
one of those babes and it could cost a few duckies heh?  I fried (I think)
one on a Honeywell mini a few years back when I started servicing
computers. 7K ! and that was a cheap one. That was the LAST one too. 3-M
grounding kits were ordered and on the way within usec's. I couldn't
believe they didn't have any already (I was new and they TOLD us in school
never, ever work on a machine without one), but when the senior techs. were
not using them I figured what the hey?

Personally, when I take my PC under the knife, I don't use one, just ground
myself (with the cord plugged) before touching anything. Always have people
asking me why I had a hand in one pocket when probing or the like.  Learned
that one by trial and error too. Got nailed by a 500vdc transformer tap on
a microwave radio about 6-7 years ago.

P.S. An untreated concrete floor can also build up a substantial charge.
Weather (humidity levels, temp.) is also a contributing factor in static
buildup.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1954  08-19-88  06:52  (Read 116 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1947

Any sources for the products you mentioned in the first reply?  I've never
noticed any offered in the ads I see.  Perhaps 'cause I haven't had this
thought in my head, but Necessity is calling now.  Thanks.
                            Bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1959  08-19-88  16:47  (Read 122 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1954

1. Jensen Tools
2. JDR Microdevices
3. Digi-key
4. Radio Shack
5. Hamfest/Swapfest

For 1-4 see the back pages of BYTE or PC.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1965  08-19-88  22:32  (Read 130 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1959

Try also 3-M. They have more in their catalog than you will find in Jensen;
about the same prices.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1972  08-22-88  07:03  (Read 120 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1959

Thanks, Tom.  I get fliers from at least 3 of them.  Appreciate all the
comments.
                                 Bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1975  08-22-88  12:35  (Read 120 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1972

On static protection: I'm preparing a massive missive (chuckle) on the
topic, to be uploaded to the Mahoney collection early this week. Look for
STATIC.ARC or something similar. I have more hard facts and numbers in the
new piece, and plan to incorporate the one I sent to you.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1976  08-22-88  13:30  (Read 120 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1933

I am uploading today a file called STATIC.ARC which will contain a 350 line
tutorial on protection against static discharge damage to parts.

One thing I failed to mention is that static damage can be hidden. The
discharge may weaken a semiconductor junction so that  the part fails after
being in operation for several minutes/days/weeks/months...

Have fun, and as always, comments invited.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1988  08-23-88  07:21  (Read 120 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1976

Tom, thanks.  Have downloaded STATIC.ARC.  Maybe for once I can get a
handle on a potential problem before it bites me.  Maybe.....
                        Bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2004  08-24-88  15:01  (Read 124 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #1988

Let me know what you think of STATIC.ARC.

I just talked to a friend of mine that used to work for RCA service. He was
there about 10 years, I guess. He said they had one family of boards that
had a 40% out-of-box failure rate. They went nuts with antistatic
packaging, floor mats, bench mats, wrist straps, the whole 9 yards. The
dead board rate dropped to next to nothing. It's policy now, at RCA.

One other thing. My friend is of the opinion that the particular brand of
pink poly bag they tried wasn't nearly as good as the 3M smoke-gray type. I
don't have enough data to confirm or deny.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2007  08-24-88  20:04  (Read 128 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2004

Tom,

Very good writeup on static.  You might want to add that polyester and
nylon clothing are bad also.

Any suggestions for lightning protection.  Some recent thunderstorms have
left my electronics in shambles.  I've got surge proctectors on just about
everything but it didn't seem to help.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2015  08-25-88  06:56  (Read 123 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2004

I thought you had done a masterful job.  I very much appreiciate the
tutorial nature of the material.  Have already passed a few copies around
here.
The only type I have is the smoke-gray type.  It came on a couple of my
boards.
Thanks much.
                            Bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #14

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2027  08-26-88  16:55  (Read 123 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2007

Protecting against lightning and surge damage is a tricky biz.  You must
protect EVERY port of entry. If you have lots of gadget on yer computer,
like printers, plotters, monitors, standalone modems, etc, everything that
gets plugged into the wall needs a surge protector. EVERYTHING. If you have
any kind of modem, you should use a surge suppresor on the telephone lines.
These are available various places, and they just plug in. Or you can open
up the wall box your telephone jack is in and stick MOVs from each wire to
ground, and also tip to ring (normally red to green).

We have a nasty problem with our big computer. It has 14 serial ports and
terminals connected to them. They are scattered around the building. When a
terminal gets shut off, every once and a while, the computer will crash. If
a spike big enough to screw up the terminal happens, the computer may also
crash. None of these events, tho they happen with regularity, has
permanently damaged the hard ware, but I think it's only a matter of time.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #15

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2028  08-26-88  19:52  (Read 122 times)
   from: BRIAN KIEHNAU
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2007

     cc: TOM PETERS

Glen

 Some time ago Tom and I had quite discussion on surge supp. devices
and there usefullness. I differ in my opinion from Tom in that I think
that surge supp. are waste of money and as you noted they can not protect
from lighting and other high power type faults. I do not have any
surge supp. on any of my equipment because for the cost of a surge supp.
I can buy a new power supply for my PC and in the event of a lighting
strike I will not have to replace both the PS and the surge supp.

Protection from lighting is hard to do because of the large amount
of voltage and current that can ocurr. The only
thing that you can do is install air gap arresters and industrial sized
MOV (the ones the size of your fist) on the main feed lines where they
come into your home. You could also install a relay to disconnect the
power from your conputer equipment when not in use and only use your
equipment when there are no storms in the area.

Brian


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #16

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2046  08-28-88  20:58  (Read 118 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2027

Tom,

Thanks for the info on lightning protection.  Just about everything is
protected by a surge suppersor except the phone line.  I think thats how my
modem got zapped.  I'll add a protector there and see what happens.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #17

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2049  08-28-88  22:07  (Read 118 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: BRIAN KIEHNAU (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2028

Brian,

My lightning problems do not seem to be from direct hits but from induction
in the underground wiring.  All the recent problems didn't seem to involve
the power lines which all have surge suppressors.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #18

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2056  08-29-88  14:13  (Read 121 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BRIAN KIEHNAU (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2028

We use surge suppressors with EMI/RFI filtering, and I believe that we
would have a higher incidence of scrambled hard disks and wierd crashes if
we didn't use them. I know for a fact that our power here is really dirty.
The wiring in the building itself is atrocious and there must be some big
equipment in the neighborhood besides.

Our big S-100 based computer system used to crash 2-4 times every day until
we bought a Best Electric Micro-ferrups u.p.s., a 1/2 kva unit. The unit
has a ferro-resonant transformer, so even if the inverter never kicks in,
we still get clean, filtered, transient and surge free, power. No more
crashes. And Wis Electric still claims it isn't their fault.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #19

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2058  08-29-88  14:17  (Read 121 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2046

  >...modem... I'll add a protector there and see what happens...

Hopefully NOTHING will happen!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #20

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2068  08-29-88  20:20  (Read 121 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2046

A modem surge protector is a good idea and a cheap item.  I once pulled the
phone line from the wall about 20 feet from the modem itself, was walking
back to the modem (carpeted), and zap. 80$ later i got the modem back.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #21

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2074  08-29-88  23:42  (Read 121 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2046

Sorry to jump in here, but I thought I would relate a little story to you.

When I was working in KS we had IBM Remote controller tubes all over the
place (attached to a sys 36). Even after users would unplug the power cord,
the frequent lightning storms in the area would take out approx. 8-10 modem
boards a month. These were internal 4800 bps modems that ran about $1,200.
IBM would not cover them under the maint. contract when they were damaged
by lightning and we couldn't get users to unplug the phone cord at night or
during thunderstorms. The investment of lightning protection on the phone
line was a definate payoff.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #22

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2079  08-30-88  07:18  (Read 126 times)
   from: BRIAN KIEHNAU
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOARD PROTECTION  Reply to #2056

Tom

I like fero-resonant type txfmrs. and have recomended them to
solve powerline noise/sag/etc. in the past with very good results.
Any installation that has has to share lines with motors and other
high current loads should have one.

Brian

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1933 reply #23  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1941  08-18-88  01:07  (Read 115 times)
   from: KEITH ROGERS
     to: ALL
subject: SEAGATE ST4144R

I note in a Seagate product information brochure that the ST4096 and
the ST4144R are much alike.  Both have the same number of tracks,
cylinders, heads, discs, flux density, and track density.  The 4096 is an
MFM
unit and the 4144 is a RLL(2,7) drive.  I wonder if the only difference
between the two is that the 4144 has plated discs, allowing the RLL
to work better?  Does anybody really know for sure is these two
units are like that?  If so, it may be better to get the 4144
(assuming price is close enough) and so eliminate any potential
problems with recording method, i.e., RLL on the 4096.  The 4144 may
work very well with ARLL, as in the Perstor controller.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1943  08-18-88  08:49  (Read 112 times)
   from: DUANE KONKEL
     to: KEITH ROGERS (Rcvd)
subject: SEAGATE 4144R

Keith,
Seagate no longer uses plated media, although the media
is still certified as a higher quality than standard
MFM media.  That is the first difference, but not the only
one.  The other exists in the circuitry.  The read/write
circuitry has a smaller envelope of time in which to read or
write the data. The circuits play an important part in an
RLL certified drive.

Any further questions, feel free to call.

Duane Konkel
DAK TEKnologies
549-1220
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1952  08-19-88  01:55  (Read 116 times)
   from: KEITH ROGERS
     to: DUANE KONKEL
subject: R: SEAGATE 4144R  Reply to #1943

I'd call, need an area code.
Do you know about a price difference level?  I know that the 4096 is
availablele many places for $550 or less.  I did call Hard Drives
Internationanal but they do not carry the ST4144R!!! so couldn't quote a
price.ce.
Regards, Keith Rogers

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1943 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1945  08-18-88  10:42  (Read 114 times)
   from: ED ERDMAN
     to: ALL
subject: IBM PRINTER

Does anyone know if there is any way to interface an IBM 5218-A02 printer
to a PC? It was originally attached to a an IBM Displaywriter.
Thanx
    Ed Erdman
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1950  08-18-88  21:16  (Read 119 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: ED ERDMAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: IBM PRINTER  Reply to #1945

Ed, give me call at work Fri afternoon or next week sometime if you don't
get another answer. Doesn't sound easy, but maybe?

784-9099

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1945 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1955  08-19-88  08:05  (Read 121 times)
   from: STEVEN KEY
     to: ED ERDMAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: IBM PRINTER  Reply to #1945

ED,

I am not sure that this is the same model number as the IBM printer I once
tried to make work with a PC or not.  The one I saw was moved from a
Displaywriter to a PC running DisplayWrite.

There are at least two interesting problems is you have the same kind of
printer.  1).  The printer uses some kind of handshaking protocol from the
computer - a software protocol.
          2)   The printer is an EBCIDC printer, not ASCII like the PC
world.

IBM had supplied some kind of device driver or TSR to interface with
DisplayWrite, but it didn't seem to work with anything else.

Then again, maybe you have an entirely different kind of printer.  Sorry I
can't remember the model number of the one I tangled with.  It was very
large and could do envelopes.

Good luck.

Steve

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1945 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1956  08-19-88  12:02  (Read 118 times)
   from: ED ERDMAN
     to: STEVEN KEY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: IBM PRINTER  Reply to #1955

Thanks Steve
          Ed Erdman

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1945 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1964  08-19-88  21:37  (Read 129 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: ED ERDMAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: IBM PRINTER  Reply to #1956

Gary Bourbonais sez "Hello" to a former Century alumnus.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1945 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1953  08-19-88  06:34  (Read 119 times)
   from: ALLAN BILDER
     to: ALL
subject: ZENITH MONITOR

I have just acquired a Zenith 1490 flat screen monitor.  Along with it came
software to modify Microsoft Windows to take advantage of VGA capability.
The only problem is that the software applies only to Windows 1.04 and I
have 2.03.  By fiddling with the Zenith software I've been able to achieve
480 line resolution with Windows 2.03, but since Zenith did not supply a
font driver compatible with 2.03, no characters on the screen are legible.
I am a rank neophyte when it comes to this sort of thing and would
appreciate any suggestions as to how to take advantage of the Zenith
monitor with Windows 2.03.  Thanks.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1962  08-19-88  20:24  (Read 131 times)
   from: WILLIAM BIRD
     to: ALLAN BILDER (Rcvd)
subject: R: ZENITH MONITOR  Reply to #1953

What kind of VGA card did you get with the monitor.  If you can't
get the 2.03 driver from Zenith you may be able to get one from
someone else, at least to 640x480 to should be pretty standard.
The 1.04 driver that you have will probably work fine as long as
you don't need to use it with Windows 386.  Unfortunately the
drivers also interpret the font files and those have changed between
1.04 and 2.03.  If you can get 1.04 display font files (leave the
printer fonts alone) you should be able to get your configuration
to work.  I may have a copy laying around if you are local to
Milwakee.  Let me know if you want me to look or if you need more
information on how to get this to work.
Have a good day...Bill

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1953 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1984  08-23-88  06:36  (Read 122 times)
   from: ALLAN BILDER
     to: WILLIAM BIRD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ZENITH MONITOR  Reply to #1962

The card is a Zenith 449.  I have the 1.04 display font files and have
tried them without success.  Microsoft Tech Support tells me that the 1.04
display font files are not compatabile with 2.03.  Since I left the
original message, however, U've been told by our beloved MIS Department
that there is a Model 80 on order for me, so the question might be moot.
Thanks for the reply and the offer to help.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1953 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1967  08-20-88  11:17  (Read 125 times)
   from: PAUL SONYE
     to: ALL
subject: APPLE MONITOR ON PC

I am trying to use an Apple II color composite monitor on an XT clone with
a CGA board.  The board has RCA jacks for composite b/w & color but the
monitor always shows b/w.  Has anyone had this problem ? Would appreciate
suggestions.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1969  08-21-88  17:05  (Read 115 times)
   from: JOE AGRO
     to: ALL
subject: BAD KEYBOARD

 I have a XT clone that recently started giving the message "BAD KEYBOARD"
on bootup.I know the keyboard is good so I assume it's on th
motherboard.Does anyone know the chip that controls the keyboard input?Woul
d changing it have any chance of correcting my problem?
Thanks in advance for any suggestions you may have
   Joe
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1977  08-22-88  20:26  (Read 116 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: ALL
subject: PORTABLE HD

Can anyone suggest a good, cheap 20 or 30 meg shock mounted hard drive to
use in a portable XT clone? Prefer 30 megs, but at this point who can be
picky?

-[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1989  08-23-88  07:39  (Read 120 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: PORTABLE HD  Reply to #1977

Steve,
    I'm running a 32 meg Panasonic HD (3 1/2") in an IBM Portable.  I do
not have it "shock" mounted, other than the flimsy fiber bracket that IBM
supplied.  It is used in the field on occcasion, and I've never had any
problems since it was installed last October.  It is a half-height HD, and
am also using an Omti short card controller with it.  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1977 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1991  08-23-88  19:47  (Read 117 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PORTABLE HD  Reply to #1989

Al,

Thanks for the info. I was hoping to do a lot of 'in the field' with it,
including trips on an plane with me. Haven't figured out how I can fit it
under the seat in front of me yet! As checked baggage it wouldn't survive
the first trip, I fear.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1977 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1999  08-24-88  07:15  (Read 119 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PORTABLE HD  Reply to #1991

Steve,
    I've never dragged it with me on a plane!  I don't think a regular
luggable would fit under the seat.  I have seen some of the new Compaq
lunchboxes though.  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1977 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2012  08-25-88  01:07  (Read 124 times)
   from: JEFFREY HOWELL
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PORTABLE HD  Reply to #1991

STEVE,
.     For what it's worth, Kaypro used NEC drives in their
luggables until they stopped making them.  (The luggables that is,
not the NEC's).
.                                   JEFFREY

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1977 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2014  08-25-88  06:31  (Read 124 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: JEFFREY HOWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PORTABLE HD  Reply to #2012

Jeffrey,

Thanks. I have a 1.4M floppy in there now and it is probably all I really
need, but one never has enough hardware so I thought I'd give it a shot. I
remembered a lot of talk here a couple of years ago about shock mounted
drives but couldn't remember who made them.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1977 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2018  08-25-88  19:21  (Read 124 times)
   from: JEFFREY HOWELL
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PORTABLE HD  Reply to #2014

STEVE,
.     The people at Kolod Research seem to think real highly
of the Conners Peripherial hard drives for use in a portable
- high "G" rating, and low current draw.
.                                       JEFFREY

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1977 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2019  08-25-88  20:39  (Read 122 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: JEFFREY HOWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PORTABLE HD  Reply to #2018

Jeffrey,

Thanks for the tip. I'll look into that one as well. That is exactly what I
need, hi G's. Like you would expect if a protable was thrown 10 feet to a
baggage conveyor! Don't think much could survive, tho. Maybe a tip to the
stewerdess would help them find a place in the forward storage compartment.
Or maybe they could put me in there and the machine in the seat. Who knows?

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1977 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2022  08-26-88  02:53  (Read 122 times)
   from: JEFFREY HOWELL
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PORTABLE HD  Reply to #2019

STEVE,
.     I remember reading somewhere about a hard disk for portables
that had a manual head locking feature (as I recall, you pulled out
a lever and inserted a pin) perhaps someone else can recall where
I read this?  I think you'll find that a drive with properly
parked heads can stand much more than the rest of the computer.
.                                   JEFFREY

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1977 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2025  08-26-88  07:44  (Read 123 times)
   from: STEVEN KEY
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PORTABLE HD  Reply to #2019

Steve,

Your expectation that your portable would be thrown to the baggage reminded
me of the day when I was having lunch at a high school buddies house -
about 20 years ago when I was in high school.  His father was the assistant
post master in town.  I said something about parcel post marked "fragile."
My friends father, who was there for lunch too, said "Those we throw
under-hand, the rest we throw over-hand."

Steve

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1977 reply #9  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1982  08-22-88  23:57  (Read 116 times)
   from: PAT PFAFFL
     to: ALL
subject: NEATSET

I recently purchased a computer based on the Chips and Technologies Neatset
chips.  Very little information was supplied with the computer on setting
the parameters for the chipset and there significance.  Can anyone supply
me with some information on the Chips and Technologies Neatset chips, and
what the parameter settings really do?  The trial and error method is
maddening...sometimes settings make a difference, and sometimes not,
depending on other settings...
Spec sheets or whatever info is available would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks for the help.
ps-this is a 20Mhz 286 from Computrade (computer brand name Novas).
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1983  08-23-88  00:11  (Read 116 times)
   from: DOROTHY MILLER
     to: ALL
subject: HACKINTOSH?

Has anyone tried the Hackintosh hack from the August COMPUTER SHOPPER?
Looks like an interesting concept - assembling a Mac with as many
inexpensive PC componants as possible....
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1992  08-23-88  20:59  (Read 118 times)
   from: JAY CHEROSKE
     to: ALL
subject: THE NOISE KILLER

╔══════════════╦═════════╦══════════════════╦═════════╦═══════════════╗
║    SIMPLE    ║         ║ THE NOISE KILLER ║         ║   ONE-TIME    ║
║ INSTALLATION ║         ╚══════════════════╝         ║  ADJUSTMENT   ║
╠══════════════╝         ╔══════════════════╗         ╚═══════════════╣
║                        ║ GET RID OF PHONE ║                         ║
║                        ╚══╗ LINE NOISE ╔══╝                         ║
╠════════════════════════╗  ╚══╗ NOW! ╔══╝  ╔═════════════════════════╣
║  GET THE NOISE KILLER  ║     ╚══════╝     ║   PLUGS DIRECTLY INTO   ║
║ WITH CORD FOR ONLY $20 ║  ╔════════════╗  ║  SECOND JACK OF MODEM   ║
║ ADD $2.00 FOR SHIPPING ║  ║ MONEY-BACK ║  ║  NO ASSEMBLY REQUIRED   ║
╠════════════════════════╝  ║ GUARANTEE! ║  ╚═════════════════════════╣
║        ╔══════════════════╩════════════╩═══════════════════╗        ║
║        ║ JUST TURN THE KNOB AND LINE NOISE IS GONE FOREVER ║        ║
╠════════╩═══════════════════════════════════════════════════╩════════╣
║    PLEASE SEND CHECK OR MONEY ORDER PAYABLE TO JAY CHEROSKE TO:     ║
║            P.O. BOX 3069, PALOS VERDES ESTATES, CA 90274            ║
╚═════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════════╝

Compatibility Check:  This is a simple test to see if the noise killer
                      will work for you.

1. Plug a standard telephone into the second jack of your modem
   (usually labeled "PHONE").

2. Using your modem, call a local BBS.

3. After you have connected, pick up the handset of the telephone and
   listen.  If you hear a static type of sound and garbage characters
   appear on your screen YOU'VE PASSED THE TEST!

That's all there is to it!  If anyone has any questions, please don't
hesitate to leave me a message or call me at 213 378-4316.


---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1993  08-23-88  21:00  (Read 115 times)
   from: DAVID LUBAR
     to: ALL
subject: HARD DISK CONTOLLER CARD

Help.................
I am adding a 2nd 20 meg hard disk to a Sterling pc.  This is an XT clone.
I have the original disk assigned a drive C: and a vdisk on an expanded
memory board assigned as drive D:.  I am trying to set the new hard disk as
drive D: the vdisk as drive E:.  The hard disk contoller card has three
jumpers and 8(?) dip switches.  This card is marked DTC or DCT.  The
problem is that I have no manual for this card and the manufacturer of the
Sterling computer is out of business.  Does anyone out there either have a
manual, know where I can get one, or know how to set these switches.  I'm
a real novice with this stuff but my friend who was trying to install the
2nd drive said unless we can figure the switches we'll need to but a new
controller card.                   I hope some one out there knows,
                                                   DML
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1994  08-23-88  23:10  (Read 116 times)
   from: MARK TIMPANY
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: FD DISABLE

Good to see you at the meeting tonight, too. I would have left you the
Inovation address earlier, but got carried away reading over the library
list.
   The Innovation folks are at:
          Innovation Computer Company
          Innovation Building
          1325-1327 Juniper Street
          Cleveland, WI 53015
          414-693-3416
  Jeff Schellhaas is the name I have written down ... I guess he's the one
you said is no longer with Innovation.
  Saw another Innovation over the weekend. I was in Fond du Lac (French for
Lake of Molten Cheese) at KFIZ-WFON. They are using the Innovation as the
terminal for an IGM program automation system. I'm told they had a Leading
Edge from the same dealer that did not work - - swapped for the Innovation
and it went to work straight away.
  I will be curious to see what the Cleveland folks say about getting a
high speed FD controller in their box. The documentation they provide is
certainly minimal.
  I must say it feels good to be a member of the PC Users Group. Unhappily,
the third Tuesday each month is also the regular meeting time of the
Milwaukee chapter of the SBE (Society of Broadcast Engineers). So, I may be
more regular on alternate meeting dates. Looking over the listing of past
meeting presentations, it appears that I've missed a wealth of information.
At least now, on the mailing list, I will know what I am missing.
                          Cheers,                Mark
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1995  08-23-88  23:18  (Read 116 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: MARK TIMPANY (Rcvd)
subject: R: FD DISABLE  Reply to #1994

I understand that MATC was selling a CAD setup about a year ago using the
1010XT and their MATCCAD.  I probably won't have time to WP a letter to
Innovation till the weekend, but I'll keep you up on what happens.  Share
water.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1994 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1996  08-23-88  23:56  (Read 115 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: MARK TIMPANY (Rcvd)
subject: R: FD DISABLE  Reply to #1994

Mark,

Sorry that I can't remember your face from the meeting tonight.  One quick
note concerning your last message.  Tuesday meeting of the Milwaukee PC
User's Group are on the FOURTH Tuesday of the month.  You could make SBE
meetings and PCUG meetings if SBE meetings are the third Tuesdays of the
month.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1994 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2000  08-24-88  08:23  (Read 124 times)
   from: MARK TIMPANY
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FD DISABLE  Reply to #1996

Mark, Right you are ... except the September meeting date is shown in an
older Blinkin Cursor as 20 September. Maybe that's a misprint or maybe
that's some famous computer holiday I don't have in my datebook - -
something like Norbert Weiner's birthday when adjusted to allow for a four
day weekend?

Funny, Joe Knapp, when he worked at what was then WZUU, always used to tell
me that there was a conflict in meeting times.

Thank you for resolving my conflict.        Cheers,     Mark

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1994 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2011  08-24-88  23:05  (Read 122 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: MARK TIMPANY (Rcvd)
subject: R: FD DISABLE  Reply to #1994

You were kidding about Fond du Lac meaning "Lake of Molten Cheese", right?
You really know that it really means "Bottom of the Lake", right?

        Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1994 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2017  08-25-88  09:08  (Read 120 times)
   from: MARK TIMPANY
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FD DISABLE  Reply to #2011

We have lots of interesting French-derived names. People in Wisconsin can
live in "The Prairie of the Dog", or perhaps at "The Small Hill of Death".
          Maybe I should correct my spelling for the "Lake of Molten
Cheese" .... Fondue Lac.     (Yes, just kidding.)        Mark

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1994 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2021  08-25-88  23:28  (Read 122 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: MARK TIMPANY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FD DISABLE  Reply to #2017

Oh, I get it.

      Yes, I've gone water skiing on the Lake of the Small Hill of Death
many times.  It can be quite exciting.  The Lake of Stinking Water is fun
too.

        Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 1994 reply #6  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #1998  08-24-88  06:48  (Read 113 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: ALL
subject: PS/2 INSTALL

Had the pleasure of installing my first PS/2 , a model 60, yesterday.  Talk
about easy.  Compared to my AT this was a breeze.  At least IBM got one
important thing right.
                              Bob
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2001  08-24-88  09:19  (Read 126 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: ALL
subject: VGA BLANKER

BTW,  anyone know of a good VGA screen blanker?  Thanks.
                     Bob
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2008  08-24-88  20:11  (Read 132 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: VGA BLANKER  Reply to #2001

Bob,

I use a device driver screen blanker called BURNDEV.  It's been tested on
VGA, EGA, CGA, monochrome with no problems.  You do have to be careful when
using it on a herc. card.  I've just found out that it conflicts with
windows when running Excel, but it can be disabled from the command line.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2001 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2016  08-25-88  07:01  (Read 126 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: VGA BLANKER  Reply to #2008

Thanks.  Pulled BRNDEV23 and CRT_SAV4 from the MAHONEY after I left the
message yesterday.  It is heartening to here good things about software
in-use.   Don't use EXCEL or WINDOWS here, yet.  Altho, I am very tempted
to "borrow" a copy from Microsoft under their current offer.
                             Bob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2001 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2010  08-24-88  23:01  (Read 124 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID LUBAR (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DISK CONTOLLER C  Reply to #1993

Well, I don't have a manual for a DTC controller, but you may not need one
or a new controller.  What have you tried so far and what have been your
results?  Do you have the daisy chain type of 34 pin cable for connecting
both drives to the controller?  Do you have the two separate 20 pin cables
connected to the controller and one to each disk, and polarities on both
ends have been double checked?  And then you low level formatted the new
drive, and then FDISKed and FORMATted?  Where was it that you ran into
trouble?

         Nick
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2020  08-25-88  20:57  (Read 124 times)
   from: DAVE SIEBENALLER
     to: ALL
subject: P1340 DIPS

Hi all!

I've gotten a hold of a Toshiba P1340 printer, but not a manual....if
someone could enlighten me as to what the DIP settings do I would be very
appreciative!  Thanks in advance!

Dave
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2023  08-26-88  04:01  (Read 122 times)
   from: JIM DUNNIGAN
     to: ALL
subject: BAD MEMORY?

Here's one for those more technically adept than I. Having gotten a few
lockups on my true-blue AT, I ran a memory tester off a DOS floppy
(RAMTESTA). Most of the time it would just freeze after 30-90 minutes
(normally I've been getting a lockup every 20-30 hours). On two
occasions the screen blinked as RAMTESTA went thru it's initial
"searching for top of memory" and then the screen would freak out on the
first test pass and report failure in memory location B000:0000. I'm
using a Chauffer HT card (mono/CGA) on a mono monitor (same basic drill
as the Compaq monitors). I wonder if the video card could be causing the
lockups? I'm not expert enough on the inner workings of the system to
confirm that diagnosis. Anyone got an idea of what might be going down
inside the box?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2024  08-26-88  07:31  (Read 120 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: PS/2 60 H.D.

Joe,

    You seem to have better IBM connections and info than most of us.  Do
you have any knowledge of how to do a low-level format of a hard drive in
a Model 60?

    I hear there is a way using the Reference disk's Testing procedure and
a CTRL A.  Have any insights or tech. notes about this?

bblair
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2030  08-27-88  15:45  (Read 124 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: PS/2 60 H.D.  Reply to #2024

Bob, I'm running a 50-Z at the office while I'm waiting for a model 80.  We
don't have any 60s, but I'll see what I can find out.  Why do you need to
low-level format the 60's HD?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2024 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2053  08-29-88  06:50  (Read 115 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PS/2 60 H.D.  Reply to #2030

Joe,  we got this in for our office early last week.  Ran fine for a day or
so then began giving access errors for the C:/D: drive ( a 40MB split 20-20
).  I did a DOS format with about 24hrs of success.  Then the trouble
returned.

When I left the message I was hoping for a quick solution.  Additional
facts since then -- moved the hd controller card to another slot, still
trouble.  This THING won't hold configuration info about the TYPE of hd.
Presently it is at a Computerland.

bblair

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2024 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2067  08-29-88  19:21  (Read 119 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PS/2 60 H.D.  Reply to #2053

Bob, are you running DOS 3.3?  If so, are you using DASDDRVR.SYS?  If not,
you should be.  There were all sorts of strange disk-related problems with
PS/2 50s and above, all (most?) of which IBM patched out of existence with
the above-mentioned driver.  You'll need a "DEVICE=[path]\DASDDRVR.SYS" in
your CONFIG.SYS.  I had a problem with my 50Z last week -- couldn't do a
vanilla COPY from a 3.5" diskette to a hard drive (sector not found).
Tried all sorts of things before taking the diskette to another 50Z and
finding that there was absolutely nothing wrong with the diskette.
Rebooted my 50Z and the problem was gone!  A bit of research turned up the
need to use the DASDDRVR.SYS driver.

I'll bet Computerland has never heard of the driver or, if so, doesn't make
the connection.  Try it and see if your problem goes away.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2024 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2078  08-30-88  07:16  (Read 118 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PS/2 60 H.D.  Reply to #2067

JOE,   This does sound very familiar to the type of problem we have.  If
one assumes CL doesn't fix the problem or only thinks they have fixed it, I
will give it a try.  This is included with DOS 3.3?  I'll look.
     The latest PC Tech. Journal mentions the Ctrl A.   Apparently this is
way to get into the Advanced Diagnostics from the Reference Diskette.  It
sure is a lot easier to work on a system when it is your own.  Moving from
my office in our plant to the administrative offices to work on a pc is a
real nuisance.  Guess next time I'll do a better job of reading the
documentation.
     Thanks for the reply.  I'll holler if the problem continues.
bblair

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2024 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2080  08-30-88  08:09  (Read 126 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PS/2 60 H.D.  Reply to #2078

Bob,
    I've got the DOS fix installed on all our PS/2's.  It is an IBM
authorized patch, and is avaiable on this board in the Mahoney collection.
Scan for DOS, or DOS33FIX, or something like that!  They also include a new
FORMAT.COM file and a couple others.  BTW, on our larger systems (40 meg
+), I'm going to switch to DOS 4.0 to take advantage of the large
partition, haven't had any major problems with it yet on an 80.  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2024 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2093  08-31-88  06:51  (Read 122 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PS/2 60 H.D.  Reply to #2080

AL,
   Thanks for the reply.  I've got DOS33FIX, but never had any use for it
on this AT.  We had been hoping that our corporation would upgrade to 4.0
before the PS/2 60 arrived.  They move too slowly however.
   I have been trying to keep up with 4.0 thru the uploads .TXT files in
the Mahoney and in the conferences.  Sounds interesting.
   Sure hope to get this resolved quickly.  Have to begin a new job next
week or so (same location) which won't leave as much time for adjusting our
users to new machines and fixing the usual problems.
bblair

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2024 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2096  08-31-88  07:22  (Read 128 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: BOB BLAIR (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PS/2 60 H.D.  Reply to #2093

Bob,
    If you tried the Ctrl-A format you'll note that is as slow as heck.  An
y PD low level program from this bbs should do the same job in about 95%
less time.  Also, as you've mentioned, the IBMCACHE program is also a joke.
I've got a Compaq 386s at home with a decent caching utility that does the
job.  I guess some of these items are part of the downfall of the beloved
micro-channel, that and the fact that IBM has yet to come up with solid
reasons for a new architecture.  Well anyway, keep that 60 humming.  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2024 reply #7  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2033  08-27-88  19:55  (Read 124 times)
   from: PATRICK KELLER
     to: ALL
subject: HARD DISK CONTROLLERS

Can you add a second controller for a second hard drive on an XT?  I've
just procured a second drive with controller, but can't get either drive to
behave properly with the second controller installed.  Any advice
appreciated at this point.
                                                  Patrick Keller
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2035  08-27-88  22:05  (Read 121 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DISK CONTROLLERS  Reply to #2033

Depending on what controllers they are, there may be jumpers that will
configure either as controller 1 or 2.  Check with the vendor or
manufacturer for configuration.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2033 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2036  08-27-88  22:38  (Read 123 times)
   from: PATRICK KELLER
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2035

The controllers are both Western Digital 27X models.  If anyone knows how
to configure them as drive 1 or 2, that would be helpful.  I don't have any
documentation on them.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2033 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2038  08-27-88  23:25  (Read 124 times)
   from: JEFFREY HOWELL
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2036

PATRICK,
.     You should be able to run both drives with only one of the
controller cards, and have lots fewer problems than configuring
them to run with seperate controllers.  If you insist on running
with 2 seperate controllers, you will have to assign a different
interrupt to each controller.  I'm not sure what jumper controlls
the interrupt address on your controller, but, you might want to
give WD a call at 714/863-0102 or 714/474-2033.  They should be
able to help you out.  Good Luck!
.                                                JEFFREY

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2033 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2039  08-27-88  23:35  (Read 123 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DISK CONTROLLERS  Reply to #2033

Jeffrey's answer was very good and I can't emphasize it enough.  Most
Western Digital controllers can run two hard disks and this is definitely
the way to go.  You need a daisy chain 34 pin cable (just like the cable on
your floppy disk drive(s)) and two 20 pin data cables.  The board will have
two places to plug in the 20 pin cables.  Most of those controller boards
have never even been tested at different interrupts than the ones they were
shipped set up for.

       Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2033 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2041  08-28-88  09:32  (Read 118 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2036

Patrick,

I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to do. Unless you are trying
to run 3 hard drives in one machine (it can be done but it ain't easy) I
see no reason to use two 27X controllers at the same time. I have the 27X
docs from WD so I could maybe help you if I knew what you wanted to do. But
if all you want is to hook up two hard drives in your machine, you have one
too many controllers. The 27X can control two drives as it is, so the other
one is not needed. I'm running one that way right now so I know it works.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2033 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2047  08-28-88  21:45  (Read 115 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2036

My WD 27X arrived with two jumpers installed together on four pins below
where the drive cables connect.  A friend told me they were for when more
than one controller is used but I don't know this for sure.  A SHOT IN THE
DARK would be to remove one from one board and the other from the other and
if that didn't work, try the other combination; THIS COULD BE DONE ONLY IF
YOU HAVE EXHAUSTED ALL OTHER POSSIBILITIES FOR CONFIRMING THEIR FUNCTION.
If anyone else on this conference can jump in here it would be appreciated.
BTW, those were the only jumpers on the controller.  Good luck and may you
never thirst.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2033 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2059  08-29-88  14:21  (Read 120 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DISK CONTROLLERS  Reply to #2033

Somebody probably already said this, but there is a text file on the board
someplace called 4DRIVES.ARC or similar, that describes how to adjust the
address of a Western Digital controller, to allow up to 2 controllers and
up to 4 hard drives in a pc/xt/etc. I may do it, since 20/30 mb drives are
cheap. And if one drive croaks, I only loose 1/4 or 1/3 of my data, not ALL
of it. I think that multiple drives may also result in better performance
that large partitions on the same drive. What does the rest of the
conference think?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2033 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2060  08-29-88  14:26  (Read 120 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DISK CONTROLLERS  Reply to #2033

Whoa, did I misunderstand your question? Don't bother with a second
controller if all you want is 2 drives. You may need a driver or a version
of DOS 3.21 or newer, but physically (electronically) the best path is to
hang both drives on 1 controller. Some driver software or DOS versions may
have trouble with the missing drive (D:) if you put 2 controllers in.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2033 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2129  09-05-88  13:36  (Read 106 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: JEFFREY HOWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2038

There are only a couple of different jumpers on the 27x.  Two of them (side
by side as I remember) allow you to logically treat the drive as 17 sector
per track, more than normal number of cylinders, or as 27 sector per track,
same # cyls.
There are no (to my knowledge) jumpers to control controller interrupt or
bios addressing.
You have to alter BOTH of these to allow two controllers to coexist. (The
OMTI 5510 has a bios alteration jumper, but you have to get a different
bios from the manufacturer!).
Anyway, depending on the prom version, your 27x may or may not be
configurable to different drive types.  If its not, get the appropriate
bios version. Most of the ones I've seen are 'hardwired' to work with 20mb
drives.
Good luck, and I may be able to help more if you contact me.  But give up
on multiple controllers in the system.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2033 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2134  09-05-88  14:16  (Read 105 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2133

I found the OEM book as well.  Yes, you can use 2 27x controllers....

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2033 reply #10  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2034  08-27-88  20:06  (Read 122 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: ALL
subject: FASTER ROM

Hi to all,
  I am looking for advice on a stunt I pulled.
         My Dell 286-8 ( 8 MHz ) has a history of occasional hangups.
What I found was a tendency to get confused when the print spooler was
beating away on the printer and I was typing ahead into the typeahead
buffer.   I guessed that the ROM-BIOS was having some kind of timing
problem.  Investigation found 200ns chips which sounded a little slow.
   Memory which can keep up with 8 mHz should require 120 ns chips by
my calculation, shouldn't it?
           So................ I tried a stunt.
   I coppied my ROM on to 150 ns chips.  All seems ok. Some stuff feels
a little faster.  Some of the sounds are a little higher in pitch (because
Dell uses CX decrement loops to time sounds).
             My question is.................
  Am I asking for any troubles?  What can go wrong with faster ROM chips?
  What kind of tests should I run to verify the safety of this stunt?
               Any hot tips or suggestions are most welcome.
                    Dave Clay
.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2040  08-28-88  00:16  (Read 122 times)
   from: MARK TELLIER
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2034

Dave,

Unless Dell is taking some very unusual steps, the access time of your ROM
chip does not determine the speed at which the code executes.  It's
determined by the crystal frequency and the number of wait states.  The
only way you could get in improvement in speed is for the number of wait
states to be decreased.  This would require some circuitry in the machine
to "sense" a faster ROM chip (complicated and not likely).

The timing problem you mention could only be a software  problem.  The
hardware timing is set at design and you have a single tasking machine, the
software can't be generating any hardware timing conflicts.

Hope this explains your situation a little.

- mwt -

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2034 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2045  08-28-88  20:48  (Read 115 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: MARK TELLIER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2040

Mark,
     Thanks for your knowledgable and quick answer.  That helps a lot.
I am just beginning to understand these beasts.  Any help is gratefully
appreciated.
                        Thanks Again,
                        Dave Clay
.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2034 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2061  08-29-88  14:30  (Read 118 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2034

I think the fact that some things sound and feel faster is youthful
optimism. I doubt that faster roms would speed anything up at all, because
the timing for accessing roms is fixed in copper and silicon. There might
be a jumper for faster roms, but if not, I wouldn't thing you could do
anything at all. Except run a program at bootup to copy the roms to ram and
redirect the pointers in DOS to the ram copy. This is easy to do with video
roms, especially EGA roms, but I think you may need an advanced '286 or
'386 model to do it with bios roms. Let's see what the rest of the
confernce has to say.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2034 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2062  08-29-88  14:33  (Read 118 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2034

A few morwe things I thought of. to clarify, ROM and RAM are clocked
separately. Your calcu;lations of 120ns is good for RAM but not ROMs.
Try cutting out TSR programs and see if things get faster. Try a good hard
disk cache, the cheapest one is to make sure you have enough BUFFERS
specified in CONFIG.SYS file, like 28 to 38, depending.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2034 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2076  08-30-88  00:35  (Read 119 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2061

I have a Titan 8086 accelerator card that came with program on disk called
"FASTROM". It will put the bios into high ram at start up. If you want to
look at it, leave me a message.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2034 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2082  08-30-88  17:09  (Read 121 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JAMES IRVING (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2076

Sure I;d like to see it. Is it copyrighted?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2034 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2130  09-05-88  13:41  (Read 106 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2034

Hmmmm...  you definitely didn't HELP anything, unless the ROMS had some
shaky bits (and you read it right when you copied it).
The speed of the rom chips has ZERO to do with the speed of the system, in
principle.  Your motherboard inserts WAIT STATES to accomodate the rom in
question (as they are always slower than dynamics), and if you have 200
speed roms now (and it boots!), your rom chips are being accessed at a
speed that makes 200ns acceptable.  Changing to 150ns just means you have
increased the waiting time between the point that the rom has the data
available, and the point that the system picks it up off the bus.
craig, baker, sysop pinecliffe bbs.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2034 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2145  09-05-88  22:11  (Read 106 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: CRAIG BAKER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2130

Craig,
    What  I suspect was that the slower ROMs may have been out of
specification and not had their data ready then the timing clock read
the data ports.  Of course, any number of other slow, or flakey
chips could cause a problem with timing. The only clue was the fact that
every time I trapped the bug, it was in the same loop in the ROM program.
If the problem was in a TSR or other port, I would have expected to have
trapped it there.  The above is all an uneducated guess on my part, and
that is why I appreciate all the feedback.
             Thanks for your input, it is much appreciated
             Dave Clay
.
PS    I may never know what really happens in this little beast, but
      that is what makes it so much fun!    Dave.
.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2034 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2151  09-06-88  12:06  (Read 100 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: CRAIG BAKER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2130

Good info in your reply about those ROMS with shakey bits. I'm not sure but
I'm starting to think he just happens to have a sloppy BIOS that doesn't
cope with typeahead buffer overflow too well.

Is pinecliffe bbs in CO? How does it compare to EXEC-PC and what's the
number?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2034 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2306  09-17-88  09:20  (Read 88 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2151

Pinecliffe is in CO.  Only 170mb (tiny compared to exec-pc), but then I'm
FREE.  Cant afford to buy these nifty drives without $$$$./MR}
Number 303 444 7073.  Voice is bbs-2.
Come visit.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2034 reply #10  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2042  08-28-88  09:54  (Read 121 times)
   from: RAOUL NELSON
     to: ALL
subject: NEC POWERMATE 386

   I recently purchased an NEC Powermate 386 from a freight salvage
company.  The machine came with no keyboard, nor DOS.  I have been
using it with Compaq DOS 3.31 with no difficulty.
   I have been using an EGA card until I decided to upgrade to VGA.
I purchased an EVEREX EVGA card and tried to install it.  The machine
refuses to complete the boot process, as the machine uses "shadow"
ram to move the rom BIOS.  It seems the VGA card also needs this space
for it to function properly.  I understand that the sahdow ram can be
disabled with the setup utility supplied from NEC. Not having the DOS,
I don't have the setup utility.
   My question is, is there a utility of some kind or some information
as to what byte in the cmos ram gets changed to accomplish the shut-off?
I am quite satisfied with the Compaq DOS and do not wish to spend the
money for NEC'S if i can avoid it. Any help on this subject would be
greatly appreciated.
                                     Thanks a lot,
                                         Raoul Nelson

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2044  08-28-88  15:38  (Read 118 times)
   from: TOM BRUCE
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: ALL CHARGECARD

Thought I would relate another pleasant experience with All Computers and
the ChargeCard:  Called up their Support BBS and was surprised to find a
new EMS 4.0 driver for the card.  I downloaded it and Viola!  For the cost
of a phone call I upgraded all my memory to the new spec.

It really seems to do the trick for Windows and all of its memory-hungry
applications.  I'm now anxious to get my Windows upgrade which promises to
make better use of EMS 4.0.  The ChargeCard is one investment that keeps
paying off.

Regards,
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2048  08-28-88  22:00  (Read 113 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: OOPS

OOPS!  I just read the rest of the thread and realized at last that you
have two boards and two drives.  I'm running 30meg and 60meg drives off my
WD27X with no problems so far.  My advice might apply if you were adding a
third drive, but I'd advise replacing the smaller drive first if you need
more storage.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2063  08-29-88  14:35  (Read 116 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: OOPS  Reply to #2048

The WD -27X card is RLL, true? What drive do you use for your 60meg?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2072  08-29-88  20:47  (Read 119 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2063

Hi, Tom.  I'm using a ST238 and a Miniscribe 3675 partitioned with Ontrack
Disk Manager to two 31+ logical drives (D and E).  The 27X seems to work
allright, but the C\> takes longer to appear than it did with the Dreaded
Adaptec 2070A.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2081  08-30-88  17:06  (Read 121 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2072

hmmm, RLL technology is supposed to be 1.5x faster. Got CONFIG.SYS? Got
BUFFERS= some big number between 24 and 48 ? Try a cache program. Or maybe
your interleave is all wrong. That's pretty common.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2085  08-30-88  21:51  (Read 119 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2081

Buffers=24, will try 20 and see if there's a difference.  I can't remember
what the interleave default was,3 or 4, I think.  Wasn't there a file on
Mahoney to change the interleave w/o reformating?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2088  08-30-88  23:18  (Read 120 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2085

The program to change the interleave without reformatting is ILEAVE16.ARC,
available here on this board.  I would STILL back up the whole thing,
though, before doing it, because if you have a power outage or something
you could still lose your disk info.  I've used an earlier version of that
program with good results.


     Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2092  08-31-88  03:47  (Read 121 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2088

Be very careful with that program.  I tried to use it on my 30 Meg drive.
It took 7 hours to complete, even though its estimate was 45 minutes.  When
it was done, everyting seemed OK until a couple of days later when I tried
to run Catdisk.  It wcould not build its file out on the hard disk.  I was
able to copy and/or delete entire file, but any program that slowly built a
file would not work properly.  Kept comming up with a sector not found
error.  Since it is the same drive that I have always been using, and still
am using, and it has no marginal sectors on it anywhere, I concluded that
when the program re-low level formatted each sector, it mess up on the
formatting somewhere.  Forunately I had done a backup before I used the
program, and re-low leveling, and formatting solved the problem entirely.
Thank God for Fastback.....................

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2099  08-31-88  20:55  (Read 116 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2088

I cut my CONFIG.SYS files and buffers to 20 and boot is much faster now.
Can you recommend interleave values for the ST238 and 3675 or will the
program set them automatically?  I backup with PCtools Deluxe whenever I
start fooling with the disks.  May you never thirst.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2102  09-01-88  00:10  (Read 127 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2099

Actually, I'm a little thirsty right now . . . Ahhh, that's better.  I went
and got a beer.

       The first thing the program does is check what your present
interleave is, and then tests other interleaves and tells you what it finds
to be the best, and then asks permission to go ahead and change the
interleave to that value.  A very courteous and intelligent program.

        Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2106  09-01-88  19:45  (Read 123 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2102

Did you see the other reply that talked of problems when building a file
slowly, like maybe DLing or maintaining a LOG file?  Maybe I'd be better
off backing up and running thru a total reformating procedure.  Sounds like
another afternoon blown.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2112  09-01-88  23:08  (Read 128 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2106

Yeah, I saw the message about building files slowly, but I didn't
understand it.  What difference does the speed at which you build a file
make?  Anyway, you should STILL just use ILEAVE.  That program DOES give
you a whole new low level format, track by track.  There's no other way to
change the interleave.

       Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2118  09-03-88  22:28  (Read 115 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2112

Since the slow boot has been considerably improved by the reduction of
files and buffers specified in CONFIG.SYS, the interleave question is nowin
the realm of "ain't broke enough to fix."  Otherwise, I think I would just
do a low level format, set partition(s) and DOS format.  While I study my
TELIX30 SALT manual to pass the time.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2149  09-06-88  11:49  (Read 103 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2085

Yes, ILEAVEn or ILEAVEnn where n was some number(s). It was very slow, took
all night in one case, but I have weird hardware. If you use it, tell me
what results you get. One note: If the onterleave you have is radically
wrong, ILEAVE will report some strange number like 19. It might have been
called IAU.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2153  09-06-88  12:13  (Read 103 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2099

Interleave values depend greatly on hard disk access time, processor speed,
and controller design. No way to recommend a good value, except that making
it too low can murder your performance even more than making it too high.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2154  09-06-88  12:17  (Read 104 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2106

Well, get this: I used ILEAVExx to do my second drive. It went all day then
crashed. The drive was intact and tested out ok. I restarted it and went
home an hour later. I got in thatmorning to discover it had crashed again.
By the way, this machine it normally very twitchy. Anyhow, I didn't have
time to fix it. I discovered that I had one interleave from track 1 thru
about 560, and a different interleave from there to the end. Really. And it
works. The drive is faster near the low tracks. I used DTST to read out
the track access time in mS and its true. I used that drive in that
condition for months with no trouble.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #14

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2168  09-06-88  21:12  (Read 106 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2149

Cutting FILES/BUFFERS to 20 in CONFIG.SYS speeded up booting considerably,
and I'm getting conflicting reports about ILEAVENN.ARC"(TM-SEA)" so I've
decided it ain't broke enuf to fix.  I have the file, but no time to play
with it anyway, it would be quicker to low and dos reformat.  Grok in
fullness.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #15

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2170  09-06-88  21:15  (Read 107 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2153

I believe it is set at 3 now, 2 would be only a slight improvement, 1 isn't
recommended for 8Mhz XT's, so (inter)leave well enough alone.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #16

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2172  09-06-88  21:21  (Read 109 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2154

I'm not sure I follow.  It crashed twice, then the third time it worked and
gave different interleaves at different parts of the disk?  The last part
could make sense if the sectors are larger further from the center...why do
I feel like I know less about this than I thought a minute ago...Anyway,
what I said in the previous messages still applies(I guess).  Share Water.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #17

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2177  09-07-88  00:05  (Read 107 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2172

Oh come on!   How can you say that it would be quicker to low level format,
then FDISK, then high level format rather then run a program you haven't
even seen yet?  Try it!  First it will tell you what your current
interleave is, then calculate what the optimum interleave is.  That takes
about a minute or two.  Then you can tell it to go ahead and leave for
lunch.  When you get back, you will have a faster machine.  It can be just
that easy, and I have used it on several machines I come in contact with.
Of course it helps if you have a current backup, but you should have that
at all times anyway.  The advantage is that it is all unattended, all
accomplished in one step, and avoids the fdisk, format and restore steps.

       Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #18

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2184  09-07-88  21:12  (Read 104 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2177

Some of the messages in this thread refer to multiple hours for ILEAVE to
perform it's function.  I have 30 and 60 meg RLL drives, and not enough
hours in the day to do all that I would.  I'm not being narrowminded, its
just that having the IDEAL interleave is for now a low priority.  I have
the 1.6 release of ILEAVE and may do it when I have some free time...which
probably won't be until the 80886 256bit processor is current.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #19

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2189  09-07-88  22:12  (Read 104 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2184

David,

If you regularly backup the drives, I would like to recommend a program
available here called "OPTIMIZE.arc" or "OPTIMISE.arc". I have used it
several times on different drives and the actual optimization is really
fast. The time for the backup and restore must also be taken into account,
but if you use Fastback (tm) or PCBACKUP (tm) you can accomplish the whole
thing much faster than with ILEAVE, at least in my experience. With RLL
drives, you may have to just let OPTIMISE find the proper interleave for
you and then do the format from debug, specifying the interleave you want
instead of having the roms use the default value. But it does work well,
and really improves performance enough to warrant the time.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #20

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2192  09-07-88  22:45  (Read 101 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2189

Thanks, Steve.  I don't have much experience with backup software, I've
usually in the past just copied generated files to floppies, but I used the
backup in PCTOOLS(tm)(SEAsux) before changing from Adaptec to WD
controllers.  Will DL OPTIMI(n)e.arc ASAP.  Might be interesting to compare
it with ILEAVE, try both and see respective results.  May get to it next
February 29 if I follow current schedule.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #21

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2194  09-08-88  06:57  (Read 101 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2192

Dave,

That is the backup I was refering to. Anyway, the results SHOULD be the
same. It is just that the time required is much less with OPTIMISE. And as
I  said, I'm not sure how well ILEAVE works with RLL drives. I had one that
refused to complete the format and had to do it from debug and enter the
interleave myself. Go for it, in most cases the results are dramatic.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #22

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2195  09-08-88  11:48  (Read 100 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2172

The program quit at some cylinder in the 500's, there are therefore two
different interleaves on the drive. Something nice before that cylinder and
something less than nice after. I ran that way for months with no problem,
if you can believe that. Eventually I reformatted that drive.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #23

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2199  09-08-88  22:15  (Read 99 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2194

Thanks, I will try to get to it. Mebbe this weekend.  What? And skip IMTS
at McCormick Place? Nevah!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #24

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2200  09-08-88  22:17  (Read 108 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2195

Sounds shaky to me, not for me thanks.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #25

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2215  09-09-88  23:44  (Read 103 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2200

I know, I know, it IS hard to find the time to do things.  But with ILEAVE,
you don't have to BE THERE for the whole thing.  You can start it up, let
it check the current interleave and calculate the optimal interleave, and
tell it to go!  Then YOU GO!  Come back on Monday morning and you have
(voila!) a faster disk.  I'm not trying to twist your arm or anything (did
it break yet?), but not having enough time available is not a good enough
excuse!  :-)

       Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #26

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2227  09-10-88  23:12  (Read 104 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2215

No time to say hello/goodby I'mlateI'mlateI'mlate.....

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #27

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2237  09-12-88  00:24  (Read 106 times)
   from: ROB GREENBERG
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2215

     cc: DAVID BIRCH

Or, gentlemen, you can buy SPINRITE which will automatically do the job
PROPERLY (no screwy behavior, no disks formatted at 2 interleaves) for
around $59.

It does an excellent job, is a joy to use, and does a 30 meg partition of
my hard drive in a couple of hours.

Rob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #28

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2253  09-12-88  20:50  (Read 109 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: ROB GREENBERG (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2237

I've heard good things about SPINRITE; thanks for reminding me that there's
a world outside shareware. Never thirst.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #29

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2308  09-17-88  09:43  (Read 96 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: OOPS  Reply to #2177

There seems to be major confusion about interleaving.  Hope this clarifies:
Interleaving applies only to soft sectored hard drives. It means that when
the sectors are constructed on the drive (via low level format), the second
sector is placed right after the first sector (interleave 1), two sectors
after the first sector (interleave 2), 3 sectors after the first sector
(interleave 3) etc. etc.
Eg on a drive with 7 sectors (to save space), interleave 1 would mean that
the sectors occur in the order: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7.
Interleave 2 means they are in order 1 5 2 6 3 7 4
Interleave 3 means they are in order 1 6 4 2 7 5 3.  Get it?
Now, what does altering interleave do?  It means that a program will have
to wait more (or less) time before the next sector comes under the head
(and is available to be read).  The OPTIMUM interleave is a fiction. (as
are any programs that claim to compute it!).  It depends on the program
that you are running.  The most that a program such as ILEAVE can do is
compute timing for an 'average' program, adjusting the interleave until
this time is minimized.
Changing the interleave downwards or upwards can BOTH result in longer
execution time for any given program.
Note -- the 'optimal' number for a MFM controller is NOT the same as for an
RLL, and the RLL is almost always BIGGER than the MFM. (Remember, the time
a program needs to 'get ready' for the next sector means that MORE sectors
have gone past on a RLL controller than on an MFM controller).
I have found by experience that optimal interleaves are:
XT -- Non RLL 3 or 4.  RLL 5 or 6.
AT -- MFM controller 2 or 3.  Adaptec 2372 (NICE controller!) 1.
Being too conservative (higher number) means your program may run SOMEWHAT
slower.  Being too liberal (lower number than above) many mean your program
runs MUCH MUCH slower...
Enjoy...
Oh - there is NOTHING at all bad about having different interleaves at
different tracks on the drive.  Odd maybe, but it will not 'confuse' the
controller.  After all, its still looking for sector 3 (say), and doesn't
care where it finds it...
Craig, sysop pinecliffe bbs.
(303)4447073

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2048 reply #30  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2050  08-28-88  22:45  (Read 118 times)
   from: PATRICK KELLER
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: HARD DISK CONTROLLERS

     cc: JEFFREY HOWELL
     cc: NICK KEES

     Thanks for the warning about using an ST225 as an RLL drive.  My XT
came set up with an ST225 and a WD 27X controller, although I haven't
known what exactly the components were until recently.  Maybe the
controller isn't set to operate as an RLL system - I really don't know.  It
hasn't given me any trouble, other than that 20 Meg just doesn't cut it any
more.  Hence the purchase of a Miniscribe 3675 that I want to use along
with the ST225.  Or does your experience still indicate that the fuse is
burning on my ST225?
     Based on all the good advice, my first objective now is to get the
necessary cable and try both drives on the first controller.  The cable
should be easier to locate during the week.  However, based on discussions
prior to obtaining the Miniscribe 3675, I'm concerned that it may require a
controller with different characteristics (RLL) than the ST225, and remain
interested in how that is to be accomplished, if it is necessary.
     This is much harder than it ought to be because of my ignorance.  An
older and wiser man once told me that "Good judgement comes from
experience, and experience comes from bad judgement."  This feels like the
experience phase which follows bad judgement.
     Thanks again for the help, guys.           ** Pat **
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2054  08-29-88  07:09  (Read 116 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DISK CONTROLLERS  Reply to #2050

Pat,

Since you are local (well, almost) it won't be to big a problem to get you
the info you need to pull it off. The fact that bought a machine with a 225
hooked to an RLL controller only shows that whoever sold it to you either
didn't know what they were doing or they had a great deal of faith in their
luck. Try doing a 'chkdsk' and record what it says for the total disk space
on the drive as it sits. Not the free space, the total. If it is >30 megs,
it is running RLL, if not, it is MFM. I can't find anything saying it can
be done this way, but maybe... If you decide to go with two controllers, I
would suggest you get another WD controller (1002-WX1) as it is sure to be
compatible with the 27X. Also, you must have the 'Super Bios' in both
controllers. This is not too big a trick if you have ONE Super Bios, the
other is just an eprom away. I can handle that for you.

As for the difference between the Miniscribe and the 225, run properly they
will require different characteristics in the controller. Thus you may be
stuck with using two of them. Is the 225 drive easily accessible (can you
get it out of the case easily)?

I'll leave you a private message with my home phone number and maybe we can
discuss this a little further. It is easier voice since my fingers wear out
rapidly when I type. Too much backspacing....

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2070  08-29-88  20:38  (Read 117 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2064

Tom,

As I recall, he has a MiniScribe 3765. And he was/is trying to run the Mini
as RLL and also the 225. That is why he wanted to run two controllers. But
the problem lies in using his present controller (WD -27X) to run a MFM
drive. Don't think it can be done. He can run the Mini as an RLL an the
-27X but the 225, in my humble opinion, should not be run RLL. If you
recall a year or so back, this is exactly the setup that cost me 2 drives
in 4 days. Thus I can't recommend it to anyone. But if he ran a -WX1 for
the 225 and the Mini, it may work. I have the WD docs for both controllers
so if he calls me we may be able to work something out to his satisfaction.
Hope so, a 60 meg drive is sure a nice thing to have. Why, I could store
amost all of my Readmac pics on one of them. ;-) just kidding!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2131  09-05-88  13:58  (Read 113 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2070

This is rather fun, seeing all these questions... Here goes...
Miniscribe drives are built (these days) to considerably higher quality
standards than Seagates (I've been a dealer for 8 years.  I quit using
Seagates when 3 out of 4 failed within a month, and when I plugged power in
a 4038 and several chips on the baseboard DETONATED.  Drive had NEVER been
tested!).
USUALLY Miniscribe drives will run RLL without trouble.  Exception is the
3053 when I have never got to run RLL.
Miniscribe has RLL versions of most of their drives (not 3053).
Eg... 8438 is RLL version of 8425.
      3675 is RLL version of 3650.
      6079 is RLL version of 6053.
Note 'RLL version' means 'guaranteed to work RLL'.
To Seagates:
Non-RLL seagates will NEVER run RLL.
Hence a St225 should NEVER repeat NEVER work RLL.
The RLL version is the ST238.
Anyone telling you any differently either 1) doesn't know or 2) has an
interest in your buying the cheaper 225.  2) applies to your dealer,
possibly 1) as well.
RLL controller (eg 27x) can NOT be run MFM.  Your drive MUST be able to
handle the increased density from an RLL controller (27 sectors vs 17).
The reasons for a drive being able to run RLL are rather technical, but
much misinformation abounds.
Some say you need plated media (not true, but often helps).
The main thing you need is a very precise spindle motor.  Any speed
variations are much more fatal when you are reading 50% mor per track.
Examples of plated media drives that will NOT run RLL are Lapines. (Had
about 30 of them, with a zero percent success rate).
Oh - a WARNING.  Formatting a drive RLL (such as the 225) will often NOT
lead to immediate errors.  RLL failures usually arise as corrupted data
sectors, after the sector has been written several times.  So, you may get
32 mb originally with out bad sectors, only to see seek and data errors
crop up later.
If you have any more questions, give me a call (voice) 303 444 7071, bbs -
Pinecliffe [phone].....
craig, sysop pinecliffe.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2136  09-05-88  14:30  (Read 105 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: CRAIG BAKER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2131

     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL

Since there are many version of ST-225's (Read message #1796), your
statement regarding ST-225's not formatting RLL may be in error.  I am
presently using ST-225's in an XT with an Omti 5527 RLL only controller.
As the message states there are two versions of the drive that will not
reliably run RLL.  But the third type of drive does consistently run RLL.
As to controller the Adaptec controller (can't recall the number), will
runn MFM or RLL.  You just have to select the drive type when low leveling.
 I don't recommend running ST-225's RLL, this is just what I have done in
the past and will contiunue to to in the future.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2137  09-05-88  14:42  (Read 107 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2135

Hmmm... I as I said found my OEM on a 27x.  But not a good idea (not
obvious what they do with the prom, anyway).
If you mean, 'can you hook a 225 up to controller' answer is yes.
If you mean 'can you run it as 38mb drive reliably' answer is unqualified
no.
The older drives were considerably better quality than current generation.
It would not surprise me to have someone running an older drive for a yar
year with not problems. It WOULD surprise me to find a current drive
running RLL without the creeping format corruption I described.
Perhaps the guys you know just got lucky.... not reason for anyone else to.
As to other requirements to run RLL, of course there are several others.
But I thought my messages was ALREADY too long!
Craig, sysop pinecliffe,.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2138  09-05-88  14:46  (Read 109 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2136

No current version 225 (last 10months) that I know of will run RLL.
Older drives MAY.  But it is never something that should even be tried.
Failure mode is creeping loss of data (as well as occasionally getting tons
of bad sectors, on a VERY bad drive).
Yes, some controllers (very few) will run both MFM and RLL. But why pay for
it?  All common controllers are one or the other.
My experiences with Seagates recently are such that I would not recommend
using ANY seagate drive. RLL or not....

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2139  09-05-88  15:03  (Read 105 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: CRAIG BAKER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2138

Older 225's will not runn RLL.  It is only the one that have the ST-238
controller that will run RLL reliably.  You may of had some bad luck with
Seagates, but that is the only drive that I will run.  Currently I am using
the 4038, and the 4053 in my AT, and 2-225's in my XT slave.  About a year
ago the 225 did have a unacceptable failure rate.  Since some of these
drive went out into the field, and are used differently, it makes the 225
still look like a culprit.  The newer seagates do not have this problem,
but slightly older ones do.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2140  09-05-88  20:57  (Read 107 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2136

Keith,

I agree with you. But due to the scope of this system and my not having
direct access to each and every 225 drive that may come into question, I
think it fair to say that you should *never* run a 225 drive RLL. You know,
I know, and I'm sure that Craig Baker knows how to tell the diference. But
the NEXT guy to read my message saying that it OK may not know, and may not
know that there is a difference and may not ask. Therefore, I try to be a
little careful what I recommend unless I have reason to believe that the
person asking or discussing the situation knows what is going on.

The Adaptec controller I referred to was the 2070A and it can run either
way, one advantage for it. But the guys I referred to were running the OLD
ST225 drives (before there were threetypes) and are still doing so. And
they are running them as RLL drives.

I hope you can understand my reasoning. Basically I am in full accord with
you, I just am a little careful about recommending it to everyone.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2141  09-05-88  21:05  (Read 105 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: CRAIG BAKER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2137

Craig,

We are in agreement then. See my reply to Keith Beckman for my reasoning in
the reply. I know it can be done, WE don't recommend it, and WE may or may
not rry it ourselves. Is this a fair assessment. I for one won't try it,
except with a very old drive. I did try it myself on the recommendation of
another, and had exactly the results you described. One drive in 10 hours a
nd the other within a few days. The only difference is that BOTH drives
were junk when they failed! Neither would format at all! You can bet *I*
will be selective about which drives I attempt it on in the future! Hope
you see my logic here.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2142  09-05-88  21:16  (Read 106 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2139

Keith,

I really don't want to start (or continue) a running battle, but my
experience is quite different re: the older drives. As I said before, the
older (>2 years old) do run RLL reliably, at least with the Adaptec 2072A
controller. I personally know people doing it, and a few who have done it,
and have heard of *many* who were and still are doing it. But all of them
have very old drives, dating back ro the days when the 2070A became
generally available. Again, since I don't know the age of the drives a
fellow might ask about, I feel it only fair to NOT recommend it since the
vast majority of the newer drives probably won't last a month with, say, a
WD -27X controller. BTW, there was also a problem with the -27X
controllers/bios roms such that even with a 238 the drive would crap out in
short order! I had one of those too! If their is any doubt about this, just
ask Everex. They shipped a ton of them, and got them all back (or at least
90% of them)!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2143  09-05-88  21:54  (Read 105 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2140

I have never recommended using the ST-225 with an RLL controller.  As I
have stated earlier in an earlier message, there are different types of
ST-225's out on the market.  For someone to come out and say that the drive
can not runn RLL is untrue.  I use my ST-225's RLL, and I will continue to
do so.  If someone is interested in experimenting with hard drives, I have
an excellent explination as to the different type of ST-255's, in message
#1796 (I think).  Again, I do not recommend using the ST-225 with an RLL
controller, unless you have the correct type of ST-225, and are willing to
take the chance on it.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2144  09-05-88  22:01  (Read 103 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2142

I don't wish to continue a battle either.  I simply feel that if someone
asks a question regarding hardware that he should be given all the facts.
If I were to ask the same question, I would also want a correct response.
If it simply can't be done, thats fine, but if it actually can be done with
perhaps another version of hardware, I would want to know that.  I don't
believe that you started this thread either, I believe that is was the
person from Denver, CO.  As to using the seagates RLL, I don't think I'll
run out and buy an MFM controller, because I'm afraid that my 2-seagates
will crap out, since they have been up and running for almost a year of 8
to 10 hour days 5 to 6 days a week.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2146  09-06-88  06:54  (Read 103 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: KEITH BECKMANN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2144

Keith,

I sure hate to let that one go, but there is no point in continuing any
further since you obviously missed my point entirely. Just hope someone
reading or collecting these messages doesn't read them and decide to try it
based on your rather overpowering statements. Even at todays prices, the
225 isn't cheap. At least not for some of us!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2165  09-06-88  13:58  (Read 105 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2146

I see that you have missed my point as well.  I have NEVER recommended
using the drive RLL to anyone.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2050 reply #14  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2051  08-28-88  23:16  (Read 113 times)
   from: STEVE RUSTON
     to: ALL
subject: LASER PRINTERS

G'DAY FROM DOWN UNDER.....
I have a slight problem with laser printers res
and the biggest manufactre hewart packard has a policy of
giving out little or No information, So  its to you I now Turn,
The problem:- the highest res on a laser jet printer here is 300dpi,
But I have heard that theree is a 600dpi avaible in THe USA, Hewlatt
packard deni this and say that a 1200 dpi is in the pipeline.
 Is this True??? can anyone support this or prove it wrong??
if anyone knows anything please let me know.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2065  08-29-88  14:45  (Read 115 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: STEVE RUSTON (Rcvd)
subject: R: LASER PRINTERS  Reply to #2051

All the way from Melbourn? G'day mate! Nice to hear from the other side of
the big pond. Are you really calling from down under, or are you on the
continent on a visit?

If you have plenty of money, the Varityper VT600 is a 600 dpi unit.
It uses a 16mhz 68020 cpu, 6 meg of memory, 20mb hard disk (really!) and
has interfaces for serial, parallel, and Appletalk. One version of it sells
for $16000 u.s. See the September 1988 isssue of Byte Magazine for a review
of the printer. It was the only reviewed with anything but 300 dpi res.
It also supports version 48.0.4 PostScript.

Any help?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2051 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2052  08-29-88  00:26  (Read 115 times)
   from: TOM VANSELOW
     to: ALL
subject: PLOTTERS

Hi,
   I'm looking into buting a plotter and I'm not sure what makes up a good
one...   What do I look for and who makes plotters which are supported by
most CADD programs?     I know HP is supose to make good stuff, but they
are expensive!  I'm not looking to spend much, but I'd like to get my
moneys worth...         Any suggestions?

                                             Thanks,
                                                Tom
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2055  08-29-88  07:14  (Read 116 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: TOM VANSELOW (Rcvd)
subject: R: PLOTTERS  Reply to #2052

TOM,

      I have been using a Houston Instruments DMP 51 for two years and no
failures, but it is also an expensive plotter. The thing I like the most
about the H.I. is the accuracy, and it always make a good drawing. (As good
as the operator). Good luck!

                                 Steve Morgan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2052 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2066  08-29-88  16:03  (Read 116 times)
   from: TOM VANSELOW
     to: STEVE MORGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PLOTTERS  Reply to #2055

Steve,
        Thanks for the reply.  I'll take a look at H.I. equipment.

                                         thanks,
                                          Tom Vanselow

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2052 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2132  09-05-88  13:59  (Read 98 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: STEVE MORGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PLOTTERS  Reply to #2055

You might consider an Enter SP1800.  It is a multipen A-D size, HP
compatible, at approx half of HP's price....

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2052 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2071  08-29-88  20:44  (Read 114 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: CORRECTION TO #2070

Tom,

unfortunately, you can't edit if you notice an error after doing a "Z"!
What I meant to say was if he ran a -WX1 for the 225 and a -27X for the
Mini it may work, etc. Sorry.

-[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2075  08-29-88  23:58  (Read 121 times)
   from: PATRICK KELLER
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: HARD DISK CONTROLLERS

     cc: NICK KEES
     cc: JEFFREY HOWELL
     cc: TOM PETERS
     cc: DUANE KONKEL

     Steve, your info of message #2054 matches completely with what I've
learned from Western Digital and Duane Konkel of DAK Technologies, who has
also been very helpful.  This BBS is a great source of technical info.
     My problem has been that I have wanted to continue to use my ST225,
which has a MFM controller, at the same time as my new Miniscribe 3675,
which requires an RLL controller.  Because of the different contoller
types, it is indeed necessary to have two controllers, one for each disk.
Once I got the info on changing the interrupts for the second controller,
which is a WD 1002, not a 1002A, things went according to plan.
     To change the interrupts for a WD 1002 27X controller for disk #2:
        1. The W4 jumper has to be on 1&2
        2. The W8 jumper has to be on 1&2
        3. The W6 jumper has to be on 1&2
        4. The W3 jumper should be left in place
     To operate in non-translated mode, any disk:
        1. In the S1 jumpers, number 6 should be jumpered but not number 5
           ( If a WD 27X model has no S1 jumpers, all jumpers should be
             removed )
        2. W9 should not be jumpered.
     With jumpers set as above, the disk installation went smoothly.
Although I haven't has much time to use it, everything seems to be working
fine with two controllers in place.
     Incidently, version 3.3 of Disk Manager which came with the Miniscribe
uses 2k clusters as its default value, not 4k.  Is 2k a more suitable
value?  I hope so, since that's how I'm set up at this point.
     Thanks very much for the offer of additional help, and  thanks to
Nick Kees, Jeffrey Howell, Tom Peters, and Duane Konkel.
     Hope I can help you guys sometime.  Now to play with my new toy!
                                                **  Pat  **
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2077  08-30-88  07:15  (Read 116 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: HARD DISK CONTROLLERS  Reply to #2075

Pat,

Glad you got it working. I had assumed that that was your reasoning for two
controllers. I was just afraid you were about to trash your 225 on a RLL
controller. You apparently have gotten the proper config from WD and DAK
since it works and agrees with the docs I have.

Thanks for the info on Disk manager. I'll have to have my friend check on
it. We set up his ST251 last week and it wound up with 4k clusters, thus my
reference to that value. I don't know what version he was using, tho.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2075 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2087  08-30-88  23:14  (Read 115 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2077

My understanding of Ontrack's Disk Manager is that the cluster size is
dependent on the partition size.  That is, if you have one partition that
is bigger than 33 meg, you will get bigger clusters than 2K.  I've used
Disk Manager to set up several ST251 disks with 2 20 meg partitions and got
2K clusters.

        Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2075 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2094  08-31-88  06:54  (Read 118 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2087

Thanks, Nick. That is exactly what we did. I never thought of that and must
have missed it in the docs.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2075 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2152  09-06-88  12:08  (Read 96 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2087

It seems to me that some later versions of Ontrack's Disk Manager even let
you override the cluster size choice.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2075 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2238  09-12-88  00:32  (Read 108 times)
   from: ROB GREENBERG
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: HARD DISK CONTROLL  Reply to #2152

     cc: NICK KEES

Later versions of Ontrack's Disk Manager *do* allow you to override the
default cluster size.  The problem is, if you pick something other than the
default, CHKDSK and some other programs may balk when they see your choice.

If you don't care about CHKDSK and some weird, outdated programs, you can
have any size clusters that you want.

Rob

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2075 reply #5  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2083  08-30-88  17:48  (Read 115 times)
   from: PAT PFAFFL
     to: ALL
subject: NEAT CHIPS

I need some information on the new Chips and Technologies NEATSET chips
used in the 20 Mhz 286 machines.  I recently purchased such a machine,
which came with little documentation on the setup of the NEATSET chips.
Thavailable parameters are very confusing to me.  Anyone with the specs or
any other info on the chips or the settings for the chips would be
appreciated.
Pat
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2155  09-06-88  12:28  (Read 101 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: PAT PFAFFL (Rcvd)
subject: R: NEAT CHIPS  Reply to #2083

Well, I can tell you what I remember about the NEAT chipset.

It has a buncha options for shadowing 16k chunks of memory at various
locations.  That's for cards that are built to take advantage of RAM
shadowing. Some are, summer not. If a card is, shadow its ROM into ram and
it'l run lots faster. Hard disk controllers live at C800, or as the NEAT
chipset says (in absolute address format) C8000. I know there's an ARCNET
card that can use shadowed RAM, etc.

Should have said first that RAM shadowing doesn't work if you select the
640k-1024k relocation option. In fact, most of the options are incompatible
with 1024k relocation, which moves your top 384k of RAM from its useless
postion above the 640k boundry up to 1 meg. Then you can use it as regular
AT style extended RAM. That's NOT Lotus/Intel/Microsoft type EMS RAM by the
way.

I think you also have options for BIOS and VIdeo ROM shadowing, also
incompatible with 640-1024 relocation. Turn them on, they make things
hustle along faster.

The Kaypro implementation of the NEAT chipset in their 16 mHz '286 requires
that you turn 640-1024k relocate OFF if you add a LIM board for EMS RAM.
Dunno why, that;s what the Kaypro tech support guy told me.

What other options do you have?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2083 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2182  09-07-88  20:19  (Read 101 times)
   from: PAT PFAFFL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: NEAT CHIPS  Reply to #2155

Tom,
The NEATset chips control alot more than you refered to...  the 206 chip
is refered to as the 'integrated peripherals controller' which controls
XIO R/W wait states, DMA wait states,  etc.  The 211 chip is the 'bus
controller' which controls processor select, timeout, bus delays and wait
states, and clock source.  The 212 is the 'memory controller', which is the
chip you spoke of.  Unfortunately my knowledge of such functions and there
actual affect on performance is severely lacking.  There are so many
parameterq to alter between the three chips that trial and error can be not
only time|4N~?nsuming, but also frustrating (the resulting effects depend
on the combination of parameters used).  Thanks for the input.  The info
was useful, but I am still looking for a more complete description of the
Neatset cp settings and there function.  Thanks again.
Pat

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2083 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2084  08-30-88  21:24  (Read 116 times)
   from: KEITH ROGERS
     to: ALL
subject: THE JOY OF SPINRITE

    Everybody talks about Spinrite so it seemed like time to take a
look at it.  A check with Egghead offered delivery in 20 days, maybe.
A call to Gibson Research in Laguna Hills, CA offered ship the next
morning with delivery at the mercy of snailmail.  Sounded good to me
so an order was placed on a Wednesday, mailed on Thursday, with
delivery coming on Monday.  First class postage yielded 44th class
delivery.  Figures.  Reading the manual first (honest!  And it was
necessary, it turns out.  For all you new guys to Spinrite, RTFM
*FIRST*.  It saved me a lot of heartache.  You absolutely must create
a special disk from the supplied disk to run Spinrite.  The supplied
disk is write protected, and Spinrite requires that certain things
from the operating system be put on the disk from which Spinrite is
run.  It personalizes the program for your system.)
.
     My hard disk is a 42 MB unit, split into 33.4 and 9.2 MB
partitions.  Started with the D: drive, 9.2MB, as a test to see how
long it takes Spinrite to do its thing.  Early returns of the program
yielded an initial 2:1 interleave for my disk with a data transfer
rate of 261Kbytes/sec. and an average random seek time of 37ms.  It
further decided that a 1:1 interleave was possible!!  The new data
transfer rate would be 522 Kbytes/sec.  That alone is reason enough to
have Spinrite.  Choosing the most stringent test of the disk, level 4,
is most strongly recommended for the first use of the program.  It
took 61 minutes to do the hard disk tests, and reset the interleave to
1:1.  All this is done in place.  By that, I mean that you do not need
to remove any thing from the disk in terms of files.  ALL TSR's,
INSTALLED PROGRAMS LIKE DBASE AND LOTUS, ETC. MUST BE DE-INSTALLED,
however.  RTFM.  (Message continued....)
.
     Next up, the C: drive at 33.4 MB.  This drive took 3h47m to do.
Time well spent, as now the data transfer rate is up to 522KBytes/sec.
Plus, now I know that there is not a single bad byte on the hard disk.
The 84 different bit patterns that were written to disk in testing
guarantee it.  And the low-level format has been refreshed.
.
Summary:
   1) Spinrite is a beauty.  Absolutely NO problems, glitches, hang-
      ups, burps, funny business.
   2) Interleave now at 1:1 vice 2:1, with twice the data xfer rate.
   3) If you read the manual first, you cannot go wrong.  It is
      perfectly clear, lucid, easy to follow.
   4) The current version is 1.2a, and does not go with any version of
      DOS 4.0.  Updates will be available, but may not be free this
      time.
   5) Notwithstanding the purported lack of need to remove anything
      (other than installed programs) from the disk prior to using
      Spinrite, only a damn fool would run it without first backing
      up.  Me, I use Fastback Plus, but almost anything similar would
      work.  Even the DOS Backup/Restore.
   6) $59.  For what you get, this is dirt cheap.  And what you get,
      mainly, is peace of mind that your hard disk is as finely tuned
      as it can get.
   7) Spinrite will not re-low-level format a hard disk that has been
      formatted with RLL disk drive controllers that use 26 sectors per
      track.
   8) FIRST, RTFM!
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2097  08-31-88  07:32  (Read 119 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: KEITH ROGERS (Rcvd)
subject: R: THE JOY OF SPINRITE  Reply to #2084

Keith,
    Thanks for the details on Spinrite.  I enjoyed your comments about
RTFM.  One major point you forgot to mention is that Spinrite has a 32 meg
partition limitation.  I'll probably wait until Gibson resolves this before
I plunk down my $59.  Now, if I could only figure out a way to tell my
users to RTFM witout any offense being taken!  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2084 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2100  08-31-88  21:10  (Read 123 times)
   from: KEITH ROGERS
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: THE JOY OF SPINRIT  Reply to #2097

Thanks for you kind words, Al, and thanks also for pointing out the 32MB
limitation.  I should have said that.  Would most computer users understand
that 32MB is really more than 33MB in actual count?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2084 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2104  09-01-88  07:40  (Read 121 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: KEITH ROGERS
subject: R: R: THE JOY OF SPINRIT  Reply to #2100

I would think that most people HERE would understand the 1024 bytes per K,
but I don't know about REAL users.  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2084 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2156  09-06-88  12:33  (Read 100 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: THE JOY OF SPINRIT  Reply to #2097

The >Phil> version is RYFM, same general meaning. I too would like to have
a polite way of saying it.

We have another one, for times when we get called to go on a service call
at $50/hour only to find that they knocked to plug out of the wall. It goes
like this:

TECHNICIAN COMMENTS/WORK DONE: Short in operator's headset.

I got that from Don Senzig.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2084 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2158  09-06-88  12:35  (Read 100 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: KEITH ROGERS (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: THE JOY OF SPINRIT  Reply to #2100

Let me get this straight about Spinright:  32mb is really 33.something
million bytes, and spinright works with 32mb, which is really 33.something
million bytes? or is there some stupid limitation to 32 million bytes which
is really 31.something megs?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2084 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2163  09-06-88  12:46  (Read 98 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: THE JOY OF SPINRIT  Reply to #2156

Tom,
    yeah that happens every now and then ..  my system operator accidently
stepped on a multi-outlet box under our modem table and wondered why our
communications ceased to function ....    AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2084 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2175  09-06-88  23:30  (Read 102 times)
   from: KEITH ROGERS
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: THE JOY OF SPINRIT  Reply to #2158

Spinrite uses the same convention as othere computer folks: 32MB is really
33,554,432 bytes, a r of 2.  It all boils down to the use 1024 bytes, a
power of 2, but which is called just 1 K bytes.  I sure hope you can
readtrhis, my screen is a mess ewith noise.  So it is 33,554,432 bytes that
Spinrite will handle, which if divided by 1.024 yeilds 32,768,000 commonly
called 32 Mb.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2084 reply #7  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2086  08-30-88  22:23  (Read 112 times)
   from: JIM CAMPOLO
     to: ALL
subject: MICROSCIENCE FDISK 60MEG

I HAVE BEEN TRYING TO INSTALL THE ABOVE DRIVE ON AN AT CLONE AND
I HAVE HAD NO LUCK.  I HAVE USED DISK MANAGER AND THE PROGRAMS IN
HDTST1.ARC WITH NO HELP.  WITH HDTEST I GET I/O ERRORS IN EVERY
CYLINDER ON THE 3RD HEAD,  SECTOR 0.  IS THERE ANY WAY I CAN GET
AROUND THIS AND USE THIS DRIVE OR IS IT JUNK.
THANKS FOR ANY HELP
JIM
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2091  08-31-88  03:38  (Read 112 times)
   from: KEITH BECKMANN
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MICROSCIENCE FDISK  Reply to #2089

If you absolutely have to use the drive with the bad head, Try using a
program called disk manager, by on track.  It will reposition the sector 0
information for that head somewhere else.  I had a similar problem, and
that program fixed it.  I had 2 drives on my system, one with 4 heads, and
the other with 5.  The Bios on my controller would not allow 2 different
types of drives.  I set up the controller as if both drives had 5 heads.
Then I used the on track program to partition the 4 head drive, and tell
DOS that every sector on the 5th head was bad.  Seemed to work.  The only
problem that occured is when I used a program like coretest.  It would try
to bypass my bad sectoring and try and write out there.  Never did get
coretest to work on it, but amlost everything else didn't have a problem.
If you happen to have an Omti 5520B controller, it has a neat alternate
tracking method that will also solve your problem.  Since I switched to
that controller from the Western Digital, I have been surpised as to what
it can do.  Good Luck.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2086 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2095  08-31-88  07:20  (Read 115 times)
   from: JIM CAMPOLO
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MICROSCIENCE FDISK  Reply to #2089

     cc: SYSOP

Hows this.  how do I et around using one head on a drive?
Thanks for the response.
P.S. the drive is not under warranty.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2086 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2160  09-06-88  12:40  (Read 98 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JIM CAMPOLO (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MICROSCIENCE FDISK  Reply to #2095

Repeating, this sounds like a setup mismatch, rather than a bad head. Tho
it could be either.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2086 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2176  09-06-88  23:33  (Read 102 times)
   from: JIM CAMPOLO
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MICROSCIENCE FDISK  Reply to #2160

THKS VERY MUCH FOR THE INFO,  I THINK I HAVE A HDWR PROBLEM,  ILL LET
THE VENDOR WORY ABOUT THE REST,  WE TRIED EVERY DIAGNOSTIC
THE BBS AND MONEY COULD PROVIDE.
THANKS AGAIN,
JIM

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2086 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2090  08-31-88  00:05  (Read 115 times)
   from: ROLANDO PENA
     to: ALL
subject: PCJR MONITOR CABLE

Does anyone out there have an adapter cable for the jr monitor they want
to unload? P.C. Enterprise has one available but there is a 6 week wait.
I want to move up to an xt clone and still use the jr monitor. VGA will
come later I hope!
                                 thanks for any info
                                         Rolando Pena
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2098  08-31-88  20:16  (Read 113 times)
   from: PETER NYGAARD
     to: ALL
subject: MONO GRAPHICS


          I'M WONDERING WHAT MAY BE WRONG WITH MY MONITOR OR
          MONO GRAPHIC CARD.  I CAN DISPLAY A PROGRAM LIKE
          PRINTSHOP FOR ABOUT 3 MINUTES, IT THEN LOOSES SYNC
          ANY ALL THAT IS DISPLAYED IS A FINE HORIZONTAL LINE

          I HAVE TRIED ANOTHER GRAPHICS CARD, AND IT DOES THE
          SAME THING.  THERE FORE I DO NOT BELIEVE IT IS THE
          DISPLAY CARD...........

          ANY IDEAS......?            THANKS..........

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2103  09-01-88  02:25  (Read 122 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: PETER NYGAARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: MONO GRAPHICS  Reply to #2098

Does that horizontal line happen when you just let the monitor on and leave
it alone ?  I have had TV's that have had the horizontal line right in the
middle of the screen. In one case a tube fixed it, another a chip, neither
was expensive or complicated (color monitors are not as easy)...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2098 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2105  09-01-88  07:49  (Read 120 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: PETER NYGAARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: MONO GRAPHICS  Reply to #2098

It's in the monitor.  Your horizontal sync is gone, or about to go.  Better
have a tech take a look at it.  I've had 3 IBM 8513 monitors with the same
problem.  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2098 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2108  09-01-88  20:18  (Read 118 times)
   from: PETER NYGAARD
     to: THOMAS ATKINSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MONO GRAPHICS  Reply to #2103


         IN TEXT MODE THE MONITOR IS FINE, BUT THEN AT A
         RANDOM INTERVAL OF TIME.  THE MONITOR GOES WACKO!!

         THE WACKO! MODE ONLY OCCURS DURING A MONO GRAPHICS SESSION.



>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2098 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2109  09-01-88  20:21  (Read 120 times)
   from: PETER NYGAARD
     to: AL HANSEN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MONO GRAPHICS  Reply to #2105


          DID THE PROBLEM WITH YOUR MONITORS POP UP IN BOTH
          TEXT MODE AND GRAPHICS MODE?  IN MY CASE THE TEXT
          MODE IS GREAT, BUT LOOK OUT FOR THE GRAPHICS MODE!
          AFTER A RANDOM INTERVAL OF TIME, THE MONITOR WILL LOSE
          ITS SYNC.............


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2098 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2110  09-01-88  20:55  (Read 121 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: PETER NYGAARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MONO GRAPHICS  Reply to #2108

Borrow a monitor and see if you can eliminate the monitor itself. Then the
card could be suspect.  The horizontal sync message was what i have
experienced...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2098 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2114  09-02-88  07:24  (Read 125 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: PETER NYGAARD (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: MONO GRAPHICS  Reply to #2109

When the hor. synce went the whole screen went to one hor. thin line.  That
was it, a replacement was received for each dead one.  AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2098 reply #6  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2107  09-01-88  20:15  (Read 115 times)
   from: GEROLD GENETT
     to: ALL
subject: 1-2-3 NO PRINT TO EPSON

I AM UNABLE TO PRINT LOTUS 1-2-3 WORKSHEETS OR TO PRINT USING THE
PRINTGRAPH UTILITY WITH 1-2-3 VERSION 2.01 ON MY NEW EPSON FX 850. ALSO THE
PRINTSHOP PROGRAM WILL NOT PRINT.  MY FORMER TANDY 1000 USING A TANDY
DMP-130 USED BOTH PROGRAMS.  WHY IS MY NEW SWAN XT-10 AND NEW EPSON FX 850
NOT CAPABLE OF PRINTING?  IN OTHER WORDS, WHAT AM I DOING WRONG?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2113  09-01-88  23:12  (Read 127 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: GEROLD GENETT (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1-2-3 NO PRINT TO EPS  Reply to #2107

First, what exactly happens when you try to print?  Do you get anything at
all?  If not, try hitting Shift-PrtScr when looking at a spreadsheet.  If
you still get nothing, you don't have the printer hooked up to the computer
right.  If PrtScr DOES work, then look at what 1-2-3 is told in the
configuration file about the printer.  Is it told that the printer is
hooked to LPT1:?  Those are some things to try first.

       Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2107 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2116  09-03-88  13:40  (Read 114 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: GEROLD GENETT (Rcvd)
subject: R: 1-2-3 NO PRINT TO EPS  Reply to #2107

Maybe your printer can't print ALL UPPERCASE LETTERS. Ha Ha

Do you have the epson set for graphics printing capabilities? I know if I
set my Panasonic to Epson emulation it won't print graphics dude.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2107 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2120  09-03-88  23:55  (Read 111 times)
   from: GEROLD GENETT
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1-2-3 NO PRINT TO  Reply to #2116

THANKS BUT NICK KEES TROUBLESHOOTING TIPS LED ME TO THE SOLUTION. AS SOON
AS I SELECTED LPT1 AS THE OUTPUT PARAMETER I WAS ABLE TO PRINT FROM WITHIN
LOTUS 1-2-3.  SOMETIMES A SIMPLE FAULT WILL BE OVERLOOKED UNLESS ONE IS
ABLE TO STEP BACK FROM THE PROBLEM.  GEROLD

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2107 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2125  09-04-88  12:20  (Read 104 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: GEROLD GENETT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1-2-3 NO PRINT TO  Reply to #2120

Yes, I saw the thread. I was of course, Gerald, being sarcastic. I would
have offered some valid suggestions if, after reading the thread, nobody
else had.

Glad to see you got the problem licked. It is always a pain when moving to
a new system, but that is also always the first thing you should check -
setup parameters.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2107 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2162  09-06-88  12:45  (Read 99 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GEROLD GENETT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 1-2-3 NO PRINT TO  Reply to #2120

Glad you got yer printer to work, let us know when you get your capslock
key fixed. All caps is a little harder to read you know. See you on the
wires...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2107 reply #5  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2111  09-01-88  22:45  (Read 120 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: ALL
subject: GENICOM PRINTER

Trying desperately to find anyone out there who uses or is familiar with
this printer.  (Please also refer to a related message I left in IBM
General Conf.)  Thanks in advance to all who reply!
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2119  09-03-88  22:41  (Read 111 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: GENICOM PRINTER  Reply to #2111

I know that USF&G uses them....

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2111 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2115  09-02-88  20:08  (Read 119 times)
   from: GEROLD GENETT
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R:1-2-3 NO PRINT

THANKS A BUNCH FOR THE TROUBLESHOOTING TIPS. I WAS JUST ABLE TO SOLVE MY
PROBLEM WITH 1-2-3 AND THE EPSON THANKS TO YOUR HELP. I ONLY GOT A BEEP AND
A FLASHING "ERROR" MESSAGE WHEN I TRIED TO PRINT. THE MESSAGE AT THE LOWER
LEFT READ "PRINTER ERROR". THEN I TRIED PRINT SCREEN ON THE KEYBOARD AND
OBTAINED A PRINT OUR AS PER NORMAL.  SO I LOOKED AT THE SETUP AND FOUND
THAT MY PRINTER WAS TO BE ADDRESSED AT "PARALLEL 1". FOLLOWING YOUR ADVICE
I CHANGED THAT TO "LPT1" AND THINGS WORKED AS PER ADVERTISEMENT.  THANKS
AGAIN FOR HELPING A DUFFER LIKE ME.  GEROLD/
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2117  09-03-88  18:37  (Read 123 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: FASTER ROM

Tom,
    Thank you for your wise and informitive counsel on how the PC clocks
memory.  That helped a lot.
    Last night, I did an experiment which indicates  that the faster
ROM-BIOS chips did eliminate my hard crashes.  My non-scientific test went
like this.
  1.  Unpack a large .ARC file in the VDISK.
  2.  Send all the .DOC files to PRN  via SUPERSPL.
  3.  Delete any un-wanted  files.
  4.  Use Phil's PKPACK to re-ARC the rest of the good files.
  5.  Type commands like DIR  CD  etc to fill the Typeahead buffer.
            Before  I put the faster BIOS into this machine, it would
always get hung up in a very strange way.  The speaker would beep
contionously, the printer would slow to 1/100 of its normal speed,
and the screen would write letters about 1/2 as fast as I type and I am ver
a very very slow typest.
  If this beast didn't go into that funny 'hung' mode, it would just
hard crash.   Now It runs like a champ when I run the goofy test.

  I also noticed that if I  had Periscope in the background, it always
popped up to a loop like this: (when I gave a NMI)
    F000:5694         OUT 61h, AL
    F000:5696         MOV CX,  0D0h
    F000:5699         LOOP, 5699           ; This is where she hangs.

  My best guess is that she cannot get out of this loop.
        Thanks again for all the help.
        Dave Clay

 PS   1. I am sure the problem is not with Phil's fine software, I get
         the hangs with many other programs.  Its just when I am processing
         a lot of shareware, I often go thru the steps above.
      2. ARC  is the property of SEA,  VDISK is the property of IBM and
         SUPERSPL is the property of AST. (got  to be carefull these days
         with all the dig-a-lings around suing every one).
         Dave.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2150  09-06-88  11:58  (Read 96 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: DAVE CLAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2117

Woah there... that doesn't sound like a hung condition or a crash, that
sounds a lot like a full typeahead buffer. If the machine is busy and you
keep generating interupts by bashing the keyboard, some of what you
describe is inevitable. Try KBFIX, available here, to expand yer buffer a
litle. The way the printer and other processes slow down is typical of a
full buffer. Some BIOS's are very innefficient about sounding the bell that
signals typeahead buffer full. Mine is- it doesn't seem to be able to do
anything at all while the beeper is going, and the beep is longer than on
other machines. Hence the slow down. One easy way to fix your problem:
Don't type ahead so much.

Also, for DOS 3.2 and up, check CONFIG.SYS  for STACKS= and add one if not.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2117 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2221  09-10-88  11:51  (Read 100 times)
   from: DAVE CLAY
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: FASTER ROM  Reply to #2150

Tom,
         Thanks for the input and good ideas.  You have  given me
         something to think about!
              Thanks again,
              Dave Clay

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2117 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2121  09-04-88  00:35  (Read 110 times)
   from: MICHEALLE LESKANIC
     to: ALL
subject: 8'' DRIVE FOR AN AT

Can someone give me a lead as to where to purchase the appropriate
equipment to interface an 8 inch drive to an AT ??? I need to be able to
write to a BASF 6104 LSI drive ( also compatible with an IBM 3740 ). Any
information would be appreciated.

                                         Thanks,
                                Michealle Leskanic
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2123  09-04-88  04:36  (Read 111 times)
   from: JIM DUNNIGAN
     to: MICHEALLE LESKANIC (Rcvd)
subject: R: 8'' DRIVE FOR AN AT  Reply to #2121

There's an outfit in Princeton, NJ called Floppy Disk Services which
seems to carry disk drive equipment for all situations. Check ads in
back pages of PC Mag or, better yet, any issue of Computer Shopper. I
know there are suppliers for your requirements around.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2121 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2214  09-09-88  22:53  (Read 98 times)
   from: MICHEALLE LESKANIC
     to: JIM DUNNIGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 8'' DRIVE FOR AN A  Reply to #2123

Jim,

 Thanks for the info on 8'' drive for the AT. I'll look them up and
try my luck. Let you know how it comes out.

                                     Thanks again,
                                Michealle Leskanic ...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2121 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2124  09-04-88  11:07  (Read 110 times)
   from: FLIP TROIANO
     to: ALL
subject: WELL'S AMERICAN COMPUSTR

Has any one bought the new tower system from Well's American. I'm thinking
of buying the 286 version now and upgrading to the 386 when it is
available. Has anyone had any trouble with the company in the past.
     Does any one Know wher else "ZIP" packaged memory can be bought.
                       Thanks,
                       Flip
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2128  09-05-88  09:25  (Read 102 times)
   from: GEORGE HOFFMAN
     to: FLIP TROIANO (Rcvd)
subject: R: WELL'S AMERICAN COMPU  Reply to #2124

I've had very good luck with wells american's A-Star (286 box) and have
always found them to be helpful.  As an example, I needed a bios update
which was done free  (compare to COMPAQ charging 50-100 bucks).  The
internal construction was superb, and it's the ONLY machine I know of which
handles the 720k/1.4meg floppies PERFECTLY with no device driver, even
supporting DOS 3.3 FORMAT B: /n:9 to get 720k on a 1.4 device.
I would have absolutely no hesitation buying one.  They make excellent
hardware, and don't release things until they work (witness the current
litany in this conference regartding attempt to get the 3-1/2 inch drives
going).
-- george hoffman

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2124 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2196  09-08-88  12:01  (Read 98 times)
   from: FLIP TROIANO
     to: GEORGE HOFFMAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: WELL'S AMERICAN CO  Reply to #2128

     Thanks George,
I'll probably be ordering within a week or two. I appreciate your time.
                             Flip

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2124 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2126  09-04-88  13:35  (Read 108 times)
   from: PATRICK KELLER
     to: ALL
subject: BOOT TIME

     With two hard drives, my boot time has increased substantially.
After checking RAM, the system looks at the second hard drive for about 20
seconds before initiating the 'normal' boot sequence at the a: drive and
proceeding to the original hard disk, from which it boots.  Both hard disks
have been set up with disk manager, and the /2 option is used with the
drdrvr.bin file in config.sys.  I'm sure others have been through this
before.  Each disk has its own controller.  Could the system be trying to
boot from the second drive first?
                                                      ** Pat **
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2164  09-06-88  12:51  (Read 99 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: BOOT TIME  Reply to #2126

Let me understand here, you have two controllers, with a hard disk on each
one, total two hard disks? Is one RLL and the other MFM? That sounds wierd,
does ontrack seem to be loaded when the slowdown is happening? Try
commenting out the DEVICE=DMDRVR.BIN and see if that changes it (besides
making the second drive inaccessable) and see if it's purely hardware.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2126 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2173  09-06-88  21:59  (Read 104 times)
   from: PATRICK KELLER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BOOT TIME  Reply to #2164

You understand correctly: I've got my original MFM hard disk and a second,
recently added RLL hard disk.  Because of MFM vs. RLL, each disk has its
own controller.  Works super except for the increased boot time, which may
be a natural consequence of such shenanigans.  I'll try omitting
DEVICE=DMDRVR.BIN as you suggest and see if boot time is affected, although
experience from getting the setup functional makes me skeptical.  Maybe it
is hardware.  I'll share the results, and thanks for the suggestion.
                                                         ** Pat **

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2126 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2127  09-04-88  23:38  (Read 103 times)
   from: EDWARD MARCH
     to: ALL
subject: 386 MOTHER BOARDS

I have a PC-TECH 286 mother board I would like to upgrade to
a 386 (or maybe a 386SX 16 bit external)  who make a
reliable mother board ?? any magazine reveiews ??

is the size the same as the AT 286 boards ?
will the present cards in my 12mhz run at 16mhz ??

what problems will encounter ??
any feedback is helpful .. thanks
  -Ed-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2148  09-06-88  11:46  (Read 97 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: PETER NYGAARD (Rcvd)
subject: ITT NO BOOT

c: PRIVATE  #65323  09-01-88  20:25  (Read 2 times)
f: PETER NYGAARD
t: TOM PETERS (Rcvd)
s: BOOT FROM HD

            HERE IS ANOTHER PUZZLING DELEMA FOR THE HARDWARE
                      .......GURU.............

         MOST PC COMPATABLES TODAY CAN BOOT FROM HARD DISK IT SEEMS.

             HOWEVER, AT WORK WE HAVE AN ITT XTRA COMPUTER THAT
             MUST BE TURNED ON ONCE.  THEN LEAVE IT SO IT ERRORS
             LOOKING FOR A DISK IN DRIVE IN (A).  NOW WE TURN IT
             OFF AND BACK ON AGAIN, AT THIS TIME IT WILL BOOT ON
             DRIVE (C).

         ANY CLUE?                      THANKS

Ask questions in the public section of the board- that way more people
can chime in. Better odds of getting an answer.

1. Hard disk formatted upright and run sitting on its side?
2. Try reformatting (back up first of course), do a low-level and then
repartition and reformat using DOS.
3. Open up and reseat all cards and conenctors.
4. Meter the power supply. Got 5vdc +15% -5% ? 12vdc +/- 10%? under load?
5. Controller might be bad.
6. If this is an OLD ITT XTRA, it may have an old BIOS which was bugggy.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2166  09-06-88  17:50  (Read 96 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: ALL
subject: BIDIR PARALLEL PORTS

> A while back, there was a discussion of using IBM pc parallel ports for
> input and output, and it was more or less decided that they weren't wired
> for that.
>
> Steve Ciarcia just published a 1 or 2 wire fix for that in BYTE. I
> organized some of what he said and uploaded it to the Mahoney collection
> into a file called PARALLEL.TXT which see, or the September 1988 issue of
> BYTE.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2171  09-06-88  21:19  (Read 97 times)
   from: DON OLSON
     to: ALL
subject: PINOUT FOR HPLJET II

Help?

I'm in need of the proper pinout for a HP Laser Jet II printer.  I've set
the current RS232 connector like a null modem cable.  It seems to work just
fine but not being sure has me worried.

Thanks!! =======================>>> Don Olson <<<=======================
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2307  09-17-88  09:30  (Read 87 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: DON OLSON
subject: R: PINOUT FOR HPLJET II  Reply to #2171

Correct Pinout for PC to HP --
HP end --------- PC end (db25 Female)
3             2
2             3
7             7
20            5&6

Note that NULL MODEM is a meaningless term (largely), usually just
involving switching pins 2 and 3.  If it prints at all, your only concern
is handshaking. Dump a HUGE file to printer.  If it loses it part way
through the file, your cable is incorrectly wired.
Craig, sysop pinecliffe. (303gs-B) 444 7073

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2171 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2174  09-06-88  23:01  (Read 103 times)
   from: PATRICK KELLER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: BOOT TIME

Booting without DMDRVR.BIN did not affect the booting sequence or time
noticably.  I don't understand why the system looks at disk #2 before disk
#1, but suspect it's time to be happy and enjoy the fact everything is
working!  Thanks again for the response.
                                                    ** Pat **
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2179  09-07-88  07:06  (Read 99 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: PS/2 60 CONTINUED

     cc: AL HANSEN

Joe and Al,
     Thanks for the comments guys.  We got it back yesterday.  Computerland
had warranteed the hard drive.  Perhaps everything will hold together this
time.
     I will install the DOSFIX33 fix this time.
bblair
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2181  09-07-88  20:03  (Read 98 times)
   from: MIKE STATLER
     to: ALL
subject: AST RAMPAGE

HELP? I INSTALLED AN AST RAMPAGE BOARD WITH 512 K IN MY AT CLONE USING THE
DEFAULT SETTINGS WITCH ARE CORRECT FOR MY COMPUTER. 512K INSTALLED ON THE
MAIN BOARD, AND 128 K TO FILL IN THE 640 DOS. ALL I GET ON START UP IS
PARITY ERRORS. SHOULD I SET THE BOARD TO FILL IN EXPANDED MEM(ie 384 K)?
I CAN'T RUN DESKVIEW, IT KEEPS TELLING ME I DON'T HAVE ENOUGH MEM.
THANKS FOR YOUR HELP.    --------MIKE STATLER----------
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2187  09-07-88  22:03  (Read 98 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: MIKE STATLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: AST RAMPAGE  Reply to #2181

Mike,

Is your AT a clone runnung at >8mhz? If it is, good luck. I sent back two
of them that acted just like yours. Also, the ram chips may be too slow for
the clock speed. Just a couple of ideas...

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2181 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2228  09-11-88  08:02  (Read 102 times)
   from: MIKE STATLER
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: AST RAMPAGE  Reply to #2187

THANKS STEVE, I WILL SLOW IT DOWN AND TRY AGAIN.
------------MIKE---------------

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2181 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2185  09-07-88  22:00  (Read 104 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: RANDY MESKER (Rcvd)
subject: R: COMPAQ/IBM  Reply to #2180

Randy,

As I recall from when I did it, you must boot from a floppy containing the
DOS3.3 system, command.com, and sys.com. Once you are booted, do a "sys C:"
to transfer the system files to the HD, copy command.com to C:\, and reboot
from the hard drive.

-[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2202  09-08-88  22:55  (Read 106 times)
   from: PATRICK KELLER
     to: RANDY MESKER (Rcvd)
subject: R: COMPAQ/IBM  Reply to #2180

Don't know how helpful this will be, but I recently had trouble when I
set up a second hard disk with MS-DOS 3.2, and my original hard disk had
been set up with IBM DOS 3.2.  In trying to get the whole system working
with MS-DOS, the MS SYS files would not overwrite the original IBM SYS on
the original hard drive.  The only way to install MS-DOS on the original
IBM installed drive was to reformat it with MS-DOS.  Interestingly, the
single disk system had worked fine with MS-DOS command files and IBM SYS
files up to that point.  If this wasn't relevant, thanks for listening.

Several messages have involved boot sequences and multiple drives.  Anyone
know how to redirect BIOS to look first at D: on a second hard drive,
ignoring C: on the first physical hard drive?  Thanks.

See Steve, now I know how to enter blank lines in my text!

                                                        **  Pat  **

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2185 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2205  09-08-88  23:41  (Read 105 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COMPAQ/IBM  Reply to #2185

     cc: RANDY MESKER

Steve, I don't mean to sharpshoot, but didn't you encounter any disk
problems by going to 3.3? It seems I have seen some horror stories about
incompatible disk formats. I know there is with 4.0, and experienced it a
little with floppies when going from 3.0 to 3.1. Just thought I'd ask.

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2185 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2211  09-09-88  20:13  (Read 100 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: PATRICK KELLER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COMPAQ/IBM  Reply to #2202

Pat,

Nice!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2185 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2212  09-09-88  20:17  (Read 100 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: COMPAQ/IBM  Reply to #2205

Russ,

There WERE a lot of reported bugs in DOS3.3 but I have seen none of them.
None at all. There is no time like the present to tackle that mess. See my
next message...

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2185 reply #4  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2186  09-07-88  22:00  (Read 98 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: ALL
subject: ADDS FOR SALE

Anyone looking for museum pieces?

I have someone with a Micro Design? Osbourne compatible CP/M (where does
the / go?) machine. It has an ADDS display, bum keyboard and bundled
software (Wordstar, etc.) that he said was THE BEST you could get in 1981
when he bought the beast. Two floppy drives thatsupposedly READ IBM format.

He's semi-interested in buying a used PC or XT or parts thereof and having
me put it together for him. So anyone interested might be able to make some
kind of deal with him.

Any takers?

P.S. I told him too bad it wasn't an Osbourne, aren't those things like a
collectors item now?

Serious replys only - NO LAUGHS OR JOKES -
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2188  09-07-88  22:03  (Read 98 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: ALL
subject: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)

Does anyone have pinouts for an IBM ext. 3.5" with a type 2 cable?

I am trying to convert it for use as an internal, any help would be GREATLY
appreciated. Yes I know there are only 13 pins to futz with (minus the 33?
grounds), but it would make things ALOT easier. Pinouts for the IBM (no
clones) XT floppy drive adapter would also help.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2190  09-07-88  22:18  (Read 98 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2188

Russ,

Are you trying to configure the cable for my controller? I have the IBM
hardware manual, but I don't know if the pinout is in there. I'll check it
out. BTW, the number I left you is a day phone, in case I forgot to tell
you that. I got real attached to that I/O board and was about to order the
parts to implement the clock when I read your message. Believe it or not, I
have a complete parts list, component placement diagram, and docs on the
jumper and switch settings for the thing!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2197  09-08-88  20:10  (Read 100 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2190

Steve, The drive comes up (partly) as B: on MY system. The motor spins and
the heads move, so I think I have the pin configured correctly; however,
the device driver comes up initializing E:.  I don't have a 3.2 or above
manual here and don't even think there is an option switch for which drive
to load. If there is, it would be great because I think that is the only
obstacle now. I have the feeling there isn't which means I'll have to rely
on some help from someone who can patch the DRIVER.SYS to NOT look for the
next available drive, but HARD CODE the drive specifier into it.

The drive is recognized as B: but I cannot format or read a diskette. I
even tried to read a single sided and it doesn't work.
Maybe there is another driver out there somwhere or a replacement BIOS that
can handle the 720k floppy as drive B: (internal). IBM's driver SUCKS!

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2198  09-08-88  20:52  (Read 101 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2197

Russ,

A replacement bios might not be a bad idea. But in the meantime try:

DEVICE=driver.sys /D:1 /T:80 /S:9 /F:2

The /D param is for the second floppy starting from 0 = A. This may
Do it. At least that is the right syntax, if it doesn't work it back to the
boards!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2201  09-08-88  22:25  (Read 106 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2197

Check your motherboard dipswitches to see if they aren't set for 4 drives
instead of two.  I helped install a hard disk in a IBM PC and the prompt
came up E> until we changed the switches to XT configuration instead of PC
and then we got C>.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2203  09-08-88  23:09  (Read 104 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2198

     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL

Thanks for the reply but /D:1 is illegal in DRIVER.SYS; however, I stumbled
on something while scanning for "driver" that I KNEW I had seen somwhere
before  - DRIVPARM -. It's an internal DOS 3.2 command that allows logical
assignment of a physical drive. i.e. /D:1 for internal drive B:

Setup as DRIVPARM=/D:1 /F:2  /F being the form factor (2=720k) in the
config.sys. It takes less RAM and can hook up logical drives to physical
ones.

My problem is not solved however. I still might have the pin config wrong
(I converted the 37-D external connector to a dual 17-pin paddle type
connector. If going over the pin config doesn't work. I'll have to see if
there is an internal drive type adapter similar to the one installed in the
external drive casing for the external connector.

I must clarify the first statement. /D:1 is illegal for MY system and most
hard drive systems. My situation is compounded by 2 hard drives C: & D:
driver.sys loads the NEXT available drive, E: in my case. Not good when the
drive is physically connected as an internal drive B:

True Blues seem to operate differently. My clone only recognizes drive A:
if I have the switches set for one diskette drive - the way it SHOULD be.
IBMers still see B: as the alien drive A: EVEN if the switches are set for
one diskette! In other words, my Big Blue XT at work, set for ONE floppy
sees it as both A: AND B:. My clone however, does not - ONLY A: (unless I
set the switch for two drives).

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2204  09-08-88  23:17  (Read 103 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2201

Thanks for the reply, but it's WAY beyond that. If you're interested see
msg # 2203, or run through the thread of 9-8-88 on this subject.

I already have one internal 5.25 and two hard drives, switches were set for
one floppy when I removed the second about a month ago to install my second
 HD.

The jist of the problem is that I'm trying to convert an external IBM to be
hooked up to the internal cable/controller because I don't have an open
drive bay and my controller is a multi I/O that controls ONLY two internal
floppies and I CANNOT disable the floppy control on the board. MUCH to my
dismay and contrary to the docs for it. (The switch is dead - doesn't hook
up to anything!)

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2218  09-10-88  09:15  (Read 100 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2203

Russ, if you get really desperate, play around with the ASSIGN command as a
temporary solution of the symptom (doesn't solve the problem).  Try
something like "ASSIGN e=b" to route disk I/O for E: to B: (or, if the
problem is the other way around, try "ASSIGN b=e").  If you try this,
please observe the cautions in your DOS manual (i.e., don't use BACKUP,
RESTORE, LABEL, JOIN, SUBST or PRINT commands with the ASSIGNed drive).

Good luck.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2226  09-10-88  23:09  (Read 101 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2204

Gotcha, I am having similar confusion right now because my passive
backplane "mother board in a slot" had the FDC on it with no apparent way
to disable it short of risky surgery.  I'm trying to add a 1.44meg 3.5" to
amine and I have no empty bays either.  5 pounds of sand in a 4 pound bag.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2234  09-11-88  22:55  (Read 103 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2226

No S&%t! How come everything always has to be such a pain? If the stupid
Multi I/O would have been able to be disabled I wouldn't be going through
all this crap now. What really p.o.'d me was that the user manual listed
one of the dips as floppy enable/disable but it isn't wired!


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2242  09-12-88  10:42  (Read 105 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2204

I assume you have a switch that is documented to disable the floppy
controller part of your multi i/o board, and doesn't seem to be connected
to anything. Make sure there isn't a trace hiding under the switch body
beforeyou jump to the that conclusion. The trace could be on either side of
the board and they can be hidden most cleverly.

If you have no switch, you can still disable the on-board controller, if
you don't mind performing minor surgery. I think I left a message before,
or uploaded something, with details on how I did it.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2252  09-12-88  20:47  (Read 107 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2234

Have Adaptec packed with MO, will hit UPS tomorrow.  I'm waiting on a
response from the mfg of my magic number box about disableing the FDC.  If
possible, 1.44meg, otherwise, I don't know...I hate to give up the
convenience of two identical 360k drives just to run stiffies.  I'll keep
an eye on your thread for inspiration, maybe an external would work.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2258  09-12-88  23:55  (Read 103 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2242

Thanks, but the problem has been conquered!

I checked for a trace and even Pulled the switch off the board after 30
minutes with an iron and a solda-pult. It was not connected at all.

Read msg #2256 in the Hardware conference for more info if you're
interested. I converted the ext DB37 to a 34-pin male edge connector.
(I like having the drive as B: much better anyway.)

Thanks again. Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2260  09-13-88  00:00  (Read 106 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2252

Check out msg # 2256 in the Hardware Conference. Though with my solution
you would still have to give up a 5.25 drive B:

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2271  09-13-88  22:30  (Read 110 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5" HELP(MINOR)  Reply to #2218

I'm replying to an old (4 days) thread so you might have seen my final
solution. If not check out msg #2256 in the Hardware conference.

Thanks for the suggestions.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2188 reply #14  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2191  09-07-88  22:37  (Read 96 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: ALL
subject: HORIZONTAL LINE/IBM MONO

I'm sorry to leave this message to "All", but I don't have enough time left
to do a search and find who was having the problem with the IBM mono
monitor.
According to the July/August issue of MICRO CORNUCOPIA magazine, a
horizontal line through the middle of the screen is a common failure mode
for the IBM monochromatic monitor. It is also the third most frequent
failure to this piece of equipment. To quote "....is a horizontal line
across the screen. This indicates a bad chip (location IC401); it is a
TDA1170 IC."
If your curious, the second most common failure is resistor R515 (180K/0.5
WATTS); symptom of this failure is inability to adjust the brightness.
The most common failure is a blank screen caused by failure of TR23, with
its fuse blown, and/or a shorted flyback transformer. They rrecommended
replacing the transistor and fuse first.

Jim
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2206  09-09-88  00:19  (Read 108 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: ALL
subject: STATIC CONTROL MATS

I have my machine sitting on a molded plexiglass piece which extends beyond
the edge of the table and drops the keyboard down to typing height.  It has
been suggested to me that this might be dangerous from a static standpoint.
 Would appreciate any comments from the "Experts" out there.  If the static
danger is a severe one, would setting the processor and the keyboard on
anti-static mats help?  If so, can you lead me to a source either local or
mail order?  Thanks in advance.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2207  09-09-88  06:42  (Read 100 times)
   from: BRIAN KIEHNAU
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: STATIC CONTROL MATS  Reply to #2206

Jan

You should be safe with out any static mats under your computer
and keyboard. If you start having problems this winter when the
air dries out you might have to do somthing like a anti-static floor
mat or somthing.

I have a lowered key board also, when it gets dry enough I can
walk across the carpet and lock up my machine by touching the keyboard.
This is only a annoyance and has not caused any damage even though
the static discharge is audible (high voltage) and it has happened
several times.

Brian

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2210  08-09-88  19:13  (Read 95 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: BRIAN KIEHNAU (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2207

     cc: JAN HARWELL

There is a product that sticks to the lower part of your keyboard that will
discharge that static. Can't remember the name of the darn thing, but I
could find out.

Jan, I wouldn't recommend that setup. Any plastic, unless properly treated
during or after manufacturing has the capability to build up a VERY
substantial static charge. Other surfaces include the well know carpet AS
WELL AS tile floors and untreated concrete floors (although these are
usually only of matter if you're working with CMOS or other succeptable
devices).

Bottom line is if you're not noticing any problems or static discharge not
to worry.

Brian, touching the system chassis FIRST would probably clear that problem;
however, the static discharge strip mentioned above would be better.

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2216  09-09-88  23:50  (Read 95 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: BRIAN KIEHNAU (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2207

Brian, thanks so much for sharing your experience.  I have been a little
worried but so far this summer have had no obvious static related
incidents.  My machine is in my basement.  Have been running a dehumidifier
during the summer and have a humidifier I could run in winter if needed.
For the past two winters the built in humidifier in the furnace seemed to
provide any necessary humidity.  I have a couple of critters so static
buildup would be pretty evident quickly.  In other homes, I have actually
caused sparks by walking across the room and then petting them.  Appreciate
your taking time to reply.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2217  09-10-88  00:04  (Read 96 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2210

Russ, so far no obvious problems.  I watch the humidity, etc. pretty
carefully since the machine is in the basement.  The floor which is
concrete is covered by a bargain all-weather, super ugly, carpet.  As I
replied to Brian, my critters are pretty good measure of static presence.

I probably would feel more assured if I installed some minimal static
control.  Have seen a couple of ads in various magazines offering mats
which can be grounded and strips which can be secured to the keyboard.  Do
you think that a keyboard strip would be enough?  I was actually thinking
of purchasing a mat for under the processor and one for under the keyboard.
This is not a cheap solution and may be overkill.  Thought I saw an ad for
the keyboard strip for around $18.  If you could give me a little more
information, it would be very much appreciated.  Thanks!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2220  09-10-88  10:39  (Read 98 times)
   from: BRIAN KIEHNAU
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2216

Jan

One extra thing to keep in mind is that if you do any
work inside your machine be vary carefull about static. The amount
of charge that it takes to zap a unprotected board is so low that
you will not be able to feel it.

Brian

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2223  09-10-88  20:39  (Read 101 times)
   from: ERIK DUFEK
     to: BRIAN KIEHNAU (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2207

     cc: JAN HARWELL

  >>I have a lowered key board also, when it gets dry enough I can
  >>walk across the carpet and lock up my machine by touching the keyboard.
  >>This is only a annoyance and has not caused any damage even though
  >>the static discharge is audible (high voltage) and it has happened
  >>several times.

When I was out in the desert of California I ran a small BBS.  One day
I came in and the same thing happened to me, an audible spark from
finger to keyboard.  It also locked up my system.  When I rebooted
my keyboard would not produce several characters.  I traced out the
keyboard schematic and discovered that one of the lines on the
keyboard matrix chip was dead.  For the next 3 days I ran the BBS by
typing the missing characters through the Alt/number process.  A real
nuisance when chatting.  When I replaced the chip I installed a socket
so if it happened again I could quickly replace the bad chip.  But did
I install static mats?  No.  I don't even use a surge suppressor.  But
for someone who isn't interested in replacing IC's it's probably good
insurance.

  EriK

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2224  09-10-88  22:57  (Read 99 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: BRIAN KIEHNAU (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2220

Brian, I think I have already had such an experience.  While in the process
of trying to install a speed up device on my machine, some pretty weird
things happened and the 'ol machine just quit.  New socket and new chip
later everything was humming along and back to normal.  Even though we were
very careful, static could be the culprit.  I'm not skilled enough to poke
around inside the case so I will leave that to others with such a talent!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2225  09-10-88  23:06  (Read 98 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: ERIK DUFEK (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2223

Erik, thanks for sharing your experience with me.  I guess that sort of
supports the 'ol cliche "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure"
or something like that!  Think I will proceed to install some kind of
protection.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2230  09-11-88  19:42  (Read 100 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2216

Jan,

My cat serves as a test device for my humidifier.  If he gets shocked while
being rubbed, I turn it up.  Works well.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2232  09-11-88  22:49  (Read 100 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2230

Glen, my critters are cats (2), too.  You are right about that being a
pretty good humidity test!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2233  09-11-88  22:52  (Read 100 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2217

I too have my machine in the basement and don't have any problems with
static. If you're not experiencing any static, I wouldn't worry about it.
As long as the system is properly grounded (no 3-prong to 2-prong adapters)
and the humidity stays up there, you shouldn't need any special control. If
you do experience any static discharge when first touching your keyboard I
would definately recommend one of the strips. I could check the prices in
my company's supplies catalog for you. I get the items at 10% over cost and
would be willing to sell it to you for the same.

I have been running my present system for over a year with no special
static control and haven'y experienced any problems.

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2236  09-11-88  23:48  (Read 105 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2233

Russ, your comments and those of others are making me feel a little less
concerned that I have a severe problem.  Still it might not be a bad idea
to install at least some minimal antistatic measures.  Would appreciate
your advising me on cost of product you have available.  Thanks!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2243  09-12-88  10:47  (Read 104 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: STATIC CONTROL MATS  Reply to #2206

You might want to use anti-static mats, properly grounded, or you could
perhaps connect wires to the case screws on both pieces, run them to
separate (!) 1 meg resistors and ground them to the same (!) point.

I uploaded a LONG article I wrote about static protection. It doesn't deal
directly with your problem, but it does give some good background data.
Scan for "static"

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2244  09-12-88  10:50  (Read 104 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BRIAN KIEHNAU (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2207

If you can lock up a machine by zapping it after a walk across the carpet,
you have a path into important parts of your computer and you WILL
eventually do permanent damage to your machine. It's only a matter of time.
You need an antistatic mat and a "touch me first" grounded button. At the
very least, grab something grounded before you touch Mr. Micro. I would
ground the housings of the keyboard and he processor thru resistors to the
same point, or you're asking for trouble.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #14

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2245  09-12-88  10:53  (Read 104 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2210

Let's emphasize that those "touch me first" medalions or strips are
effective only because they have a wire you run to the wall plate screw on
an outlet or other suitable ground point (water pipe?). Failure to install
properly means failure to protect and false confidence.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #15

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2246  09-12-88  10:55  (Read 103 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2217

Perhaps a static mat under the computer and then ground the keyboard. Then
add a touch strip.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #16

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2250  09-12-88  20:26  (Read 105 times)
   from: BRIAN KIEHNAU
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2244

Tom

As you may have noticed I have not gotten caught up in the
static/voltage spike/noise will kill Mr. Micro stuff. As a rule
I have no respect for electronic equipment eventhough I make
my living working on same.

This goes back to our earlier theard on noise/surge supp. devices
and how I can't justify them. For static junk to protect my key
board I also can't see spending $50 to save a $50 taiwan key board.

As long as there is no traceable problems I will take no precautions
is my rule or in laymans terms if it dosnt break don't try to fixit!!

Brian

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #17

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2257  09-12-88  23:51  (Read 105 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2236

You're Welcome. I'll get back to you on the items.

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #18

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2259  09-12-88  23:57  (Read 104 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2245

EXACTLY. You know it, I know it, and unfortunately, many others do not.
I should have emphasized that point. Thanks for the reminder.

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #19

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2272  09-13-88  23:36  (Read 110 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2243

Tom, had downloaded your "static" file previously.  It was thought
provoking.  That was what me got moving to ask some of you experts out
there about my specific situation.  Thanks for the reply!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #20

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2273  09-13-88  23:40  (Read 110 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2246

Tom, can you be more specific about what you mean by "ground the keyboard"?
Also, do you have any recommendations for products either available locally
or via mail order?  What kind of costs am I looking at?  Appreciate your
advice.  Thanks!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #21

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2274  09-13-88  23:41  (Read 109 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2257

Will look for your reply.  Thanks again for your interest!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #22

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2277  09-14-88  18:02  (Read 106 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2273

What I meant by grounding the keyboard is to run a piece of heavy gauge
stranded wire from a screw in the bottom of the keyboard to one of the case
screws on the back of the PC. Use crimp-on solder eyes onm both ends-
available at one's local Radio Shack, or hardware store.

A better option might be a "touch me first" pad. We have the 3M product and
the ones made by other people. The 3M piece is $20 and includes a touch
strip, cable, and resistor. Easy to install.

Anti static mats range in price from 9.95 (2.25" x 4.5") to $60. Come look
at the pretty pictures in the catalog- any size (just about) can be had.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #23

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2279  09-14-88  20:36  (Read 101 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2277

Tom and Jan,

When working on carpet, you might want to consider an anti-static chairmat.
They are available from office supply stores and are almost identical to
the ones you see in offices all the time.  I can't remember if they have a
ground or dissapate the static.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #24

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2280  09-14-88  21:38  (Read 97 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2274

Do you have access to a FAX? I copied the pages from the catalog and got
the prices I can offer. If not, I will reply with the best description of
the product I can muster.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #25

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2282  09-14-88  23:16  (Read 98 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2277

Tom, thanks for the additional information.  Will try to get over to see
you in the next weekend or so!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #26

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2283  09-14-88  23:22  (Read 99 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2280

Russ, a FAX machine?  You bet - we just installed one two days ago.  Don't
have the number here at home (memory is one of the first things that goes,
they say) but as soon as I get to the office on Thurs. I will put a message
on EXEC-PC in the private conference providing the tel no. of our FAX.  The
machine is very near my office and one of my staff is the key operator so I
should know as soon as it comes in.  Thanks for the offer!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #27

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2293  09-16-88  16:34  (Read 95 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: GLEN THOMPSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2279

     cc: JAN HARWELL

Ithink we sell chairmats of both varieties, ie dissipative and grounded
types.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #28

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2301  09-16-88  23:43  (Read 93 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2293

Tom, if one uses mats under the processor and/or the keyboard or a keyboard
pad, how helpful/necessary is a chair mat?  Also, I left your business card
at work and since I might be out and about this weekend, could you refresh
my memory as to where you are located?  Thanks!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #29

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2339  09-19-88  12:08  (Read 68 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JAN HARWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2301

Sorry not to get back to you before the weekend. Um, I don't really know
how critical a chair mat is. If you are careful to grab something large and
grounded after yoyu sit down, and before you touch pinky to keyboard, you
shouldn't be in trouble. How did you get my card? I don't remember meeting
you-- did I? I'd have thought I'd remember that, but my mind doesn't even
work as good as my flakey AT.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #30

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2342  09-20-88  00:25  (Read 49 times)
   from: JAN HARWELL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2339

Tom, could you tell me what your hours are and how to get there from the
vicinity of College Ave & 27th?  I would like to get over to talk with you
and see what is available. Maybe I could make it Sat. after Al's Run if you
are open then.  We met at the Exec-PC Picnic.  That's when you gave me your
card.  I shall not throw stones as sometimes my mind doesn't even work as
good as my ancient but dependable upgraded 5150!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #31

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2347  09-20-88  10:29  (Read 31 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JAN HARWELL
subject: R: R: STATIC CONTROL MAT  Reply to #2342

Yup. We just went to winter hours, which now included saturdays. The boss
seems to be making changes in our after 5 hours, so call first.
Mon 8:30 - 5:00
Tue 8:30 - 7:30
Wed 8:30 - 7:30
Thu 8:30 - 5:00
Fri 8:30 - 5:00
Sat 9:00 - 5:00

See Dick when you come if I'm not around. We have a separate catalog for
data processing supplies. It would be easier to find than in the main one.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2206 reply #32  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2213  09-09-88  20:25  (Read 100 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: ALL
subject: DOS 3.3 BUGS

A while back Tom Peters and I had a discussion about the reported bugs in
PC Dos 3.3 and I agreed to ask about them. Then I promptly forgot to do it.
So... has anyone out there ACTUALLY encountered any of the reported bugs?
If so, aould you care to enlighten us as to just what the bugs was, what
the symptoms were, and what if any damage was done. I have heard many
reports of all sorts of evil deads being attributed to this version but
have been unable to locate anyone who has actually experienced them. I
would appreciate any response from anyone who has, and I'm sure that many
others would as well. Thanks in advance...

-[Steve]-
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2219  09-10-88  09:27  (Read 100 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS 3.3 BUGS  Reply to #2213

Steve, I'm running DOS 3.3 on a PS/2 50Z at my office.  During its first
week of life, I had done some experimentation with various entries in my
AUTOEXEC (notably, changing the PROMPT command).  Immediately thereafter, I
tried to copy some files from a 3.5" floppy to the hard drive and got some
kind of bad sector or sector not recognized message (can't recall which
one).  I thought I had a bad diskette, so I took the diskette to another
50Z and had absolutely no problem reading it.  I couldn't even do a DIR on
my 50Z.  I rebooted and the problem went away.  A little research led me to
a .BAT file distributed by IBM which described various disk-related
problems with 3.3.  They pointed me to DASDDRVR.SYS as a solution.  I added
that driver to my CONFIG and have had no problems since.  That doesn't
necessarily mean that that action precluded problems, I just haven't had
any since.  I should note that the problems were unique to the PS/2.

I'm running 3.3 on my AT at home and we're running 3.3 on PS/2 30s and 50Zs
at the office with no problems.

Like you, I'm wondering where all of the alleged 3.3 bugs are.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2213 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2222  09-10-88  20:34  (Read 101 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS 3.3 BUGS  Reply to #2219

Joe,

Thanks for the input. As I understood it, the DASDDRVR.SYS was only for use
on PS/2's with non-blue drives. But if it works, what the heck. Maybe I
misread the info. Anyway, I hope someone can shed some light on just what
we should expect from the 3.3 version, 'cause the things that are being
said about 4.0 are far more frightening than anything I have heard about
3.3!

Anyone have anything else to add?

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2213 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2229  09-11-88  12:30  (Read 105 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS 3.3 BUGS  Reply to #2222

Yes, the news about 4.0 is scary and anticlimactic.  I was looking forward
to using > 32MB drives without either partitioning or using non-blue device
drivers.  Now, I learn that there are incompatibility problems with some
software I use and moving to 4.0 is a "burn your bridges" conversion, once
drives are formatted for >32MB as a single drive.  <sigh>  I'll wait for
4.01 or 4.1 or 4.2 -- whatever.

BTW, the .BAT files from IBM didn't mention that the DASDDRVR.SYS was
intended to address problems with non-blue drives only.  The problems
appeared to be generic.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2213 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2231  09-11-88  20:55  (Read 101 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: JOE VINCENT (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS 3.3 BUGS  Reply to #2229

Joe,

Right you are. In fact, I went back and looked at them after I left that
message. I seem to remember seeing that in a file listing on some BBS but
it was obviously wrong. The .bat did say that it was specific to the
PS/2's, however. I never did use it or find a need to try on my XT clown.
:-)

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2213 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2239  09-12-88  07:10  (Read 108 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS 3.3 BUGS  Reply to #2231

    Now the only problems I had with DOS 3.3 is I got a ECC error on my
hard disks using the HDtest program (Jim Bracking?) I went back to 3.2 and
the errors went away. On both versions once in a while I can't format
disketts. I use PC Tools and it formats the disks fine (floppies). I'm
using a Columbia 1600-1 expanded for an excuse as a computer..

                          Steve Morgan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2213 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2241  09-12-88  10:40  (Read 108 times)
   from: GEORGE KOFMAN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS 3.3 BUGS  Reply to #2213

-[Steve]-,

I've been using PC-DOS 3.3 on two IBM MOD 30's for the last year or so.
Never had any problems. I've also been using Compaq DOS 3.31 on a Compaq
286-12 and a 386-16 clone. As far as non-IBM equipment goes, I prefer Compaq
DOS. I had a problem with one Clipper-compiled dbaseiii program under
PC-DOS 3.3. The problem went away under Compaq DOS 3.31, but that was on a
non-IBM box.
BTW,  one guy here had diskette formatting problems on his MOD 60 (DOS
3.3). It seemed as though it could only format one 3.5" floppy at a time,
even if you asked for another floppy. But that was the bug with DOS.
All the software that we run here is Hard Disk-based, backup is done with
tape, so we don't use floppies that often.

Hope this helps.  If you have any questions, just yell.

George M. Kofman.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2213 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2249  09-12-88  20:23  (Read 110 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: STEVE MORGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS 3.3 BUGS  Reply to #2239

Steve,

Thanks! I'm going to compile a list of the replies I get here and see if I
can somehow test to confirm them. Your input is appreciated.

The floppy format problem doesn't seem to be related, if I read it right,
since it happens with 3.2 as well as 3.3 .... I had a problem formatting
1.4m disks under 3.3 for a while, but it was a hardware problem. Not fair
to blame it on *any* DOS version.

Thanks again.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2213 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2251  09-12-88  20:31  (Read 110 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: GEORGE KOFMAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS 3.3 BUGS  Reply to #2241

George,

Thanks to you as well. I also have never had any DOS related problems. The
1.4m floppy format thing was supposed to be fixed by the DASDDRVR.sys
thing, as I recall. But I never found a need for it

I have heard many good things about Compac 3.31 but have not actually seen
it. I always prefer an MS authored (or fixed) DOS, but I got a GREAT deal
on PC 3.3 so I went for it. Haven't had a reason to be sorry, *yet*! But
from all the reports I've heard, I'd expect my clown to have exploded by
now!

Thanks again, I'll add your comments to the list.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2213 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2275  09-14-88  05:37  (Read 114 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS 3.3 BUGS  Reply to #2249

STEVE,

       I wish I could use DOS 3.1, but my Columbia won't boot it. The
floppy format problem isn't specific to DOS 3.3, but version 3.0 never had
problems formating floppies. I just think it is strange that PC Tools will
format floppies when DOS won't.

                     Steve Morgan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2213 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2276  09-14-88  07:13  (Read 114 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: STEVE MORGAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS 3.3 BUGS  Reply to #2275

Steve,

This floppy format business IS strange! I had a setup in my XT clone where
PCTools format was the only way I could format 1.$m floppies. I changed
controllers and now it won't, but DOS format will where it would not
before. Who can figure it...

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2213 reply #10  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2235  09-11-88  23:06  (Read 101 times)
   from: BOB ARING
     to: ALL
subject: ATARI 1025 PRINTER

   I have a friend who has an Atari 1025 printer which he would
to use on a PC.   The printer has a 13 pin serial connector on
the back (the manual defined it as "serial").

   Is there anybody out there who knows if this can be done?
Any help would be appreciated.

Bob Aring





---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2247  09-12-88  11:07  (Read 104 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: BOB ARING (Rcvd)
subject: R: ATARI 1025 PRINTER  Reply to #2235

Yeah, sure, another one of those questions where the guy is embarrased to
ask him self, so he makes up a "friend" who has an atari printer....

 ...just kidding.

You need to find something in the printer manual that gives the speed, or
baud rate, the printer runs at. Not print speed, mind you, but handshake
speed. Does the manual list any pin numbers and signal names? If not, you
could be cooked.

You could I suppose open it up and trace the wires from the 1488 and 1489
chips. Anything connected  to the one type is an input and anything
connected to the other is an output, for handshake or whatever.

I can't remember which is which.


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2235 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2255  09-12-88  23:02  (Read 108 times)
   from: BOB ARING
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: ATARI 1025 PRINTER  Reply to #2247

Tom,

     Well, this friend actually has a whole system that he bought,
before I knew him.   I have a whole series of other items that I've
purchased that I have to chalk up to a great learning experience.
(Anybody want to buy some land in Arkansas??) - (Come to think of it, I
should trade him the land for the Atari system - even up.)

>>   If not, you could be cooked.

     How about well roasted??   The manual is a beautiful example of four
color reproduction that tells one:

               a)   How to plug device into wall.

               b)   How to plug device into disk drive (runs on a daisy
                    chain)

               c)   How to turn it on


          You get the idea....

     I'm going to suggest that he use my printer for his project.   It's
just sitting around gathering dust right now.

     Thanks anyway for the answer.

Bob Aring




>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2235 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2240  09-12-88  10:35  (Read 108 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: ALL
subject: DISK CONTROLLER

Anybody know a good hard disk controller for XT's that can have radically
difrernt drives as drives 0 and 1? I have a Q540, 512 tracks by 8 heads,
that I want as drive 1 and a ST-225 that I want as drive 1. I have an older
OMTI controller, model 5510, but the BIOS on it seems to require identical
drives. Using a WD controller results in Ontrack saying "drive not
connected" for drive 1, altho it sees drive 0. The best would be a
jumperless controller, that can have to head and track count entered in at
the keyboard, yes?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2254  09-12-88  22:31  (Read 110 times)
   from: JEFFREY HOWELL
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: DISK CONTROLLER  Reply to #2240

TOM,
.     Have you tried a WD with the SuperROM, I believe that will
allow you to enter the drive paramaters when you format the disks.
I'm using an old Adaptec 2007 upgraded to a 2010 with a ROM
upgrade that will do what you want, but, I don't know where to
find another.  Optionally you could use Disk Manager to do what
you are after (you don't have to use it to add/or divide drives,
it will write a boot record that the driver reads), but, you will
have to put up with loading a driver.
.                                       JEFFREY

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2240 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2265  09-13-88  11:09  (Read 113 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JEFFREY HOWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DISK CONTROLLER  Reply to #2254

Yah, Jeff, I tried my OMTI controller, along with DM by OnTrack. No good. I
then called SMS OMTI and they told me to call their BBS and down load some
programs. I did. No good. I'll see If I can find a WD with SuperROM and
give it a try. Seems to me I did try some WD controller, tho. Maybe I tried
w/o ontrack.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2240 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2310  09-17-88  09:59  (Read 96 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: DISK CONTROLLER  Reply to #2240

WD XTGEN and WX2 controllers both allow you to specify 2 drives with
unrelated characteristics.  Have done so on several occasions.  If you use
Disk Mangler to do the drive, it can NOT be used to do the low level
format, because it will say the the controller parameters cannot be
overridden.  Just do the LL format with debug, (allows you to put in bad
track info as well), and then use DM to do the preparation and volume
chopping if you need to.  I've combined ST225 and Min6085 drives this way,
and two more dissimilar drives would be hard to find!
Craig, Sysop Pinecliffe (303)4447073.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2240 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2311  09-17-88  10:01  (Read 94 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: DISK CONTROLLER  Reply to #2240

Oh, forgot to add.  In proper entrepreneurial spirit, I'll sell you the
XTGEN controller for $53 plus shipping (6% over wholesale).

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2240 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2323  09-17-88  22:53  (Read 97 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: CRAIG BAKER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DISK CONTROLLER  Reply to #2310

Well, sure, the ST225 and the Min6085 have different numbers of heads and
cylinders, but both are MFM drives.  I think the original question related
to whether it was possible to run an MFM drive and an RLL drive off the
same controller.  Doesn't the Adaptec 2072 have that ability, with proper
jumper settings?

     Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2240 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2331  09-18-88  10:39  (Read 95 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: NICK KEES
subject: R: R: DISK CONTROLLER  Reply to #2323

There are a couple of controllers that DO allow either (not sure about
both) RLL & MFM.  Dont know the 2072, but I'll check on the 2372 (Nice
controller).

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2240 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2340  09-19-88  12:11  (Read 66 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: CRAIG BAKER
subject: R: R: DISK CONTROLLER  Reply to #2311

I have some WD superbios ROMS comming in to update my WX2 controllers, so I
can enter the parameters manually. What is special about the XTGEN
controller, what features do it have?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2240 reply #7  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2248  09-12-88  20:06  (Read 103 times)
   from: JAY SCHLUETER
     to: ALL
subject: AST SIX PACK PREMIUM

Here's the problem I'm encountering, I want to utilize the rs232 port
on the ast six pack premium eems board.  With the enclosed instructions
I cannot make heads or tails on how to accomplish this.  I want it to be
used as com port 2.  Any help will be appreciated.  Thanks.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2256  09-12-88  23:49  (Read 112 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: ALL
subject: 3.5 HELP SOLVED

     cc: STEVE MCCRYSTAL

Thanks to all those who replied to my need for help but I have solved the
problem. It WAS the pinouts AND Driver.sys incompatability that was the
culprit. Please read on if you would like the info to convert a 3.5 ext.

The pinouts for converting an IBM external 3.5" 720k drive with a TYPE 2
interface cable (power pigtail) to an internal dual 17-pin (34-pin) edge
connector are:

Drive                        DB37   17x2   Adapter
---------------------------- conn.  Lands  -----------------------------
Unused                       1-5
 (1-4 are POWER and are inserted in the DB37 but not connected. Pin 5 is
wired back to the drive but is not used.  ISOLATE AND COVER THESE LEADS!

                                    2,4,6  Unused
Index Out                     6  -->  8    Index In
Motor Enable C In             7  <-- 16    Motor Enable B Out
Drive Select D In(not wired)  8
Drive Select C In             9  <-- 12    Drive Select B Out
Motor Enable D In(not wired) 10
Direction(Stepper Motor) In  11  <-- 18    Direction(stepper motor) Out
Step Pulse In                12  <-- 20    Step Pulse Out
Write Data In                13  <-- 22    Write Data Out
Write Enable In              14  <-- 24    Write Enable Out
Track 0 Out                  15  --> 26    Track 0 In
Write Protect Out            16  --> 28    Write Protect In
Read Data Out                17  --> 30    Read Data In
Select Head 1 In             18  <-- 32    Select Head 1 Out
Ground                     19-33    1-33   Ground

This pin configuration will allow the use of the 3.5" drive as either A: or
B: in the same manner as connecting 5.25" drives. (Twist goes on A: drive).

YOU MUST PUT   DRIVPARM=/D:n /F:n IN YOUR CONFIG.SYS

  where n=drive # i/e: 1=A:  2=B:
  and /n= form factor, 2 being for a 720k drive

    *****  Device=Driver.sys WILL NOT work!  *****

This conversion WORKS! I am using it now and have verified the drive
operation as both A: and B: depending on which cable connector it is
attached to. It causes no problems with the 5.25" 360k I also have
installed.

I HAVE NOT tried to boot from the 3.5 as drive A:, but if the config.sys
is on the boot disk it shoiuld work. I'm too tired of this thing to check
it out.

DRIVPARM IS A PARTIALLY UNDOCUMENTED INTERNAL DOS 3.2 COMMAND, I THINK IT
WAS DROPPED IN 3.3.

Russ
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2264  09-13-88  06:36  (Read 111 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: 3.5 HELP SOLVED  Reply to #2256

Russ,

That's fantastic! Glad you finally did it. And thanks for documenting it so
well. That will go in my 'how to do the unlikely' file. As to DRIVPARM, if
you are not afraid of patching to acheive a good end, there are a pair of
files in Mahoney that document how to activate DRIVPARM in PC-DOS 3.3 and
should you want to really gamble, 4.0 as well. I have done it to my 3.3 and
it's super! Saves a bunch of memory, and IT WORKS. I, like you, had a
problem with DRIVER.SYS not working with my 1.4m drive and it was internal.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2256 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2268  09-13-88  18:14  (Read 110 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 HELP SOLVED  Reply to #2264

First I'll have to get a hold of PC-DOS 3.3. I have access to MS-DOS 3.3
but will the patches work for it also?

Have you had any problems relating to disk/diskette format with 3.3?
It doesn't require anything but a  A:>SYS C: and copy of command.com does
it? I'm sure all the accompaning .com's would have to go too but I've heard
of problems with Chkdsk.com on 3.3. Any suggestions?

P.S. When do you want your book back?

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2256 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2269  09-13-88  20:22  (Read 110 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 HELP SOLVED  Reply to #2268

Russ,

The guy who did the patch has told me that it works on MS 3.2 but I have
yet to try it. But the fellow hasn't failed me yet. So I assume it will
work. But the patch is well documented so if the required bytes don't show
up in the right place, just don't put it in.

Not sure if I understand your second question. But to put 3.3 on the HD all
you need is a sys c: and copy command.com. And, as you said, all the other
DOS files will have to be ocpied over as well. I've never had (or heard of)
any problems with CHKDSK under 3.3, but there is a problem using it with
some partitioned drives, as I recall. Take a look back a few days in this
conference and see if you can find a reference to it. The problem may have
been with a single partition >32 megs or maybe on PC 4.0, I can't remember
and I haven't printed the messages for a few days. Too busy!

Are you done with the manual. If so, I could stop and pick it up. If not,
it's not a problem. I don't use it EVERY day!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2256 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2270  09-13-88  21:09  (Read 112 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 HELP SOLVED  Reply to #2269

Yes, I'm done with it, give me a call at work before you stop to get it so
I can make sure to be there.

Thanks again for all your help Steve.

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2256 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2278  09-14-88  19:47  (Read 102 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 HELP SOLVED  Reply to #2270

Russ,

I tried to do that today. Unfortunately, I filed your number under 'don't
loose this under any circumstances'. Now I can't find it! Could you leave
it for me again? Thanks.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2256 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2285  09-15-88  12:58  (Read 98 times)
   from: GEORGE HOFFMAN
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 HELP SOLVED  Reply to #2268

ms-dos 3.3 requires no modifications for drivparm (i.e. microsoft hooked
the code back up). That's why i use it.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2256 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2288  09-15-88  20:29  (Read 101 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: GEORGE HOFFMAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 HELP SOLVED  Reply to #2285

George,

Now that's what I wanted to hear. Thanks!

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2256 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2290  09-15-88  22:25  (Read 99 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: GEORGE HOFFMAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: 3.5 HELP SOLVED  Reply to #2285

Thanks for the info. I've been considering going to 3.3 but after a long
bout with the 3.5 conversion, I might wait a while before tackling it. It
never goes easy it seems.

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2256 reply #8  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2261  09-13-88  01:29  (Read 107 times)
   from: STEVE RUSTON
     to: ALL
subject: IBM PC BIOS UPGRADE.

Dose Anyone Out The Know Wher I Can Get A BIOS Rom Upgrade For An Origin-
al IBM 64k PC?? AS I cant Run EGA or Put In A 386 With The
27th Oct 82 Bios That I Have.
If Anyone Can Then Please Give me Full Details.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2262  09-13-88  01:38  (Read 109 times)
   from: JEFFREY HOWELL
     to: STEVE RUSTON (Rcvd)
subject: R: IBM PC BIOS UPGRADE.  Reply to #2261

STEVE,
.     One source of the upgrade BIOS ROM (pn MK36C35N-4) is:
.          HI TECH ELECTRONICS
.          7686 ST. CLAIR C.
.          MENTOR, OHIO  44060
.          216/951-1884
.     They list the price as $25.  I have a couple of other
sources, but, they want about $39 for the BIOS.  I would
suggest picking one up quick if you are contemplating changing
out your old BIOS, as IBM has discontinued this item and they
will soon become real scarce.
.                                       JEFFREY HOWELL

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2261 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2263  09-13-88  02:01  (Read 108 times)
   from: STEVE RUSTON
     to: JEFFREY HOWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: IBM PC BIOS UPGRAD  Reply to #2262

tHANK YOU For The Information, It Will get me Out Of A Tricky Problem
I did'nt Expect Such A quick Reply!! But Thanks Again.......

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2261 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2266  09-13-88  11:18  (Read 121 times)
   from: PAUL MANKUS
     to: ALL
subject: NO SLOT CLOCK

HELP!!!!
I HAVE A TANDON XT COMPATABLE WITH A SEAGATE RLL HARD DRIVE 30 MG.  IT
WOULD NOT FORMAT WITH THE TANDON DOS BUT WOULD WITH MICROSOFT DOS BUT...
IT CANNOT FIND MY NO SLOT CLOCK. IT WAS ABLE TO FIND THE CLOCK BEFORE I
INSTALLED THE NEW DRIVE.  THE MANUFACTURER HAS NO RECOMMENDATIONS ON HOW TO
AVOID THIS DELEMMA.  THE ERROR I GET FROM THE GET CLOCK PROGRAM READS NO
REAL TIME CLOCK INSTALLED.  ANY SUGGESTIONS WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED.
THANKS.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2267  09-13-88  13:05  (Read 110 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: ALL
subject: HELP: SYS360/PC XFER

7I have a client who like to move some documents from the
system 36 to their PC. She thinks they are displaywrite
documents. I don't really care- I can do the file convert
once I get the file physically on an IBM PC floppy.

Can a System 36 write a PC floppy, or is there a file
transfer facility built in?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2284  09-15-88  11:29  (Read 98 times)
   from: PHIL PUCCI
     to: ALL
subject: COMPAQ PARTS


I am looking for an alternate source for COMPAQ
and COMPAQ compatible hardware replacement parts.

About one year ago, I saw a company (advertised
in a computer-related periodical) which stated
that they were a source for COMPAQ parts (as well
as other well known computer manufacturers).
Unfortunately, I have not been able to locate this
advertisement.

Please leave me a message (here) if you can offer
any assistance.

Thank you,

Phil Pucci

Exec-PC 414/964-5160
C$I 71001,3613

---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2286  09-15-88  18:26  (Read 95 times)
   from: RICK PORUBCAN
     to: ALL
subject: CALL BACK MODEMS

Does anyone know of any modems that have call back capability on their own?
There used to be quite a few manufacturers, but most have dropped call back
models.  The one I'm looking for does not need to store many numbers, at
most maybe 10 to 20.  Also has anybody had any experience using portable
computers with cellular phones?

Thanks in advance

Rick
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2291  09-15-88  23:12  (Read 96 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: RICK PORUBCAN (Rcvd)
subject: R: CALL BACK MODEMS  Reply to #2286

I believe Black Box sells call back modems and front ends to modems.
You will pay big $$$ from these folks, but from what products we have from
them it seems to justify it.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2286 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2292  09-16-88  01:09  (Read 94 times)
   from: RICK PORUBCAN
     to: THOMAS ATKINSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: CALL BACK MODEMS  Reply to #2291

Thanks alot!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2286 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2287  09-15-88  19:26  (Read 96 times)
   from: DON SYLVESTER
     to: ALL
subject: EPSON EQ II & MULTITASK

I have a EPSON Equity II PC running under DOS 3.1. I have been trying to
use a multitasking software like Double Dos and Omniview 4.0 so that I can
run my modem and do other things during downloads. My problem is that my
EPSON won't respond to the hotkeys of these programs. Other programs like
Software Carousel and ALT work just fine as does Sidekick and Prokey. My
EPSON repair dealer worked with EPSON and upgraded my ROM to Ver 1.11 and
the motherboard to Ver. 3, but still no luck. Epson seems to have given up.
I know that the software is ok since it works on my WYSE pc at work. Can
anyone help me with a solution, or is this just an Epson incompatibility
problem?
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2289  09-15-88  21:39  (Read 104 times)
   from: MIKE CODY
     to: ALL
subject: PERSTOR & AWESOME I/O

To Whom may have any answers:

     I have a few questions about PerStor Controller Cards.

a. Do they increase RLL encoded drives. In other words how much
   space can I expect to gain on an ST-238?

b. Are the capable of controller more than 1 drive and if so, do
   the drives have to be identical..ie can they contol a ST-238
   and a ST-277....?

c. Do these controllers require a 16 bit slot or 8 bit?

d. How do they compare in speed of Xfer..to a RLL card?

e. Do you know how they handle patitioning. Do they work under
   Ontrack or Dos 3.3?

        In general I am interested for myself and couple of
customers. I have a an ST-238 and ST-277 runing with a RLL card on
my system, and would like to stick with half height drives in my
new AT class system. I have only 3 drive bays, and would perfer not
to go external. Hence if I can get 80 megs or so out of my ST-277 or
maybe 90 megs out of a 60meg half hieght, I will go that route. If
I should go external full hieght, I will probably use an ST-4096.
What kind of results could I expect with the Perstor on it? Also I
have a customer with a ST 4096 in his server. He could use the space
does the Perstor run under Novell?

Sorry for the long winded rhetoric. But Lastly:

In reference to the above questions..does anyone out there know
anything about the Awesome I/O controller card in regards to the
above questions....

Thanx ...

                        Mike Cody
                        Home Plate BBS
                        313-385-9969
                        Port Huron, Mi



---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2312  09-17-88  10:20  (Read 91 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: MIKE CODY (Rcvd)
subject: R: PERSTOR & AWESOME I/O  Reply to #2289

Perstor information:
They have 2 models the 180 and the 200 series.  180 series write 31 sectors
per track (unlike MFM at 17 or RLL at 27). 200 series writes 34 sectors per
track.  Both controllers are 8 bit cards, suitable for both XT and AT, (but
with different roms for each).  They are table driven as far as the drive
types, and different drives may be attached (as long as both are on the
same table).  the 200 series last I heard was only available as OEM, and
was not fully debugged.  180 series is solid. Have one on my BBS and have
run it for 2 years, no problems.  It increases drive size by app. 90%.
Seagates can be handled, but I would be leary of reliable operation, just
due to poor quality that Seagate has been turning out for last year.
The Perstor has its own low level formatting software, and Ontrack,
Vfeature, DOS work fine.  I have a Miniscribe 6085 and get 130Mb formmatted
from the drive.
Perstor is more tolerant than RLL, and should (in theory) work with ANY
drive. Cost (from me, if I remember right off top of head) is about
$210.  I'll check the price, but my price to you guys here is 6% above
wholesale... Oh -- Perstore is HD Only controller, but will coexist with
any other controller in an AT, and if its the only one, you tell Setup that
there is NO drive attached....
Craig, sysop Pinecliffe (303)4447073.  Voice=BBS-2.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2289 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2318  09-17-88  13:35  (Read 91 times)
   from: MIKE CODY
     to: CRAIG BAKER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PERSTOR & AWESOME  Reply to #2312

Thanx Craig...this the info I was looking for. I have just recieved a MS
6085 and had decided to use it on my own upgrader. I stilll will ust teh
4096 sg though for my customer. It's one of them coporate types that insist
on certain models and they only use SEGATE. Appreciated the input..

 _ _ _            __
' ) ) )   /      /  )       /
 / / / o /_  _  /    ______/ __  ,
/ ' (_<_/ <_</ (__/ (_) (_/_/ (_/_
                               /
                              '
Sysop of Home Plate
Another Wildcat BBS
313-385-9969 7/24
3/12/24/9600 MNP 5 HST
Call Port Huron,MI....

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2289 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2330  09-18-88  10:37  (Read 90 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: MIKE CODY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: PERSTOR & AWESOME  Reply to #2318

Alas, I know the type all too well.  Good luck.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2289 reply #3  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2294  09-16-88  16:37  (Read 95 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: JIM CAMPOLO (Rcvd)
subject: BAD TK 0?

Regarding your MicroSci 10 mb drive:

If track 0 is TRULY bad, chuck the drive in the trash. The bad track
sparing and partition table live there, and some boot information too, I
think. Nothing can be done for a drive that has a bad track 0.

BUT, it's more likely that you aren't hooked up right, rather than having a
real dead track 0.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2299  09-16-88  20:43  (Read 95 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: BAD TK 0?  Reply to #2294

     cc: JIM CAMPOLO

Jim, DO NOT throw away that drive even if track 0 IS bad. Use Disk Manager
 to partition the drive with the second partition starting at
track 1 and format ONLY that partition. It will not of course be able to be
a boot drive, but can serve as a second drive. I think I have a text file
laying around somwhere that goes into more detail on this. If you would
like, I could dig it up.

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2294 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2313  09-17-88  10:26  (Read 94 times)
   from: CRAIG BAKER
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BAD TK 0?  Reply to #2299

I second the motion.  If track 0 is bad on a drive, you can often make it
bootable and have it WORK, by having Dos (or whomever) start with DOS
partition at track 1.  All that is required for Bootability is to have
Track 0 Head 0 Sector 0 READ correctly.  Making the partition start at 1
means that the other sectors on Tr 0 Hd 0 are not necessary.
If drive fails to boot when you have done this, then have partition start
at 1, and make it drive D in your system.  A good hard drive should not be
pitched just because track 0 cannot be read. Unless its a Seagate.  (Only
joking....maybe).
Even if the drive has head N dead, the drive can be configured with WD
controllers (as well as others) to be a N-1 Head drive with the correct #
cyls.  Of course if N=0 drive cannot be used, and if N=1 the drive will be
on the small side.  But if you have and 8 head drive and head 6 is dead,
you still have usuable storage here!.
Craig, sysop pinecliffe. 303 444 7073.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2294 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2319  09-17-88  15:33  (Read 93 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: CRAIG BAKER (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BAD TK 0?  Reply to #2313

My point exactly. I also saw something about using CPM to format the drive
partition as bootable even with track 0 bad (read AND write). I'll have to
dig up the file and U/L it if it isn't on here. It's called something like
TRK0BAD.ARC

I have an OLD IBM 40 meg drive that has noisy bearings and a bad head, but
I formatted it out to 32m and will use it until it totally crashes. Hey,
it's got a 30msec access time and has given me NO problems since I got it
running two months ago. No since in trashing it eh?

Russ

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2294 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2338  09-19-88  12:05  (Read 67 times)
   from: TOM PETERS (LEADER)
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BAD TK 0?  Reply to #2299

Do you think he can really get away with that? Using Disk Manager to
partition the drive with a "second" partition beginning at track 1 is
clever, but doesn't the partition table live at track 0? can disk manager
even put a partition table on the drive?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2294 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2341  09-19-88  22:55  (Read 55 times)
   from: RUSS TERRY
     to: TOM PETERS (LEADER) (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BAD TK 0?  Reply to #2338

Let me see if I can dig up that *&^$%*^% file and upload it. Let me see?
(why oh why do I keep putting off cataloging my disk!) Check back later
Tom.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2294 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2344  09-20-88  07:30  (Read 41 times)
   from: JIM CAMPOLO
     to: RUSS TERRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: BAD TK 0?  Reply to #2299

Thanks for all of the help, I ended up getting the drive up
using hdtest and reformatting and testing several formats.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2294 reply #6  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2295  09-16-88  19:19  (Read 98 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: ALL
subject: DOS?

I'd like to take a survey of the various different DOS versions in use by
Exec-PC subscribers.

1)What release of DOS are you currently using?
2)PC-MS-Compaq-System specific(Blue Chip,etc.)?
3)Is it official? Bootleg?
4)Have you had any problems with it, or have you changed DOS because of
  problems?

I am currently using MSDOS3.20.  I bought Microsoft's DOS for the BlueChip
and had no problems with it, but am running a vanilla version for a reason
no longer relevant. If you're shy, leave a response in PRIVATE.  Any
messages there will go no further, although I intend to share the overall
numbers with the board. Thanks!
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2296  09-16-88  19:38  (Read 92 times)
   from: JOE VINCENT
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS?  Reply to #2295

1. PC DOS 3.3, both at home and on all machines at the office.
2. True-blue IBM PC DOS.
3. All copies purchased, both at home and at the office.
4. Once I installed DASDDRVR.SYS (IBM's official "fix"), DASD-related
   problem went away on office PS/2 50Z.  No other problems on PS/2s and
   never any problem on PC/AT at home.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2298  09-16-88  20:41  (Read 93 times)
   from: STEVE SHATTUCK
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS?  Reply to #2295

David,
     Tandy MS-DOS 3.20, official version, absolutely no problems with a
very extensive configuration that includes COM1, COM2, COM4, 20meg HD,
40Meg HD, 10+10 Bernouli box, Oki Laserline 6 Printer, Courier 2400, Kurta
Series I Digitizer, BSR Home Controller and 2Megs memory.
                                  Steve

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #2

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2300  09-16-88  20:46  (Read 99 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS?  Reply to #2295

Dave,

I am using a True Blue version of DOS 3.3, and it is a legit copy from IBM.
I have had exactly zero problems with it that could be attributed to the
DOS itself. I originally upgraded to it just for the CALL batch command,
and have since found many other features that make the move worthwhile,
like the fastopen filename cache to name just one.

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #3

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2302  09-17-88  00:03  (Read 96 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS?  Reply to #2295

   IBM PC-DOS, on clones all around.  Version 3.3 at home because I have an
ST-251 and I'd rather not run a device driver if DOS will handle the whole
drive, even though I DO set up two partitions.  Just switched over from 3.1
only little while ago.  In that same vein, still using PC-DOS 3.1 at the
office because I haven't taken time to make the switchover yet while at the
office.  No problems with either one yet (knock on wood).

         Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #4

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2303  09-17-88  02:25  (Read 94 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS?  Reply to #2295

    I'm using DOS 3.2 version 3.3 doesn't seems to work as well for me. I'm
using two legit copies on a DTK 12 Mhz AT and Columbia 1600-1 expanded to
run two hard disks. 3.2 seems to fill my needs and I don't have a need
for 3 1/2" floppies yet.

                            Steve Morgan

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #5

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2305  09-17-88  09:17  (Read 94 times)
   from: AL HANSEN
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS?  Reply to #2295

David,
     I support various machines, so I'll just comment on the ones I use
most, or personally own.  (All of our PS/2's run PC DOS 3.3 with the
official IBM patch device driver)
.
1. Compaq 386S - Compaq DOS 3.31
   IBM PS/2 80 - PC DOS 4.0
   IMB Portable PC - PC DOS 3.3
2. As stated above.
3. All are legit copies, or upgrades from previous versions of PC DOS.
4. Problems with 3.31 and 4.0, FAT related as in Norton Utils, and some
   shareware stuff.  Nothing that I can't live with until the vendor offers
   new version.  I really don't know why we're having such an uproar over
   DOS 4.0, its got the same problems I have with Compaq 3.31.   AL --

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #6

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2315  09-17-88  11:17  (Read 95 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: NICK KEES (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS?  Reply to #2302

I just tried ILEAV16 and was told that I had:
FIRST PHYSICAL DRIVE:
980 cylinders, 5 heads, 0 sectors per track
Maximum capacity:0.0 Megabytes

SECOND PHYSICAL DRIVE:
331 cylinders, 189 heads, 112 sectors per track
Maximum capacity:3587.4 Megabytes

Do you think Mahoney could use a 3587.4meg disk?  When the program asked me
which disk I wanted to process, I said the second and I got a response that
ILEAVE16 would only work with 17 sectors per track.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #7

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2316  09-17-88  11:22  (Read 94 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: ALL
subject: DOS?  Reply to #2315

Thanks for all the responses so far and keep them coming!

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #8

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2320  09-17-88  21:16  (Read 99 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS?  Reply to #2315

David,

Those results are not uncommon with ILEAVE! I had the same type of snafu
when I tried it, that's one reason I use OPTIMIZE. It works! But to avoid
seeming to bad-mouth ILEAVE, I have avoided saying that too loudly, UNTIL
NOW! But since you pointed out the obvious, I don't feel too bad about
backing you up...

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #9

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2321  09-17-88  22:09  (Read 100 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS?  Reply to #2295

PC-DOS 3.3 and Tech Ref, paid in full, only problem that may be due to
speed card is the 301 bad key message at times on reboot, even after
loading Dasddrvr.sys. Bought it because my wife wanted me to (ha)...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #10

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2322  09-17-88  22:46  (Read 98 times)
   from: NICK KEES
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS?  Reply to #2315

Hey, any drive with 189 heads has got to be a doozy.  Seriously, ILEAVE
must have problems with RLL drives.  I never realized that.  I've only used
it with MFM drives.  Sorry you wasted your time.

     Nick

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #11

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2324  09-17-88  23:04  (Read 97 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: STEVE MCCRYSTAL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS?  Reply to #2320

The docs with OPTIMISE said that the low level format would destroy data,
not move it to RAM.  It seemed clear on this, so am I missing something?

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #12

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2325  09-17-88  23:08  (Read 97 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: NICK KEES
subject: R: R: DOS?  Reply to #2322

Time is not wasted when something is learned; we learned that ILEAVE and
RLL don't get along.  No problem(but if ILEAVE really could give a
multigigabyte drive...)

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #13

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2328  09-18-88  05:14  (Read 94 times)
   from: JIM HARRY
     to: THOMAS ATKINSON (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS?  Reply to #2321

Tom:    The 301 key error is usually from holding down one or more keys too
long when doing a CTL-ALT-DEL to reboot rather than being strictly due to
the speedup.  It will show up more often with the speedup because it gets
to that part of the self-test faster.
...Jim...

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #14

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2329  09-18-88  09:45  (Read 93 times)
   from: STEVE MCCRYSTAL
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS?  Reply to #2324

Dave,

No, you didn't miss anything. That is how it works. But on the drive I used
both on, it was quicker to do a backup, optimize the interleave, and
restore the data than it was to "move it to ram" and reformat. By about 2
hours! So I do it that way, since frequent backups are a must anyway it
presents no problem. And a lot of folks would have NO backups if it were
not for the one they were FORCED to make to use Optimise! But it is my
opinion that any program which purports to "reformat the drive without
losing data" is an invitation to disaster, ALL of them including SpinRite!
I would not even THINK of trying to do it without current full backup. But
that is just my opinion ...

-[Steve]-

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #15

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2332  09-18-88  11:42  (Read 93 times)
   from: THOMAS ATKINSON
     to: JIM HARRY (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: DOS?  Reply to #2328

I thought at first the ctrl/alt/del was the problem, only thing is that i
use a reboot program that copies autoexec and config to the root, and then
the system boots from code.  The 301 still shows at times even though the
last key touched may have been 5 seconds prior, this is sporadic and not a
major problem.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #16

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2333  09-18-88  16:50  (Read 92 times)
   from: PAUL GLANDER
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS?  Reply to #2295


David

1) PCDOS 4.0
2) IBMPC-AT (the real thing)
3) Official
4) Problems:
        a)Memory allocation error
          Cannot load Command, System halted
          Go the error after using Autocad, shelling while in ACAD,
          returning to ACAD and exiting. I couldn't return to the
          Dosshell without a reboot. After this happened several
          more times I changed my buffers from 40 to 38.
          NO PROBLEM ANYMORE.
        b)Now that Print was installed automaticly, print screen works
          in some programs where it never worked before.
          But in basic where I used to do a print screen, it prints to
          my Panasonic KX-P1090 sideways (and very slow).  Mybe I should
          uninstall Print
        c)I've been getting quite a few unallocated clusters which never
          used to happen before unless I would bomb out while in ACAD.
        d)PCTOOLS Deluxe ver 4.1 must be upgraded to ver 4.3 in order for
          Mirror to work.  I called Central Point and this can be done
          for $8.00 and an order ref. number , to the registered.
        e)In the Dosshell all the hidden files are shown.  I like to have
          my hidden files hidden.  There should at least be an option.

Paul


>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #17

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2335  09-19-88  00:30  (Read 74 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS?  Reply to #2316

David,

I use PC-DOS 3.1 at home (upgrade from 2.0) and PC-DOS 3.2 at work.  I'm
thinking about going to DOS 3.3 at home since I've upgraded to a 64 MB disk
and it would handle the partitioning.  All copies are legit.

glen

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #18

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2336  09-19-88  07:27  (Read 71 times)
   from: BOB BLAIR
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: R: DOS?  Reply to #2295

1) IBM PC DOS 3.3 (AT) and 3.1 (XT)

2) IBM PC DOS on IBM AT and IBM XT respectively

3) Both versions official and 3.3 has TECH. REF. added

4) With 3.3 have one software difficulty between Disk Manager (for an
ST-251) and Genoa tape backup software as far as partition backups.  The
problem is not present with 3.1.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2295 reply #19  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2304  09-17-88  02:35  (Read 91 times)
   from: STEVE MORGAN
     to: JIM CAMPOLO (Rcvd)
subject: BAD TRACK 0

Jim,

       If you really want to keep the drive there are some good hard disk
repair facilities available to you with 5 - 7 day turn around times.
Brockway Disk Technologies is mt first choice because they have done
excellent work for me. They can be reached at 1 800 322 8234. Another
more expensive choice would be Peripheral Repair Corp., Miniscribe refered
them to me and they did excellent work on a 3425 and a CMI 6426-S that no
one else could fix. They can be reached at 1 818 700 8482. Tom's suggestion
should also work as long as you can accept your hard disk not booting.

                       Steve Morgan
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2345  09-20-88  07:34  (Read 39 times)
   from: JIM CAMPOLO
     to: STEVE MORGAN
subject: R: BAD TRACK 0  Reply to #2304

Thanks for all of the info, I ot the drive up using HDTEST,
a very comprehensive hdtest and formatter (LL).

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2304 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2314  09-17-88  10:37  (Read 90 times)
   from: PAT BIESER
     to: ALL
subject: HARD DISK REPAIR

I'm looking for someone to repair old 10, 20 and 30 meg IBM hard disks.
Preferably looking in the Wisconsin area.  Any information or leads that
could help me find someone would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for your help guys:

Patrick Bieser
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2317  09-17-88  13:12  (Read 90 times)
   from: STEVE LUNSFORD
     to: ALL
subject: 1984 NEC APC COMPUTER

IS THERE ANY WAY TO UPGRADE A 1983-84 NEC APC COMPUTER WITH 128K AND TWO 8"
DISK DRIVES.  IT USES MSDOS IS AN ORPHAN AN ISNT TOTALLY IBM
COMPATIBLE.  WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE TO BUY A NEW 8088 TYPE MOTHERBOARD AND
REPLACE WHAT WAS THERE WITH IT.  WE WOULD UTILIZE WHATEVER PREEXISTING
COMPONENTS WE COULD BUT WOULD OBVIOUSLY NEED AT LEAST ONE 5 1/4 DISK DRIVE.
WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE TO USE SHAREWARE ETC., AND TRANSFER IT TO THE APC BY A
MODEM OR ONE OF THE OTHER TRANSFER DEVICES?  IS IT POSSIBLE TO USE PUBLIC
DOMAIN SOFTWARE ON THE NEC APC?  THANKS FOR ANY HELP!
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2326  09-17-88  23:16  (Read 91 times)
   from: DAVID BIRCH
     to: STEVE LUNSFORD
subject: R: 1984 NEC APC COMPUTER  Reply to #2317

Hope you have better luck than I did on an identical machine ran a special
release of MSDOS2.1, but had many problems with hardware and software
incompatilities.  The owner transferred Norton Utilities to 8" and the
system couldn't do any thing with them.  The money to upgrade it would buy
an AT clone with 512k and Hercules graphics.  This is what the owner did.

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2317 reply #1  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2327  09-18-88  00:11  (Read 93 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: DOS

I'm using Zenith DOS 3.1 at home on ZDS 148; I carry the "office" with me
while I'm working and use MSDOS 3.2 on a Grid.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2334  09-19-88  00:07  (Read 74 times)
   from: JAMES IRVING
     to: DAVID BIRCH (Rcvd)
subject: DOS

Sorry Dave, but I just saw you wanted to know if the DOS's used were
official versions. The answers are yes and yes, respectively. I also have
an official, but unused, copy of MSDOS 3.2, originally intended for a Blue
Chip computer. Don't ask me why I bought it; found it on clearance at
K-Mart (!) for $20 about two years ago. I'll be interested in seeing the
results of your survey.
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2337  09-19-88  09:13  (Read 67 times)
   from: NIGEL GRAY
     to: ALL
subject: TAPE DRIVES


Subject:  Machines that use DC-300-XL/P Tapes

Issue:  I have a stack of DC-300-XL/P tapes (unformatted 45mb) that I
would like to use rather than trashing!  I also have a list of tape
drives that use these tapes.  My questions to all are:  Does anyone know
which, if any, of these tape drives are IBM PC/XT/AT compatible?  If
drives are compatible with IBM, are they still available "new" or
should I look to the used market?  And, if the used market is the place
to look, does anyone have a source?

The following is a list of machines that use DC-300-XL/P tapes:

Archive:        Scorpion #5920, 5945
                Sidewinder #9020
                Super Sidewinder #9045
Cipher:         540 Series
                Series 400
Corvus:         TLC
D.E.I.:         EL5/SL5, EL6/SL6
                Super Funnel
                Mini-Qic-Stream III
                Streaker
Emulex:         Decathon & Javalon
Everex:         4500 XL
Fortune:        System 1,5,10
IBM:            5100, 5110
                5363
                6157
NCR:            7200, 9100, 9300 Series
                8100, 8130, 8150 Series
                Tower XD
NEC:            Astra Series, 5110-001
                CT-7700 Series
Prime:          4581, 4582
                4651, 2250("Rabbit")
Siemens:        3309
                3951
Sysgen:         11-G-10, 11-G-20
                PC 1/0 Subsystem
Tallgrass:      TG-2200
Tandy:          TCS-1000
Televideo:      TS-806
                TS-816
Texas Instrum't DS-990 Model 4
                Explorer, WD-800
3M:             DCD-3 (Data Cartridge Drive)
Wang Labs:      All systems

        Any info, on any of these, will be greatly appreciated.  Please
leave message on board or call (voice) 201-724-3897 (8 to 4 EST).

                                 \\\\\\\ Nigel Gray ///////


---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2343  09-20-88  00:45  (Read 46 times)
   from: JEFFREY HOWELL
     to: NIGEL GRAY (Rcvd)
subject: R: TAPE DRIVES  Reply to #2337

NIGEL,
.     I have a pair of Tandy TCS 100's, and 4 controller cards in
the following computers.  Tandy 1200 (highly modified), IBM PC/AT,
IBM PC/XT, and IBM PC.  I shift the tape drives between the machines
regularly with no problems.  The nice thing about Tandy's software
is that it allows either an image or file-by-file backup.  The file
-by-file is really nice when you want to transfer info from one machine
to another, as an image can only be restored to the exact same
configuration.
.     The Tandy TCS 100 is actually a Techmar unit relabeled and
sold to Tandy.  If you do set one up and a tape gets to the point that
the software/drive tells you the tape is no longer reliable, you
might want to use a bulk eraser on it.  I have done this several times,
and each time was able to reliably use the tapes again.  My theory
is that as you "format" the tape and write BOT and EOT markers to
the tape several times, the drive/controller/software becomes
confused and refuses to function with the tape until it is "cleaned".
By the way I hereby disclaim any responsibility for a loss of
data if you try this - it is only one user's experience.
.                                         JEFFREY

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2337 reply #1

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2346  09-20-88  08:26  (Read 33 times)
   from: NIGEL GRAY
     to: JEFFREY HOWELL (Rcvd)
subject: R: R: TAPE DRIVES  Reply to #2343

Jeffery,  Sounds like I have an option to look into.  I'll contact Tandy
for availability and interface.  Thanks for the info and I'll let you in on
the results of my findings.
                                \\\\\\\ Nigel Gray ///////

>>>>>>>>>> Msg 2337 reply #2  >>>Last msg in reply thread.
Returning to normal sequence.

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2348  09-20-88  12:12  (Read 27 times)
   from: GLEN THOMPSON
     to: ALL
subject: TAPE BACKUP

What recommendations does everyone have regarding reasonable priced tape
backup units.  This will be installed in an AT clone.  The requirements
are:
  1) Backup a 32 meg disk to one tape.
  2) unattended operation.
  3) Individual file restore.
  4) Restore to different drive/directory.
  5) backup/restore of subtrees.

It can have its own controller or use a floppy interface.  Speed in not
important as the backup will be started and run unattended.  Low price is
better.

thanks,

glen
---------------

   conf: COMPUTER HARDWARE  #2349  09-20-88  19:30  (Read 8 times)
   from: JOHN GRANT
     to: ALL
subject: SLAVES IN 386

I am having problems installing slaves in a Zenith 386.  The 386 does not
seem to have an open port address in which to install the slaves.

Does anyone know what range of addresses may be open and why i can't use
220 hex?
---------------

Conf: *HARDWARE*

Read messages:
<F>orward or <R>everse multiple
<N>ew msgs
<M>arked msgs (also unread Email)
<S>elective on from/to/subject
<I>ndividual msgs by #

Non-retrieval commands:
<L>eave (send) a msg
<U>pload msg
<D>elete a msg
<Z>ip scan & mark

<CR> or <Q> to QUIT

 376 READ command (FRNMSILUDZQTG, ?=help) -->