A Beginner's Guide to the Internet/INTERNET.ISO/text/telediag/tc13-151.txt

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TELECOM Digest     Thu, 4 Mar 93 14:29:00 CST    Volume 13 : Issue 151

Index To This Issue:                     Moderator: Patrick A. Townson

    Re: Internet Radio Program, "Geek of the Week" (Ben Burch)
    Re: Internet Radio Program, "Geek of the Week" (Harold Hallikainen)
    Re: Internet Radio Program, "Geek of the Week" (Tad Cook)
    Re: Toll Stations in California (Don Lynn)
    Re: 1-800 Collect Callbacks (Justin Leavens)
    Re: NY World Trade Center - Some Telecom News (Aninda Dasgupta)
    Re: WTC Blast (Jeffrey Jonas)
    NYTel and the Bombing (Dave Niebuhr)
    News Clips re: WTC (Daniel Burstein)
    Re: Remembering the Old Punch Cards (Brad Hicks)
    Re: Remembering the Old Punch Cards (Max J. Rochlin)
    Re: Remembering the Old Punch Cards (Al Stangenberger)
    Re: A Little More TWX History (Harold Hallikainen)
    Address Correction For Moderator's Note (Frank Carey)
----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Ben Burch <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Internet Radio Program, "Geek of the Week"
Organization: Motorola, Inc.
Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1993 17:15:39 GMT


In article <[e-mail]> TELECOM Moderator,
[e-mail] writes:

> The interviews are mastered onto Digital Audio Tape.  A typical
> 30-minute program occupies 15 Mbytes of disk space.  UUNET

Just what the internet needs; Hundred of folks FTPing 15 MB files on a
regular basis.  This is a really nifty concept, but it would be a
better idea if it waited for the high bandwidth "superhighway" backbone.


Ben Burch   [e-mail]

------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Harold Hallikainen)
Subject: Re: Internet Radio Program, "Geek of the Week"
Organization: California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo
Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1993 19:37:19 GMT


    Seems that distribution of audio over internet is going to
take an awful lot of bandwidth and be real costly.  Is it worth it?  I
keep looking at my phone bill and wish there was an easy way to just
pay by the bit (sending ASCII at my relatively slow typing speed)
instead of having to pay for a pair of 64 kbps circuits every time I
phone someone.

    Also, what sort of compression is to be used in this audio
distribution system?


Harold Hallikainen              [e-mail]
Hallikainen & Friends, Inc.     [e-mail]
141 Suburban Road, Bldg E4      phone [phone] fax [phone]
San Luis Obispo, CA 93401-7590  telex 4932775 HFI UI

------------------------------

From: hpubvwa![e-mail] (Tad Cook)
Subject: Re: Internet Radio Program, "Geek of the Week"
Date: Thu, 04 Mar 1993 16:23:41 GMT


There is an article about internet talk "radio" on the front page
of this morning's (3/4/93) {New York Times}.


Tad Cook     |  Phone:  [phone]  (home)     |   MCI Mail: 3288544
Seattle, WA  |  Packet: KT7H @ N7DUO.WA.USA.NA   |   [e-mail]
             |  Internet: [e-mail]           or...sumax!ole!ssc!tad

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 10:50:56 PST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Toll Stations in California


In David Esan's list of all non-dialable California phones, I was
surprised to see one that I have actually seen.  A few others that I
probably was by, but didn't notice.  The only phone in Nevada Falls,
California (Population Zero), is a phone for use by backpackers with
emergencies.  The phone was in a weatherproof box on a post a few
hundred yards south on the trail from the top of Nevada Falls, which
some of you may know is two or three miles, and about 2000 feet climb,
out of Yosemite Valley, in the beginning of the back country
wilderness of Yosemite National Park.  The phone is so incongruous
there that you can't miss it.

I have never been interested in making a phone call when hiking there,
so did not open the box to check it out.  Was not clear if
non-emergency use was allowed.  Should I have called Domino's rather
than carrying my lunch ten miles, as I did last time I was there?
Probably even get it free for missing the guaranteed delivery time.
There are no structures and no tents allowed in the area of this
phone, so I guess we could say it is the smallest town served by the
phone company.  From the report of a friend who was in the area
earlier this week, I can tell that the phone is inaccessible now,
unless you have snowshoes, so you probably don't want to check out
Nevada Falls 1 right now.

I must have walked past the phone Vernal Falls 1, about a mile and
1000 feet closer to a road than Nevada Falls 1.  There's a restroom
and a drinking fountain there, so it's practically a metropolis by
comparison.

Glen Aulin 1 and Merced Lake 2 are undoubtedly at the High-Sierra
Camps of the same names, also in Yosemite Park.  These consist of one
or two permanent buildings and a bunch of tent buildings erected every
summer, to serve backpackers and equestrian campers who wish to eat
and sleep in relative comfort, though at least a day's hike away from
the nearest road.

I will have to try to find and check out one of the numerous
non-dialable phones next time I am in Idlewild, a town of cabins in
the San Jacinto Mountains, in the Palm Springs vicinity.

Gaviota is on a major US highway (101), not all that far from Santa
Barbara, a sizable city, so I'm not sure why its fossil phone has not
been replaced.  Since the phone is Gaviota 43, it implies that they
DID get rid of at least 42 of them.

This message may seem to wander off the topic of telecom, but let me
justify this by saying that it is in understanding the locations that
we can see why these anachronisms, non-dialable phones, still exist.

Anybody want to start a movement to declare a few of these phones as
historical monuments? :-)


Don Lynn

------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Justin Leavens)
Subject: Re: 1-800 Collect Callbacks
Date: 3 Mar 1993 14:18:04 -0800
Organization: University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA


In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail]
(James Olsen) writes:

>  Sec. 64.714  No Disconnection for Failure to Remit pay-per-call Service
>  Charges.

>    No common carrier shall disconnect, or order the disconnection of, a
>  telephone subscriber's basic communications service as a result of that
>  subscriber's failure to pay interstate pay-per-call service charges.

   The problem that is left is that if a slimy IP charges you for
something that legitimately you should not have been charged for, and
you cannot get the IP to reverse the charge, the balance stays on your
account and then is reported to Equifax as a deliquent balance. Then
see if you can get new phone service established in a new
residence ... not likely.

   It still boggles my mind that the second most powerful collection
agency (referring to the collective Phone Company) in the country can
be used by any patch of slime to do what they wish. I think the whole
concept of "putting the charge on the phone bill" for any service
other than phone company charges is insane. I can't use $15 worth of
stamps on a package to buy a compact disc mail order, I can't put my
grocery charges on to my gas bill, and I can't pay for pool
maintenance on my water bill. If IPs can use the telco billing
procedures, why can't I order Chinese food for delivery and put *that*
on my phone bill ...


Justin Leavens    Microcomputer Specialist   University of Southern California

------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Aninda Dasgupta)
Subject: Re: NY World Trade Center - Some Telecom News
Organization: Philips Laboratories, Briarcliff, New York
Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1993 22:43:09 GMT


I'm not sure if anybody mentioned this in the Digest, but the blast at
the WTC took most TV stations out in NYC and the vicinity.  On the way
home from work that day, I couldn't get anything but CBS Radio, coming
live from the site. When I reached home, I turned on the TV to see if

they were showing any gory sights, but only CBS TV and a (Telemundo?)
station from NJ were on the air. My landlady's son, who works for CBS,
said that all the other TV stations had their transmitters on top of
the WTC.  CBS radio reported that the authorities had to actually
remove some of the TV and radio antennae in order to make space for a
helipad for the rescue helicopters to land on top of the WTC. [Some
transmitters may have suffered from the power cutoff.]  CBS TV
apparently transmits from the Empire State Building.

However, CBS radio also reported that one of the first persons to be
rescued from the top of the WTC, by helicopter, was a pregnant CBS
employee who was up on the WTC roof to repair the transmitter/antenna.
CBS probably maintains transmitters on both the WTC and ESB. I
couldn't tell if the cable operators were able to get feeds from the
TV stations that were off the air, because I don't subscribe to CATV
(I refuse to aid any monopoly) and I am also not sure if the rest of
the country got to see Peter Jennings or Tom Brokaw for the evening
news, but we were able to get only Dan Rather.

The CBS people were very good in reporting the developments non stop
that night, both on radio and on TV.  I was constantly wondering when
they would take a commercial break, but hats off to them, they kept
their cameras glued to the WTC towers. Even their weather and traffic
helicopters were kept hovering around the WTC, reporting on (and
possibly aiding in directing) emergency vehicle movements to and from
the site.

Two days ago, while dropping off my car at a basement parking garage
in a high-rise building next to Rockefeller Center in NYC, the
attendant jokingly asked me if I had a bomb in my trunk.  And
yesterday, while driving into Canada from the I-87 border in New York,
the customs official kept a straight face and asked us if we were
running away from the WTC blast. Then he burst out in a guffaw. Can't
blame him, it was 3 in the morning and he probably needed some
lighthearted banter for entertainment at the lonely border post, with
nothing but the miles of snow-covered landscape for company. But, the
blast has certainly affected people, all the way from NYC to a remote
border post on the NY-Canada border.


Aninda DasGupta ([e-mail]) Ph:[phone] Fax:[phone]
Philips Labs\n 345 Scarborough Rd\n  Briarcliff Manor\n NY 10510

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Mar 93 11:05:02 EST
From: [e-mail] (Jeffrey Jonas)
Subject: Re: WTC blast


There's a new newsgroup dedicated to the World Trade Center (WTC)
blast, but that's on another system so I can't find the name.  It was
curious that somebody posted that they first learned about the
"incident" from the TELECOM Digest, so thanks for the swift
turnaround.

I just came to work today via the PATH train WTC station.  Except for
the roped off area, it looks like business as normal on the concourse.
Most of the Path tracks are open as are the turnstiles, and most of
the stores are open with no apparent damage.

Two vacant stores are being used for the police, and for organizing
people to visit their offices to retrieve stuff.  After all the press
coverage, I'm amazed at how much is reopened again.  You'd think the
place was destroyed, but a lot is really back to normal.

I'm glad to have read in TELECOM Digest that Teleport was barely
damaged.  I guess it's more a RISKS item at how all the backup and
emergency systems were knocked out at once.  Just as the Hinsdale fire
demonstrated how not to build a facility, the WTC bomb demonstrated
that we need to protect our infrastructure from un-natural as well as
natural disasters.  There are many lessons that relate to telecom
here, sad to say.


Jeffrey Jonas    [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 3 Mar 93 14:04:06 EST
From: [e-mail] (Dave Niebuhr)
Subject: NYTel and the Bombing


New York Telephone announced in {Newsday} and other papers that they
have installed many more lines in wake of the bombing of 2 World Trade
Center and limited emergency office space.

1,700 new regular lines and 176 T1/T3's in addition to call-forwarding
and other features to 4,083 lines.  150 technicians have been added to
the immediate area to expedite whatever else needs to be done.


Dave Niebuhr      Internet: [e-mail] / Bitnet: niebuhr@bnl
Brookhaven National Laboratory Upton, NY 11973  (516)-282-3093

------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Daniel Burstein)
Subject: News Clips re: WTC
Organization: PANIX Public Access Unix, NYC
Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 08:05:33 GMT


While not directly related to telecom, the explosion at WTC has lots
of interesting ramifications.

I've put together a series of news clips from the incident.  If anyone
would like them, please send me email with something like:

  "wtc news request"
 in the subject line.

Note that I'm not a listserv, and don't even play one on TV, so it may
take a bit till I get it out to you.  Also, there are roughly
100K/day, and at this point, I have three days worth online.


email address: [e-mail]
twice the usual disclaimers apply...


[Moderator's Note: Here's the latest news: The White House announced
Thursday morning that the FBI has made at least one arrest in the WTC
matter. Someone in is custody who was seen on a videotape taken in the
garage. The FBI says a search is underway for 'others', but they won't
say how many or who, nor will they identify the person they did arrest
overnight Wednesday/Thursday morning.  PAT]

------------------------------

From: mc/G=Brad/S=Hicks/OU=[e-mail]
Date: 4 Mar 93 16:35:44 GMT
Subject: Re: Remembering the Old Punch Cards


It isn't just old foggies (grin) like Gordon and Pat who remember
punched cards; not only did the community college where I took my
first computer course (in 1978) still use punched cards (on an IBM
360/30), but as late as when I graduated from college in 1982 the ACM
computer programming competition was still using ANSI 66 (?) Fortran,
pre-Fortran-IV, and you HAD to punch your own decks and submit them in
batch via the official card readers.  (How much have things changed?)
I'm pretty proud of the teams I was on; Taylor was the only
undergraduate school in our region to send a team, and the only school
to send a team that had no keypunches for us to practice on, and we
still took third place in the region two years in a row.

And yes, Gordon's memory is correct; the bottom edge of the card is
called the "nine edge," but I thought that the top two rows were
labelled "B" and "A", not "11/10" or "X/R".  Different card stock?
But this all brings back to mind this little ditty that I learned in
my youth:

THE BALLAD OF THE UNKNOWN PROGRAMMER

"No program is perfect," / They said with a shrug. / "The customer is
happy, / What's one little bug?"

But he was determined. / The others went home. / He dug out the
flowcharts, / Deserted, alone.

Chain smoking, cold coffee, / Logic, deduction. / "I've got it!" he cried,
/ "Just change one instruction!"

Then two.  Then three more. / As year followed year, / New employees would
say, / "Is that guy still here?"

He died at the keypunch / of hunger and thirst. / Next day, he was buried,
/ Face down, nine-edge first.

His wife, through her tears, / Consoling her fate, / Said, "He's not
really gone, / He's just 'working late.'"


J. Brad Hicks     Internet: mc![e-mail]
X.400: c=US admd=ATTMail prmd=MasterCard sn=Hicks gn=Brad

------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Max J. Rochlin)
Subject: Re: Remembering the Old Punch Cards
Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1993 18:30:21 GMT
Organization: QueerNet


Ya know, you can still order the ANSI Standards documentation (which
just went "FINAL" last year).  I've misplaced my copy so I can't give
you the order number.  The title has the words Holerith Codes in it.



[e-mail]  |   Max J. Rochlin   |  {uunet,sgi}!unpc!max

------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Al Stangenberger)
Subject: Re: Remembering the Old Punch Cards
Date: 3 Mar 1993 20:11:03 GMT
Organization: U.C. Forestry & Resource Mgt.


Here at Berkeley, the first successor to the keypunch was a Teletype
and paper tape.  Editing paper tape was a pain, but bypassing the card
reader and saving a half-hour walk to the computer center was worth
it. (That was half-hour to submit the deck, and possibly another trip
later to pick up the (hopefully correct) output. We really felt great,
even at 110 baud!  (circa 1967).

I have the last surviving card reader at Berkeley.  Get to know some
interesting people through referrals -- there are still lots of decks
hidden away in files.  Possibly the last IBM cards punched on campus
were done on a 1939-vintage IBM model 01 hand-operated keypunch when I
had to make new control cards so my reader could talk to a revised
operating system. The cards were alphabetic, so each column had to be
multi-punched by hand.


Al Stangenberger                    Dept. of Forestry & Resource Mgt.
[e-mail]          145 Mulford Hall - Univ. of Calif.
uucp:  ucbvax!ucbviolet!forags      Berkeley, CA  94720
BITNET: FORAGS AT UCBVIOLE          [phone]  FAX: [phone]

------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Harold Hallikainen)
Subject: Re: A Little More TWX History
Organization: California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo
Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1993 20:00:48 GMT


    Thanks for the interesting history of Teletypewriters!  Back
in high school I used a model 15 with model 14 tape "typing reperf"
and "transmitter distributor" on amateur radio.  A friend and I also
set up a local teletype network.  We ran about a mile and a half of
single conductor wire through the trees of the neigborhood.  We then
fed this wire against ground, running a 60 mA current loop.  We made a
motor control circuit for each end.  When I wanted to leave a message
on his machine, I'd supply loop current, which would start both
motors.  To shut down, I'd drop my loop power supply which would cause
both machines to "run open" for a while, 'til a capacitor across a
current sense relay discharged, shutting down the AC to the motor.

    I also remember the very complicated wiring inside the model
15.  There was a huge wiring harness that seemed to allow for infinite
options.  I finally ripped it all out and brought out six wires.  Two
for the keyboard, two for the "selector magnets" (series for holding
magnets at 60 mA, parallel for pulling magnets at 60 mA, or series for
holding magnets at 20 mA), and two for AC power to the motor.

    The previous article spoke of various codes used on Teletypes.
I recall seeing machines that LOOKED like model 15s, but used a six
level code.  These were used by press wire services.  The sixth bit
allowed for upper and lower case.  At my college newspaper, they had
one of these printers and a tape punch running all the time.  When the
editor found an article of interest, he/she would go searching through
the punched tape looking for the article.  Articles were identified by
a number that was punched to be readable in the holes on the tape (and
garbage on the printer).  This tape was then sent to mechanical
Linotype machine where the article was cast in lead.  They'd then pull
a proof from the lead type, put it in the paste-up for the page.  Then
they'd photograph the page, make offset plates and print the paper.
Watching that Lintotype cast the type to be used just once was pretty
amazing!

    The previous article also mentioned the use of model 15s in
radio and TV station wire service use in the 1950s.  Here in SLO Town,
they were used through the mid 1970s.  These were eventually replaced
with Extel dot matrix printers, the first dot matrix printer I ever
saw.

    Finally, I still have a model 33 with tape punch, reader and
internal Bell 103 modem sitting back in a corner here.  When I got it,
I was thinking of taking info out of our old CP/M PC board CAD system
and generating drill tapes for the PC house.  The machine is still
sitting in the corner.  We now don't even plot our boards.  We just
take a disk with the Gerber photoplot file and drill file across town
to the PC house.  We give them a disk and back come PC boards.  Pretty
neat!

    It's amazing to see the changes I've seen in the electronics
industry ... but then, I'm getting older ...


Harold Hallikainen              [e-mail]
Hallikainen & Friends, Inc.     [e-mail]
141 Suburban Road, Bldg E4      phone [phone] fax [phone]
San Luis Obispo, CA 93401-7590  telex 4932775 HFI UI

------------------------------

Date: Wed,  3 Mar 93 10:23:44 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Address Correction
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories


> Readers with factual information about schemes like this should
> probably write Frank Carey to discuss it; he invited such email at
> fec.arch2.att.com.  PAT]
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Won't work!

Should be:   [e-mail]


Frank Carey at Bell Labs       908/949-8049


[Moderator's Note: Sorry about that. Frank did include the latter
address in the text of his message. When I went back to reference it
the next day, I grabbed the 'from' address instead.  PAT]

------------------------------

End of TELECOM Digest V13 #151
******************************