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- Path: sparky!uunet!gatech!news.byu.edu!ux1!mica.inel.gov!guinness!opal.idbsu.edu!holmes
- From: holmes@opal.idbsu.edu (Randall Holmes)
- Subject: Re: Proof of God's Existence
- Message-ID: <1992Sep7.061526.21429@guinness.idbsu.edu>
- Sender: usenet@guinness.idbsu.edu (Usenet News mail)
- Nntp-Posting-Host: opal
- Organization: Boise State University Math Dept.
- References: <1992Sep1.215331.89956@vaxc.cc.monash.edu.au> <1992Sep1.183536.8925@cs.rose-hulman.edu> <wx5pbcjl@csv.warwick.ac.uk>
- Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1992 06:15:26 GMT
- Lines: 92
-
- In article <1992Sep4.192528.21285@guinness.idbsu.edu> holmes@opal.idbsu.edu (Randall Holmes) writes:
- >In article <1992Sep1.090011.1@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi> hporopudas@tnclus.tele.nokia.fi writes:
- >>
- >>In article <17ui6kINNsft@matt.ksu.ksu.edu>, bubai@matt.ksu.ksu.edu
- >>(P.Chatterjee) writes:
- >>> I was told by somebody that there is a mathematical proof of God's existence;
- >>> was wondering if somebody could shed some light on the same.
- >>>
- >>> Thanks. Looking forward to the response.
- >>
- >> I think that God's existence is an axiom. He says in the Holy Bible (Second
- >> book of Moses 3:14-15 in Old Testament and also in Johannes 8:28-29 in New
- >> Testament) that He is "Existence Himself".
- >> If someone is arguing that "Existence Himself" does not exist, I think that
- >> at the same time he/she is arguing that he/she himself/herself does not exist.
- >>
- >> Hannu.
- >
- >This reminds me of the student who responded to my (true) assertion
- >that we can prove in ZF that the universe does not exist (i.e., there
- >is no set containing everything) by asking why we were bothering with
- >the course (or anything) if there were a mathematical proof that
- >nothing exists. It is not a prerequisite for the existence of
- >individual objects that the abstract object "existence" exist.
- >--
- >The opinions expressed | --Sincerely,
- >above are not the "official" | M. Randall Holmes
- >opinions of any person | Math. Dept., Boise State Univ.
- >or institution. | holmes@opal.idbsu.edu
-
- I can expand on this.
-
- Proposition: God is the attribute of existence.
-
- Proposition: An attribute can be identified with the class which is
- its extension.
-
- Lemma: God is the universal class (or set).
-
- Proof of Lemma: Apply the two propositions.
-
- Theorem 1: The non-existence of God is consistent with accepted
- principles of mathematical reasoning.
-
- Proof of Theorem 1: The non-existence of the universal set (i.e.,
- God) is a theorem of ZFC (Thomas Jech, _Set Theory_, p. 2).
-
- Theorem 2: The existence of God is consistent with accepted
- principles of mathematical reasoning.
-
- Proof of Theorem 2: The existence of God (the universal set) is an
- axiom of NFU ("New Foundations" with ur-elements) (it is the case
- "{x|x=x} exists" of the stratified comprehension scheme). NFU is
- consistent if ZFC is consistent; this is a result of Jensen (in
- Synthese, vol. 19).
-
- Not only is the existence of God independent of accepted principles of
- mathematical reasoning, but the believer can model the universe of the
- atheist inside his own (bounded Zermelo set theory can be modelled in
- NFU + Infinity; stronger versions of NFU can model ZFC) and the
- atheist can model the universe of the believer (ZFC models NFU and
- strong extensions thereof). Both ZFC and extensions of NFU are
- adequate set theories for all mathematical purposes. It seems that
- the status of God resembles that of the Parallel Postulate or the
- Continuum Hypothesis.
-
- Since the working set theory of most mathematicians is ZFC or none at
- all, we must conclude that most mathematicians are atheists or
- agnostics in their official capacity.
-
- I hope that this is enlightening.
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- --
- The opinions expressed | --Sincerely,
- above are not the "official" | M. Randall Holmes
- opinions of any person | Math. Dept., Boise State Univ.
- or institution. | holmes@opal.idbsu.edu
-