home *** CD-ROM | disk | FTP | other *** search
- Newsgroups: alt.fan.tolkien
- Path: sparky!uunet!stanford.edu!nntp.Stanford.EDU!jchokey
- From: jchokey@leland.Stanford.EDU (James Alexander Chokey)
- Subject: Re: Language Origins
- Message-ID: <1993Jan24.171733.13719@leland.Stanford.EDU>
- Sender: news@leland.Stanford.EDU (Mr News)
- Organization: DSG, Stanford University, CA 94305, USA
- References: <C1599o.Hos@sci.kun.nl> <1993Jan21.181326.23081@b11.b11.ingr.com> <cos.727820671@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu>
- Date: Sun, 24 Jan 93 17:17:33 GMT
- Lines: 33
-
- In article <cos.727820671@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu> cos@chaos.cs.brandeis.edu (Ofer Inbar) writes:
- >craig@b11.b11.ingr.com (Craig Presson) writes:
- >>OTOH, the few words of the speech of the Rohirrim in LOTR that are not
- >>translated into the Westron are perfectly good Anglo-Saxon (OTTOMH:
- >>"_Westhu Theoden hal_!" (Hale be thou, Theoden ~ Hail, Theoden)). The
- >>proper names of course are not attested AS names, but have a distinct
- >>AS flavor.
- >
- >I recall reading Tolkien's explanation somewhere that the Anglo-Saxon
- >was *not* the actual language of Rohan, but rather a translation of
- >it. In the same way, Westron is not actually English, but is
- >translated into English in the books so that we can understand them.
- >Tolkien decided that since the relationship between Westron and the
- >language of Rohan in their world was equivalent to the relationship
- >between English and Anglo-Saxon in ours (one having developed partly
- >from the other), since he translated Westron to English, he would
- >translate Rohan to Anglo-Saxon for us readers.
- >
-
- Yes, that was Tolkien's explanation for his use of Anglo-Saxon.
- As I've said before, however, it strikes me as a rather "side-stepping"
- explanation, considering how much like the Anglo-Saxons (as described in
- literature in any case) the Rohirrim actually are. The same might be said
- about the various modern English dialects Tolkien uses for "translations"
- of Westron elsewhere. Is it mere convenience of translation that Tolkien
- has the hobbits, who in many ways are a romanticized vision of the English
- yeomanry, speak a 19th century rural dialect, or might there not be something
- more to it? Considering, furthermore, that Tolkien never actually "invented"
- a unique language for the Rohirrim or of Westron in the same way that he
- invented his Elvish languages, I think we have to take this comment about
- "translation" with a serious grain of salt.
-
- -- Jim C. <jchokey@leland.stanford.edu>
-