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- Newsgroups: sci.space
- Path: sparky!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!swrinde!emory!rsiatl!ke4zv!gary
- From: gary@ke4zv.uucp (Gary Coffman)
- Subject: Re: Let's be more specific (was: Stupid Shut Cost arguements)
- Message-ID: <1993Jan12.171525.7437@ke4zv.uucp>
- Reply-To: gary@ke4zv.UUCP (Gary Coffman)
- Organization: Destructive Testing Systems
- References: <1993Jan9.030346.9714@ptdcs2.intel.com> <ewright.726733131@convex.convex.com> <1993Jan11.154812.235@ke4zv.uucp> <ewright.726776389@convex.convex.com>
- Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 17:15:25 GMT
- Lines: 67
-
- In article <ewright.726776389@convex.convex.com> ewright@convex.com (Edward V. Wright) writes:
- >In <1993Jan11.154812.235@ke4zv.uucp> gary@ke4zv.uucp (Gary Coffman) writes:
- >
- >>A warhead re-entry vehicle is not a good model for a lander. A warhead
- >>doesn't attempt to do atmospheric braking. It's shaped like a long narrow
- >>cone, or hypersonic bullet.... A lander presents a blunt surface to the
- >>atmosphere and tries to shed as much velocity as possible by atmospheric
- >>braking.
- >
- >Ah, which lander are you talking about. The Delta Clipper *is* shaped
- >like a bullet. It does not present its blunt surface (base) on entry.
- >It makes a nose-first, high-angle-of-attack entry modelled after an
- >ICBM-warhead trajectory. This was chosen because of the large amount
- >of data available from computer modelling of missile warheads.
- >
- >It seems rather presumptuous to claim you know more than McDonnell
- >Douglas engineers working on the project about what is and isn't
- >possible when you are uninformed on such basic facts as this.
-
- I don't have the direct pipeline into MacDD that Allen seems to have,
- but from what little description he's posted, I don't see anything
- about Delta Clipper retaining a 30 km/sec velocity to near ground
- level. Nor would I consider a 1,279,000 pound (104,100 pound dry),
- 40 foot in diameter, 127 foot tall vehicle "a bullet". Certainly not
- when compared to a 8 inch in major diameter, 4 foot long, 80 pound
- nuclear re-entry vehicle.
-
- From the descriptions I've seen posted, DC-Y is supposed to enter
- nose first, aerobrake down to under 1 km/sec, then turnover and
- descend on it's rocket exhaust. From Alan's latest post, the vehicle
- is supposed to be subject to only 95 psf Q at turnover. If that's a
- faulty description, please post the actual flight profile.
-
-
- >>Shuttle designers originally
- >>considered a titanium skin for the Orbiter, but even a metal as refractory
- >>as titanium wasn't up to the job
- >
- >Yet Another Historical Error. Refractory metals were up to the
- >job until NASA doubled the size of the Shuttle orbiter to meet
- >military payload demands. (And some engineers at Rockwell still
- >felt that refractory metals were viable, given sufficient ingenuity.
- >Langley, and possibly other NASA centers have since come up with
- >refractory metals which they believe can do the job. Some of these
- >were considered for use on the fifth orbiter.)
-
- Even the SR71 uses fuel to help cool it's titanium skin, and it travels
- more than four times slower than a re-entry vehicle. The only practical
- metal more refractory than titanium is tungsten, and no one would seriously
- consider a tungsten skinned vehicle. It would weigh too much, not to mention
- the fabrication difficulties or the cost. Using titanium instead of aluminum
- to *back up* a lighter heat shield is certainly practical, but with the
- extremely good insulating qualities of available ceramic refractories, it
- isn't necessary. An active cooling system could negate the need for a ceramic
- shield, but would likely weigh more and be prone to breakdown. A heat shield
- has to do more than not melt, it has to protect the internals of the vehicle
- from the extremely high heat loads. All metals are good heat conductors, so
- they make poor heat *shields*. That's why *insulating* ceramic refractories
- are a preferred solution. Honeycomb composite structures are another good
- solution, but remain very expensive to fabricate.
-
- Gary
- --
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