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- From: sasghm@theseus.unx.sas.com (Gary Merrill)
- Subject: Re: Schools, philosophy of science, epistemology
- Originator: sasghm@theseus.unx.sas.com
- Sender: news@unx.sas.com (Noter of Newsworthy Events)
- Message-ID: <C0p2qy.Fv3@unx.sas.com>
- Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 14:54:34 GMT
- References: <gj169883.726421462@cunews> <C0M726.Jo7@umassd.edu> <1993Jan10.203936.607@news.wesleyan.edu>
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- In article <1993Jan10.203936.607@news.wesleyan.edu>, RGINZBERG@eagle.wesleyan.edu (Ruth Ginzberg) writes:
- |> In <1993Jan10.234752.4562@news.eng.convex.com> cash@convex.com writes:
- |> > Ah, but do you ask them why they want to get a graduate degree in
- |> > philosophy? I would caution all and sundry that your motives had best not
- |> > include making a living as a philosopher.
- |>
- |> Well, even if I forget to give that particular speech, the APA won't. It still
- |> asks graduate departments to send to all applicants that dreary & discouraging
- |> form letter that says, roughly, "You think you're gonna get a JOB in
- |> philosophy? HA Ha ha hahahahahahahahahahaha......" So if a student applies to
- |> 10 schools, 10 copies of that letter show up. Blah! I'm surprised ANYONE ever
- |> decides to go to grad school in philosophy.
-
- This has bothered me for some years. What bothers me is that the explicit
- impression the APA has been giving (for almost 20 years now?) is that
- the the only reason for pursuing a graduate degree in philosophy is to
- get a job as an academic philosopher. I know that at the meetings sessions
- on "non-academic employment" are held, but from what I have seen these are
- not done by people with the sort of experience that would be really helpful.
- Further, this is a post hoc approach -- now that you *have* your degree and
- can't get the job you want, here are some desperate alternatives. Since I
- agree with Peter concerning the value of such training in a *wide* variety of
- fields, this approach seems to do a disservice. Sure, it's hard to get certain
- jobs if you walk into an interview waving your philosophy Ph.D. In fact, my
- wife ultimately ended up *concealing* her Ph.D. in order to get her first job
- in technical writing. Bell Labs' personnel department was so puzzled by my
- background and experience that I never did get an interview with them, though
- they ended up paying much more for me as a consultant through a consulting
- firm that *would* take a chance on me.
-
- I really think that the APA should do a better job in career counseling and
- strategy and tactics of job finding and acquisition. However, since this is
- primarily an organization of academics and for academics, I can see the
- difficulties.
-
- |> For every philosophy Ph.D. who is
- |> > successful at doing this (like our very own Dr. Ruth), there are dozens who
- |> > must resign themselves to lesser lives, toiling among the masses (such as
- |> > your humble correspondent).
-
- Here is where Peter (and to some degree my wife) and I differ. I do not regard
- this as a "lesser life". After a number of years in the university I made the
- change with all due consideration and as a matter of choice. If a major university
- were to *beg* me to take a position on the faculty, I would decline. (Well,
- I suppose I can imagine circumstances under which I would take such a position,
- but I can't imagine any university meeting my conditions.) Of course, having
- less than year ago left a position of management, I feel the same way about
- management. (Now *there* is a lesser life!)
-
- |> Well, Peter, let me assure you that those of you living such "lesser lives,
- |> toiling among the masses" probably have a helluva easier time paying off your
- |> student loans. :-)
-
- You bet. There was a time when we had two working Ph.D.'s in the house and
- we had to get cash advances on the VISA card at the end of the month to feed
- the kids. I think things have improved a *bit*.
-
- |> Just for comparison on that point, the esteemed institution at which I earn my
- |> rent payments pays me (mid-range assistant prof) $8000/year less than I would
- |> earn if I were an elementary school teacher in this state. Or rather, that's
- |> how much it WOULD be paying me if I weren't on only 3/4 salary this year (a
- |> move VERY strongly recommended by my dept chair in order to "buy myself some
- |> writing time" in order to bolster my publications so that I don't "perish" when
- |> my publish-or-perish day o' reckoning arrives). %^O
-
- Here is a recommendation for some (not necessarily for Ruth). If what you like
- is the *teaching*, there are alternatives to colleges and universities. Public
- schools aren't such a great way to go (for the most part, though there are exceptions).
- But private high schools usually appreciate Ph.D.'s. My younger son's history
- teacher, for example, has a Ph.D. in philosophy from DePaul and has been teaching
- history and related courses in private schools for about ten years. He certainly
- is among the very best of the teachers at an excellent school. Last year my
- elder son had quite a good course in "Radical and Revolutionary Thought" taught
- by another member of the history department (not a philospher, but a good critical
- thinker). So there *are* opportunities to teach genuine philosophy outside the
- university. If teaching is what you like, and if you can look at this as a
- positive career move rather than as settling for second best, it is a good way
- to go. (You may have to coach track or field hockey or something, but at least
- the school my kids go to doesn't have cheerleaders -- *everybody* plays.)
-
-
-
-
-
-
- --
- Gary H. Merrill [Principal Systems Developer, C Compiler Development]
- SAS Institute Inc. / SAS Campus Dr. / Cary, NC 27513 / (919) 677-8000
- sasghm@theseus.unx.sas.com ... !mcnc!sas!sasghm
-