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- From: rks@cscns.com (Dancing With synergy)
- Subject: Re: Donahue: Options for Kids
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- References: <1993Jan9.005313.4854@porthos.cc.bellcore.com>
- Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 08:16:36 GMT
- Lines: 99
-
- gray,david l (smile1@dancer.cc.bellcore.com) wrote:
-
- (deletia regarding religious beliefs...)
-
- : is how he made things. I strongly disagree with those who would say I support
- : parents owning their child and that they can do anything they want because
- : they kind of own them. I do not feel that men own their wives either.
-
- I understand that you have those religious beliefs and perhaps use a
- Biblical premise for your statements. And in an ideal universe, perhaps
- that philosophy would work. If it works for you and you are not harming
- any others -- then live it and go in peace.
-
- My argument comes in when you make blaket statements about *the way things
- are* like your religion has a cornerstone on the *way things are*. It is
- the way things are for *you*. Personally, I find the idea that I should
- submit to a man repugnant. I believe that we are all born with divine
- power within us. The problem with abusive parents is that they try to
- *steal* that divinity.
-
- One of the problems with fundamentalism is that there is no respect for
- individualism. There is no respect for the needs, the path or the
- wants of an individual. It is a structured, organized way of looking
- at the world with little area for the various shades of grey that make
- up the complex universe we live in.
-
- Religiosity seeks to control. It flies in the face of intellect,
- preferring that its adherents remain ignorant.
-
- Spirituality is another issue entirely.
-
-
- : So don't bother saying so because I don't feel that way. But in
- : the order of things, parents and adults are responsible for children.
-
- Yes. Response-able. And if the parent is not being responsible then
- children need a recourse. And it is certainly not within the system which
- has failed children for years and years. It gave them no power over
- their own lives.
-
-
- : I find that society has been trying to settle out social ills
- : by reversing everything and it is not working well. Men and women are
- : responsibile for the welfare of our children. If they don't do their job,,
- : we don't ask the 10 year old what to do. We, as adults, with values step in
-
- It depends entirely on the 10-year-old. Some are better able to take
- care of themselves than others. I think the one thing that is certain
- is that children don't like change. They are not going to throw their
- lives into upheaval for no reason.
-
- : and do something!!! I would never trust the welfare of a child to a lawyer.
- : Never!!! Their only goal is to take a case and win.
-
- Painting all lawyers with the same brush is no different than painting
- all children with the same brush. Or all races or all religions. There
- are lawyers who *are* concerned with justice.
-
-
- : I can understand if you have been abused that you will not feel this way.
- : You will want to see the child with their own choices. You may be right
- : to feel that way because society did not step in for you when you needed
- : them. I just feel real strong about society stepping up to their
-
- I didn't expect *society* to step in for me. I learned at a very young age
- that I had to take care of myself. Abused children have a different
- way of looking at the world -- and if you haven't been there -- it is
- not wise to make judgements. The real issue is one of protection on
- *all* levels.
-
- The best way to protect children is to teach them that they *do* have
- power in their lives -- within their range of ability. Feeding thwem
- full of philosophy will not do it. Especially a philosophy that
- states that we are the worms of the earth.
-
- I don't have any investment in debating you about your religious
- beliefs or the validity of them. It obviously works for you and
- makes you happy. I honor that. BUT -- just because it works for
- you doesn't mean that it will work for me or society at large. We
- all have our own mythologies. My concern is that *all* people have
- freedom (balanced with responsibility) and that *all* people have
- a sense of worth. I am concerned about the attitude toward children
- in general. They are *people* not pawns.
-
- : responsibility. Protect our children now and in the future should not
- : be shuffled off onto our children. They have enough to worry about without
- : trying to decide if they need a divorce or need to hang in..
-
- And is protection the same as powerlessness? Believe me, survival is
- not a difficult decision to make and I hardly think that kids need
- to be 'protected' from their right to have a healthy, nurturing
- environment in which to grow up.
-
- namaste
-
- //gisle
-
-
-
-