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- Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
- Path: sparky!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!hemi!jerry
- From: jerry@msi.com (Jerry Shekhel)
- Subject: Re: Future Amiga chipsets
- References: <1992Dec22.173828.5167@oracle.us.oracle.com>
- Sender: nobody@ctr.columbia.edu
- Organization: Molecular Simulations, Inc.
- Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 20:08:16 GMT
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- Message-ID: <1992Dec22.200816.25990@sol.ctr.columbia.edu>
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-
- David Navas (dnavas@oracle.uucp) wrote:
- :
- : Informative discussion you're having here, mind if I join?
- :
-
- Of course not. Go right ahead!
-
- :
- : Well, personally, I would define crippled as any machine whose principle
- : communication's bus cannot transfer memory at anything even approaching a
- : rough approximation of processor speed.
- :
-
- Does anyone else define it that way? Face it, your definition is totally
- arbitrary.
-
- :
- : You've got these great 66Mhz,
- : 32 bit processors that are running through an 8Mhz 16bit bus. If you can't
- : see how that might affect you, you're living in some other universe.
- :
-
- Really? Well, in *my* universe the average hard drive isn't capable of
- more than, say, 1.5-2MB/sec, which ISA can easily deal with, with plenty of
- room to spare. What about your universe?
-
- :
- : "implies that it has difficulty performing everyday tasks"
- :
- : Think about this for a minute. How are you defining "everyday tasks"?
- :
-
- I define "everyday tasks" for an expansion bus as "interfacing with normal
- peripherals found in most personal computers". Is that an unfair definition?
- What good is a 550 GB/s bus if all your peripherals being cranked at once
- don't add up to 5MB/s?
-
- :
- : Now it is true that the PC is getting important additions in the way of
- : LocalBus. However, if processor-speed access continues to be limited to just
- : memory and video, you've already limited the extent of your horizons,
- : confining yourself to a box that is bigger than the one you were in before,
- : but no less constraining, and no less limited to the (inaccurately ascribed,
- : at this time) banal mediocrity for which PCs are notorious.
- :
-
- Where are you getting your information? LocalBus supports any type of
- peripheral, not just video. Look at a Gateway ad; most of their PC's now
- ship with LocalBus disk controllers. Besides, the fact that a bunch of
- frustrated Amiga fanatics consider PC's "banally mediocre" has no bearing
- on reality. Your attempt to pass it off as common knowledge is typical as
- well as laughable.
-
- :
- : Had you folks existed in a vacuum (sp?), you wouldn't have the hi-res graphics
- : cards you have now, as "everyday tasks don't require it." You wouldn't have
- : sound cards either "who needs those?" What you probably WOULD have is a
- : 128Mhz Pentium computer with a version of Word Perfect that required two
- : or three extra function keys and ALT-modifiers that no one has created a
- : keyboard for yet.
- :
-
- Your point, please?
-
- :
- : What makes me sick about -some- of the arguments PC folks (that includes
- : Amiga folk!) put forward is that they DEFINE what computers can do for them
- : in the future by what they're doing for them RIGHT NOW. It's all very well
- : to say that "I bought a PC because I wanted to be able to afford 1024x768,"
- : or "I bought an Amiga because it had the best animation software I could
- : find." But proselytizing (sp?) a particular computer because it somehow
- : achieves some kind of mediocre standard during "everyday chores" and then,
- : even worse, proclaiming how cheap these wizz-bang 88Mhz, clock-doubled,
- : FM stations (aka PCs) are is the most incredibly NAIVE thing to say. How
- : can you possibly advocate anything as "a giant leap forward in processing
- : technology" when all it achieves is (to paraphrase) adequacy in day-to-day
- : tasks.
- :
-
- Nice speech, but totally pointless. Technology doesn't exist for technology's
- sake -- it has to be useful for human beings, *today*. I have to have a
- computer *today*, and *today* there aren't any peripherals which would
- seriously tax the ISA bus. Why should I spend extra for a fast bus and
- get *nothing*, when I could spend the money on a 24-bit graphics card and
- get *something*?
-
- :
- : That's not revolutionary.
- : It's not even EVolutionary.
- : It's sick, it's not what the computer revolution is about, please leave
- : before you do us any MORE harm.
- :
-
- Thanks for the advice :-P Come on, face it. Computers are tools. When I'm
- in the market for a drill or a screwdriver, I'll take the one which is the
- most capable of helping me with the tasks I need to accomplish, even if
- there's another one whose specs look more macho on paper.
-
- :
- : And that's as much directed to Amiga users who think that the A600 is some
- : kind of benchmark computer that everything else should size up to as PC
- : users who think that ISA "isn't so bad."
- :
-
- I ask you again. What can't my ISA PC do directly because of ISA bus
- limitations? Look, I'll even help you by mentioning one thing: DMA to
- memory above 16MB can't happen due to the ISA's 24 address lines, but then
- again, it's invisible at the end-user level. Is there anything else?
-
- :
- : Having said all of that, you are right about one thing -- it does amount
- : to what you want to use your machine for. Frankly, the PC is mostly just
- : a status symbol.
- :
-
- Status symbol? A computer? Ha! Not within my group of friends, unless
- you're talking about "nerd status" or something such.
-
- :
- : Let's face it, we don't write 20 letters a day, we don't
- : do daily mailings to 100s of relatives, most of use don't balance our
- : checkbooks with or without a computer, and as far as requiring a database,
- : I'd bet more families have encyclopedias.
- :
-
- Are you the same person who complained a few paragraphs before about
- people who base their computer purchasing decisions on what they can
- do with computers RIGHT NOW? Think about it, and when you make up your
- mind, let's resume this discussion.
-
- :
- : David C. Navas
- :
- --
- +-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+
- | JERRY J. SHEKHEL | Molecular Simulations Inc. | Time just fades the pages |
- | Drummers do it... | Burlington, MA USA | in my book of memories. |
- | ... In rhythm! | jerry@msi.com | -- Guns N' Roses |
- +-------------------+----------------------------+---------------------------+
-