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- Newsgroups: sci.engr.mech
- Path: sparky!uunet!news.uiowa.edu!news
- From: haferman@icaen.uiowa.edu (Jeff Haferman)
- Subject: Re: Warm water freezes first. why?
- Sender: news@news.uiowa.edu (News)
- Message-ID: <1992Dec18.194120.6520@news.uiowa.edu>
- Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1992 19:41:20 GMT
- Nntp-Posting-Host: t_ecn12.icaen.uiowa.edu
- Organization: University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA, USA
- Lines: 53
-
- From article <1992Dec18.143813.16785@aio.jsc.nasa.gov>, by mike@drseus.jsc.nasa.gov (Mike Ross):
-
- >
- > I'm the original poster who asked this question. This is the biggest
- > thread I've ever generated. A thoroughly interesting engineering
- > discussion by a lot of learned individuals regarding my question!
- >
- > It appears the answer is as many people have pointed out, that the
- > evaporation rate causes there to be less water when the hot tray
- > reaches the temperature that the cold tray started out from, and so
- > less energy actually needed to be removed to freeze. I had been told
- > that the phenomenon could be explained via differential equations,
- > so the evaporation rate fits that.
- >
- > Of course, I'm still drawing my conclusions from the net.discussion,
- > I've not checked that explanation, it just seems the most plausible.
- > The rationale that the warm water makes better contact with the metal
- > tray doesn't wash, because the cold water would also melt the ice on the
- > grill and get good contact.
- >
-
- The evaporation rate doesn't have anything to do with it. Try
- putting saran wrap tightly over both trays. The tray with the hot
- water still freezes much more quickly.
-
- Sure, this can all be shown using some mathematics. Just write
- an energy balance equating the rate of heat loss at the surface of
- an ice cube with the rate of change of internal energy of an ice cube,
- vis a vis (assuming the lumped capacitance method, see any heat transfer
- text):
-
- -h * A * (T - Tsur) = rho * cp * V * dT/dt
-
- This equation can be integrated to give
-
- |Tx
- ln (T/Tsur - 1)| = h * A * (tf - to) / (rho * cp * V)
- |Tsur
-
- where Tx is either Th (T-hot) or Tc (T-cold).
-
- Continuing the evaluation, it can be shown that the time ratio is
- inversely proportional to the temperature ratio.
-
- Is the above analysis valid? Notice that it is independent of material,
- and initial and final temperatures.
-
-
-
- Jeff Haferman internet: haferman@icaen.uiowa.edu
- Department of Mechanical Engineering DoD 0186 BMWMOA 44469 AMA 460140
- The University of Iowa
- Iowa City, IA 52242 '76 R90S
-