NetNews Usenet Archive 1992 #30/NN_1992_30.iso/spool/comp/sys/ibm/pc/hardware/32924

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From: [e-mail] (GRUBB)
Subject: Mac & IBM Info-Version 0.90
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Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 13:24:01 GMT
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Mac & IBM Info-Version 0.90

Thank you all for your information.
The reason for this general data sheet is that people in both camps are not
clear or accurate about what they are saying about their machines.
This was part of the reason the Mac vs. IBM, Mac bigots, and similar threads
degenerated into a mess.  To help keep this organized please provide, if
possible, article citations for the information provided or corrected.
Note: this is a data sheet so let's keep the opinions to a minimum.  Also do
not just say it is incomplete, but give me the info to make it complete.

When completed, this data sheet will, I hope, enable us to make
convincing and intelligent comparisons between Mac and IBM.  Thank you.
Due to the fragmentation of the IBM info, I have desided to post this to the
IBM groups to get more IBM info.

Special thanks to [e-mail] (Chihuahua Charlie), bell-
[e-mail] (Peter Bell), [e-mail] (Carl B Jabido),
[e-mail] (Faisal Nameer Jawdat), [e-mail]
(Julian Harris), [e-mail] (Matt Healy), [e-mail]
(Nan Zou), pwagner%us.oracle.com, [e-mail], [e-mail]
(Wolfgang Strobl), [e-mail], and [e-mail] for
providing informational corrections to this list.

The CPU

Note: I am only showing the Motorola & Intel CPUs used in the Mac and
the main IBM machines. This is why, for example, the Motorola
68008 and 68010 are not listed: Apple never used these chips in the Mac.

IBM     ALU  Registers  External  External  Total  Features/
CPU                      bus      address           Notes

 8088   16      16        8         20       52  {A dead CPU}
 8086   16      16       16         20       60  {Ditto}
80286   16      16       16         24       72   Protected Mode & segmenting
80386   32      32       32         32      128   MMU & 32-bit Protected Mode
80486   32      32       32         32      128   80386 & FPU
586(P5) 64      64       32        128      288   RISC-like features, 386-
                                                  emulator, superscalar

386sx   386 chip with 32 bit internal architecture, & 16 bit external.
386slc  low power version of the 386 with a chip cash. Used mainly
        in laptops.
486sx   486 with no built in FPU.
486dx2  same as 486 but the internal clock rate of the chip is
      doubled in comparison to the clock rate of the rest of
      the machine. (ex. a machine with a 50 Mhz dx2 has a
      chip that runs at 50 MHz, the rest of the machine runs
      at 25 MHz

80586(P5): Intel claims a performance of 100+ MIPS. It is to be out in the
first quarter of 1993 [InfoWorld July 27, 92 & Vaporware 9/92].{We need to see
this.}
PowerPC: The chip is out and rumor has it that IBM may build its PowerPC 601
EARLY 1993 (InfoWorld June 8 and 15, 92; MacWeek July 13, 92) It is also
rumored that the 601  machine will be four times as fast as a 50 MHz 486dx
running Windows.{could give P5 a run for the money with the five OSs that
could run on this: DOS, Windows 3.x, OS/2, Mac OS, & UNIX (AU/X 4.0) and its
earlier release date.}

MAC     ALU  Registers  External  External  Total  Features/
CPU                      bus      address           Notes

68000   16      32       16         24        88 {Cheap CPU use, dieing}
68020   32      32       32         32       128 {no longer used}
68030   32      32       32         32       128     MMU
68040LC 32      32       32         32       128  MMU & faster
68040   32      32       32         32       128  MMU & FPU
68050    development discontinued in favor of 68060
68060: Anyone have the data for this?
PowerPC: Chip is out and rumor is that the 601 machine will be three times as
fast as a Mac Quadra. Apple PowerPC 601 will be about a year latter the IBM's.
Rumor is that Apple is planning to provide info to third party developers to
use this as an accelerator for present Nubus Macs [InfoWorld August 3 and
Vaporware 9/92]

68040LC:  a 68040 without a working FPU, a varient of this to be used in the
Centris 610 due out on Feb. 15 (MacWeek 11/02/92).  Unclear as if a 68040LC
will be used or Motorola will go the 468sx trek. (a 'failed' chip as opposed
to a purposely designed one.)

in comparing the CPUs the list looks like this:

8088/8086 ~ 68000 {16-bit vs 16/24/32-bit chip (data path/address
lines/data and address registers.  The ALU is what determines the bit
classification chip so the 68000 is 16-bit despite the higher bits
of the External Address(24) and the Registers(32)}{Side note: aside
from use as a cheap CPU in the Classic and the lower end notebooks the
68000 is basicly a dead CPU at Apple due to its poor performance compared
to the 68030 under System 7.0.dot. 8088/8086 bought the farm around 1989 and
it looks like the 68000 goes out as a CPU in February 1993.}

286        ~ 68020 {This is the poorest comparison since the hardware
segmenting in the 286 pulls it past the 68020 and to the 68030 class while the
16-bit of the 286 pulls it nearer the 68000. OS/2 1.0 though 1.3 all use the
protected mode of the hardware segmenting in the 286,  as does Windows 3.X.  I
think that this makes the 68020 fit better even though the 286 is 16-bit and
the 68020 32-bit. Side Note: the 68020 bit it as a CPU with the end of the
LC.}

386       ~ 68030 {The MMUs, 32-bit nature of these chips and
their protected memory puts them roughly together.  AU/X 3.0 is
at present the only Mac OS to use the protected memory feature of
the 68030.}

486sx   ~ 68040LC {same as 486 and 68040 but without the FPU, used as
a low cost solution for people who do not need the FPU.}

486       ~ 68040 {two 32-bit microprocessors with built-in FPU, MMU, 8K
internal cache.  The cache is implemented as two 4K caches in the 68040
and one in the 486.  This is as far as that goes.}

P5(586)   ~ 68060 {Both are planned to be superscalar but may flounder
against the earlier released PowerPC chip.  Too early to compare these.}
[PC Week Sept 7 & 14 on 68060]

PowerPC   = PowerPC {This is the only CPU to be used by both IBM and
Apple and is planned to run DOS, Windows 3.x, OS/2 and Mac OS on top of the
Taligent OS. {Prototype is PowerOpen (AU/X 4.0)}

Hardware
Color Support
Mac:  Using 32-bit color QuickDraw, which is in ROM, all present Macs except
the Classic and Powerbook 100 support 24(32)-bit color. Older machines that
supported color (SE/30, II, IIX, and IIcx) used a software patch for the ROM
to use 32 bit color. (MacUser special 1993: 28-29)  To keep costs down and
speed up most Macs display only 8-bits at a time, with some expandsion needed
to display 24(32)-bit color. 32-bit color QuickDraw results in a transparent
capability to display 1, 2, 4, 8, and 32-bit images on 1, 2, 4, 8, and 32-bit
displays requardless of monitor resolution {63 dpi (12" color) to 80 dpi (full
page grey)}.  This consistent interface also allows for the use of multiple
monitors in a -plug and play- system on machines with more than one Nubus
slot.

IBM:  I need more information on this. According to Matt Healy, IBM never
bothered to provide a standard mechanism for software to determine what
display mode is actually present. As a result some modes are very hard to
detect, and some of the "clone" graphics cards are only partly IBM-compatible.
According to Faisal Nameer Jawdat graphics depend on the card that came with
the machine bought and accelarated graphics are fairly inexpensive.
{Is this as messy as it looks?}
monitor types:
Monographics/Hercules Monochrome:  Text only/Text & Graphics
{due to the age of these I am thinking of droping them from the list.}
MDA: original character-mapped video mode, no graphics, 80x25 text.
CGA: 320x200 4 colors or 640x200 b/w, 16 color pallette, bad for the eyes.
EGA: 640x350 16 colors from 64 color pallette (and some lower res);
     some versions could run at 256 colors, bearable on the eyes.
VGA: 320x200 and 640x480 at 256 colors, 640x480 at 16 colors, and some others,
     these two are the most commonly used.  All modes have a 256K color
     pallette, from a 18-bit CLUT (Color LookUp Table).  Monitors use
     analog input, incompatible with TTL signals from EGA/CGA etc.
MCGA: {What is this?}
SVGA: At first no standardization which resulted in chaos, each manufacturer
      used their own implementation scheme,  either 512K (two years
      ago) or 1M (today), resolution of 800x600 and 1024x768 at 16 and 256
      colors are common, newer ones (since last year) have the Sierra HiColor
      RAMDAC, giving 15-bit 32,768 colors at 800x600, some of the very
      newer ones (23 month ago) can do 24 bits per pixel (usually at 640x480).
      {a standard called VESA was established latter and is used in the newer
      units} Speedwise, too much variation, some very slow (Western Digital
      Paradise based, for example), some very fast (S3 86C911 based, for
      example), some are so-so(like Tseng ET4000, a very popular
      chipset).  Some limiting factors: 8.33 MHz ISA bus, AT
      architecture where the CPU looks at the card through a 64K
      "window", etc. {There is  for the new units.}
Other standards not classified as SVGA:
8514/a: IBM's own standard, graphics accelerator with graphics functions
        like linedraw, polygon fill, etc. in hardware.  Uses interlacing.
        Some clone implementations from ATI are the fastest video available
        today, though some models do not have interlacing.
XGA: newer and faster than 8514/a, only available for MCA bus-based
     PS/2s, clones are coming out soon.  Max resolution at 1024x768x8b,
     same as 8514/a, also some 16 bpp mode.
TMS34010/34020: high end graphics co-processors, usually >$1000, some
                do 24-bit, speeds up vector-oriented graphics like CAD.

Network (Includes printing)
Mac:  Built in AppleTalk functionality (Includes LocalTalk).  For most present
machines Ethernet requires a card (PDS or Nubus) and the hardware support for
each machine runs about $250-$300.
Printing requires connection of the printer and the printer being selected in
the chooser.  Changing printers is by selecting a different name in the
chooser.

IBM:
Network Harware: Ethernet or TokenRing  (Appletalk not widely used on PCs, but
is avalable.)
Network Software: Novell Netware, Banyan Vines, DECNet, Windows/Work Groups
Each of the MS-DOS networking schemes are, in general, totally incompatible
with the others. Once you have chosen one, you are pretty much locked-in to
that product line from then on.  Novell Netware is the biggest, especially in
corporate environments where it controls something like 80 percent of the
market.  In general, Netware is more powerful and offers better
control/management/security than AppleTalk, but it's designed around a
mainframe type set-up.
Printing {Looks like a mess. Need more info}
If it's a single user, then you plug the printer into the parallel port, and
don't worry about it. {Tweeking may be needed with poorly written software.}
Network Printing is not controlled by the system; it is mostly implemented by
the actual program, therefor performance varies from one software program to
the next; Windows 3.x can do a good job of showing "jobs" in the print queue,
but it always lists printers as "active"... even if they are not.
This becomes a problem if there are several incompatible printers on the same
net, because there's no way for software to reliably determine which printer
is active right now. According to Jawdat "under DOS each piece of software
needs its own printer drivers, which have been fairly standardized." {Could
somebody explain how this is standardized and why MicroSoft has not written
its own standard print drivers to save HD space? I am confused.}

Expansion
Mac:  All Macs since the Plus have a SCSI interface and SIMM memory expansion.
PDS: Avalible in the SE and all present Modular Macs.
NuBus: Supported in all Modular Macs except the LC, LCII, and Performa 400.
The SE/30 could be adapted to use this as well.
CPU expansion is handled either through the PDS or the NuBus.

IBM:  {need more info}
HD Interfaces:
MFM (?), RLL (Run Length Limited): hard drive only interfaces, and only used
    in smaller (2 60mb) hard drives.
IDE (Integrated Drive Electronics): currently the most common standard, and is
    used for medium sized drives. Can have more than one hard drive
ESDI (Enhanced Storage Device Interface): generally considerred
    better than SCSI in many ways but not common enough for practical
    consideration. Can have more than one hard drive
SCSI:  not too wide spread yet, generally not bundled with
      systems, except as add-on. Can support up to 7 devices per SCSI
      controller.  Novell servers and the fastest disks use this.
      One problem:  here's no exact specifications for the
      controller so incompatibilities result.
BUS interfaces {More info please, this is Greek to me.}

ISA:  dominant factor, but it's showing its age.  Uses edge-triggered
      interrupts, can't share them, hence comes the IRQ conflict.
      Limited busmastering capabilities. 8 and 16 bit... 8 bit devices are
      rarely used any more, any 16 bit slot can accept a 8 bit card.
      Most ISA motherboard designs these days have memory on a 32 bit path
      direct to the processor.

MCA: IBM's 32-bit bus; anything can talk to anything, as fast as the two
components involved can handle it. Never took off because it was incompatible
with ISA.
EISA: microchannel and local bus are both 32 bit and run at 8Mhz, local bus
runs at CPU speed. Compatible with ISA cards.

PDS(Local Bus):  one standard exists, VESA Local Bus, or simply VL-bus,
starting to appear on high-end systems, high speed (CPU clock rate, 25/33/50
MHz), hugh bandwidth (~130 MB/sec), makes it ideal for video I/O (and disk
I/O).

Memory expansion is through parity-checked SIMMs, same as special Mac IIcis.
{Parity SIMMs are more expensive then 'normal' SIMMs and their importance is
at present questionable with error correction in OS and hardware avalible.}
Side Note: to find the number of SIMMS that a full x-bit chip requires to run
at full speed, divide x by 8.  So 16 bit requires two SIMMS, 32-bit requires
four, and 64-bit requires eight SIMMS. One way to get around this is to halve
the data path, but this can half the speed of the machine so its a trade off.
{LC II uses a 32-bit chip but a 16 bit data path so only 2 as opposed to 4
SIMMS are required; the 386sx is the IBM equivalent.}


OSes {assumes full installation [print drivers, fonts, Multifinder, etc.]
and multiple application use.}

Mac
6.0.7: Requires 2 MB and HD floppy and features a GUI, sudo-multitasking
       (MultiFinder), standard program interface, & standard stereo sound
       support (snd). Has a 8MB RAM barrier and is a 24-bit OS.
       Some third party products allow 14MB of Virtual Memory as long as real
       RAM is below 8MB.
6.0.8: 6.0.7 with 7.0.0 print drivers
6.0.8L:  System 6 for new Macs that require System 7.
7.0.1: Base requirements 2MB, 40MB Hard Drive, and a 68000; to run well it
       requires 4 MB, a 80 MB Hard Drive, and a 68030. It has 6.0.7 features
       and AIC (between computers), built in network support, Virtual Memory
       in machines with MMU{1.6 times real RAM for least noticeable speed
       degradation on a IIsi}, & drag and drop. Can access up to 1GB of true
       RAM and 4GB of virtual memory and is both a 24 and 32-bit OS.
7.1.0: 7.0.1 with WorldScript support and less RAM usage then
       7.0.dot.[MacWeek Aug 24 & Sept 14 and PC Week Sept 7]
AU/X 3.0(Unix): Needs 8MB of RAM{12-20MB suggested}, a 160MB hard drive, and
       something the power of a 68030 or 68040 to run.  32-bit OS.
PowerOpen(AU/X 4.0): Rumor is that it is ahead of schedule to the point it
       COULD be out by the end of this year.  Planned to run on 68030, 68040,
       and PowerCP chips [MacWeek 13 July] 32-bit OS.

IBM
DOS 5.0: Has a 640K barrier with its own memory manager, a 1 MByte barrier
         with third party memory managers.
DRDOS 6.0: same as DOS 5.0 with some extras (like built-in data compression)
       and memory management enhancements. Still has 640K/1Mb barrier.
Window 3.1: runs on top of DOS.  Breaks 640K and 1M barriers but still has to
       deal with DOS file structure.  Base requirements 1 MByte, floppy and a
       286; to run well 2MB, Hard Drive, and 386sx. Rumor of a 16 MB RAM
       barrier on some machines.
Windows NT:  Rumor mill is that the final version and all programming
       information not to be available before Oct 1993 (InfoWorld May 25 and
       July 6, Vaporware 07/92 and 08/92.) Also PC Week Sept 28 points to a
       3rd or 4th quarter 1993 release date.
       Some people see a July 4 release date (InfoWorld November 16, 1992)
OS/2: Unix like features and unix like requirements; 8 MB of RAM,
      a 60MB hard drive (uses 17-33MB on HD), and 386 CPU. Has to use a swap
      file to handle more then 16 MB RAM.  IBM plans to use Taligent's OOPS in
      future versions of this. (InfoWorld October 26, 1992) 32-bit
      multithreaded, multitasking os.
Mac 7.0: {Maybe} Apple has System 7.0 running off Intel Chips and is looking
         at making this version available for IBM. {Another wait & see}
         (ComputerWorld November 2, 1992)
PowerOpen(AU/X 4.0): Rumor is that this could be the OS for IBM's PowerPC 601
due out in early 1993 (Apple's PowerPC 601 is not due out until Jan 1994.)
{Supports the theory of Apple planning to be both a hardware and software
company.}

Price issue: Apple has dropped prices for dealers 15% to 20%
[MacWeek 17 August] and the Preforma line is out.
IBM is planning cheap machines as well:
A 25 MHz 386SLC model with a 60 MByte hard drive and color VGA for less
than $1,200 is planned after September 14.[MacWeek 17 August] These changes
will in the LONG term change the price issue. Too early to tell though.


Bibliography notes
VAPORWARE is available in the digest/vapor directory on Sumex(36.44.0.6) and
is by Murphy Sewall, From APPLE PULP H.U.G.E. Apple Club (E. Hartford) News
Letter  $24/year, P.O. Box 18027, East Hartford, CT 06118.
Phone #: "Bit Bucket" [phone] {"These are rumors folks; we reserve
the right to be dead wrong!"}


Corrections to the information are welcome

"Eliminate the impossible and what ever remains, no matter how improble,
is the truth" -- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle through Sherlock Holmes

"The Computer is your friend"--Parinoia RPG