NetNews Usenet Archive 1992 #30/NN_1992_30.iso/spool/comp/std/internat/873

Text File | 1992-12-16 | 11.3 KB | 311 lines

Xref: sparky comp.std.internat:873 soc.culture.nordic:7922 soc.culture.german:9309
Newsgroups: comp.std.internat,soc.culture.nordic,soc.culture.german
Path: sparky!uunet!mcsun!sunic!nobeltech!admin.kth.se!ojarnef
From: [e-mail] (Olle Jarnefors), [e-mail] (Peter Svanberg)
Subject: Re: ISO Latin 1 to 7-bit ASCII conversion (final draft!)
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Followup-To: comp.std.internat
Summary: Table modifiability needed. New conversions suggested for several
 characters. Special problems with Scandinavian 7-bit codes. The C3 system.
Keywords: character sets, ISO 8859-1, terminals, user interface
Sender: [e-mail] (Olle Jarnefors)
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Sweden
References: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 16:50:27 GMT
Lines: 294

Some comments on Markus's proposal:

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Representation of ISO 8859-1 characters with 7-bit ASCII
> --------------------------------------------------------
>
> Markus Kuhn -- 1992-12-13
>
> SUMMARY: This text describes a technique of displaying the 8-bit
> character set, which is used today in many modern network services, on
> old 7-bit terminals. Authors of software dealing with text received
> from international networks are strongly encouraged to implement this
> or similar methods as options in their software for the convenience of
> users all over the world. Implementation is often trivial.

By only offering four tables to choose from it's impossible to
satisfy the different needs of many languages and national
cultures covered by ISO 8859-1. Therefore it should be stressed
already in the summary that it is important that the conversion
table can be easily changed by system managers and end users.

> The disadvantages of this approach are often acceptable:
>
>   a) No one-to-one mapping between Latin 1 and ASCII strings possible
>   b) Text layout may be destroyed by multi-character substitutions

Add "..., especially in tables" to mention the practically most
important case.  We would also suggest the addition of some text
about a related disadvantage:

:   *) Truncation may be necessary to fit textual data into
:      fields of fixed width

> ... Users should be able to switch between the different
> tables and the 8-bit transparent normal mode. ...

Many users can get along with only one default conversion that
is always activated.  For most others it's sufficient with one
alternative conversion.  We suggest this addition to the text:

: It should be possible and not difficult to configure a default
: conversion and possibly a default alternative conversion for
: the program on a per user basis.

> ... User defineable tables
> are always a nice possible extension.

In our opinion this is not only a nice feature but a user need
almost as important as the capability of switching between the
five conversions defined in this text.  Write something like:

: A simple way for users to modify the conversion tables is also
: desirable.

> Users should know if the text they read has been converted from the
> original Latin 1 text. ...

Do you have in mind any specific way of visually indicating that
conversion takes place?  Underlining converted characters?
Something else?

> ... This avoids confusion if e.g. someone asks for
> sending him a 3<fraction 1/2>" disk [3╜"], which will be displayed
> after the conversion as 31/2" (= 15.25").

This particular problem is most easily solved, we suggest, by
converting the character not to "1/2" but to " 1/2", with an
initial space character.

> ... First of all, a table with the
> real characters in the range 160 - 255 (0xa0 - 0xff):

Two of the "high" characters of ISO 8859-1

160 "A0 '240  NO-BREAK SPACE (NBSP)
173 "AD '255  SOFT HYPHEN (SHY)

are not ordinary graphic characters but a sort of hybrid
characters with both a graphic component and a control
component.

For soft hyphen the graphic component is an ordinary hyphen
glyph.  The functional component is that this glyph should only
be displayed or printed if the character is at the end of a
line.  If it is somewhere else in the line, _nothing_ should be
displayed or printed.

In the simple, context-insensitive conversion that we are
dealing with here, SHY should be converted to the empty string,
since it will occur less often at the end of a line than
elsewhere.

> Table 0 is a universal table that is expected to be suitable for many
> languages. The letters are simply the ASCII versions without the
> diacritics. The character '?' as a fallback substitution where no ASCII
> string is suitable is used as little as possible ...

Even if it is used as little as possible we suggest that "_" is
a better fallback substitution than "?".  Genuine question marks
can be important for the correct interpretation of a text.
it's unfortunate if they are mixed with replacement characters.
By the way, there is a case of a genuine conversion to "?" in
the tables, viz. of the Spanish inverted question mark.  This of
course must not be replaced by "_".

For TABLE 0 we suggest the following changes:

0a: 164 "A4 '244  CURRENCY SIGN
    Now:        SUBST (general substitution character)
    Suggestion: DOLLAR SIGN

    This character was actually invented for the international
    reference 7-bit character set of first version of ISO 646.
    It is the only character that can replace the dollar sign in
    ISO 646-compatible character sets and no other character may
    be allocated to code position 36.  Therefore this characters
    have in practice become almost equivalent in those countries
    where the currency sign is known at all. (ISO has adopted a
    system for currency codes that doesn't use the currency sign
    at all.)

0b: 173 "AD '255  SOFT HYPHEN (SHY)
    Now:        "-"
    Suggestion: ""

0c: 175 "AF '257  MACRON
    Now:        SUBST
    Suggestion: "-"

    Macron is a diacritical mark used in semi-phonetical
    notation to indicate that a vowel is to be pronounced with a
    long sound.  In fine typography it has the same width as the
    vowel letter and its vertical position is adjusted to the
    height of the letter.  In ISO 8859-1 text it has to be
    written before or, preferably, after the vowel.  In the
    conversion to a 7-bit character set its principal graphical
    form can still be preserved.

0d: 176 "B0 '260  DEGREE SIGN
    Now:        SUBST
    Suggestion: "o"

    This is most often used in numerical data and can, without
    risk of misunderstanding, be substituted with the lowercase
    "o", as is often done.

0e: 188 "BC '274  VULGAR FRACTION ONE QUARTER
    Now:        "1/4"
    Suggestion: " 1/4"

0f: 189 "BD '275  VULGAR FRACTION ONE HALF
    Now:        "1/2"
    Suggestion: " 1/2"

0g: 190 "BE '276  VULGAR FRACTION THREE QUARTERS
    Now:        "3/4"
    Suggestion: " 3/4"

0h: 247 "F7 '367  DIVISION SIGN
    Now:        ":"
    Suggestion: "-:"

    This symbol has the meaning of subtraction in some countries
    and some application fields.  In addition, division is
    in some countries normally indicated by "/" rather than ":".
    We therefore suggest that the conversion should be neutral
    by trying to approximate the appearance of the symbol,
    rather than its meaning.  "-:" is better than ":-", since
    the "-" can't be misinterpreted as a minus on a following
    number.

These suggestions also apply to TABLE 3.

For TABLE 1 we suggest the following changes:

1a: 164 "A4 '244  CURRENCY SIGN
    Now:        SUBST (general substitution character)
    Suggestion: DOLLAR SIGN

1b: 173 "AD '255  SOFT HYPHEN (SHY)
    Now:        "-"
    Suggestion: ""

1c: 175 "AF '257  MACRON
    Now:        SUBST
    Suggestion: "-"

1d: 176 "B0 '260  DEGREE SIGN
    Now:        SUBST
    Suggestion: "o"

1e: 171 "AB '253  LEFT-POINTING DOUBLE ANGLE QUOTATION MARK
    Now:        '<'
    Suggestion: '"'

    The generic double quotation mark of ASCII can be used to
    reduce the risk for confusion with a genuine "<" used as a
    left angle parenthesis.

1f: 187 "BB '273  RIGHT-POINTING DOUBLE ANGLE QUOTATION MARK
    Now:        '>'
    Suggestion: '"'

1g: 188 "BC '274  VULGAR FRACTION ONE QUARTER
    Now:        SUBST
    Suggestion: "/"

    By using "/" instead of the general fallback character at
    least we indicate that the real character was a vulgar
    fraction.

1h: 189 "BD '275  VULGAR FRACTION ONE HALF
    Now:        SUBST
    Suggestion: "/"

1i: 190 "BE '276  VULGAR FRACTION THREE QUARTERS
    Now:        SUBST
    Suggestion: "/"

> In some north european languages, any US-ASCII replacement for the
> relevant Latin 1 characters is unacceptable for many people. In these
> countries, national variants of 7-bit ISO 646 are still very popular.
> These use the codes of []{}\|~^`$ for national characters. ...

The last sentence is partially incorrect.  Write instead: "These
use the codes of [ ] \ { } | in a consistent manner for national
letters.  One of the codes also uses @ ^ ` ~ for additional
letters."  (The spaces make it easier to identify the special
characters.)

> ... Table 2 has
> been designed for Danish, Finnish, Norwegian and Swedish users of ISO
> 646 terminals:

Unfortunately it uses @ ^ ` ~ as conversions for the letters
E WITH ACUTE and U WITH DIAERESIS.  This will give good results
only with one of the two Swedish 7-bit character sets and
disastrous results with the other Swedish code and with the
Danish/Norwegian code.

2a: 201 "C9 '311  CAPITAL LETTER E WITH ACUTE
    Now:        "@"
    Suggestion: "E"

2b: 233 "E9 '351  SMALL LETTER E WITH ACUTE
    Now:        "`"
    Suggestion: "e"

2c: 220 "DC '334  CAPITAL LETTER U WITH DIAERESIS
    Now:        "^"
    Suggestion: "Ue"

2d: 252 "FC '374  SMALL LETTER U WITH DIAERESIS
    Now:        "~"
    Suggestion: "ue"

Finally we would like to say that we are impressed by Markus's
work.  It identifies an important and neglected problem, is
based on principles that are technically sound, and offers a
practical solution.  The alternative approaches used by people
working with EBCDIC-ASCII conversion in the IBM mainframe world
and by Kermit developers are less promising.

We are ourselves active in this area, and have designed a more
ambitious system, called "The C3 System for Character Code
Conversion", as part of a joint project between Swedish
universities.  Actually, it's not quite finished yet.  The big
difference is that Markus's solution only treats two conversion
paths:

Latin-1 -> ASCII
Latin-1 -> Scandinavian 7-bit character sets

The C3 system will provide 3 types of conversion - 1-1, legible,
and reversible - between any two of about 20 coded character
sets by means of conversion tables on 3 levels - prototype,
elementary, and working table.

An obvious complement to Markus's work is a system that makes
_input_ of all Latin-1 characters from a 7-bit terminal
possible.  To make this reasonably user-friendly seems to be a
rather difficult task though.

--
Olle Jarnefors                     Internet: [e-mail]
Information Management Services        UUCP: ...!uunet!mcsun!sunic!kth!ojarnef
Royal Institute of Technology (KTH)  BITNET: ojarnef@sekth  Fax:[phone]
S-100 44  Stockholm, Sweden           Phone: [phone] (time zone +0100)

---
Peter Svanberg, NADA, KTH                   Email: [e-mail]
Dept of Num An & CS,
Royal Inst of Tech                          Phone: [phone]
S-100 44  Stockholm, SWEDEN                 Fax:   [phone]