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- Newsgroups: soc.motss
- Path: sparky!uunet!think.com!spdcc!rdonahue
- From: rdonahue@spdcc.com (Bob Donahue)
- Subject: Re: Men Not Getting It (was Re: Twice Fucked)
- Message-ID: <1992Nov15.165939.28836@spdcc.com>
- Organization: insert anything here
- References: <1992Nov11.173952.8562@cbnewsh.cb.att.com> <1992Nov14.150859.8271@panix.com> <1992Nov15.160349.4486@macc.wisc.edu>
- Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1992 16:59:39 GMT
- Lines: 59
-
- anderson@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:
- mara@panix.com >(Mara Chibnik) writes:
- >>dfs@lestat.bellcore.com (Deborah Swayne) asked Andrew M. Solovay:
-
- >>>>Excellent. Do you use anti-woman expressions whenever you
- >>>>want to insult a man, or do you reserve them for insulting
- >>>>gay men?
-
- >>psp@cbnewsh.cb.att.com (P.S. Powledge) follows up:
- >>>what *really* pisses me off is to see this women-hating
- >>>drivel posted here time and time again [...]I mean by men
- >>>who are claiming to be part of this community.
-
- >>Yup. It's a little hard to explain if you don't get it in
- >>the first place.
-
- >*So* much seems to rest on men not "getting it," doesn't it?
- >I've always been somewhat at a loss to understand to
- >understand why more men, indeed all men, don't get it.
-
- I think except for the terminally clueless a lot of people
- (and this extends to "not getting it" in situations of race, creed,
- orientation, sex, age, etc...) are afraid of exploring themselves,
- their thoughts, actions, words, gestures, etc. for fear of finding
- themselves imperfect or impure from prejudices, and the associated
- "-isms" and "-phobias" that go along with them.
-
- The rational don't want to think themselves "Xphobic"
- or "Xist" since they do realize that is isn't a good thing. On the
- other hand they won't self-examine their behavior because they
- don't want to have to come to grips that they might be Xist and
- then have to deal with it.
-
- And so they deal with it in any number of ways: throwing
- $$$ at it (so they have some tangible "proof" that they couldn't
- *possibly* Xists, look at all the charity they gave to stopping
- anti-X stuff...!), denying its existence in things they have contact
- with, pointing it out in everyone thing and everyone but themselves,
- and not recognizing it when pointed out in something they say/do.
-
- I'd like to think that I am not misogynist, racist, etc.
- but there are skeletons to be found if I choose to look for them and
- see them when they scream "boo!". Hunting them down and not ignoring
- them is the only way to purge them. Putting better locks on the closet
- doors might fool some people and usually fools oneself best, but it
- doesn't make the bogeyperson go away.
-
- In this regard (and linking in with another thread), I *greatly*
- appreciate soc.motss for helping me to beat down some of those barriers.
- It's very difficult to keep up pretenses of "well, *I* don't have those
- problems" when there are N people out there who can call me to the carpet,
- and (in a bittersweet sort of way) M 'bad examples' to compare my own
- behavior with. I've seen some misogyny here attempting to disguise
- itself as "camp" (there are differences!) and have been at first suckered
- into going along with it until someone has the foresight to point it out.
- Social decay, like tooth decay isn't a pleasnt thing, nor is cleaning
- it up painless... But the benefits afterwards make it worth the effort.
-
- BBC
-