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- Newsgroups: talk.abortion
- Path: sparky!uunet!gatech!taco!csl36h.csl.ncsu.edu!dsh
- From: dsh@csl36h.csl.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger)
- Subject: Re: Abortion and Infanticide
- Message-ID: <1992Jul24.153727.6528@ncsu.edu>
- Keywords: doug rich and mike
- Sender: news@ncsu.edu (USENET News System)
- Reply-To: dsh@csl36h.csl.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger)
- Organization: North Carolina State University
- References: <1992Jul19.194752.18295@ncsu.edu> <1992Jul21.215735.15272@spool.cs.wisc.edu> <1992Jul22.014836.6377@ncsu.edu> <1992Jul22.101440.23207@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU>
- Distribution: na
- Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 15:37:27 GMT
- Lines: 54
-
- In article <1992Jul22.101440.23207@pasteur.Berkeley.EDU>
- tjoa@cory.Berkeley.EDU (Richard Tjoa) writes:
-
- >In some article...dsh@csl36h.csl.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger) writes:
-
- >> But why doesn't the fetus enjoy the same right to bodily autonomy?
- >> In the vast majority of abortions, the fetus is either vacuumed out
- >> of the womb or scraped out, thus killing it in the process.
-
- > I think the big reason is because it is not autonomous. Show me a fetus
- > that cannot survive without a host to leech off of, and then I'd agree that
- > it was autonomous.
-
- A newborn infant sucking on its mother's breast is not "autonomous",
- If a newborn infant and its mother were isolated from civilization,
- and the mother had only her breast milk to feed the infant, then the
- newborn infant would not be "autonomous" by your definition, and hence
- it would not enjoy the right to bodily autonomy.
-
- > Also, looking at your "assumption" in the second part,
- > if it is correct, then you seem to imply that it is ok to be killed
- > in one piece.
-
- No, I was assuming that the right to bodily autonomy includes the
- right not to be killed by any method.
-
-
- > [...]
- >> What if you tried to grab hold of my arm -- would I have the right
- >> to remove your hand from my arm and let you drown, even if I had pushed
- >> you overboard?
-
- > Even if you didn't push this guy overboard, you aren't obligated to help him.
- > It's a decision that YOU get to make. I think he'd appreciate it if you
- > decided to help him, and that he'd be upset with you if you didn't, but
- > ultimately you're the one who has to live with the choice that you've made.
-
- But since I had pushed this person overboard, am I not obligated to
- help him? If he drowned as a result of pushing him overboard, wouldn't
- that be murder?
-
-
- > (Can be avoided==>we have an alternative)
-
- But in fact, there is an alternative to killing the fetus -- it can be
- removed surgically without killing it. But in the vast majority of
- abortions, the fetus is killed during the abortion procedure.
-
- > [.. rest deleted ..]
- >-Richard
-
-
- Doug Holtsinger
-
-