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- Newsgroups: rec.autos
- Path: sparky!uunet!rsiatl!jgd
- From: jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)
- Subject: Re: Air Conditioning
- Message-ID: <yfmmrvb@dixie.com>
- Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 06:22:04 GMT
- Organization: Dixie Communications Public Access. The Mouth of the South.
- References: <1992Jul27.163616.2372@wpi.WPI.EDU>
- Lines: 71
-
- beuf@wpi.WPI.EDU (Richard J Fuller) writes:
-
- >I am bout to purchase a new Geo Storm Coupe....
-
- >I was a bit confused about the Air Conditioning posts I have
- >been reading over the past week....
-
- >Can someone explain this 1995 thing to me clearly?
-
- In 1995, unless the govt comes to its senses, the manufacture of R-12
- will stop by govt edict. Not of any terrible concern, as there is
- a considerable stockpile. Of concern is the fact that the perceived
- "shortage" and the new ban against releasing R-12, the mandatory
- capture and recycling of old R-12 and the impending licensing requirement
- of service technicians are already being used to jack up the price of
- service.
-
- On the horizon is an even worse horror - R-134a. This substitute
- refrigerant is being passed off by the government, some auto mfrs and
- the service industry which stands to reap a large financial windfall,
- as the panacea to all our problems. R-134a costs much more than R-12,
- has less refrigeration capacity, requires special oil, appears to be
- at least a little toxic and may break down at the operating temperatures
- in condensers during the summer. Ford (always on the leading edge for
- finding new things to break [ ahem ]) and some foreign manufacturers
- are now using R-134a. Hapless customers will first discover this fact
- when their AC quits or needs filling and the price tag arrives. Sticker
- shock all over again.
-
- A car that uses R-12 will be in pretty good shape until at least 2000.
- What happens then rides strictly on some nasty politics now unfolding.
- When R-12 becomes unavailable around 2000, the govt and service
- industry plan is you will have to pay an estimated $1000 to have your
- R-12 system converted to R-134a. This will involve replacing just about
- every component in the system.
-
- Several people have been working on an alternative. DuPont has a product
- called SUVA that is designed to be a drop-in replacement for R-12.
- George Goble (ghg@ecn.purdue.edu) has developed another patent pending
- substitute. Not only is this product a drop-in replacement, it actually
- improves the cooling capacity of the system by an average of 20%. I have
- been involved with George since the beginning and have installed
- GHG in over a dozen cars. Over 400 cars total are now running GHG.
-
- The political problem is the car AC service industry, seeing all those
- R-134a conversion dollars flying out the window on the wings of these
- substitutes, is now trying to solve its problem by getting the EPA
- to ban all other substitutes. If this attack on your pocketbook
- makes you mad, write a letter to the EPA. If there is interest,
- I might scan and post the text of MACS's (Mobile Air Conditioning Society)
- petition to the EPA.
-
- This is the bottom line. Buy a car that uses R-12. It will be
- serviceable using R-12 for at least 5 years. Modern leakrates being
- what they are, it will likely not need service for 5 years. Assuming
- MACS does not get its way, the substitutes should be in wide deployment
- by then. Don't make the mistake of buying a vehicle that uses R-134a.
- This is a dead end. you will pay big bucks everytime the system has
- to be serviced. R-134a is an eco-chic non-solution that is being
- forced to the market by forces unrelated to engineering or need.
- I predict it and/or its lubricants ultimately will be found to be
- hazardous and will be pulled from service. Someone's going to have
- to pay for all this.
-
- John
- --
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