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- Newsgroups: comp.lang.c++
- Path: sparky!uunet!mole-end!mat
- From: mat@mole-end
- Subject: Re: Speed, Correctness, Availability, and the Real World
- Message-ID: <1992Jul21.134143.20911@mole-end>
- Organization: :
- References: <1992Jul10.212014.4869@mksol.dseg.ti.com> <1992Jul21.011256.1404@microsoft.com>
- Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1992 13:41:43 GMT
- Lines: 61
-
- In article <1992Jul21.011256.1404@microsoft.com>, jimad@microsoft.com (Jim Adcock) writes:
- > In article <1992Jul18.214750.12347@mole-end> mat@mole-end writes:
- > |I beg to differ. What _does_ seem to happen is that if you don't participate
- > |in the live discussions, you don't appreciate how much analysis is needed,
- > |or the problems of communicating with others present.
-
- > On the contrary, I haven't been there, yet I DO appreciate the problems.
-
- > |If you haven't seen
- > |it happen, you just can't provide what's needed. (So I testify, having been
- > |there.)
-
- > As one WG member told me, "tough nuggets." I can't be there, so this is
- > besides the point. If committee members cannot communicate what's needed,
- > then they certainly cannot communicate what is required of C++ programmers
- > and C++ compiler implementors via a written document called a "standard."
- > If it is impossible for them to communicate via written form, such as by
- > letters or by email, then the issue of this written document called
- > the "standard" is moot.
-
- Ok. Let's try some things on for size. (I'm taking some text out of
- order here.)
-
- > If some "analysis" of operator.() remains to be done, then how come neither
- > you nor any other committee member is willing to identify for me EXACTLY
- > WHAT issues remain to be addressed? I submit on the contrary, if neither
- > you nor any other committee member is willing to identify to me EXACTLY
- > WHAT issues remain to be addressed, then there ARE NO such other issues
- > that remain unaddressed.
-
- First, take some of Coplien's examples (or your own) and show how they
- would look if your version of operator.() is implemented. Interlard
- the before and after in the paper. Give consideration to interactions
- with other things (e.g. overloading and function signatures) because
- people _will_ want to use them together in expressions.
-
- Second, gather up the miscellaneous issues that we've been kicking around
- on this newsgroup and incorporate them into the right places in the
- proposal. Then let's you and me and a few others get together by email
- and work the proposal over end-to-end.
-
- > BUT, I HAVE BEEN asking WG committee members of these "other" proposals
- > you mention for about the last year, and none have been willing to
- > send me a copy of these "other" proposals. HOW can I address these
- > "phantom" proposals if no one will show them to me?
-
- Let's get together on e-mail about these. You'd be surprised what can
- be done on a small-circulation mailing list. We have until very late
- fall; that's enough time if we start now.
-
- > Then send me a copy of these alternative proposals, and I will write
- > up such a comparison from my point of view. Even if you disagree with
- > my "analysis" I will take at least some of the burden off of you and
- > the other committee members.
-
- Right now, none of them has much favor.
- --
- (This man's opinions are his own.)
- From mole-end Mark Terribile
-
- uunet!mole-end!mat, Somewhere in Matawan, NJ
-