InfoMagic Internet Tools 1995 April/Internet Tools.iso/dos_win/winsock/maillist/94-03.Z/94-03/text0278.txt

Text File | 1994-03-30 | 23.8 KB | 594 lines

In article <2mkeol$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (John Vriniotis) writes:
>From: [e-mail] (John Vriniotis)
>Subject: Winsock FTP site wanted
>Date: 21 Mar 1994 15:33:41 GMT


>Hi,  I am looking for a site that carries a lot of WINSOCK addons (FTP,
>GOPHER, etc..) and the WINSOCK program itself.  Basically, I am starting
>from scratch and would like to set myself up with a SLIP account.  Any ideas?

>John

>[e-mail]


yep if ya login to
b61503.student.cwru.edu
you will be able to have the same setup as i do (geez that sounds egotistical
sorry)
i've tried to compile a archive of the latest and most useful winsock stuff.
just go into the winsock dir.
it has eudora, trumpet, gopher, the packet driver for windows, winsock, irc,
talk , etc...
check it out and lemme know if there is anything its missing that you need (or
would like to see up there) i've tried to make it a small site for winsock
stuff.
hope this helps

-Sargon                                  Ftp for windows and winsock files
[e-mail]                        'b61503.student.cwru.edu'
                     "The only perfect science is hindsight."
From [e-mail] Tue Mar 22 00:14:29 1994
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Date: Tue, 22 Mar 94 00:14:29 GMT
From: [e-mail] (MIGUEL PALACIOS)
Message-Id: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept.
Sender: ses
Subject: Chameleon 4.0 and Lanman

Does anyone out there know if Netmanage is going to support NetBIOS in
their TCP/IP stack?

While I'm at it:
I have a TCP/IP Lan that has Ungermann-Bass X.25 gateways to connecte
to X.25 hosts (i.e. HP3000s, Vaxes, etc).  The HP3000s are connected to
our X.25 network and in the X.25 gateway we have pnemonics (sp?) that
are given tcp/ip addresses.  These pnemonics really set up an X.25 call
to the address in the gateway.  This way I can telnet to an address on
the gateway via TCP/IP and the gateway really just calls the X.25 address.

With other TCP/IP stacks (like UB's TCP/IP, FTP's TCP/IP and HP's TCP/IP),
I can connect without a hitch this way using most Telnet applications like
Reflection 1 Windows (4.1) that uses the winsock interface.  Chameleon's is
not able to set up the connection.  Sucker just cannot connect to the
host (ip address on the gateway)

Does anyone out there have a similar setup or can give me some hints?
Netmanage tech support is impossible to get through, so I'm asking here
first.

Thanks,

[e-mail]
*OR*
s=palacios%i=[e-mail]
From [e-mail] Mon Mar 21 19:50:32 1994
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Date: Tue, 22 Mar 1994 00:50:32 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Bob Natale)
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To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re:  WSAAsynchSelect(), FD_WRITE etc
Cc: [e-mail], [e-mail]

> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 1994 20:27:05 -0500
> From: [e-mail] (Pete Bentley)

Hi Peter,

I apologize in advance for only attempting to answer a few of your
questions...as you will see below, I am forwarding your message
(by copy hereof) to the winsock-hackers list, and I expect that
those (multitudes) more knowledgeable than me will post some answers
too.

> [Er, if there is a newsgroup / mailing list where winsock programmers
> hang out, I'd be grateful if someone would point me at it.  It's hard
> to keep up with alt.winsock as 99% of it is noise (from a programmer's
> point of view :-)]

Subscribe to  [e-mail], by sending e-mail:

    To:  [e-mail]
    Subject:  <leave blank>
    subscribe winsock-hackers Pete Bentley

(Actually, I've meaning to run a check to see how many folks are on
"winsock-hackers" but not "winsock".  It's kinda hard to get a sustained
discussion going on winsock-hackers.  Hence the otherwise unfortunate
cross-posting of this reply back to the main "winsock" list.)  :-(

> According to my version of the Winsock 1.1 spec, when WSAAsyncSelect()
> is called with FD_WRITE set in the event mask,

This was the topic of a recent series of exchanges on winsock-hackers,
and the solid consensus was that if the socket is writable at the/any
time that a WSAAsyncSelect() (with FD_WRITE set) is called, then an
FD_WRITE message should be posted by the DLL.

> no message is returned to the application until some send() call
> actually blocks. Fair enough.

Actually, bearing in mind my previous answer, in the case you cite
immediately above, you should not get an FD_WRITE messge after a
WSAEWOULDBLOCK error _until_ sufficient DLL buffer space is again
available.

> Some DLLs seem to try and be 'helpful' including the free Microsoft
> stack and Trumpet (up to alpha #18, at least) and will deliver an
> FD_WRITE indication if a WSAAsyncSelect() is issued on a socket which
> includes FD_WRITE *if* the previous mask didn't include FD_WRITE *and*
> the socket is currently writable.

I don't think the "*if*" part is correct; the "*and*" part is.  There
appears to be some possible degree of ambiguity wrt the term "initially"
on pp. 90-91 of the v1.1 spec wrt FD_WRITE postings.

> In my opinion, this behavious is more useful, as it will naturally
> kick-start applications which are totally message driven.

As they should be.  :-)  And you really should try to avoid using
superfluous WSAAsyncSelect() calls to [re]set notification requests
(which typically only need to be set once per socket per <some
logically "large" functional block of code>.

> As it happens I have written a set of class libraries which are
> totally event driven and do their 'real' work by making callbacks to
> the application code (it overrides member functions).  One application
> which makes use of these classes is basically structured as a state
> machine, with certain state transitions being made when all the data
> that the application queued on a socket has made it through send()
> (this app is making use of buffering within the socket class so it
> issue lots of small send()'s without causing network load (or having
> to rely on Nagel algorithms within the Winsock DLL to do that)).
>
> Now, my previous strategy was to add FD_WRITE to an internal event
> mask and issue a new WSAAsyncSelect() whenever data was added to an
> empty buffered socket,

Sounds like this last step ("...issue a new WSAAsyncSelect()...) is
something you should avoid.  We have observed problems in our code
when taking this approach...and regardless of who was to blame, going
to a more Spartan approach to using WSAAsyncSelect() both removed
the problem and "simplified" our code vis-a-vis the Windows programming
model.

> then when the app returns to Windows, many (most?)
> Winsock DLLs will send a message indicating FD_WRITE and the data gets
> sent to send().

Yes, if the writable state exists when WSAAsyncSelect() is called
with FD_WRITE, then the DLL _should_ post the FD_WRITE message.
(But bear in mind my earlier comments about the ambiguity of the
term "initially" in the spec.)

> And then someone tries to use the application with FTP's PC/TCP stack
> & DLL and it falls flat because this DLL really won't deliver an
> FD_WRITE indication until a send() returns EWOULDBLOCK.

I know that Bob Quinn of FTP has posted very knowledgeable messages
on winsock-hackers about the proper flow of FD_WRITE, so I am sure
that he will be able to help you here...maybe it's a version thing
...that's a pretty common problem across the board today.

> Reading the spec closely, I can't fault them for that, but its a
> real pain.

I'd be interested in hearing how you interpret the description of
the FD_WRITE message flow on pp. 90-91 or so of the v1.1 spec....

I think I'll skip the next two paragraphs...this is getting ugly! ;-)

> Suddenly code which was happily event driven needs to be kick started
> by a flush() function if there is a chance the socket isn't blocked.
> And to make the class libraries work I either have to call the
> callbacks directly or post fake FD_WRITE messages.  Neither of these
> approaches are desirable, one risks recursion (the callback is
> extremely likely to queue more data which may need to be flush()ed)
> and the other tends to overlflow the task's message queue when run
> with a 'nice' DLL which is also queuing FD_WRITE indications.
>
> Anyway, looking at it (hopefully) objectively, the approach where the
> DLL sends extra FD_WRITE messages is cleaner from an event-driven
> point of view, and is no extra stress on applications written for the
> behavious in the 1.1 spec, as they have to cope with spurious FD_WRITE
> messages anyway.  So my questions are:-
>
> 1) Any chance of this being changed in a future winsock spec. ie
> mandate that if an application does a WSAAsyncSelect() including
> FD_WRITE and the socket is writable that one FD_WRITE indication gets
> sent immediately.

Well, except for some ambivalence wrt "immediately", my understanding
is that what you suggest is what is supposed to be happening now (i.e.,
with the v1.1 spec).

> 2) How do other people using the async. interface cope with this if
> they want to keep the socket code as seperate as possible from the
> application code.

We've had to work at.  But removing superfluous WSAAsyncSelect()
calls seemed to help our code (I don't do it first-hand...just try
to follow the problem resolution cycles).

> 3) What does a return value of 0 from send() mean?  Neither the
> winsock spec. nor any of the Unix manuals I have to hand say this
> means anything special (like EOF when recv() returns 0).  I only ask
> because the Microsoft DLL seems to often send an FD_WRITE message to
> the application, but when the application tries a send() it returns 0.
> As my socket classes use a pretty standard loop write (loop until all
> data written or send() returns SOCKET_ERROR), this just means they
> sometimes loop rapidly through about 60 send() calls, all returning 0
> until the DLL finally accepts some data.  Curious, eh?  I certainly
> can't afford to treat this the same as -1/EWOULDBLOCK because I very
> much doubt I would get another FD_WRITE...Just another Microsoft bug,
> I guess.

Like Bob Quinn for FTP, J. Allard and/or David Treadwell often posts
concise, precise answers to such WinSock programming questions for
Microsoft...so I hope (and trust) that one of them (or one of their
associates) will post an answer for you.

Good luck,

BobN
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Bob Natale               American Computer           301-258-9850 [tel]
Director                 209 Perry Pkwy              301-921-0434 [fax]
Network Mgmt Products    Gaithersburg MD 20877          [e-mail]
From [e-mail] Mon Mar 21 20:15:11 1994
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Date: Tue, 22 Mar 1994 01:15:11 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Bob Natale)
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To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re:  Q:WinSock.DLL and OS/2?
Cc: [e-mail]

> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 1994 05:06:01 -0500
> From: Ling Thio <[e-mail]>
> To: Multiple recipients of list <[e-mail]>

Hi Ling,

I am hereby forwarding your inquiry to the "winsock" list...
I think you'll probably have better luch there with this one!

> Does anyone have any experience in trying to use winsock.dll under
> Win OS/2, or is this a technically impossibility?
>
> Ling.
> --
> Ling Thio                            E-Mail: [e-mail]
> CSE Computer Systems Expertise       Phone:  [phone]
> G. Gezellelaan 49                    Fax:    [phone]
> 2624 KX  Delft
> The Netherlands
>
From [e-mail] Tue Mar 22 05:31:20 1994
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Date: Mon, 21 Mar 1994 21:46:54
From: [e-mail] (Trent Stevens)
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Organization: UT Austin
Sender: ses
References: <[e-mail]>, <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Re: Chameleon Demo & ftp.netmanage.com...or the bug-fixes, for that matter

>...If anyone from Netmanage is reading this -- would y'all
>   please stick these and other patches/bug-fixes in the
>   pub/pc/win3/upload directory at FTP.CICA.INDIANA.EDU.
>   The patches can be moved to the /patches subdirectory
>   later. This would make things _MUCH_ better.

I second that wholeheartedly.  For a company that built its reputation with
TCP/IP products, NetManage seems awfully indifferent to its internetworked
users . . .

>...Pat
>--
>Pat Hayes, Meteorology, Texas A&M University  *** whoop! ***
>[e-mail] <<--email---U$Mail-->> TAMU,CS,TX,77843-3150
>         "...yankee by birth...Aggie by the grace of God..."

Um, don't you mean "by the wrath of God" ;)!

Trent Stevens  [e-mail]
From [e-mail] Tue Mar 22 03:18:51 1994
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From: [e-mail] (Pat Hayes)
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Organization: Meteorology, TAMU, USA
Sender: ses
References: <[e-mail]>
Subject: HELP!!! Re: Chameleon Demo & ftp.netmanage.com...or the bug-fixes, for that matter

>Hello!
>Has anyone managed to pull this thing down?  I haven't
>seen thoroughput that slow since my 1200 baud C64 days
>in grade school.  Ugh!

...here's a big-fix from hell...

   I <somehow> <net>managed to get the v402.exe bug-fix for
   my Chameleon v4.0...1.something-mbs. I never heard from
   Netmanage or NCD about it -- I read it hear.

   Installed it.

   Then I read <here> that there's a bug in the bug-fix;
   something about a bad nmredir.386 file.  So now there's
   a third bug-fix -- v403.exe -- to fix the second bug-fix.
   Great!

   Only thing is ...  you can't get there from here!

   Now I keep getting bumped off Netmanage's ftp server
   somewhere right around halfway thru the 1.2mb download.

   Sheesh!


>If anyone has it at an alternate site or could somehow
>manage to email it to me I would appreciate it.  As I


...If anyone from Netmanage is reading this -- would y'all
   please stick these and other patches/bug-fixes in the
   pub/pc/win3/upload directory at FTP.CICA.INDIANA.EDU.
   The patches can be moved to the /patches subdirectory
   later. This would make things _MUCH_ better.

>Thanks!

...yeah.

>-Rich


...Pat
--
Pat Hayes, Meteorology, Texas A&M University  *** whoop! ***
[e-mail] <<--email---U$Mail-->> TAMU,CS,TX,77843-3150
         "...yankee by birth...Aggie by the grace of God..."
From [e-mail] Tue Mar 22 06:31:20 1994
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Date: Mon, 21 Mar 1994 18:42:48 UNDEFINED
From: [e-mail] (Lin Jyun-Naih)
Message-Id: <[e-mail]>
Organization: III
Sender: ses
Subject: The 1994 TCP/IP Windows sockets and PPP Bake-off

Is there any one who knows whether the 1994 TCP/IP Windows sockets and PPP
bake-off in Redmond on 4/18 - 4/23 will take place or not?

J.N. Lin
From [e-mail] Tue Mar 22 06:58:55 1994
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Organization: sometimes works
Sender: ses
References: <[e-mail]>, <[e-mail]>, <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Re: Chameleon Demo & ftp.netmanage.com...or the bug-fixes, for that matter

So what are the bugs that these patches are supposed to fix?
The main bug I am concerned with is Chameleon's nasty habit of
crashing out to DOS without warning.  i have had this happen
using telnet and gopher.  Both seem to occur during initial
nameserver lookups.

jeff
From [e-mail] Tue Mar 22 09:47:15 1994
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Date: 22 Mar 94 09:47:15 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Gunter Hille)
Message-Id: <hille.764329635@fbihh>
Organization: University of Hamburg -- Germany
Sender: ses
Subject: Web4Ham - A WWW server for MS-Windows


    Web4Ham - A World Wibe Web Server
       for the Windows Socket API
        version  0.14
         20-MAR-1994

        (c) Gunter Hille 1994
    [e-mail]

This is the alpha release of my WWW server for the Winsock API.
Although I know that there already exists another WWW server (SERWEB),
I wrote this program to learn the asynchronous features of the Winsock API.

Features:

 - detailled logfile of sessions in SDF format
 - allows private directories for special hosts / domains
 - handles GET and HEAD methods

This is a call for alpha testers willing to test another MS-Windows WWW server.
Please report errors by Email to the author.

The server has been developed on a local network not connected to the Internet
and is has been tested successful against the following Winsock stacks:

TRUMPET Winsock 1.0 final beta #5
NetManage vers. 4.0

The Web4Ham server is available by anonymous ftp from this location:

    ftp://ftp.informatik.uni-hamburg.de/pub/net/winsock/web4ham.zip
From [e-mail] Tue Mar 22 07:16:32 1994
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Date: Tue, 22 Mar 1994 07:16:32 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Alex Reijnierse)
Message-Id: <[e-mail]>
Organization: PTT Research
Sender: ses
References: <[e-mail]>, <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Re: Chameleon Demo & ftp.netmanage.com...or the bug-fixes, for that matter

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Pat Hayes) says:
>
>>Hello!
>>Has anyone managed to pull this thing down?  I haven't
>>seen thoroughput that slow since my 1200 baud C64 days
>>in grade school.  Ugh!
>
>...here's a big-fix from hell...
>
>   I <somehow> <net>managed to get the v402.exe bug-fix for
>   my Chameleon v4.0...1.something-mbs. I never heard from
>   Netmanage or NCD about it -- I read it hear.
>



In what directory did you find this patch. I have been searching
high and low on ftp.netmanage.com but i cannot find it. I haven't
looked in all directories, but if i was going to do that i would
have to take a week off, with the speed they offer.


- Alex



>   Installed it.
>
>   Then I read <here> that there's a bug in the bug-fix;
>   something about a bad nmredir.386 file.  So now there's
>   a third bug-fix -- v403.exe -- to fix the second bug-fix.
>   Great!
>
>   Only thing is ...  you can't get there from here!
>
>   Now I keep getting bumped off Netmanage's ftp server
>   somewhere right around halfway thru the 1.2mb download.
>
>   Sheesh!
>
>
>>If anyone has it at an alternate site or could somehow
>>manage to email it to me I would appreciate it.  As I
>
>
>...If anyone from Netmanage is reading this -- would y'all
>   please stick these and other patches/bug-fixes in the
>   pub/pc/win3/upload directory at FTP.CICA.INDIANA.EDU.
>   The patches can be moved to the /patches subdirectory
>   later. This would make things _MUCH_ better.
>
>>Thanks!
>
>...yeah.
>
>>-Rich
>
>
>...Pat
>--
>Pat Hayes, Meteorology, Texas A&M University  *** whoop! ***
>[e-mail] <<--email---U$Mail-->> TAMU,CS,TX,77843-3150
>         "...yankee by birth...Aggie by the grace of God..."
From [e-mail] Mon Mar 21 14:57:39 1994
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Date: 21 Mar 1994 14:57:39 GMT
From: [e-mail] (smile)
Message-Id: <2mkcl3$[e-mail]>
Organization: Computer Center, National Chiao-Tung University, Taiwan
Sender: ses
Subject: How to get ethernet packets like Sun's NIT?

    I want to get ethernet packets. Can winsock support? We can use NIT in SUNOS.Can we do the same thing in MSWINDOWS?

Thanks a lot.

email:[e-mail]
From [e-mail] Tue Mar 22 13:21:06 1994
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Date: Tue, 22 Mar 1994 13:21:06 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Marc J. Mass)
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Organization: United States Environmental Protection Agency
Sender: ses
Subject: Looking for WSARCHIE

I've been looking for a copy of WSARCHIE to download by FTP but haven't found
one.  The one listed for monu6.cc.monash.edu.au in /pub/win3/uploads transfers
as a file with only 3K in it.  Anyone have a site (verified) I can get it from?

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