Arabic

This topic was created by student
[Wed 28 April, 12:04 Tasmanian Standard Time]

I really want to learn Arabic but I've heard there are
different dialects for different countries.Is there one
general dialect spoken in most ME countries?
Is it impossible to teach myself? What books do you
recommend? I want to travel mainly in Iran,Maroc, Syria and
Lebanon.
Any advise welcome.

[There are 21 posts - the latest was added on Fri 7 May, 7:04]

Use the form at the end of this page to add your own post.

Topics | Thorn Tree | Home


  1. Arabi Added by: herman
    [Timestamp: Wed 28 April, 12:43 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    First of all, Persian is the main langauge of Iran, not
    Arabic - which is entirely different except for a general
    similarity in the scripts. Secondly different dialects do
    make up the vernaclar languages spoken by various regions -
    Standard Literary Arabic is the common denominator, but even
    that is not necessarily effective in ordinary communication
    - for giving speeches or attending conferences in the ME is
    it great. Morrocan is very differnet from Syrian Arabic,
    and Arabic generally is very hard to learn - dificult sound
    for English speakers, conceptaully different from Indo
    European languages, and difficult plurals and agreements.
    There is a discussion further down this branch with
    information about classes etc.



  2. By the way..... Added by: Mariam
    [Timestamp: Wed 28 April, 13:02 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Persian is also officially known as Farsi. Just thought I'd
    mention that to avoid confusion. The only similarities are
    the sounds, and as Herman mentioned, the script.



  3. For Your Information ! Added by: Amir
    [Timestamp: Wed 28 April, 14:15 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Iran is NOT an Arabic country. This is the very first thing
    you should learn about Iran, newcomer!
    Thanks others for mentioning this, but every Iranian deems
    it its duty to note once more. We Are Persians!



  4. Learning Arabic Added by: Jake C.
    [Timestamp: Wed 28 April, 16:11 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Learning Arabic, like any language, requires patience and a
    genuine interest. I would suggest that you learn a few
    words and phrases for your first trip. If you decide you
    would like to return and experience the ME more in-depth,
    then you should consider learn Arabic.
    Arabic is not related to European languages, therefore, it
    is far more difficult to pick up than German or Spanish.
    It would be very difficult to teach yourself. You should
    take classes at a university near home, or, if you have the
    time and money, in the Middle East.
    Your best bet is probably to learn either Modern Standard
    Arabic or Egyptian Arabic because of its wide-spread use in
    films and literature.



  5. Iranian vs. Persian Added by: Amir - why don't you clarify
    [Timestamp: Thu 29 April, 10:44 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Please fill me in on why some Iranians prefer to be
    classified as Persians? It seems to me that most of those
    who prefer the term 'Persian' do so because of some
    perceived idea that 'Iranian' has a negative connotation to
    it.
    I once knew an Iranian fellow named Amir who insisted that
    he was Persian, later to change his name to Emile and tell
    others he was Spanish.
    Fess up Amir!



  6. Arabic is a fun challenge! Added by: Euro
    [Timestamp: Thu 29 April, 10:46 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    I think its a great idea to start learning Arabic! I learned
    some while living in Bahrain and had great fun doing so -
    plus it is a way to meet some locals and lots of westerners
    who have interest in the culture where they are living.

    There are quite a few books you can get, I have some, but
    still packed away in boxes. I do NOT recommend the
    Linguaphone course, as it is too advanced for a beginner!

    The kewlest site for learning Arabic is www.travlang.com - I
    suggest you start by learning the numerals from 0-9.
    I found learning to read/write Arabic a great help to my
    pronnunciation and ability to ask what words meant and how
    they are spelled/pronounced.

    If you buy bilingual dictionaries, make SURE that you have
    the arabic in them as well!

    I learned "classical Arabic" - not sure if this is the same
    as the standardised Arabic mentioned above. It is not the
    same as any "dialect" but is a common denominator for them
    all and most Arabic-speakers with higher education (not sure
    what level, though) have learned classical Arabic as well as
    their "local dialect", I was told, anyway. I got away with
    most of my "classical" words.

    Egyptian Arabic is your next choice - or maybe first, as
    Egyptian films have been popular for ages all over the Arab
    world. I was lucky enough to have an Egyptian teacher, so I
    got the pronunciations from her.

    The Arabic words are difficult to learn at first, because
    they have so little in common with European languages.
    Still, there are some tricks you can use - like "sayarah" is
    car - and Sierra (by Ford) is also a car! Silly link, but it
    helped me remember. Had an awful time learning the numbers
    from 8-10, though - got really muddled. But got it in time.

    A big advantage of Arabic is that one word gives many words.
    For example if you learn the word for book (kitab) you will
    easily get the word for office and library and a couple of
    other things, because they add to the beginning or end of
    the basic word to make different uses of the "core word". It
    sounds complicated, but once you grasp the concept, it makes
    life really easy - and you can finally start looking up
    words in Arabic dictionaries (which go by core word - ktb
    for kitab - instead of by the Western alphabetical system).

    If there isn't a university near you offering Arabic, maybe
    you can get some help from the links below - or maybe put an
    ad in the local paper asking for someone to tutor you. I had
    a tutor to start with and I think that was a great help
    because I then got one-on-one when I was trying to grasp the
    new concepts.

    In any case - I wish you the best of luck!

    http://philae.sas.upenn.edu/Arabic/arabic.html
    http://darkwing.uoregon.edu/~alquds/arabic.html
    http://darkwing.uoregon.edu/~alquds/
    http://www.teleport.com/~alquds/arabic.html
    http://www.uoknor.edu/cybermuslim/cy_quraan.html
    http://arabic.wjh.harvard.edu/index.htm
    http://www.arabic2000.com/
    http://fas-www.harvard.edu/~munson/arabic2.html
    http://arabic.wjh.harvard.edu/texts.htm
    http://www.ArabicNews.com/
    http://www.teleport.com/~alquds/arabic2.html
    http://www.arabchat.com/
    http://www.gy.com/www/ww1/ar_e.htm



  7. That looks so silly! Added by: Euro
    [Timestamp: Thu 29 April, 10:51 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    When I said buy bilingual dictionaries with arabic in them,
    I meant with arabic script - not just the european
    transliterations!



  8. Thanks! Added by: student
    [Timestamp: Thu 29 April, 11:58 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Thank you for all the help. I'm sorry I assumed Iran was an
    Arabic country. Are there ME countries besides Iran where
    Farsi is spoken? I'm sorry if this is a stupid question but
    I'm genuinely interested in the culture.
    Thanks again.



  9. #8 Added by: Jorg
    [Timestamp: Thu 29 April, 12:17 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    I think there's a Farsi minority in Afghanistan, and maybe
    also in some of the former Soviet republics in central Asia.



  10. Farsi Added by: herman
    [Timestamp: Thu 29 April, 14:55 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Pashto, one of the main languages of Afghanistan is a Farsi
    dialect, and so is Tazjiki of Tazjikistan. How close or far
    from Persian I do not know.



  11. one more thing Added by: herman
    [Timestamp: Thu 29 April, 14:56 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Persian is also resonably common in learned Muslim
    communities in India and Pakistan.



  12. Bahrain Added by: Euro
    [Timestamp: Thu 29 April, 18:54 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    There are quite a lot of people of Iranian descent living in
    Bahrain. I think a lot of them speak Farsi still.



  13. Try Egyptian Added by: EGYPTIAN
    [Timestamp: Fri 30 April, 4:43 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Egyptian is very widely understood since many or most
    arabic tv is produced in Egypt. Also Egypt is considered
    the Hollywood of arabia. But they pronounce their J's like
    G. For exsample- Al Sen bilad jamil. China is a beautiful
    country. But Egyptians pronounce jamil like Gamil. But
    they have a great dialect that is favored as a universal
    arabic. Standard arabic is too complex and the general
    population arent tuned into it. Especially in more rural
    regions. But they understand egyptian because of its
    saturation on the tv.



  14. Egyptian Arabic Added by: Jorg
    [Timestamp: Fri 30 April, 12:27 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Everyone says that Egyptian is the most widely understood
    dialect, so if I speak that then people of other dialects
    will understand me. But will I understand THEM? That is,
    will they be able to adjust from their dialect and SPEAK
    Egyptian, or just understand it?



  15. Don't worry Added by: Euro
    [Timestamp: Fri 30 April, 20:20 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    You will get used to the local dialect as you go. The most
    difficult, I found was this hard G/soft G (J) business. That
    threw me off a lot. But you get used to that as well pretty
    quickly, really.



  16. Can I have two tickets to the pyramids and a yellow vacuum cleaner please? Added by: kiwi (coldkiwi@yahoo.com)
    [Timestamp: Sat 1 May, 18:43 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Dialects vary a lot as far as I know - I was told by two
    Arabs recently that they couldn't converse if they spoke
    their dialect of Arabic. One was UAE, the other was Omani.
    .
    Hugo produce books to teach you a language in 3(!) months.
    I've bought a couple (not Arabic) and was completely
    unsuccessful. But they looked ok.

    You need an Arabic speaker or at least a tape to learn the
    sounds - some don't exist in English.

    I think a lot of the travel type phrase books us Egyptian
    Arabic because that's understood everywhere.

    Good luck!



  17. Hugo 3 months Added by: Jorg
    [Timestamp: Sun 2 May, 13:26 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    The Hugo "Arabic in Three Months" kit looks strange to me
    because it teaches a mixture of spoken Arabic, ie. not a
    specific dialect but a mixture of several. Why they would do
    that is beyond me. I liked their Hebrew kit though.



  18. info Added by: Matthias (skout@ucla.edu)
    [Timestamp: Sun 2 May, 15:39 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Dear "student",
    for your traveling purposes, learning Syrian dialect is
    probably the best. This is spoken in Syria, Lebanon,
    Palestine, Jordan. (Yeah, I know that there are variations,
    but these are insignificant for a beginner, more like the
    difference between New York English & the lingo we speak in
    California...) This dialect is also called "Levantine
    Arabic" by some language books. In any case, check with the
    next big university & see whether they have any courses. I'm
    not sure whether LP has a language kit for this dialect, but
    there some out there. Moroccan Arabic is very different;
    there definitely IS a LP language kit for this dialect, just
    take it along. Modern Standard is useful, alas people will
    only understand you but almost never talk back in anything
    other then their dialect. Syrian/Levantine, by the way, is
    pretty close to Modern Standard...
    As for Persian, it is officially not called "Farsi" (this is
    a rule from the Persian Language Association), on the
    grounds that we don't call what the French speak "francais"
    or the what Germans speak "Deutsch". In any case, Tajik is a
    form of Persian, as is Dari (on of the main languages in
    Afghanistan). Pashto, on the other hand, is a language
    different from Persian, although related (more like Italian
    & French).
    "Iran" vs. "Persia": The country's official name was Persia
    until about 1936, when its ruler, Reza Shah, changed it to
    "Iran" (meaning "Land of the Aryans"), most likely in order
    to highlight his country's "blood-ties" to the Europeans, &
    especially to the Nazis in Germany. I have friends who call
    themselves Persians as well as others who call themselves
    Iranians. Same difference.
    If you do end up going, read some books before you leave
    home. Can't emphasize enough how important that is. Start
    with the LP books, but also hit some "serious" material.
    Have a safe trip.



  19. Understanding each other Added by: Euro
    [Timestamp: Sun 2 May, 20:24 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Some Bahrainis I knew worked in Egypt quite a bit. They told
    me that they could converse with the Egyptians just fine and
    always understood what the Egyptians were saying, but that
    if they spoke their Bahraini "dialect" really fast, the
    Egyptians weren't able to catch what was going on.
    Why the Bahrainis understood the Egyptian so easily? They
    had seen TV and movies from there lots!

    So - I still say, go for Egyptian if you want to pick a
    "dialect" as you will be understood by the most
    arabic-speakers.



  20. Iranians Added by: alpha omega
    [Timestamp: Mon 3 May, 9:33 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Iranians may speak Farsi (the 'F' sound itself comes from
    Arabic influence and is a distorsion of 'Parsi'), but they
    have been converted en masse by invading Arab hordes---it's
    as if India had become Church of England wholesale because
    the English invaded. So this business of strong, distinct
    Iranian culture is a bit of a crock. Islam is a religion
    that requires converts to learn the language of the holy
    text...much like if you had to learn Aramaic/Greek/Hebrew in
    order to be a Christian. So no matter how much Iranians
    protest (correctly) that they are not Arabs, most of them
    speak some Arabic; by the mullahs, Farsi is spoken with a
    strong Arabic accent. And the script is the same.
    .
    PS Just in case it is not clear from the above thread,
    'Arab' is a linguistic classification. Anyone whose first
    language is Arabic is Arab, including Christians (although
    Jews are apparently never Arab, I wonder why). Racially,
    however, Egyptians (descendants of the great
    pyramid-builders) are very different from say Bahrainis
    (descendants of fisherman).



  21. parsi Added by: ugo (makrook@caramail.com)
    [Timestamp: Fri 7 May, 7:04 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    actually, parsi or farsi is widely spoken in afghanistan,
    can be understood in some parts of pakistan, and you could
    get along with it in some gulf countries as UAE where a lot
    of farsi speakers live.I think also though I'm not sure
    that you'll find a lot of people undestanding it in
    some former soviet countries of the area (turkmenistan,
    ouzbekistan...)I've been told that maybe a third of its
    vocabulary is borrowed from arabic.It's an indo-european
    language though, thus its grammar has nothing to do with
    arabic grammar, but lot more with european languages.the
    script is arabic alphabet with some extra letters to write
    sounds unknown of arabic.




Add a post

Your name or handle
Your email address (optional)
A title for your post

Away you go...

Topics | Thorn Tree | Home


Lonely Planet Publications

talk2us@lonelyplanet.com.au