Under this posting, I have left a copy of a recent article
discussing the treatment of "dissidents" in Cuba. Should be
interested reading for those of you who applaud the Cuban
government so much. Granted, it's from the Miami
Herlad....but I think we should listen to the message before
dismissing the messenger.
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By JUAN O. TAMAYO
Cuban President Fidel Castro's latest crackdown on the
island's dissidents has angered an array of nations and
institutions whose support he had successfully courted over
the past year. Spain said Tuesday that King Juan Carlos
could postpone a visit to Cuba expected during the spring.
Canada, a leading proponent of engaging instead of
pressuring Havana to ease controls, had Deputy Foreign
Minister Donald Campbell summon the Cuban ambassador to his
office to voice his dissatisfaction.
It's still unclear whether Castro's draconian new laws, mass
detentions of dissidents and high-profile trial of four
opposition leaders will affect the actual policies of Cuba's
traditional friends.
``I still believe that it is important to continue a direct
dialogue with Cuba. The fact that we have this dialogue
gives up the opportunity to broach problems very openly,
very frankly and very directly,'' said Canadian Foreign
Minister Lloyd Axworthy.
Even less clear is whether the international outrage over
the Cuban moves will have any significant impact on the
human rights policies of a regime that has stayed in power
40 years through authoritarian means.
Almost bizarrely, some analysts in Havana argue that the
recent rough handling of dissidents is in fact a sign of
better times to come.
The crackdown is a preemptive strike, they claim, designed
to keep dissidents in line after Castro is forced to adopt
new economic reforms later this year to counter the island's
current stagnation.
``They are cleaning the floor before it gets dirty, said one
veteran foreign journalist in Havana. ``Fidel knows he has
to open up, and he does not want it said that dissidents or
foreign pressures made him do it.
But such arguments are unlikely to carry much weight among
the many nations that have recently stepped up their
policies of engagement with Cuba and criticized the U.S.
policy of pressuring Havana to make changes.
``At every step of the way the Cubans are . . . deliberately
choosing to take harsh measures, a Western diplomat in
Havana said. ``This can go a long way toward laying the
groundwork for a reconsideration of engagement.
Cuba had been experiencing a virtual honeymoon with many
other nations since Pope John Paul II visited the island in
January of last year and called for a warming in relations
between Havana and the outside.
``May Cuba, with all its magnificent potential, open itself
to the world and may the world open itself to Cuba, John
Paul said at the start of his first visit to the
last communist regime in the Western Hemisphere.
Much of the world indeed opened itself to Cuba. More than 30
heads of government and 90 cabinet-level officials visited
Havana last year, and four Latin American nations opened or
upgraded diplomatic ties with Cuba.
But some of those same friends sounded angry after Cuban
police jailed about 60 dissidents Monday to keep them away
from the trial of Cuba's four top opposition leaders,
Vladimiro Roca, Marta Beatriz Roque, Felix Bonne and Rene
Gomez Manzano. Two weeks earlier, Cuba had outlawed
virtually any act seen by authorities as supporting U.S.
policies.
In the most stunning outburst, an editorial Tuesday in the
French left-of-center newspaper Le Monde blasted Havana's
crackdown in unusually harsh terms under the headline
Havana, End of an Illusion.
One year after the Pope's visit, the newspaper said, ``Cuba
has ended the illusion that it maintained for an
international community impatient to see it respect
human rights.
``The government of Fidel now shows itself for what it is: a
trapped dictatorship, it added.
More condemnations of Cuba came from the usually pro-left
human rights commissions in El Salvador and Guatemala,
Mexico's chapter of the Pen Club, the worldwide grouping of
Christian Democratic parties and the European Union.
A spokesman for Sir Leon Brittan, vice president of the EU's
executive committee, said Tuesday there was ``extreme
concern within the 15-nation alliance that now provides the
bulk of Cuba's foreign aid and trade.
And Canada, one of Havana's top sources of tourists and
hard-currency earnings, sent a written complaint to Cuban
Foreign Minister Roberto Robaina.
``We continue to have serious concerns about Cuba . . . and
find the latest measures particularly worrisome, said
Christian Girouard, spokesman for Canada's Department of
Foreign Affairs and International Trade.
Uruguayan Senator Americo Ricaldani said he would urge the
government to push for Cuba's expulsion from the Latin
American Parliament and the World Interparliamentary Union.
But Spain held out what may turn out to be one of the most
significant sanctions of all -- the postponement of King
Juan Carlos' spring trip to the only former Spanish colony
he has never visited.
Juan Carlos' visit had been expected to cap a warming in
Spain-Cuba relations after a rocky start for conservative
Spanish Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar. But the Foreign
Ministry confirmed Tuesday that the visit is up in the air
because of Cuba's new controls on dissent.
``The ministry is working to ensure that the visit . . .
goes ahead in an atmosphere of normalcy, not repression,
said a spokesman, who also confirmed a recent Herald report
that Madrid is seeking a Cuban promise of total freedom and
access to the media for the monarch's visit.
``If these things are not guaranteed, the visit will not
proceed, the spokesman said.
The Castro government has been lobbying for the monarch's
visit for years as a symbol of Cuba's full membership in the
Hispanic family of nations, and is expected to take strong
steps to forestall any possible problems.
One longtime Latin American resident in Havana predicted
that as a result of all the foreign protests against the
crackdown on dissent, ``Castro may be willing to convict
these four people, then wrap them up in gift paper and
donate their freedom to the king as a present.
I wish you yanks would stop criticising Cuba on human rights
issues. At least they don't put innocent people in the
electric chair like you do. You also have the highest prison
population per capita in the world. What sort of a society
do you call that??? A sick one, I'd say.
Did you guys criticise so strongly the right wing
dictatorships in Latin America that systematically tortured
and killed thousands?? No, you didn't, and why not?
Yes, there are political dissidents in Cuba, but they're not
tortured and they are not killed.
Some were killled after the 1959 Revolution, but most of
them were torturers for Batista themselves.
hasta la victoria siempre
The truth hurts, Bob. And if you think Cuban people do not
deserve the chance of decen life and opportunities you have,
who don't you go and claim your victory in Villa Marista,
and become one of their officers. YANKS, as you call them,
fought against Franco in Spanish civil war, why dont you
bring this up? How about Cuba adn Soviets subsidizing
terrorism in all Africa and Latin America all these years?
And a lot of those comun delinquents in U.S. prisons sit on
drug charges, because Cuban Gov. has a plan to destabilize
U.S. by aiding drug cartels to smuggle the dust into U.S.
territory.
Bu the way, Cuban gov. is really scared of those dissidents,
because the head of them is the son of the legenday cuban
revolutionary BLAS ROCA, who named his son after LENIN:
VLADIMIRO ROCA. It is clear proof that Cuban people want the
chance to voice their opinion.
Just about any movement or individual who is seen as a threat
to the power structure of any society will eventually be
neutralized, resisted or compromised in some way. That is
what makes being a dissident activist whether in Cuba,
America, Myanmar, or Mexico such brave and selfless work.
I feel sorry for you. You are obviously very poorly
informed. I will not waste any more of my time trying to
educate people like yourself. Basically, you are beyond
help. They say ignorance is bliss......well you must be one
of the happiest people alive on this planet.
How much more beautiful the world would be without the US
government and the sick society and sick right-wing people
(fortunately not all of them) there. How much more beautiful
the world would be with more places like Cuba, and more
politicians like Fidel.
Incidentally Chad. How was it that I guessed right when I
said yanks??? The reason is that your level of ignorance is
so high that you could only be American.
By the way, I am not anti-American, just anti-american
foreign policy and anti-ignorance.
As evidenced in the above article, there are many who are
thinking twice about dismissing U.S. foreign policy towards
Cuba. Maybe we were right?!?! Incidentally, where are you
from and what has your country's foreign policy done to
improve the lives of Cubans? It's easy to throw pebbles at
the big boys, but "what have you (and your country) done for
Cuba lately?"
Unfortuately, while the revolution served a very necessary
purpose forty years ago, it has failed dismally to deliver
a real existence for most Cubans. They are poor, hungry
and not very happy with the situation. And now, the
government's policies with regard to tourism are creating a
climate of discrimination against Cubans themselves, and
setting up a system fraught with corruption and crime.
"How much more beautiful
the world would be with more places like Cuba, and more
politicians like Fidel." Definitely wearing rose coloured
glasses here Bob, lucky you didn't have to buy them in
Cuba. Rudimentary education levels, insufficient food and
clothing, oppression by the police, lack of personal
freedom, inadequate medical supplies, no access to even the
commodities that Cuba itself produces, or used to produce
in abundance, like coffee and sugar. All seafood exported
or sold to tourists (or only available to Cubans
illegally). No access to the internet, to the huge
majority of books, papers, magazines, information in
general. Not that I am advocating capitalism, Bob. Just
that the socialist experience has failed in Russia, East
Germany, Vietnam, Cuba ... everywhere, really, because if
you stifle a person's individual desires you make it
impossible for them to WANT to do anything useful.
Indeed Anny, the revolution served a very necessary purpose
40 years ago. To throw over the corrupt Batista regime which
was virtually ruled by the Americans. The same Americans
that were misbehaving themselves in the extravagant casino's
and brothels, spending their black money. When Fidel
put an end to these criminal activities and liberated the
country from this 'legalised' repression, the U.S. took in
all those Cubans that were collaborating with them.
Admittedly, Cuba's economic position is worsening every day,
but not in the least due to the American boycot. Not only
the U.S. refuses to officially apologise to the Cuban
people for their past misbehaviour, they also feel the need
to prevent the country from developing, albeit in a
socialist structure.
Personally I prefer a democratic structure, not a socialist
one. But it is not up to other countries to decide which
path should be followed by Cuba. Definitely not by the
American hypocracy. Comparing Cuba with the U.S. Bob did a
good job (reaction 2). Looking at the overall performances,
in my view Cuba does a better job (fortunately, many
European societies do even better). On a Cuban street I feel
much safer as in urban areas like New York or L.A. Less
crime, no death penalty, intensive hospital care free for
all, food for everyone. Wow, Americans pay attention, you
might learn something here.
Most pressures put on the Cuban system, due to scarcity in
a wide variety of things, is caused by an aggressive U.S.
anti trade campaign. They are not only hypocrit, but also
bad loosers.
I try not to become an opponent of American policy, but when
I watch the news, seeing the president being handicapped for
over a year for a sexual affair (no, it had nothing to do
with purgery), an individual succesfully sueing a tobacco
company for 200 million dollar, refusing to sign the anti
landmine treaty (the economic lobby of the war industry??),
Americans being the worst pollutors, I do not know.
Maybe the U.S. is turning mad. Napoleon made a mistake by
going to the east. Is Cuba going to be America's mistake?
Americans definitely have the capacity to transfer their
social and economic structure to a more sustainable and
acceptable one. Hope they do so before it is too late.
Charles
I have travelled in Cuba and I have read history
(independent sources). I am afraid that also this is a
complex question. The Batista regime was corrupt, but still
supported by USA. I cannot understand why USA did support
Batista who was much more brutal than Fidel. Cuba has a good
education system, a good health system and social security.
However, the authorities have failed to let people get
responsibility. The authorities always knows what is best.
This has made many Cubans apathetic, and therefore the
economy is in a bad condition. I should wish that USA and
Cuba could start a constructive cooperation. However, the
"Russian solution" is a very destructive one. Cuba needs
democracy, freedom and motivated people. At the same time
they should keep their unique social security, education
system and health care. Traveller
"I cannot understand why USA did support Batista who was
much more brutal than Fidel." Its not too hard to work
out: Fidel refuses to lick the asses of the good ol' USofA
unlike Batista. Batista made Cuba america's whore and as a
result was able to do whatever the hell he liked. Then
Fidel came along and refused to play ball - his love was
for Cuba, not selling it and his soul at the expense of the
Cuban people. How DARE america think that it has ANY say
whatsoever in ANY other country's politics??!! How fucking
DARE america refuse trading with any other country if that
country trades with Cuba?? What kind of world are we living
in?? How can they get away with that?? Bastards. And
before I get a heap of patriotic replies from americans,
I'm not anti-american, I have an american boyfriend, etc
etc - but as a human being first and foremost I cannot
possibly comprehend how this came about and how all the
other gutless countries agreed to it. FUCK!!!!
"I cannot understand why USA did support Batista who was
much more brutal than Fidel." Its not too hard to work
out: Fidel refuses to lick the asses of the good ol' USofA
unlike Batista. Batista made Cuba america's whore and as a
result was able to do whatever the hell he liked. Then
Fidel came along and refused to play ball - his love was
for Cuba, not selling it and his soul at the expense of the
Cuban people. How DARE america think that it has ANY say
whatsoever in ANY other country's politics??!! How fucking
DARE america refuse trading with any other country if that
country trades with Cuba?? What kind of world are we living
in?? How can they get away with that?? Bastards. And
before I get a heap of patriotic replies from americans,
I'm not anti-american, I have an american boyfriend, etc
etc - but as a human being first and foremost I cannot
possibly comprehend how this came about and how all the
other gutless countries agreed to it. FUCK!!!!
Give Θm hell! If anyone disagrees with these folk, have a
read of Noam Chomsky....
woo hoo!
When are people going to move past this whole Batista vs.
Castro discussion? I think that many people would agree
that Castro has "liberated" Cuba in a time when such a
change was needed. Fine! End of story! What's going on
today? Cuba is in dire straits and government officials
have gotten drunk off of their own wine. (Even
Fidels daughter left the country!) Fidela, your points are
interesting but I think they're moot. The U.S. gov't, much
like the Cuban gov't, can do whatever it likes. The Cuban
government has made its bed. There seems to be this
overriding sense of entitlement, not only on the part of the
Cuban government but the people as well. Perhaps it's an
outgrowth of socialism. But Fidel still complains about the
embargo - which is his excuse for why his government can't
get its act together. I'm sorry, but I'm not impressed. No
one owes Cuba anything. If they want something, then work
for it! That's what politics is all about! The Soviet
Union is no more! No more handouts! Reality is slowing
setting in for this country and it's unprepared for it.
It's much like the perverbial man who one day said to the
universe, "Sir, I exist." To which the universe replied,
"that fact, however, does not create in me a sense of
obligation." So....Baptista sucked......yes, we know. Fidel
liberated Cuba......and that's wonderful! So now what?
Build expensive hotels, persecute journalists, throw people
with AIDS/HIV in sanitariums, exploit tourists, tacitly
condone prostitution, deny personal freedom, keep the people
hungry and malnurished, institute apartheid like
policies......all in the name of Socialismo?????? Socilismo
y Muerte?
Thankfully, a few people with a bit of intelligence and
objectivity have now added posts. The US' foreign policy
towards Cuba and all of Latin America sucks, big time. It is
a bullying and cynical superpower. Look at what's happened
this week with the banana trade war. Now Eurpoe is getting a
taste of what Central America has suffered under for the
last century - big US corporate interests who dictate
foreign policy in Washington. These sickos actually corrupt
not only Washington by funding electoral campaigns there,
but pay off politicians in Latin America, fund and train
brutal right wing military men, and create a situation of
total dependence on single crops (eg Bananas) and crush
anything that is not supportive of their corporate interests
(eg social movements). It is all basically down to money and
economic interests. Anything that the US cannot control it
wishes to crush. The Cuban Revolution was anathema to the
US. The US rapidly lost all its economic interests in the
island which had served it indirectly for near over 60
years. Corporate pressure from; Fruit companies, Mineral
extraction companies, Sugar producers and refiners etc, they
all had to pull out and will never accept socialism in Cuba.
These people prefer the great social inequalities in Central
America; the misery, endemic diseases, drug trafficking,
corruption, education and health only for the elites, as
long as they are earning huge profits for themselves and the
US. Without its economic dominance in the world, the US
would not have its military and political power. This is
Realpolitik.
I'll give you an example. What happened when the recent
hurricane passed through Central America killing thousands
and destroying banana plantations?? The big US banana
companies laid off thousands of workers overnight, who they
have been exploiting for decades. The US government gave
some aid (not a great deal considering its riches), but it
no doubt came with many strings attached. What did
impoverished Cuba do? It cancelled its foreign debt with the
countries most affected (50 million US dollars in
Nicaragua's case) and sent brigades of doctors to help
alieve the humanitarian disaster, and offered thousands of
free grants for medical students in the region to study
medicine in Cuba. When I said thank God for countries like
Cuba, and politicians like Fidel, this is the kind of action
I'm talking about. Not everything, my American friends,
should come down to money and materialism. US foreign policy
is sick, hypocritical, bullying, and creates misery and
death in many parts of the world.
This century was the American century, but things will
change, slowly. History will move on. When there's someone
in the world more powerful than you, you'd better hope
they're on your side, coz you'll have a lot to answer for.
The first mail started by saying that the Spanish Royal
Family were considering cancelling their visit to Cuba. This
is a lie, followed by many others. I heard the Spanish
Foreign minister on TV saying that they were considering
nothing of the sort. You nutcases there in Miami, or
wherever you are. Just stay put. Cuba doesn't want you or
need you, now, or ever again.
Viva la Revolucion.
Bob, the debt thing for Nicaragua was a nice gesture. I'm
truly touched. However, to judge a country or its policies
on one gesture is quite a stretch. While Cuba extends
itself to other countries, it exploits its own people! If
you want to talk about exploitation, you need go no further
than the Cuban government. And "yes," the U.S. government
has gotten its hands dirty on more than one occasion.
However, it's a little nauseating to read all these "evil
superpower" posts! Why don't you try throwing stones at
some of these other countries? While I admit the U.S. has
committed many of atrocities in the name of democracy, the
reality is that no government is altruistic and I would dare
say that no other country has a foreign policy that has
benefitted more people than the U.S. One of the great
things about the U.S. is its ability to change and reflect
the will of the people! Not many countries can make such a
claim. The U.S. is not perfect and its policies should be
held up to a microscope. But it's a little convenient that
so many people can shower accolades on a pathetic government
like Cuba while demonizing that of the U.S. - while driving
around in their American-made cars, surfing the net on their
American-made computers, and spending American dollars.
Long live the armchair revolutionaries!
Geez Charles, why not actually READ what people say before
you rave on at them? Everything you said agrees with what
I said, so why tell me to wake up? YOU wake up.
Geez Charles, why not actually READ what people say before
you rave on at them? Everything you said agrees with what
I said, so why tell me to wake up? YOU wake up.
Sorry Ann, after rereading your contribution I still find it
difficult to find the similarities. In my opinion the world
would be a better place with more countries like Cuba and
more leaders like Fidel. You condemn the Cuban government by
pointing at the negative impacts of U.S. foreign
policy. Insufficient food and medications are indeed a
problem, largely caused by a boycot. Freedom of information
is curtailed and incentives to be productive and innovative
are marginal compared with capitalist countries, but this is
inherent to socialist systems and more than compensated by a
low criminality and abscence of any unethical death
penalties.
Adios, Charles
"Drawing a wave of tough foreign condemnations, a Cuban
court Monday convicted four of the island's most celebrated
dissidents on charges of sedition and sentenced them to
prison terms ranging from 3 1/2 to 5 years. The sentences
were short enough to make the four eligible for early
release to serve the remainder of their terms -- they were
jailed in July 1997 -- under parole or house arrest, Western
diplomats in Havana said.
But the ruling came as Cuba gave another sign of its
determination to brook no opposition -- the
official enactment of a Draconian new law setting 20-year
sentences for dissidents who support U.S. policies against
Cuba.".............
"Cuba's Government Gazette, meanwhile, published the ``Law
for the Protection of the National Independence and the
Economy, which threatens sentences of up to 20 years for
anyone convicted of ``supporting hostile U.S. policies
toward Cuba. From now on, because of this legal maneuver,
journalists, intellectuals and citizens can be fined . . .
and sent to jail for expressing ourselves freely,
said CubaPress, an opposition news agency not recognized by
the government."
Although many of us have different views, I think we all
value the right to disagree! Too bad the Cuban people can't
enjoy the same right!!!!!!!!!
Canada to evaluate relations with Cuba
OTTAWA -- Prime Minister Jean Chretien said Monday that
Canada would review its ties to Cuba after the sentencing in
Havana of four political dissidents.
``We have informed the Cuban government that we would be
reviewing the range of our bilateral activities,'' Chretien
said in a statement.
Chretien said he had discussed the cases of the four with
Cuban President Fidel Castro during a visit to Havana last
April.
``Cuba sends an unfortunate signal to her friends in the
international community when people are jailed for peaceful
protest,'' Chretien said.
Unfortunately, most of the selfish know nothings who are
travelling to cuba have little time or intelligence to
understand the effects of stimulating their economy with
touristdollars. The cuban government is not stupid,
folks. They are reaping huge revenue due to the
unscrupulous who travel there, oblivious to the oppression
of the cuban government. As most ex cuban nationals now in
the USA will tell you, there is no support for removing the
US sanctions on cuba. Listen to the cubans who spent time
in cuba! This stuff should be mandatory reading for anyone
oblivious to the reasons why the US has the embargo.
Anyone travelling to cuba should be forced to spend a day
with an ex cuban here in the USA so they can learn the
reality of the oppression in cuba that the tourist dollar
is supporting. Wake up folks.
While there may be some unscrupulous, unintelligent people
visiting Cuba, I think those of us who have visited
post-revoutionary Cuba know much more about the oppression
of the people in Cuba than those who have long since
abandoned their homelands and families. Many of us, have
shared their lives - even if for a brief moment. However, a
considerable amount of Cubans now living in the U.S. have no
real idea of how their countrymen are lving. The bottom
line for many of these people is money - they want their
property and money back, and have little regard for the
people struggling in Cuba. Just out of curiosity, why
haven't Cuban Americans used their leverage in Washington to
make it easier to bring Cubans to this country and escape
the oppression they face in Cuba? Aside from Brothers To
The Rescue, the attempts to help the people in Cuba have
been pathetic. I also would disagree with your contention
that the presence of foreigners is supporting Castro's
government. In fact, I think it's helping to undermine it.
The people are gaining exposure to people who they have
previously been taught to see as the enemy. It's been a
learning experience for them - and I think it's contributing
to a growing wave of discontent among the people in Cuba.
Reality has many sides - you might want to open your mind a
little more.
Obviously everyone has some pretty strong opinions about
this one! But if you want to read more about the real
thing and what is really happening out there in the world
the person way up there was right. Read some books by Noam
Chomsky, Vandana Shiva, also a great book called Toxic
Sludge is Good for You, and another one called Open Veins
of Latin America. Check out some alternative media - not
the mainstream crap that the US multinationals control -
regardless of which country you live in - except maybe Cuba.
And then maybe you will agree that USA should get it's nose
out of other countries problems and stop playing monopoly
with the resources of the world. You can not say that USA
actually gives a shit about real people living in any of
the countries where they are intervening by "restoring
democracy" blah blah blah whatever new name they want to
give to their acts of violence and oppression. Basically
USA only acts to serve themselves.
And yes - Cuba does have it's problems... so do many
countries. But I think Bob made some really relevant
comments about aid to areas with hurricane problems. Sure
it's just one example... but unfortunately this example can
be repeated many times over if you look at the way USA
treats other countries.
If you really are interested in this issue and in the
involvement of USA in other countries business then I do
suggest you look at some of the literature addressing it.
Although I've given USA are bit of a blasting here - i'm
not attacking the citizens. Most citizens just don't know
or don't care or are living in such poverty (cause
unfortunately USA has massive poverty problems of it's own)
that they don't have energy to think about this shit. But
I think it is up to US citizens to become aware about what
their tax dollars are doing around the world... cause
otherwise it will never change.
Political systems which give power to people will never
work because USA nips them in the bud as soon as they
start... look at Vietnam, Guatemala, Chile... I could go on!
And here we all think we live in democratic countries... as
if any politician would ever listen to any of us. And if
you read some of the above literature you can see how
elections have been rigged in the usa.
Well I've babbled enough - sure I will get some
fiirrreeeyyy replies to this!
Ciao - Chris
bob, i've been reading over some of your posts and you make
NO sense whatsoever. you wrote..."On a Cuban street I feel
much safer as in urban areas like New York or L.A.
Less crime, no death penalty, intensive hospital care free
for all, food for everyone." no death penalty? are you
serious? what about this salvadorian who was just sentenced
to death for the bombings? intensive hospital care? do you
have any REAL idea how lousy the medical treatment is for
Cubans? i suspect not! food for everyone? damn, you are
so damn stupid it's nauseating! if there is all this FOOD,
than why are so many people starving and malnurished? hey
charles, you are full of shit too! you wrote to
Anny...."You condemn the Cuban government by pointing at the
negative impacts of U.S. foreign policy." so Cuba doesn't
have food because of the U.S.? wait a second, the biggest
island in the caribbean can't produce enough food to feed
it's people, and that's the fault of the u.s.? but didn't
bob just say that there is food for everyone? than you
hypocrites talk about the u.s. should keeps its nose out of
other countries, but then criticize it for its embargo
against Cuba!!!! what do you want??????? should the u.s.
stay out of Cuba or give it food.....ooops, wait........cuba
has food for everyone......right bob? but then again, there
is no food and that's the fault of the u.s. you two dumb
assess should not be allowed to post on this forum -
especially since none of it makes sense! while i enjoy the
right to disagree and voice my opinion (WHICH IS A BASIC
RIGHT THAT CUBANS ARE NOT AFFORDED - you assess!), you Noam
Chomsky reading, armchair revolutionaries (as Diago
appropriately called you) really need to give it a
rest!!!!!!! charles, what is this crap?????......"Political
systems which give power to people will never work because
USA nips them in the bud as soon as they start... look at
Vietnam, Guatemala, Chile." look at south africa, look at
indonesia, look at ghana, why don't you just open your eyes
and LOOK!
You made some good points Mason. I'm disappointed that you
failed to address fidela and her comment about her
mentally-retarded American boyfriend. Perhaps she could
invite him to leave the U.S. and live in her country. That
would increase the IQ level of both countries.
As for the other 'armchair revolutionaries' who have read a
book or two and have become authorities on the economics,
politics, and foreign policy for the whole world, we can
only wish that birth control could be made retroactive.
Don't let your blood pressure get too high Mason over some
of these posts. Just remember, the only traveling and
only first hand experience that some of these people have is
through their TV or their computer.
Cheers
not that it's any of your business kent... but i've been
travelling (and working voluntarily and for money)
throughout latin america and other countries around the
world for the last two years. I figure out my opinions from
experience, what i see, and information which i can access.
if you don't agree with what someone says why not try and
address it directly rather making stupid comments about
whether they should exist or not!
Saying we need more politicians like Fidel Castro is like
saying we need more dinosaurs or more Jesse Helms. One of
those is about as out of touch with reality as the
other. Maybe one day ALL the other countries of the world
will wise up and get in step with Fidel and become
communistic countries ruled by dictators! Try to tell those
in Cuba who go to bed hungry at night that Fidel's economic
policies are so great! Go there. Give your money away. Try
to get a job. THEN, see how you like the system.
Batista made Cuba into one of richest Caribbean nations in
the Western Hemisphere. I saw newsreels of hospitals and
other public works that are built by him. To the one who
dislike him,why he freed Castro? Is it out of the goodness
of his heart? Also why he stayed in power when the US wanted
him to leave? Batista is a complex man who is misunderstood
by many. Now why is Castro letting prostitution and hotels
that discourage the regular Cuban? Why he didn't revive the
1940 Cuban Constitution after comming to power in 1959?
Since the US is paying rent for Gimo why Castro didn't cash
the checks? Last but not least where are the billions of
dollars,and other currancies spent by travellers? Are they
used for public works or the Swiss bank accounts of the
Castro government and why Castro didn't take the route of
Tito and the current Chinese government? Cuba would had been
like China but Castro wouldn't do it. Just typing some
common sense questions. I welcome the discourse.
Batista made Cuba into one of richest Caribbean nations in
the Western Hemisphere. I saw newsreels of hospitals and
other public works that are built by him. To the one who
dislike him,why he freed Castro? Is it out of the goodness
of his heart? Also why he stayed in power when the US wanted
him to leave? Batista is a complex man who is misunderstood
by many. Now why is Castro letting prostitution and hotels
that discourage the regular Cuban? Why he didn't revive the
1940 Cuban Constitution after comming to power in 1959?
Since the US is paying rent for Gimo why Castro didn't cash
the checks? Last but not least where are the billions of
dollars,and other currancies spent by travellers? Are they
used for public works or the Swiss bank accounts of the
Castro government and why Castro didn't take the route of
Tito and the current Chinese government? Cuba would had been
like China but Castro wouldn't do it. Just typing some
common sense questions. I welcome the discourse.
Batista made Cuba into one of richest Caribbean nations in
the Western Hemisphere. I saw newsreels of hospitals and
other public works that are built by him. To the one who
dislike him,why he freed Castro? Is it out of the goodness
of his heart? Also why he stayed in power when the US wanted
him to leave? Batista is a complex man who is misunderstood
by many. Now why is Castro letting prostitution and hotels
that discourage the regular Cuban? Why he didn't revive the
1940 Cuban Constitution after comming to power in 1959?
Since the US is paying rent for Gimo why Castro didn't cash
the checks? Last but not least where are the billions of
dollars,and other currancies spent by travellers? Are they
used for public works or the Swiss bank accounts of the
Castro government and why Castro didn't take the route of
Tito and the current Chinese government? Cuba would had been
like China but Castro wouldn't do it. Just typing some
common sense questions. I welcome the discourse.
Blind American patriotism... or just right wing self
righteousness, whatever you want to call it. The bottom
line is this, my enlightened "support the embargo"
croonies. LOOK IN YOUR OWN BACK YARD BEFORE TELLING ME
WHERE TO TRAVEL OR PUT MY DOLLARS. You think oppression
doesn't happen in the land of Mom and Apple pie? Pull your
head out of your rectum and focus on serious atrocities and
human rights violations that go on and are ignored EVERY
DAY in your homeland, wherever that may be. (I have a
pretty good idea.) By the way, I am a very patriotic
American who gets "nauseated" at having to hear you get
self righteous based upon your late night philosophy as
hosted by CNN's perspective of the world. I thank my
Creator every day that I was educated abroad. This way I
can go back and tell my fellow countrymen that our nation
is not as "well off" or "free from condemnation" as they
would like to think in their houses up on the hill. In
closing, have you guys ever even been to Cuba? Just curious.
Mason, Mason, Mason. You poor misguided, frustrated little
boy. Ever heard of Augusto Pinnochet? Yeah, he is a great
guy. Backed by the US is right buddy. Glad you got some of
your vulgarity streammed babbling correct. Have you ever
been to Chile oh enlightened one? Try asking some of the
Mothers, Daughters or sisters of "missing" men over there
how their loved ones right to free speach was backed by our
great nation, until they leaned ever so slightly to the
left. Pinnochet did all of this with the full support of
the US. As the saying goes again, Mason: "Freedom of
speech, just watch what you say." CLEAN UP YOUR OWN BACK
YARD. Is anyone out there as tired of hearing that as I am
of typing it?
Why on earth is the US continuing its trade embargo toward
Cuba, 7 years after the collapse of the Soviet Union? Not
even the most rabid right-wingnut could argue that Cuba, all
by itself, poses a serious threat to US national security.
So then is it part of some consistent ideological position?
No - all you have to do is look at our trade policy toward
China to see that. In my opinion, the main thing motivating
the continued embargo is spite and not knowing when to give
up. I admit to not knowing as much as I'd like about daily
Cuban life (of course, my "free speech and discourse"
valuing government has made it illegal for me to go see for
myself) but I've got to admire any country that has stood up
to the biggest bully on the planet for this long.
Oh, and Mason - your comment about "you hypocrites talk
about the u.s. should keeps its nose out of other countries,
but then criticize it for its embargo against Cuba!!!! what
do you want??????? should the u.s. stay out of Cuba or give
it food" shows some scary misunderstanding. Despite what
you might think by looking at the current state of
congressional politics, the US *government* (the entity that
makes laws) and US *business* (the people who would be
trading with Cuba) are not the same thing. US Government
(and its strongman the IMF) should stop trying to dictate
the internal affairs of every other country, so that
businesspeople could buy Cuban products and sell (not give)
Cuba food and other goods.
Finally, of course Cuban socialized medicine, housing, etc.
are in a sorry state, but this is because the country is
poor, not because it's socialist! You can talk about how
great US medicine is all you want, but for those of us (like
me) who can't afford health insurance, it sucks. And I
would prefer bad socialized health care to the nonexistent
health care I have now.
For those who think the US is not ideological bully to the
planet, I challenge you to name any government which came to
power in the last 50 years and which was more socialist than
its predecessors, that the US has not tried to undermine or
prevent from taking power. When our elected leaders talk
about promoting "democracy" what they really mean is
"laissez-faire capitalism." And the concept of "national
sovereignty" just doesn't seem to enter into the mix.
Cayman Steve, why don't you get off your American-made
computer and stop using your American-based e-mail - you
hypocrite! It's pretty convenient that you're sitting on
your hump, criticizing the U.S. while enjoying all the
benefits that the U.S. has brought to the world. And please
spare me your evil dictator-backed-by-the-U.S. conspiracy
theories. Sure, the U.S. has made some boo boos. However,
you sound like some weed-smoking, malcontent, who's just
looking for something to complain about. Incidentally,
what's the current weather like up in Utopia? Stop acting
like any gov't will ever be beyond reproach! That's not
realistic! You sound like a little kid who just
discovered Santa doesn't really exist. The great things
about the U.S. is not its infallibility, but rather its
ability to change and reflect the will of the people. It
happened, it's being rectified, now go watch more American
T.V. and shut the fuck up!
troutlily, your comments show your lack of understanding
about the embargo against Cuba. You suggest that we should
differentiate between the U.S. gov't and U.S. businesses.
However, the only ones who really care about maintaining the
embargo are the Cuban Americans in Miami - the rich business
men. They are mostly Republican and are a strong
constituency for any Republican looking to stay in office.
They have molded our policy towards Cuba. Most Americans
don't care about the embargo - Cuba is not a threat. But
it's the formerly rich Cubans who now live in Miami, who
would be doing business in Cuba, that have been the strength
behind the embargo. Most politicians don't care either
way about Cuba or Castro. They just care about being
re-elected. who helps them get re-elected? Rich
businessmen! Read up a little more before putting your foot
in your mouth.
What is up with your dumb comments about "if you don't like
the US government then stop watching tv and using email".
Don't you understand that it is possible to love and
appreciate your country, and still criticize the government?
That's what democracy is all ABOUT, you idiot.
Yes, I understand that very well. However, I don't
understand the level of hypocrisy that these
socialist-loving idiots embrace! It's very convenient that
they want to talk about how great Cuba is, when they don't
live there, and how the U.S. sucks.......while enjoying all
the benefits the U.S. has brought about. Furthermore, I
acknowledged that criticizing the gov't is fine - but to
completely demonize it, while taking advantage of it is
unacceptable. Perhaps you should have read my posts more
carefully. Now go back to hugging your tree, you
pachulli-smelling, Che Guevara t-shirt wearing hippie!