Cuba...the truth please!!!!

This topic was created by Confused
[Mon 24 May, 21:21 Tasmanian Standard Time]

After reading several postings here i am left with the
impression that either Cuba is a wondeful place to visit or
its a country full of people waiting to rip you off!!
I am hoping that its the firsst aand not the second!
Please tell me the truth from your own experiences!!!
Than

[There are 12 posts - the latest was added on Wed 26 May, 12:48]

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  1. No simple answers...... Added by: Diago
    [Timestamp: Mon 24 May, 23:27 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    After six trips in the last two years, I can say that Cuba
    can be both. It's really a land of paradoxes - a classless
    society with clear class deliniations; a proud country - but
    not too proud to beg; a socialistic country where American
    dollars rule; etc., etc. It's a confusing place where very
    little makes sense. However, there's nothing else in the
    world like it too. If you're up for the adventure and you
    have the internal fortitude, it's a worthwhile place to
    visit - at least once. Some prefer the all-inclusive
    resorts, where they have essentially no contact with the
    people, which is fine. However, if you venture beyond the
    protective gates of these resorts, be prepared for a
    whirlwind of an adventure. By the way, I'm confused about
    the place too - and I've been there. (smile)



  2. a supplement: Added by: joe
    [Timestamp: Tue 25 May, 2:54 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Pro:
    1]safe
    2]affordable
    3]friendly people
    4]warm yr/round
    Con:
    1]it's a police state w iron grip, that's why it's safe
    2]the people are pay shitty wage by Fidel, hence affordable
    3]because they know if they befriend you, you can work miracles
    4]sometimes too warm
    I disagree with Diago, I've been to vietnam as a non-tourist and I found things similiar but not quite the same. I guess in any country isolated from the west, things are bound to be bizzare in the Gringo's eyes.
    When N Korea opens I bet that's going to be a whopper of a trip.



  3. Diago Added by: Sarah
    [Timestamp: Tue 25 May, 4:09 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    I agree with your posting except, the classless part.
    Perhaps it is classless on an officiallevel, but I found
    that the people themselves form their own classes. Those
    with money and those without and to a certain degree
    colouring...don't mean to to denigrate but this was
    gathered from talking with Cubans themselves. Perhaps this
    is regional?



  4. Diago Added by: Sarah
    [Timestamp: Tue 25 May, 7:05 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Sorry...re read your post...forget what I wrote!



  5. 2 to Tango Added by: Indignant666
    [Timestamp: Tue 25 May, 17:32 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    In Cuba - its fuck now, pay later.
    You can take a Cuban out of Cuba, but you're still fucked.



  6. No rip off Added by: Miguel
    [Timestamp: Tue 25 May, 22:01 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    You should go, majority of people warm hearted, friendly
    and welcoming, taxi drivers, esp turist taxi will try rip
    off as anywhere else but 'ordinary' people no problem. But
    remember that Cuba has a duel economy, wges are paid in
    pesos, approx 20/22 to a dollar, 200 pesos per month is
    above average wage, (eg Doctor). The only shops with
    anything to buy are dollar shops, for Cubans the only way
    to get dollars is from turists, either taxi, guide, selling
    fruit, cigars etc, etc, so you can expect some people to
    ask for dollars for any small service, others too proud to
    ask but welcome any gift, take clothes etc that you dont
    need and give them away rather than bring them back. A few
    dollars goes along way. Have fun!, buy the music tapes.



  7. Reply to Sarah. Added by: Diago
    [Timestamp: Wed 26 May, 0:24 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Exactly, the 'classlessness' is supposed to be a goal of
    socialism. However, in Cuba there are class distinctions.
    Rather than being based solely on money, much of what
    determines class is based on the person's affiliation with
    the government. For example, the people with whom I
    initially stayed, lived in a huge 4 bedroom apartment with
    three bathrooms in Vedado while my girlfriend's family lives
    in a small one-room house in Habana Vieja. After Castro
    assumed power and everything became property of the
    government, people who were considered 'good workers' were
    given homes, cars, etc. as rewards for their commitment to
    the revolution. That's how the family I mentioned got this
    huge home. Unquestionably, personal politics and
    patronage played a role in this. But that's how most things
    are doled out among the people. There are some people with
    cars and some without - why? Some have phones and others
    don't. Since everything is 'government owned,' the people
    can't 'officially' buy and sell these things - although it
    does happen on an unofficial level. Consequently, they are
    obtained through service to the government.
    -
    Another contributing factor to class, at least as I see it,
    is the access to American dollars. Those Cubans with family
    abroad fair much better than those without. And everything
    in Cuba is up for sale, provided you have enough money. So
    if you don't have a phone, you can always 'pay' to get a
    phone (albeit for an exorbitant amount of money, by Cuban
    standards).
    -
    Race is another factor. While the government preaches about
    equality for everyone and the people claim there is no
    racism, it's so deeply entrenched in that society that it
    goes unnoticed on some levels. Why is it that the suburb of
    Vedado is largely white, while Central Habana and Habana
    Vieja are largely black? (That was a rhetorical question -
    smile) The issue of racism is further clouded because of
    the lack of racial identification in latin america. Rather
    than being black or white, the people are described by their
    appearance - i.e., mulatto, negro, etc. When I was in Cuba,
    that was the first time I was EVER called mulatto. And you
    have many people that try to move away from their own
    'blackness.' While, genetically, some people may be black.
    Their appearance is what shapes their identity. So how can
    one address the issue of racism when the issue of race is so
    clouded? This is not exclusive to Cuba, however. You see
    it in Mexico, Colombia, Equador, etc. - with those of
    European, Indian, or African ancestry. Once again, you see
    those with European ancestry and the mestizos on the top,
    while the Indian population is relegated to the position of
    second class. While racism exists everywhere, the denial of
    its existence in Cuba is what worries me. Some people
    recognize it, and other don't. But until they talk about it
    and address it, the problem will always exist.
    -
    Just as a side note, I live in a largely Dominian community
    in New York. When I was very little, I looked at these
    people who looked exactly like me - yet didn't understand
    why they spoke Spanish. And then I was even more confused
    when they said that they weren't Black! After all, they
    looked just like me - if not MORE black; yet they weren't
    Black? What I didn't realize was that they identified
    themselves as Dominican first, and by their appearance
    second. But the damning the about it all is that so many
    people don't want to be Black. They have bought into the
    racism hook, line and sinker! Oh well.



  8. Ooopss.... Added by: Diago
    [Timestamp: Wed 26 May, 0:44 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    .....I'm sorry too. I didn't see your next post. ha! ha!
    ha! Sorry for taking up memory on everyone's computers!!!



  9. A supplement to Diago's analysis Added by: Tony Montona
    [Timestamp: Wed 26 May, 3:31 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Diago hit the spot head on about racism. The fact is most
    Cubans define themselves hispanics first. But the subtlety
    is real. A little experiment, hotel/tourisy jobs are staffed
    by mostly light skinned workers. When you're there, take
    note the percentage and compare it to percentage of
    light/dark folks on street. Gurantee it'll reveal something
    (Note: tourist only areas don't count)



  10. Jus Wonderin Added by: CuriousOutsider
    [Timestamp: Wed 26 May, 5:05 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Diago and others. Have read many postings here.
    Why does this group of people attach themselves to
    people who are extremely poor and probably not very
    well educated. You said your girlfriend works in
    customs and lives in a one room house. Whay are you
    who looks smart and articulate involving yourself
    with someone like that. Is it that cool to be with
    a cuban person that you can forget your inequality ?
    Do you think you can "save" this person ? Just wonderin.
    Is it the sex ?



  11. Good Post Added by: Sarah
    [Timestamp: Wed 26 May, 10:47 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Well said Diago! "Confused" you asked an interesting
    question...
    Diago...I asked many questions about racism while in Cuba.
    You are absolutely correct that racism is not publicly
    awknowledged but very rampant among themselves..based on
    colour, money and government affiliation...what an
    absolutely confusing society it is! I don't think I can
    ever understand it!



  12. DIAGO's Point Added by: Rodrigo
    [Timestamp: Wed 26 May, 12:48 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Diago, does this bother you that those of us who are of
    mixed race do not think of ourselves as only black? I think
    you should take in consideration a different perspective we
    as hispanic have about race. In U.S. there is a much
    stronger antagonism, because of historical reasons, you feel
    blacks first, and then americans. In Cuba the story is
    different. On the other hand, if my father is white and my
    mother is mulata, and both are cubans why can not I consider
    myself simply "cubano"? Why should I reject the fact that
    75% of me is european? and, that a 100% of my culture is
    cuban? After all, I do not speak "yoruba" or "caravali," my
    name it Rodrigo, I speak the same spanish that is spoken
    everywhere else in Cuba. Why should I feel that I am a
    traitor, when I am not? Please, understand, Diago, I am not
    saying it maliciously, but I was just born with a beautiful
    natural tan. That is all I feel about my color. Sorry, if it
    dessapoints you.




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