Hacker Chronicles 2/HACKER2.BIN/423.SF018074.TXT

Text File | 1993-02-05 | 18KB | 429 lines

SF-LOVERS Digest            Friday, 5 Feb 1993         Volume 18 : Issue 74

Today's Topics:

              Books - Niven (7 msgs) & Kim Stanley Robinson &
                      Vance (3 msgs) & Canadian Slave Magic

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Date: 19 Jan 93 16:30:20 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Ross Smith)
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: Re:   Niven and Female Aliens

[e-mail] (Bryant Durrell) writes:
>[e-mail] (Ross Smith) writes:
>>(I heard/read a rumour recently - wish I could remember where, that Niven
>>is actually planning to write "Down in Flames" for real. Anyone know
>>anything about this?)
>
>My failing memory tells me that Locus' upcoming book list mentioned an
>anthology titled _Down In Flames_ which would include the outline already
>published plus a bunch of other authors cheerfully destroying their worlds
>in similar fashion.  But then, that list doesn't have info that detailed
>so I think I'm wrong.  Maybe in the news section?

AHA! Yes, that's what I was thinking of. Thanks!

As someone else pointed out, there are too many inconsistencies in later
material (real Thrintun in one of the MKW yarns, a real singularity in "The
Borderland of Sol", etc.) to make it practical without major revisions.
Pity, it could have been fun...

In that case, does anyone know if Niven is ever planning to write any more
Known Space stories at all, apart from the odd contribution to the MKW
series?

Ross Smith
Wanganui, NZ
[e-mail]

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Date: 28 Jan 93 22:09:00 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Helge Thorsten Kautz)
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: Voodoo Game

Hey Folks,

Nobody told me that there's a new book by Niven and Pournelle, "The
California Voodoo Game". I discovered it yesterday in my bookstore!  What a
surprise! I like that kind of surprise :-)

I just love Niven + Pournelle (& Barnes, too)! Say, do you know if one of
them is on the Net, incognito or by real name? (Probably a FAQ).

Well, I think, if they were on the Net, they would get killed by Email...

Helge Thorsten Kautz
Duesseldorf, Germany
[e-mail]

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Date: 2 Feb 93 02:52:56 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Erik Max Francis)
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Voodoo Game

[e-mail] (Helge Thorsten Kautz) writes:
> Nobody told me that there's a new book by Niven and Pournelle, "The
> California Voodoo Game". I discovered it yesterday in my bookstore!  What
> a surprise! I like that kind of surprise :-)

_The California Voodoo Game_ is by Larry Niven and Steven Barnes, and has
been out for a while now; it originally came out in hardcover and has been
reissued in paperback.

Also, the publishers have reissued a number of the Niven and Pournelle
novels with new covers (to be like the cover of _The Gripping Hand_): I've
noticed _Oath of Fealty_, _The Mote in God's Eye_, and _The Legacy of
Hereot_ have new covers.  Quite frankly, I think they weren't worth the
change.

Erik Max Francis
1070 Oakmont Dr. #1
San Jose, CA  95117
..!apple!uuwest!max
[e-mail]

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Date: 3 Feb 93 00:08:57 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Peter Hunt)
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Voodoo Game

On a related topic, (or maybe not-so-related), what are the Dream Park
novels, and in what order should they be read? The ones I've seen are (I
think) - Dream Park, The Barsoom Project (both in pb), and Dream Park:
Voodoo Game (Trade pb). I'm not sure whether this last is the same as
California Voodoo Game ...

Can someone clarify this for me? Thanks in advance.

Peter Hunt
Networks and Comms (Aust)
Digital Equipment Corp.

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Date: 3 Feb 93 03:44:43 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Damien P. Neil)
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: Dream Park novels (was Re: Voodoo Game)

[e-mail] (Peter Hunt) writes:
>On a related topic, (or maybe not-so-related), what are the Dream Park
>novels, and in what order should they be read? The ones I've seen are (I
>think) - Dream Park, The Barsoom Project (both in pb), and Dream Park:
>Voodoo Game (Trade pb). I'm not sure whether this last is the same as
>California Voodoo Game ...

_Dream Park_ comes first, then _The Barsoom Project_. I never heard of
_Dream Park: Vodoo Game_, but if it exists (no reason for it not to) it
would be third.

I recommend reading _Descent to Anansi_ (sp?) before _The Barsoom Project_.
There are some references to _Anansi_ in _Barsoom_.

Good books. Mind candy, but good.

Damien Neil
Case Western Reserve University
[e-mail]

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Date: 3 Feb 93 06:59:56 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Erik Max Francis)
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Dream Park novels (was Re: Voodoo Game)

[e-mail] (Damien P. Neil) writes:
>_Dream Park_ comes first, then _The Barsoom Project_. I never heard of
>_Dream Park: Vodoo Game_, but if it exists (no reason for it not to) it
>would be third.

The third Dream Park book is _The California Voodoo Game_, and is now out
in paperback.

> I recommend reading _Descent to Anansi_ (sp?) before _The Barsoom
> Project_.  There are some references to _Anansi_ in _Barsoom_.

The title is _Descent of Anansi_; I found this book quite entertaining.  I
couldn't finish _The Barsoom Project_; perhaps I'll try again someday.

Erik Max Francis
1070 Oakmont Dr. #1
San Jose, CA  95117
..!apple!uuwest!max
[e-mail]

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Date: 4 Feb 93 19:08:38 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Chris Meadows)
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Voodoo Game

The Dream Park novels were Niven and Pournelle's answer to D&D.  They were
written back when Dungeons and Dragons was just becoming a craze.  The
premise is that they're set in a holographic amusement theme park (sort of
a precursor to the holodeck), and you go out and slay monsters.  Of course,
sometimes other things than monsters get slain...

The first novel is DREAM PARK.  Won't spoil it for you except to say that
of the two I read, I liked this one better.  It's a really fun read,
especially if you know anything about RPGs (Role-Playing Games).

The second novel is called THE BARSOOM PROJECT, "Barsoom" being what the
inhabitants of Edgar Rice Burroughs' Mars called their home planet.  I feel
it's not as good as the original, but it does make for a good read, and it
has several of the same characters from DREAM PARK in it, too.

I haven't read CALIFORNIA VOODOO GAME yet, so I can't say anything about
it.  However, I am looking forward to getting it, someday, and comparing it
to the others.  If it's half as good as the original DREAM PARK, then it's
going to be a lot of fun...

Chris Meadows
CHM173S@SMSVMA
[e-mail]
[e-mail]

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Date: 28 Jan 93 19:07:49 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Evelyn C Leeper [phone])
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: RED MARS by Kim Stanley Robinson (and also "Green Mars")

                     RED MARS by Kim Stanley Robinson
                   "Green Mars" by Kim Stanley Robinson
                     Book reviews by Evelyn C. Leeper

                      RED MARS by Kim Stanley Robinson

   Kim Stanley Robinson has taken a big subject, one might almost say
sprawling - the colonization and terraforming of Mars.  It is so big that
it needs three books, of which this is the first.  But this book is
independent enough to stand on its own.

   Robinson's works often derive from history or historical trends, and so
one isn't surprised to see that outlook brought to this book.  Yes, it is a
book about its characters, but it is about them as shaping (and being
shaped by) history.  Though the plot of the space colony torn between
loyalty/duty to the parent government(s) on Earth and desire for their own
freedom is scarcely new, Robinson lifts it above a simplistic parallel to
the American Revolution or some other familiar event.  It becomes its own
event, similar in some ways to earlier events, different in others.  He
deals with the idea that the Mars colonies will be in many ways less
heterogeneous than the American were, for example.  In many space
colonization stories, we see only the main characters, with everyone else
seeming to be sheep following the leaders of various factions.  In RED MARS
the later colonists are not sheep to follow the "First Hundred" blindly;
everyone is an individual and everyone has a point of view.  The politics
of the novel encompasses all the nations of Earth, not (as is all too
common) merely the superpowers.  The effort of the developing nations to
"get their share of the pie" is one of the main forces behind much of what
goes on in (and on) RED MARS.

   Robinson also assumes his characters know their history - discussions of
terraforming Mars are not the totally technical and scientific discussions
one has come to expect, but include references to projects and events which
affected Earth's environment.  RED MARS is an adventure story, true, but it
is not a simple-minded one and there is much to chew on.  It seems to be a
descendent of Heinlein's THE MOON IS A HARSH MISTRESS, only more
sophisticated and writ large.  More sophisticated because Heinlein stacks
his deck: he doesn't give any "responsible spokespersons for the opposing
view."  All Heinlein's characters speak "self-evident" truths ("why should
anyone trust someone else to license a doctor instead of making his own
decisions?")  that always work (the successful line marriages, clan
marriages, and other social structures in THE MOON IS A HARSH MISTREES work
because Heinlein writes them as working).  Robinson, on the other hand,
gives two, or rather all, reasonably balanced sides to every argument and
lets the reader decide.  Writ large, because Heinlein's Lunar colony is
fairly small and compact while Robinson covers, if not all of Mars,
certainly a substantial part.

   Not only are the philosophies and their expositions more sophisticated,
but the style is as well.  For example, Robinson's use of color is both
expected and surprising.  There are the Reds and the Greens, and we as
readers have some already-wired reactions to those names.  But here the
Reds are not the Communists or even the Russians, they are the
"environmentalists" who want to preserve Mars in its pristine state: red.
And the Greens want to terraform Mars to serve the people - a more Marxist
approach in a sense.  This total reversal of expectations is just one way
in which Robinson makes the reader think about his or her automatic
assumptions and quick reactions to certain words or phrases.  (Some of this
may be from having read "Green Mars" as well; I am not absolutely sure that
the Reds or the Greens are specifically named as such in RED MARS.  See my
review of "Green Mars" below for more details.)

   I definitely recommend RED MARS, and in fact intend to nominate it for a
Hugo.  (While the copyright date of this edition is 1993, the first
publication was in Great Britain in 1992, so this book is eligible for the
Hugo *this* time around.)

                   "Green Mars" by Kim Stanley Robinson

   People have told me that Kim Stanley Robinson has said that this will
not be part of his "Mars" trilogy, but his interview in LOCUS last year
says that it was certainly the first step toward writing it.  Even if he
does not incorporate the text into one of the three novels, "Green Mars"
will clearly remain a part of the same timeline.  The basic story of "Green
Mars" is of a group of people climbing Olympus Mons, but the real beauty is
in the filling in of detail for the world around the volcano.  You are *on*
Olympus Mons, but you see all of Mars, not only at this instant, but also
its past and its future.  Thus may sound like Jorge Luis Borges's "Aleph,"
so let me make clear that I am not talking about the climbers finding some
magical window - I am saying that the story is that magical window for the
reader.

   I am sure a rock climber would appreciate the descriptions and details
of the climbing itself, but even a person whose only exercise is opening
the door to the library will enjoy this novella.  If you are reading
Robinson's "Mars" trilogy starting with RED MARS, this is a must-read as an
adjunct to that.

Title:     Red Mars
Author:    Kim Stanley Robinson
City:      New York
Date:      February 1993
Publisher: Bantam Spectra
Comments:  trade paperback, US$11.95 [1992]
Order Number: ISBN 0-553-37134-7
Pages:     519pp
Series:    Mars
Volume:    1

Title:     Green Mars
Author:    Kim Stanley Robinson
City:      New York
Date:      1988
Publisher: Tor
Comments:  paperback, US$2.95 [1985]
Order Number: ISBN 0-812-53362-3
Pages:     113pp
Series:    Mars; Tor Double
Volume:    ?; 1

Evelyn C. Leeper
[phone]
[e-mail]

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Date: 22 Jan 93 03:32:35 GMT
From: [e-mail] (Christopher L. Davis)
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Jack Vance recommendations?

[e-mail] (Torkel Franzen) writes about The Demon Princes novels, and
>  Another superb Vance series is the Planet of Adventure series (4
>volumes).  These exist, or at least they existed, in an omnibus volume.

Torkel is correct about the above series.  It is actually called:
Tschai: Planet of Adventure.  The books are as follows:
 City of the Chasch
 Servants of the Wankh
 The Dirdir
 The Pnume

My paperbacks are quite old, but the story is quite good.  I will try to
summarize.

An Earth ship is shot down over a planet that has been newly discovered and
is being investigated (inhabited planet, that is).  The ship is shot down,
and (ugh my memory is quite fuzzy here) somehow the story ends up being
about a single human, Adam Reith and his adventures in trying to get back
to Earth.  It seems that there are humans on Tschai (the planet), and have
been there for quite some time.  No one believes Reith about Earth.  Four
races have split up Tschai and govern those areas.  Each has fostered a
different beginning for man that portrays man as a servant of the "greater
race".  The book is the story of Reith's trials and travails against these
races and his trying to get home.  Well, that's pretty much it.  Doesn't
sound like much, but I consider it a great story.  Check your local used
book store.

Chris Davis
[e-mail]

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Date: 2 Feb 93 14:17:57 GMT
From: [e-mail] (C Revie)
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: Jack Vance Cadwul Book 3 is out in UK

Well the title about says it all really. It's called Throy and it is
published in large format paperback (and one presumes hardback as well),
published by New English Library.

Chris

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Date: 29 Jan 93 16:47:30 GMT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: New Fanzine coming

   I am currently writing/compiling an e/snail-mail fanzine dedicated to
the works of Jack Vance.  I plan to complete the first issue by Mid-March
and am looking for possible subscribers and/or submitters for it.  I will
be making e-mail versions in ps, AMIPRO, and ascii formats.  I'll also do
TeX if I can find a ps to TeX converter.
   I have no idea right now what production costs will be, and so have not
decided upon what a good subscription rate might be.
   I am looking for reviews, analysis, parodies, and whatever else people
wish to submit, which I decide is appropriate, and I can get legal
permission to do.  I plan to print older discussions of Vance from various
sources which most people haven't had a chance to see before.  (The first
issue will have a reprint of Russell Letson's introduction to _Light from a
Lone Star_).  I also will be putting in bibliographic information for
English and translated editions of Vance's work.
   Let me know what y'all think.

Gregg  Parmentier
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 20 Jan 93 05:16:25 GMT
From: atlantis![e-mail]
Reply-to: [e-mail]
Subject: Canadian Slave Magic

I just got finished reading two books, both (not coincidentally - it's
Aurora time again) by Canadian authors, both fantasies.  Snowbrother by
S.M.  Stirling, and Greenmagic by Crawford Kilian.

Both of them had certain features in common.  Specifically, there were two
races, one of which was militarily inclined, and had a magic that suited
that inclination - straightforward, mostly, and geared towards practical
and often destructive ends.  The other race was more pacifistic, tried to
live in harmony with nature, and had a magic that also sought this
resonance with nature.  The military race took the other race as slaves
quite commonly.

I don't think it's spoiling too much in the plots of both books to say
that, by and large (in Snowbrother it's more ambiguous) the slave race are
the more sympathetic, but the master race also have their own system of
thought, and can't understand how their slaves think, nor the basis for
their magic.  The slaves' magic, while more subtle than the masters', does
prove effective to some extent (moreso in Greenmagic than Snowbrother).

Comments?  I guess what I'm driving at is - is this tiny subgenre of
fantasy a distinctly Canadian phenomenon, or can non-Canadian examples be
found as well?  And, Crawford, I'd be interested in what led you to come up
with the configuration you did, if possible...

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End of SF-LOVERS Digest
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