8bitfiles.net/archives/archives.tar/archives/genie-commodore-file-library/CompSysCBM/070996A.TXT/text0000.txt

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>I use to run a BBS on a c64 using Color 64 BBS.  We even had a network
>setup, man that was something!  Are there any old Color64 Sysops out
>there?

Hi,

You can call at this ColorBBS: 514-471-1762

It run a modified version of ColorBBS with 85Megs HD.
Located in Montreal, Canada.

Snap


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.pitt.edu!newsflash.concordia.ca!feed.umontreal.ca!news.polymtl.ca!music.=
mus.polymtl.ca
From: Snap <$[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: How to connect to internet with a C64?
Date: 09 JUL 96 03:32:20 EST
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique de Montreal
Lines: 25
Sender: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <Pine.A32.3.92.960703235318.164=
[e-mail]> <4rg0lk$[e-mail].=
au> <4rrena$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: music.mus.polymtl.ca

>> that people confuse the two?
>
>Alas, I'm afraid it is.  In fact, it appears to be a lot worse than that.
>When I was looking for a shell account in the Montreal area a few months
>ago, I was actually told by a couple of service providers that in order =
to
>access the internet I'd need all of:
>
>    - SLIP or PPP
>
>    - Netscape
>
>    - a 14.4 Kbaud modem or higher
>
>This is getting ridiculous.
>
Hi!

I have my shell account in Montreal! Got it from polytechnique
of Montreal. Your chance is to know someone that is student
at this school.
Do you talk French btw?

Bye!
Snap

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From: [e-mail] (Lelio Pacino)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: c64 to pc serial
Date: 9 Jul 1996 07:49:54 GMT
Organization: Dipartimento di Informatica, Universita' di Pisa
Lines: 10
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <4rt2v2$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: helen.cli.di.unipi.it
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

It may be a common question.......but i have a printer (star NL-10)

with detachable interface for c64, now i want to use it with my pc (seria=
l port

I think),so i need know how to make compatible signals (c64 is not standa=
rd
 serial), have you any possible electronic schema? Thank you.

=20

                                   Lelio  Pacino
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nXS.uu.net!saix!usenet
From: [e-mail] (Adrian Bartel)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: Question/CP/M
Date: Tue, 09 Jul 1996 07:15:52 GMT
Organization: The South African Internet Exchange.
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <4rt0jp$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: qtts-bartelar.telkom.co.za
X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.0.82

Dennis Brew <[e-mail]> wrote:

>I load the cpm disk into the 128 and at the A> prompt I type in the name=
 of=20
>the file and put in the disk with the program then press return but it=20
>can't find the program on disk.

Can you you the files when you do a directory listing of the disk? (in
CPM mode, of course)

The other replies give good advice on possible problems.


Cheers
Adrian



--------------------------------------------------------------
  "It does not do to leave a live dragon
   out of your calculations."      -- Tolkien
--------------------------------------------------------------

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From: Seamus <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: comp.emulators.cbm,comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: Name this song, please
Date: Tue, 09 Jul 1996 09:24:02 +0100
Organization: BT Labs, Martlesham Heath, Ipswich, UK
Lines: 22
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <4rlsjq$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: brains.gfms.bt.co.uk
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (X11; I; SunOS 4.1.4 sun4m)
Xref: pravda.aa.msen.com comp.emulators.cbm:12388 comp.sys.cbm:57647

Ping wrote:
>=20
> Hi
>=20
> Can anyone give me the name of the song of Pengo Patch (Pengo) ?
> I heard it on the radio yesterday and I want to have it, but
> I don't have its name.
> It goes something like this: tick tack tick tock tuck, tick tack tick t=
ock ...
>=20
> Please help me
>=20
> Christoph
-------------------------------
The original arcade version of Pengo used the "Ode To Joy" - Beethovens
9th symphony as its theme tune. I've not played the c64 version of the
game since it first came out so I'm not sure if this uses the same
tune or not.

hope this helps

Seamus
--------------------------------
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eed-1.peachnet.edu!news.Gsu.EDU!panther.Gsu.EDU!gs03jaf
From: Andrew Freck <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: WTB: Commodore Colt PC
Date: Tue, 9 Jul 1996 00:11:23 -0400
Organization: Georgia State University
Lines: 24
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
References: <4rkapk$[e-mail]> <4rn8e3$[e-mail]=
s.prodigy.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: panther.gsu.edu
Mime-Version: 1.0
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NNTP-Posting-User: gs03jaf
In-Reply-To: <4rn8e3$[e-mail]>=20

On 7 Jul 1996, Josh Spatz wrote:

> What is a Commodore Colt?
>=20
>=20
>=20
It's a Commodore brand PC-clone...

-Drew
      __          __          ___         __
 THE / /\        /_/\        / / \       /_/\
    / / /     __ \ \ \      / / _ \   __ \ \ \
   / / / __  /_/\ \ \ \    / / /_\ \ /_/\ \ \ \
  / / / /_/\ \ \ \ \ \ \  / / /  / / \ \ \ \ \ \
  \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \_/ /__ \ \ \ \ \ \=20
   \ \ \/ / /  \ \ \/ / /  \ \   ___ \ \ \ \/ / /
    \ \ \/ /    \ \ \/ /    \ \ \ \_\/  \ \ \/ /=20
     \ \  /      \ \  /      \ \ \       \ \  /
      \_\/        \_\/        \_\/        \_\/
 ///             JOHN ANDREW FRECK              \\\
 |||   Aspiring College Radio DJ (WRAS ATLANTA) |||
 \\\  [e-mail] OR [e-mail] ///


#! rnews 1492
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coast.net!swidir.switch.ch!scsing.switch.ch!news.rccn.net!master.di.fc.ul=
.pt!caravela.di.fc.ul.pt!i19948
From: Carlos Miguel Pereira da Silva <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Need info on drives
Date: Tue, 9 Jul 1996 11:38:02 +0100
Organization: Faculdade de Ciencias da Universidade de Lisboa
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <[e-mail].p=
t>
NNTP-Posting-Host: caravela.di.fc.ul.pt
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=3DUS-ASCII

I'm interested in a drive for my C64, and since i never had one, i'll try=
=20
to but the recommended one.
So i ask which are the C64 drives available, their differences and what=20
is your recommendation on the best.
Best regards,
Carlos

                        (~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~=
)
Be Happy,                )    ___ ___ _  _ _  _ ___  __  __  ___ ___    (=
 =20
doing the write thing!  (      |  |_  |\ | |\ | |_  (__ (__  |_  |_      =
)
                         )     |  |   | \| | \| |      )   ) |   |      (
And don't forget:       (      ~  ~~~ ~  ~ ~  ~ ~~~  ~~  ~~  ~~~ ~~~     =
)
Write bounces back!      )   Email: [e-mail]         (
                        (                                                =
)
                         ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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!newsmaster
From: [e-mail] (St=E9phane)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: MoEBIUS (free to 4th caller)
Date: 9 Jul 1996 11:19:51 GMT
Organization: Galeode
Lines: 19
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <4rtf8n$[e-mail]>
References: <4remrs$[e-mail]> <4rg9si$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: jonc.galeode.fr
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=3DUS-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

In article <4rg9si$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>

>
>I tryed something like this. I offered to give away programs to anyone w=
ho=20
would
>send a box with return postage. I offered over 500 disks...
>
>Two people responded, one guy doesn't even get on line. He heard about i=
t on=20
his
>LoadStar disk.
>
>Al
>
??? such a pity. I wish I was here when the message was posted. And that =
I'll=20
be there the next time ;-)
--=20
How much wood would a woodchuck chuck, if a woodchuck could chuck wood ?

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it!sirio.cineca.it!NewsWatcher!user
From: [e-mail] (Andrea MILOCCO)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: How to transfer files from PC to C64?
Date: Tue, 09 Jul 1996 13:37:21 +0100
Organization: Sincrotrone Trieste
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <milocco-0907961337220001@140.105.4.232>
References: <4rcep2$[e-mail]> <milocco-0507961828030001@140.=
105.4.232> <4rs2po$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mac-linac-1.elettra.trieste.it
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.1.2

> >For the software there is now available on-line a LIST of a TELECOM BA=
SIC
> >program which name is XMODEM64: it uses xmodem protocol to transfer fi=
le
> >through the user port; you can download the file at this address:
>=20
> >ftp://ccnga.uwaterloo.ca//pub/cbm/telecomm/xmodem64.zip
> >ftp://ccnga.uwaterloo.ca//pub/cbm/telecomm/xmodem64.readme
>=20
> Thank you!  That is _exactly_ what I wanted to know.  I tried to reply
> to you through e-mail, but I kept getting bounced.
>=20

This is the second time someone have problems to email to me; I'm sorry
but I don't know the reason: I have my mail server at work and it should
ever work!

> There is one problem:  That file is apparently corrupted, and I cannot
> unzip it.  I e-mailed the administrator.
>=20

I have downloaded the file and it works, but anyway...

> If anyone has a copy of this file, could they please e-mail it to me?
> Thanks.
>=20

I will send you the file by separate mail. If anyone think I should post
it also to this group, let me know and I will sure do it

################################################################
# /\       |\/|                                                #
#/--\ndrea |  |ILOCCO          Trieste, ITALY                  #
#                                                              #
# ELETTRA, Syncrotron Facility                                 #
#                                                              #
# e-mail: [e-mail]                           #
# http://superciuk.elettra.trieste.it:8080/~tomicich/team.html #
#                                                              #
# office: ++39/40/375.8244                                     #
################################################################
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From: [e-mail] (St=E9phane)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: MoEBIUS (free to 4th caller)
Date: 9 Jul 1996 11:22:01 GMT
Organization: Galeode
Lines: 22
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <4rtfcp$[e-mail]>
References: <4remrs$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: jonc.galeode.fr
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=3DUS-ASCII
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.7

In article <4remrs$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] says...
>
>This time I'll give away  MoEBIUS (C=3D64) ... used, still in the box, u=
ntried=20
by me.
>Contains two disks, pamphlet, player ref card.
>
>Maybe the winner can pay the postage but if you feel you can't, I'll pay=
 it=20
because
>this is just for fun.  I'll mail it right away to the winner and notify=20
everyone here.
>
>If this works OK, I'll do another right afterward.  If it makes everybod=
y=20
mad, I'll
>quit it.  No catch. Just for fun!
>
>Jim Self
Hey, this is really fun !=20
There must be a third one, so I am.
Good luck to your offer, Stephane
--=20
How much wood would a woodchuck chuck, if a woodchuck could chuck wood ?

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From: [e-mail](Michael J. Novak Jr. )
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: FS/T: Commodore 64/128/Vic-20 items  [07/09/96]
Date: 9 Jul 1996 12:09:34 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 223
Message-ID: <4rti5u$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: clv-oh5-04.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Tue Jul 09  7:09:34 AM CDT 1996

All VGA FS/T lists are updated weekly and are available on the WWW at
http://www.io.com/~vga2000/


This list was last updated on 07/09/96
--------------------------------------
NOTE: Screen shots of some of these games are available on my
web site.


I have the following Commodore 64/128/Vic-20 software, hardware,
and accessories for sale or trade.

There are a few items that are listed as untested.  When I bought
these items I was told that they all worked, but due to a lack of
time, I have been unable to test them myself.


SALE CONDITIONS:

 1)  Sales are first come, first served.  For faster service, please
     include your full postal mailing address in your reply.

 2)  Everything is sold as is.  Unless specified, all games and
     systems have been tested and are in working order.  I very
     rarely sell items that aren't working, but if I do, they are
     clearly labeled as such.

 3)  Trade offers, in particular for items that I need, will be
     given priority (especially if the trade offer overwhelms me).
     I collect for over 40 different systems, so please feel free
     to send me a trade list.  Ask for my want lists!

 4)  Buyer has ten (10) days to send payment, and pays all shipping
     costs.  Shipping cost depends on both the weight of the order
    nd the distance that the order must travel, unless set
     amount is already listed.  No orders will be sent C.O.D.

 5)  No package deals on games or systems.  All prices are clearly
     listed.

 6)  If you have a problem with the listed price, please remember
     that nobody is forcing you to buy from me.  My personal
     philosophy is that something is only worth what someone is
     willing to pay for it.

 7)  Payment must be made in U.S. funds, by either check or money
     order, drawn from a U.S. bank branch.  Orders from outside the
     U.S. are also accepted.

 8)  I reserve the right to refuse any sale or trade offer, and to
     correct mistakes made while typing this message.


SOFTWARE:

NOTE:  If the company name isn't listed, then the game was released
by the same company as the system.

NOTE:  All cartridges are loose (ie. without box and manual), unless
specified.

NOTE:  Since all cartridges are used, some labels will have small
defects.  Major defects will be listed.


COMMODORE 64 COMPUTER:
----------------------
Loose cartridges, no box, manual, or overlays:
$ 9.00     Fast Load (Epyx)
$ 5.00     Jupiter Lander
$ 5.00     Kickman
$ 4.00     Magic Desk I
$ 5.00     Music Composer
$ 6.50     Omega Race
$10.00     Q*Bert (Parker Brothers)
$ 5.00     Speed/Bingo Math

Complete cartridges.  With box, and manual:
$ 7.00     Kickman



COMMODORE VIC-20 COMPUTER:
--------------------------
Loose cartridges, no box, manual, or overlays:
$ 4.00     Avenger (#1901)
$ 4.00     Omega Race (#1924)
$ 3.50     Radar Rat Race (#1910) -- no label
$ 5.00     Super Slot (#1904)
$ 4.00     Speed Math / Bingo Math (#1933)

Loose cartridges with manual.  No box:
$ 6.00     Cosmic Cruncher (#1922)



Accessories:
$ 9.00     Commodore 64 User's Guide (167 pages, with Quick
            Reference Card)
$ 9.00     Commodore 64 User's Manual (207 pages)
$ 9.00     Commodore 64C Personal Computer System Guide: Learning to
            program in BASIC 2.0 manual (198 pages)
$12.00     Commodore 128 System Guide (404 pages)
$ 9.00     Commodore 1541 Disk Drive User's Guide (70 pages)
$ 7.00     Personal Computing on the VIC-20: a friendly computer
            guide (164 pages).
$19.00     Vic-20 Programmer's Reference Guide (289 pages).
$ 5.00     Vic-20 RF connector cable/box -- not RF switchbox
$ 7.00     Vic-20 User's Guide (170 pages).
$10.00     VicModem (Model 1600) [300 BAUD]
$ 9.00     Star SG-10/15 Dot Matrix Printer Users Manual





HARDWARE:

-----
NOTE #1 FOR THOSE BUYING SYSTEMS:  If you buy certain systems (they
are marked) you will have the option of buying a BRAND NEW RF
switchbox for $5 that is virtually identical to one sold at Radio
Shack for $7, plus tax.  It allows for the connection of both 300 OHM
and 75 OHM antenna lead-in's.

If you already have an RF switchbox, most systems will work fine with
it.  Some systems still include one, please read carefully.
-----

NOTE:  The Lots listed below include only what is listed!


LOT #1

*NEW* RF SWITCHBOX PURCHASE OPTION

COMMODORE 64 COMPUTER with box, and power supply.

This is a complete system, except for RF switchbox and RCA cable.

$29.00


*****


LOT #2

*NEW* RF SWITCHBOX PURCHASE OPTION

COMMODORE 64C COMPUTER with power supply.

This is a complete system, except for RF switchbox and RCA cable.

$39.00


*****


LOT #3

*NEW* RF SWITCHBOX PURCHASE OPTION

COMMODORE 128 COMPUTER with power supply.

This is a complete system, except for RF switchbox and RCA cable.

$64.00


*****


LOT #4

CITIZEN 120-D DOT MATRIX PRINTER, with built-in power cord, User's
Manual, and all attachments.

This item has not been tested.

$34.00


*****


LOT #5

RITEMAN LQ [model LTR-1] TERMINAL PRINTER (InfoRunner / Japan
Electronics Ind., Inc.), with built-in power cord and manual.

This item has not been tested.

$24.00


*****


To reserve an item listed here, please contact me.

Please include a list of the items that you are interested in,
and your full postal mailing address.  Thank you!


Michael J. Novak Jr.
[e-mail] -- for quickest response
[e-mail]
[e-mail]

--=20
Michael J. Novak Jr.      BUYING / SELLING / TRADING systems and games fr=
om:
Video Game Advantage      3DO, Atari, NEC, Nintendo, Sega, Sony, as well =
as
6861 Anthony Lane         all Classic video game and Classic cartridge ba=
sed
Parma Hts., OH  44130     computers, for over 2 years on the Internet!
[phone]  Voice     Visit us on the WWW at  http://www.io.com/~vga2=
000/
for FS/T & Want lists, FAQ's, Screen Shots, Collecting tips and much more=
...

For current list, or to be placed on my e-mail list, please leave E-Mail =
at:
[e-mail]   OR   [e-mail]   OR   [e-mail]=
t.edu

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voicenet.com!goodnews.voicenet.com!omni1!decibel
From: [e-mail] ()
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: WTB: ActionReplay CArt!
Date: 9 Jul 1996 13:39:31 GMT
Organization: Voicenet - Internet Access - [phone]
Lines: 3
Message-ID: <4rtnej$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: omni1.voicenet.com
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

looking to buyan ActionReplay Cart mk 5 or mk 6, anyone want to see their=
s
also looking for othe C64 equipment and in the market for a CMD REU

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From: [e-mail] (Larry Mullaly)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Apple //e trade for C128
Date: 9 Jul 1996 14:52:24 GMT
Organization: SkyPoint Communications, Inc.
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <4rtrn8$[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: mirage.skypoint.net
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]


I am looking to trade an Apple //e system for a Commodore 128 system with
someone in the Minneapolis/St. Paul area.  Here is what I would like to
trade: =20

Enhanced Apple //e with 128K=20
Super serial card=20
Two Disk ][ drives
Apple color monitor=20

In exchange for: =20

Commodore 128 computer=20
Two 1571 Disk drives (I might also take 1541 drives instead)=20
1701 color monitor=20
All associated power supplies and cables=20

If interested leave me mail at [e-mail]
=20
=20

=20
=20
=20
=20


--

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h.xlink.net!rz.uni-karlsruhe.de!news.uni-stuttgart.de!cipdd097
From: [e-mail] (Daniel Dallmann)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: How to connect to internet with a C64?
Date: 9 Jul 1996 15:05:54 GMT
Organization: Students' Computer Pool at the University of Stuttgart (Ger=
many)
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <4rtsgi$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
NNTP-Posting-Host: indcip1.ind.uni-stuttgart.de
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

Aaron Baugher ([e-mail]) wrote:
> ...
> everything is graphical on those platforms.  However, on PC's for
> example, there is DOS TCP/IP SLIP software that has text-based clients
> for mail, news, etc.; it's just not commonly used anymore.  A nice
> elm-ncftp-tin-telnet text-based setup would be very nice on the
> Commodore without graphics.

You know, that there already is something like that (and available for=20
free !!)

look at http://wwwcip.rus.uni-stuttgart.de/~etk10217/proj.html
               (129.69.21.101)

bye
  Daniel

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.honeywell.com!usenet
From: Brian Heyboer <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: 1526 printer ribbons?
Date: Tue, 09 Jul 1996 12:48:30 -0400
Organization: Honeywell Space Systems
Lines: 22
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George Szaszvari wrote:

> I've just acquired a Commodore 1526 Centronics printer (with interface.=
)
> Please tell me where I might obtain replacement ink ribbons for it. The
> bulky ribbon cartridge (one, half-used, came with the printer) seems
> unusually shaped....any leads much appreciated.

The 1526 is no a Centronics printer.  Are you sure that's what you have? =
 There was an=20
IEEE-488 version (connector looks like Centronics but shorter -- 22 pins =
rather than 36),=20
I think its the 4023.

Assuming it is a 1526 or 4023 (if I have the number right), the ribbon is=
 the same as a=20
Mannesman Tally Spirit 80.  Most stationary stores have a ribbon list the=
y can order from,=20
and the Spirit 80 is listed by most manufacturers, but not always the CBM=
's.

BEWARE that some are selling inked ribbons for use in these printers in a=
ddition to the=20
carbon-film ones.  They are not designed for that -- stick with the carbo=
n-film ones even=20
though they are more expensive to use.  Ribbon type is usually a code in =
the ribbon=20
listing -- be sure to check.  The 1526 has square pins and very little sp=
ace between pins=20
and head.  Carbon-film ribbons don't leave a residue in the pins, but ink=
ed ribbons DO. =20
This will cause the pins to stick and the resultant increase in power req=
uired to "fire"=20
the pins can damage the head.
#! rnews 1452
Path: pravda.aa.msen.com!news1.best.com!news.texas.net!news.kei.com!news.=
mathworks.com!uunet!inXS.uu.net!rcogate.rco.qc.ca!altitude!Ocean.CAM.ORG!=
not-for-mail
From: [e-mail] (Ismael Cordeiro)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: How to connect to internet with a C64?
Date: 9 Jul 1996 11:17:28 -0400
Organization: Communications Accessibles Montreal, Quebec Canada
Lines: 20
Message-ID: <4rtt68$[e-mail]>
References: <[e-mail]> <Pine.A32.3.92.960703235318.164=
[e-mail]> <4rg0lk$[e-mail].=
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Keith Pomakis ([e-mail]) wrote:

> Alas, I'm afraid it is.  In fact, it appears to be a lot worse than tha=
t.
> When I was looking for a shell account in the Montreal area a few month=
s
> ago, I was actually told by a couple of service providers that in order=
 to
> access the internet I'd need all of:

>     - SLIP or PPP
>     - Netscape
>     - a 14.4 Kbaud modem or higher

There aren't many ISPs in the Montreal area offering shell account but
at least Communications Accessibles Montreal and Pubnix Montreal offer it.

Ismael
--=20
         +---------------------------------------------------------+
         | ISMAEL CORDEIRO            | [e-mail]             |
         | Montreal - Quebec - Canada | http://www.cam.org/~ismael |
         +---------------------------------------------------------+