"Free form" : sometimes called 'noise' and non-structural because it'd
be difficult to find structure in
the only piece itself but maybe in the whole bunch of works.... The
musician can be free of anything
but of his own history - as a listener,
player, composer and improviser, the more complicated and freely treated
it is, the more his music is flux,
an individual process continually complementing itself. That may be
called 'structure' and also
the individuality of every musician.
And talking about scripting, what do you think of Braxton's schemes? (I
don't know
if there is some stuff written about these so maybe anyone can clue
me?)
> I only bring up that it's highly structured noise because so many untrained listeners just lump it as "noise" and dismiss stuff like that as pure garbage, people just goofing off, when it's as structured and difficult (or more difficult) as the average Beethoven sonata.
> he told us they only let him play on three songs so far, because that's all he had learned at that point. The idea being, here's this disc (I was totally into Soul Discharge at the time) that was so fucking wacked, and yet, it was sculptured enough that even this avant leaning, and I assume technically able, guitarist couldn't just pick up and play along.
> I saw the record release party tonight. Very good show! [snip]
> Anyone else see the show?
Well, yeah, me.
My general feeling was that I'd had Friedlander's Topaz figured all wrong, and this having never even heard them. I'd simply read some lazy journalists' prose dubbing this as Erik's "Miles-influenced" electric project.
Like hell. I found this to be a really swell worldfusion band, in the same continuum that ranges at least from Shakti to Pachora. At times I was amazed at how the alto sax and cello could sound like the same instrument (with my eyes were closed, I sometimes couldn't tell Andy Laster and Erik apart).
At other times, when Friedlander and Laster played the same notes in different octaves, the two combined sounded like an accordion played by a single player. And on an inspired cover of Julius Hemphill's "Skin 2," it seemed fairly ingenius to have the cello play the bass line while the electric bassist played the melody in unison with the alto sax player...
Aside from that, bassist Stomu Takeishi played impossible stuff on (fretted but sounding fretless) electric bass, as only he can. Percussionist Slatoshi Takeishi played a great deal of music on a few hand drums, a few frame drums and a few brake drums, sitting on the floor all the while. He made me want to take tabla lessons right away.
Didn't have enough scratch on the way out the door to buy Erik's Topaz disc (see http://www.siamrecords.com). The journalist with whom I'm exiting Tonic asks "you still pay *money* for new discs?"
Yes, I'm afraid I do, and at the moment can't even comment online... ;-P
Last I had heard (from Dave Douglas himself), the new "Strings" disc was supposed to come out in November of '98. Anyone know when it may see the light of day?
> Last I had heard (from Dave Douglas himself), the new "Strings" disc was supposed to come out in November of '98. Anyone know when it may see the light of day?
>I'll echo the previous comments about Meshuggah's _Chaosphere_ and Gorguts'
>_Obscura_ . These are two of the most amazing techno/thrash metal albums i've
>heard in quite a while. Absolutely brilliant stuff...
Previous Gorguts material was good, but not this good... the first album was very by-the-numbers death metal. The second, "The Erosion of Sanity," hinted at what was to come, but the greatness of "Obscura" is unparalleled in my opinion...
>I'd have to agree, in general, other than Naked City = complexity, Pain Killer =
>aggression + volume, and Meshuggah = complexity + aggression + volume. But
>that's a massive oversimplification.
As I mentioned in my earlier message, the comparison was only because I was asked to describe the band related to Zorn... I agree it is oversimplifying things, but you hit the idea behind my description right on the head!!
>For me Meshuggah exists in a sort of techno-thrash metal continuum that follows
>in the progression of Voivod and Fear Factory - note that that's just *my*
>conception: there are plenty of gaps in my knowledge of contemporary metal,
>though it's an area I'm currently really addressing (going through a divorce can
>have that effect on you!).
Voivod are another great band... I love every album with the exception of "Angel Rat." I actually got some nice Voivod bootleg videos a few weeks back...
>I am going quite mad searching NYC for anything by Candiria. You wouldn't think
>it would be so hard given that they're from Brooklyn.
You can get the album at http://www.relapse.com
>I look forward to hearing both Meshuggah and Candiria live at the March Metal
>Mayhem festival in Asbury Park, NJ on March 12-23. Sepultura is headlining. I
>don't know any of the other bands. There will also be professional wrestlers
>and a porn queen as MC. Whoopee...
I'll be there!! Gorguts are also playing!!
>Think I'll check out Gorguts.
>NP - Gorguts, "Nostalgia," _Obscura_ (RealAudio soundbite on Amazon.com)
> Voivod are another great band... I love every album with the exception of "Angel Rat."
Agreed.
> >Think I'll check out Gorguts.
> >NP - Gorguts, "Nostalgia," _Obscura_ (RealAudio soundbite on Amazon.com)
>
> So what did you think of the sample?
Enough to want to hear more, though clearly 30 second mono clips in crappy RA quality are a hard thing to base an opinion upon! Same holds true for the Candiria and Soulfly clips I checked out.
At this point, for the sake of the rest of the Zornlist, we should probably conduct any further posting on this thread privately.
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
NP - the sounds of hammering in an adjacent apartment undergoing renovation... gah!
> A good place is actually the Downtown Music Gallery. There is a buy who works there along with Bruce (I think his name is Mike) that stocks specialty metal items in the shop and will order most stuff for you.
GAHHH!!! How the hell did I forget Emperor Mike? Must be because he's been pretty quiet on most recent DMG newsletters.
I'll go looking for the new Lethal Zone... it was recommended to me back when it was Lethal Wear but that location closed before I could check it out. Thanks for the other tips.
>I've heard it and I love it. It can get a little mechanical sounding, but
>then a human element pops up and surprises you. Some of it is reminiscent
>of Peter Gabriel's Last Temptation Score.
Speaking of which, I just got "Passion Sources" in the mail today, which is the original music that inspired Passion (one of my all time favorite albums!).
>I like City alot too but the additional production and "slower" songs
>make it less appealing to me.
I love the "slower" songs. I think they are as heavy as the faster material... and you are going to be hard pressed to find a much faster or more intense song than "Home Nucleonics."
> >been away for a while, so I'm kind of falling in into this thread. I
> >think comparing Meshuggah to Zorn stuff is impossible when trying to
> >match genre-like parallels.
>
> I suppose you missed that portion of the thread, but the Meshuggah-Zorn comparison came about as a result of someone actually asking us to describe Meshuggah with reference to Zorn, so I made the Naked City/Painkiller - Meshuggah comparison because it s
eemed most appropriate when considering
Zorn's body of work.
>
And as the guy that asked, I have to say that I do grok the
comparison. I've laid hands on some Meshuggah (and some
Gorguts, and some Strapping Young Lad) since I asked, and I can
see the similarity in the spirit of musical abandonment, if not
> Even straighter is The Sonny Clark Mem'l Quartet w/ Horvitz,
Previte, and
> Ray Drummond, on Black Saint. No one ever mentions this one; its
> definitely straight but very good. I feel repetitive b/c I've
mentioned
> this one before, but anyway...
Is this still in print? I haven't been able to find it anywhere.
Eric
==
"We live ... lives based upon selected fictions. Our view of reality is conditioned by our position in space and time -- not by our personalities as we like to think. Thus every interpretation of reality is based upon a unique position. Two paces east or west and the whole picture is changed."
Local Boston guitarist Issi Rosen released a disc last year, The Red Sea. Very un-zornish (no squeaks, shreiks, dirges, ...et al) but, if Masada like includes a blending jewish folk and american jazz (trad. guitar/bass/drums trio in Issi's case) I'd say what the hey - Red Sea is an excelent, imho, disc.
Now when are the new Frisell and Waits recordings hitting the bins? I've given up (almost) on a re-release of additional Evan Lurie discs, although and very happy with the new African Swin/Manny & Low sndtrk by John Lurie. Pure genius.
> Now when are the new Frisell and Waits recordings hitting the bins?
Don't remember when the Waits is due to drop, but the ex tells me Frisell's "Good Dog Happy Man" is due in June if I remember correctly. It's Frisell, Krauss, Keltner, Horvitz, I think a pedal steel player whose name I've forgotten (help me, Jody), and Ry Cooder on a track or two.
> > Now when are the new Frisell and Waits recordings hitting the bins?
>
> Don't remember when the Waits is due to drop, but the ex tells me Frisell's "Good Dog Happy Man" is due in June if I remember correctly. It's Frisell, Krauss, Keltner, Horvitz, I think a pedal steel player whose name I've forgotten (help me, Jody), and Ry Cooder on a track or two.
Jerry Douglas? Not really a pedal steel player (in that he plays Dobro),
but he has played with Frisell before ...
>
> Steve Smith
> ssmith36@sprynet.com
> NP - Alanis Morrisette on the Grammies
I saw/heard some of that. I must say, I never heard her before and
based on this introduction I'll be slow to return. Perhaps I'm
> Jerry Douglas? Not really a pedal steel player (in that he plays Dobro),
> but he has played with Frisell before ...
Uh-uh, not him.. Jerry Douglas I'd have remembered. I heard the "Nashville Trio" (Frisell, Douglas and Krauss) about a year ago in Brooklyn... Douglas made an indelible impression. No, the pedal steel player (?) in question here is a new name to this list, if I'm recalling correctly.
> > NP - Alanis Morrisette on the Grammies
>
> I saw/heard some of that. I must say, I never heard her before and
> based on this introduction I'll be slow to return. Perhaps I'm
> just a fuddy-duddy.
No, you're not. I'll admit that in general I'm pretty impressed by Alanis, as pop music goes. And, given that reservation, the song Alanis performed, "Uninvited" (from the otherwise useless "City of Angels" soundtrack, if I recall correctly) was better on the record than it is live.
So perhaps *I* am the "fuddy-duddy" you fear yourself to be... after all, while I struck out in such categories as jazz and rap and metal, the votes I cast in the "Big Four" categories (Record of the Year, Song of the Year, Album of the Year, Best New Artist) were all winners - Celine
Dion with "My Heart Will Go On" for the former two, and Lauryn Hill for the latter two.
