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From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest)
To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Zorn List Digest V3 #175
Reply-To: zorn-list
Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Zorn List Digest Wednesday, November 22 2000 Volume 03 : Number 175
In this issue:
-
sharp knife
Re: All that electro-acoustic discussion and the avant-garde, etc.
e# syndaKit
Re: All that electro-acoustic discussion and the avant-garde, etc.
Odp: electroaccoustic dressed up as the vanguard
Re: Gratkowski / electro-acoustic arguments / avant harmonica?
singer/picker DANNY BARNES (Bad Livers, etc) - *LIVE* 11/24-25
Mac help (no Music content)
Mac help (no Music content)
Ribot guest appearance on local CD/Intro
Gratkowski dates
Re: Gratkowski dates
stockhausen on music (was: Re: electroaccoustic dressed up as the vanguard )
Re: Gratkowski / electro-acoustic arguments / avant harmonica?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 18:06:59 +1100
From: "Lee, Edgar" <Edgar.Lee@dva.gov.au>
Subject: sharp knife
Kevin Sharp still lives in the USA. He only tours with Damaged, who are from
Ballarat, Australia. The drummer from Damaged previously played in a
grindcore band called Blood duster who were named after a Naked City track.
The original and best Damaged singer Jamie Ludbrook later played in
Australian versions of Cobra.
Edgar
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 10:16:25 -0000
From: "Bill Ashline" <bashline@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: All that electro-acoustic discussion and the avant-garde, etc.
>From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
>OK, let's go for a cheap shot:
>He [Stockhausen] describes the evolution of point music in PUNKTE and
>KONTRA-PUNKTE. The approach was criticised by philosopher Theodor Adorno
>for
>its lack of structure. "I said, but Professor, you are looking for a
>chicken
>in an abstract painting. That's when I began to have my doubts about
>intellectuals and so-called specialists..." Adorno was "not basically a
>creative person".
Ouch Patrice. I should have seen that one coming. But then we've been here
before and I've stated that I'll NEVER defend Adorno on music. Stockhausen
is basically right to have doubts about intellectuals, but before he throws
in the towel altogether, he should give the "Dialectic of Enlightenment" a
round or two.
>From: Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com>
>As they say, in theory there is no difference between theory and practice,
>but in practive there is.
Fair enough, Joseph, but for me good theory is "music" to my ears, which I'm
glad to have been able to train myself to "hear." ;-)
>From: "Jim McLoughlin" <jim@intelligenesis.net>
>Also for those dubious of contemporary harmonica innovation, I recall a
>Young Philadelphians show (Ribot, Zorn, Tacuma, Weston) where Zorn played
>harmonica as the group moved from a free-funk thing into an outrageous C&W
>style stomp. Is that avant-garde? If not, at least it's some token Zorn
>content...;-)
Good questions Jim. I always "read" Zorn as a kind of postmodernist who
derived his aesthetic out of a grand pastiche, at least until Masada, which
was more synthetic. Postmodernists gave up on the avant-garde, probably for
good reason, sensing there wasn't anything more to be done with it.
>From: "William York" <william_york@hotmail.com>
>You mean, you are a professional internet discussion group theorist? Or
>something else? Because I tried to look and see if you had any other
>writings by searching the net and that was all I could find. Just curious,
>really.
You're curious eh? Well no. None of my theory is available on the
internet. Only via direct mail on data CDRs. Though I am looking for an
American distributor. My hope is that by keeping my intellectual work off
the internet, I won't have to deal with copyright violations were it to be
stolen. In the meantime you will have to do with my limited contributions
to this site, carried out between marking some rather dull papers.
;-)
_____________________________________________________________________________________
Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 11:17:48 +0100 (MET)
From: zxmqq16@student.uni-tuebingen.de
Subject: e# syndaKit
hi all,
i just resubscribed to the list after months of not being here, so i dont
know what was going on lately.
anyways: i had the chance to play live with mr. elliot sharp one week ago
and have to say that it was a great musical and personal experience. here
in tuebingen, germany we performed his piece SyndaKit with a bunch of
local musicians. Great stuff!!! If you have the chance, everybody
interested in E#s work should try to get his/her hands on the limited to
400 copies CD of the SyndaKit performance at the Knitting Factory. And
those of you being able to read music: Get the scores from his official
website, so that you have the chance to completely understand the idea
behind the piece.
Anyways, if you have the chance to see SyndaKit live, go and have fun.
It=ABs an experience, close to seeing Mr. Zorn perform one of his game
pieces.
Bjoern
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 10:52:56 -0500
From: Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com>
Subject: Re: All that electro-acoustic discussion and the avant-garde, etc.
On Tue, Nov 21, 2000 at 10:16:25AM -0000, Bill Ashline wrote:
> >From: Joseph Zitt <jzitt@metatronpress.com>
>
> >As they say, in theory there is no difference between theory and practice,
> >but in practive there is.
>
> Fair enough, Joseph, but for me good theory is "music" to my ears, which I'm
> glad to have been able to train myself to "hear." ;-)
I agree... but I find that the theory flows best when it gets so far
away from practice that it becomes its own beautiful, abstracted
glass bead game. But then, I always enjoyed mathematics in inverse
proportion to how useful it appeared to be.
- --
|> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <|
| jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt |
| Latest CD: Jerusaklyn http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt |
| Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List |
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 17:33:30 +0100
From: "Marcin Gokieli" <marcin.gokieli@mospan.pl>
Subject: Odp: electroaccoustic dressed up as the vanguard
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Patrice L. Roussel <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
> intellectuals and so-called specialists..." Adorno was "not basically a
> creative person".
Which proves that Stockhausen was an intelligent one.
> Review of the book STOCKHAUSEN ON
> MUSIC: LECTURES AND INTERVIEWS in
THE
> WIRE, May 2000 (06/27/00)
Is there any way of getting the book ? Is it currently available (sorry
for bothering, but with internet connection in poland it's sometimes hard to
search the web)
Marcin Gokieli
marcin.gokieli@mospan.pl marcingokieli@go2.pl
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 11:57:04 -0500
From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Gratkowski / electro-acoustic arguments / avant harmonica?
JonAbbey2@aol.com wrote:
> all that being said, I've been enjoying quite a few trumpet recordings
> lately, the Bill Dixon ones I mentioned here a little while ago, the so=
lo
> Kelley, and some live recordings of Axel D=F6rner with Kevin Drumm. not=
sure
> what that means exactly...
Perhaps it's a reflection of something Joe McPhee told me yesterday in an
interview about his own work. He says he gravitated towards the saxophon=
e,
among other reasons, because the trumpet (his first instrument) and its p=
layers
have always lagged behind the saxophonists in terms of sheer innovation a=
nd
boundary stretching. Perhaps you're gravitating towards trumpeters tryin=
g to
close the gap... In the cases of Kelley and Dorner this would certainly =
seem to
be the case. They're doing things timbrally that I've not heard before.
Perhaps there's more room for the kind of sheer innovation and surprise y=
ou're
not finding in the sax world, where the tradition from Pharoah and Ayler =
through
Parker and Brotzmann to Butcher and Gustafsson has pushed the sonic envel=
ope
about as far as it can go, technique-wise. The same could be said for Ni=
nh in
re: percussion, perhaps. Just a thought.
Steve Smith
ssmith36@sprynet.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 08:51:43 -0800
From: "James Kirchmer" <jamesk@telisphere.com>
Subject: singer/picker DANNY BARNES (Bad Livers, etc) - *LIVE* 11/24-25
Hi, just a quick shout out here to all you folks out there
in internet-land who might live in/near SEATTLE, WA -->
(or, if ya have a friend there, do consider fwding this info to
'em! - they'll give new meanin' to the word "thanksgiving" ;)
---> Danny Barnes, the Texas-bred American singer &
picker extraoridinaire (of the BAD LIVERS & "Bill Frisell's
Willies" fame, among *MANY* other fine acts/projects....
including a just-released "solo" record on Cavity Search -
[ www.cavitysearchrecords.com ~ www.dannybarnes.com ]
- - not to mention the fact that he's Frisell's banjo teacher...)
---> will be playing LIVE at Seattle, WA's "historic"
(and currently rapidly "improving" - i.e. - better sound :)
** RAINBOW ** this upcoming Thanksgiving weekend.
Here's the skinny:
** ON FRI. ~AND~ SAT., NOV 24th & NOV 25th ------->
* "THEE OLD CODGERS" will open each night, and feature:
Danny Barnes - vocals/banjo
Keith Lowe (Zony Mash, Bill Frisell, etc., etc.) - bass
Jon Parry - fiddle (ex-Goosecreek Symphony, 78-rpm)
* "THEE HEATHEN" headline each night, and feature:
Danny Barnes - vocals/electric guitar!
Keith Lowe - electric bass (see above)
Dan Tyack - pedal steel! (ex-Asleep at the Wheel!)
Andy Roth - drums (Zony Mash)
* AT: THE RAINBOW - 722 NE 45th St. (by I-5 / U-District)
Club phone: 206-634-1761 / website: www.therainbow.cc
* TIME: 10pm start each night
* COVER: $6 (bargain city, folks!!!!)
* AGES: 21+
* (beer/liquor/smoke available!)
***** SPECIAL - $2.50 MICROS ALL WEEKEND! *****
The music you'll ^hear will start out with a bit of bluegrass,
(^disclaimer: Danny tends to be a "genre" all unto himself! ;)
with the mostly acoustic THEE OLD CODGERS, and slowly
morph into a wicked mix of classic American music -- all the
way from the "tear in your beer" kinda thang -- to ac/dc-ish
"beer in the air" sorta craziness, so to speak, courtesy of the
absolutely *honkin* *cryin* and *rockin* THEE HEATHEN,
perhaps best described by the following media quote.....
=======
DANNY BARNES & THE HEATHEN
(Owl 'n' Thistle) What a treat it has been to hear Danny Barnes
(Bad Livers, Old Codgers) pick up his electric guitar once again
with this phenomenal new band, starring Zony Mash's rhythm
section and pedal steel ace Dan Tyack. It's simply a case of
Danny wanting to use "the right wrench for the job" -- as many of
his songs, both old and new, call for the kinda muscle his trusty
old banjo just ain't got. He's also breathing new life into classic
country tunes and rockin' covers of the likes of the MC5 and
Roky Erickson. In sum, welcome to Americana bar-band heaven.
- - (The STRANGER, Seattle - "UP & COMING" sec. - 12/23/99)
=======
......and best explored further by visiting the websites related
to these mighty fine musicians, for starters:
www.dannybarnes.com (music is good. period.)
www.cavitysearchrecords.com (see Danny Barnes)
www.sugarhillrecords.com (see Bad Livers)
www.tyacktunes.com (pedal steel ace Dan Tyack)
www.moonliner.com (bassman Keith Lowe)
www.78-rpm.com (Jon Parry's bluegrass crew)
www.zonymash.com (Keith & Andy's "other" band)
Thanks for listening, and have a happy Thanksgiving!
Sincerely, James K.
Seattle, WA, USA
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 18:39:45 +0800
From: "Rob, the Belgian Guy" <Rob@llaert.NU>
Subject: Mac help (no Music content)
Zorn-agains,
Since all of us have left the wicked world of pop in search of musical
truth, I assume many of us did the same thing on a virtual scale and
converted to the gospel of Macintosh after a life of Microsoft addiction.
Being a new convert I would to ask someone to be my Macintosh mentor.
Respond privately.
Thanks brothers,
Rob Allaert
Rob@llaert.NU
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 18:39:45 +0800
From: "Rob, the Belgian Guy" <Rob@llaert.NU>
Subject: Mac help (no Music content)
Zorn-agains,
Since all of us have left the wicked world of pop in search of musical
truth, I assume many of us did the same thing on a virtual scale and
converted to the gospel of Macintosh after a life of Microsoft addiction.
Being a new convert I would to ask someone to be my Macintosh mentor.
Respond privately.
Thanks brothers,
Rob Allaert
Rob@llaert.NU
- -
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 19:29:50 -0000
From: "Les Rhoda" <les_rhoda@hotmail.com>
Subject: Ribot guest appearance on local CD/Intro
This kinda wavers off topic here, but if you are as far from Downtown NYC as
I am here in Portland, ME, little things like this give a momentary lapse of
Mainedom...
Excerpted from our local arts rag, the Casco Bay Weekly:
DARIEN BRAHMS GOES SWEET, SOUR, AND SOLO
As veterans of Portland's music scene know, Darien Brahms,
chanteuse/guitarist of the Latin-lounge-rock combo the Munjoy Hill Society,
had a long, if intermittent, solo career before she boarded the Smirnoff and
sailed into the hearts of local music fans. Now, Brahms is jumping overboard
with the release of "Little Bundle of Sugar," her first album under her own
name in nearly a decade.
- -snip-
Though she's still part of the Society, Brahms' new album explores several
other musical styles with the help of Munjoy Hill crewmates Matt Staples and
Paul Chamberlain, drummer Ginger Cote of Coming Grass fame, esteemed session
guitarist **Marc Ribot** (who appears on two tracks) and others. [asterisks
added]
- -snip-
Brahms financed the album with $1,000 she won last spring from what she
calls her "semi-successful appearance" on "Paranoia," a game show on the Fox
Family Channel.
- -----------------
Apparently Ms. Brahms knew a bassist who had worked with Ribot and just
cold-called him for the session. That is cooler than Canada Dry.
Although I use this list for educational purposes and not to spout off, I
guess I'll give a quick introduction- my name is Les, I live in Portland,
ME, and play saxophones and samplers in a couple of bands. My project is
called Shortly After Takeoff, a 12 piece improvisational
house/jungle/ambient/tribalistic trancefusion freakout (A swell cat, that
Ribot. He even supplied me with a perfect name for a band), the other a
funk/soul/reggae band called Sly-Chi.
I've been on this list before and have been lurking for quite a while. Zorn
and Frisell are two of my heroes (thought I must admit I have not been into
buying much of Bill's recent mellower stuff. Eventually... but not now.) I'm
also into Negativland, John Oswald, the Droplift Project, and their ilk.
BTW, if any of you nonprofiting collectors out there have an imperfect yet
blissed-out tape of Frisell playing a solo show at Scullers 4/9/96, that
came from me! (I'm going to burn in hell, I know...)
... I did once hear a rumor that Zorn has a brother who is a lawyer here,
though none list in the phone book....
Back to lurk-n-learn,
Les
A resident of Munjoy Hill
_____________________________________________________________________________________
Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 15:29:27 -0500
From: "Jim McLoughlin" <jim@intelligenesis.net>
Subject: Gratkowski dates
Hi
As a tangent to my last post, I thought I would post some tour date info I
received for Gratkowski . He isn't sure of the venue in all cases, but
provided contact info. The Empty Bottle show in Chicago looks
intereesting...
November
20. East Hampton (CT)
21. Boston (MA) Zeitgeist Gallery (I think it's in Cambridge)
25. Montreal (QC, Canada) (with Sam Shalabi git., Alexandre St-Onge bass and
Alex MacSween drums) info: <lxndr@CAM.ORG>
26. Guelph (Ontario,Canada) info: "Jesse" <jazzfest@uoguelph.ca>
28,29. Carrboro (NC) one set solo one with the MicroEastCollective
info:"Walter Davis" <aimjazz@altavista.net> or "Ian Davis"<idavis@nc.rr.com>
30. Athens (GA) Workshop
December:
1. Athens (GA) Concert info:"Julie Powell" <jpowell@arches.uga.edu>
2. Atlanta (GA) info: "Milton Jones" <murphyjones@earthlink.net>
3. Nashville (TN) info: VoightKampff@hotmail.com
5. Portland (OR) info: "Laura+Brad Winter" <LauraW@ocf1.org>
6. Chicago (IL) Empty Bottle (with Fred Lonberg-Holm Cello and Jim Baker
analog synth.)
8. Madison, (WI) (Duo with Scott Fields git.) info:"Scott Fields"
<scottfields@berbee.com>
9. Detroit (MI) (Duo with John Lindberg bass) info:<pfrisco@hotmail.com>
10.Minneapolis (MN) info:"Jon Morgan" <morga041@tc.umn.edu>
JM
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 13:54:45 -0800
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <proussel@ichips.intel.com>
Subject: Re: Gratkowski dates
Should be a great show since (cherry on top of the cake) Frank will
play with Seattlelites Michael Bisio and Eyvind Kang!
On Tue, 21 Nov 2000 15:29:27 -0500 "Jim McLoughlin" wrote:
>
> 5. Portland (OR) info: "Laura+Brad Winter" <LauraW@ocf1.org>
December 5, 8:00pm at First Christian Church (1315 SW Broadway)
Patrice.
- -
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 23:56:45 -0600
From: "sergio luque" <sergio@tomate.com.mx>
Subject: stockhausen on music (was: Re: electroaccoustic dressed up as the vanguard )
"Marcin Gokieli" <marcin.gokieli@mospan.pl> asked:
>Is there any way of getting the book ? Is it currently
>available
yes (it seems easy to get) and yes.
_stockhausen on music: lectures and interviews_
compiled by robin maconie
isbn: 0714529184
marion boyars
reprint edition (may 1, 2000)
____________________________________________________________
sergio luque sergio@tomate.com.mx
- -
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 13:27:58 +0100
From: "Andreas Dietz" <andreasdietz@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Gratkowski / electro-acoustic arguments / avant harmonica?
>From: Steve Smith <ssmith36@sprynet.com>
>
>Perhaps it's a reflection of something Joe McPhee told me yesterday in an
>interview about his own work. He says he gravitated towards the saxophone,
>among other reasons, because the trumpet (his first instrument) and its
>players
>have always lagged behind the saxophonists in terms of sheer innovation and
>boundary stretching. Perhaps you're gravitating towards trumpeters trying
>to
>close the gap... In the cases of Kelley and Dorner this would certainly
>seem to
>be the case. They're doing things timbrally that I've not heard before.
In this vein there┤s a trumpet player from Vienna: Franz Hautzinger. He┤s
doing really unusual things with his instrument and combines it with
electronics. Definitely worth checking out...
Andreas
_____________________________________________________________________________________
Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com
- -
------------------------------
End of Zorn List Digest V3 #175
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