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zorn-list Digest         Friday, June 27 1997         Volume 02 : Number 084



In this issue:

    Upcoming ION releases
    Re: Upcoming ION releases
    dougie
    nashville
    Re: nashville
    Re: nashville
    Material
    Need dates
    Re: Need dates
    Zorn article?
    Re: Zorn article?
    Re: Zorn article?
    eric friedlander
    Re: Zorn article?
    albinees
    painkiller
    Zorn's aesthetic
    Ikue Mori
    Bacarach/Zorn readings
    Re: Material
    Re: Material
    Re: Ikue Mori
    Re: eric friedlander
    The Tzadik website
    Does anybody know the line-up for the Masada Montreal show?
    Questions
    Re: Questions
    Re: Ikue Mori
    Re: Zorn's aesthetic
    Re: albinees
    Kronos Quartet
    RV: Kronos Quartet
    Re: Kronos Quartet
    Switchbox CD
    Re: Questions
    Info about John Zorn box... (fwd)
    Re: Questions
    Re: Kronos Quartet
    john zorn show?
    Masada Live CD, etc.
    Re: Masada Live CD, etc.
    RE: Masada Live CD, etc.
    Re: Masada Live CD, etc.
    Re: Masada Live CD, etc.

See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the zorn-list
or zorn-list-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 11:04:23 -0400
From: Sean Terwilliger <[e-mail]>
Subject: Upcoming ION releases

Hey All,

These are listed at the Caroline web site. Any ideas as to release date?
Any clue as to what ELIXER is?

ION  CD ION 002003   ELIXIR  HEGALIEN
ZONE                                       611688200325   1598A
15.98

ION  CD ION 002004   DEATH CUBE K   DISEMBODIED
611688200424   1598A
15.98

Also, Jeff, any word on the status of the US releases for the Douglas
stuff? Praxis? I'm real excited about the Skopelitis Bjorkenheim
release.

- -Sean

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 09:38:09 -0700
From: Jeff Spirer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Upcoming ION releases

At 11:04 AM 6/13/97 -0400, Sean Terwilliger wrote:
>Hey All,
>
>These are listed at the Caroline web site. Any ideas as to release date?
>Any clue as to what ELIXER is?
>
>ION  CD ION 002003   ELIXIR  HEGALIEN
>ZONE                                       611688200325   1598A
>15.98

This is DXT and a few other people (I am in NYC for the Praxis concert and
don't have my notes with me) doing some spacey turntable stuff.  I should
have a tape next week and can report more.

>
>ION  CD ION 002004   DEATH CUBE K   DISEMBODIED
>611688200424   1598A
>15.98

Buckethead doing the dark ambient thing, Bill plays bass and there is
someone else I think.  Once again, I should be able to tell more next week.

>
>Also, Jeff, any word on the status of the US releases for the Douglas
>stuff? Praxis? I'm real excited about the Skopelitis Bjorkenheim
>release.

Douglas is working on a US distribution deal.  I don't know when it will be
done.  The Skopelitis Bjorkenheim thing is really good.


Jeff Spirer
Axiom/Material
www.hyperreal.com/axiom/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 13 Jun 97 15:37:51 EDT
From: M.Ho <[e-mail]>
Subject: dougie

I'm having the worst time finding the Dougie Bowne-Hopkins-Medeski
disc. Can anyone help?

- -Mary.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 14 Jun 1997 23:46:49 +0100 (BST)
From: N Vassiliou <[e-mail]>
Subject: nashville

Frisell's Nashville is out for some time now. Has anybody listened to it?

Nick V.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 14 Jun 1997 19:29:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: nashville

In a message dated 97-06-14 18:53:12 EDT, [e-mail] (N Vassiliou)
writes:

>
>  Frisell's Nashville is out for some time now. Has anybody listened to it?
>
>  Nick V.

Yes, I love it!!! It still blows me away what he can do.  I mean the way he
can fit into any musical setting, still sounding like "Frisell", yet nothing
he plays sounds out of context.

Jody

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 15 Jun 1997 08:59:21 -0400
From: "ALAN E. KAYSER" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: nashville

N Vassiliou wrote:
>
> Frisell's Nashville is out for some time now. Has anybody listened to it?
>
> Nick V.
If you are familiar with the previous "Quartet" release and such CDs as
"Have a little faith" then it is not a great leap toward "Nashville."
It is excellent.  Frisell is certainly not afraid to take chances, and
most of what he does is worth hearing.  There is almost a straight line
from way back to his Vernon Reid duos up to Nashville, fans need not
worry!
Alan

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 16 Jun 1997 10:44:31 -0500 (CDT)
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Material

CD Now lists two items by Material that I am curious about. The first is
called _No Day To Talk_, its on EFA/DNA records and is due next week.
The secon is an apparant re-issue of _Seven Souls_ on Triloka. Is this the re-
mix that was supposed to be on Meta last year?

- -Sean

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 16 Jun 1997 11:58:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Need dates

I'm finishing up a history of free jazz and improvised music, to be published
in early '98 by Greenwood Press. Could someone on the list please provide me
with the birthdates of Zorn, Bobby Previte, Wayne Horvitz and Fred Frith, and
the date of Sonny Sharrock's death? That's about all I need to polish off the
bio pages. Thanks!

- - Todd S. Jenkins, Executive Director, American Jazz Symposium

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 16 Jun 1997 17:00:30 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Need dates

On Mon, 16 Jun 1997 11:58:36 -0400 (EDT)  [e-mail] wrote:
>
> I'm finishing up a history of free jazz and improvised music, to be published
> in early '98 by Greenwood Press. Could someone on the list please provide me
> with the birthdates of Zorn, Bobby Previte, Wayne Horvitz and Fred Frith, and
> the date of Sonny Sharrock's death? That's about all I need to polish off the
> bio pages. Thanks!

Zorn: September 2nd, 1953

    Patrice.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 16 Jun 1997 17:09:26 -0700 (MST)
From: Corey Marc Fogel <[e-mail]>
Subject: Zorn article?

does anyone remember/have an essay written by Steve Albini where he
harshly criticizes Zorn for his inclusion in such a multitude of projects
that he doesnt necessarily have that much to do with, etc etc?

correct me if you know what i'm referring to and i've mixed up any of the
information.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 16 Jun 1997 17:17:55 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Zorn article?

On Mon, 16 Jun 1997 17:09:26 -0700 (MST)  Corey Marc Fogel wrote:
>
>
> does anyone remember/have an essay written by Steve Albini where he
> harshly criticizes Zorn for his inclusion in such a multitude of projects
> that he doesnt necessarily have that much to do with, etc etc?
>
> correct me if you know what i'm referring to and i've mixed up any of the
> information.

It was reproduced in an Italian magazine. Forgot where it got published
first.

The article showed that Albini had not the slightest clue of what Zorn
had done in the past 10 years... He could have written the same thing
in 1985 and would have been, at least, saying the same kind of blurb
that most journalists were writing on Zorn at that time.

    Patrice.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 16 Jun 1997 17:20:40 -0700
From: "Patrice L. Roussel" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Zorn article?

On Mon, 16 Jun 1997 17:09:26 -0700 (MST)  Corey Marc Fogel wrote:
>
>
> does anyone remember/have an essay written by Steve Albini where he
> harshly criticizes Zorn for his inclusion in such a multitude of projects
> that he doesnt necessarily have that much to do with, etc etc?

The article was published in THE WIRE 122.

    Patrice.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 15 Jun 1997 19:53:08 -0700
From: [e-mail] (dmr)
Subject: eric friedlander

does anyone have any info on eric friedlanders Avant release?  avalibility,
descriptions as well as other musicians involved.

thanks,

david

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 01:49:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: Christopher Hamilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Zorn article?

As Patrice wrote, the article's in _The Wire_ 122.  It's not written by
Albini; it's in a "blindfold test" type interview.  Albini criticizes Zorn
in discussing a Naked City piece the interviewer puts on.  As I read his
comments, the criticism is fourfold:

(1)  Zorn makes his money by having great musicians do their thing and
then
adding some basically trivial content of his own ("blowing a duck call
over them").

(2) Zorn hops around between different aesthetics.  He could not be fully
committed to all of them.

(3) Zorn also hops from band to band without allowing one project to
develop.

(4) Zorn takes his aesthetics from others, rather than developing one of
his own.

  I'm not sure I entirely agree with Patrice that the criticism couldn't
apply to the last ten years of Zorn's work.  (I don't think it does, but I
think it's mostly as reasonable now as it would have been in 1987.)  (1),
I suppose, is not plausible as a criticism of, say, Masada, but it's more
applicable to, say, _New Traditions in East Asian Bar Bands_, than it
would have been to, say, _The Classic Guide to Strategy_.  However, I seem
to recall reading someplace that Zorn typically gives/gave part of the
composer's royalties to his musician's, on the ground that they
contributed to the final composition through their playing.  Can anyone
back me up on this?

   I find (2) through (4) a lot more interesting.  One could imagine them
being applied not only to Zorn, but also to some other musicians whose
work I admire a lot:  Bill Laswell, Kip Hanrahan, Hector Zazou  .  .  .
My server's about to go down, so I don't have time right now to say why I
don't think these criticisms apply, but I'd be interested in hearing what
others think.  Perhaps this could foment a discussion.  The list's been
kind of dead lately.

   So here are the two questions raised by Albini's criticisms which I
find most interesting:  Does Zorn have a consistent aesthetic underlying
all his work?  Is it artistically important to have such an aesthetic?
I'll post more on this some time in the next couple of days if there's
interest.

Chris Hamilton



------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 09:21:15 +0100
From: cedric perrier <[e-mail]>
Subject: albinees

So here are the two questions raised by Albini's criticisms which I
> find most interesting:  Does Zorn have a consistent aesthetic underlying
> all his work?  Is it artistically important to have such an aesthetic?
> I'll post more on this some time in the next couple of days if there's
> interest.
>
> Chris Hamilton
>

I don't know what is "a consistent aesthetic underlying", but I think
anyone could easily answer that question by yes; zorn got obviously a
really personal style and sound and it's enough to define the identity
of a musician as we can call it and whatever postmodern he can be


this sound could easily be identify as the usual mix of dry hard bop and
postserial european music whatever cultural content he's throwing in it
(from napalm death to jewish tradition to...) even when he squeals and
crash whith say eye yamatsuka it's easy to recognize this zorn touch
which is probably his inner core of influence and his most ancient
aproach to music, so that we can by the way consider as his own style...
blah blah blah; anybody practicing music has a style anyway and it's not
a content question, I don't see why zorn shouldn't have one.


as an avid consumer of steve albini words and sounds I can as well say
that one shouldn't take too seriously what steve usually say to
magazines  as his taste for language  don't really go over metaphoric
level of putting fire in a trashcan or pissing down the street;

so I don't think albini's  beavis and buttheadish declarations should
constitute something of a debate, as he's just  trying to piss off pc
middle class americans like some of this zorn list, or worst (or best)
making them debate about nothing of particular interest.


so steve, well, fuck you and thanks

and for you all get to the point

faster!


best regards

cedric perrier
>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 16 Jun 1997 17:13:57 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Nathan M Earixson)
Subject: painkiller

Recently, someone metioned a Painkiller Cd called "Rituals".
I have never heard of it before, Can anyone give me some information on
this?


*****************************************
"The Universe, She is a Bitch."
*****************************************

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 11:10:19 -0400
From: Matthew Ross Davis <[e-mail]>
Subject: Zorn's aesthetic

At 9:21 AM +0100 6/17/97, cedric perrier wrote:
>So here are the two questions raised by Albini's criticisms which I
>> find most interesting:  Does Zorn have a consistent aesthetic underlying
>> all his work?  Is it artistically important to have such an aesthetic?

I believe that Zorn has a unique sense of aesthetic, and certainly a
profoundly personal one. This aesthetic is similar across certain genres of
music in which he works, but I hold that it is not consistent *inbetween*
these genres. Furthermore, I would say that this is one of the defining
characteristics of Zorn's style, plus it fits with his often cited short
attention span (which is also evidenced in his work) and extremely wide
area of musical interest.

For example, the identifiable aesthetic of "Blood is Thin" doesn't carry
over to "Sicilian Clan". Similarly, there is a consistency between the
Morricone interpretations and pieces on Filmworks, but these consistencies
don't necessarilly match the aesthetic of a piece like Carny or Red Bird.

On the other hand, there is a certain part of the music we'd like to call
"Zorn's" which isn't "Zorn's" at all. It's the same kind of thing that Cage
was about in divorcing the composer from the music - the elements of the
music making are more indicative of the performers involved than the
composer, per se. For instance, with Naked City we hear the aesthetic of
Frisell filtered through that of Zorn. Often times these aesthetics match
up with superb results, as in Masada.

This is one of the wonderful things about improvised music - that the
performer can infuse their own personality into the music in a way that can
be done in no other kind of music making.


| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
m-a-t-t-h-e-w r-o-s-s d-a-v-i-s                university of maryland
http://www.butterfly.net/mozart                       school of music
| | S | O | H | C | 4 | # | 3 | 6 | 5 | 7 | 9 | C | B | 6 | 5 | 0 | |

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 11:17:04 -0500
From: [e-mail] (Nathan M Earixson)
Subject: Ikue Mori

I picked up the Ikue Mori, Robert Quine, and  Marc Ribot
disc yesterday, and I can't stop listening to it.
What are Ikue Mori's Tzadic Releases Like?




*****************************************
"The Universe, She is a Bitch."
*****************************************

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 17:44:49 -0500
From: Mark Corroto <[e-mail]>
Subject: Bacarach/Zorn readings

check the latest Atlantic Monthly online
Re: Burt Bacarach as cult hero
and an archive article 1991 on JZ

http://www.theAtlantic.com/atlantic/issues/97jun/burt.htm

http://www.theAtlantic.com/atlantic/atlweb/jazz/dzorn.htm

mc

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 17:39:05 -0500 (CDT)
From: "[e-mail]" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Material

On Mon, 16 Jun 1997 [e-mail] wrote:

> CD Now lists two items by Material that I am curious about. The first is
> called _No Day To Talk_, its on EFA/DNA records and is due next week.
> The secon is an apparant re-issue of _Seven Souls_ on Triloka. Is this the re-
> mix that was supposed to be on Meta last year?

1)  _No Day To Talk_ is really by Materia (notice the absence of the
letter "l").

2)  Yes, it is a re-issue of the original with several (3?) remixes.

Out 2 Lunch With Lunch,eat,

Paul
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 16:45:24 -0700
From: Jeff Spirer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Material

At 05:39 PM 6/17/97 -0500, [e-mail] wrote:

>2)  Yes, it is a re-issue of the original with several (3?) remixes.

It is three remixes along with the original tracks.  All three remixes are
excellent, having listened to them several times now.  Also, the recording
originally called The Assassins will be released this year and will have
some more Burroughs.  It is now called Hashisheen: The End of Law and also
includes Peter Wilson, Ira Cohen, Patti Smith, Iggy Pop among others doing
spoken word, and music by Techno Animal, Paul Schutze, Sussan Deyhim, Anton
Fier, Nicky Skopelitis, Eyeless in Gaza, Helios Creed, and Bill Laswell.


Jeff Spirer
Axiom/Material
www.hyperreal.com/axiom/

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 08:27:22 +0000
From: Scott Russell <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Ikue Mori

- --MimeMultipartBoundary
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Nathan M Earixson wrote:
>
> I picked up the Ikue Mori, Robert Quine, and  Marc Ribot
> disc yesterday, and I can't stop listening to it.
> What are Ikue Mori's Tzadic Releases Like?


I have Hex Kitchen which is great. There are various ensembles all
playing different sounds. Mori's drum sounds are fascinating ranging
from textured, percussive snaps to full on Zappa-esque flatulent blats.
There are also bagpipes, things that sound like vacuum cleaners, guitars
and Zorn.The music reminds me sometimes of Synclavier era Zappa (that's
Jazz from Hell, Civilisation and bits of Meets the Mothers of
Prevention). It's quirky but with a great sense of structure. Mori seems
to be able to build layers and layers of sound each with it's own inner
complexity. But she's also got a sense of humour.

I'd love to hear the disc you mention, I take it it's Painted Desert
right?

Cheers

Scott Russell
- --MimeMultipartBoundary--

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 10:45:55 -0400
From: [e-mail] (Steve Smith)
Subject: Re: eric friedlander

>does anyone have any info on eric friedlanders Avant release?  avalibility,
>descriptions as well as other musicians involved.
>
>thanks,
>
>david

Friedlander's Avant release, like his Tzadik release, is played by Erik
with clarinetist Chris Speed, bass clarinetist Andrew d'Angelo, and bassist
Drew Gress.  Both are quite wonderful, in a dark chamber music kind of
style on Jewish themes.  Highly recommended if that description appeals.
Don't know if Koch has resolicited the Avant release yet but the Tzadik
should be widely available.

The Tzadik website is in progress and should be quite amazing... more
details when I get them.  We're talking graphics, soundbotes, text
descriptions, and the ability to either buy CDs direct or pay

Steve
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 11:11:27 -0400
From: [e-mail] (Steve Smith)
Subject: The Tzadik website

Sorry, ladies and gentlemen... for reasons beyond my control, the last
message got sent before I could finish my thought.  Here goes again...

The Tzadik website is in progress and should be quite amazing... more
details when I get them.  We're talking graphics, soundbites, text
descriptions, and the ability to either buy CDs direct from Tzadik or pay
to download music directly.  Zorn will have ultimate authority over
everything on the site including regular editorial input.  It should be up
in a month and will truly be a definitive site, much more than anything I
was able to do myself at Koch.  I'll keep you posted when I hear more...

Steve
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 21:59:34 +0000
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Does anybody know the line-up for the Masada Montreal show?

Hi,

I was wondering if anybody knows the line-up for Masada's show in
Montreal.

Thank you,
jeremy

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 10:34:14 -0400
From: Dave Brunelle <[e-mail]>
Subject: Questions

I had a couple of questions that I hope someonw can answer :

1. In the liner notes for Zorn's "First Recordings" he made mention of
re-releasing "Archery" on Tzadik last year. I assumed it was going to be
on the 3 CD "Parachute Years" set, but that never showed up. Does anyone
know what's going on with that?

2.  I read an interview with Mick Harris about a month and a half ago in
which he spoke of getting together with Painkiller in June. Does anyone
know the status of that either? He was going to play as Scorn in
Brooklyn last night, but he cancelled the show.

3.  Who was the drummer at the Praxis show last week? The recording at
Creative Time said her name was Sandra Blackman (I think). Truthfully,
from where I was, I couldn't see if it was a guy or girl! I was curious
who the drummer was, and what else she/he has done.

Thanks for any help anyone can give me.

Dave Brunelle

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 08:16:38 -0700
From: Jeff Spirer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Questions

At 10:34 AM 6/20/97 -0400, Dave Brunelle wrote:

>2.  I read an interview with Mick Harris about a month and a half ago in
>which he spoke of getting together with Painkiller in June. Does anyone
>know the status of that either? He was going to play as Scorn in
>Brooklyn last night, but he cancelled the show.

Verona, Italy on June 22.

>
>3.  Who was the drummer at the Praxis show last week? The recording at
>Creative Time said her name was Sandra Blackman (I think). Truthfully,
>from where I was, I couldn't see if it was a guy or girl! I was curious
>who the drummer was, and what else she/he has done.

Cindy Blackman.  Most well-known for playing with Lenny Kravitz, but now
likely to tour with Praxis, mostly in Europe.  Seeing her after the show
was surprising - she has very thin arms and it is hard to imagine how she
plays.


Jeff Spirer
Axiom/Material
www.hyperreal.com/axiom/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 15:36:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: Christopher Hamilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Ikue Mori

_Garden_ is probably my favorite non-Zorn release on Tzadik.  It's a solo
album focusing largely on overlapping drum machine sequences, although it
also includes samples and some non-electronic percussion.  If you like
Mori's work, or you're interested in electronic music, I'd highly
recommend it.

Chris Hamilton

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 16:07:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: Christopher Hamilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Zorn's aesthetic

On Tue, 17 Jun 1997, Matthew Ross Davis wrote:

> I believe that Zorn has a unique sense of aesthetic, and certainly a
> profoundly personal one. This aesthetic is similar across certain genres of
> music in which he works, but I hold that it is not consistent *inbetween*
> these genres. Furthermore, I would say that this is one of the defining
> characteristics of Zorn's style, plus it fits with his often cited short
> attention span (which is also evidenced in his work) and extremely wide
> area of musical interest.

I think the short attention span (is this still plausible as a description
of Zorn after _Redbird_?) manifests itself in more ways than just the
genre-hopping.  I see concision as being a longstanding theme in Zorn's
work.  The quick changes in _Cobra_, _Spillane_ and much of the Naked City
material are one example of this.  Each soundblock has to be concise, or
it won't have the chance to be developed.  The interest in hard-bop
compositions and Coleman's small-group compositions seems to be related in
that the written music in these cases typically consists of a short,
catchy head. (The Masada compositions obviously come in part from this
tradition.)  And, of course, film music also often involves a
severe
compression of musical material in order to fit the screen action.  This
is particularly evident in obvious Zorn influence Carl Stalling and in
Zorn arrangee Ennio Morricone.  And even much of Zorn's straight
free improv work is based on this idea.  For examples, see the
Stalling-like solo playing on _The Classic Guide to Strategy_ and the
short, punky improvs on _Locus Solus_.

> On the other hand, there is a certain part of the music we'd like to call
> "Zorn's" which isn't "Zorn's" at all. It's the same kind of thing that Cage
> was about in divorcing the composer from the music - the elements of the
> music making are more indicative of the performers involved than the
> composer, per se.

Absolutely.  But, like Cage, Zorn typically does impose a structure on the
way his musicians contribute.  The game pieces are the most radical
example of this, but I think it applies to something like the Masada
pieces too.  For contrast, think of projects organized by someone like
Derek Bailey, who leaves overall structures completely unpredetermined,
but does a lot to determine how they'll sound internally through his
own playing.  Actually, I think that the attempt to develop compositional
structures which give as much freedom as possible to the improviser while
still being ordered by the composer's personality is one of the unifying
themes of Zorn's work.  The file-card pieces and the use of the studio as
a compositional tool fit in here, I think.


Chris Hamilton

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 20 Jun 1997 16:22:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: Christopher Hamilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: albinees

On Tue, 17 Jun 1997, cedric perrier wrote:

> this sound could easily be identify as the usual mix of dry hard bop and
> postserial european music whatever cultural content he's throwing in it

I'm trying to think of a good counterexample to this, and, to my surprise,
I can't.  I think you're right that the hard-bop influence is (at
least in retrospect) evident in
his playing even in the early years when his work scarcely seemed to draw
on the mainstream jazz tradition.

> as an avid consumer of steve albini words and sounds I can as well say
> that one shouldn't take too seriously what steve usually say to
> magazines  as his taste for language  don't really go over metaphoric
> level of putting fire in a trashcan or pissing down the street;

Yeah, well, I know Albini mouths off a lot, and I don't really mean to
give him any credit for incisive criticism here.  I just think the
questions I drew from Albini's comments are genuinely interesting.

> so I don't think albini's  beavis and buttheadish declarations should
> constitute something of a debate, as he's just  trying to piss off pc
> middle class americans like some of this zorn list, or worst (or best)
> making them debate about nothing of particular interest.

Well, obviously I am interested in discussing Zorn's music.  If you're
not, you may not be on the right mailing list.  As far as who Albini's
trying to piss off, I'd imagine an article in _The Wire_ is more likely to
piss off Europeans than Americans, as it's published on your side of the
Atlantic.  I'm not sure how you've learned so much about the political
views and class identity of Americans on this list, but feel free to blow
it out your pompous, inbred European ass.

     Have a nice day, and thanks for the thoughtful response.


Chris Hamilton

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 21 Jun 1997 21:32:58 +1000
From: "Julian" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Kronos Quartet

I have recently been investigating the work of the Kronos Quartet... Does
anyone out there have any opinions on any of the quartet's work? Also, I
was interested to find their recordings of works by Zorn, Bartok and
Shostakovich...can anyone tell me of a collection which contains this
material?

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 21 Jun 1997 16:04:56 -0300
From: "cmurat" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RV: Kronos Quartet

- ----------
> De: cmurat <[e-mail]>
> A: Julian <[e-mail]>; Zorn List
<[e-mail]>
> Asunto: RE: Kronos Quartet
> Fecha: sßbado 21 de junio de 1997 16:01
>
> Here is some of what you want:
> Short Stories (Elektra 79310-2) J.Zorn:Cat O┤Nine Tails
> Winter was Hard (Elektra 79181-2) J.Zorn: Forbidden Fruit (originally
> released on
> J.Zorn┤s Spillane)
> Black Angels (Elektra 79242-2) D.Shostakovich: Quartet No. 8
> White Man Sleeps (Elektra 79163-2) B.Bartok:String Quartet No.3
>
> [e-mail]
>
>
> ----------
> > De: Julian <[e-mail]>
> > A: Zorn List <[e-mail]>
> > Asunto: Kronos Quartet
> > Fecha: sßbado 21 de junio de 1997 8:32
> >
> > I have recently been investigating the work of the Kronos Quartet...
Does
> > anyone out there have any opinions on any of the quartet's work? Also,
I
> > was interested to find their recordings of works by Zorn, Bartok and
> > Shostakovich...can anyone tell me of a collection which contains this
> > material?
> >
> >

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 21 Jun 1997 15:44:23 -0400
From: [e-mail] (Steve Smith)
Subject: Re: Kronos Quartet

>I have recently been investigating the work of the Kronos Quartet... Does
>anyone out there have any opinions on any of the quartet's work? Also, I
>was interested to find their recordings of works by Zorn, Bartok and
>Shostakovich...can anyone tell me of a collection which contains this
>material?

As I recall a barrage of pro/con Kronos sentiment posted here last year, I
think it's safe to say that yes, many people out there have very distinct
opinions on this group's work.  For myself, I think that whatever the
relative merits of their playing, they ARE providing a welcome service by
championing the living composer (and ever letting the world at large know
that yes, there ARE still living composers, for that matter).  Sure, they
do descend into kitsch, the comfortable exotica of world music, and fashion
on regular occasions, but for every PIECES OF AFRICA or "Purple Haze"
there's more than enough credible music to make up for it.  Of course, the
upcoming PIECES OF AFRICA II and ANCIENT MUSIC (new transcriptions of
ancient works by the likes of Hildegarde of Bingen - a dreadful New Age
arrangement IMHO) may tip the scles in the other direction.

You might try the two CD set RELEASED/UNRELEASED, one disc containing
samplings of many of their prior releases and one containing new,
previously unreleased material.  It's a pretty fair representation of the
group at its best and, sometimes, its worst.  The collection SHORT STORIES
I also find to be quite exceptional.

And I've always wanted to have a collection of the three Zorn quartets,
even if it meant the third repackaging of "Forbidden Fruit" and the second
of "Cat o'Nine Tails."  It would be worth it to have a recording of "The
Dead Man."  Of course, Nonesuch COULD also issue "The Dead Man" as a single
(they've done something like seven CD singles by Kronos so far)... that
way, you could stick the thing on shuffle play and create a new version
every time.  For those who don't know the piece, it's a tribute to Robert
Mapplethorpe in something like 40 short sections, and no performance is
supposed to include all of the sections.  I heard it twice in consecutive
evenings the year it was premiered and it was similar yet different each
time.

Maybe Tzadik could assemble a quartet to do just that... then we'd perhaps
have a basis for comparison.  Certainly the Kronos statute of exclusivity
has run out... it only lasts three years and "The Dead Man" dates from
1989...

Steve Smith
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Jun 1997 15:17:45 +0800
From: Jan-Wen Lu <[e-mail]>
Subject: Switchbox CD

There's a new CD of Frank Schulte's Switchbox-"Berge Du Berg Ich" reviewed
by "Wire" magazine this month. Released by Moers Music(Moers Music 03008
CD). With Anna Homler, David Shea, Tony Buck, Michael Moore, Axel Otto and
Martin Schutz. Sounds a great release!! Can anyone inform me any good
online mailorder distributor with this item? Thanks!!


- --
Jan-Wen Lu  E-Mail address: [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Jun 1997 12:47:12 -0400 (EDT)
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Questions

In a message dated 97-06-21 03:24:20 EDT, [e-mail] (Dave
Brunelle) writes:

>
>  3.  Who was the drummer at the Praxis show last week? The recording at
>  Creative Time said her name was Sandra Blackman (I think). Truthfully,
>  from where I was, I couldn't see if it was a guy or girl! I was curious
>  who the drummer was, and what else she/he has done.
>

She was Cindy Blackman.  She's well known for playing with Lenny Kravitz.  I
thought she was really good. She reminds me of Tony WIlliams at times.
 Although I think she could have used some more practice time with Praxis.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Jun 1997 09:51:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: [e-mail] (m. rizzi)
Subject: Info about John Zorn box... (fwd)

    Hi,
    I got this email from someone who isn't
    a member of the zorn-list. Can anyone
    more knowledgeable than I on this topic
    reply to him personally.

    Thanks,
    mike rizzi
    zorn-list-owner-from-hell

>From: "Valerio Uberti" <[e-mail]>
>To: [e-mail]
>Subject: Info about John Zorn box...
>Date: Mon, 16 Jun 1997 00:00:17 PDT
>
>Hi I'm Valerio from Italy.
>
>I heard something 'bout a 100 cd box set live that should be released
>this year by John Zorn.
>This (huge) box it's been recorded in China.
>Distributors here in Italy are collecting money 'bout
>pre-selling/booking, offering a special price if you pay in advance.
>The point is that there's no sign 'bout this box set...
>What is your comment/advice???
>Did you hear other info 'bout this box set?
>
>Thanks for your attention!!!
>
>email me back at [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Jun 1997 12:47:31 -0700
From: Jeff Spirer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Questions

At 12:47 PM 6/22/97 -0400, [e-mail] wrote:
>In a message dated 97-06-21 03:24:20 EDT, [e-mail] (Dave
>Brunelle) writes:
>
>>
>>  3.  Who was the drummer at the Praxis show last week? The recording at
>>  Creative Time said her name was Sandra Blackman (I think). Truthfully,
>>  from where I was, I couldn't see if it was a guy or girl! I was curious
>>  who the drummer was, and what else she/he has done.
>>
>
>She was Cindy Blackman.  She's well known for playing with Lenny Kravitz.  I
>thought she was really good. She reminds me of Tony WIlliams at times.
> Although I think she could have used some more practice time with Praxis.

There was only one practice session, the night before.  Since it looks like
she will be playing more, things should get a little tighter.


Jeff Spirer
Axiom/Material
www.hyperreal.com/axiom/

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Jun 1997 13:17:49 -0700
From: john shiurba <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Kronos Quartet

steve:
> And I've always wanted to have a collection of the three Zorn quartets,
> even if it meant the third repackaging of "Forbidden Fruit" and the second
> of "Cat o'Nine Tails."

there's at least one other Zorn string quartet; "Memento Mori" which (I
believe) was also commissioned by Kronos, or at least they premiered it.
- --



[e-mail]

http://www.sfo.com/~shiurba

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Jun 1997 01:45:14 -0400 (EDT)
From: [e-mail]
Subject: john zorn show?

does anyone know if john zorn will be playing in SF soon (e.g., this summer)?
info is greatly appreciated

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 27 Jun 1997 11:04:29 -0700
From: Mike Rizzi <[e-mail]>
Subject: Masada Live CD, etc.

While in Amoeba Music (Berkeley, CA) yesterday, I noticed a
reasonable stock of the Masada Live (Jazz Door - Germany)
"bootleg" CD's for $18.

Also, the Groove Yard (Oakland, CA) $11.98 sale on all in
stock Avant and DIW titles was extended until July 6th.
I've been having a ball filling in the holes of my Avant
collection this way. I'll write some reviews of my
purchase spree "one these days"[tm].

cheers,
m.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 27 Jun 1997 11:18:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: SUGAR in their vitamins? <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Masada Live CD, etc.

On Fri, 27 Jun 1997, Mike Rizzi wrote:

> While in Amoeba Music (Berkeley, CA) yesterday, I noticed a
> reasonable stock of the Masada Live (Jazz Door - Germany)
> "bootleg" CD's for $18.

this sounds like the same bootleg
i asked about a year ago. the
sound quality is good, but the
location and lineup are apparently
referenced incorrectly. i listen
to it often enough to say it
was worth buying.

> Also, the Groove Yard (Oakland, CA) $11.98 sale on all in
> stock Avant and DIW titles was extended until July 6th.

wow! too bad i won't be able to
make it up there before then.
bought a few things the last time
i was there during the sale.
does the extension include all
Soul Note titles?

hasta.

Yes.  Beautiful, wonderful nature.  Hear it sing to us: *snap*  Yes.  natURE.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 27 Jun 1997 11:37:15 -0700
From: Mike Rizzi <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: Masada Live CD, etc.

>> Also, the Groove Yard (Oakland, CA) $11.98 sale on all in
>> stock Avant and DIW titles was extended until July 6th.
>
>does the extension include all
>Soul Note titles?

    The postcard I got says that all Black Saint, Soul Note, Red,
    Improvising Artists, Philology and Ram CDs are $9.98 a disc.
    It also says that phone/mail orders welcome [phone]

    m.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 27 Jun 1997 16:58:41 -0500
From: "Glenn Astarita" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Masada Live CD, etc.

- ----------
> From: Mike Rizzi <[e-mail]>
>>
>     The postcard I got says that all Black Saint, Soul Note, Red,
>     Improvising Artists, Philology and Ram CDs are $9.98 a disc.
>     It also says that phone/mail orders welcome [phone]
>
>     m.
>
>
>
>
> FWIW,, Tower is having a sale on all Soul Note, Black Saint, Songlines
and Allegro cd's this week....Lots of great stuff on those labels....hurry
! It may be over after tomorrow..

Glenn

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 28 Jun 1997 00:18:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: Christopher Hamilton <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Masada Live CD, etc.

On Fri, 27 Jun 1997, SUGAR in their vitamins? wrote:

> this sounds like the same bootleg
> i asked about a year ago. the
> sound quality is good, but the
> location and lineup are apparently
> referenced incorrectly. i listen
> to it often enough to say it
> was worth buying.

I'd second the recommendation for those without scruples about this sort
of thing.  But I hadn't heard that the lineup was listed incorrectly.
What's the supposed error?

Chris Hamilton


------------------------------

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