From: ("Paul D Richardson") <Richardson.Paul@amstr.com>
Subject: [MV] RE: Mission Impossible 2
> 3.5/5, very good film but the fact the story is so simple
> and unoriginal prevents me from being more generous. (I
> gave 4/5 to the first film !)
I pretty much agree with most of your review, but I thought that MI:2 was
superior to the first film, which I didn't care for. In fact, had the
director been anybody John Woo, chances are that I wouldn't have seen MI2 at
all.
The first MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE had a lot of problems. Some major ones for me:
1. The television series is about a team, who each have a speciality, working
together. The film is about one guy (Ethan Hunt) who does almost everything
himself (a la James Bond). It's a completely different concept. In fact, the
opening sequence of the film is a slap in the face to fans of the television
series.
2. Jim Phelps as the villain. WHAT? No wonder Peter Graves turned down the
role!
3. The action was pretty poor, with a lot of obvious blue-screen work. Case
in point: the scene where the train explodes and Cruise is thrown towards the
camera is terribly done. There are many other such scenes.
I do recommend MISSION IMPOSSIBLE, however, for one sequence: the CIA
break-in. It's a fun homage to TOPKAPI (the film that inspired the MI TV
series), and it's one of the best heist scenes ever put on film (despite the
fact that it makes no sense). Wow!
The sequel still retains the first problem (I don't know why Cruise bothered
to license the MISSION IMPOSSIBLE name when the films bear no resemblance to
the show), but problems 2 and 3 are gone. The stuntwork in MI:2 is easily
some of the best this year, and it's made even more impressive when you take
into consideration that Cruise is doing almost everything himself. The
sequence that stands out the most (for me) is the climb at the beginning.
Just incredible.
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Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 12:49:16 EST
From: Smokefeath@aol.com
Subject: [MV] Mission: Impossible
In a message dated 12/18/2000 11:12:51 AM Central Standard Time,
Richardson.Paul@amstr.com writes:
<< it's one of the best heist scenes ever put on film (despite the
fact that it makes no sense). >>
That scene made no sense? The entire movie made no sense. I have asked
several people to explain the plot of the movie to me and no one has managed
to do it.
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Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 12:52:06 EST
From: Smokefeath@aol.com
Subject: [MV] Re: [film] RE: Mission Impossible 2
In a message dated 12/18/2000 11:13:35 AM Central Standard Time,
richardson.paul@amstr.com writes:
<< Jim Phelps as the villain. WHAT? No wonder Peter Graves turned down the
role! >>
Does anyone remember the very first season of Mission: Impossible when
Stephen Hill was the leader of the IM team? Yes, the same Stephen Hill who
for years played the District Attorney on "Law & Order" and whose lunchroom
scene with Christine Lahti in "Running on Empty" is one of the most
heartbreaking scenes I have ever witnessed in a motion picture.
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Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 11:18:00 -0700
From: ("Paul D Richardson") <Richardson.Paul@amstr.com>
Subject: [MV] RE: Mission: Impossible
> That scene made no sense? The entire movie made no sense. I have asked
> several people to explain the plot of the movie to me and no one has managed
> to do it.
It's been awhile since I've seen the film, but I'll give it a go. The basic
plot is simple: hero and villain race to find the McGuffin. It's the same
plot as MI:2, as well as numerous other films.
More specifically, the McGuffin in MISSION IMPOSSIBLE is the NOC list, a list
of all the IM operatives around the world. The list is in two parts for
encryption purposes. The villain steals the first half of the list in order
to sell the list to a rival agency. He blames the hero for the crime. The
hero is arrested and escapes custody. In order to locate the actual traitor,
he steals the second half of the list himself and contacts the rival to
arrange a sale. This flushes out the villain and clears the hero's name. The
End.
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Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 10:30:10 -0800
From: "Marc Claude Desbiens" <marcdesbiens@apolloguide.com>
Subject: [MV] RE: Mission: Impossible
***** Yes, You are correct, Paul D.
This is what I thought as well ... although I think this film is better on repeated viewings ... after only one viewing I was confused about some of the details as a lot of people were (3.5/5 after the 1st viewing !) but then I saw it again and it went up to 4/5 because I understood the plot better, what was going on ... There are plenty of little details that you don't really notice the first time around trying to understand what is going on ... the film gets better once you see "The big picture" ...
I prefer the original 1996 film over MI2 myself because the plot is more complicated and interesting ...
The plot of MI2 is so simple and not very original but I like the film because it looks so good, well made, packed with good action scenes ... etc. I prefer a complicated movie that makes you think over one that is really very simple (Too simple and formulaic ??)
I can understand someone who would say MI is a mess though ... you REALLY have to pay attention or else you are lost quickly !
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Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 10:53:32 -0800
From: "Marc Claude Desbiens" <marcdesbiens@apolloguide.com>
Subject: [MV] RE: Paul D. / Mission Impossible 2
**** Marc ;-)
>
>1. The television series is about a team, who each have a speciality, working
>together. The film is about one guy (Ethan Hunt) who does almost everything
>himself (a la James Bond). It's a completely different concept. In fact, the
>opening sequence of the film is a slap in the face to fans of the television
>series.
**** I have to agree the opening sequence is rather weak ...
>
>2. Jim Phelps as the villain. WHAT? No wonder Peter Graves turned down the
>role!
**** Well, he must be pretty old by now, no ?? Isn't that you remembering the "Good ol' days" and the original TV SERIES ?? I agree that series was great but Landau and company had no place being in that 1996 film ... same as the Charlie's angels from the original TV SERIES had no place in the movie released recently for example, or Sean Connery in the next Bond film, making a cameo or having a small part ... That would be sentimentalism ... I thought Voight was a bit of alright anyway .. but I like him in a lot of films ! ;-)
>
>3. The action was pretty poor, with a lot of obvious blue-screen work. Case
>in point: the scene where the train explodes and Cruise is thrown towards the
>camera is terribly done. There are many other such scenes.
***** Mmmmm ... I thought it was exciting, but not the level of MI2 of course ... plus in some shots you are correct that it looks like blue screen material and that helicopter and train looked a bit too much like miniature models in a couple of long shots ... The main reason I like MI more than MI2 is because of the story that is a lot more interesting for me ... the story in MI2 is stuff we have seen often, nothing very original there ...
>
>I do recommend MISSION IMPOSSIBLE, however, for one sequence: the CIA
>break-in. It's a fun homage to TOPKAPI (the film that inspired the MI TV
>series), and it's one of the best heist scenes ever put on film (despite the
>fact that it makes no sense). Wow!
**** Yes, that break-in is an great sequence ... and much better than the break in sequence in MI-2 as well (Although that one was still good, but the break in scene in MI is something else !)
>
>The sequel still retains the first problem (I don't know why Cruise bothered
>to license the MISSION IMPOSSIBLE name when the films bear no resemblance to
>the show), but problems 2 and 3 are gone. The stuntwork in MI:2 is easily
>some of the best this year, and it's made even more impressive when you take
>into consideration that Cruise is doing almost everything himself. The
>sequence that stands out the most (for me) is the climb at the beginning.
>Just incredible.
**** Yes, imagine what the film would have been with a better story .. WOW !! I was surprised in fact that it wasn't better than that ... I was almost sure I would go as high as 4/5 but it doesn't deserve it due to the weak story. The stunts were impressive though, I was reminded of The matrix sometimes in the sense the film looks amazingly good on screen but I don't really like the story so much !
>Hello all, I am calling to all of you for a little help. I am in the process of making a movie. We are at the writing stage right now, and are running out of ideas
>
The story is about a sales office and the one day where every dreaded sales nightmare happens. It is going to be done a way similar to Glengarry Glen Ross ( a movie I think everyone should watch at least once).
>
>So anyway What I am looking for are the real experiences from anyone that has a sales background. You will get mention in the credits if your story is used. Please let me know if you are interested in participating by emailing me at the address below.
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Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 18:40:31 -0800
From: "Marc Claude Desbiens" <marcdesbiens@apolloguide.com>
Subject: [MV] Memorable final scenes ...
Here's a good Topic ...
Great final scenes ... some movies are really excellent all the way through but the final scene is not really memorable and vice-versa ... in random order ... here are some of my favorite final scenes !
(Of course some great ones will be forgotten but it's just for fun anyway !)
How about your choices ??
- - Pulp fiction - 1994 ... the final speech by Samuel L. Jackson to Tim Roth ... "We're gonna be cool ..."
- - Seven - 1995 - the entire last part. Spacey in the back of that car, and then how he talks to Pitt ... "Envy is my deadly sin ..."
- - A clockwork orange - 1971 ... In the hospital, Malcolm McDowell in bed being fed by the minister ... "You shall have a good job with a salary that is appropriate" ... "What job and how much ??"
- - One flew over the cuckoo's nest - 1975 ... The big indian lifting the marble sink and throwing it out that damn window ...
- - Happiness - 1998 ... The teenager watching the girl sunbathing outside ... then going back in afterwards ... "I came" ..
'nuff said !!
- - The Blair witch project - 1999 .. Heather running down the stairs in a frenzy ...
- - The vanishing - 1988 (original european version !) ... Bernard-Pierre Donnadieu looking at the trees he planted in his backyard ...
- - Jaws - 1975 ... Roy Sheider aiming at the shark ... and then ... BOOM !!
- - Death and the maiden - 1994 ... Ben Kingsley's final speech .. admitting what he did to Sigourney Weaver. "I played music to suit your mind ..."
- - Dog day afternoon - 1975 ... "Sal, would you point your gun in the air ... in case we hit a bump on the road ..."
Have a fine day !
Marc ;-)
"...When I ask for a packet of Sweet-And-Low ... that's what
I want ... and it is your responsibility now to see that I get
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Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 10:56:57 -0800
From: "David F. Nolan" <DFN@alum.mit.edu>
Subject: Re: [MV] RE: Memorable final scenes ..
A Boy and His Dog
Lonely Are The Brave
Ocean's Eleven
The Omega Man
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Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 20:53:21 -0800
From: "Marc Claude Desbiens" <marcdesbiens@apolloguide.com>
Subject: [MV] Gump : Was it really **that** bad ??
The other day I received a message from someone who was claiming that "Forrest Gump" was the ... and I quote ... "Worst movie ever made" and I thought that was really **out there** of course so I deleted that message right away ... but then today at work someone was also saying that Gump was totally awful ... so I was rather surprised ...
>Mentioning "Forrest Gump" as the worst movie ever made is totally ridiculous
>in my opinion, it's an excellent film but it's just not "cool" to admit that
>you like that one, same as "Titanic" for example ... you have to keep it
>hush-hush if you like those two ... it's "cool" to say you like "Dogma" and
>"South park : Bigger, longer and uncut" though ...
>
>4/5 for "Forrest Gump". Excellent film, great acting, dialogues, story,
>neat special effects, the soundtrack
>is amazing too ... some funny moments, some touching
>ones ... I just don't understand why so many people dislike this movie ??
>
>I like it a lot, only loses it a little in the last half hour or so (when
>Gump starts jogging for example ...) but overall it is a great film but you
>can't say that of course ... unless you are not afraid of creating a lil'
>controversy !
>
>hehe !
>
>Have a fine day !
>
>
Marc ;-)
"A guy told me once ... Don't let yourself get attached
to anything you are not willing to walk out on in thirty
seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner ..."
> Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products.
> http://shopping.yahoo.com/
>
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Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2000 08:28:21 -0800
From: "Marc Claude Desbiens" <marcdesbiens@apolloguide.com>
Subject: [MV] Gump & Paul D.
*** Marc ;-)
>I agree. FORREST GUMP is not the worst movie ever made, but that's not
>praise. I didn't like the film, but that doesn't mean I think it was the
>"worst ever."
**** Oh good !! Yes, to be considered for this "Worst film of all times" award a film would have to be sooooooooooo awful ... not necessarely because it's ludicrous though ... I mean "Robot monster" that old sci-fi/horror film from the 50's is LUDICROUS but it still is mighty entertaining ... hehe !! ;-)
>
>[sarcasm]Yes, Marc...you've caught onto me. I say that I didn't like FORREST
>GUMP and TITANIC because I'm trying to be cool.
***** Hehe !! You're so good when use scrcasm !! ;-) Well, it'S "hip" to say you dislike those two, you have to agree with that statement ??
I actually LOVED those
>movies, but I want total strangers on an email list to think I'm hip.
**** I've received a billion e-mails from you so even if I just know your name and location I don't think of you as a total STRANGER ... hehe !! ;-) Well, maybe you try to appear "hip" for your own personal reasons, people get off on all sorts of things, you know ...
I also
>claim to like DOGMA and SOUTH PARK -- but it's all a lie! Once again, I'm
>just trying to get into the "in crowd." It's completely impossible for me to
>actually have formulated those opinions on my own![/sarcasm]
***** Dogma and South park were just examples ... I personally experienced it too .. sending nasty comments about both and then getting nasty replies that were often not even relevant ... Maybe it's a subconscious thing ... you "feel" like you have to like these and dislike the others ... peer pressures, that can happen ! (Is this sarcasm .. Mmmmmmm ... hard to tell !) ;-)
>
>There's been some interesting responses to this thread from those who like
>this film (from various groups):
*** I agree, fun to read those different opinions !
>
>"Whoever says this film is "the worst movie ever made" obviously hasnt seen
>many movies,and is quite dumb." -- TongueXXX
**** I wouldn't say someone disliking this film is dumb ... but saying it is the worst film ever made .. I mean ... come on !
>
>"to a growing minority a film with a STORY that unfurled
>around life lessons might be too much for individuals without moral
>perceptions." -- edward j
>
>"Forrest Gump" is a magnificent movie, but too many people are obsessed with
>plot driven movies over character driven movies" -- Smokefeath
>
>"It seems that there are movies/music/art created every year that achieve
>"popular" success and even though they have redeeming artistic merit they
>become vilified by certain critics or members of the public for no other
>reason than it's financial success." -- Stephen
>
>It's interesting that many of those who enjoyed the film felt the need to
>flame those who dared to disagree with their opinion.
**** Yes, for once it's Mr. Paul D. who is feeling the heat around the corner ... Yay ! Just like my new "quote" down there ... nice change !
Let me tell you
>something...just because I didn't like GUMP doesn't mean I'm dumb, immoral,
>prefer plot-driven films, or hate films that are financially successful. If
>you want to discuss the film, fine, let's discuss the film. There is no need
>to start labeling people.
**** You can hate a film for all sorts of reasons ... yes !
>
>While GUMP was certainly a well-crafted film, it failed for me on several
>levels:
>
>My main objection was that I'd seen it all before. The film owes a lot to
>BEING THERE and (to a lesser extent) ZELIG. Both of those earlier films are
>far superior to GUMP.
***** You can't expect to go in a movie and see something 100% different everytime ... watching a film I am often reminded of other films ... sometimes as many as 6-7-8 if the plot is not very original ... example : "Pitch black" I liked Being there a lot too !
>
>Secondly, the film isn't nearly as clever as it pretends to be: "life is like
>a box of chocolates: you never know what you're gonna get." Actually, a box
>of chocolates is usually clearly labeled as to it's contents, Forrest! Most
>of the so-called "Gumpisms" make no sense if you think about them.
**** Well, inside a box of chocolates there are many different kinds ... and anyway those phrases are not supposed to be analyzed, they're being said by a very simple minded man who is not bothered by all those details ... same as Sellers in Being there ... when he says he likes to watch TV the journalists go crazy thinking he means the information in the newspapers is not worthy of his precious time.
>
>Thirdly, Tom Hanks' performance wasn't that great. Go around the office water
>cooler and ask people to do their impressions of Gump...many of them can get
>it right on. All he did was talk slow and with a heavy southern accent: not
>great acting by any means.
**** hehe !! This made me laugh, it would be fun to do that ... people acting like Gump all day ! Hank is a very good actor, this one was not one of his best performances but even an average one from him is better than the best performance by an ordinary actor.
>
>Finally, I question the message about a character who lucks into success again
>and again. In this world, success comes from hard work. There are too many
>people out there who sit around waiting for their ship to come in, and this
>movie only encourages that sort of behavior.
**** Geeeeesh ... I guess I'll go sit at the park bench in front of that bus stop ... **right about now** ... now why would you write something like that ?? This would NEVER happen !! Not in a million years !!
>
>I should point out one thing: I'm not a baby boomer. I've heard a lot of baby
>boomers praising the film because they feel it represents their lives and
>values accurately. I can appreciate that, but I can't relate. Similar to
>FIGHT CLUB, which struck a chord with Generation X, while baby boomers
>scratched their head in disbelief.
**** I liked both of those films myself.
>
>Not every movie is going to appeal to everybody. I didn't like FORREST GUMP.
>Many people did. But I won't be insulting them: it's counter-productive.
>Instead, I'll agree to disagree.
***** Sure, it's not a battle to the death ... ;-)
Marc ;-)
"A guy told me once ... Don't let yourself get attached
to anything you are not willing to walk out on in thirty
seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner ..."
