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mobility-digest       Wednesday, August 4 1999       Volume 02 : Number 069



(mobility) Sifl and olly
Re: (mobility) moby's abs
Re: (mobility) moby on "house of blues"
Re: (mobility) moby's abs
(mobility) Long post, but please read
Re: (mobility) Off-topic      YOU DIE!  (and minneapolis)
Re: (mobility) Off-topic      YOU DIE!  (and minneapolis)
Re: (mobility) Long post, but please read
Re: (mobility) Long post, but please read
Re: (mobility) Long post, but please read

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Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 22:55:49 -0500
From: david j bass <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) Sifl and olly

Hey Paul, do you watch Space ghost coast to coast, or Cartoon planet?
Just curious, somehow I think you'd like them.

Dave

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Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 22:06:50 MST
From: "Derek ~" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) moby's abs

if i was old enough to drive and lived by myself i would start the campaign
but i have about 4 years before i can move out of my house so maybe in the
meantime we can start planning...

>mtv = mobility television!!  that would kick so much
>ass... we can only dream, though. :(


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Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 22:13:51 MST
From: "Derek ~" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) moby on "house of blues"

hey would you mind telling me the address i can listen to that broadcast? i
would really appreciate it
thanks



>moby will be performing live at the "house of blues" radio station which
>will
>be broadcasted over the web @ 6:30 pm (PT) wed 8/4.
>
>animal lib, consider veganism.
>
>


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Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 22:11:53 MST
From: "Derek ~" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) moby's abs

clinton's armed forces couldn't do shit to us moby fans! we would wipe them
out! somehow we would. yeah definately death sentence to britney spears and
BSB but you forgot to throw in nsync. but you see we're not terrorists we're
out to play good good music videos. we would really be doing good to the
world of MTV. we would become heroes! yeah!!!!


>a campaign?  Hell no!  Terrorist invasion! I can see the CNN announcement
>now... "In a shocking development today, scores of armed Moby fans stormed
>the broadcasting studio of MTV, declaring martial law.  Their first act was
>to order the death sentence for Britney Spears and the Backstreet Boys and
>to play a Moby video marathon.  It is not known at this time if President
>Clinton will be deploying the armed forces to liberate the studio."
>
>Now THAT'S a dream!
>
>Buckoe
>
>


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Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 05:45:32 GMT
From: "Roy Batty" <[e-mail]>
Subject: (mobility) Long post, but please read

>the whole
>manufactured pop thing is starting to make me sick already... it's time
>for mtv to play some more REAL stuff... like moby!!!

It's interesting that you say that. Moby is my favorite musical artist right
now, and I think Play is one of his best albums, but once in a while he does
something that really suggests that, whether or not his music is superior,
he wants to appeal to and produce work for the Britney Spears/Pepsi-pop
demographic.

I like the song "Bodyrock" a lot, but it is totally an attempt to appeal to
a post-Fatboy Slim pop culture landscape.
    Even more obvious is "South Side". It's the weakest, worst song on Play, in
my opinion... although I've gotta admit the tune is pretty damn catchy. But
it is so incredibly engineered for the summer-single/Live 105/MTV Woodstock
'99 set that it's almost the most apparent signal of a man trying
desperately to break through to a wider audience by imitating the scene
around him.
    Fortunately, Moby hasn't abandoned his individual musical art, because even
though Play features tracks like Bodyrock and South Side, the majority of it
is comprised of highly personal, emotional, contemplative tracks that
transcend the work produced even by Moby's peers. This is why he continues
to be the best.

One of the reasons I like Moby so much is because although he seems to
understand the Rock-star process of the deification of the artist... he
allows that status to drop when not performing. When he talks about his
opinions, when he gives interviews, he sometimes says things that I disagree
with... but he is willing to admit he doesn't know everything, and he is
also willing to change his mind, and THAT I respect almost even more than
his music.
He understands himself to be human, and not a distanced ARTIST, and by this
understanding his flaws are sometimes revealed. One of those human pulls is
the pull of celebrity. Part of him wants to be Mick Jagger.

I guess the main point is that, while he produces his individual musical
artwork, Moby is also trying to appeal to a more mainstream audience, and in
order to do that, he is appearing on Politically Incorrect, he is appearing
on Loveline, he is appearing on Conan O'Brien, and he is writing songs like
Bodyrock and South Side. I'm not saying it's bad or wrong, I'm just saying
that that is what he is doing. And therefore by saying that you're sick of
the manufactured pop scene (I am too, believe me), you are essentially
saying that you are sick of the same scene of which Moby is attempting to be
a part.
    So what makes Moby any more REAL than the Backstreet Boys or 98░? The fact
that we prefer his music? I think that's about it.

Peace out,
Dan Lee


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Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 01:01:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: theShackofXaq <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Off-topic      YOU DIE!  (and minneapolis)

On Tue, 3 Aug 1999, krwilson wrote:
> Also- does anyone know concretely if Moby's show in Minneapolis is 21+ or
> not?  If so I need a fake id which is $20 and I don't wanna get it
> unneccesarily.  Thanks.

yo mo,

i'm still working on getting the id show changed to AA. i talked to his
management on thursday and they were VERY PISSED this it was being
promoted as a 21+ show. (i could hear them yealing and swearing in the
background) so it looks like it will be changed. i will let everyone know
for sure the minute i know. remember dude, you have tickets already!

later,
- -xaq-

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 01:01:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: theShackofXaq <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Off-topic      YOU DIE!  (and minneapolis)

On Tue, 3 Aug 1999, krwilson wrote:
> Also- does anyone know concretely if Moby's show in Minneapolis is 21+ or
> not?  If so I need a fake id which is $20 and I don't wanna get it
> unneccesarily.  Thanks.

yo mo,

i'm still working on getting the id show changed to AA. i talked to his
management on thursday and they were VERY PISSED this it was being
promoted as a 21+ show. (i could hear them yealing and swearing in the
background) so it looks like it will be changed. i will let everyone know
for sure the minute i know. remember dude, you have tickets already!

later,
- -xaq-

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 00:26:30 MST
From: "Derek ~" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Long post, but please read

boy i'm gonna have to let that sink in for a bit then read it again man
- -derek




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Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 03:03:44 -0500
From: "Daniel Orion Davis" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Long post, but please read

I'm going to start off by saying that I agree with you, Roy, as a whole, but
felt I had to refute a couple of points...


> It's interesting that you say that. Moby is my favorite musical artist
right
> now, and I think Play is one of his best albums, but once in a while he
does
> something that really suggests that, whether or not his music is superior,
> he wants to appeal to and produce work for the Britney Spears/Pepsi-pop
> demographic.
>
> I like the song "Bodyrock" a lot, but it is totally an attempt to appeal
to
> a post-Fatboy Slim pop culture landscape.
> Even more obvious is "South Side". It's the weakest, worst song on Play,
in
> my opinion... although I've gotta admit the tune is pretty damn catchy.
But
> it is so incredibly engineered for the summer-single/Live 105/MTV
Woodstock
> '99 set that it's almost the most apparent signal of a man trying
> desperately to break through to a wider audience by imitating the scene
> around him.

Part of the problem I have with the above is it assume a greater deal of
calculation then I believe actually exists....I certainly agree that
Bodyrock sounds very 'of the moment' , but just because of piece of music is
timely, that doesn't necessarily make it a conscious attempt to emulate
styles, or to market to a particular demographic...I find it much more
likely to believe that Moby was influenced by the current musical climate
while he was recording Play then that he sat down and listened to the
current singles and plotted out a song as a direct line of attack...

The other part is, even if it is an attempt to widen his success...the
'Britney Spears/Pepsipop' audience?  Come on! Give us and him some
credit...that audience is 14 year old girls, and I hardly think that would
be his target if that was what he was doing...

> One of the reasons I like Moby so much is because although he seems to
> understand the Rock-star process of the deification of the artist... he
> allows that status to drop when not performing. When he talks about his
> opinions, when he gives interviews, he sometimes says things that I
disagree
> with... but he is willing to admit he doesn't know everything, and he is
> also willing to change his mind, and THAT I respect almost even more than
> his music.

Now I'm gonna jump the fence here...Didn't you see his Politically Incorrect
appearance?  Arguing with Maher about his enlightement...I would hardly call
him a modest man

> I guess the main point is that, while he produces his individual musical
> artwork, Moby is also trying to appeal to a more mainstream audience, and
in
> order to do that, he is appearing on Politically Incorrect, he is
appearing
> on Loveline, he is appearing on Conan O'Brien, and he is writing songs
like
> Bodyrock and South Side. I'm not saying it's bad or wrong, I'm just saying
> that that is what he is doing.

well, see, that's my main problem with the whole 'selling out'
concept...people draw the line in the wrong place, I believe...going on
television to promote his album is not selling out, it's doing his
job...selling out is when your art is directly influenced by the potential
money you're gonna make, or the money you've made..which as I've said before
I don't think is the case with BR or SS...


>And therefore by saying that you're sick of
> the manufactured pop scene (I am too, believe me), you are essentially
> saying that you are sick of the same scene of which Moby is attempting to
be
> a part.

One last jump here <grin>  I think the phrase 'manufactured pop scene'
doesn't even  have to refer to a particularly music style or anything, but
the current musical climate of a few large corporations realeasing more than
80% of the music out there, and the radio stations and MTV not looking
further to find what to play...So if you're on a major label, and you're
getting airplay, you're part of the manufactured pop scene, no matter how
good your music is, or how inventive...

> So what makes Moby any more REAL than the Backstreet Boys or 98░? The fact

> that we prefer his music? I think that's about it.
>

I think, if pressed, I could make a good argument for the fact that that
statement is not true...I mean Moby can be credited with creation of
something new and original that has had a dramatic influence on the music
scene of the '90s (even if you don't necessarily hear it on the
radio)..where as Backstreet Boys and 98 are simply products to cash in on a
long trend that started before the beatles and will be around when we're all
old men (and women)...sugar-coated pop released by pin-up stars for
adolescent consumption---nothing new conceptually or musically...although I
did bring up an interesting thought...we've already thought about armed Moby
terrorists...what about old retired Moby fans?  ("In my days it was enough
for a little bald man to get up there and shake his ass...we didn't need any
of these virtual rock stars, and their time travel shows...kids
today"...sorry, don't know what happened to me there)


Well...whew...that was a long and rambling post....hope somebody stayed
around to read it...


Buckoe

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 03:43:12 -0600
From: Daniel Redmond <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (mobility) Long post, but please read

This is a mishmash reply to two posts at once, so I apologise in
advance.....

>Part of the problem I have with the above is it assume a greater deal of
>calculation then I believe actually exists....I certainly agree that
Bodyrock sounds very 'of the moment' , but just because of piece of
>music is timely, that doesn't necessarily make it a conscious attempt to
emulate
>styles, or to market to a particular demographic...I find it much more
likely to believe that Moby was influenced by the current musical
>climate while he was recording Play then that he sat down and listened
to the current singles and plotted out a song as a direct line of
attack...

I remember reading somewhere (maybe it was here?) that the songs from
"Play" were recorded over the last two years.  I'd be interested to find
out when Bodyrock was created, approximately.  The big thing here is
influence - who drew influence from where.  Did Moby draw influence from
FBS/Chemical Bros./Crystal Method/etc., or did he draw his main influence
for the song from the original recording he sampled?  My thought is that
it was both modern-influenced and 70's-influenced.  Moby himself has
proven to be a very complex individual, perhaps he is expressing that
complexity once more?

>The other part is, even if it is an attempt to widen his success...the
'Britney Spears/Pepsipop' audience?  Come on! Give us and him some
>credit...that audience is 14 year old girls, and I hardly think that
would be his target if that was what he was doing...

How many 14-year olds even know who Moby is?  before i get flamed, let me
explain.  figure that there's about 250 million people in the USA, with
ages ranging from 1 second old to 107+ years old.  There are
approximately 250 people or so on this mailing list, plus maybe , let's
say 10 million people who've heard OF him or like his music, but not as
fanatically as we like it.  this gives a ratio of 4% of the USA
population that at least knows of Moby.  Now look at N'Sync, who are
practically owned by Disney.  It's probably safe to say that at least 65%
of the USA has heard of them.  Why?  Because some businessman decided to
build a band of boys and market them to the 'Britney Spears/Pepsipop'
audience.  Moby isn't being promoted to that audience.  Unfortunately,
MTV tends to aim to that audience, so it all adds up to high exposure for
N'Sync, Backstreet Boys, and Britney Spears (who don't actually play
instruments, just dance, sing what they are told to sing, and look cute),
and low exposure for Moby, and Blur (who (let's face it) aren't the best
things to look at, but are some of the best musicians in the 1990's)

>> One of the reasons I like Moby so much is because although he seems to
>> understand the Rock-star process of the deification of the artist...
he
>> allows that status to drop when not performing. When he talks about
his
>> opinions, when he gives interviews, he sometimes says things that I
disagree
>> with... but he is willing to admit he doesn't know everything, and he
is
>> also willing to change his mind, and THAT I respect almost even more
than
>> his music.

This is the hallmark of an enlightened individual - one who can admit
that his (or her) opinion isn't the best one.  Someone that can admit
they are wrong rather than claiming that they know exactly what is right
due to the fact that they are famous and that all of us know-nothing
peasants are idiots.  it is nice to see someone that is famous, yet
humble enough to admit being wrong at times, to admit that they are
human.

>well, see, that's my main problem with the whole 'selling out'
concept...people draw the line in the wrong place, I believe...going
>on television to promote his album is not selling out, it's doing his
job...selling out is when your art is directly influenced by the
>potential money you're gonna make, or the money you've made..which as
I've said before
>I don't think is the case with BR or SS...

What everything in this world comes down to is that one has got to put
food on the table.  True, some "artists" have been making their music
only to reap the monetary benefits they will recieve.  However, the
majority of musicians out there in this little world of ours
write/record/play music for the music's sake.  I'm not going to say that
a true musician writes and records for the love of music, but i will say
that a sellout musician writes for the monetary reward at the end of the
MTV rainbow.

>One last jump here <grin>  I think the phrase 'manufactured pop scene'
doesn't even  have to refer to a particularly music style or anything,
>but the current musical climate of a few large corporations realeasing
more than 80% of the music out there, and the radio stations and MTV not
looking
>further to find what to play...So if you're on a major label, and you're
getting airplay, you're part of the manufactured pop scene, no matter
>how good your music is, or how inventive...

I disagree here.  I view "manufactued pop scene" and I see 98 Degrees,
N'Sync, and to a further extent, Korn and Limp Bizkit.  To me,
manufactured pop is music that is written either for shock value (in the
cases of Korn and Limp Bizkit) or schlock value (in the case of N'Sync
and 98 degrees).  manufactured pop has only one goal - to make the
artists huge piles of money and to hell with wether or not the fans
actually notice the song that was just released sounds just like the last
six songs the artist released last month; whereas the "nonmanufactured"
music scene artist writes songs that actually sound different from one
another.  Look at it this way, you can definitely tell Bodyrock apart
from South Side, can't you?

>> So what makes Moby any more REAL than the Backstreet Boys or 98░? The
fact that we prefer his music? I think that's about it.

Perhaps the fact that Moby actually had a hand in creating his music???

>Well...whew...that was a long and rambling post....hope somebody stayed
around to read it...

at least one person did, I'm hoping someone else shows me the same
courtesy.

It's been a while since i did some reasoned discourse....how'd i do?

daniel

The funniest thing about watching the Fox Woodstock 99 recap was that,
during the Kid Rock segment, you missed half the song because he was too
busy saying "F---- this, F---- that!"
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------------------------------

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