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klr650-digest        Tuesday, October 27 1998        Volume 01 : Number 329




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Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 17:08:41 -0500
From: Stuart Heaslet <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (klr650) Reliability and Shifter?

At 03:17 PM 10/27/98 -0400, Michael Kovaliv wrote:

>I know I am going to get blasted for even asking this, but here goes.
>Is the KLR650 a "dated" bike and can I expect to have more problems than
>the other two bikes I am looking at?  (the Suzuki DR650SEX and the BMW
>F650 Funduro)

I like the fact that the KLR hasn't changed much over the years.   I bought
a 1998 10 months ago thinking that if anything, the manufacturer would tend
to correct items on the assembly line that caused after-the-sale warranty
work.  Plus, after reading solid advice from Mister T and other listers
over time, it occurred to me that longtime KLR history has enabled
consistent mechanical opinion (good and bad) - as well as growth of a
stable parts and aftermarket network.   FWIW.

Stuart
Juno Beach, Florida
USA

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 09:36:26 +1000
From: Ted Palmer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (klr650) Reliability and Shifter?

Michael Kovaliv wrote:

[...]
> I know I am going to get blasted for even asking this, but here goes.
> Is the KLR650 a "dated" bike and can I expect to have more problems than
> the other two bikes I am looking at?  (the Suzuki DR650SEX and the BMW
> F650 Funduro)

Yes, it's dated, but it works.
The DR650 is an update on a DR600 that was behind the KLR600 in 1985.
The Rotax motor that powers the BM had been around for quite a few years
before BM considered using it.

The DR650SE is closer to a KLX650 than the KLR, IMO, and a F650 is
a softer option to the KLR.
Each bike has its own strengths. You'll hsve to decide which applies
to you the most.

[...]
> impresive.  A good friend of mine has an F650 ST and swears I could have
> the bike for the rest of my life, if I wanted to.

Depends on what you do with it. An F650 would have a hard time on some
of the trails that some guys here regularly float over on a KLR.

[...]
> 1.    Engine - The only KLR I have ever seen at a dealer in town was
> leaking coolant on the show room floor!  I've also read a few posts to
> the list about leaking.  Two mechanics I have talked to both said the
> KLR engine make strange sounds.  I have ridden two older (87-88) KLRs
> that both had shifting problems.  One I had to fight to get into second
> gear, the other sounded like someone left a wrench in the gear box and
> was also hard to shift.  Valve sticking and clearance adjustments seem
> very common.

We tend to do more work on our bikes than others might, so we tend to
discuss maintenance more.
Maybe I'm biased, but I suspect KLR owners do more of their own
maintenance than F650 owners would.
Not sure about DR650SE owners, but I suspect a list for them wouldn't
be that much different to ours.

KLR gearboxes don't seem to have a bad reputation around here.
Mine still works perfectly, anyway.
A KLR with a dud box would have to have had a pretty severe life, and
like any bike in that age and state is best avoided.
We'll have to wait and see how many DRs there are thumping around 10
years on.

Valve sticking is news to me.
Valve adjustment is something to get really right in any motor.
We just care more about these things. Geez, there's only 4 valves in
there, might as well get them spot on, eh?

> 2.    Electrical system - there are a lot of posts about cheap wire,
> blown fuses and an over all under powered electrical system.  The side
> stand safety switch seems to act up  as well.

Ditch the sidestand switch.
Electrics are a bit light, as they would be on just about any similar
class of bike.
Don't expect a Suzuki to supply megawatts.
BMs (at least the bigger ones) have tended to have gruntier alternators
to cope with BM accessories like heated grips, heated vests, heated
visors and stuff.

> 3.    Gas Tank - Is a vacuum based fuel system a problem?

I doubt if it's any worse than other bikes, but KLRs tend to get used
in harder conditions by their nature.
My 600 doesn't use a vacuum tap, so I don't have any such problem.

> 4.    Carburetor -  I've read a lot of posts about the KLR just
> quitting, about "carb icing" and blockages.  The carb also seems one of
> the main things people on the list adjust.

The stock adjustment is rather lean, like the vast majority of recent
4 stroke engines, on car or bike.
We can tinker with ours a lot more than on some other vehicles to get
improved response and running. Blame the government.

For what the stock KLR carby does, it's pretty simple. Many of us
here would have little hesitation in pulling one apart on the side
of the trail (if deemed really necessary).
In my case, just draining the float bowl is enough.
I'd have my doubts with a twin-carb F650.
An accessory inline fuel filter will save lots of grief in most cases.

> Aside: (I've been watching alot of Speedvision lately and the dual-sport
> segments always seem to have lots of guys on DRs? What's with that?)

DRs would be a bit lighter, I suppose, which makes some difference
offroad.
I doubt if Speedvision shows the same DRs getting ridden to work every
day, as many KLRs are.
If you saw a TV show on some recent Australian Safari offroad events,
you'd see KLX650s beating XR600s and just about everything else on
two wheels out there.

A DR is more likely to get trailered to the bush and back than a KLR,
IMO.
A BM is less like likely to even go near the bush at all, I reckon.

> Bottom line, are these valid concerns?  Are these problems the price I
> will pay for buying the least expensive Dual-Sport?  Or should I just
> stop reading the list so much?  People generally aren't going to post
> "The KLR worked great today, just wanted to let everyone know!"
>
> Without these concerns, the KLR650 is my favorite of the three bikes.  I
> like the huge tank and long range, the overall size and ground
> clearance, the tach and temp gage, and the style and color are just
> killer.

It works for us, too.

[...]
> them.  I love to ride and simply don't want to waste any time with my
> bike in the shop.

A lot of the time, giving any bike to many shops to service is a waste
of time and money.

I doubt whether DRs or Fundies are perfect. Exactly what goes wrong
with them I don't know as I'm not very interested.

Mister_T
Melbourne, Australia

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 17:46:03 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: (klr650) Reliability and Shifter - Opinions?

In a message dated 10/27/98 12:17:16 PM Pacific Standard Time,
[e-mail] writes:

<< I know I am going to get blasted for even asking this, but here goes.
 Is the KLR650 a "dated" bike and can I expect to have more problems than
 the other two bikes I am looking at?  (the Suzuki DR650SEX and the BMW
 F650 Funduro) >>

Michael,

Boy does your post sound familiar!
In the spring of this year, I was in the same boat as you are now. I had made
the decision to go from sportbikes/sport tourers to a dual sport. After years
of just riding on the street, I just wanted to have more capabilities than
that. i thought fondly of my youth when I used to race motocross bikes.

At the time I had the cash to buy whatever I wanted; I.E. the F650, DR650SE,
XR650L, XT600, or KLR650, and so on. I seriously looked at all the bikes, read
everything I could find, covered the internet many times, and even joined
lists to check out owners opinions.

Obviously you can read great things about any particular bike, but in
researching things well, you also find the negatives. The January/February 98'
issue of the DSN has a good review of the DR650SE. It gets very positive
marks, but the closing statement is "If you are looking for the best 50/50
dual sport, look no furthur than the DR650. If you are looking for a capable
dual sport tourer, however, the DR650 can't hold a candle to the KLR650.
Despite the DR650's excellent resume, the KLR650 low price, proven history,
and ability to perform in dirt, road, and highway make it the better dollar
for dollar choice for those who like to travel."

The BMW is probably the best equipped bike for all out touring, but I have
read several articles about people hating them after they get to where they
are going (Can't beat em' in the dirt/expensive to drop/geared to
tall/etc...).  The articles usually state that it really can't handle the
rigors of Dual Sport events/Riding, and is better kept on gravel roads/easy
dirt trails. i bet there are people who beat em' like we beat our KLR's on the
trails, I just never here about those people.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that you really have to decide exactly what
you want out of the bike. Are you really gonna ride it like a dirt bike
sometimes, or are you really after a street bike that can handle a few gravel
roads now and then? Here's a synopsis of my opinion on this issue ----The DR,
and XLR are definitely better all-out dirt bikes, the KLR and DR are better
street bikes, With the KLR being the better touring bike. And the Beemer being
the poser dual sport, but the best tourer.

I was in your shoes, and chose the KLR. I have to admit, I have wondered about
the DR650SE and XL650R from time to time. Especially the times I've taken my
KLR into pure Motocross bike territory! BUT, if I had to choose all over
again, I'd still buy the KLR, because of it's all around value as a true do-
it-all bike for me.
So far, I've ridden it with Beemer touring bikes, hyper sport bikes, cruisers,
and even dirt bike stuff. No problems.

The bike has it's little shortcomings (needs a little suspension help, about
10 more hp, a sixth gear, etc..), but you'd find this with any bike out there.
Nothing is gonna be perfect for everything. The KLR came closest for me to do
what I wanted out of a dual sport bike. My main thing was I wanted to be able
to tour comfortably (stock), and do extensive trail/dirt riding when I got
there. Then ride the thing back home, even if it was 2000 miles away, and even
if I'd dropped it a few times.

I've really never heard of reliability being a problem on the KLR's as a
whole. just look at the internet with articles about guys riding them across
the country and then beating them in Alaska, and riding them home. There is
one site called "Riding to the Moon", about 5 guys who rode their KLR's about
14,000 miles on a trip to raise money for cancer research.

Probably can find similiar articles about other bikes, but lately it seems a
lot more people are riding KLR's these days, for these kinds of things in the
mags/internet sites.

Definitely a tough call, but the things you posted as concerns, at least in my
opinion, have not really been big problem areas with the majority of KLR's out
there.
If you go with a KLR and have the cash, get a newer one, cuz they are
OBVIOUSLY THE BEST LOOKING! (Just HAD to raz the guys with the multi- colored
versions!)

My two cents on the matter,

Bill Swindle
98' KLR650
Montgomery, IL.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 16:13:51 -0700
From: Kurt Simpson <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (klr650) Riding tips...

> Does anyone have any tips or tricks to handle the KLR in the rough
> stuff?

I've asked this question of the list a couple of times. I'd love to sit
back and have one of you better riders take us through a clinic...Don't
be shy...other good riders will jump in...

Kurt A12
Bountiful, UT

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 16:47:57 -0700
From: Kurt Simpson <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (klr650) Reliability and Shifter?

Michael Kovaliv wrote:

> this list could serve as an "Internet Dealer"
> where I will get truthful answers and un-biased opinions.  Thanks again.
>

eh...be careful there...some pretty "shifty" (pun intended) characters
hereabouts.

Your question has raised some excellent replies and capture much of my
own sentiments. I bought mine in February after stumbling on a picture
of Bill Haycock's ride on the webpage. I wondered where this great
looking bike had been all my life.

The KLR responds beautifully to upgrades and those upgrades are
relatively cheap. Each one has made my bike and even greater joy. I like
it more with each mile.

I think Mr. T's points about reliability are correct. This is an
enthusiasts list. We like to play with our bikes and see if we can
improve on a good thing. There are a few areas we haven't yet dared
(front forks) but that day is coming.

Problems:

Carb #1. I think KLR's may have a factory quality control problem with
gunk in the carb that causes early float problems. Mine clogged at 550
miles on the second day of Moab, several other listers have reported
this. OTOH, it could be that I created the problem with the jet kit
install.

Carb #2. Hard starting. When I brought mine home in February it wouldn't
start well. Putting in the jet kit, using a battery tender, and
eliminating the emissions stuff has put an end to that.

Fuses. The bike seems to have a habit of blowing fuses for no apparent
reason. They are a pain to replace. I don't know whether it does this
more than other bikes. I think we will see an excellent fix for this
problem in the newsletter very soon and later on the web page.

Temp Reading. Some listers have had problems with what seems like "high"
temp readings. As best as I can tell most have determined that their
gauge is more sensitive than others. Mine has never gone above 1/2 and
most of the time rests comfortably on 1/4 to 1/3.

Shifter. When I have my Combat Touring Boots on I usually embarass
myself with missed shifts for a few miles until I get used to the
different feel. I get a pretty good clunk when I shift into first at a
stop and sometimes have to hunt for neutral. When it is just warming up
sometimes the engine will kill when I shift into first with the clutch
held in. Mr. T offered an explanation for this a long time ago.

I would call these quirks rather than reliability issues. Slowly but
surely, a list like this can eliminate or make better many of these
issues.

I think the larger question is how do you intend on using the bike. Here
I think Bill Swindle's analysis is pretty correct. The DR is probably a
better 50/50 bike, the F-650 a tourer, but the KLR is right there in the
center. I'm not a good off-road rider but I was amazed where I took this
bike at Moab...rock shelves, steps, sand...I just went pretty slow. When
it starts to fall there is nothing to save you because of its top
heaviness but I can't imagine dropping an F-650 w/o having a heart
attack for the potential damage to the gorgeous plastic...

All are good choices...If you haven't checked out Florida Frank's
comparison you might enjoy it.
http://home.att.net/~flafrank/bikesfor.htm

Kurt A12
Bountiful, UT

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 19:03:06 -0500
From: "Robert frey" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: (klr650) Riding tips...

Best way to handle the KLR is to begin your workout 1 year ahead of when you
plan to take it off-road(trails fellas, not jeep roads) It's heavy and
sluggish, and more than a handful, but it can be done. My 18 year old
stepson rode his on a single track like it was a CR500! He was whooped
afterwards!


we rode the KLR on mountain roads in Georgia (no problems)(its just a
handfull because its such a big bike), and in the woods here in Florida.
With the Florida Riding, it doesn't really matter what your bike is, if your
in sand, ride fast, the bike rises to the top, slow down and your peddling
and getting stuck. In the mud and water, go slow and pick the shallowest
line. We hauled a 95 KLR out of a mud hole with the water spalshing in the
headlight.(It was pulled out by an XT350!)

Great all-around bike though.

Robert
KTM RXC
KLR650
- -----Original Message-----
From: Kurt Simpson <[e-mail]>
To: Darren Koepp <[e-mail]>
Cc: Robert Hutchings <[e-mail]>; 'KLR'
<[e-mail]>
Date: Tuesday, October 27, 1998 6:47 PM
Subject: Re: (klr650) Riding tips...


>> Does anyone have any tips or tricks to handle the KLR in the rough
>> stuff?
>
>I've asked this question of the list a couple of times. I'd love to sit
>back and have one of you better riders take us through a clinic...Don't
>be shy...other good riders will jump in...
>
>Kurt A12
>Bountiful, UT
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 18:33:28 -0700
From: Tony <[e-mail]>
Subject: (klr650) Wolves

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> telling me that there has been a low-profile effort ongoing by certain
> groups to reintroduce predator wildlife to our area. Being on the
> cynical side, I blew it off as rumor. No more. This weekend I was riding
> a remote dirt road in a land management area near here, came around a
> corner and there is a wolf standing in the middle of the road. He found
> himself in a section where the banks along side the road were high and
> almost vertical so I ended up following a wolf running down the road for
> about 30 or 40 feet until he found a spot to jump in the woods.
> Definitely a first for me. I may start listening to my wife, also a
> first (g).
> - --
> John Tranter
> 93 Concours, 91 XR250L, 89 TW200
> Montgomery, AL
>


Try reading the protection laws for the wolves, if you think that your
wife's story was unbelievable.  The only time you can kill one is if its
in the ACT of killing a person.  You will just have to say good by to
the family pet if a wolf gets near it.
    Tony

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<HTML>

<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
<PRE>
telling me that there has been a low-profile effort ongoing by certain
groups to reintroduce predator wildlife to our area. Being on the
cynical side, I blew it off as rumor. No more. This weekend I was riding
a remote dirt road in a land management area near here, came around a
corner and there is a wolf standing in the middle of the road. He found
himself in a section where the banks along side the road were high and
almost vertical so I ended up following a wolf running down the road for
about 30 or 40 feet until he found a spot to jump in the woods.
Definitely a first for me. I may start listening to my wife, also a
first (g).
- - --
John Tranter
93 Concours, 91 XR250L, 89 TW200
Montgomery, AL</PRE>
</BLOCKQUOTE>


<P>Try reading the protection laws for the wolves, if you think that your
wife's story was unbelievable.  The only time you can kill one is
if its in the ACT of killing a person.  You will just have to say
good by to the family pet if a wolf gets near it.
<BR>    Tony</HTML>

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End of klr650-digest V1 #329
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