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From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #411 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Friday, November 19 1999 Volume 01 : Number 411 In this issue: -áááááá MtMan-List: Re: Wahintke (mystery solved) -áááááá MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá MtMan-List:hide tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá MtMan-List: E-mail address -áááááá MtMan-List: Instructional media -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá MtMan-List: address -áááááá Re: MtMan-List:hide tipi's -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Instructional media -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's -áááááá MtMan-List: Social Studies Project for some nice kids. -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Social Studies Project for some nice kids. -áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Social Studies Project for some nice kids. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:37:26 -0500 From: "Henry B. Crawford" <mxhbc@TTACS.TTU.EDU> Subject: MtMan-List: Re: Wahintke (mystery solved) >Thanks Henry, I was really beginning to wonder if my edition was just an >apparition. Interesting comment about the plagarism since the Vol IV >article is by >the same author. > >Tom I didn't know they were written by the same person, having never seen the original vol. III article (mine is the revised ed.). The plagarism story came from someone at Rebel Publishing. I took it at face value, assuming it was true. I hope my passing that along didn't offend anyone. Cheers, HBC **************************************** Henry B. Crawford Box 43191 Curator of History Museum of Texas Tech University mxhbc@ttacs.ttu.edu Lubbock, TX 79409-3191 806/742-2442 FAX 742-1136 Website: http://www.ttu.edu/~museum ****** Living History . . . Because It's There ****** - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:00:59 EST From: SWcushing@aol.com Subject: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's Ho the list, In 1540-42, Coronado reports of Indian "tents" as being "poles fastened at the top and covered with buffalo hides".... so one can assume the tipi has been around for quite some time. Chris brought canvas, among other things, to the mainland way back in 1492...so that material has been available. With the destruction of the buffalo, canvas became the material of choice.... My question is when is the earliest known report of tipi's being made of canvas? It would seem that given the near 300+ years the material was available, a canvas tipi might have around since the 1700s..... YMOS, Steve - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:55:07 EST From: JSeminerio@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's I would almost swear that in the Mooney Ethnograph, I have forgotten the real name of it. Mooney mentions tipis made from various sacks, this was the 1880 or there about. They used to let you read the actual government printing in the NYPL main reading room long, long, ago. Hope that helps John Seminerio - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:13:27 -0600 From: Jim Colburn <jc60714@navix.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's Washtahay- At 09:00 PM 11/17/99 EST, you wrote: >My question is when is the earliest known report of tipi's being made of >canvas? It would seem that given the near 300+ years the material was >available, a canvas tipi might have around since the 1700s..... Think it through. The only real advantage canvas offers is the lighter weight (and lack of needing to be tanned, I guess). Canvas would have been more expensive that buff hide for most of that period. Something-hides, probably-would have had to be traded for that canvas. New techniques would have to be learned to sew it together. And then, it wouldn't last as long as hide; it wouldn't be as warm in winter; it wouldn't be what the tribe had used for as long as most folks could remember (though the Cheyenne and Sioux were relative latecomers to the plains-not becoming "buffalo Indians" until late 1700s); worn out canvas can't be used like last year's lodge cover could be. From the stories I heard as a child, when the tribes went to canvas many felt embarrassed-as if it were a sign they couldn't hunt enough to provide for their families, and the women couldn't tan the hides for a new lodge. For whites, tipis weren't used as often as some might think-earliest mention I can recall was the Fremont expedition (check me on this, am running on old memories). As I recall the story, Carson wanted to take a lodge as the most practical shelter (so apparently he had previous exposure, but my thought is that was from time with various tribes) but he had to hire a native woman to teach him how to set it up! The records I have seen of the various trapping brigades don't mention lodges, tents sometimes but not tipis. Basically, to have a practical period shelter, we make a compromise and use cotton canvas (rather than linen) and use white-man style tents. If a guy was living with a tribe he might be in a tipi-but it would be hide, and it probably wouldn't be his. Groups not with a tribe would probably be in a half-faced shelter. Realistically, the man on his own was probably dead too soon for it to be a factor. LongWalker c. du B. - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:00:17 +0000 From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's SWcushing@aol.com wrote: Chris brought canvas, among other things, to > the mainland way back in 1492...so that material has been available. Steve, I submit that your line of reason is somewhat flawed. Consider that it was the Plains Indians that used the teepee not the indians of Mexico or the eastern seaboard. It was really some time after Columbus before much in the way of European contact was made with these inland peoples. The destruction of the buffalo did not happen until after the War of Southern Obstinence and up until that time many contemporary writers recorded the construction of the Plains Indian Tee Pee as being with hides of some type, usually buffalo. With the > destruction of the buffalo, canvas became the material of choice.... As has been pointed out, the destruction of the buffalo didn't really come about until late in the 19th Century and until those late Indian wars the Plains Indian were a very independent people not at all beholding to the white man for their basic needs. Not to say that much in the way of European goods weren't traded to these peoples, of course trade was going on. And not to say that there never was a lodge made of canvas early in the 1800's, there may have been. But to say that canvas or linen lodges were made because canvas sails came to the Americas with Christopher Columbus is a stretch. We use canvas for lodges today, not because it is authentic but because it is an expedient. Hide lodges are expensive and heavy and thus hard to come by. IMHO, I remain... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:12:08 -0600 From: John Kramer <kramer@kramerize.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's At 09:00 PM 11/17/99 +0000, Capt. wrote: >The destruction of the buffalo did not happen until after the War of >Southern Obstinence Surely you are referring to the "War of Northern Aggression." John... P.S. The rest of the information is correct. Use it up, wear it out, make do, or do without. John Kramer <kramer@kramerize.com> - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 01:49:13 EST From: Htorr@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's I have heard it called "The War to Preserve the Union." In a message dated 11/17/1999 10:16:49 PM Pacific Standard Time, kramer@kramerize.com writes: At 09:00 PM 11/17/99 +0000, Capt. wrote: >The destruction of the buffalo did not happen until after the War of >Southern Obstinence Surely you are referring to the "War of Northern Aggression." John... P.S. The rest of the information is correct. - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:39:28 EST From: SWcushing@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's In a message dated 11/17/99 9:01:25 PM, lahtirog@gte.net writes: <<It was really some time after Columbus before much in the way of European contact was made with these inland peoples.>> Haaaaa... I guess I didn't phrase that very well. The point I was trying to make was that canvas has been around quite some time as well as the tipi. When the Plains Indians started to use canvas as a substitution for hides is what I'd like to know. In the short introduction to Laubin's "The Indian Tipi", Stanley Vestal writes ....."The tipi went out of common use on the Plains during the first decades of the present century." Mebbe my question should be when did we wipe out the Buffalo? Having a canvas lodge, I'm asked why it ain't made of hide, often..... YMOS, Steve - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 09:26:37 +0000 From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's John Kramer wrote: > > At 09:00 PM 11/17/99 +0000, Capt. wrote: > >The destruction of the buffalo did not happen until after the War of > >Southern Obstinence > > Surely you are referring to the "War of Northern Aggression." John, Figured that would wake up someone! Glad we agree on the rest. Perhaps it would be better refered to as the "War of American Foolishness"? I remain... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 10:48:18 -0500 From: "John L. Allen" <johnlallen@uconn.cted.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's Ho, the list: I raised a similar question about a year or so ago and asked for help--which I got in abundance, much of it off-line. In summary form, this is what I learned about both canvas/hide tipis and buffalo: Although available in the European-native trade as early as the 1600s, canvas was not normally in use by the Plains tribes (the primary cultural group that utilized tipis) until around 1870. Even then, for reasons already stated by Capt Lahti, native users preferred the hide tipis to the canvas ones by a wide margin--the primary reason given in the documents I've consulted was durability. About the only advantage of canvas for lodges was its lighter weight and there may have been some instances in which tribes (particularly the Blackfeet) that had canvas used canvas lodges for summer hunting camps when light weight was a decided plus and the lack of heat retention not a problem because of warmer temperatures. When native peoples gave up long distance wandering patterns (coinciding in time with both the movement onto reservations and the severe reduction of the natives' buffalo hunting economy) in the 1870s and 1880s, the lightweight advantage was no longer relevant and buffalo hide continued to be the material of choice for lodges, many of them now stationary throughout the year. By the last decade of the 19th century, however, many lodges made of buffalo hide started to be replaced by canvas because buffalo hide was no longer widely available. Therefore, the first instances of replacement of hide by canvas for lodges pretty well coincides with the beginnings of both the major reduction in the buffalo herd, and the reservation system in the 1870s. (The construction of the first transcontinental railroad line in the 1865-68 period interrupted north-south migration patterns of the buffalo and established northern and southern herds. Hide and tongue hunting in the 60s and 70s contributed to bison eradication and by 1880 the combined northern and southern herds numbered less than a million--down from an estimated 18-20 million in 1800). But by the late 1890s only about 500 buffalo were left in Yellowstone and Alberta (most of the latter were Woods Bison, a slightly smaller version of the Plains Bison but genetically interchangeable -- in other words, could interbreed) and the Plains tribes had no choice but to make the switch to canvas material for lodges. Hides simply were no longer a part of their resource base. With thanks to all those who provided information on this topic last year. John Dr. John L. Allen 21 Thomas Drive Storrs, CT 06268 860/487-1346 johnlallen@uconn.cted.net - ----- Original Message ----- From: <SWcushing@aol.com> To: <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 11:39 AM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's > > In a message dated 11/17/99 9:01:25 PM, lahtirog@gte.net writes: > > <<It was really some time after Columbus before much > in the way of European contact was made with these inland peoples.>> > > Haaaaa... I guess I didn't phrase that very well. The point I was trying to > make was that canvas has been around quite some time as well as the tipi. > When the Plains Indians started to use canvas as a substitution for hides is > what I'd like to know. > > In the short introduction to Laubin's "The Indian Tipi", Stanley Vestal > writes ....."The tipi went out of common use on the Plains during the first > decades of the present century." Mebbe my question should be when did we wipe > out the Buffalo? Having a canvas lodge, I'm asked why it ain't made of hide, > often..... > > YMOS, > Steve > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:52:29 -0600 From: Monte Holder <sja028@mail.connect.more.net> Subject: MtMan-List:hide tipi's All this talk about tipi's and canvas - hide differences reminds me of seeing a pattern for a tipi and thinking about how the native people got the hides sewed (sown?) together to make the cover. I've seen the one in the museum beneath the arch in St. Louis, I don't know who made it or where it came from, but it is amazing to think of going from buffalo on the hoof to a tipi. Not wishing to whip up any controversy, just sitting here amazed at the work that would go into a project such as that. Monte Holder - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 10:00:59 +0000 From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's SWcushing@aol.com wrote: > Haaaaa... I guess I didn't phrase that very well. The point I was trying to > make was that canvas has been around quite some time as well as the tipi. Steve, I thought you phrased it quit well. The point is that just because canvas has been around for quit some time as well as the tipi has nothing to do with why we use canvas today. > When the Plains Indians started to use canvas as a substitution for hides is > what I'd like to know. Thought I did a pretty good job of answering that question. <G> What part of "after the Civil War" didn't you understand? The buffalo was pretty much wiped out during the last part of the 1800's by commercial hunters, disease, and as a policy of the US Gov. to rid the Plains Indian of his economic base. When those peoples were finally rounded up an placed on reservations, canvas was just about the only material available. That happened at the end of the Century. I can't give a specific date. > > In the short introduction to Laubin's "The Indian Tipi", Stanley Vestal > writes ....."The tipi went out of common use on the Plains during the first > decades of the present century." At that point they were probably made mostly if not entirely out of canvas. Mebbe my question should be when did we wipe > out the Buffalo? Having a canvas lodge, I'm asked why it ain't made of hide, > often..... Thought I did a pretty good job of answering that one too. <G> A. Late 1800's, B. Too heavy, too expensive, hides are hard to come by. I remain... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 10:27:06 +0000 From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net> Subject: MtMan-List: E-mail address I'm asking if Bill Cunningham has an e-mail address? Would like to send him an article. Thanks, I remain.... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 17:18:59 EST From: ThisOldFox@aol.com Subject: MtMan-List: Instructional media List, I was cleaning out the closet and ran across some instructional media that had been given to me. It consists of 5 filmstrips and 5 cassettes which were used in the old machines that advanced the filmstrip by audible clues on the cassette. The series is entitled "Visions from America's Past, Part One" The individual fimstrips are: The New Land Settlement Forming a New Nation Revolution Moving into the Interior Anyone who has a use for them can have them for free. I have no idea of the age level they were made for. Contact me offlist if interested. Dave Kanger - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 17:02:58 -0500 From: Linda Holley <tipis@mediaone.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's Ok...here is my two bits. The buffalo hide tipi under the St. Louis arch was made by Larry Belitz who wrote the small book "Brain Tanning the Sioux Way" (I think that title is right?) Also, the Natives went to Cow hides when the buffalo where not available. Several of the tipis in museums are of cows and not buffalo. The tipi, now set up at the Buffalo Bill Museum is cow hide and wonderfully put together. I think they are now changing out the Native American Exhibit so it may not still be up. Canvas was also used and it is light as we all know. Or some of us know. I have tried to pick up a buffalo hide cover for an 18' or so lodge and it is HEAVY!!!!!!!!!! Thank God for canvas and I have made over 300 lodges on my own. Now the back is gone, so is my mind. Too much canvas dust. Larry is writing a book on the Buffalo hide tipi that should be coming out this next year. Saying we all out live the Millennium bugs. Linda Holley R Lahti wrote: > SWcushing@aol.com wrote: > > > Haaaaa... I guess I didn't phrase that very well. The point I was trying to > > make was that canvas has been around quite some time as well as the tipi. > > Steve, > > I thought you phrased it quit well. The point is that just because > canvas has been around for quit some time as well as the tipi has > nothing to do with why we use canvas today. > > > When the Plains Indians started to use canvas as a substitution for hides is > > what I'd like to know. > > Thought I did a pretty good job of answering that question. <G> What > part of "after the Civil War" didn't you understand? The buffalo was > pretty much wiped out during the last part of the 1800's by commercial > hunters, disease, and as a policy of the US Gov. to rid the Plains > Indian of his economic base. When those peoples were finally rounded up > an placed on reservations, canvas was just about the only material > available. That happened at the end of the Century. I can't give a > specific date. > > > > > In the short introduction to Laubin's "The Indian Tipi", Stanley Vestal > > writes ....."The tipi went out of common use on the Plains during the first > > decades of the present century." > > At that point they were probably made mostly if not entirely out of > canvas. > > Mebbe my question should be when did we wipe > > out the Buffalo? Having a canvas lodge, I'm asked why it ain't made of hide, > > often..... > > Thought I did a pretty good job of answering that one too. <G> A. Late > 1800's, B. Too heavy, too expensive, hides are hard to come by. > > I remain... > > YMOS > Capt. Lahti' > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 19:39:42 -0800 From: "larry pendleton" <yrrw@airmail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0079_01BF31FC.A91F8CC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Capt. How rude to speak of THE LATE UNPLEASANTNESS in such a manner. <G> Pendleton =20 -----Original Message----- From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net> To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com <hist_text@lists.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, November 18, 1999 9:26 AM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's =20 =20 John Kramer wrote: >=20 > At 09:00 PM 11/17/99 +0000, Capt. wrote: > >The destruction of the buffalo did not happen until after the War = of > >Southern Obstinence >=20 > Surely you are referring to the "War of Northern Aggression." =20 John, =20 Figured that would wake up someone! Glad we agree on the rest. = Perhaps it would be better refered to as the "War of American Foolishness"? = I remain... =20 YMOS Capt. Lahti' =20 ---------------------- hist_text list info: = http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ------=_NextPart_000_0079_01BF31FC.A91F8CC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN"> <HTML> <HEAD> <META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 = http-equiv=3DContent-Type> <META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.3110.7"' name=3DGENERATOR> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#b8b8b8> <DIV>Capt.</DIV> <DIV> How = rude to speak of=20 THE LATE UNPLEASANTNESS in such a manner. <G></DIV> <DIV>Pendleton </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE=20 style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: = 5px"> <DIV>-----Original = Message----- From:=20 R Lahti <<A=20 href=3D"mailto:lahtirog@gte.net">lahtirog@gte.net</A>> To: = <A=20 = href=3D"mailto:hist_text@lists.xmission.com">hist_text@lists.xmission.com= </A>=20 <<A=20 = href=3D"mailto:hist_text@lists.xmission.com">hist_text@lists.xmission.com= </A>> Date:=20 Thursday, November 18, 1999 9:26 AM Subject: Re: = MtMan-List:=20 canvas and tipi's </DIV>John Kramer wrote: > = > At=20 09:00 PM 11/17/99 +0000, Capt. wrote: > >The destruction of = the=20 buffalo did not happen until after the War of > >Southern=20 Obstinence > > Surely you are referring to the = "War of=20 Northern Aggression." John, Figured that would = wake up=20 someone! Glad we agree on the rest. Perhaps it would be better = refered to=20 as the "War of American Foolishness"?=20 I remain... YMOS Capt.=20 Lahti' ---------------------- hist_text list info: <A=20 = href=3D"http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html">http://www.xm= ission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html</A> </BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML> - ------=_NextPart_000_0079_01BF31FC.A91F8CC0-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 20:20:29 +0000 From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's > larry pendleton wrote: > > Capt. > How rude to speak of THE LATE UNPLEASANTNESS in such a manner. <G> Larry, The Late Unpleasantness was RUDE. <G> I remain... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 20:28:50 +0000 From: R Lahti <lahtirog@gte.net> Subject: MtMan-List: address Roger Here is Bill's address. You probably have several copies by now. Lanney Thank you Lanney, Dennis, Larry, etc. Yes I have several copies now and thanks to you all. I remain... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: 19 Nov 1999 06:05:07 -0800 From: Buck <buck.conner@uswestmail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List:hide tipi's On Thu, 18 November 1999, Monte Holder wrote: > > All this talk about tipi's and canvas - hide differences reminds me of seeing a > pattern for a tipi and thinking about how the native people got the hides sewed > (sown?) together to make the cover. I've seen the one in the museum beneath the > arch in St. Louis, I don't know who made it or where it came from, but it is > amazing to think of going from buffalo on the hoof to a tipi. > Not wishing to whip up any controversy, just sitting here amazed at the work > that would go into a project such as that. > > Monte Holder At the making of the TV Series "Centennial", the prop people setup an 18' hide tipi for the rendezvous scene, it took a crew to get this done. At first we thought it must have collected moisture making it so heavy, figuring it was brought in from Hollywood. But found it had been purchased just a short period before setup from a gentleman in southern Colorado, as dry as it is here that shot that idea. I saw a short series on the nomads that live in Sibera, this family group used hide tipi type structures, single hides that are layered (not sewn together) started at the bottom and layed up in the same manner as our tiled roof's are today. This made them easy to handle in setting up the tipi, as well as moving to the next site as they traveled from one area to another. When a hide started to show some wear, it was used on the floor, everything was used until gone. Canvas would be a great improvement for tribes moving around during the mid to late 1800's, think of the reduction in weight in setup or moving. It's amazing that the poles didn't break with a good snow laying on the hides. Later, Buck Conner _________________________________ Personal :http://home.att.net/~buck.conner/personal.html Business :http://www.teleport.com/~walking/clark/ AMM Party:http://klesinger.com/jbp/jbp.html _________________________________ Aux Ailments de Pays! Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: 19 Nov 1999 06:07:42 -0800 From: Buck <buck.conner@uswestmail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Instructional media On Thu, 18 November 1999, ThisOldFox@aol.com wrote: > > List, > I was cleaning out the closet and ran across some instructional media that > had been given to me. It consists of 5 filmstrips and 5 cassettes which were > used in the old machines that advanced the filmstrip by audible clues on the > cassette. > > The series is entitled "Visions from America's Past, Part One" > The individual fimstrips are: > > The New Land > Settlement > Forming a New Nation > Revolution > Moving into the Interior > > Anyone who has a use for them can have them for free. I have no idea of the > age level they were made for. Contact me offlist if interested. > > Dave Kanger > Dave, Would they be worthwhile to transfer them to a video, if so have a friend that maybe able to do this. Let me know. Later, Buck Conner _________________________________ Personal :http://home.att.net/~buck.conner/personal.html Business :http://www.teleport.com/~walking/clark/ AMM Party:http://klesinger.com/jbp/jbp.html _________________________________ Aux Ailments de Pays! Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 08:43:10 -0700 From: Joe Brandl <jbrandl@wyoming.com> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: canvas and tipi's The earliest known canvas tipi was at Ft Union in 1851. It was considered high status to have one, therefore only the wealthy had them. Joe Check out our web site at: www.wy-biz.com/absarokawesterndesigns/index.html Try our great Home Tanning Kit for $39.95, based on 20 years of tanning Rawhide lampshades, buffalo hides, lodgepole furniture, furs & leather Give us a call? - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: 19 Nov 1999 07:10:22 -0800 From: Buck <buck.conner@uswestmail.net> Subject: MtMan-List: Social Studies Project for some nice kids. Received this message, and as slow as it is on the list right now, I'm passing it on, answer and pass it on. - ---------------------------- Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 11:39 AM Subject: Fw: Social Studies Project We are third graders in Alpine, Texas USA. We live in the mountains of West Texas in the Big Bend of the Rio Grande River that divides the United States from Mexico. We are going to map the progress of this email message and see where it travels between today, October 25 and November 22, 1999. Please help our Social Studies project by doing two things: 1) Email us and tell where you live. 2) Forward our message to as many people as you can! Please use the address below. Our email address is tchandler@alpine.esc18.net Your new friends, Mrs. Chandler's Third Grade Alpine Elementary School Alpine, Texas USA Later, Buck Conner _________________________________ Personal :http://home.att.net/~buck.conner/personal.html Business :http://www.teleport.com/~walking/clark/ AMM Party:http://klesinger.com/jbp/jbp.html _________________________________ Aux Ailments de Pays! Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 10:21:00 -0500 From: deforge1@wesnet.com (Dennis Miles) Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Social Studies Project for some nice kids. We used to do this with a helium ballon and a piece of paper.... D Buck wrote: > Received this message, and as slow as it is on the list right now, I'm passing it on, answer and pass it on. > > ---------------------------- > Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 11:39 AM > Subject: Fw: Social Studies Project > > We are third graders in Alpine, Texas USA. We live in the mountains of > West Texas in the Big Bend of the Rio Grande River that divides the > United States from Mexico. > > We are going to map the progress of this email message and see where it > travels between today, October 25 and November 22, 1999. Please help our > Social Studies project by doing two things: > 1) Email us and tell where you live. > 2) Forward our message to as many people as you can! Please use the > address below. > > Our email address is tchandler@alpine.esc18.net > > Your new friends, > Mrs. Chandler's Third Grade > Alpine Elementary School > Alpine, Texas USA > > Later, > Buck Conner > _________________________________ > Personal :http://home.att.net/~buck.conner/personal.html > Business :http://www.teleport.com/~walking/clark/ > AMM Party:http://klesinger.com/jbp/jbp.html > _________________________________ > Aux Ailments de Pays! > > Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - -- "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e" DOUBLE EDGE FORGE Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements http://www.wesnet.com/deforge1 - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: 19 Nov 1999 08:25:14 -0800 From: Buck <buck.conner@uswestmail.net> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Social Studies Project for some nice kids. wasn't a buffalo bladder, filled with personal body gas !!! how's my folder doing ??? - --------------------- On Fri, 19 November 1999, Dennis Miles wrote: > > We used to do this with a helium ballon and a piece of paper.... > D > > > Buck wrote: > > > Received this message, and as slow as it is on the list right now, I'm passing it on, answer and pass it on. > > > > ---------------------------- > > Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 11:39 AM > > Subject: Fw: Social Studies Project > > > > We are third graders in Alpine, Texas USA. We live in the mountains of > > West Texas in the Big Bend of the Rio Grande River that divides the > > United States from Mexico. > > > > We are going to map the progress of this email message and see where it > > travels between today, October 25 and November 22, 1999. Please help our > > Social Studies project by doing two things: > > 1) Email us and tell where you live. > > 2) Forward our message to as many people as you can! Please use the > > address below. > > > > Our email address is tchandler@alpine.esc18.net > > > > Your new friends, > > Mrs. Chandler's Third Grade > > Alpine Elementary School > > Alpine, Texas USA Later, Buck Conner _________________________________ Personal :http://home.att.net/~buck.conner/personal.html Business :http://www.teleport.com/~walking/clark/ AMM Party:http://klesinger.com/jbp/jbp.html _________________________________ Aux Ailments de Pays! Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #411 ******************************* - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message.