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hist_text-digest      Monday, December 16 2002      Volume 01 : Number 1124



In this issue:

-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloading shotgun loading
-áááááá MtMan-List: Beams
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloading shotgun loading
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beams
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beams
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beams
-áááááá RE: MtMan-List: Beams
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloading shotgun loading
-áááááá RE: MtMan-List: Beams
-áááááá MtMan-List: Pacific Northwest Things To Do
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beams
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beams
-áááááá Re: MtMan-List: Beams

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 13:22:01 -0700
From: Charlie P Webb <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloading shotgun loading

I would like to compliament Dave Kanger on his comments on shooting
smooth bores.  I have seen numerous leaf, grass and paper loads do
exactly as he says, set the woods on fire.  I have seen non lubed felt
wads(made from a an old hat) smoulder and smoke, but not burst into
flames.  I have not experienced a well lubed felt wad even smoulder.
Perhaps they do, but I have never witnessed it.
I totally agree with TOF in his not recommending FFF powder.  My muzzle
loading shot gun shooting really improved after a chance encounter many
years ago with VM Starr.  I adopted many of his recommendations and
proved they worked in my guns after many hours  on the pattern board.  I
prefer  1F and 2F in 20 to 10 ga. Each of my guns seem to prefer a little
change in the loading formula, no two of my guns like exactly the same
wadding and powder combinations.  Again as TOF said, "work up your load".
 I have experienced what I call "the Donut" effect in my shot patterns
even with 1f powder, I found that acassionally (not predictable)
that the cushion wad or "Tater Tot" would be blown up and into the shot
column
and create an open centered pattern that a bird could fly through.  For
breaking clay birds I use as recommended by Starr, two .125 cards over
the powder with an over shot wad created by splitting the .125 wad into
approximate thirds.

I sincerely wish Dave would share his experiences gained with using
different wad column lengths, and his findings on how the wad column
length effects the shot pattern.

In closing I say again good job Dave K
Old Coyote,
Charlie Webb
 I am leaving Dave Kanger message on my post, because if you haven"t read
it, I believe you should.

> Nick,
> I get a lot of old doubles in and many are still loaded.  Of the
> ones I've
> pulled the loads on, they have used old newsprint or book pages for
> wadding.
> However, there is a problem with using these materials.  They will
> set the
> woods on fire, because they ignite and continue to burn after the
> shot.
>
> What you use is a catch 22.  A cushion wad helps keep your load
> together.  If
> lubed, usually with Crisco, you will need to use an overpowder wad
> both to
> back it up and to keep the lube from migrating into the powder.
> With lubed
> cushion wads, you keep the barrel fouling down.
> You also have options with the cushion wad.  You can use fiber wads
> and
> adjust their thickness to pattern your gun.  You can also use felt
> wads,
> usually cut from old felt hats and such, but which can also be
> ordered
> pre-cut.  If you are afield and there is no danger of a fire, then
> you can
> use almost anything, but patterns can suffer a bit, because of the
> inconsistency of the length of the wad column.  Like any other gun,
> you have
> to develop the loads for it.
>
> You will also find that you probably want to shoot 2F in your gun,
> and even
> 1F.  You will usually get a faster shot column with slower powder,
> especially
> as your shot weight goes up.  3F is pretty sudden in its ignition,
> and will
> often shoot the wad through the center of the pattern.  The neat
> thing about
> an open choked gun, is that you can vary the components to pattern
> at almost
> any distance up to 70 yards.  It's a science gained through
> experience and
> experimentation.
>
> >Don't know if there is any discrepencies with this historically
> though?
>
> Historically, cased doubles came with a wad punch sized for the gun
> which
> wed you to cut your own.  These punches were also advertised in the
> catalogs of major gun suppliers to the trade, and most mercantiles
> carried
> them as an accessory.  I have a number of catalogs showing such.
>
> Dave Kanger
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info:
> http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>
>

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Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 15:12:38 -0700
From: "Wynn Ormond" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Beams

Today I have been fleshing a couple of deer hides and for a change I rigged
my beam so that it was a waist high push beam instead of the ussual lean
agianst the wall, chest high type.  I really like the way this works, except
for the fact that your pants get more wet and smelly.

 I am curious which types others prefer or if they use different ones for
different jobs etc.  Input?
Wynn Ormond

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Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 14:25:25 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloading shotgun loading

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>I would like to compliament Dave Kanger on his comments on shooting smooth=20
bores.=A0

Charlie, thanks for the kind words, but you have probably forgotten more tha=
n=20
most of us can remember about shooting.  I still have many of your old=20
postings archived on floppies.

>I sincerely wish Dave would share his experiences

I guess that I am kind of like you.  When you weigh the time vs the=20
aggravation factor, it don't weigh out in the end.  Just seems to fall on=20
deaf ears.  I have pulled out of almost all of my volunteer efforts and just=
=20
do my own thing now.  I have opened a retail muzzleloading and gunbuilding=20
store.  It takes up most of my time.

Thanks again.
Dave

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<HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=
=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">>I would like to compliament Dave Kanger on his com=
ments on shooting smooth bores.=A0<BR>
<BR>
Charlie, thanks for the kind words, but you have probably forgotten more tha=
n most of us can remember about shooting.  I still have many of your ol=
d postings archived on floppies.<BR>
<BR>
>I sincerely wish Dave would share his experiences<BR>
<BR>
I guess that I am kind of like you.  When you weigh the time vs the agg=
ravation factor, it don't weigh out in the end.  Just seems to fall on=20=
deaf ears.  I have pulled out of almost all of my volunteer efforts and=
 just do my own thing now.  I have opened a retail muzzleloading and gu=
nbuilding store.  It takes up most of my time.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks again.<BR>
Dave</FONT></HTML>

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Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 12:11:45 -0700 (MST)
From: <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beams

Wynn,
     I was taught to flesh on a waist high beam, fleshing down and away
from me. There are other ways but this is the way you see it in old
English drawings and its been done this way for centuries. Might be harder
on the back than chest high but the hide or pelt can be handled quicker as
just stomach pressure holds it in place and it can be moved quickly. I
think the speed factor out weighs the need for comfort when you have a
pile of furs or hides to flesh or dehair. IÆve fleshed everything from
rats to buffalo on this type of set up.
     It is messy. I wear a full-length rubber apron and knee high rubber
boots plus rubber surgical gloves so clean up after three hours of
fleshing is minimal. I also place a large (4Æ x 4Æ) piece of cardboard
under the beam to keep the floor clean up to a minimum. With the rubber
apron on you can use a piece of burlap or old rag between the hide and
your stomach as you put pressure on the hide to hold it in place. The rag
keeps it from sliding out of place. I then have a stool on each side of me
so I can reach my double handed fleshing tool, Dexter knife, or steel as
needed. I also keep a pot on one of the stools for meat scraps I knife off
and feed to the dogs.
     The beam should be cleaned once in awhile or as needed when it gets
greasy. You may have to rasp it too once in a great while to smooth out
any gouges from the double handed fleshing tool. I have a heavy beam for
in the garage and a smaller 4ö inch wide one for canoe trips or camps.
They are both made of hardwood and both fold.
      In my ten years of buying furs at trapperÆs homes I saw every beam
set up imaginable. I guess itÆs what you like but if you spend more than 5
minutes fleshing a coon, 20 minutes fleshing a beaver or ╜ an hour
fleshing a deer hide you probably could use to improve the method you
chose. But if a guy only has a few hides or pelts a year to do, who cares
how long it takes him.
     One thing about time on a beam. ItÆs always been hard work and always
will be hard work.
                beaverboy

> Today I have been fleshing a couple of deer hides and for a change I
> rigged my beam so that it was a waist high push beam instead of the
> ussual lean agianst the wall, chest high type.  I really like the way
> this works, except for the fact that your pants get more wet and
> smelly.
>
> I am curious which types others prefer or if they use different ones
> for
> different jobs etc.  Input?
> Wynn Ormond
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 13:14:34 -0500
From: "traprjon" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beams

Hi Wayne,
    I always use the waist high beam where you push the fleshing knife away
from you (except for beaver which I lay on a plywood board and start to tack
out while using a beaver knife or ulu and keep stretching and tacking as I
get the fat/tissue off).  I also wear a rubber or waterproof covered fabric
type apron that hangs below the knees.  I put a box under the beam as an
easy place to drop the scraped off fat and tissue.  These methods work best
for me.  I guess it's all in what you get used to.  Good luck!!!
Sincerely,
John Enos
TrapRJohn
[e-mail]


- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Wynn Ormond" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2002 5:12 PM
Subject: MtMan-List: Beams


> Today I have been fleshing a couple of deer hides and for a change I
rigged
> my beam so that it was a waist high push beam instead of the ussual lean
> agianst the wall, chest high type.  I really like the way this works,
except
> for the fact that your pants get more wet and smelly.
>
>  I am curious which types others prefer or if they use different ones for
> different jobs etc.  Input?
> Wynn Ormond
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 09:20:12 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beams

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What you are doing now is what I like best. I am a life member of National
Trappers Assn. and have fleshed many, many pelts. A rubber apron helps
preserve clothing or an old pair of chest waders

                         Ridge Pole

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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">What you are doing now is what I like best. I am a life member of National Trappers Assn. and have fleshed many, many pelts. A rubber apron helps preserve clothing or an old pair of chest waders<BR>
<BR>
                         Ridge Pole</FONT></HTML>

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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 21:49:41 -0800
From: "Randal Bublitz" <[e-mail]>
Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Beams

Hi Wynn,   I prefer the wet scrape method, generally.  Large hides (elk)
need to be done in a frame, yet I still pretty much do them wet.  For a
beam, as I live in a quasi desert area (ie, no access to cottonwood, etc...
trees), I use a piece of PVC sewer pipe as a scraping beam.  I lay the pipe
along a couple of saw horses (that have  V shaped fittings on the ends for
holding non square pieces).  I lay the hide over the horizontal pipe, lean
on the end, and scrape away from me.  I put the far end of the pipe against
a wall, or fence to hold it steady.  I keep a trash bag handy to put
between me and the wet hide.  In this way I keep from looking like I wet my
pants. I've tried other methods, and I prefer this way.  I Like the wet
scrape method because I can wrap it up at any point, and put it in the
freezer until I'm ready to continue.  Also, with the wet scrape method one
can work the hide to the very edges, leaving less wasted hide.  The dry
scrape method will allow for one to work, wait, and work some more...but, a
margin of the hide is wasted where it is laced into the frame.  I have
dogs, and they will chew on a hide if I leave it hanging around in a frame
(darned mutts).  I have done many hides, but still consider myself a
student of the craft.  I am always open to suggestions (especially labor
saving ones).  If you are not familiar with www.braintan.com , you should
be....check it out.  There is lots of good info. on that site.  Also
nativetech.com.    I also would like o hear other's input.     hardtack

Randal Bublitz
[e-mail]
Freedom is Not Free


> [Original Message]
> From: Wynn Ormond <[e-mail]>
> To: <[e-mail]>
> Date: 12/14/02 2:12:38 PM
> Subject: MtMan-List: Beams
>
> Today I have been fleshing a couple of deer hides and for a change I
rigged
> my beam so that it was a waist high push beam instead of the ussual lean
> agianst the wall, chest high type.  I really like the way this works,
except
> for the fact that your pants get more wet and smelly.
>
>  I am curious which types others prefer or if they use different ones for
> different jobs etc.  Input?
> Wynn Ormond
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 01:15:33 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloading shotgun loading

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In a message dated 12/10/2002 12:35:14 PM Pacific Standard Time,
[e-mail] writes:

> The neat thing about
> an open choked gun, is that you can vary the components to pattern at
> almost
> any distance up to 70 yards.  It's a science gained through experience and
> experimentation.
>

Can't say that I've ever seen a cylinder bore (open choked?) shotgun
"pattern" at 70 yards.... save for a few pellets getting there. What kinda
load are you using????

Magpie

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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">In a message dated 12/10/2002 12:35:14 PM Pacific Standard Time, [e-mail] writes:<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">The neat thing about <BR>
an open choked gun, is that you can vary the components to pattern at almost <BR>
any distance up to 70 yards.  It's a science gained through experience and <BR>
experimentation.<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
Can't say that I've ever seen a cylinder bore (open choked?) shotgun "pattern" at 70 yards.... save for a few pellets getting there. What kinda load are you using???? <BR>
<BR>
Magpie</FONT></HTML>

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Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 12:01:52 -0500
From: [e-mail]
Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Beams

Wynne,

I like the waist beam, also.  I feel I can get more ooomph! into each push if neccessary and have more control of the hide. And if not doing a PC hide, a lawn&leaf bag tied round the waist keep the pants clean!  Seems to go faster with this beam for me, too.
- -Chris B.
"Wynn Ormond" <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Today I have been fleshing a couple of deer hides and for a change I rigged
>my beam so that it was a waist high push beam instead of the ussual lean
>agianst the wall, chest high type. áI really like the way this works, except
>for the fact that your pants get more wet and smelly.
>
> I am curious which types others prefer or if they use different ones for
>different jobs etc. áInput?
>Wynn Ormond
>
>----------------------
>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 16:45:39 -0800
From: "Lee Newbill" <[e-mail]>
Subject: MtMan-List: Pacific Northwest Things To Do

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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 Here's a couple of things that have crossed my desk recently, passing =
'em on to y'all.

Regards

Lee Newbill
AMM#1821
January
Jan 19, 2003
Hells Canyon Muzzleloaders Annual Turkey Shoot
Near Clarkston, Wa
Larry Presnell: 509 746-3109=20


- -------------------------------------------------------------------------=
- -------

February
Feb 1-2, 2003
Tioga Mountian Men Winter Rendezvous
Coos Bay Oregon (10 miles east of Coos Bay at Rook Higgins Park)
POC: Ken Sjogren: 541-396-5565 =20

Feb 14-16, 2003
Rain-De-Vous '03
Olympia, Washington (south of) (Littlerock,Wa)
POC: Booshway- Robinson Hartsell [phone] or Segundo- Kevin Stuber =
[phone]

Feb 15-16 2003
Muzzleloader & Primitive Crafts Show for the year 2003
Coeur D'Alene, Idaho
At the Fairgrounds


- -------------------------------------------------------------------------=
- -------

March

Mar 8-9, 2003
Cascade Mountian Men Gun Show
King County Fairgrounds, Enumclaw Washington

Mar 9, 2003 (2nd  weekend in March)
Muzzleloading Clubs of the Snake & Clearwater Confluence Memorial Shoot
Near Clarkston, Washington
POC: Russell Page at [phone], email [e-mail]; Don =
Robinson, email [e-mail]

Mar 14-16, 2003
7th Annual Pioneer Living Craft Show=20
Kitsap County Fairgrounds, Bremerton,  WA
POC: Too Frank email at [e-mail], or phone at [phone]

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dwindows-1252">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1126" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>
<DIV> <STRONG><FONT size=3D4>Here's a couple of things that have =
crossed my=20
desk recently, passing 'em on to y'all.</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT size=3D4></FONT></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT size=3D4>Regards</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT size=3D4></FONT></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT size=3D4>Lee =
Newbill<BR>AMM#1821</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<H2 align=3Dcenter><BIG>January</BIG></H2>
<P align=3Dleft><BIG><STRONG>Jan 19, 2003<BR></STRONG><A=20
href=3D"rendz_flyers_2003/hellscanyon_turkey02.gif">Hells Canyon =
Muzzleloaders=20
Annual Turkey Shoot</A><BR>Near Clarkston, Wa<BR>Larry Presnell: 509 =
746-3109=20
</BIG></P>
<DIV>
<HR>
</DIV>
<H2 align=3Dcenter><BIG><A name=3D2></A>February</BIG></H2>
<P><STRONG><BIG>Feb 1-2, 2003</BIG><BR></STRONG><A=20
href=3D"rendz_flyers_2003/tioga_mt_mn.gif"><BIG>Tioga Mountian Men =
Winter=20
Rendezvous</BIG></A><BR><BIG>Coos Bay Oregon (10 miles east of Coos Bay =
at Rook=20
Higgins Park)</BIG><BR><BIG>POC: Ken Sjogren: 541-396-5565<STRONG>  =

</STRONG></BIG></P>
<P><BIG><STRONG>Feb 14-16, 2003<BR></STRONG><A=20
href=3D"rendz_flyers_2003/rain_de_voo_2003.gif">Rain-De-Vous =
'03</A><BR>Olympia,=20
Washington (south of) (Littlerock,Wa)<BR>POC: Booshway- Robinson =
Hartsell (360)=20
459-2387 or Segundo- Kevin Stuber [phone]</BIG></P>
<P><BIG><STRONG>Feb 15-16 2003<BR></STRONG><A=20
href=3D"rendz_flyers_2003/cda_2003.gif">Muzzleloader & Primitive =
Crafts Show=20
for the year 2003</A><BR>Coeur D'Alene, Idaho<BR>At the =
Fairgrounds</BIG></P>
<DIV>
<HR>
</DIV>
<H2 align=3Dcenter><BIG><A name=3D3></A>March</BIG></H2>
<P align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT><BR><STRONG><BIG>Mar 8-9, =
2003</BIG><BR></STRONG><BIG>Cascade=20
Mountian Men Gun Show</BIG><BR><BIG>King County Fairgrounds, Enumclaw=20
Washington</BIG></P>
<P align=3Dleft><BIG><STRONG>Mar 9, 2003 (2<SUP>nd<SPAN=20
style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">  </SPAN></SUP>weekend in =
March)<BR></STRONG><A=20
href=3D"rendz_flyers_2003/memorial.htm">Muzzleloading Clubs of the Snake =
&=20
Clearwater Confluence Memorial Shoot</BIG><BR></A><BIG>Near Clarkston,=20
Washington<BR>POC: Russell Page at [phone], email <A=20
href=3D"mailto:[e-mail]">[e-mail]</A>; Don =
Robinson, email=20
<A =
href=3D"mailto:[e-mail]">[e-mail]</A></BIG></=
P>
<P align=3Dleft><BIG><STRONG>Mar 14-16, 2003<BR></STRONG>7th Annual =
Pioneer Living=20
Craft Show <BR>Kitsap County Fairgrounds, Bremerton,  WA<BR>POC: <A =

href=3D"mailto:[e-mail]">Too Frank</A> email at <A=20
href=3D"mailto:[e-mail]">[e-mail]</A>, or phone at =
(253)=20
472-6110</BIG></P></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 18:35:01 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beams

In a message dated 12/14/02 10:17:38 PM, [e-mail] writes:

<<  Input? >>

Wear a blacksmith apron or one of similar pattern.  If you are not given to
100% authenticity, get on that is waterproom
Cheers
Richard James

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Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 12:29:01 -0800
From: "Lee Newbill" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beams

Hallo Wynn

I have done a few hides, but by no means am an expert. I've done enough to
know that I prefer to pay others for their work <G>

I prefer the push beam with a heavy rubber chemist's apron to keep the
lovely smell from permeating everything. I've tried mounting the hides on
boards, staking them out on the ground, etc, but find the beam is the
fastest and least hard on my back. The only caveat to the beam is that one
needs to make sure it is completely smooth... otherwise you risk punching
through the hide if your tool catches on a bump or divet.

Regards

Lee Newbill of North Idaho
AMM# 1821

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Wynn Ormond" <[e-mail]>
> Today I have been fleshing a couple of deer hides and for a change I
rigged
> my beam so that it was a waist high push beam instead of the ussual lean
> agianst the wall, chest high type.  I really like the way this works,
except
> for the fact that your pants get more wet and smelly.
>
>  I am curious which types others prefer or if they use different ones for
> different jobs etc.  Input?
> Wynn Ormond

- ----------------------
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 17:02:13 -0800
From: "kc16" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beams

I have only done a few hides.....deer or elk.  I did flesh out one beaver in
the field and did it the way some native tribes did....staked it to the
ground....that worked very well, except my back and knees bothered me from
having to kneel the whole time.  Thank God it was just a beaver.

The deer and elk hides I've done have always been in a frame with a wahinke
(sp?)  I enjoyed that method alot.  I did do one over a beam and it was ok,
but didn't impress me as being any better than the frame except you didn't
have to lace the hide into the frame....so in that respect it was easier.

Anyway you do it.....it's work!

Blood
#1651  NW Co Party

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Newbill" <[e-mail]>
To: <[e-mail]>
Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2002 12:29 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beams


> Hallo Wynn
>
> I have done a few hides, but by no means am an expert. I've done enough to
> know that I prefer to pay others for their work <G>
>
> I prefer the push beam with a heavy rubber chemist's apron to keep the
> lovely smell from permeating everything. I've tried mounting the hides on
> boards, staking them out on the ground, etc, but find the beam is the
> fastest and least hard on my back. The only caveat to the beam is that one
> needs to make sure it is completely smooth... otherwise you risk punching
> through the hide if your tool catches on a bump or divet.
>
> Regards
>
> Lee Newbill of North Idaho
> AMM# 1821
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Wynn Ormond" <[e-mail]>
> > Today I have been fleshing a couple of deer hides and for a change I
> rigged
> > my beam so that it was a waist high push beam instead of the ussual lean
> > agianst the wall, chest high type.  I really like the way this works,
> except
> > for the fact that your pants get more wet and smelly.
> >
> >  I am curious which types others prefer or if they use different ones
for
> > different jobs etc.  Input?
> > Wynn Ormond
>
> ----------------------
> hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html
>

- ----------------------
hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html

------------------------------

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