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hats Digest              Saturday, 1 February 1997     Volume 02 : Number 015

In this issue:

    Re: (hats) Pop Goes the World
    Re: (hats) PGTW/21st Century talk!
    (hats) Re: Pop Goes the World/21 Century
    (hats) What is this?
    (hats) Thank You
    (hats) Re: Dons Emotive powers
    (hats) Re: Pop Goes the World/21 Century
    (hats) Re: What is this (Sideways)?
    Re: (hats) What is this?
    Re: (hats) Pop Goes the World
    (hats) MWH Video/Cd's
    Re: (hats) Howdy
    Re: (hats) Pop Goes the World
    (hats) PGTW/21st Century
    Re: (hats) Pop Goes the World
    Re: (hats) Pop Goes the World
    (hats) Synthsound
    (hats) Re: Cheezy Synthesizers

See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the hats
or hats-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Gregor Watson <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 1997 22:29:03 GMT
Subject: Re: (hats) Pop Goes the World

>21st >Century is impressive too.  Why doesn't anyone ever talk about that?

"Underneath the rainbow" and "I'm in love" are IMO two of the very best
songs ever - All time, not just MWH tracks.

Gregor

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------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Donald Stroud)
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 1997 16:36:01 -0800
Subject: Re: (hats) PGTW/21st Century talk!

>
> >21st >Century is impressive too.  Why doesn't anyone ever talk about that?
>

I used to talk about "21st Century" and "Pop" all the time. But it seems
like the majority of the fans on the mailing list enjoy the first two
albums more.

Don't get me wrong, I love just about everything the band created... hell,
it was "Safety Dance" that got me hooked on techno-pop to begin with!
But the later albums struck an emotional chord in me... they appealed to
me in a way that was much deeper than just "fun to listen to".

"Pop Goes The World" (the song) will forever live on in my memory... I
mimed the entire video for the song to the love of my life. She thought it
was hysterical. We're no longer together, sadly enough, and everytime I
hear it I remember the smile on her face and how much I still love her.

Which leads me to "Bright Side Of The Sun". Hearing that song for the
first time was like a punch in the gut, as the aforementioned woman and
I had parted ways (on her insistance), and I'd had fallings-out with a
couple of very good friends. It's still my fondest wish that one day I
and all the people I miss will find some way to meet again and continue
what I believe was merely put on hold. I've ended many, many, many mixed
tapes with this song.

"O Sole Mio" really hits home because of the situation I find myself in now:
far from my original home and without much meaningful human contact. (For
some reason, I used to make my own videos for this song in my head... they
all ended with Ivan atop a rainbow, arms spread, surveying a lush green
landscape. Dunno why...)

"In The 21st Century" is wonderful. I can't explain it any better than that.
Sometimes there are sounds or sights or smells that grab you and won't let
go... this song is like that. And after getting Tom's tape and finally
seeing the video, it's leapt WAAAAAY up on my list of faves. That video is
truly something special.

"You & Me" is haunting. I love how Ivan talks about all these major events
in his life that, to anyone else, would be so trivial, but to him are
moments of epiphany. The 'angel in a stream' line is something I can relate to,
having spent an afternoon wading down a river with a girlfriend and having
the time of my life. And the most important event in his life? 'You and
me.' Really, really touching. (See my comments above about the love of my
life...)

"All We Do" is another song that makes you look at what's in front of you
in a different light. 'If all we do is live and die..' It's so cool how
the lyrics cause you to notice what you have, how important it is to
experience everything, and about how life is something special, something
that people seem to take for granted.


Okay, sorry for being so long-winded, but I've been in a wordy, emotive
mood lately. And someone *did* ask for some discussion about these
albums, so it's not all my fault!...

Looking forward to the 2-on-1 CD,

Don2
[e-mail]



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------------------------------

From: Steven Enz <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 1997 20:00:56 -0800
Subject: (hats) Re: Pop Goes the World/21 Century

> You know, I find it strange how everyone loves early MWH but doesn't have
> much to say about their later stuff.
>        Hillary

Actually,  I remember taking a poll of the hats listing about six months
ago and Pop Goes the World came out on top. The exact results were:

Pop Goes The World--------9.411
FOT80 /  FREEWAYS---------9.400
Rhythm Of Youth-----------9.222
FOT80 III-----------------8.644
Adventures in 21 Century--8.056
Sideways------------------6.375

(people rated every album out of 10 and the average was taken)

Times change of coarse so the numbers might be a little different if it
were taken now.  Personally, I was extatic when I first heard 21 Century
and I would give just about anything if MWH came out with another album
of similar quality!  Like Don Stroud, I have many personal memories that
I associate to that period in time, made even more memorable because of
this album. I think we all do because this album does have some very
intense and emotional works. Ivan did well to communicate those ideas to
us!

I still can't figure out what happened with Sideways though!  There
seems to be anger and frustration coming from this one. (And IMHO,
little else!)

Pop Goes The World is my favourite album. The title track, On Tuesday, O
Sole Mio, Lose My Way, Moonbeam, Jenny Wore Black and especially The End
(of the World) are all songs that have no equal ANYWHERE in the entire
world. One thing about PGTW is that it was done as a single work of art,
unfolding like a story and refering to itself while Ivan even refers to
his own past! PGTW is unparalleled, beautiful, and simply THE best album
in existance!

Senz

Senz

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------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 1997 22:46:44 -0500 (EST)
Subject: (hats) What is this?

I am new to this list. MWH has been with me since I first heard Safety
Dance.
Each work is excellent in itself. Each work is progressively better than
the last.
Sideways has some of the best lyrical content ever written! The musical
content is a step in a different direction, and it is a direction that
I enjoyed very much.
Sideways is not the first work to have a different musical content. From
synth-pop to a "tasteful" broad range styling pop to a r'n'r pop to
Sideways(a delightful mix of stylings), MWH has always been progressive.
Sideways is a step away from the pop stylings we were used to hearing. The
feeling is still there, though.
And let us not forget, Sideways has the first Beatles cover song that was
better than the original!
Later,
Andrew Bradford

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------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 1997 21:46:58 -0600
Subject: (hats) Thank You

To All the people who replied to my Pop Goes the World querie:
            Thank You.
    I'm glad some others agree with me that PGTW is the best album in
existence.  I'm also glad that someone else thinks that Underneath the
Rainbow is the best song ever.  I know I do.  Thanks guys,
                    Hillary

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------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 1997 23:25:03 -0500
Subject: (hats) Re: Dons Emotive powers

Don....

your "longwindedness and emotive mood swings" are welcome anytime .
thanks for sharing.

wolfgang



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------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Rod MacQuarrie)
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 1997 23:37:16 EST
Subject: (hats) Re: Pop Goes the World/21 Century

On Thu, 30 Jan 1997 20:00:56 -0800 Steven Enz <[e-mail]> writes:
>Actually,  I remember taking a poll of the hats listing about six
>months
>ago and Pop Goes the World came out on top. The exact results were:
>
>Pop Goes The World--------9.411
>FOT80 /  FREEWAYS---------9.400
>Rhythm Of Youth-----------9.222
>FOT80 III-----------------8.644
>Adventures in 21 Century--8.056
>Sideways------------------6.375

Hmmm...I just might want to change my vote now...I'm preferring them
almost in order of release as time goes on....But then again there's 21st
Century....I hate those kind of decisions!!!

>Personally, I was extatic when I first heard 21
>Century
>and I would give just about anything if MWH came out with another
>album
>of similar quality!

I disliked this album when it first came out...now I absolutely love it!
Times change...


>I still can't figure out what happened with Sideways though!  There
>seems to be anger and frustration coming from this one. (And IMHO,
>little else!)

Ditto...but somewhat before its time wouldn't you say?

>The title track, On Tuesday,
>O
>Sole Mio, Lose My Way, Moonbeam, Jenny Wore Black and especially The
>End
>(of the World) are all songs that have no equal ANYWHERE in the entire
>world...

Yes...same with every other song ever done in the entire world....

..PGTW is unparalleled, beautiful, and simply THE best
>album
>in existance!

Hmmmm....that's pushing it a little...What of Roxy Music's "Avalon"???
That has got to be the best one "ever" in my opinion...

Rod

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------------------------------

From: Steven Enz <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 1997 22:18:37 -0800
Subject: (hats) Re: What is this (Sideways)?

[e-mail] wrote:

> Sideways has some of the best lyrical content ever written!

I agree that Ivan's poetic communication continued to shine through even
in this album.

> Sideways is not the first work to have a different musical content. From
> synth-pop to a "tasteful" broad range styling pop to a r'n'r pop to
> Sideways(a delightful mix of stylings)

I disagree here though. Except for sideways, MWH is not that easily
pigeon-holed. In the beginning Ivan went through great lengths to go
beyond the music of the day. (ie create something new and different)  It
seems to me that in Sideways he made no such effort.

Rod MacQuarrie,  this is what I mean when I say a song "has no equal".
Some songs are very uniquly constructed and others are simply rip-offs
(blatantly sometimes) of earlier songs or ideas. There aren't many songs
or artists (for that matter!) who don't continuously mimmick other more
sucessful artists.

and yes I do believe that PGTW is even better than Avalon!  Just a
matter of taste here though, Rod ;-)

Senz

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------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Date: Fri, 31 Jan 1997 03:48:13 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: (hats) What is this?

well hello everyone i am new to list well im not the one to be listed its my
brother.  My computer though, but anyways he love the men without hats so i
found this for him   he reads all the letters and has great stuff to say but
is shy!  So i thought once again and help him out(after all he is family)
with talking on the list here.  So maybe if some of u wrote to the list maybe
to mention him,  his name is dave Woodman.  Im not to sure what to say but
maybe anything im sure some of u can think of something!

thanx
tj

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------------------------------

From: "Lars Wendt" <[e-mail]>
Date: 31 Jan 1997 10:35:29 +0100
Subject: Re: (hats) Pop Goes the World

I agree with you Hillary and Thomas. Personally I find PGTW one of the best
pop-albums ever to be written. More than ROY and FOT80's it is cleverly
balanced between up-beat and off-tempo music. It is also a concept album which
is neatly tied together in the beginning and the end. I think of it as a circle
of good music which never stops. You can play it over and over and it never
stops to amaze me how cleverly it is put together. It is really well-produced
and all the music is really melodic.

I also believe that since ROY and FOT80 has become so rare, more and more
people wanted to get what they couldn't get. I think it is obvious that most of
the success of this list is based on the fact that ROY and FOT80 is impossible
to get hold of. It wouldn't be so fun chasing a record which was in every shop
in the world. Some of the excitement would be lost then. I think that most of
us wants to prove to the rest of the world that MWH really made great music. We
still hope that the new records would sell in great volumes and that Ivan & co
would get really popular again, since they never really got to stay at the top.

I have never heard the mixes of PGTW though, so I still have something to look
forward to, if someone wants to make copies available.

Greetings

Lars

'Ladies and Gentlemen: Pop Goes the World by Men Without Hats'

>
> You know, I find it strange how everyone loves early MWH but doesn't have

> much to say about their later stuff.  I love ROY and Folk of the Eighties
> but I personally think that Pop Goes the World is their best work.  21st
> Century is impressive too.  Why doesn't anyone ever talk about that?  Oh,
> and does anyone know how to get a copy of the Pop Goes the World video
> collection?
>       Hillary

Hehe, picked up a used copy of PGTW for $7 right yesterday. It's $25 at the
only regular store in town that has it.
Although it was a wednesday, I loved 'On Tuesday' from the very first time
 I
listened to it. (Most music I like needed more time to grow on me.) They
 were
really at their best in ballads! Think of 'You And Me' or 'Everybody Wants
 To
Know'!
And yes, Hillary, I'd also say that I like PGTW (the song) most of all I've
heard from them so far (including ROY). In particular, I love the awsome
remixes.

Hmm, so why does noone ever talk about these albums? Perhaps they are not
 rare
enough? ;-) I wonder what we'll talk about when everybody has the 2in1 ...

Greetings, Thomas

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__________________________________________________________________

Lars Wendt
Telenor Online AS
Tel + 47 22771900 - ext: + 47 22771806
Fax + 47 22771910
Internet: [e-mail]
P.O.Box 405, 1324 Lysaker, Norway
Office: Vollsveien 6, Lysaker
__________________________________________________________________

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------------------------------

From: FRANCOIS BLAWAT <CUNAGWC#c#CUNAGWC.CUCS#c#[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 31 Jan 1997 08:53:25 -0600
Subject: (hats) MWH Video/Cd's

Hi all,

   Any word yet on when there will be another video or cd out?  I've
written to this list three separate times and I haven't heard back. All I've
heard is that Olgio will be releasing a CD but not for sale in the US.



Francois

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------------------------------

From: CartOOn Guy <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 31 Jan 1997 14:24:17 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: (hats) Howdy

>things. I love "I LIKE" and "I GOT THE MESSAGE"!! I think the Pet Shop Boys
>could do a great remake version of IGTM with Bananarama singing the chorus!
>Whatya think?

Actually that wouldn't sound too bad.  Good idea!  And welcome to the
mailing list :)

I think Pet Shop Boys would also do a good cover of "The Great Ones
Remember" seeing that they also write lyrics which sometimes are difficult
to understand the meaning of the songs.
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
<> HAVE A SURREAL DAY!                                    <>
<> Bored?  Read some comics at                            <>
<> http://www.interlog.com/~daniele                       <>
<> This month's issue is now up!                          <>
<> Daniele Rossi                                          <>
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>


apelle figlio di apollo fece una palla di pelle di pollo tutti i pesci
vennero a galla per vedere la palla di apelle figlio di apollo




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------------------------------

From: Thomas Bieler <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 31 Jan 1997 21:25:12 +0100 (MET)
Subject: Re: (hats) Pop Goes the World

> I also believe that since ROY and FOT80 has become so rare, more and more
> people wanted to get what they couldn't get. I think it is obvious that most of
> the success of this list is based on the fact that ROY and FOT80 is impossible
> to get hold of. It wouldn't be so fun chasing a record which was in every shop
> in the world. Some of the excitement would be lost then.
Carl, what kinda people are the two of us? We're gonna DESTROY this list!  ;-)
[snicker!]

Thomas

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------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Date: Fri, 31 Jan 1997 15:56:00 -0600
Subject: (hats) PGTW/21st Century

I was very happy at my response to the Pop Goes the World message.  And I agree\with the person who said that this mailing list thrives because of the fact
that ROY and FOT80 are so rare.  But hey, I've never seen a copy of 21st
Century on CD and I've only seen 1 of Pop Goes the World, the one my
brother found for a dollar.  And I don't even have a copy of Sideways.
Where do you guys find these CD's.  When PGTW came out, I was only 7
years old so I hardly went out and bought the CD.  If anybody happens to have
an extra copy just lying around...
                    Hillary

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------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Jupiter Eight)
Date: Sat, 01 Feb 1997 00:42:51 EST
Subject: Re: (hats) Pop Goes the World

On Fri, 31 Jan 1997 21:25:12 +0100 (MET) Thomas Bieler
<[e-mail]> writes:
>> I also believe that since ROY and FOT80 has become so rare, more and
>more
>> people wanted to get what they couldn't get. I think it is obvious
>that most of
>> the success of this list is based on the fact that ROY and FOT80 is
>impossible
>> to get hold of. It wouldn't be so fun chasing a record which was in
>every shop
>> in the world. Some of the excitement would be lost then.
>Carl, what kinda people are the two of us? We're gonna DESTROY this
>list!  ;-)
>[snicker!]

I think the reason the first two albums are my favorites is because they
used the raw Prophet-5 instruments (for those with the video its the
wooden looking synths - three of them used in the concert). That synth
has a quality about it that make the songs sound so....synth poppy...And
Men Without Hats wrote great synthpop on the first two albums. The next
two albums used alot of digital stuff and sampled voices...then came the
grunge on the last one. As someone who prefers the old analog sound over
digital or even guitar, I feel that the first two albums are best just
because of the instruments they used. The sound is so unique and brash
and bubbly. But when you think about it, the songs really remained quite
the same from album to album but the band used different instruments to
songwrite with.

But I agree with you...notice how quiet the list got once everyone
received the video and 3CD set? Makes me wonder what will happen too once
the 2-fer is out.

Rod

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------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Christofer Evangelista)
Date: Fri, 31 Jan 1997 22:22:45 -0800
Subject: Re: (hats) Pop Goes the World

>I think the reason the first two albums are my favorites is because they
>used the raw Prophet-5 instruments (for those with the video its the
>wooden looking synths - three of them used in the concert). That synth
>has a quality about it that make the songs sound so....synth poppy...And
>Men Without Hats wrote great synthpop on the first two albums. The next
>two albums used alot of digital stuff and sampled voices...then came the
>grunge on the last one. As someone who prefers the old analog sound over
>digital or even guitar, I feel that the first two albums are best just
>because of the instruments they used. The sound is so unique and brash
>and bubbly. But when you think about it, the songs really remained quite
>the same from album to album but the band used different instruments to
>songwrite with.

You gotta love that rennisance (sp?) medival sound that created with those
cool sounding analog synths. The Great ones remember also had some
interesting synth arrangements and is one of my fave songs. Folk of the
80s had some experimental digital stuff (the weird clashing sound on
Eurotheme for example) that kind of continued the experimentation with
electronics. The later stuff does have some analogish sounds on it
(Moonbeam, Walk on Water, I'm in love) but it isn't the same. Still I like
Pop goes the world and In the 21st century nonetheless, but I'll always
love Rhythm of youths synthy sound. It was that album that taught me how
to play keyboards. :)



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------------------------------

From: Steven Enz <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 01 Feb 1997 00:57:45 -0800
Subject: (hats) Synthsound

> That synth
> has a quality about it that make the songs sound so....synth poppy...And
> Men Without Hats wrote great synthpop on the first two albums.

That synth sound sure feels nice on the ears! But its more than just the
fact that its synth.  These albums feel like they were created by a
playful and enthusiastic Ivan. (ie. they are very clever albums). You're
right though, there are two kinds of synth but I think its not quite
"analog vs sampler".  For example, I easily created that cheezy synth on
my Roland S-10 by looping single pulses of just about any sample. This
created a square wave which is in fact the basis of those analog
synths.  The first 2 or 3 albums of MWH used these simpler waveforms
while PGTW used more complex waveforms.  Acoustic instruments have
infinitely complex waveforms (which, of coarse, end up being sampled
waveforms when on a CD).

My heart has always been with that wonderful "cheezy" synth and if it
came right down to a decision between the first 3 MWH albums and PGTW
I'd have to go with the first 3 "cheezy" ones.  But PGTW was more
adventurous, had a great variety of sounds (that's an understatement!)
and put together with meticulous attention to detail and the art of
music.

> ...notice how quiet the list got once everyone
> received the video and 3CD set? Makes me wonder what will happen too once
> the 2-fer is out.

I noticed this too!  I'll admit, when I got the video I had the sense of
being content. (Like my long thirst for MWH and been quenched.)  Now, I
NEED MORE!!!!  Hurry up IVAN!

Senz

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------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Jupiter Eight)
Date: Sat, 01 Feb 1997 11:03:11 EST
Subject: (hats) Re: Cheezy Synthesizers

On Fri, 31 Jan 1997 22:22:45 -0800 [e-mail] (Christofer
Evangelista) writes:
>
>You gotta love that rennisance (sp?) medival sound that created with
>those
>cool sounding analog synths. The Great ones remember also had some
>interesting synth arrangements and is one of my fave songs. Folk of
>the
>80s had some experimental digital stuff (the weird clashing sound on
>Eurotheme for example) that kind of continued the experimentation with
>
>electronics.

Yeah...I believe it was one of the first samplers...Emulator II or
Synclavier...

 The later stuff does have some analogish sounds on it
>(Moonbeam, Walk on Water, I'm in love) but it isn't the same. Still I
>like
>Pop goes the world and In the 21st century nonetheless, but I'll
>always
>love Rhythm of youths synthy sound. It was that album that taught me
>how
>to play keyboards. :)

The video for 21st Century shows a guy playing a little Korg semi-modular
synth - either an MS-10 or MS-20...incidently a very popular synth in
these techno times...

Rod

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------------------------------

End of hats Digest V2 #15
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