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From: owner-canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com (canslim-digest)
To: canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com
Subject: canslim-digest V2 #1962
Reply-To: canslim
Sender: owner-canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com
Errors-To: owner-canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com
Precedence: bulk
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-No-Archive: yes
canslim-digest Sunday, December 16 2001 Volume 02 : Number 1962
In this issue:
Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2001 20:36:30 -0500
From: "Dan Forant" <dforant1@nycap.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
- ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C18671.57AA75A0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Because in a bad market like this one, short term cup & handles and =
other chart formations used with technical charts help me get out =
quicker. They also bolster my urge to buy a stock. I don't care why a =
stock goes up or down, as long as I can get some insight *when* it will. =
Example, EPIQ, I was in at 22, 11/8 and out 11/20 at 25.15 the close. =
Not a staggering profit, but not a %7 loss either. Macd, macd hist, =
stoch, rsi stock compared to SP500, was falling. I cut and run and don't =
look back. Who was it Carnegie that always sold early?? We've been =
given a lot of huff and puff with this rally. There are many casualties.
DanF
Danf
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Gene Ricci=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 8:08 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
Dan, I assume that you're supporting the 'need' for fundamentals. If =
so, why?
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Dan Forant=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 6:24 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
Funny, I've been using a simple stochastics and macd hist chart for =
months now. Sure when green rolls over red buy. Red over green sell. =
Know what? It works, till *M* rolls around again for Canslim. It's like =
being on vacation away from all the data. The big winners are few to =
none though compared to when Canslim works.
DanF
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Gene Ricci=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 5:23 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with =
fundamentals?
K, thanks for the clarification.
A couple of weeks ago I would have said 'no fundamentals... are =
you kidding me'.=20
I've had several discussions over the past 2-3 weeks and as =
recently as last Thursday, I was told to think 'out of the box' by a VP =
at WizeTrade. I signed up for their 30-day trial (week ago) and was in =
his office 'showing' him the shortcomings of his system. He showed me a =
sign that said... price is determined by buyers and sellers. He went on =
to say that all I had to do was to look at the Green (buy) and Red =
(sell) indicators.... green means more buyers than sellers and red more =
sellers than buyers. The program has charts.... felt better when I found =
that out.... turns out the charts were just time intervals intraday, =
day, week, month.... the lines on the chart were green and red. When the =
green crossed up over red, time to buy.... when red over green it's time =
to sell.=20
From WizeTrade home page or links.
The green line and the red line are summation formulas and not =
price lines or graphs
"No, WizetradeT is not based on "moving averages." =
WizetradeT uses seven key technical indicators to perform its complex =
"real-time" calculations at the rate of 800-1500 calculations per =
second. The seven key indicators are the previous day's closing price, =
the current day's opening price, high, low, every up tick, every down =
tick - which are then exponentially weighted to volume."=20
How can this system work, no fundamentals, stochastic, MACD, =
candlesticks, CANSLIM, etc.?? They seem to take pride in buying =
companies that they don't know much about or what the symbol stands =
for.... they do take pride in the fact that their software tells them =
immediately when there are more buyers than sellers, etc. .... BTW, they =
signaled to get out of ENE at 80+.
I was told that fundamentals were nothing more than a time waster =
and a poor placebo (in a nice way).=20
I'm interested in learning 'the truth'. Certainly would be nice to =
quit looking at fundamentals and all that research as well as spending =
money on DGO/IBD.... etc. WizeTrade also eliminates the need to track or =
know anything about sector rotation.... their buyers and sellers tell =
them all that.
Is it possible that I've been wasting my time looking for data to =
support what I call a good company?
Naw, can't be!
Guess I'll just have to try to understand how and if their system =
works.... over the holidays.=20
Disclaimer: I don't work for them and until my trial is over, I'm =
not even a customer.
Gene
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Katherine Malm=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 2:55 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with =
fundamentals?
That would mean any selection criteria that depended on =
something other than price/volume/volatility technical indicators.
Katherine
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Gene Ricci=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 3:14 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with =
fundamentals?
Please define "any sort of fundamental analysis"...=20
Thanks,
Gene
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Katherine Malm=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 10:12 AM
Subject: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with =
fundamentals?
Proposed:
If a typical CANSLIM/Intermediate term move in a stock lasts =
only a few weeks, and in good markets, only a few months, why bother =
selecting portfolio candidates using any sort of fundamental analysis? =
Returns in this time period are strictly based on price movement and can =
be maximized based on technical indicators and price/volume action =
alone.
Thoughts pro/con?
Katherine
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2600.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Because in a bad market like this one, =
short term=20
cup & handles and other chart formations used with technical charts =
help me=20
get out quicker. They also bolster my urge to buy a stock. I don't =
care=20
why a stock goes up or down, as long as I can get some insight *when* it =
will.=20
Example, EPIQ, I was in at 22, 11/8 and out 11/20 at 25.15 the close. =
Not a=20
staggering profit, but not a %7 loss either. Macd, macd hist, =
stoch, rsi=20
stock compared to SP500, was falling. I cut and run and don't look back. =
Who was=20
it Carnegie that always sold early?? We've been given a lot of =
huff and=20
puff with this rally. There are many casualties.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>DanF</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Danf</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dgenr@swbell.net href=3D"mailto:genr@swbell.net">Gene =
Ricci</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, December 16, 2001 =
8:08=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] Point of =
View: Why=20
bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Dan, I assume that you're supporting =
the=20
'need' for fundamentals. If so, why?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Ddforant1@nycap.rr.com =
href=3D"mailto:dforant1@nycap.rr.com">Dan=20
Forant</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, December 16, =
2001 6:24=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] Point =
of View:=20
Why bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Funny, I've been using a simple =
stochastics and=20
macd hist chart for months now. Sure when green rolls over red buy. =
Red over=20
green sell. Know what? It works, till *M* rolls around again for =
Canslim.=20
It's like being on vacation away from all the data. The big winners =
are few=20
to none though compared to when Canslim works.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>DanF</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dgenr@swbell.net href=3D"mailto:genr@swbell.net">Gene =
Ricci</A>=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, December 16, =
2001 5:23=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] =
Point of View:=20
Why bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">K, thanks for the=20
clarification.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">A couple of weeks ago I would =
have said=20
'no fundamentals... are you kidding me'. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">I've had several discussions =
over the past=20
2-3 weeks and as recently as last Thursday, I was told to think =
'out of=20
the box' by a VP at WizeTrade. </FONT><FONT=20
face=3D"Comic Sans MS">I signed up for their 30-day=20
trial (week ago) and was in his office 'showing' him the =
shortcomings=20
of his system. He showed me a sign that said... price is =
determined by=20
buyers and sellers. He went on to say that all I had to do =
was to=20
look at the Green (buy) and Red (sell) indicators.... green means =
more=20
buyers than sellers and red more sellers than buyers. The program =
has=20
charts.... felt better when I found that out.... turns out the =
charts were=20
just time intervals intraday, day, week, month.... the lines on =
the chart=20
were green and red. When the green crossed up over red, time to =
buy....=20
when red over green it's time to sell. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">From WizeTrade home page or =
links.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> <FONT face=3DArial color=3D#330099 size=3D2><EM>The =
green line and=20
the red line are summation formulas and not price lines or=20
graphs</EM></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV>
<TABLE cellSpacing=3D0 cellPadding=3D2 width=3D"100%" border=3D0>
<TBODY>
<TR vAlign=3Dtop>
<TD align=3Dleft width=3D"98%"><FONT face=3D"Arial, Helvetica, =
sans-serif"=20
color=3D#330099 size=3D2><EM>"No, Wizetrade=99 is not based =
on "moving=20
averages." Wizetrade=99 uses seven key technical indicators =
to perform=20
its complex "real-time" calculations at the rate of 800-1500 =
calculations per second. The seven key indicators are the =
previous=20
day's closing price, the current day's opening price, high, =
low,=20
every up tick, every down tick - which are then =
exponentially=20
weighted to volume."</EM></FONT></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<P><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">How can this system work, no =
fundamentals,=20
stochastic, MACD, candlesticks, CANSLIM, etc.?? They seem to take =
pride in=20
buying companies that they don't know much about or what the =
symbol stands=20
for.... they do take pride in the fact that their software tells =
them=20
immediately when there are more buyers than sellers, etc. =
.... BTW,=20
they signaled to get out of ENE at 80+.</FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">I was told that fundamentals =
were nothing=20
more than a time waster and a poor placebo (in a nice way). =
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">I'm interested in =
learning 'the=20
truth'. Certainly would be nice to quit looking at fundamentals =
and all=20
that research as well as spending money on DGO/IBD.... etc. =
WizeTrade also=20
eliminates the need to track or know anything about sector =
rotation....=20
their buyers and sellers tell them all that.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Is it possible that I've been =
wasting my=20
time looking for data to support what I call a good =
company?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Naw, can't be!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Guess I'll just have to try to =
understand=20
how and if their system works.... over the holidays. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Disclaimer: I don't work for =
them and=20
until my trial is over, I'm not even a customer.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Gene</FONT></DIV></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dkmalm@earthlink.net =
href=3D"mailto:kmalm@earthlink.net">Katherine=20
Malm</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, December =
16, 2001=20
2:55 PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] =
Point of=20
View: Why bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>That would mean any selection =
criteria that=20
depended on something other than price/volume/volatility =
technical=20
indicators.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Katherine</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dgenr@swbell.net =
href=3D"mailto:genr@swbell.net">Gene Ricci</A>=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, December =
16, 2001=20
3:14 PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] =
Point of=20
View: Why bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Please define "any sort of =
fundamental=20
analysis"... </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Thanks,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Gene</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dkmalm@earthlink.net=20
href=3D"mailto:kmalm@earthlink.net">Katherine Malm</A> =
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, =
December 16, 2001=20
10:12 AM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [CANSLIM] =
Point of=20
View: Why bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Proposed:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> </DIV></FONT>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If a typical =
CANSLIM/Intermediate term=20
move in a stock lasts only a few weeks, and in good markets, =
only a=20
few months, why bother selecting portfolio candidates using =
any sort=20
of fundamental analysis? Returns in this time period are =
strictly=20
based on price movement and can be maximized based on =
technical=20
indicators and price/volume action alone.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thoughts =
pro/con?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
=
size=3D2>Katherine</DIV></FONT></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></B=
LOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
- ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C18671.57AA75A0--
- -
- -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com"
- -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or
- -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2001 20:24:38 -0500
From: "Tom Worley" <stkguru@netside.net>
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
- ------=_NextPart_000_0032_01C1866F.AFA4F5C0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Gene,
It all depends on whether you have the time and stamina to day trade, or =
you are trying to invest. If the former, go with WizeTrade. If the =
latter, find something that works beyond a few hours or a few days.=20
I have known a number of day traders over the years, and none used =
fundies, most didn't even know what the company did for business. =
Ignored sector or industry group, earnings (past or future), RS, etc. =
Several didn't even really know how to read a chart, simply relied on =
current momentum. The ones that did it professionally spent upwards of =
10 hours a day in front of their monitor(s). One had 7 different =
monitors and two TVs he tried to watch continuously.
Tom Worley
stkguru@netside.net
AIM: TexWorley
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Gene Ricci=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 5:23 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
K, thanks for the clarification.
=20
A couple of weeks ago I would have said 'no fundamentals... are you =
kidding me'.=20
=20
I've had several discussions over the past 2-3 weeks and as recently =
as last Thursday, I was told to think 'out of the box' by a VP at =
WizeTrade. I signed up for their 30-day trial (week ago) and was in his =
office 'showing' him the shortcomings of his system. He showed me a sign =
that said... price is determined by buyers and sellers. He went on to =
say that all I had to do was to look at the Green (buy) and Red (sell) =
indicators.... green means more buyers than sellers and red more sellers =
than buyers. The program has charts.... felt better when I found that =
out.... turns out the charts were just time intervals intraday, day, =
week, month.... the lines on the chart were green and red. When the =
green crossed up over red, time to buy.... when red over green it's time =
to sell.=20
=20
From WizeTrade home page or links.
=20
The green line and the red line are summation formulas and not price =
lines or graphs
=20
"No, WizetradeT is not based on "moving averages." WizetradeT =
uses seven key technical indicators to perform its complex "real-time" =
calculations at the rate of 800-1500 calculations per second. The seven =
key indicators are the previous day's closing price, the current day's =
opening price, high, low, every up tick, every down tick - which are =
then exponentially weighted to volume."=20
How can this system work, no fundamentals, stochastic, MACD, =
candlesticks, CANSLIM, etc.?? They seem to take pride in buying =
companies that they don't know much about or what the symbol stands =
for.... they do take pride in the fact that their software tells them =
immediately when there are more buyers than sellers, etc. .... BTW, they =
signaled to get out of ENE at 80+.
I was told that fundamentals were nothing more than a time waster and =
a poor placebo (in a nice way).=20
=20
I'm interested in learning 'the truth'. Certainly would be nice to =
quit looking at fundamentals and all that research as well as spending =
money on DGO/IBD.... etc. WizeTrade also eliminates the need to track or =
know anything about sector rotation.... their buyers and sellers tell =
them all that.
=20
Is it possible that I've been wasting my time looking for data to =
support what I call a good company?
=20
Naw, can't be!
=20
Guess I'll just have to try to understand how and if their system =
works.... over the holidays.=20
=20
Disclaimer: I don't work for them and until my trial is over, I'm not =
even a customer.
Gene
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Katherine Malm=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 2:55 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
That would mean any selection criteria that depended on something =
other than price/volume/volatility technical indicators.
=20
Katherine
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Gene Ricci=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 3:14 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with =
fundamentals?
Please define "any sort of fundamental analysis"...=20
=20
Thanks,
Gene
=20
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Katherine Malm=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 10:12 AM
Subject: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
Proposed:
=20
If a typical CANSLIM/Intermediate term move in a stock lasts =
only a few weeks, and in good markets, only a few months, why bother =
selecting portfolio candidates using any sort of fundamental analysis? =
Returns in this time period are strictly based on price movement and can =
be maximized based on technical indicators and price/volume action =
alone.
=20
Thoughts pro/con?
=20
Katherine
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<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
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<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Gene,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>It all depends on whether you have the time and =
stamina to day=20
trade, or you are trying to invest. If the former, go with WizeTrade. If =
the=20
latter, find something that works beyond a few hours or a few days.=20
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>I have known a number of day traders over the years, =
and none=20
used fundies, most didn't even know what the company did for business. =
Ignored=20
sector or industry group, earnings (past or future), RS, etc. Several =
didn't=20
even really know how to read a chart, simply relied on current momentum. =
The=20
ones that did it professionally spent upwards of 10 hours a day in front =
of=20
their monitor(s). One had 7 different monitors and two TVs he tried to =
watch=20
continuously.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Tom Worley<BR><A=20
href=3D"mailto:stkguru@netside.net">stkguru@netside.net</A><BR>AIM:=20
TexWorley<BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"mailto:genr@swbell.net" title=3Dgenr@swbell.net>Gene =
Ricci</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com"=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com>canslim@lists.xmission.com</A> =
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, December 16, 2001 =
5:23=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] Point of =
View: Why=20
bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">K, thanks for the =
clarification.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">A couple of weeks ago I would have =
said 'no=20
fundamentals... are you kidding me'. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">I've had several discussions over =
the past 2-3=20
weeks and as recently as last Thursday, I was told to think 'out of =
the box'=20
by a VP at WizeTrade. </FONT><FONT=20
face=3D"Comic Sans MS">I signed up for their 30-day =
trial (week=20
ago) and was in his office 'showing' him the shortcomings of his =
system. He=20
showed me a sign that said... price is determined by buyers and =
sellers. He=20
went on to say that all I had to do was to look at the Green =
(buy) and=20
Red (sell) indicators.... green means more buyers than sellers and red =
more=20
sellers than buyers. The program has charts.... felt better when I =
found that=20
out.... turns out the charts were just time intervals intraday, day, =
week,=20
month.... the lines on the chart were green and red. When the green =
crossed up=20
over red, time to buy.... when red over green it's time to=20
sell. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">From WizeTrade home page or=20
links.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> <FONT color=3D#330099 face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>The green =
line and the=20
red line are summation formulas and not price lines or=20
graphs</EM></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV>
<TABLE border=3D0 cellPadding=3D2 cellSpacing=3D0 width=3D"100%">
<TBODY>
<TR vAlign=3Dtop>
<TD align=3Dleft width=3D"98%"><FONT color=3D#330099=20
face=3D"Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size=3D2><EM>"No, =
Wizetrade™ is not=20
based on "moving averages." Wizetrade™ uses seven key =
technical=20
indicators to perform its complex "real-time" calculations at =
the rate=20
of 800-1500 calculations per second. The seven key indicators =
are the=20
previous day's closing price, the current day's opening price, =
high,=20
low, every up tick, every down tick - which are then =
exponentially=20
weighted to volume."</EM></FONT></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<P><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">How can this system work, no =
fundamentals,=20
stochastic, MACD, candlesticks, CANSLIM, etc.?? They seem to take =
pride in=20
buying companies that they don't know much about or what the symbol =
stands=20
for.... they do take pride in the fact that their software tells them=20
immediately when there are more buyers than sellers, etc. .... =
BTW, they=20
signaled to get out of ENE at 80+.</FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">I was told that fundamentals were =
nothing more=20
than a time waster and a poor placebo (in a nice way). </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">I'm interested in learning 'the =
truth'.=20
Certainly would be nice to quit looking at fundamentals and all that =
research=20
as well as spending money on DGO/IBD.... etc. WizeTrade also =
eliminates the=20
need to track or know anything about sector rotation.... their buyers =
and=20
sellers tell them all that.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Is it possible that I've been =
wasting my time=20
looking for data to support what I call a good company?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Naw, can't be!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Guess I'll just have to try to =
understand how=20
and if their system works.... over the holidays. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Disclaimer: I don't work for them =
and until my=20
trial is over, I'm not even a customer.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Gene</FONT></DIV></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"mailto:kmalm@earthlink.net" =
title=3Dkmalm@earthlink.net>Katherine=20
Malm</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com"=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com>canslim@lists.xmission.com</A> =
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, December 16, =
2001 2:55=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] Point =
of View:=20
Why bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>That would mean any selection =
criteria that=20
depended on something other than price/volume/volatility technical=20
indicators.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Katherine</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"mailto:genr@swbell.net" title=3Dgenr@swbell.net>Gene =
Ricci</A>=20
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com"=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com>canslim@lists.xmission.com</A> =
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, December 16, =
2001 3:14=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] =
Point of View:=20
Why bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Please define "any sort of =
fundamental=20
analysis"... </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Thanks,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS">Gene</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"mailto:kmalm@earthlink.net" =
title=3Dkmalm@earthlink.net>Katherine=20
Malm</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com"=20
=
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com>canslim@lists.xmission.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, December =
16, 2001=20
10:12 AM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [CANSLIM] Point =
of View:=20
Why bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Proposed:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> </DIV></FONT>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If a typical =
CANSLIM/Intermediate term move=20
in a stock lasts only a few weeks, and in good markets, only a =
few=20
months, why bother selecting portfolio candidates using any sort =
of=20
fundamental analysis? Returns in this time period are strictly =
based on=20
price movement and can be maximized based on technical =
indicators and=20
price/volume action alone.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thoughts pro/con?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
=
size=3D2>Katherine</DIV></FONT></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></B=
LOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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- -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or
- -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2001 20:36:53 -0500
From: "Tom Worley" <stkguru@netside.net>
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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Actually, Warren, I didn't hold onto it thru "thick and thin". My first =
trip well over two years ago was a near perfect CANSLIM play, only rules =
I violated was buying a stock then around $12, and with limited =
liquidity. Timed it near perfect, went up in an almost continuous trend =
for 7 straight weeks. There I violated the other rule, sold a stock with =
more than a 20% gain in less than 8 weeks (sold for a 70% gain in 7 =
weeks). Exit turned out also correct, later bought it a 2nd and 3rd time =
for 20% and 30% gains. Last buy was nearly 18 months ago, and sold half =
after 10 months for a 220% gain, then sold another qtr position several =
months later for over 400% gain.=20
I have made it clear, through over five years of posting here, that I =
violate many CANSLIM rules. Simply by buying thinly traded, low priced =
small caps, I am out of the mainstream of modern day CANSLIM. That's =
just one of many reasons why I do not normally post my stocks. But with =
my years of experience in investing, and many painful lessons learned, =
plus over a decade of trying to work with CANSLIM and WON products, I =
feel I can take those risks with my own money.
EPIQ is just one example of where early profits, combined with an =
exceptional business model, and solid fundies, allowed me to hold thru =
numerous corrections that would have stopped out the typical short term =
investor. That is why my remaining holding in EPIQ is up 408% in under =
2 years. And why I will buy more at the right price. But I never could =
have done it without knowing how to invest in thinly traded, low priced =
small and micro cap stocks.
CANSLIM is designed for individual customization.
Tom Worley
stkguru@netside.net
AIM: TexWorley
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Warren Keuffel=20
To: canslim@lists.xmission.com=20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 7:20 PM
Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with fundamentals?
Yes, but if you held on to EPIQ through thick and thin, you're =
violating
the sell rules of CANSLIM. So are you saying you only follow the buy
rules but not the sell rules?
Warren
Tom Worley wrote:
> CON - I like fundies Aside from artificial stimulus like a wire =
house
> upgrade, or a firm being paid to hype / tout a stock, price movement
> is driven by expectations for the future. And those expectations are
> based on fundamentals of the stock. I also disagree with a belief =
that
> a solid, quality CANSLIM purchase will only make you money for a few
> weeks or a few months. Had I played EPIQ for every updraft and
> downdraft, I would undoubtedly have found myself on the wrong side
> more than once. Instead I held for over 14 months and saw it go up
> over 500%. Fundamentals also build a degree of confidence that =
during
> major events such as the 9/11 attacks, a good company can survive =
and
> recover value. Fundamentals, and their rate of growth, also help us
> see leadership. Tom Worley
> stkguru@netside.net
> AIM: TexWorley
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Katherine Malm
> To: canslim@lists.xmission.com
> Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 11:12 AM
> Subject: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother with
> fundamentals?
> Proposed: If a typical CANSLIM/Intermediate term move in a
> stock lasts only a few weeks, and in good markets, only a
> few months, why bother selecting portfolio candidates using
> any sort of fundamental analysis? Returns in this time
> period are strictly based on price movement and can be
> maximized based on technical indicators and price/volume
> action alone. Thoughts pro/con? Katherine
>
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-In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or
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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Actually, Warren, I didn't hold onto it thru "thick =
and thin".=20
My first trip well over two years ago was a near perfect CANSLIM play, =
only=20
rules I violated was buying a stock then around $12, and with limited =
liquidity.=20
Timed it near perfect, went up in an almost continuous trend for 7 =
straight=20
weeks. There I violated the other rule, sold a stock with more than a =
20% gain=20
in less than 8 weeks (sold for a 70% gain in 7 weeks). Exit turned out =
also=20
correct, later bought it a 2nd and 3rd time for 20% and 30% gains. Last =
buy was=20
nearly 18 months ago, and sold half after 10 months for a 220% gain, =
then sold=20
another qtr position several months later for over 400% gain. =
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>I have made it clear, through over five years of =
posting here,=20
that I violate many CANSLIM rules. Simply by buying thinly traded, low =
priced=20
small caps, I am out of the mainstream of modern day CANSLIM. That's =
just one of=20
many reasons why I do not normally post my stocks. But with my years of=20
experience in investing, and many painful lessons learned, plus over a =
decade of=20
trying to work with CANSLIM and WON products, I feel I can take those =
risks with=20
my own money.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>EPIQ is just one example of where early profits, =
combined with=20
an exceptional business model, and solid fundies, allowed me to hold =
thru=20
numerous corrections that would have stopped out the typical short term=20
investor. That is why my remaining holding in EPIQ is up 408% in =
under 2=20
years. And why I will buy more at the right price. But I never could =
have done=20
it without knowing how to invest in thinly traded, low priced small and =
micro=20
cap stocks.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>CANSLIM is designed for individual =
customization.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Tom Worley<BR><A=20
href=3D"mailto:stkguru@netside.net">stkguru@netside.net</A><BR>AIM:=20
TexWorley<BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"mailto:wkeuffel@xmission.com" =
title=3Dwkeuffel@xmission.com>Warren=20
Keuffel</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com"=20
title=3Dcanslim@lists.xmission.com>canslim@lists.xmission.com</A> =
</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, December 16, 2001 =
7:20=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CANSLIM] Point of =
View: Why=20
bother with fundamentals?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Yes, but if you held on to EPIQ through thick and thin, =
you're=20
violating<BR>the sell rules of CANSLIM. So are you saying you =
only=20
follow the buy<BR>rules but not the sell =
rules?<BR><BR>Warren<BR><BR>Tom=20
Worley wrote:<BR><BR>> CON - I like fundies Aside from artificial =
stimulus=20
like a wire house<BR>> upgrade, or a firm being paid to hype / tout =
a=20
stock, price movement<BR>> is driven by expectations for the =
future. And=20
those expectations are<BR>> based on fundamentals of the stock. I =
also=20
disagree with a belief that<BR>> a solid, quality CANSLIM purchase =
will=20
only make you money for a few<BR>> weeks or a few months. Had I =
played EPIQ=20
for every updraft and<BR>> downdraft, I would undoubtedly have =
found myself=20
on the wrong side<BR>> more than once. Instead I held for over 14 =
months=20
and saw it go up<BR>> over 500%. Fundamentals also build a degree =
of=20
confidence that during<BR>> major events such as the 9/11 attacks, =
a good=20
company can survive and<BR>> recover value. Fundamentals, and their =
rate of=20
growth, also help us<BR>> see leadership. Tom Worley<BR>> <A=20
href=3D"mailto:stkguru@netside.net">stkguru@netside.net</A><BR>> =
AIM:=20
TexWorley<BR>><BR>> ----- Original =
Message=20
-----<BR>> From: Katherine=20
Malm<BR>> To: <A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:canslim@lists.xmission.com">canslim@lists.xmission.com</A>=
<BR>> =20
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2001 11:12 =
AM<BR>> =20
Subject: [CANSLIM] Point of View: Why bother=20
with<BR>> =20
fundamentals?<BR>> Proposed: If =
a=20
typical CANSLIM/Intermediate term move in=20
a<BR>> stock lasts only a few weeks, =
and in=20
good markets, only a<BR>> few months, =
why=20
bother selecting portfolio candidates=20
using<BR>> any sort of fundamental =
analysis?=20
Returns in this time<BR>> period are =
strictly=20
based on price movement and can =
be<BR>> =20
maximized based on technical indicators and=20
price/volume<BR>> action alone. =
Thoughts=20
pro/con? Katherine<BR>><BR><BR><BR>-<BR>-To subscribe/unsubscribe, =
email=20
"<A =
href=3D"mailto:majordomo@xmission.com">majordomo@xmission.com</A>"<BR>-In=
=20
the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or<BR>-"unsubscribe =
canslim". =20
Do not use quotes in your email.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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------------------------------
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